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Brock Osweiler agrees to 4 year 72 million

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corytx8 said:
You know what man, that's fine. I respect your draft insight. If Oz works out for the Texans, it's great for us fans. If it doesn't in 2 years, okay so what we move on.

At this point, the signing is already a done. The Texans aren't trading up for your love. So if you want to sit here and hope that the Texans fall flat on their faces so that you can beat your chest and say that you are right. You minus well just go sell your Texans gear, stop following the Texans. Go buy yourself a Carson Wentz jersey and become a fan of the team he is on.

Otherwise, get over it man and just hope that it does work out because you are wasting electricity and bytes displaying your butthurt. Sorry man, had to.
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You know you couldn't be more wrong. When things get boring around here I try to write a sentence or two that will stir up some interest. For some that is a button that is easily pushed. But I hope it made you feel better. When I see comments like yours, I get a good laugh.

You respect my insight, what exactly do you think was going on here?
 
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steelbtexan said:
Last yr Graham had more drops than that in one game that I watched. Are you actually saying Graham was a good TE last yr. If so, we will never agree and I just need to move on to another discussion.

There's a reason Graham got cut. BTW, can you imagine a TE like Gronk/Olsen/Graham etc... that can stretch the middle of the field?
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Davis wasn't good either. He's averaged 5.9 yards per target and 10.0 yards per catch since he turned 30.

For reference, Griffin averaged 7.4 yards per target and 12.6 yards per catch last year.
 
Griffin is a fine player. Honestly, I think it's obvious as hell. But I've also liked him since he was at UConn. I think he demonstrates all the qualities you look for in a starting NFL TE.

The issue there is lack of opportunity, not lack of talent. So far our offense has asked him to block more than it has asked him to run routes. And when he does get to run a route, his QB play has been a mix of guys that think he is invisible and guys that throw passes to the dirt with greater frequency than they throw passes to an actual receiver.
 
WolverineFan said:
Davis wasn't good either. He's averaged 5.9 yards per target and 10.0 yards per catch since he turned 30.

For reference, Griffin averaged 7.4 yards per target and 12.6 yards per catch last year.
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Yea. But Davis is a 4.4 guy and Griffin is a 4.8 guy.
 
thunderkyss said:
He's also a prima donna. I don't want him in our locker room.
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I don't think that's accurate. I haven't read anything like that since the Singletary days. Coming in mid stream like that is very difficult. That said, I do think he's still an athlete playing te vs an athletic te. I do think he will draw more coverage if he runs a seam vs griffin or fedo. Even at 31, you cant play a lb on him.
 
Texian said:
Or in other words another typical McNair panic and a rush to judgement to buy the hype. Got It!
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Once again, your default position that anything Smith or McNair does MUST BE wrong shows through. We get it.

Analysis must be objective and that train left the station a long time ago.

But I understand. I felt the same way about Ed Wade and created a Fire Wade thread on the Astros board before the first game of his first full season.

But let's drop the pretense that there is any objectivity.
 
Texian said:
You know you couldn't be more wrong. When things get boring around here I try to write a sentence or two that will stir up some interest. For some that is a button that is easily pushed. But I hope it made you feel better. When I see comments like yours, I get a good laugh.

You respect my insight, what exactly do you think was going on here?
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Not sure if this was already covered but I thought it was interesting:
Lack of O’Brien-Osweiler meeting a hallmark of modern NFL free agency; LINK

It was regarded as a surprise this week when Texans coach Bill O’Brien said he hadn’t met quarterback Brock Osweiler before the Texans agreed to pay him $37 million fully guaranteed as part of a four-year, $72 million contract. As Ben Volin of the Boston Globe writes, “This move has owner Bob McNair’s signature all over it, and you have to wonder how comfortable O’Brien is with his owner making football decisions.”
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PapaL said:
Not sure if this was already covered but I thought it was interesting:
Lack of O’Brien-Osweiler meeting a hallmark of modern NFL free agency; LINK
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It was brought up by Texian to support his agenda. However, lets not ignore this part

"The reality is, however, that plenty of free agents currently get paid plenty of money without the player and the coach ever meeting. The legal tampering period encourages this kind of sight-unseen dealmaking, with agents negotiating contracts that technically are unenforceable agreements in principle but that almost always become binding business arrangements without the principals ever shaking hands or exchanging pleasantries. (They’re also not even supposed to talk during the legal tampering period — and that’s a provision that needs to go away.)"

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...meeting-a-hallmark-of-modern-nfl-free-agency/
 
corytx8 said:
It was brought up by Texian to support his agenda. However, lets not ignore this part

"The reality is, however, that plenty of free agents currently get paid plenty of money without the player and the coach ever meeting. The legal tampering period encourages this kind of sight-unseen dealmaking, with agents negotiating contracts that technically are unenforceable agreements in principle but that almost always become binding business arrangements without the principals ever shaking hands or exchanging pleasantries. (They’re also not even supposed to talk during the legal tampering period — and that’s a provision that needs to go away.)"

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...meeting-a-hallmark-of-modern-nfl-free-agency/
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Yeah that was in the article I read...it's the next paragraph. Just sounds weird is all. I don't consider it a big deal. I'm 100% sure they watched film and discussed Os.
 
Marshall said:
Once again, your default position that anything Smith or McNair does MUST BE wrong shows through. We get it.

Analysis must be objective and that train left the station a long time ago.

But I understand. I felt the same way about Ed Wade and created a Fire Wade thread on the Astros board before the first game of his first full season.

But let's drop the pretense that there is any objectivity.
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Their actions speak for their self.

corytx8 said:
It was brought up by Texian to support his agenda. However, lets not ignore this part

"The reality is, however, that plenty of free agents currently get paid plenty of money without the player and the coach ever meeting. The legal tampering period encourages this kind of sight-unseen dealmaking, with agents negotiating contracts that technically are unenforceable agreements in principle but that almost always become binding business arrangements without the principals ever shaking hands or exchanging pleasantries. (They’re also not even supposed to talk during the legal tampering period — and that’s a provision that needs to go away.)"

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...meeting-a-hallmark-of-modern-nfl-free-agency/
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In a nutshell, here is where the Texans fall short. They couldn't talk to Osweiller but they could talk to every QB in the draft. The Texans took a pass on the latter. Instead of leaving no stone upturned and completing a full due diligence to find the best QB available, the Texans based their decision on cash vs draft picks. OB took a quick look at the racing forum, looked at one horse, fell in love with one previous race he had run and immediately took off to the betting window and placed his bet not knowing that Secretariat and Man o War are running in the same race.
 
Where do you think the texans would have had to move to to potentially get a,qb then?
Whats your estimate on how many picks?
 
Texian said:
Their actions speak for their self.



In a nutshell, here is where the Texans fall short. They couldn't talk to Osweiller but they could talk to every QB in the draft. The Texans took a pass on the latter. Instead of leaving no stone upturned and completing a full due diligence to find the best QB available, the Texans based their decision on cash vs draft picks. OB took a quick look at the racing forum, looked at one horse, fell in love with one previous race he had run and immediately took off to the betting window and placed his bet not knowing that Secretariat and Man o War are running in the same race.
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:deadhorse:deadhorse:firehair:
 
Wolf said:
Where do you think the texans would have had to move to to potentially get a,qb then?
Whats your estimate on how many picks?
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3, 4, 5 or 6. Swap 1st 2016, 1st RD 2017 and Clowney or Merciless, possibly but not necessarily a 2nd or 3rd RD in 16 or 17 to get to 3 or 4. Assume the Texans miss out on Wentz or Goff, there is not much difference in drafting Lynch or Cook at #22 at $9MM and signing Osweiller at $72MM.
 
Texian said:
The horse is not dead, their will be more bonehead, panic, rush to judgement decisions....IT's a CONSTANT CONSISTENT PATTERN OF BEHAVIOR.
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I disagree with you that the Os signing was a boneheaded rush to judgement. You keep asserting your opinion as fact and can't get past your own boneheaded rush to judgement that either Wentz or Goff will be markedly better than Os and that the Texans could realistically be able to trade up to get one of them.

This discussion is a dead horse, like it or not.
 
Suddenly I wish I hadn't read that article or shared it here. FML. There's no off button on that dude.
 
DocBar said:
I disagree with you that the Os signing was a boneheaded rush to judgement. You keep asserting your opinion as fact and can't get past your own boneheaded rush to judgement that either Wentz or Goff will be markedly better than Os and that the Texans could realistically be able to trade up to get one of them.

This discussion is a dead horse, like it or not.
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As for my rush to judgement for Wentz or Goff, I'm still PATIENTLY waiting on the draft. As to bonehead rush to judgement decisions, that's exactly why Hoyer was the starting QB.
 
Texian said:
In a nutshell, here is where the Texans fall short. They couldn't talk to Osweiller but they could talk to every QB in the draft. The Texans took a pass on the latter. Instead of leaving no stone upturned and completing a full due diligence to find the best QB available, the Texans based their decision on cash vs draft picks.
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The Texans did meet with all of the top quarterback prospects at the NFL combine. Free Agency takes place before the draft, so if they didn't move to get Osweiler when the legal tampering period started, they would not have been able to get him at all.
 
Swapping firsts this year , a second this year, a first next year, and Merciless or Clowney for a guy that your coaching staff isn't sold on is ridiculous. If O'Brien had thought Goff (or Wentz) was the guy he absolutely wanted, they'd have tried to make that happen. They didn't, so he obviously didn't feel as strongly about either of them as Texian does. There is also the prospect of either sitting the rookie or throwing him to the wolves while taking their lumps for at least a couple of years of Watt and a very good defense's prime. That in mind, the Os signing would appear to be the opposite of "rush to judgement". It would appear to be the prudent choice.
 
Losing 3 players for one potential? Nah.

Too many times heard the "once in a lifetime player" only to not turn out so much.
 
Jagian said:
Their actions speak for their self.

OB took a quick look at the racing forum, looked at one horse, fell in love with one previous race he had run and immediately took off to the betting window and placed his bet not knowing that Secretariat and Man o War are running in the same race.
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Yeah, yeah, but seriously isn't all this analysis of Secretariat, Wentz, Man o War, Goff, Os, and Old Glue just a big waste of time since the awesome super horse from Krypton (Bortles) is in the same race? The Texans could have Goff, Wentz, Os, Luck, Brady, and Rodgers and they can never hope to even win the division if your assessments of QBs are worth anything.
 
Texian said:
Their actions speak for their self.



In a nutshell, here is where the Texans fall short. They couldn't talk to Osweiller but they could talk to every QB in the draft. The Texans took a pass on the latter. Instead of leaving no stone upturned and completing a full due diligence to find the best QB available, the Texans based their decision on cash vs draft picks. OB took a quick look at the racing forum, looked at one horse, fell in love with one previous race he had run and immediately took off to the betting window and placed his bet not knowing that Secretariat and Man o War are running in the same race.
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I thought they had already spoken with Wentzville & Goff at the Senior Bowl or at the combine.
 
GoCoogs said:
The Texans did meet with all of the top quarterback prospects at the NFL combine. Free Agency takes place before the draft, so if they didn't move to get Osweiler when the legal tampering period started, they would not have been able to get him at all.
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Not necessarily so...

February 23-29
NFL Scouting Combine, Lucas Oil Stadium, Indianapolis, Indiana.

March 7
Beginning at 12 noon, New York time, clubs are permitted to contact, and enter into contract negotiations with the certified agents of players who will become Unrestricted Free Agents upon the expiration of their 2015 player contracts at 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 15. However, a contract cannot be executed with a new club until 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 15.

They may not be a bad thing
 
Bane said:
Swapping firsts this year , a second this year, a first next year, and Merciless or Clowney for a guy that your coaching staff isn't sold on is ridiculous. If O'Brien had thought Goff (or Wentz) was the guy he absolutely wanted, they'd have tried to make that happen. They didn't, so he obviously didn't feel as strongly about either of them as Texian does. There is also the prospect of either sitting the rookie or throwing him to the wolves while taking their lumps for at least a couple of years of Watt and a very good defense's prime. That in mind, the Os signing would appear to be the opposite of "rush to judgement". It would appear to be the prudent choice.
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I think you're kind of making up stuff as you go a long.
 
Texian said:
3, 4, 5 or 6. Swap 1st 2016, 1st RD 2017 and Clowney or Merciless, possibly but not necessarily a 2nd or 3rd RD in 16 or 17 to get to 3 or 4. Assume the Texans miss out on Wentz or Goff, there is not much difference in drafting Lynch or Cook at #22 at $9MM and signing Osweiller at $72MM.
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Except they think Osweiler can be special & probably don't think Lynch/Cook can be special. Or they think Osweiler is two years ahead of Lynch/Cook & don't see a reason to waist another Jj Watt season.

Or, they just don't see Lynch/Cook as fits. I argued earlier that I don't understand the whole "Whoever's left, Goff or Wentz" thing. I can't see a single team who would grade them one & two on their board where one is just as good as the other, since these two are very different QBs. Just like Lynch & Cook are very different QBs.

I can see a draftnik rating them 1, 2, 3, & 4 where he doesn't have a particular system he's trying to match the skills to, but a coach or GM are more likely to view them as Wentzville, being 1, followed by Cook at 2, Hogan 3, then a bunch of developmental guys. Or Goff being 1 and Lynch #2, Prescott 3 then a bunch of developmental guys.

Or something like that.

People are going to hate hearing this, but while I believe Kubiak could have made Osweiler a star, Sanchez is a better fit for his WCO. I'm not saying Kubiak prefers Sanchez, I don't know. But if I were Kubiak I'm not losing sleep over losing Osweiler.

At the same time I'm not kicking myself in the butt for not getting Sanchez instead if I were O'Brien. Sanchez has shown to be unreliable with a fixed launching point. But the misdirection, & moving pocket Kubiak uses (pre Schaub & Flacco) will go a long way keeping Sanchez clean.
 
Bane said:
There is some speculation there, sure, almost as much as there is in every single post you've made on the subject in this thread.
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Greg Cosell Retweeted
Shutdown Corner ‏@YShutdownCorner 29m29 minutes ago


In his first draft preview, @gregcosell says Andrew Luck-Carson Wentz comparisons are valid: http://yhoo.it/1MvXcGh

"I believe Carson Wentz is a high-level prospect, my top quarterback in this draft class, and I think the comparison to Luck is valid."

"Like Luck, Wentz is smart. He was a 4.0 student at North Dakota State. Physically, the two are similar, and we’ll get to that in a bit. One thing that stood out to me about Wentz is his poise in critical moments. That reminds me of Luck as well."

"He has an awareness of how to play the position, like Luck. He has the ability to drive the ball when the throw demands it, as Luck does. "

"If a team decides to use Wentz as a regular part of their running game, as the Panthers do with Cam Newton, he has the ability to excel in that role. "

"I can only tell you what I’ve seen on tape from the prospects going into the draft. And what I’ve seen from Wentz is pretty good. He's my No. 1 quarterback in this draft. "
 
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Texian said:
They get 15 minutes. Seriously? This is your argument? 15 minutes??
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But you want the Texans to give up multiple 1st round picks and more to try to move up and snag one of these guys based on the same 15 min?
 
Texian said:
Their actions speak for their self.



In a nutshell, here is where the Texans fall short. They couldn't talk to Osweiller but they could talk to every QB in the draft. The Texans took a pass on the latter. Instead of leaving no stone upturned and completing a full due diligence to find the best QB available, the Texans based their decision on cash vs draft picks. OB took a quick look at the racing forum, looked at one horse, fell in love with one previous race he had run and immediately took off to the betting window and placed his bet not knowing that Secretariat and Man o War are running in the same race.
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I wonder how much time the coaching staff was able to watch and interact with Os during week long practices with Denver the previous year. Adam Gase was in his 2nd year as OC, so I'd imagine they had some elements of the E-P System installed. OB and Gase are connected through McDaniels...I'd have a hard time believing that there weren't conversations regarding Os going on between those two as well. The acquisition was definitely not "sight unseen".

I can understand your point of view, and even your overt bias...we've been burned a lot as a fanbase. But we shouldn't present the Os signing as if it happened in a black box.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T337A using Tapatalk
 
Texian said:
Not necessarily so...

February 23-29
NFL Scouting Combine, Lucas Oil Stadium, Indianapolis, Indiana.

March 7
Beginning at 12 noon, New York time, clubs are permitted to contact, and enter into contract negotiations with the certified agents of players who will become Unrestricted Free Agents upon the expiration of their 2015 player contracts at 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 15. However, a contract cannot be executed with a new club until 4:00 p.m., New York time, on March 15.

They may not be a bad thing
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What isn't necessarily so?

I ask because your response included a link to a list of combine results, and a description of the legal tampering period - neither of which even addresses - much less refutes in any way - the comments made in the post you were responding to.
 
Bane said:
More speculation. This time from the same guy that said RGIII was a better choice than Luck.
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Never said that Bane, your words not mine. What I actually said was Luck was off limits and RGIII was next best choice available. If the Texans had a chance at Luck it was a no brainer. I would've thought that you would know that.
 
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Texian said:
Never said that Bane, your words not mine. What I actually said was Luck was off limits and RGIII was next best choice available. If the Texans had a chance at Luck it was a no brainer. I would've thought that you would know that.
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I wasn't referring to anything you said. I'm new here. I have no idea what you may or may not have said prior to that draft. I was referring to what your source, the guy you are using to back your argument, said.
 
Bane said:
I wasn't referring to anything you said. I'm new here. I have no idea what you may or may not have said prior to that draft. I was referring to what your source, the guy you are using to back your argument, said.
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Cosell said RGIII had a stronger arm than Luck but many said the same.

BTW Bain, RGIII in his rookie year took WASH from worst to first, went to the Pro Bowl and was the NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year (not Luck). Before he suffered major multiple injuries.
 
He called RG3 "a more remarkable talent". He did have a very good rookie season, sidelined by injury, no debate there. If it were just the injuries, that would be one thing, but his character has also come into question. Character is the type of thing that generally comes to light after a few years in the league, like Osweiler has had for example. Funny how that works huh?
 
This thread is like watching WWE, I can not watch for a while knowing the same old story lines and same wrestlers spouting them will be here next time I tune in. I probably should work on the habit of watching both.
 
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