Brian Gaine Thread

[Earl34]

I know where it came from because I posted it as a joke years ago (true story).
I did it because I saw they were joined at the hip with respect to personnel decisions. Back then, Smith would hardly make a move without running it past Kubiak.

And I think that's the way it should be. How else can a GM and scouting dept make good/effective evaluations unless they and the coaching staff are thinking along the same lines??

IMHO, the GM and HC has to be on the same page and thinking along the same lines. However, I'm reluctant to have a first time HC too involved with personnel. I want them to learn their job. You can't be dabbling on the personnel side when you're making boneheaded game management mistakes, wasting timeouts or chickening out when Belichick is on the opposite sideline.

Being an NFL HC is one of the most stressful, complicated OJT you can experience. Why are you adding personnel decisions when you have scouts, a GM and personnel department that does it full time? Now if you win a Super Bowl, multiple playoff wins, a couple of championship game appearances, maybe we can add personnel. Otherwise, learn to be a better NFL HC.

Also, I was listening to an interview with Michael Lombardi and he mentioned how O'Brien was used to how the Patriots do things with the HC being involved in everything. Well, my response is he's not Belichick. Maybe that's why so many former Belichick coaches fail when they get away from Belichick. They want the Belichick power structure and they don't have any experience or have earned the right to have total control of an organization.

By many accounts, Chip Kelly is a brilliant offensive mind. Look at what happened to the Eagles with Chip Kelly, when they hired him, when they gave him full control of personnel and after they fired him.

 

[steelbtexan]

3 OL that stood out to me were Alex Cappa, Isiah Wynn/Bradley Bozeman.

 

[steelbtexan]

Delete

 

[Mangler]

3 OL that stood out to me were Alex Cappa, Isiah Wynn/Bradley Bozeman.

I doubt they’ll be available for us.

 

[steelbtexan]

I doubt they’ll be available for us.

Bozeman will be probably in the 4th rd.

Wynn will probably be gone, I've got him as a early 2nd rd pick.

There's a chance Cappa will be there. If he falls to rd 2 25 or so I would think about trading up for him.

 

[Texansballer74]

He's just a Bill O'Brien yes man IMO.

He's gonna align the scouting department with OB's philosophy.

He's already stated that they are philosophically in sync. Bwhahaha im like stop it.

But I do hope and wish for the best. He has a tall task ahead of him already.

1st: Starting with the draft. No 1st or 2nd round pick. Will he be able to works some deals that will at least get us a 2nd round pick.

2nd: Acquirig FA that will play for McNair after his tragic speech at the owners meetings.

3rd. Cleaning house. Getting rid of players like Cushing, most of that oline and others. ( Joseph is already gone because his contract is up)


Its going to be interesting.

 

[Texansballer74]

I like the hire, he was my 2nd choice.

Wonder why the McNair's weren't at the press conference? Strange

Was he really. Lol

 

[Texansballer74]

Can someone explain what Brian Gaines's strengths are? I'm just not seeing anything really other than being around in a lot of places. I just don't see where he shines at. It feels like a Texans hire where OB is getting a yes man to control sort of like what Kubiak received when Smith got introduced after his recommendation. I think the Texans should have looked long and hard and put a lot of words out there to see who all might be interested. I'll give this guy a chance, but I fail in seeing any real upside in him as it stands now. I'll just hope for the best.

Well the upside so far is him and O'Brien getting along.

 

[Texansballer74]

Is he a legit insider? Serious question. Like I know cyberex on clutchfans is

Lol cyberex

 

[Texansballer74]

Everybody should give Gaine a clean slate. Quite a few on this MB wont.

This is a 2-3 yr project to fix Ricky's incompetence, so hopefully they give Gaine/BOB the time to put the team they want on the field.

Do you think this will happen?

I knew it was coming.

 

[Texansballer74]

So you think they are going to be able to fill atleast 6 holes that badly need filling this offseason (2-3 OL, CB, S, TE and fixing the ST's) without a 1st/2nd rd pick?

High expectations indeed for Gaine in his rookie yr as GM. Good to see you have more faith in Gaine than I do.

If the HC and staff coaches these players up as well as make better in game decision ( go back to the Patriots and Seahawks game). Well that shouldn't be a huge stretch at all.

No way in hell a better coached team loses twice to the terrible Colts team.

 

[Texansballer74]

Adam Wexler@awexlerKPRC

"Brian & I see things in similar ways, we understand each other. He’s probably already sick of me. Great person, very calm guy, very smart guy. He’s got excellent thoughts about how to create the most competitive roster we can," #Texans O'Brien from @seniorbowl on GM Gaine @KPRC2

1:23 PM - Jan 23, 2018

And it begins.

 

[ObsiWan]

IMHO, the GM and HC has to be on the same page and thinking along the same lines. However, I'm reluctant to have a first time HC too involved with personnel. I want them to learn their job. You can't be dabbling on the personnel side when you're making boneheaded game management mistakes, wasting timeouts or chickening out when Belichick is on the opposite sideline.

Being an NFL HC is one of the most stressful, complicated OJT you can experience. Why are you adding personnel decisions when you have scouts, a GM and personnel department that does it full time? Now if you win a Super Bowl, multiple playoff wins, a couple of championship game appearances, maybe we can add personnel. Otherwise, learn to be a better NFL HC.

Also, I was listening to an interview with Michael Lombardi and he mentioned how O'Brien was used to how the Patriots do things with the HC being involved in everything. Well, my response is he's not Belichick. Maybe that's why so many former Belichick coaches fail when they get away from Belichick. They want the Belichick power structure and they don't have any experience or have earned the right to have total control of an organization.

By many accounts, Chip Kelly is a brilliant offensive mind. Look at what happened to the Eagles with Chip Kelly, when they hired him, when they gave him full control of personnel and after they fired him.

I don't want the HC having full control over salary cap matters and researching free agents and all that personnel stuff. You're right, that's too much.

I want the HC, and his coordinators, to be able to identify what their schemes are designed to do and what sorts of players/skill sets are necessary to make those schemes work. The scouts and GM should take it from there and bring the coaching staff a list of prospects. Before the draft the coaches and scouts go over that list build a draft board.

Ever notice that the Pats' WRs all look like Amedola/Wes Welker/Troy Brown who can play wide or slot and make yds after the catch? Or all those 1000-yd RBs Denver was cranking out that knew how to set up the ZBS blocks and cut back at the right time? That's what I mean by identifying the skill sets that make your offense (in this example) work to perfection. The HC should be able to communicate those attributes to the scouts' and GM's so they can better do their jobs.

 

[Perki-Perk]

I knew it was coming.

I wonder if some people in here have the same unrealistic expectations of themselves at their jobs that they do of the new GM. No 1st or 2nd round pick, an owner that made a statement that pissed a lot of people off, and you want what? A one year turn around? LMAO. Some of you people are great entertainment in here. It's like reading the script to Idiocracy in here and on message boards around the interwebs.

For what it's worth though, I do expect we will be back to playoff contention next year, and probably barely miss it on the last game of the season a la the early 90s Oilers. After a full year under Gaine's belt, and if Watson stays healthy and continues to shine, I fully expect that in year 2 we are competing in the AFC Championship game. We have a lot of talent, just a lot of holes to fill. If we don't win a superbowl in the next 5 years or so with a healthy Watson, I MIGHT be an NFL free agent fan. 20 years is too long to not get your $h!t together as an organization and I'm not really a gluten for punishment.

 

[Thorn]

I'm not really a gluten for punishment.

Gluten is a composite of storage proteins termed prolamins and glutelins and stored together with starch in the endosperm of various cereal grains

So you're saying you don't like your cereal?

 

[steelbtexan]

If the HC and staff coaches these players up as well as make better in game decision ( go back to the Patriots and Seahawks game). Well that shouldn't be a huge stretch at all.

No way in hell a better coached team loses twice to the terrible Colts team.

If the talent level isn't improved and Luck comes back I could see them losing twice. Where we disagree is you want to blame losing to the Colts on coaching. I say if you look at the roster for the last Colts game where the QB1 is Yates and The WR1 is Thompson along with the OL they fielded that day, Lombardi could coach that team and they would still suck.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

I wonder if some people in here have the same unrealistic expectations of themselves at their jobs that they do of the new GM. No 1st or 2nd round pick, an owner that made a statement that pissed a lot of people off, and you want what? A one year turn around? LMAO. Some of you people are great entertainment in here. It's like reading the script to Idiocracy in here and on message boards around the interwebs.

For what it's worth though, I do expect we will be back to playoff contention next year, and probably barely miss it on the last game of the season a la the early 90s Oilers. After a full year under Gaine's belt, and if Watson stays healthy and continues to shine, I fully expect that in year 2 we are competing in the AFC Championship game. We have a lot of talent, just a lot of holes to fill. If we don't win a superbowl in the next 5 years or so with a healthy Watson, I MIGHT be an NFL free agent fan. 20 years is too long to not get your $h!t together as an organization and I'm not really a gluten for punishment.

Perfect post! Like Luhnow did with the Astros, his initial moves, with Cranes blessings had fans in an uproar. So many fans wanted to bail on the organization b/c they didn't like the fact they were going to rebuild the Astros from the ground up. Personally, I loved the move and fully understood the commitment to winning for the long haul. Instead of getting excited about the major league squad, I was following the MiLB affiliates knowing these were the guys that would "be the team" in the near future.

At the moment, the Texans are in 20' hole with a 10' ladder. Gaine can earn his cudo's this season if he somehow finds a way to make this 2018 draft work for the Texans in regards to finding a couple of starters as well as quality developmental depth players that can produce on ST's in the interim. That may be asking a lot, but John Lynch sure had a hell of a first season as the 49's GM and he accomplished that without near the core talent as the Texans possess for Gaine's first season.

If Gaine can nail this off-season and draft, then I'm going to be fine with a couple of more years to see this build take shape for the long haul. I'm really against moving any 2019 picks for the 2018 draft. If a trade or 2 can be accomplished and it adds a pick or 2 to this seasons draft and pick to 2019, then that's moving in the right direction. 2 solid drafts could change this teams perspective and 2020 could be the year of arrival along with additional talent. Watt and Clowney may not be with the team when the arrives but with a solid draft in 2019 and another in 2020, their replacements could already be with the team by then.

 

[Perki-Perk]

Perfect post! Like Luhnow did with the Astros, his initial moves, with Cranes blessings had fans in uproar. So many fans wanted to bail on the organization b/c they didn't like the fact they were going to rebuild the Astros from the ground up. Personally, I loved the move and fully understood the commitment to winning for the long haul. Instead of getting excited about the major league squad, I was following the MiLB affiliates knowing these were the guys that would "be the team" in the near future.

At the moment, the Texans are in 20' hole with a 10' ladder. Gaine can earn his cudo's this season if he somehow finds a way to make this 2018 draft work for the Texans in regards to a couple of starters and quality developmental depth that can produce on ST's in the interim. That may be asking a lot but John Lynch sure had a hell of a first season as the 49's GM and without near the core talent as the Texans possess for Gaine's first season.

If Gaine can nail this off-season and draft, then I'm going to be fine with a couple of more years to see this build take shape for the long haul. I'm really against moving any 2019 picks for the 2018 draft. If a trade or 2 can be accomplished and it adds a pick or 2 to this seasons draft and pick to 2019, then that's moving in the right direction. 2 solid drafts could change this teams perspective and 2020 could be the year of arrival along with additional talent. Watt and Clowney may not be with the team when the arrives but with a solid draft in 2019 and another in 2020, their replacements could already be with the team by then.

I don't know that the Texans need the complete tear down/rebuild the Astros did. The farm system was completely depleted and now we have one of the best in baseball and a title to boot. The Texans need to get a solid LT. When D Brown was active and healthy, he did wonders for an average to below average line. I think a pair of tackles would go a long way as well as some better development with what we have. As far as the secondary, it should improve with one solid acquisition as well as just everyone returning on the front 7 to inflict a menacing pass rush on opposing teams. That in itself will greatly improve the secondary. We have many pieces in place, it's our offensive trenches and secondary that need addressing, as most people agree. Watson, Hopkins, Fuller, Miller will all perform better with a better Oline. The Defense will perform better with the return of RAC to the sideline as well as the return of Watt, Mercilus and Cole. Although, Watt may not be what he once was, he's still much better than most DE's you could pick up today or in the draft in the rounds we pick. Leaving the team is an empty threat. I am a Houstonian, and I can only root for Houston. Hell I couldn't root for the Oilers when they left lol. I'm really hoping Gaine can take us back to 2012 level performance and more with Watson behind center. He has been handed a gift and a curse of a project.

 

[TheKDog]

We have a lot of talent

Is this actually true?

Great talent on offense- Hopkins and Watson
Good talent on offense- Will Fuller and maybe Lamar Miller (who is declining) and Fiedo (but Fiedo may not play)

Everything else on offense is basically crap though there is hope for younger guys like Martin.

Great talent on defense- Clowney (injury prone?), Mercilus, Watt (may never be the same)
Good talent on defense- McKinney, Cunningham, Covington, Reader, Joseph (declining)

Maybe Cole develops and Kevin Johnson bounces back.

The defense is in better shape but it's still not a lot.

 

[Perki-Perk]

Is this actually true?

Great talent on offense- Hopkins and Watson
Good talent on offense- Will Fuller and maybe Lamar Miller (who is declining) and Fiedo (but Fiedo may not play)
I would add Anderson and Ellington to the good talent list. We could use a blocking tight end and a power runner.

Everything else on offense is basically crap though there is hope for younger guys like Martin. I'd like to see how Davenport could develop too. May be hope there as well.

Great talent on defense- Clowney (injury prone?), Mercilus, Watt (may never be the same)
Good talent on defense- McKinney, Cunningham, Covington, Reader, Joseph (declining)

Maybe Cole develops and Kevin Johnson bounces back. This is key

The defense is in better shape but it's still not a lot.

I think with Watson and what we all saw, You don't need a whole lot of talent on offense, similar to other great QBs who didn't need as much talent around them to win. The OL is most important here to me.

 

[Speedy]

You can't really do an Astros type tear down in the NFL. Those high draft picks the Astros collected over that time period didn't have to make an immediate impact like they would need to in the NFL.

In the NFL you have to rebuild on the fly. Sure, high draft picks for 5 straight seasons might help the cause like the Jags have done, but look at the team's that have won the last 16 years or so. They're basically the same teams and they rarely have high picks to keep them going.

Not to mention trades don't work the same in NFL like they do in baseball where 4 for 1 player swaps are common. In the NFL draft picks are the hot commodity, not prospects. And again, those draft picks have to make a difference almost immediately unlike a prospect in baseball who can spend a couple of years in the minors. So an Astros like rebuild for the Texans doesn't really make a lot of sense.

The problem the Texans have is making decisions so bad that they've left themselves with fewer options to add more talent, i.e. no draft picks in the 1st 2 rounds. Recovering from that is the hump they have to find a way to get over. Doing an Astros like dumping of everyone worth a damn isn't the way.

 

[Perki-Perk]

You can't really do an Astros type tear down in the NFL. Those high draft picks the Astros collected over that time period didn't have to make an immediate impact like they would need to in the NFL.

In the NFL you have to rebuild on the fly. Sure, high draft picks for 5 straight seasons might help the cause like the Jags have done, but look at the team's that have won the last 16 years or so. They're basically the same teams and they rarely have high picks to keep them going.

Not to mention trades don't work the same in NFL like they do in baseball where 4 for 1 player swaps are common. In the NFL draft picks are the hot commodity, not prospects. And again, those draft picks have to make a difference almost immediately unlike a prospect in baseball who can spend a couple of years in the minors. So an Astros like rebuild for the Texans doesn't really make a lot of sense.

The problem the Texans have is making decisions so bad that they've left themselves with fewer options to add more talent, i.e. no draft picks in the 1st 2 rounds. Recovering from that is the hump they have to find a way to get over. Doing an Astros like dumping of everyone worth a damn isn't the way.

I would only count losing that 2nd round pick to bad decisions and maybe (Trading Osweiler). If Watson pans out with the promise he showed, you give up that 1st for him every time without question. More on the Osweiler trade, while I'm not for certain there are a couple things here that make me almost give a pass on that, ALMOST. The Texans were FINALLY trying to do something to solve QB situation and BO was the hot thing on the market. The Broncos made a comparable offer, but the Texans offered more. Obviously, he sucked and now he's back in Denver backing up whoever. Sometimes you miss. And because he missed, RS tried to fix it as fast as possible, trading him and a 2nd (and there is speculation the draft swap may have been included). Now we have cap room THIS offseason to try and fix the line with, because we aren't sitting on Os's fat ass contract with a shiny new franchise QB to boot. Only if the Rockets could pull off something similar to dump Anderson's contract.

 

[steelbtexan]

I would only count losing that 2nd round pick to bad decisions and maybe (Trading Osweiler). If Watson pans out with the promise he showed, you give up that 1st for him every time without question. More on the Osweiler trade, while I'm not for certain there are a couple things here that make me almost give a pass on that, ALMOST. The Texans were FINALLY trying to do something to solve QB situation and BO was the hot thing on the market. The Broncos made a comparable offer, but the Texans offered more. Obviously, he sucked and now he's back in Denver backing up whoever. Sometimes you miss. And because he missed, RS tried to fix it as fast as possible, trading him and a 2nd (and there is speculation the draft swap may have been included). Now we have cap room THIS offseason to try and fix the line with, because we aren't sitting on Os's fat ass contract with a shiny new franchise QB to boot. Only if the Rockets could pull off something similar to dump Anderson's contract.

They had cap space last yr in a much better FA OL class and did abosultely nothing to fix the problem. Trading a 2nd for Os was flat out stupid. You make him ride the bench last yr then cut him and save cap $$$$ that way.

The problem has been the Texans org doesn't acquire players the right way. (talent trumps everything.) Couple that with Ricky usually striking out in rds 2-4 and you get 4-12. Hopefully Gaine can get this franchise back to where it needs to be. He's a smart guy and I would bet on him succeeding. Looks like the McNair's agree with me on this one.

Seems like Ricky was always scrambling to fill holes, which leads to the bad picks instead of acquiring the most talented players. A good GM needs to match up the draft yrs strength to what he needs. If the strengths dont match up you fill the holes in FA. Luckily the draft this yr matches up with the 2 biggest holes. (OL/DB)

 

[Perki-Perk]

They had cap space last yr in a much better FA OL class and did abosultely nothing to fix the problem. Trading a 2nd for Os was flat out stupid. You make him ride the bench last yr then cut him and save cap $$$$ that way.

The problem has been the Texans org doesn't acquire players the right way. (talent trumps everything.) Couple that with Ricky usually striking out in rds 2-4 and you get 4-12. Hopefully Gaine can get this franchise back to where it needs to be. He's a smart guy and I would bet on him succeeding. Looks like the McNair's agree with me on this one.

Seems like Ricky was always scrambling to fill holes, which leads to the bad picks instead of acquiring the most talented players. A good GM needs to match up the draft yrs strength to what he needs. If the strengths dont match up you fill the holes in FA. Luckily the draft this yr matches up with the 2 biggest holes. (OL/DB)

I hope you didn't take that as a defense of RS, as was not my intention. I agree with you in most of this assessment, but if it is true that Osweiler became a locker room cancer and got into a screaming match with the coach, you have to get rid of that guy.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

You can't really do an Astros type tear down in the NFL. Those high draft picks the Astros collected over that time period didn't have to make an immediate impact like they would need to in the NFL.

In the NFL you have to rebuild on the fly. Sure, high draft picks for 5 straight seasons might help the cause like the Jags have done, but look at the team's that have won the last 16 years or so. They're basically the same teams and they rarely have high picks to keep them going.

Not to mention trades don't work the same in NFL like they do in baseball where 4 for 1 player swaps are common. In the NFL draft picks are the hot commodity, not prospects. And again, those draft picks have to make a difference almost immediately unlike a prospect in baseball who can spend a couple of years in the minors. So an Astros like rebuild for the Texans doesn't really make a lot of sense.

The problem the Texans have is making decisions so bad that they've left themselves with fewer options to add more talent, i.e. no draft picks in the 1st 2 rounds. Recovering from that is the hump they have to find a way to get over. Doing an Astros like dumping of everyone worth a damn isn't the way.

I never meant that the Texans would need to do a complete tear-down, but by the same token, the Texans aren't going to turn this mess around in 1 season. If Gaine has a good draft, then I will be excited about the next 2 drafts that will be necessary to really set the foundation for this team. I believe this draft would be considered highly successful if it nets 2 starters immediately, a couple of solid rotation guys, and some development/ST or PS players. This could be the start of a quick and effective turnaround.

 

[Double Barrel]

A lot of people on here like to think selecting QBs are easy, and if you fail on it, you should be fired. Lol.

I'm not sure about the easy part, but no doubt that your second point is life in the NFL for most teams if you fail.

And by "most teams", I mean everyone but the Cleveland Browns and their 1-31 HC for the past two seasons.

I know where it came from because I posted it as a joke years ago (true story).
I did it because I saw they were joined at the hip with respect to personnel decisions. Back then, Smith would hardly make a move without running it past Kubiak.

And I think that's the way it should be. How else can a GM and scouting dept make good/effective evaluations unless they and the coaching staff are thinking along the same lines??

Yep. This is why the "traditional" method of an owner choosing a GM and letting that person dictate vision, direction, and choosing his HC has been in place for so many years. The GM would certainly pick a HC that he's "aligned" with because it's his ass on the line, too.

The Texans do things so ass backwards that they let the HC determine vision, be part of the GM hiring process, and then dissipate power with consensus-building that it is very difficult - if not downright impossible - to determine responsibility for poor decisions.

 

[Speedy]

I would only count losing that 2nd round pick to bad decisions and maybe (Trading Osweiler). If Watson pans out with the promise he showed, you give up that 1st for him every time without question. More on the Osweiler trade, while I'm not for certain there are a couple things here that make me almost give a pass on that, ALMOST. The Texans were FINALLY trying to do something to solve QB situation and BO was the hot thing on the market. The Broncos made a comparable offer, but the Texans offered more. Obviously, he sucked and now he's back in Denver backing up whoever. Sometimes you miss. And because he missed, RS tried to fix it as fast as possible, trading him and a 2nd (and there is speculation the draft swap may have been included). Now we have cap room THIS offseason to try and fix the line with, because we aren't sitting on Os's fat ass contract with a shiny new franchise QB to boot. Only if the Rockets could pull off something similar to dump Anderson's contract.

I get using the 1st to move up to get Watson, but then there's the years of bad decisions not addressing QB.

 

[DocBar]

I hope you didn't take that as a defense of RS, as was not my intention. I agree with you in most of this assessment, but if it is true that Osweiler became a locker room cancer and got into a screaming match with the coach, you have to get rid of that guy.

You make him a post June cut, choke on the dead money and keep your 2nd round draft pick.

 

[Perki-Perk]

I get using the 1st to move up to get Watson, but then there's the years of bad decisions not addressing QB.

Rick Smith Should have just traded the rest of his draft picks for an additional first round pick each year and we'd be sitting pretty. Here's 2-7 for your late first, because we aren't going to hit on it anyway. Maybe then he could have drafted Blake Bortles. Or Jonny Manziel...or whoever else was the hot name at the time with the pick we had. Seriously, I wish I had the foresite was as good as my hindsite like some of the folks here. Y'all look back and act like Dak, Carr, Bridgewater, etc etc were a lock, NO. There is a reason they were taken later and not in the top 10. essin emmin my H

 

[Speedy]

Rick Smith Should have just traded the rest of his draft picks for an additional first round pick each year and we'd be sitting pretty. Here's 2-7 for your late first, because we aren't going to hit on it anyway. Maybe then he could have drafted Blake Bortles. Or Jonny Manziel...or whoever else was the hot name at the time with the pick we had. Seriously, I wish I had the foresite was as good as my hindsite like some of the folks here. Y'all look back and act like Dak, Carr, Bridgewater, etc etc were a lock, NO. There is a reason they were taken later and not in the top 10. essin emmin my H

Trying vs. not trying, I'll take the former every time.

 

[Perki-Perk]

Trying vs. not trying, I'll take the former every time.

This is a very subjective argument here and while they may not have tried during the draft for various...ah eff this, I don't even like Rick Smith enough to put forward the effort here.

 

[TheKDog]

Rick Smith Should have just traded the rest of his draft picks for an additional first round pick each year and we'd be sitting pretty. Here's 2-7 for your late first, because we aren't going to hit on it anyway. Maybe then he could have drafted Blake Bortles. Or Jonny Manziel...or whoever else was the hot name at the time with the pick we had. Seriously, I wish I had the foresite was as good as my hindsite like some of the folks here. Y'all look back and act like Dak, Carr, Bridgewater, etc etc were a lock, NO. There is a reason they were taken later and not in the top 10. essin emmin my H

No one said they were a lock. But the QB guru went with really bad options instead

 

[Texansballer74]

If the talent level isn't improved and Luck comes back I could see them losing twice. Where we disagree is you want to blame losing to the Colts on coaching. I say if you look at the roster for the last Colts game where the QB1 is Yates and The WR1 is Thompson along with the OL they fielded that day, Lombardi could coach that team and they would still suck.

And yet we were up. The Colts did not and I mean did not have a good team last year. They had just as much changes to their roster as well. They had an inexperience QB who is merely a backup. They had a terrible defense as well. They had an old RB who might shut it down this off season.

 

[Texansballer74]

I wonder if some people in here have the same unrealistic expectations of themselves at their jobs that they do of the new GM. No 1st or 2nd round pick, an owner that made a statement that pissed a lot of people off, and you want what? A one year turn around? LMAO. Some of you people are great entertainment in here. It's like reading the script to Idiocracy in here and on message boards around the interwebs.

For what it's worth though, I do expect we will be back to playoff contention next year, and probably barely miss it on the last game of the season a la the early 90s Oilers. After a full year under Gaine's belt, and if Watson stays healthy and continues to shine, I fully expect that in year 2 we are competing in the AFC Championship game. We have a lot of talent, just a lot of holes to fill. If we don't win a superbowl in the next 5 years or so with a healthy Watson, I MIGHT be an NFL free agent fan. 20 years is too long to not get your $h!t together as an organization and I'm not really a gluten for punishment.

So basically you're calling me an idiot because I think we can still make the playoffs with a healthy roster. You'r acting as if we just don't have the talent when we seen the offense put up 30 points a game with a healthy Watson ( consistently might I add). The year before we had the #1 defense. We had one of the top front 7 that year as well. And that was without JJ Watt. So how in the hell is that farfetched to think they could make a run for the playoffs next season.

 

[banned1976]

And yet we were up. The Colts did not and I mean did not have a good team last year. They had just as much changes to their roster as well. They had an inexperience QB who is merely a backup. They had a terrible defense as well. They had an old RB who might shut it down this off season.

That game might as well have been a scrimmage. I understand O'Brien isn't a great coach, he might not even be a good one. But if you want to pick a game to indict him on, I'd choose a different game than the last game of the season which was, as you pointed out two injury riddled 3-13 (at that point) teams that just wanted to get the season over with.

 

[Perki-Perk]

So basically you're calling me an idiot because I think we can still make the playoffs with a healthy roster. You'r acting as if we just don't have the talent when we seen the offense put up 30 points a game with a healthy Watson ( consistently might I add). The year before we had the #1 defense. We had one of the top front 7 that year as well. And that was without JJ Watt. So how in the hell is that farfetched to think they could make a run for the playoffs next season.

Well then I wasn't talking to you and misunderstood your comment lol. If you look at one of the other posts I made, I fully expect a playoff run next year with the possibility of barely missing it, then after year 2 of Brian Gaine, I want to be in the Conference Championship and think it is a realistic goal.

 

[Texansballer74]

Well then I wasn't talking to you and misunderstood your comment lol. If you look at one of the other posts I made, I fully expect a playoff run next year with the possibility of barely missing it, then after year 2 of Brian Gaine, I want to be in the Conference Championship and think it is a realistic goal.

I seen that comment. Had me confused with the expectations comment. My thing is BG will have address that offensive line as well as the TE position. He has some cleaning up to do but we have some really solid players on both sides of the ball. With a good bed of healthy I don't see any problems with us making a strong run for the playoffs. But hey time will tell.

 

[Texansballer74]

That game might as well have been a scrimmage. I understand O'Brien isn't a great coach, he might not even be a good one. But if you want to pick a game to indict him on, I'd choose a different game than the last game of the season which was, as you pointed out two injury riddled 3-13 (at that point) teams that just wanted to get the season over with.

I have a **** load of games ro indict him. Ive also mentioned two other dang games in which I see you completely ignored.

 

[Malloy]

And it begins.

WHat do you want him to say? 'Oh nose we're puckered... I hate this guy and I have no respect for his body of work... I'm the one that threw him out of town last year!!!'... ?

 

[Malloy]

So you're saying you don't like your cereal?

Freudian slut... SLIP!!

 

[adama51]

No way in hell a better coached team loses twice to the terrible Colts team.

 

[Malloy]

double post

 

[Texansballer74]

WHat do you want him to say? 'Oh nose we're puckered... I hate this guy and I have no respect for his body of work... I'm the one that threw him out of town last year!!!'... ?

The freaking truth.

 

[Mr teX]

The freaking truth.

which is what exactly?

 

[TheKDog]

IMO, OBrien got his way under Rick Smith, but when move after move failed, he blamed the scouting and Rick.

He thinks with "alignment" that his moves will now work out brilliantly.

 

[Lucky]

You can't really do an Astros type tear down in the NFL. Those high draft picks the Astros collected over that time period didn't have to make an immediate impact like they would need to in the NFL.

Exactly. MLB teams can keep prospects in the minors for 5 seasons, then they can't become free agents for 6 more. The longest rookie contract in the NFL is 5 years (4 years plus a club option). Make it or break it in the NFL.

 

[Double Barrel]

IMO, OBrien got his way under Rick Smith, but when move after move failed, he blamed the scouting and Rick.

He thinks with "alignment" that his moves will now work out brilliantly.

The thing is, we don't really know for certain who got their way with any given decision. That's not how the Texans front office is structured.

I get that Rick was the GM and takes the heat, but really, the power structure on Kirby is cloudy, at best.

For instance, good and bad: We still don't know who really picked JJ Watt, and we still do not know who was really pushing for Brock. You can find public statements claiming to be responsible for JJ (who doesn't want that feather in their hat?). And we can find public statements at the time of signing Brock claiming it was a joint decision, but when it went south, we find quasi-public rumors and innuendos pointing fingers for it.

Now, though, with O'Brien being a part of the GM hiring process and the mention of being aligned, we will at least be able to point in his general direction since he's supposed to be the man with the vision and has a GM that supports it.

 

[infantrycak]

For instance, good and bad: We still don't know who really picked JJ Watt....

I thought Wade gave the perfect insight on that and how the Texans operate generally. Not a quote but pretty sure a close paraphrase: 'We targeted Patrick Peterson. Rick worked out a trade with Atlanta for #6 to go get him. Arizona took him at #5. Rick asked if we wanted to still make the trade and take Aldon Smith. We talked and decided we were good with our choices at #11. When #11 came around and JJ was still available we were happy to take him.'

That's how I imagine Texans' drafts generally. I'm sure there have been some disagreements, but unless we have specific information to the contrary, the credit or blame goes to them collectively.

I know that's frustrating as hell to fans who want to burn Kewpie dolls of their most hated team member.

 

[Earl34]

I thought Wade gave the perfect insight on that and how the Texans operate generally. Not a quote but pretty sure a close paraphrase: 'We targeted Patrick Peterson. Rick worked out a trade with Atlanta for #6 to go get him. Arizona took him at #5. Rick asked if we wanted to still make the trade and take Aldon Smith. We talked and decided we were good with our choices at #11. When #11 came around and JJ was still available we were happy to take him.'

That's how I imagine Texans' drafts generally. I'm sure there have been some disagreements, but unless we have specific information to the contrary, the credit or blame goes to them collectively.

I know that's frustrating as hell to fans who want to burn Kewpie dolls of their most hated team member.

Agree 100% and most objective people can understand that scenario and the working relationship. This is why McNair should have fired Smith and Kubiak or Smith and O'Brien. You cannot separate the wheat from the chaff.

I read a tweet from Stephanie Stradley where she hints that Smith wasn't strong enough to prevent the owner from making bad decisions (Reed or Osweiler?) and coaches felt he relied too much on them to make draft decisions.

It seems that the biggest flaw in this decision making process is accountability. Coaches can always say, "you're not giving us enough good options or we are picking the best of a bad lot". On the other hand, the GM can say, you wanted that guy. Based on the results, regardless of hits or misses, the GM and coach will eventually want more control because they can easily rationalize the other side had a greater impact on the misses.

 

[Double Barrel]

I thought Wade gave the perfect insight on that and how the Texans operate generally. Not a quote but pretty sure a close paraphrase: 'We targeted Patrick Peterson. Rick worked out a trade with Atlanta for #6 to go get him. Arizona took him at #5. Rick asked if we wanted to still make the trade and take Aldon Smith. We talked and decided we were good with our choices at #11. When #11 came around and JJ was still available we were happy to take him.'

That's how I imagine Texans' drafts generally. I'm sure there have been some disagreements, but unless we have specific information to the contrary, the credit or blame goes to them collectively.

I know that's frustrating as hell to fans who want to burn Kewpie dolls of their most hated team member.

Yep, this falls in line with just about everything we have heard with the way the front office works. It is easier to point the finger at a dictator-like structure, but that's not the Texans.

Here's some more Wade nuggets about JJ:

"With players, you give your opinion and then whoever's in charge of the Draft decides how good your opinion is," Phillips said at the time. "With [Saints defensive end] Rickey [Jackson], my Dad sent me up to watch him and Hugh Green at Pittsburgh, and we obviously ended up picking him.

"With JJ, half the group didn't want him and half the group did. Our side won, and it turned out great."

As Phillips admitted during the interview, "there was some dissent" toward drafting Watt and even the people backing his selection had no idea that he would end up being as good as he's been.

"A few of us stood up strongly for him at 11th overall — there was some dissent — but I don't think any of us thought at the time that he'd be the dominant player that he's been," Phillips recalled. "We thought he was gonna be good. What we saw is that he had a great feel for where the football was. He had more pass breakups than any of the defensive backs. He knocked down so many passes. He's a great athlete, and I think people kind of miss that. They worked him out at the combine as a linebacker, and he moved pretty well there, and he has tremendous acceleration.

"We liked him a lot, obviously, and after his first year I told everybody he was gonna be in the Hall of Fame."

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