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Brandin Cooks to the Texans

steelbtexan said:
It's been discussed why this happened. The entire Rams offense sucked.

I read somewhere it was 8 mil this year and if he doesn't produce they can cut him with very little cap ramifications.

I think last year was an outlier. I'm actually very happy to get a wr with speed that's only missed 2 games in the last 5 years.
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Rams offense sucked? They were number 7 in the NFL for total offense while the Texans ranked 13. Rams threw for 717 more yards than the Texans last season.

www.espn.com

2023 NFL Offense Total Team Stat Leaders - ESPN

ESPN is the place for NFL stats! Find a list of the Offense Total team stat leaders for the 2023 NFL Regular Season.
www.espn.com www.espn.com

If Sean McVay can't or won't get a WR heavily involved in the offense, do you really think BOB can?
 
houstonhurricane said:
Moving past the lunacy of the Hopkins trade that got us here...why in the world would you trade a second rounder in this deep WR draft for a guy who wholly underperformed last year and has at least a concerning history with concussions? So many talented rookie WR’s who would cost less, be cemented on the team for the years ahead, and still give you the type of explosive speed we seem to be interested in. Makes. No. Sense.
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What's lunacy is that the Hopkins trade itself wasn't the end of it. Because now OB has created a need he didn't have before, he's now got to go out and do the Cooks deal. He's trying to solve problems that he's creating.
 
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
 
Lucky said:
The #4 passing offense. Robert Woods put up 1100 yards receiving. Cooper Kupp put up 1100 yards. Cooks failed to get to 600. If there is a reason the the Rams offense under performed from the previous season, point to Brandin Cooks as the reason.
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The emergence of a healthy Cooper Kupp, Goff's favorite target, likely was the main reason for Cook's 2019 production dropoff. To your point, he clearly fell out a favor to Kupp, Woods, and a shift by the Rams to incorporate their TEs more.
 
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Killer Bee said:
The emergence of a healthy Cooper Kupp, Goff's favorite target, likely was the main reason for Cook's 2019 production dropoff. To your point, he clearly feel out a favor to Kupp, Woods, and a shift by the Rams to incorporate their TEs more.
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So Cooks is not as good as Woods or Kupp? That makes sense. Why does Billy Oh think Cooks is an adequate replacement for Hopkins? Because Hopkins is better than Woods or Kupp.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
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I hope so. Actually I expect so. With this speed, any coach is going to find ways to use it. X and Z going deep. Slot across the middle. TE up the seam. RB in the flat. A nightmare for defenses. It'll be in Watson's hands to read the open man.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
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The check down play was to Marshall Faulk. When the Texans have a Marshall Faulk type RB, the show will be able to go on. What we have in Houston is a bunch of identical parts that will be forced into unfamiliar roles.
 
Uncle Rico said:
so give up a 2nd for a rental or eat the salary for a bigger injury concern than Jadaveon Clowney.
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playing devils advocate here, but I would think if he proves to be injury prone then it would be a one year rental.

If he proves to be a player, then we’ll pick up the rest of his contract. Basically we gave up a 2nd round pick to bring Cooks in on an $8M one year prove it deal.

It’s the dumbest gamble you can imagine. Unless it works.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
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Those Rams had a top 5 run game, top 2 YPC, and a #1 overall offense in both yards and points. Texans have never come close to any of that under OB, including Mike Martz being a lot more of an offensive guru than OB could ever dream of being.

Let's not forget, OB is still the designer of this offense. It's still the clusterfuck that takes 3 years to get down and now you've got a major portion of your skill players in it for the 1st time. And now, no off-season workouts.
 
Killer Bee said:
The emergence of a healthy Cooper Kupp, Goff's favorite target, likely was the main reason for Cook's 2019 production dropoff. To your point, he clearly feel out a favor to Kupp, Woods, and a shift by the Rams to incorporate their TEs more.
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What do you make of the Rams receiver’s YPC? Kupp & Woods avg just over 12 ypc, like a good TE. Cooks avg right at 14, like a WR.

Two years previous Kupp & Woods avg’d over 14 yards. Cooks 16
 
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thunderkyss said:
playing devils advocate here, but I would think if he proves to be injury prone then it would be a one year rental.

If he proves to be a player, then we’ll pick up the rest of his contract. Basically we gave up a 2nd round pick to bring Cooks in on an $8M one year prove it deal.

It’s the dumbest gamble you can imagine. Unless it works.
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And me being the optimist, it's going to work.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
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It’s a solid theory, let’s face it even the biggest of Watson fans will admit he loves the highlight reel plays. He’s gotten better but he still looks for that down field ,deep ball first. It could be that whoever is pushing for this 3 speed demon WR group is trying to create the kind of scheme Watson likes. That’s most likely wishful thinking but at least it’s a theory.

Let’s face it as things were Texans were never going to change. I don’t like the Hopkins trade because of the value we got but other than that sometimes to push forward you do have to look at the whole picture and ask yourself “If everything was on the table and there were no sacred cows what would I change to try and get over the hump.” Could be I’m giving OB to much credit but whether by design or circumstance that’s where we are now.

I don’t see next season being a repeat of what we have seen, whether it works or crash and burns I don’t know but I do believe it will be different. Maybe at this point different is the best we can hope for.
 
thunderkyss said:
playing devils advocate here, but I would think if he proves to be injury prone then it would be a one year rental.

If he proves to be a player, then we’ll pick up the rest of his contract. Basically we gave up a 2nd round pick to bring Cooks in on an $8M one year prove it deal.

It’s the dumbest gamble you can imagine. Unless it works.
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Do you think signing Cooks precludes drafting a WR @ 40. Should be several good receivers to choose from.

Even if Cooks does have a good year we might have found his replacement with a years experience, and on a rookie contract.

This would allow a trade of Cooks. Not a good year? Eight million $ rental.

:coffee:
 
thunderkyss said:
I’m pretty sure we’re going to establish the run to set up the pass.
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With the receivers OB has pulled together, this offense is being designed as a passing offense. The pass will set up the run game. Or it may better be described as the threat of the pass will set up the run game.
 
cuppacoffee said:
Do you think signing Cooks precludes drafting a WR @ 40. Should be several good receivers to choose from.

Even if Cooks does have a good year we might have found his replacement with a years experience, and on a rookie contract.

This would allow a trade of Cooks. Not a good year? Eight million $ rental.

:coffee:
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I’m pretty sure BO’b is in win now mode so we’re more likely to reach for need than any bpa scenario you could dream up.
 
Number19 said:
With the receivers OB has pulled together, this offense is being designed as a passing offense. The pass will set up the run game. Or it may better be described as the threat of the pass will set up the run game.
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:kitten:
 
OptimisticTexan said:
OK,

RAMS Trade to TEXANS:
Rams Send:
WR- Brandon Cooks (2019: 2 Concussions & 42 REC / 583 YDS + Full Contract 8M Guaranteed)
2022 RD4 Pick

Texans Send:
2020 RD2-057 Pick

TEXANS Trade to CARDINALS:
Texans Send:
WR- Deandre Hopkins (2019: 104 REC / 1,165 YDS + 0 Guaranteed on Contract)
2020 RD4-131

Cardinals Send:
RB- David Johnson (2019: RB3 / 94 RUS / 345 YDS / 36 REC / 370 YDS + 10.2M Guaranteed & 14.2M Cap Hit)
2020 RD2-040 Pick
2021 RD4-??? Pick

Brandon Cooks 2019 production would never warrant a RD2-057 pick from any other organization......except the Texans.
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What would warrant a Cooks trade.

Your mixing the 2 trades together.

I look at it like this, could the Texans or any team for that matter draft a WR at 57 that's as good as Cooks in yrs 1-2? Keep in mind that there will be no OTA's and probably a shorter TC to help get the rookie WR you draft at 57.

Other than last yr (We've talked about this) what Wr in this draft has Cooks production (You can only hope a rookie WR can achieve the level of success Cooks has achieved in his NFL career.) and can match his production next yr? The only guys that can give you this kind of production as rookies with no OTA's/TC are Juedy/Lamb.

Ruggs is a young Cooks IMHO and you can expect numbers similar to Cooks rookie yr from him. Of course Ruggs is going top 15 and may not even be able to reach Cooks rookie numbers with no OTA's/TC.

Bottom line is do you think Cooks had an off yr or do you think he's in decline? CnD's post about Cooks injury history turned me into a yes on this deal. Cooks talent is undeniable and if he stays healthy he's well worth pick 57. He gives the Texans what they miss when WFV gets hurt again and when both are healthy along with Cobb there will always be somebody open DW4 just has to get them the ball.

The Texans have a better overall WR corps if healthy this yr than they did last yr and that was with Nuk playing great. There are more weapons at DW4's disposal.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Let's see, Rams are in cap hell and looking to dump salaries of lower performing but highly paid players. OB calls the Rams to enquire about Cooks.....Rams ask for a RD2....OB should've laughed and said call me when you're serious. How many other teams were on the get Cooks at all cost bandwagon? I'm pretty sure the Texans were only bidding against themselves. If OB had played hardball, he probably gets Cooks for a RD5 at best and RD4 at worst while taking on his entire contract. Eager Beaver OB got himself into a fan hole.
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This is all speculation.

You dont know this.

When the Nuk trade went down and 4 teams were reported to have bid on him, posters on here said no way that Nuk is only worth 40. Well, that was the best deal on the table at the time whether posters are willing to admit this or not.

Posters are having trouble with the Nuk trade and the change that BOB has brought to the team and the rebuilt WR corps without Nuk. I get this, but if healthy the newly constructed WR corps is better even without Nuk. IMHO
 
Number19 said:
With the receivers OB has pulled together, this offense is being designed as a passing offense. The pass will set up the run game. Or it may better be described as the threat of the pass will set up the run game.
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Hopefully this is the case.
 
houstonhurricane said:
Moving past the lunacy of the Hopkins trade that got us here...why in the world would you trade a second rounder in this deep WR draft for a guy who wholly underperformed last year and has at least a concerning history with concussions? So many talented rookie WR’s who would cost less, be cemented on the team for the years ahead, and still give you the type of explosive speed we seem to be interested in. Makes. No. Sense.
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Who are these WR's that can come in day 1 and put up the production Cooks has had in his career that would be available at 57?
 
Rich Schmidt said:
Because your head coach is your GM and thus 2020 is more important then the outer years. GM's think more long term, coaches look out for today or they get fired. Thus why very few coaches are good GM's, hard to balance this. If we were close to the SB, I see going all in and weighing proven vets a bit higher, but sadly we are just a fringe contender so doing short term things will only speed our demise
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Agreed

Which wouldn't be a bad thing.
 
Speedy said:
Those Rams had a top 5 run game, top 2 YPC, and a #1 overall offense in both yards and points. Texans have never come close to any of that under OB, including Mike Martz being a lot more of an offensive guru than OB could ever dream of being.

Let's not forget, OB is still the designer of this offense. It's still the clusterfuck that takes 3 years to get down and now you've got a major portion of your skill players in it for the 1st time. And now, no off-season workouts.
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I agree.

I was thinking since we do have a RB if healthy can put up big numbers in both the running game and passing game. And Duke is top notch in the passing game as well. The offensive line wasn’t that bad in run pro last season. Now that we have three receivers who can take the top off. Kelly should design something legit to open up the entire field with his three to four receiver sets. Defenses should find it difficult to handle this offense with all that speed and two backs that are really good in the passing attack. Now leaking the TE up the seam will be that much lethal and dangerous.

Like I stated it’s a wild thought on my behalf. Mainly because we like to run up the gut a lot hoping to establish some dominance.
 
Speedy said:
What's lunacy is that the Hopkins trade itself wasn't the end of it. Because now OB has created a need he didn't have before, he's now got to go out and do the Cooks deal. He's trying to solve problems that he's creating.
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The WR corps is better overall than it was at the end of last season.
 
maverick512000 said:
It’s a solid theory, let’s face it even the biggest of Watson fans will admit he loves the highlight reel plays. He’s gotten better but he still looks for that down field ,deep ball first. It could be that whoever is pushing for this 3 speed demon WR group is trying to create the kind of scheme Watson likes. That’s most likely wishful thinking but at least it’s a theory.

Let’s face it as things were Texans were never going to change. I don’t like the Hopkins trade because of the value we got but other than that sometimes to push forward you do have to look at the whole picture and ask yourself “If everything was on the table and there were no sacred cows what would I change to try and get over the hump.” Could be I’m giving OB to much credit but whether by design or circumstance that’s where we are now.

I don’t see next season being a repeat of what we have seen, whether it works or crash and burns I don’t know but I do believe it will be different. Maybe at this point different is the best we can hope for.
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^^^^
This

And I'm looking forward to this.

Bold moves to try to get this team out of mediocrity or it crashes and burns. Win/Win, I'm on board.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I was listening to Kurt Warner this morning on an interview. He was talking about his first year with the Rams. The description of the Greatest show on turf had me wondering are we trying to do something similar. With all the fast weaponry that we have in the skills department. And the fact that both Watson and O’Brien loves the home rub plays. So whe Kurt said that prolific Rams offense fit him well. And within that offense he would look for the home run (big play) first, then the midrange plans and finally the check down plays. Do you guys thinks, maybe just maybe this will be they type of offense that Kelly employs?

Disclaimer: this is just a wild guess.
Click to expand...

I had to laugh at the thought of O'Brien trying to run that offense!

Lol
 
thunderkyss said:
Was the NFC West one of the toughest divisions in the league last year? Cardinals & Rams struggled all year.
The AFC South was easily as tough as the NFC West in 2019.
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Not sure exactly how you are figuring out "toughest" divisions. If you are just going by total wins, the NFC North was tougher than AFC South.
 
Lucky said:
So Cooks is not as good as Woods or Kupp? That makes sense. Why does Billy Oh think Cooks is an adequate replacement for Hopkins? Because Hopkins is better than Woods or Kupp.
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At face value, I would say Cooks is better then Woods and on par with Kupp, but all three are different players with different skill sets. My point isn't based purely on talent alone. Goff clearly used Kupp as his security blanket, which he also did before Kupp went on IR early in the Rams superbowl run. Additionally, the Rams oline had protection issues, which hindered their ability to stretch the field with Cooks. A less effective run game didn't help either. Hince why the Rams offence transitioned to more short to intermediate pass plays.

In 2018, McVay would make the pre-snap reads for Goff and relay it to him prior to the 15 seconds play clock radio cutout. Defensive coordinators got wise to this last year and would shift coverages after McVays radio was cut. Another reason why the Rams passing attack regressed. Goff is simply a flawed NFL QB. Just like Cook, his 2019 stats are far less impressive then 2018.

I don't think O'Brien, nor anybody for that matter believes Cooks is an adequate replacement for Hopkins. I hated the Hopkins trade. I'm okay with Cooks trade. I much preferred to have Hopkins over Cooks, David Johnson, and a marginal improvement in draft picks. As others have said, there's got to be more than money when it came to Hopkins. Was he really going to sit out with three years left on his contract? We can only hope there's a method to the madness. O'Brien isn't an actual stupid person, foolish and arrogant, but not stupid.

If I had to guess, Hopkins had too much influence and O'Brien didnt like it. Either he felt threatened or was actually being undermined. At the end of the day Hopkins is gone and I'm still not a fan of O'Brien, even less so now. That said, he's clearly adapting the offensive scheme to stretch the field with speedy WRs. It'll be interesting to see how the RBs factor into the short passing game. I dont think the Texans know what they have in David Johnson. Maybe they'll put David and Duke on the field at the same time and cause matchup issues.
 
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cuppacoffee said:
Probable.

I look for a defensive draft.

Really apprehensive for the coming year. So many moving parts. New OC, DC but same weaknesses in pass rush and OL.

:coffee:
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Hopefully they can answer some of these defensive questions in the draft and FA after the draft. Everson Griffen is a guy I would look at. Hopefully this happens, this would represent a big change in the way the Texans org has done business in the past.
 
Killer Bee said:
If I had to guess, Hopkins had too much influence and O'Brien didnt like it. Either he felt threatened or was actually being undermined. At the end of the day Hopkins is gone and I'm still not a fan of O'Brien, even less so now. That said, he's clearly adapting the offensive scheme to stretch the field with speedy WRs. It'll be interesting to see how the RBs factor into the short passing game. I dont think the Texans know what they have in David Johnson. Maybe they'll but David and Duke on the field at the same time and cause matchup issues with defenses.
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No doubt that the Hopkins deal revolved around a personality conflict. Money, change in schematics, regression...that was all BS.

Cooks is the same player as Fuller and Stills. In the past, a superior version. Now, who knows? I don’t know if most fans understand the value of a 2nd round pick. A very likely contributor at a very low cost. If Cooks can produce as he has in the past, that’s still a big cap hit. If he can’t, Billy Oh has petered away a valuable resource. A failed trade, either way.

So if the Rams inability to utilize the deep passing game revolved around poor protection and an ineffective run game, why does anyone think the Texans aren’t facing the same restrictions? Watson will have to hold the ball longer for downfield plays to develop. There’s no bell cow RB on the roster to put fear into the opposing defense. Exactly how is stretching the field going to work if the ball has to come out before the deep pass breaks open?
 
All of you guys arguing over this trade reminds me of arguing over deck chair placement on the titanic after it hit the iceberg. Get it through y’all’s heads - this team is going absolutely nowhere as long as BOB is in charge. It’s all a useless pointless argument. It. Does. Not. Matter.

I just come around once in a while now to check out the **** show. I might actually watch some football this year just to admire the train wreck from afar. Y’all enjoy.
 
Number19 said:
With the receivers OB has pulled together, this offense is being designed as a passing offense. The pass will set up the run game. Or it may better be described as the threat of the pass will set up the run game.
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Billy OH jettisons his best receiver so he can switch to a “passing offense”? I guess that makes sense to some here.
 
Porky said:
All of you guys arguing over this trade reminds me of arguing over deck chair placement on the titanic after it hit the iceberg. Get it through y’all’s heads - this team is going absolutely nowhere as long as BOB is in charge. It’s all a useless pointless argument. It. Does. Not. Matter.

I just come around once in a while now to check out the **** show. I might actually watch some football this year just to admire the train wreck from afar. Y’all enjoy.
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Actually, I think Watson is going to save Billy’s arse. Again. And if you think a contract signed in 2020 will be huge, wait until next offseason comes around.
 
steelbtexan said:
Like I said this isn't about what I would do. For instance I would take chances on guys with character concerns in the draft and FA. (Looking at you Aldon Smith.

This is about the culture BOB's trying to cultivate and me as fan hoping this all works out.

How you got this from my post is beyond me.

You must be going stir crazy or something.
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You are wondering how the MB is going to be if this experiment actually does well. That is my answer. Anything else that I need to explain?.
 
Porky said:
All of you guys arguing over this trade reminds me of arguing over deck chair placement on the titanic after it hit the iceberg. Get it through y’all’s heads - this team is going absolutely nowhere as long as BOB is in charge. It’s all a useless pointless argument. It. Does. Not. Matter.

I just come around once in a while now to check out the **** show. I might actually watch some football this year just to admire the train wreck from afar. Y’all enjoy.
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The next guy will need 10 years to turn this around.

The cap/roster/draft pick situation is extremely bad
 
steelbtexan said:
What would warrant a Cooks trade.

Your mixing the 2 trades together.

I look at it like this, could the Texans or any team for that matter draft a WR at 57 that's as good as Cooks in yrs 1-2? Keep in mind that there will be no OTA's and probably a shorter TC to help get the rookie WR you draft at 57.

Other than last yr (We've talked about this) what Wr in this draft has Cooks production (You can only hope a rookie WR can achieve the level of success Cooks has achieved in his NFL career.) and can match his production next yr? The only guys that can give you this kind of production as rookies with no OTA's/TC are Juedy/Lamb.

Ruggs is a young Cooks IMHO and you can expect numbers similar to Cooks rookie yr from him. Of course Ruggs is going top 15 and may not even be able to reach Cooks rookie numbers with no OTA's/TC.

Bottom line is do you think Cooks had an off yr or do you think he's in decline? CnD's post about Cooks injury history turned me into a yes on this deal. Cooks talent is undeniable and if he stays healthy he's well worth pick 57. He gives the Texans what they miss when WFV gets hurt again and when both are healthy along with Cobb there will always be somebody open DW4 just has to get them the ball.

The Texans have a better overall WR corps if healthy this yr than they did last yr and that was with Nuk playing great. There are more weapons at DW4's disposal.
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Cooks decline might be an accumulation of concussions which may be due to the fact he returned to early instead of giving himself the proper time to heal. No reason to move him to WR3 unless the other 2 just flat out beat him.....based on the numbers that's probably the case. Also, not certain how many folks would've predicted Kupp to be better than Cooks going into the 2019 season.
 
Lucky said:
So if the Rams inability to utilize the deep passing game revolved around poor protection and an ineffective run game, why does anyone think the Texans aren’t facing the same restrictions? Watson will have to hold the ball longer for downfield plays to develop. There’s no bell cow RB on the roster to put fear into the opposing defense. Exactly how is stretching the field going to work if the ball has to come out before the deep pass breaks open?
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I never said us stretching the field will work, just that it seems to be the direction O'Brien is taking the offense, but I'll bite and play devils advocate. First, Deshaun holds onto the ball too long anyways. Granted, long developing plays aren't the hallmark of great offenses, especially with suspect offensive lines, though I think ours will be better next year. Plus, it's not like there wont be check downs available to the TEs and RBs. Hell, Randall Cobb might be the big winner in this whole thing if the safeties are pushed downfield. When Fuller is on the field, our offense is markedly better. Well as you said, we basically got another Will Fuller. Only time will tell what this offensive iteration looks like.
 
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