kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
Give me Smith at #11, or if he does shoot up hopefully Prince might fall down to us. He would be lights out with good safety protection in the cover 2.
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Big Board Thread
- Thread starter beerlover
- Start date
beerlover
Hall of Fame
with all due respect I didn't like what I saw @ the Senior Bowl. Against better competition he lost his base & was easily disengaged with quicker/stronger DE unobstructed to the QB. In short he would get Schaub killed. He needs to increase his core strength & fill into his frame which will take a year or two, then maybe you really got something but in regards to the Texans now he would be a mistake, IMO.
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
I heard the same thing.
I believe it may have been Kerrigan but someone made Solder their mummy dog.
You might have mistaken him with Castonzo. They look similar, especially with that gold helmet.
I counted Solder with one bad play (that he was beaten to the inside by Acho 'cause he played too high) and two subpar plays (one to the inside but it took a little while and the QB scramble up the pocket, and one he was pushed close to the QB who had made a completion - this one probably shouldn't count as a subpar play)
.
Castonzo was involved in at least 4 bad plays.
Got pushed into the QB, forcing poor throws and on one he pulled too far to the right and completely missed the defender who came in for a tackle in the backfield.
There was also a subpar play where he got beat to the inside, but the QB rolled to the other side.
Sherrod was in for 5 bad plays and a couple of subpar plays.
Of the 5 bad plays, 3 were in the passing game (getting pushed in to the QB forcing hurried/poor throws) and two in the running game (one where he let the DT got around him near the goal line to stop the RB for no gain, and one where he completely missed the outside defender, letting him pursue the back side and take away the cut back lane.)
I dindn't wacth Carpenter closely (but there was at least one bad play) since I've already known he was quite inconsistent at Bama the last two years (I do watch a lot of Bama games.)
I didn't watch Carimi either, 'cause he played RT.
As far as competition is concerned.
Of the games I watched, OU and Georgia have players (DEs and LBs) that will be drafted this year and some will be drafted next year.
Jeremy Beal, Justin Houston, Travis Lewis, Akeem Dent to name a few.
Some may be UDFAs because they are close to NFL talent level.
If I have time, I may watch him in action against Jordan (Cali), Clayborn and Ballard (Iowa), Piere Allen (Nebraska), Aldon Smith (Mizzou).
But I suspect he got good grades due to the fact that he can play against those guys anyway.
OK, so I took a look at a couple more games:
California in week 2 ad Nebraska in the last week of the regular season.
In the California game (just as in the game against against Colorado St in week 1) he looked suspected at times.
It was due to him playing high.
However, Jordan couldn't do anything against him.
But Solder had quite a bit of difficulties against Mychal Kendricks, the OLB (giving up 1-1/2 sack and one pressure that was not recorded in the official ncaa stat site - I have found that what I observe on the field has not been the same as whatever the official site recorded at times.)
I guess we need to put a watch on this guy (Kendricks) for next year (he totalled 8-1/2 sacks for the year.)
Against Nebraska, he pretty much controlled the left side.
He did very well against Georgia and OU as I've already mentioned.
I don't see him having problem on the second level at all.
However, I will admit that due to his natural height, he might have problem with the quickness and speed in the NFL. They can set him up with an outside move and come back with an inside move that may give him problem.
(But perhaps it can be helped with whatever they mean by the tackle needing to overset or underset depending on guard play on different blocking scheme?!?)
California in week 2 ad Nebraska in the last week of the regular season.
In the California game (just as in the game against against Colorado St in week 1) he looked suspected at times.
It was due to him playing high.
However, Jordan couldn't do anything against him.
But Solder had quite a bit of difficulties against Mychal Kendricks, the OLB (giving up 1-1/2 sack and one pressure that was not recorded in the official ncaa stat site - I have found that what I observe on the field has not been the same as whatever the official site recorded at times.)
I guess we need to put a watch on this guy (Kendricks) for next year (he totalled 8-1/2 sacks for the year.)
Against Nebraska, he pretty much controlled the left side.
He did very well against Georgia and OU as I've already mentioned.
I don't see him having problem on the second level at all.
However, I will admit that due to his natural height, he might have problem with the quickness and speed in the NFL. They can set him up with an outside move and come back with an inside move that may give him problem.
(But perhaps it can be helped with whatever they mean by the tackle needing to overset or underset depending on guard play on different blocking scheme?!?)
beerlover
Hall of Fame
I appreciate all the time you spend reviewing film. I'm just saying one of the scouting services I subscribe to rates Solder #50th overall & 3rd overall OT prospect. Just from reading your reports the common theme seems to be he struggles with speed inside, this is going to be a problem in the NFL don't you agree? Look I can see investing a first round pick on the position but not to develop, think this is what the Texans saw in Bulter, needed to increase his core strength & refine his tools. Great frame, great attitude & work ethic Nate will surely succeed in the league if he can avoid injury & back pains like other tall LT's see Marcus McNeill, whom the Texans passed on, drafted by San Diego, 2nd rd. 50th overall.
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
FWIW Nebraska's scheme doesn't emphasise outside pass rush from the DE's so you would expect Solder to look like he did good against them.
What about Sebastian Vollmer who measured in at 6'8 and 314 lbs on his pro day.
He turns out to be a very good RT for the Pats.
I've mentioned before that he also had a heck of a game at LT against Freeney (he played LT when Matt Light was out against Denver in week 5 - 09, and started 5 more games at LT). After that, he claimed the starting spot at RT ever since.
He's a kid who played for the Cougars that I thought the Texans should have seriously looked at. (What a value at #58).
I'm curious as to who the scouting service rate at #1 & 2 (must be Carimi and Castonzo)??? But these two guys are about as tall.
Or is it Sherrod and Tyrod Smith??? (I don't dislike these two guys; I just don't like them as much from a couple of games I've watched - maybe more than 2.)
As far as starting, I disagree a little bit, as I din't think the Texans should have started Duane Brown right away.
Now, you have known that I rated Brown in the early 2nd round, but then I had to agreed that he's also the #8 tackle on the board, and if all the others were gone, and the Chargers coming up, I can see why the Texans took him at his spot (I think it was either your or badboy who pointed this out to me.)
I like Solder better than Brown as a prospect.
Back then I did say that Brown sometimes had the same problem that Solder has now.
As a prospect, Brown has a slight edge over Solder in the running game (due to his overall quickness and agility.)
But I can see that Solder is much stronger and can dominate a defender.
And he's really long; once he got all the techniques down, his chance to latch onto the defenders should increase; and once he latches on, we know it's going to be quite difficult for the defender to disengage.
Also, with his low body fat count, it's quite possible for him to add on even more muscle. I see that as a plus over Brown.
Even so, I wouldn't mind at all for him to sit and watch a few games, then play every third series (with Winston sliding into the Guard spot.)
Winston is a vet and a pro; he should be able to handle that.
Or we could start the season with Winston at RG; Butler at RT and Solder alternating every third series.
It's a long shot anyway, since it's highly likely that the Texans won't try to fix something that ain't broken.
At any rate, I haven't really study them all yet so it's still fluid right now.
For example, I haven't watched the drills at the senior bowl practice - I only glossed over it.
I've seen plenty of Castonzo in his soph year, and some in both his junior and senior year. He kinda dissappoint me his senior year (maybe he got some minor health issues?)
I've seen plenty of Carimi his junior year (when I studied Graham) and a couple games this year.
OK, I agree.
The right side of the Cornhuskers was not the best on the front four;
the guys over there were young (Meredith - who was injured during the game and Williams; then Randle is just a Fr).
However, Solder did slip out on the LBs on occasions, and he also slid over on a blitz or two (I think there was at least one corner or safety blitz)
Again, your point is taken.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
I'm 100% with you concerning Sebastian Vollmer & Duane Brown. So what is fair value? one is a steal the other a reach but in the overview of entire draft board they balance out & are an example how the strong fed off mistakes of the weak.
Clearly contained in this BIG BOARD thread, it is noted Nate Solder as highest rated OT in the draft class @ #13. Maybe we, as a group, feel the need to reopen the board & make some adjustments? Clearly Nate could be bumped up higher as some like Stephen Paea have fallen (surgery) just one example, plus reflecting ascending value of Von Miller who most feel is not only top 10 material but could be selected by Arizona #5.
Here is our Big Board with just a few updates (biggest movers Cam Jordon/Von Miller). see what you think & we'll tweak it a bit I think it's time, been almost two months exactly from when we started. Thank You
1. Da'Quan Bowers, DE, Clemson - 6'4 - 280
2. Nick Fairley, Auburn, (Jr.), 6-4, 298
3. Patrick Peterson, DB, LSU - 6'1 - 222
4. A.J. Green, WR, Georgia - 6'4 - 212
5. Von Miller, DE, Texas A&M - 6'3 - 243 previous Blaine Gabbert, Missouri, (Jr.), - 6'5 - 235
6. Marcell Dareus, DT, Alabama - 6'3 - 306
7. Robert Quinn, DE, North Carolina - 6'5 - 268
8. Prince Amukamara, DB, Nebraska - 6'1 - 205
9. Cameron Jordan - DE, California - 6'4 - 285 previous - J.J. Watt, DE/DT, Wisconsin - 6'6 - 290
10. Julio Jones, WR, Alabama - 6'4 - 220
11. Nate Solder, OT, Colorado - 6'9 - 315 previous - Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon State - 6'1 - 311
12. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri, (Jr.), - 6'5 - 235- previous -Von Miller, DE, Texas A&M - 6'3 - 243
13. J.J. Watt, DE/DT, Wisconsin - 6'6 - 290 previous - Nate Solder, OT, Colorado - 6'9 - 315
14. Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa - 6'4 - 285
15. Akeem Ayers, LB, UCLA - 6'4 - 255
16. Jake Locker, QB, Washington - 6'3 - 230
17. Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama - 5'10 - 215
18. Ryan Kerrigan, DE, Purdue - 6'4 - 263
19. Tyron Smith, OT USC - 6'6 - 290
20. Justin Houston, LB Georgia - 6'3 - 260
21. Cameron Newton, QB, Auburn - 6'6 - 250
22. Ryan Mallett, QB, Arkansas - 6'6 - 238
23. Anthony Costanzo OT, Boston College - 6'7 - 308
24. Brandon Harris, CB, Miami - 5'11 - 195
25. Cameron Heyward, DE/DT, Ohio State - 6'5 - 288
26. Aldon Smith, DE/OLB Missouri - 6'5 - 260
27. Mike Pouncey OG, Florida - 6'4 - 310
28. Drake Nevis DT, LSU - 6'1 - 285
29. Derek Sherrod, OT, Mississippi State - 6'5 - 305
30. Stephen Paea, DT, Oregon State - 6'1 - 311 previous - Cameron Jordan - DE, California - 6'4 - 285
31. Mikel LeShoure, Illinois, (Jr.), - 6'0 - 230
32. Corey Liuget, DT, Illinois - 6'3 - 295
(1) I only think that Solder is the #1 LT prospect in this class; I'm not sure where he should be as a pick on the whole board. That part can be adjusted according to whether there is a need among all the NFL teams.
With the runs on tackles the last few year, it's possible than OT is not as highly regarded as recent years.
(2) The more I watched LSU, the more Nevis jumped out at me, whether at NT in the 4-3 or the 3-4 or DE in either scheme. He looks pretty nasty in most games, and he always do a lot of things every game. He seems to be even more consistent than Dareus.
At least he needs to be moved up above Pouncey, because he dominated Pouncey most every time, and never once lost the individual battle (I don't think.) In that game (Bama) they needed to double team him often (as well as in each game that I've watched so far.) Remarkably, he held off the double team really well. I was very impressed with him. He's consistently in the opponent's backfield; I'm thinking he's a very good fit for the one-gap scheme that Wade Phillips runs.
With the runs on tackles the last few year, it's possible than OT is not as highly regarded as recent years.
(2) The more I watched LSU, the more Nevis jumped out at me, whether at NT in the 4-3 or the 3-4 or DE in either scheme. He looks pretty nasty in most games, and he always do a lot of things every game. He seems to be even more consistent than Dareus.
At least he needs to be moved up above Pouncey, because he dominated Pouncey most every time, and never once lost the individual battle (I don't think.) In that game (Bama) they needed to double team him often (as well as in each game that I've watched so far.) Remarkably, he held off the double team really well. I was very impressed with him. He's consistently in the opponent's backfield; I'm thinking he's a very good fit for the one-gap scheme that Wade Phillips runs.
Also, noted that Julio Jones beat Peterson in their matchup both last year and this year.
While the announcer (in this year's game) indicated that last year, Jones did not have any catch against Peterson, it wasn't true.
Peterson was called for PI on one pass.
Peterson got away with PI on one pass.
There was one more instance but I suddenly forgot (just rewatched it last night late - couldn't sleep much but a bit sleepy by the time I wanted to take note.)
In this year game, I can't remember exactly the number, but Jones got either 3 or 4 catches over Peterson (short to medium.)
There was also a pass that Peterson mixed up coverage scheme (I'm not a hundred percent sure, 'cause you never know what defense it's supposed to be some time) but the QB missed Jones, who was wide-open in the corner.
I think Peterson broke off a pass, but it was due to the QB being late getting the ball out.
He broke off another pass (almost an INT) as Jones thought McElroy would just throw the ball away as he was chased out of the pocket.
My memory is kind of hazy now, but at any rate, what I'm sure is that Jones won the match-up fair and square both times (even though Peterson put up a good fight both times.)
While the announcer (in this year's game) indicated that last year, Jones did not have any catch against Peterson, it wasn't true.
Peterson was called for PI on one pass.
Peterson got away with PI on one pass.
There was one more instance but I suddenly forgot (just rewatched it last night late - couldn't sleep much but a bit sleepy by the time I wanted to take note.)
In this year game, I can't remember exactly the number, but Jones got either 3 or 4 catches over Peterson (short to medium.)
There was also a pass that Peterson mixed up coverage scheme (I'm not a hundred percent sure, 'cause you never know what defense it's supposed to be some time) but the QB missed Jones, who was wide-open in the corner.
I think Peterson broke off a pass, but it was due to the QB being late getting the ball out.
He broke off another pass (almost an INT) as Jones thought McElroy would just throw the ball away as he was chased out of the pocket.
My memory is kind of hazy now, but at any rate, what I'm sure is that Jones won the match-up fair and square both times (even though Peterson put up a good fight both times.)
This is why I'm advocating taking Jones at 11. Jones and AJ would almost complete the offense and if there at 11 would represent BPA.
The Texans reaching to fill needs has been a major contributor to their recent draft failings.
Do you like Nevis in the 2nd rd over Taylor? I haven't studied this as much as you. But give me Taylor over Nevis. Taylors' best yrs are ahead of him and trading up into the bottom of the 1st rd should be an option.
Ndevine7
Rookie
I would love to trade down and get taylor at the end of the 1st if there was no proven star at pick 11th. This would give us a chance to get more quality picks and totally rehaul this defense. At this point we could get taylor a cb like williams or smith if and they drop and an olb like acho or reed
Doppelganger
None
At the moment that may be a solid move. However, as time goes along, Taylor may have to be taken at 11 if you want him.
I checked out Ellis and Powe in the Texas vs the Nation game.
They both look like major upgrades to what is currently on the roster at the NT position.
Powe made a great stop on a goalline stand to win the game. This is something as Texans fans we've heard about. But have never seen. LOL
They both look like major upgrades to what is currently on the roster at the NT position.
Powe made a great stop on a goalline stand to win the game. This is something as Texans fans we've heard about. But have never seen. LOL
Texan4Ever
All Pro
I like Powe as a player but he needs to loose weight and drop down to at least 325-Lbs. Also, we're going to need more then one nose tackle so I would like a combination of guys, some with size and some with speed.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Man ... Barry Warner just kills Amobi Okoye on the radio . Says he doesn't like contact and that the Texans scouting stinks . He said if Amobi was a player he'd gone in and asked Wade what it takes to be a NT . Then he'd gone to the trainer and dietician to see how to get there .
OkOye doesn't care he got paid.
That's a pretty dumb statement by Warner. Not that I expect anything else from him.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
1. Da'Quan Bowers, DE, Clemson - 6'4 - 280
2. Nick Fairley, Auburn, (Jr.), 6-4, 298
3. Patrick Peterson, DB, LSU - 6'1 - 222
4. A.J. Green, WR, Georgia - 6'4 - 212
5. Von Miller, DE, Texas A&M - 6'3
As the top rated player coming into the Senior Bowl he aquitted himself nicely displaying his speed, quickness & competitive attitude propelling himself into the top 10.
6. Marcell Dareus, DT, Alabama - 6'3 - 306
7. Robert Quinn, DE, North Carolina - 6'5 - 268
8. Prince Amukamara, DB, Nebraska - 6'1 - 205
9. Cameron Jordan - DE, California - 6'4 - 285
Cam made the biggest move on our board was disruptive & for time being solidified himself as the top rated 5 tech DE in a 3-4 scheme.
10. Julio Jones, WR, Alabama - 6'4 - 220
11. Nate Solder, OT, Colorado - 6'9 - 315
Distanced himself from OT group if for no other reason measureables.
12. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri, (Jr.), - 6'5 - 235
Did nothing but is part of a group yet to be defined as elite QB prospects worthy of Top 10 grade.
13. J.J. Watt, DE/DT, Wisconsin - 6'6 - 290
14. Justin Houston, LB Georgia - 6'3 - 260
15. Akeem Ayers, LB, UCLA - 6'4 - 255
16. Cameron Newton, QB, Auburn - 6'6 - 250
Newton moved up because Locker could possibly be less accurate & given the choice of athletic ability we should move forward with Newton.
17. Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama - 5'10 - 215
18. Ryan Kerrigan, DE, Purdue - 6'4 - 263
Kerrigan is really solid football player, but more of a base 4-3 end still has time to prove otherwise @ combine, pro-days & private workouts.
19. Aldon Smith, DE/OLB Missouri - 6'5 - 260
20. Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa - 6'4 - 285
Clayborn is a fine football player but now rates #3 prospect as a 5 tech DE
21. Jake Locker, QB, Washington - 6'3 - 230
see above
22. Ryan Mallett, QB, Arkansas - 6'6 - 238
23. Anthony Costanzo – OT, Boston College - 6'7 - 308
24. Brandon Harris, CB, Miami - 5'11 - 195
25. Cameron Heyward, DE/DT, Ohio State - 6'5 - 288
26. Tyron Smith, OT USC - 6'6 - 290
27. Mike Pouncey – OG, Florida - 6'4 - 310
28. Drake Nevis – DT, LSU - 6'1 - 285
29. Derek Sherrod, OT, Mississippi State - 6'5 - 305
30. Phillip Taylor, NG/NT, Baylor - 6'3 1/2" - 337
Taylor made himself some money too @ the Senior Bowl & now is the top rated, highly coveted Nose Tackle in the draft while Stephen Paea DT OSU, damaged his lateral meniscus in his right knee during a practice drill at the Senior Bowl.
31. Mikel LeShoure, RB, Illinois, (Jr.), - 6'0 - 230
32. Corey Liuget, DT, Illinois - 6'3 - 295
After the Sr.Bowl and before the combine. I would have to move Taylor into Paea's spot and Paea into the top of the 2nd rd.
But that's just me and JMHO
Thoughts
But that's just me and JMHO
Thoughts
beerlover
Hall of Fame
good catch. see thats what I'm talking bout'
beerlover
Hall of Fame
bump- need more input/suggestions. made some corrections but thats to be expected its been two months since we started.
Texan4Ever
All Pro
Here's my Top 15 Big Board so take it for what its worth (subject to change):
1.) Nick Fairley, DT
2.) AJ Green, WR
3.) Patrick Peterson, CB
4.) Von Miller, OLB
Has improved throughout the course of his career
and is a terror off the edge. Needs to add some bulk and become
stronger, but no doubt the potential is there.
5.) Robert Quinn, DE
6.) Julio Jones, WR
Its been said many times that he may
have a better pro career than he did in college. He is
a go-to receiver and is a vertical threat who combines size,
speed, and ball skills into one nice package.
7.) Da’Quan Bowers, DE
8.) Marcell Dareus, DL
9.) Prince Amukamara, CB
10.) Brandon Harris, CB
Harris is a special player IMO and has a knack for being physical
and has good closing speed. If he can learn to grab the INT instead
of batting the ball away, he would dominate just as Joe Haden and
Devin McCourty have this past season.
11.) JJ Watt, DL
12.) Justin Houston, OLB
13.) Akeem Ayers, OLB
14.) Ryan Kerrigan, DE
Ryan did well during the Senior Bowl game and has developed
some pass-rushing moves. Strictly a 4-3 DE IMO but one of the
more consistent DE in this class in terms of overall production
throughout his collegiate career.
15.) Adrian Clayborn, DE
Reminds me of Tyson Jackson (DE LSU/Kansas City Chiefs),
but with off the field issues. Has the physique to hold his own
and make plays but there was a drop off in production last season.
1.) Nick Fairley, DT
2.) AJ Green, WR
3.) Patrick Peterson, CB
4.) Von Miller, OLB
Has improved throughout the course of his career
and is a terror off the edge. Needs to add some bulk and become
stronger, but no doubt the potential is there.
5.) Robert Quinn, DE
6.) Julio Jones, WR
Its been said many times that he may
have a better pro career than he did in college. He is
a go-to receiver and is a vertical threat who combines size,
speed, and ball skills into one nice package.
7.) Da’Quan Bowers, DE
8.) Marcell Dareus, DL
9.) Prince Amukamara, CB
10.) Brandon Harris, CB
Harris is a special player IMO and has a knack for being physical
and has good closing speed. If he can learn to grab the INT instead
of batting the ball away, he would dominate just as Joe Haden and
Devin McCourty have this past season.
11.) JJ Watt, DL
12.) Justin Houston, OLB
13.) Akeem Ayers, OLB
14.) Ryan Kerrigan, DE
Ryan did well during the Senior Bowl game and has developed
some pass-rushing moves. Strictly a 4-3 DE IMO but one of the
more consistent DE in this class in terms of overall production
throughout his collegiate career.
15.) Adrian Clayborn, DE
Reminds me of Tyson Jackson (DE LSU/Kansas City Chiefs),
but with off the field issues. Has the physique to hold his own
and make plays but there was a drop off in production last season.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
good stuff Texan4Ever. Here is sidelineview.com new website rankings 11-20 with quick re-cap in relation to what we have this moment.
http://thesidelineview.com/2011/02/04/top-11-20-best-available-in-the-nfl-draft/
11. Ryan Kerrigan, DE/OLB, Purdue Size: 64″ 255 lbs.
little high until proven he is a 3-4 OLB IMO. High motor constant pressure using instincts, timing & reads. lacks natural athletic explosiveness. Lance must have personal crush on Ryan then I think why not Watt, same kind of player but bigger?
12. Aldon Smith, DE/OLB, Missouri Size: 65″ 260 lbs.
Relatively un-tested only one solid season, redshirt sophomore draft on potential. 19th on Big Board for that reason.
13. Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama Size: 511″ 225 lbs.
Ingram is worth the 13th pick but he is a RB, maybe some teams think they can find better value later hurts his stock just a bit, we have him #17.
14. Cameron Jordan, DE, Cal Size: 64″ 287 lbs.
Most projections I've seen place him top 10. But Lance was @ the Senior Bowl, versatility to fit both 3-4 or 4-3 end a plus so we have him #9.
15. Justin Houston, OLB, Georgia Size: 64″ 260 lbs.
Been trying to move Houston higher, early favorite for Texans #1. We have him #14.
16. Akeem Ayers, OLB, UCLA Size: 63″ 255 lbs.
Close again Ayers @ #16.
17. Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa Size: 64″ 275 lbs.
Glut of 3-4 ends hurts Clayborn, pushing him back to #20.
18. J.J. Watt, DE, Wisconsin Size: 66″ 292 lbs.
Could be my own personal bias, just love watching this kid play the game. He is very active, plus strong, natural pass rush instincts, clearly higher 3-4 end than Clayborn in my book #13.
19. Cameron Heyward, DE/DT, Ohio State Size: 64″ 287 lbs.
Again another 3-4 end, not sure whats going on here, guess this is the strength of the draft but only one QB & no LT's or DB's? #25
20. Ryan Mallett, QB, Arkansas Size: 67″ 235 lbs.
We have Mallett #22 but where are the rest? I'm not saying one won't be drafted in the Top 10 but our top QB rated is Gabbert #12 & Newton #16.
http://thesidelineview.com/2011/02/04/top-11-20-best-available-in-the-nfl-draft/
11. Ryan Kerrigan, DE/OLB, Purdue Size: 64″ 255 lbs.
little high until proven he is a 3-4 OLB IMO. High motor constant pressure using instincts, timing & reads. lacks natural athletic explosiveness. Lance must have personal crush on Ryan then I think why not Watt, same kind of player but bigger?
12. Aldon Smith, DE/OLB, Missouri Size: 65″ 260 lbs.
Relatively un-tested only one solid season, redshirt sophomore draft on potential. 19th on Big Board for that reason.
13. Mark Ingram, RB, Alabama Size: 511″ 225 lbs.
Ingram is worth the 13th pick but he is a RB, maybe some teams think they can find better value later hurts his stock just a bit, we have him #17.
14. Cameron Jordan, DE, Cal Size: 64″ 287 lbs.
Most projections I've seen place him top 10. But Lance was @ the Senior Bowl, versatility to fit both 3-4 or 4-3 end a plus so we have him #9.
15. Justin Houston, OLB, Georgia Size: 64″ 260 lbs.
Been trying to move Houston higher, early favorite for Texans #1. We have him #14.
16. Akeem Ayers, OLB, UCLA Size: 63″ 255 lbs.
Close again Ayers @ #16.
17. Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa Size: 64″ 275 lbs.
Glut of 3-4 ends hurts Clayborn, pushing him back to #20.
18. J.J. Watt, DE, Wisconsin Size: 66″ 292 lbs.
Could be my own personal bias, just love watching this kid play the game. He is very active, plus strong, natural pass rush instincts, clearly higher 3-4 end than Clayborn in my book #13.
19. Cameron Heyward, DE/DT, Ohio State Size: 64″ 287 lbs.
Again another 3-4 end, not sure whats going on here, guess this is the strength of the draft but only one QB & no LT's or DB's? #25
20. Ryan Mallett, QB, Arkansas Size: 67″ 235 lbs.
We have Mallett #22 but where are the rest? I'm not saying one won't be drafted in the Top 10 but our top QB rated is Gabbert #12 & Newton #16.
Julio Jones will be a bigger stronger Jacoby Jones with better hands, that's for sure!
I know that people talked about him dropping some balls; he didn't do any worse than AJ in this department, from what I can see (and I have watched him play in some 20 plus games.) There are passes that were behind or things of that nature that I noticed once in awhile, even a commentator "expect" him to catch.
Nevis is 100% better than Taylor. I will come back to this in a bit.
Ole Miss Texan
Hall of Fame
Not sure if you're referring to Julio or Jacoby as far as the dropped passes go. Jacoby makes me facepalm a lot though. If I'm not mistaken, I believe Julio played through this season with a broken bone in his hand. The guy has great size and is TOUGH.
I liked Blackmon more at first b/c he seems to be a more exciting WR to me, but I actually think Julio would be a great fit on this team. An excellent #2 opossite AJ. His physicality is something I think Kubiak would like too.
OK, so I studied Taylor against TCU - 3rd game of the season, Texas Tech - 6th game and Okl. St. - 10th game.
These are 3 teams with good passing game; TCU is actually a good running team with a good QB on top of it.
He was a non-factor in all those 3 games.
Taylor did show some flashes here and there, but for the most part, he was inefficient agaisnt these offenses (which is something he can expect to see in the NFL.)
The thing that strikes me is that, as compared with what he showed at the Senior Bowl, he was much heavier in the midsection and ran like it (imagine a huge Donald Duck.)
Not that I was impressed with his showing during the Senior Bowl week.
Honestly, I think people like to see a big NT who can move around, and so they liked what they saw.
If Taylor can keep that weigh then I think he can become a good player in the NFL, once he improves his overall game.
But that red flag (his weigh) somebody has already mentioned needs to be kept in mind if one likes him as a prospect.
He may turn out to be another Frank Okam.
Personally, I don't like him any earlier than our slot in the second round.
(I've seen him in a few other games as well during the season - I follow Robert Griffin, the Baylor QB.)
These are 3 teams with good passing game; TCU is actually a good running team with a good QB on top of it.
He was a non-factor in all those 3 games.
Taylor did show some flashes here and there, but for the most part, he was inefficient agaisnt these offenses (which is something he can expect to see in the NFL.)
The thing that strikes me is that, as compared with what he showed at the Senior Bowl, he was much heavier in the midsection and ran like it (imagine a huge Donald Duck.)
Not that I was impressed with his showing during the Senior Bowl week.
Honestly, I think people like to see a big NT who can move around, and so they liked what they saw.
If Taylor can keep that weigh then I think he can become a good player in the NFL, once he improves his overall game.
But that red flag (his weigh) somebody has already mentioned needs to be kept in mind if one likes him as a prospect.
He may turn out to be another Frank Okam.
Personally, I don't like him any earlier than our slot in the second round.
(I've seen him in a few other games as well during the season - I follow Robert Griffin, the Baylor QB.)
I agree with you.
What I said was that Julio did drop a few catches (I compare him with AJ, who would drop a ball once in awhile.)
Jacoby, on the other hand, dropped a few too many as we all know.
Nevis, on the other hand, IMO, fits the 1-gap scheme of Phillips better.
I've watched him some last year.
This year, so far, I've seen him against Miss St., Florida, Auburn, Alabama, Mississippi, and Arkansas.
(I might have watched the W.Virg and Tennesse games as well during the season.)
He's a contributing factor or a major contibutor in all those games.
He played well against both the run and the pass.
Just by numbers alone, his production is much better than Taylor in most, if not all areas (sacks, tackles for loss, total tackles, QB hurries, forced fumbles, etc.)
And he did it against better competition (compare the two schedules and you will see.)
Beyond the numbers, there are things he does more efficiently than Taylor in the running game that does not show up on the stat sheet.
Let's say, a team can try a run to the right side; Nevis would penetrate that A gap (or push the O-lineman toward the running lane.)
This forces the RB to go wider than he would like, or cut back at a steeper angle.
He can occupy two blockers in this situations (and others), leaving a LB free to get to the RB.
In the passing game, he can put a hand up or he can get close enough to make the QB feel the pressure (besides from the time that he did get close enough to influence the QB in making a poor attempt.)
There were plenty of times in which he forces the QB to scramble around in the pocket. You don't get credit for a QB hurry, but clearly, you've made him taking longer to attempt a pass, during which time, another defender can get to him or influence him to throw a bad ball.
He was clearly miles ahead of Taylor in this part of the game.
To sum it up, I think Nevis might have been a more constant disruptive force in the backfield than Dareus (I haven't seen enough of Fairley to make a comparison.)
I've watched him some last year.
This year, so far, I've seen him against Miss St., Florida, Auburn, Alabama, Mississippi, and Arkansas.
(I might have watched the W.Virg and Tennesse games as well during the season.)
He's a contributing factor or a major contibutor in all those games.
He played well against both the run and the pass.
Just by numbers alone, his production is much better than Taylor in most, if not all areas (sacks, tackles for loss, total tackles, QB hurries, forced fumbles, etc.)
And he did it against better competition (compare the two schedules and you will see.)
Beyond the numbers, there are things he does more efficiently than Taylor in the running game that does not show up on the stat sheet.
Let's say, a team can try a run to the right side; Nevis would penetrate that A gap (or push the O-lineman toward the running lane.)
This forces the RB to go wider than he would like, or cut back at a steeper angle.
He can occupy two blockers in this situations (and others), leaving a LB free to get to the RB.
In the passing game, he can put a hand up or he can get close enough to make the QB feel the pressure (besides from the time that he did get close enough to influence the QB in making a poor attempt.)
There were plenty of times in which he forces the QB to scramble around in the pocket. You don't get credit for a QB hurry, but clearly, you've made him taking longer to attempt a pass, during which time, another defender can get to him or influence him to throw a bad ball.
He was clearly miles ahead of Taylor in this part of the game.
To sum it up, I think Nevis might have been a more constant disruptive force in the backfield than Dareus (I haven't seen enough of Fairley to make a comparison.)
Thanks for reviewing Taylor.
I saw him against Illinois and his Sr.Bowl practices and Taylor impressed me. If the Texans were to take Taylor they would be gambling that he will be able to keep his weight down. For this reason taking Ellis or Powe in the 3rd would be the safest route.
If you get a chance check out a couple of late NT candidates Chris Neild WVU. Dexter Larimore OSU. They would be really good late rd sleeper candidates.
J.Jones will probably be gone by #11. But I'm thinking how good this offense could be with AJ,JJ and OD as the main receiving corps. It would open up the offense and if you think Foster looked good last yr. Imagine all of the running lanes and mismatches that drafting Julio Jones would create.
This would be the fastest way to become a good team. IMHO
The Gary and Rick could spend the rest of the draft and FA fixing the defense and in a couple of yrs the Texans may become a playoff team.
Illinois is a run-oriented team; I imagine that's why Talor looked better.
Still, the QB had the second highest passing yard (for the season) in that game.
He's a 58% QB yet managed 18 of 23 for 78% in that game (which helps raise his percentage to 58%, LOL).
bah007
Hall of Fame
Oh you're in trouble now, 76. You have been around here long enough to know that the #1 thing you are not allowed to do in the college football threads is criticize the current NT flavor of the week/month/year.
For the record, I agree with you. I've never seen anything on the field from Taylor that made me think he would turn out to be a great player.
The reason he is so popular here right now is the same reason the highest rated NT is always popular around here. A majority of the fans want a big fat NT in the middle.
I want the best player in the middle, not the biggest player.
Is the guy worth a shot if he falls to our spot in the second? Yea, if he can keep his weight down. But I'm not projecting first round on this guy. There are too many flags and not enough good tape to be worth the risk.
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
BUT, BUT, BUT the Senior Bowl....
I just finished watching that game.
That's the most active I've seen him.
He still didn't do much in the pass rush, but he really looked good in the running game, even on runs to the outside. He gave a lot of effort in pursuit.
He also looked to be "more trim" than in the previous games, but not as trim as in the Senior Bowl.
He didn't impress me as first round material in the Senior Bowl, or at anytime for that matter.
I haven't watched all the practices yet, but in the Thurs. session that I saw, I agree, there were a couple of times where he showed something good.
But still, it's practice!
Something I found regarding Nevis:
Rob Rang, a senior draft analyst for nfldraftscout.com, rated Nevis before the season as a potential fifth-round pick. Rang now believes Nevis should get taken at least in the second round and may even work his way into the latter part of the first round.
"I don't think there's any question he's been the best senior defensive tackle so far this season," Rang said. "His sophomore and junior seasons, he wasn't a dominant player. He was a productive player, but it was in flashes. Now on a snap-to-snap basis, he's a force to be reckoned with."
He almost certainly won't get taken as early as Dorsey, who went to the Chiefs with the fifth overall pick in the 2008 draft. Dorsey was regarded as a more physical player and was more consistent from year to year than Nevis.
But even though it took some time for him to reach this level, Nevis' performance this season is offering reminders of his former teammate.
"They have a similar burst," Rang said. "I'd actually argue that Nevis is a step quicker and more explosive off the snap. I don't know if he plays with the same intensity that Dorsey did throughout his career, but the greatest similarity between them is the intensity with which they play, that ability to turn it up a notch. That's what Dorsey was known for at LSU, and that's what Nevis has shown this year."
Rob Rang, a senior draft analyst for nfldraftscout.com, rated Nevis before the season as a potential fifth-round pick. Rang now believes Nevis should get taken at least in the second round and may even work his way into the latter part of the first round.
"I don't think there's any question he's been the best senior defensive tackle so far this season," Rang said. "His sophomore and junior seasons, he wasn't a dominant player. He was a productive player, but it was in flashes. Now on a snap-to-snap basis, he's a force to be reckoned with."
He almost certainly won't get taken as early as Dorsey, who went to the Chiefs with the fifth overall pick in the 2008 draft. Dorsey was regarded as a more physical player and was more consistent from year to year than Nevis.
But even though it took some time for him to reach this level, Nevis' performance this season is offering reminders of his former teammate.
"They have a similar burst," Rang said. "I'd actually argue that Nevis is a step quicker and more explosive off the snap. I don't know if he plays with the same intensity that Dorsey did throughout his career, but the greatest similarity between them is the intensity with which they play, that ability to turn it up a notch. That's what Dorsey was known for at LSU, and that's what Nevis has shown this year."
Texan4Ever
All Pro
^ Isn't Nevis a bit undersized for a DT? I think he's at around 285-Lbs which is light for a DT IMO.
Also, is it possible for Wade Phillips to want a guy like Stephen Paea as a nose tackle similar to Kyle Williams in Buffalo? Paea is not a big ugly but he is stout at the point of attack and very strong from what I have read.
Also, is it possible for Wade Phillips to want a guy like Stephen Paea as a nose tackle similar to Kyle Williams in Buffalo? Paea is not a big ugly but he is stout at the point of attack and very strong from what I have read.
I don't know what his weight is, but he played as well as anybody against the double team. I must have excellent leverage; it seems like his height (less than 6'1) is a natural advantage for him.
It was not easy for them to him for some reason.
Most of the time, he split the double team anyway.
I was so surprised to see how effective he was in short yardage situation.
And if Phillips want a penetrating NT (which is what Earl Mitchell is), Nevis is 100% better than Mitchell at the same stage in their career.
I haven't seen him lining up against an OT, so I don't how effective he can be as a 3-4 DE, but I think he can do well there.
He's just too quick for those guys!
I was only comparing Nevis with Mitchell in their collegiate career.
But it might not be fair to Mitchell, for he lacked the experience.
I like Mitchell when we drafted him. I still like him now; however, I still have concern about him taking the double team.
I'm curious to see whether they're gonna use him at DE or not.
I think this closely describes Nevis as I saw him:
http://warroom.sportingnews.com/nfl/draft/2011/players/9945.html
JCTexan
Hall of Fame
Nevis is listed at 285-Lbs on NFLDraftScout.com, which seems a little small to be a 3-4 NT.
Interesting part of that:
So would you like for the Texans to take him as a 3-4 DE?
I've seen Neild in 3 games while watching the safety Robert Sands but did not pay close attention.
I've heard his names called out, and I've seen some good plays.
I just finished watching another game (but it was against a weakling: UNLV) and the first half of the USF game (I've seen them listed the C Sampson as probably a late round prospect.)
Neild plays a 2-gap NT in their 3-4
Good base; pretty strong; move his feet well; uses his hands very well.
I'm gonna watched some more of him and also go back to the Senior Bowl to check him out, as well as re-reviewing the other NTs.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Earl is like a transformer. He only played DT two years, in College, formerly a TE, but played behind Gronkowski. I'm told he's still growing, very toned & could easily add 10-20 lbs. which puts him in 315 area w/o losing explosiveness. For everyone bashing Texans, favorite past time for some, Earl may wind up worth that weight in gold
I've suggested that may be he can be tried at DE for the Texans, even though I don't see him having problem playing at the nose.
I know that his LSU Bio also listed him at 285.
CDS listed him at 294.
I don't know what his real weigth is, but he plays BIG.
There's that potential for sure.
You know that I've been singing him from day one and had repeatedly said that I was happy with his weekly performance and his overall season.
I went back to the Senior Bowl and checked each play that Taylor was in.
The play that he shined in was on the Reed's sack.
Taylor joined in shortly.
He had beaten the C one-one-one as the C got too high on his first step.
Ever heard of Slippery Rock?
Well, that's where the C came from.
To be fair, he won the Gene Upshaw Award for the best offensive lineman in D-II so he should be pretty good.
He could be a good project for some team in the late round?!?
At any rate, Taylor didn't look bad, but he didn't look anywhere near first-round talent either.
As I've said before, he showed some flashes, mostly in the running game during college.
If he can keep that weight in check and improve on his technique and train harder on his aigiilty and quickness, he has a chance to be a good player.
But every time the word potential comes up, I hesitate.
I hate to draft player by emphasizing too much on "potential".
I'd rather have a bunch of guys who are either smart football players or players that play hard all the time (or at least 95% of the time.)
For the same reason, I do not like Peterson at CB or safety early in the first round.
If I'm the GM, I wouldn't draft him at #11 but would take Julio Jones over him for a safer pick.
The play that he shined in was on the Reed's sack.
Taylor joined in shortly.
He had beaten the C one-one-one as the C got too high on his first step.
Ever heard of Slippery Rock?
Well, that's where the C came from.
To be fair, he won the Gene Upshaw Award for the best offensive lineman in D-II so he should be pretty good.
He could be a good project for some team in the late round?!?
At any rate, Taylor didn't look bad, but he didn't look anywhere near first-round talent either.
As I've said before, he showed some flashes, mostly in the running game during college.
If he can keep that weight in check and improve on his technique and train harder on his aigiilty and quickness, he has a chance to be a good player.
But every time the word potential comes up, I hesitate.
I hate to draft player by emphasizing too much on "potential".
I'd rather have a bunch of guys who are either smart football players or players that play hard all the time (or at least 95% of the time.)
For the same reason, I do not like Peterson at CB or safety early in the first round.
If I'm the GM, I wouldn't draft him at #11 but would take Julio Jones over him for a safer pick.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Updated Big Board (changes bolded). Biggest jump was Cam Newton, moved up post workout & very positive report from Cornell Gowdy, draftnasty -