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All Encompassing Andre Johnson Thread (Just got some disturbing news about A Johnson)

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CloakNNNdagger said:
???I've posted my feelings on the effect on QB/WR prep/timing/chemistry, and the potential negative effects on trying to incorporate a new offensive scheme without a major piece.........specifically since he is slated as the #1 WR on the team.
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Which is really a bit of a misnomer. The playbook doesn't have WR1, WR2, or WR3 in any of the plays. Typically it's X, Y, or Z... generally speaking, the #1 WR is usually the guy who produced the most at the end of the season.

For the most part, it doesn't matter who is running those routes right now. By the time the season starts, the coach may change it all up, preferring to use one as the X more than the others, or the Z, or whatever.

But just like there's a lot of film on Fitzpatrick that the coaches "know" what they can & can't do with him, there's plenty of film on Andre & the coaches should have an idea how they're going to use him. & we've still got mini-camp & training camp to work out the details.
 
thunderkyss said:
Which is really a bit of a misnomer. The playbook doesn't have WR1, WR2, or WR3 in any of the plays. Typically it's X, Y, or Z... generally speaking, the #1 WR is usually the guy who produced the most at the end of the season.

For the most part, it doesn't matter who is running those routes right now. By the time the season starts, the coach may change it all up, preferring to use one as the X more than the others, or the Z, or whatever.

But just like there's a lot of film on Fitzpatrick that the coaches "know" what they can & can't do with him, there's plenty of film on Andre & the coaches should have an idea how they're going to use him. & we've still got mini-camp & training camp to work out the details.
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You really believe this? Or are you just being contrary?

AJ is and has always been a WR1.
 
thunderkyss said:
Which is really a bit of a misnomer. The playbook doesn't have WR1, WR2, or WR3 in any of the plays. Typically it's X, Y, or Z... generally speaking, the #1 WR is usually the guy who produced the most at the end of the season.

For the most part, it doesn't matter who is running those routes right now. By the time the season starts, the coach may change it all up, preferring to use one as the X more than the others, or the Z, or whatever.

But just like there's a lot of film on Fitzpatrick that the coaches "know" what they can & can't do with him, there's plenty of film on Andre & the coaches should have an idea how they're going to use him. & we've still got mini-camp & training camp to work out the details.
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I hear what you're saying, but Andre being there would be a good thing. It'd help.

If the coaches could just look at film and see what they can do with guys, then lots of players could just stay away. Coaches could just use this time to watch film and conceptualize.

Everyone else is there for a reason. It's to get reps, get to know the system, your new teammates, your new coaches.

I don't know how much of a negative effect this'll ultimately have, but I know one thing....it sure isn't helping.

Regarding wr1. Andre is wr1 until proven otherwise.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
???I've posted my feelings on the effect on QB/WR prep/timing/chemistry, and the potential negative effects on trying to incorporate a new offensive scheme without a major piece.........specifically since he is slated as the #1 WR on the team.
Click to expand...
Establish chemistry and timing with WHO??
Four different guys?!
Ridiculous.
Pick a damn starter O'Brien.
And I've not seen a single word that says O'Brien thinks Andre' is a "major piece".
Think about it, under the "Patriot way" Tom Brady has only had one or two top tier WRs in his N.E. 13-yr career. And the two they had, they let walk.
Wes Welker? Don't need him. We can get Danny Amendola cheaper.
Randy Moss? cut him. We don't need him.
Andre Johnson? The "Patriot way" says he just another WR.
 
steelbtexan said:
You really believe this? Or are you just being contrary?

AJ is and has always been a WR1.
Click to expand...

Not being contrary... just trying to tame some of the, "Andre's not here, the sky is falling." talk. Like ObsiWan said, he'd have four QBs throwing him the ball. This is OTAs, not camp. Not the preseason.

xtruroyaltyx said:
I don't know how much of a negative effect this'll ultimately have, but I know one thing....it sure isn't helping.

Regarding wr1. Andre is wr1 until proven otherwise.
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Not having Matt Schaub for OTAs helped Tj Yates a bit before the 2011 season.
 
badboy said:
I have not heard of one player being distracted. It sounds like AJ is not doing what you want him to and you are distracted. His contract (thru the CBA) allows him to do exactly what he is doing with only minor consequences. I think if NFL owners were really upset with behavior of players like AJ holding out or not showing or whatever, the consequences would be more severe. His actions are not immoral, criminal or evil. He is doing what he thinks is best for him under the rules.
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Do you really think players would voice their displeasure of Johnson not being in camp? Would someone risk the wrath of the HC who has clearly imposed a "Keep your mouth shut" mentality? I think not. The distraction comes not from the "Minor Consequences" that the league might impose, but rather from what is bouncing around in players heads while they are soaking from a hard days work that their supposed teammate is skipping because he he does not like the direction the team is going even though he does not know the direction it is going because he is not there to see it. That does not scream team player no matter how you slice it.

For you to try to pretend that this is not a setback and a distraction for the team is absurd. Either asked to be traded or get to work. All of this poor Andre crap is nonsense. No player is guaranteed playoffs or championships. Plenty of players better than AJ have never sniffed a SB, yet they reported to work the next year without needing to ponder their poor millionaire life before being able to go on.

It Must be so hard for Dre to get out of bed each day knowing the shame and hardship he faces from being a Texan.
m0831.gif


Andre is fast approaching Bowe Bergdahl status in my eyes, and who wants someone like that on their team? Someone who bails out when things get tough. You can try to romanticize this all you want, it boils down to a player who is being selfish and is no longer a team player. This is not a good example for his teammates, or more importantly all of the young kids who look up to this guy. So it is not about what I want him to do, it's about living up to your contract, and more importantly the role model he has become for millions of kids.

Did Dan Marino, or Barry Sanders ever behave this way? This is T.O., or Ochocinco kind of behavior. This is simply about his personal feelings, and as much as I used to respect Dre, I find his current behavior disgusting! Not that he will lose any sleep over it, but any respect and good will I ever had for the man will be gone if he continues this behavior.
 
Nitrofish said:
blah, blah, blah

For you to try to pretend that this is not a setback and a distraction for the team is absurd.
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No, you've gone full on delusional as proven by:

Andre is fast approaching Bowe Bergdahl status in my eyes, and who wants someone like that on their team?
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You sound like a 2 year old girl screaming her life has been ruined because the cake shop put pink instead of fuchsia sprinkles on her birthday cupcakes.

Fine, it's less than ideal, but the sky is not falling.
 
thunderkyss said:
What did you think about his first four years in the league when he didn't come to OTAs & worked out in Miami instead?

This is no different, he has no obligation whatsoever to be here... until next week.
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He said he wont be here for Mandatory also. That's what i'm going off of.

PLUS in my defense i drink maybe 1 time a year and i was really ****ed up when i typed that, hell i dont even remember writing it, but i still partially agree with my drunken self, and must give myself credit for spelling also. :handshake:
 
ObsiWan said:
Establish chemistry and timing with WHO??
Four different guys?!
Ridiculous.
Pick a damn starter O'Brien.
And I've not seen a single word that says O'Brien thinks Andre' is a "major piece".
Think about it, under the "Patriot way" Tom Brady has only had one or two top tier WRs in his N.E. 13-yr career. And the two they had, they let walk.
Wes Welker? Don't need him. We can get Danny Amendola cheaper.
Randy Moss? cut him. We don't need him.
Andre Johnson? The "Patriot way" says he just another WR.
Click to expand...

Those (Welker/Moss) WRs you named both always routinely attended OTAs when they were part of the team. Heck, Welker was recovering from ACL surgery in 2010, but felt it important enough to participate (which included helping out the other WRs), even though he was only 4 months out of surgery and still wearing a heavy brace.

bos_a_welker2x_200.jpg


******************************************************

From another year where the Patriots had coaching changes.

OTAs Begin, Don’t Discount Their Importance

Written by Steve Balestrieri
Posted May 21, 2012 at 5:57 pm

The New England Patriots started their OTAs today as the players (in shorts and helmets) start to go through their first organized team workouts for the 2012 season.

While teams have been doing off-season workouts together these are the first real teaching points for the Patriots’ coaching staff and the team can start back again with the basics. While most casual fans breathe a selective cry of “so what?” the answer to if these workouts are important lies within a few important points.

Team Building- This is a very important aspect of any organization not just a professional NFL team. The Patriots have brought in many new free agents, draftees and unsigned rookie free agents. These initial practices are invaluable in showing the new guys how the Patriots conduct business. Everything from team meetings, how practices are conducted, what’s expected of veterans and rookies is spelled out early in the process.

Make no mistake, the Patriots and Bill Belichick value this very highly and this is where it all starts. Building team camaraderie and character begins today…now. Veterans will be looked upon as teachers as well as competitors and with so many coaches switching positions, this time will be invaluable to them to adjust to their new surroundings and different players.
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And as far as OB not commenting on AJ being a "major piece," all I can say is that he has made all attempts to avoid the subject. Remember when asked about some players, he said we will only speak about the players on the field. The sky is certainly far from falling, but I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
 
ObsiWan said:
Establish chemistry and timing with WHO??
Four different guys?!
Ridiculous.
Pick a damn starter O'Brien.
And I've not seen a single word that says O'Brien thinks Andre' is a "major piece".
Think about it, under the "Patriot way" Tom Brady has only had one or two top tier WRs in his N.E. 13-yr career. And the two they had, they let walk.
Wes Welker? Don't need him. We can get Danny Amendola cheaper.
Randy Moss? cut him. We don't need him.
Andre Johnson? The "Patriot way" says he just another WR.
Click to expand...

I agree he needs to pick a starter at QB, but the beginning of training camp should work.

I'm not concerned he didn't name one in OTA's.
 
infantrycak said:
No, you've gone full on delusional as proven by:



You sound like a 2 year old girl screaming her life has been ruined because the cake shop put pink instead of fuchsia sprinkles on her birthday cupcakes.

Fine, it's less than ideal, but the sky is not falling.
Click to expand...

That's your opinion, but that's all it is. I never said the sky was falling. I said Dre is not setting a good example for young players or kids that admire him, but just go ahead and ignore that part and put words in my mouth about pink and fuchsia sprinkles.

Comparing AJ to a deserter is a perfect analogy. He has deserted his teammates because they took his pictures down and he doesn't want to go through another rebuild. Pooooor baby. Stop defending him and call a spade a spade.

You sound like a 2 year old transgender child who is having difficulty with his/her hormones today and can't decide whether to sit or stand to urinate.
 
Nitrofish said:
Do you really think players would voice their displeasure of Johnson not being in camp? Would someone risk the wrath of the HC who has clearly imposed a "Keep your mouth shut" mentality? I think not. The distraction comes not from the "Minor Consequences" that the league might impose, but rather from what is bouncing around in players heads while they are soaking from a hard days work that their supposed teammate is skipping because he he does not like the direction the team is going even though he does not know the direction it is going because he is not there to see it. That does not scream team player no matter how you slice it.

For you to try to pretend that this is not a setback and a distraction for the team is absurd. Either asked to be traded or get to work. All of this poor Andre crap is nonsense. No player is guaranteed playoffs or championships. Plenty of players better than AJ have never sniffed a SB, yet they reported to work the next year without needing to ponder their poor millionaire life before being able to go on.

It Must be so hard for Dre to get out of bed each day knowing the shame and hardship he faces from being a Texan.
m0831.gif


Andre is fast approaching Bowe Bergdahl status in my eyes, and who wants someone like that on their team? Someone who bails out when things get tough. You can try to romanticize this all you want, it boils down to a player who is being selfish and is no longer a team player. This is not a good example for his teammates, or more importantly all of the young kids who look up to this guy. So it is not about what I want him to do, it's about living up to your contract, and more importantly the role model he has become for millions of kids.

Did Dan Marino, or Barry Sanders ever behave this way? This is T.O., or Ochocinco kind of behavior. This is simply about his personal feelings, and as much as I used to respect Dre, I find his current behavior disgusting! Not that he will lose any sleep over it, but any respect and good will I ever had for the man will be gone if he continues this behavior.
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Dude what a rant and comparing Andre to a possible deserter is way over board. Where do you get that I am romanticize anything? You are putting words into my mouth just as you put "thoughts" into players' heads. What is wrong with a player taking care of himself? We always hear "This is a business" from management and if a player does anything in a business manner he is selfish? I want AJ in camp but it is his right to do as he is and he will face consequences. Yo have the right to handle your job the way you wish but do NOT have right to tell others how to handle their jobs.

You are acting like a child having a temper tantrum.
 
The 'what have you done for me lately' way of thought is cringe worthy. Dre has broken his body down for this team. He was paid handsomely, but maybe having the opportunity to play in important games means more to him than money. 2 winning seasons in his career. 2 playoff games. Sad. He was always the first vet into camps, ota's whatever the team wanted and now since he has a year or two left and he doesn't want to waste it on a sucky team he is a villain?
 
Uncle Rico said:
The 'what have you done for me lately' way of thought is cringe worthy. Dre has broken his body down for this team. He was paid handsomely, but maybe having the opportunity to play in important games means more to him than money. 2 winning seasons in his career. 2 playoff games. Sad. He was always the first vet into camps, ota's whatever the team wanted and now since he has a year or two left and he doesn't want to waste it on a sucky team he is a villain?
Click to expand...

3 winning seasons in the last 5. Two significant playoff runs in the last three years... Of course, he was barely involved in 2011 due to injury. If the winning years happened early in his career his frustration would be more understandable. However, they had two very successful seasons prior to last year's disaster. As a player frustrated with losing, I would think he would be very supportive of the organizational changes after the 2013 disappointment.
 
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...on-that-the-texans-would-trade-andre-johnson/

As Texans receiver Andre Johnson continues to be sufficiently unhappy with the team to not show up for offseason workouts, the Texans continue to show no inclination to give him what he wants — a new home.

But Johnson remains dug in. With potential fines for skipping mandatory minicamp at only $70,000, it’s a no-brainer he won’t be there; Johnson already has blown a $1 million roster bonus by not attending offseason workouts.

The stakes will get a lot higher come training camp, when Johnson faces fines in the amount of $30,000 along with partial forfeiture of bonus money previously paid. And if he ultimately doesn’t play in 2014, Johnson will pass on a base salary of $10 million.

Unless the Texans decide to trade Johnson, the options become play for Houston or play for no one, retiring from the game (with the option of unretiring a la Carson Palmer if/when he’s finally traded).

While Johnson doesn’t have much leverage, retirement can be a powerful tool. If he convinces the Texans he’ll truly not play if his only option is to play for the Texans, the Texans would be wise to get what they can and move on.

There’s chatter regarding teams potentially clearing cap space to absorb the Johnson contract, and other teams definitely would be interested in the soon-to-be 33-year-old receiver, if he were available.

For now, he’s not. If he keeps not showing up for the Texans he eventually may be, even though they’ve done absolutely nothing to prepare for life without him.

The fact that the Texans didn’t make a post-Andre plan suggests that they badly misread the situation, which first emerged last November when he said “I’m under contract so I have to play my contract out” after getting into a little bit of a verbal squabble with Matt Schaub and leaving the field before the team’s then-latest loss. The team surely assumed that, even if he huffs and puffs, Johnson wouldn’t walk away from $10 million in 2014.

At least for now, he’s doing a very good job of creating the impression that he will.
 
dalemurphy said:
3 winning seasons in the last 5. Two significant playoff runs in the last three years... Of course, he was barely involved in 2011 due to injury. If the winning years happened early in his career his frustration would be more understandable. However, they had two very successful seasons prior to last year's disaster. As a player frustrated with losing, I would think he would be very supportive of the organizational changes after the 2013 disappointment.
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spin it any way you want, this team sucks currently. he has poured blood,sweat and tears into this organization he should be allowed to pursue greener pastures elsewhere because all we have here is a dried up rice field. Why let it become personal and bitter after such a stellar career?

Oh and why not mention the other 9 or 10 seasons of misery that he endured?
 
The "Texans have done nothing to prepare for no AJ" line is getting tired.

They spent a first rounder a year ago no doubt with an eye towards "life after AJ."

Besides passing on Clowney to reach for (?) I'm not sure what more they could have done that result in finding a new prospective number 1 WR than Hopkins...
 
And I do find myself wondering, who would trade for him AND would make AJ happy to play there.

I dont see alot of teams at the crossroads of contender/plenty of cap space/need a WR.

Maybe the Bengals come closest?
 
The article above said he has missed a roster bonus but I thought that was for the final roster? Can someone clarify?
 
thunderkyss said:
Not having Matt Schaub for OTAs helped Tj Yates a bit before the 2011 season.
Click to expand...

Your statement seems to be indicating that Dre stating away is good for the team. I could pick that statement apart, but I'm not going to.

I am curious though...
Did Schaub stay completely away from ota's?

Was he hurt, but still there? I don't remember.

But really, it doesn't matter. Completely different situations.
 
Uncle Rico said:
Seahawks,Niners and Ravens could all use a WR of his caliber.
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Wanna know what I think?

I thought you did.

I think AJ wants to go to the Ravens where he can play for his former coach and have an easy ride. He might expect to influence a trade to Baltimore, to get cut and join them, or to retire and sign with them a year later.
 
Uncle Rico said:
Oh and why not mention the other 9 or 10 seasons of misery that he endured?
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To answer your question... I didn't hear him complaining about losing when he signed his 7 year $68 million contract in 2009. Since he signed that contract, they have played in 4 playoff games and won two division titles. Before he signed that deal, in 6 years, they had no playoff appearances. So, yeah, I am not feeling a ton of pity for the guy. He chose to re-sign. I have little doubt the Texans would trade him if he is willing to reduce his contract to make him more appealing to potential trading partners. Something tells me, though, that winning isn't that important to him!
 
thunderkyss said:
Not having Matt Schaub for OTAs helped Tj Yates a bit before the 2011 season.
Click to expand...
There were no OTAs in 2011 due to the lockout. If you're referring to the 2012 OTAs, when Schaub was rehabbing, I don't see your point. Yates seemed to regress after 2011.
 
badboy said:
Dude what a rant and comparing Andre to a possible deserter is way over board. Where do you get that I am romanticize anything? You are putting words into my mouth just as you put "thoughts" into players' heads. What is wrong with a player taking care of himself? We always hear "This is a business" from management and if a player does anything in a business manner he is selfish? I want AJ in camp but it is his right to do as he is and he will face consequences. Yo have the right to handle your job the way you wish but do NOT have right to tell others how to handle their jobs.

You are acting like a child having a temper tantrum.
Click to expand...

No matter how you slice it, he is deserting the team. Everyone but him was at OTA's and everyone but him will be at mini camp. How can you compare it to anything else?

What is wrong with him taking care of himself? This is a team sport, and Dre has been all about the team up until this point, and now suddenly he can't take it anymore? Nonsense. Should the rest of the players just take care of themselves also, or is this just something Dre has a right to do? If all of the rest of the players behaved like this what kind of a team would we have?

I am not telling anyone how to do their job. I am just another voice on a MB, and like it or not I am entitled to my opinion, and just because you do not agree with it does not mean I am acting like a child. That is just an ad hominem attack.

Uncle Rico said:
The 'what have you done for me lately' way of thought is cringe worthy. Dre has broken his body down for this team. He was paid handsomely, but maybe having the opportunity to play in important games means more to him than money. 2 winning seasons in his career. 2 playoff games. Sad. He was always the first vet into camps, ota's whatever the team wanted and now since he has a year or two left and he doesn't want to waste it on a sucky team he is a villain?
Click to expand...

Dre is not entitled to play in important games. No player is. Nobody promised that to him, nor could they. He has had plenty of chances to leave for greener pastures but he didn't so it's a little late now to cry foul.

There is no "Sucky Team" clause in his contract that I know of. and if he really wanted out he should have made that clear at the end of last season and asked for a trade instead of waiting until OTA's to start whining.

Yeah he as broken down his body to play for the Texans, but he was highly paid to do so, and he kept coming back for more so I don't want to hear that excuse. This behavior is not becoming of someone of his character. I believe if he was really tired of the losing he would have demanded a trade at the very least in the off season.

This whole thing with saying those things on video were designed to put pressure on the organization. What other reason would he have to tell anyone that on camera? Something smells here, and it's not the fish.
 
Nitrofish said:
No matter how you slice it, he is deserting the team. Everyone but him was at OTA's and everyone but him will be at mini camp. How can you compare it to anything else?

What is wrong with him taking care of himself? This is a team sport, and Dre has been all about the team up until this point, and now suddenly he can't take it anymore? Nonsense. Should the rest of the players just take care of themselves also, or is this just something Dre has a right to do? If all of the rest of the players behaved like this what kind of a team would we have?

I am not telling anyone how to do their job. I am just another voice on a MB, and like it or not I am entitled to my opinion, and just because you do not agree with it does not mean I am acting like a child. That is just an ad hominem attack.




Dre is not entitled to play in important games. No player is. Nobody promised that to him, nor could they. He has had plenty of chances to leave for greener pastures but he didn't so it's a little late now to cry foul.

There is no "Sucky Team" clause in his contract that I know of. and if he really wanted out he should have made that clear at the end of last season and asked for a trade instead of waiting until OTA's to start whining.

Yeah he as broken down his body to play for the Texans, but he was highly paid to do so, and he kept coming back for more so I don't want to hear that excuse. This behavior is not becoming of someone of his character. I believe if he was really tired of the losing he would have demanded a trade at the very least in the off season.

This whole thing with saying those things on video were designed to put pressure on the organization. What other reason would he have to tell anyone that on camera? Something smells here, and it's not the fish.
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So Dre is the first player to use these tactics in order to get satisfaction? Its pretty common. Talk of desertion and obligations are a bit strong IMO. When you have tenure within a company you are entitled to certain things that's just the way things go contract or no contract.

Obviously the team owe's him nothing, 'true' fans owe him nothing, but I can only speak for myself when I say that I feel he has earned the right to compete for a championship, he's earned his stripes here, and this team isn't going to contend anytime soon. He's bit his tongue and toe'd(sp) the company line all this time being an exemplary employee and now that he wants his release the team will hold him hostage? Real weak.

All the talk about him 'being paid millions' screams of envious minds and 'what could have beens' for most of the people who post here. Anyone of you could have put in the hours working out, getting faster, learning the game etc... etc... but you didn't, I didn't. Instead we are managers, machininsts cooks or bus drivers, and so is life, no complaints from me. I'm a fan of the team, I grow attached to certain players and I wish them all the best, sue me.

Hopefully Dre retires I wouldn't risk more injuries on a rebuild.
 
dalemurphy said:
To answer your question... I didn't hear him complaining about losing when he signed his 7 year $68 million contract in 2009. Since he signed that contract, they have played in 4 playoff games and won two division titles. Before he signed that deal, in 6 years, they had no playoff appearances. So, yeah, I am not feeling a ton of pity for the guy. He chose to re-sign. I have little doubt the Texans would trade him if he is willing to reduce his contract to make him more appealing to potential trading partners. Something tells me, though, that winning isn't that important to him!
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Actually, he never signed a 7 year contract in 2009. He originally signed an extension in 2007, while he was still on his rookie contract. However, he did hold out in 2009 for more money after back to back 100 catches 1500+ yard seasons (so perhaps that is what you're talking about). Of course, that was after we went 8-8, which was after our first NON LOSING season in franchise history. Also, that was after our 2nd season with Kubiak as out coach. The thinking when he signed that extension was probably not "We going to mediocre forever", but probably more like "We're getting better every year we can win here". I'm sure he never thought we'd revert back to the "glory days".
 
Uncle Rico said:
spin it any way you want, this team sucks currently. he has poured blood,sweat and tears into this organization he should be allowed to pursue greener pastures elsewhere because all we have here is a dried up rice field. Why let it become personal and bitter after such a stellar career?

Oh and why not mention the other 9 or 10 seasons of misery that he endured?
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I don't care about trading AJ for a 2nd rd pick.

If I was in McNair's shoes I would say AJ go ahead and sit out the season. You lose 10 mil and have a happy retirement.

But that's just me and the way I conduct business.
 
Uncle Rico said:
So Dre is the first player to use these tactics in order to get satisfaction? Its pretty common. Talk of desertion and obligations are a bit strong IMO. When you have tenure within a company you are entitled to certain things that's just the way things go contract or no contract.

Obviously the team owe's him nothing, 'true' fans owe him nothing, but I can only speak for myself when I say that I feel he has earned the right to compete for a championship, he's earned his stripes here, and this team isn't going to contend anytime soon. He's bit his tongue and toe'd(sp) the company line all this time being an exemplary employee and now that he wants his release the team will hold him hostage? Real weak.

All the talk about him 'being paid millions' screams of envious minds and 'what could have beens' for most of the people who post here. Anyone of you could have put in the hours working out, getting faster, learning the game etc... etc... but you didn't, I didn't. Instead we are managers, machininsts cooks or bus drivers, and so is life, no complaints from me. I'm a fan of the team, I grow attached to certain players and I wish them all the best, sue me.

Hopefully Dre retires I wouldn't risk more injuries on a rebuild.
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Just because others have done it does not mean it is right, or that fans should support it. Dre has no special rights that other players don't have and when you start saying that, you have thrown the team concept out the window.

All of the "managers, machinists cooks or bus drivers" are all expected to show up to work regardless of what we think of the direction of the organization we work for. And how good we are at our jobs gives none of us special rights over other employees.

Hopefully he does retire, because at this point it is the right thing to do if it really is all about losing. Forget about injuries, those go with the territory and all players know that going in.
 
dalemurphy said:
To answer your question... I didn't hear him complaining about losing when he signed his 7 year $68 million contract in 2009. Since he signed that contract, they have played in 4 playoff games and won two division titles. Before he signed that deal, in 6 years, they had no playoff appearances. So, yeah, I am not feeling a ton of pity for the guy. He chose to re-sign. I have little doubt the Texans would trade him if he is willing to reduce his contract to make him more appealing to potential trading partners. Something tells me, though, that winning isn't that important to him!
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I think the difference is he does not see team doing all it can to be better at least in his mind. He wanted a better QB and does not seem to think Fitz or Savage is the future and what is wrong with that? Most of us are hopeful but none feel very confident. Yes, AJ gets paid a lot but he also wants to win and it is his body getting beat up each week so I am willing to let him do what he wants until preseason. He has broken no rules.

Until, we know that Texans asked him to reduce his contract to aid in a trade and he refused, you are only speculating as to whether winning is that important. We do not know.
 
Nitrofish said:
Just because others have done it does not mean it is right, or that fans should support it. Dre has no special rights that other players don't have and when you start saying that, you have thrown the team concept out the window.

All of the "managers, machinists cooks or bus drivers" are all expected to show up to work regardless of what we think of the direction of the organization we work for. And how good we are at our jobs gives none of us special rights over other employees.

Hopefully he does retire, because at this point it is the right thing to do if it really is all about losing. Forget about injuries, those go with the territory and all players know that going in.
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The bold is where I think you keep saying incorrectly that he is using some "special privilege" other players do not have. All the vets can do the same thing he is doing but chose not to. None is an 11 year with individual stats that he has. They chose to show he did not.

Any worker can decide to not show for work and experienced the consequences which would be different for many. That is what he is doing. He did not create the consequences; the players union and the owners created the consequences. His choice does not make him wrong, it just means some disagree or like me wish he had chosen differently.

I also think you are wrong if you think some employees do not get treated differently than coworkers if they are demonstrably better than those coworkers.
 
badboy said:
The bold is where I think you keep saying incorrectly that he is using some "special privilege" other players do not have. All the vets can do the same thing he is doing but chose not to. None is an 11 year with individual stats that he has. They chose to show he did not.



Any worker can decide to not show for work and experienced the consequences which would be different for many. That is what he is doing. He did not create the consequences; the players union and the owners created the consequences. His choice does not make him wrong, it just means some disagree or like me wish he had chosen differently.



I also think you are wrong if you think some employees do not get treated differently than coworkers if they are demonstrably better than those coworkers.
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Your last paragraph. Yep. Superstars get special treatment. Fact of life, in sports and in regular workplaces.

Having said that...I don't feel sorry for Andre.
 
houstonspartan said:
Your last paragraph. Yep. Superstars get special treatment. Fact of life, in sports and in regular workplaces.

Having said that...I don't feel sorry for Andre.
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I don't feel sorry for him either but he has not asked us to. He made a decision for his life and is willing to pay for it. None of us would like others (not counting family) to demand we do what they want. Fans often believe for some reason that they have right to intrude. We demand freedom to do as we please but entertainers must act as e want. We have our opinions but will not allow those to have theirs. I want what I want because I bought a ticket or jersey or watch on TV.

How selfish and ego driven. As the song said "Who in the world do you think you are? A super star?" Except how right you are in this context just ain't so.
 
EllisUnit said:
He said he wont be here for Mandatory also. That's what i'm going off of.
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He said if he had to make the decision at that time, he would answer no. But he didn't have to & we'll just have to wait & see. Personally, I'd appreciate it if we weren't stabbing dude in the back until he does not show up.

All this crap going on right now is an example of what fans are like in Houston... or of Houston sports teams. I know that makes me look foolish for typing it out loud, but I truly believe that. Houston won't ever have a truly successful franchise because their fans don't know how to get behind it's team & it's players.

Jj Watt won't be staying here unless we pay him a shtload of money, way more than any one player should get... because he like all the other guys who come through are only playing for the money. They're not playing for you or me, because we act like this.

EllisUnit said:
PLUS in my defense i drink maybe 1 time a year and i was really ****ed up when i typed that, hell i dont even remember writing it, but i still partially agree with my drunken self, and must give myself credit for spelling also. :handshake:
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It's all good. :butterfly: :rainbow:
 
Nitrofish said:
Comparing AJ to a deserter is a perfect analogy. He has deserted his teammates because they took his pictures down and he doesn't want to go through another rebuild. Pooooor baby. Stop defending him and call a spade a spade.
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You're making crap up to support your opinion. That should tell you right there your opinion has holes in it.
 
Uncle Rico said:
The 'what have you done for me lately' way of thought is cringe worthy. Dre has broken his body down for this team. He was paid handsomely, but maybe having the opportunity to play in important games means more to him than money. 2 winning seasons in his career. 2 playoff games. Sad. He was always the first vet into camps, ota's whatever the team wanted and now since he has a year or two left and he doesn't want to waste it on a sucky team he is a villain?
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Maybe if he was a little more vocal & demanded more of his teammates on the field...



:kitten:
 
dalemurphy said:
3 winning seasons in the last 5. Two significant playoff runs in the last three years... Of course, he was barely involved in 2011 due to injury. If the winning years happened early in his career his frustration would be more understandable. However, they had two very successful seasons prior to last year's disaster. As a player frustrated with losing, I would think he would be very supportive of the organizational changes after the 2013 disappointment.
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Unless he thought Smith should go & Kubiak should stay.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Your statement seems to be indicating that Dre stating away is good for the team. I could pick that statement apart, but I'm not going to.
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I don't believe it's good for the team. I'd rather he be there. But to say absolutely no good can come from it... which is what I think I was replying to.

xtruroyaltyx said:
I am curious though...
Did Schaub stay completely away from ota's?

Was he hurt, but still there? I don't remember.

But really, it doesn't matter. Completely different situations.
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Well, Lucky proved my memory not to be so good. But I remember a time Schaub wasn't able to practice & Yates getting a lot of reps because of it helping him out. Or maybe because we didn't have a back up at that time... Lienart, I don't know.
 
Mike Florio is a shill. His latest is just blatant Texan bashing as is his usual M.O. towards this franchise.

I hope the Texans stand pat and tell Andre to play or retire. there are no other options.
 
Andre is hands down my favorite player. He's deserved so much and he's been a great football player to the team and off the field with his charity work and work in the community.

But a player is never above a team. And imo he's been unprofessional about the whole situation. People like my little son and his friends look up to Andre (we bought him the official Andre J jersey/autographed pictures in his room) and don't understand the situation.

While I still love the football player and will always support him, the situation needs to be solved. At this point, I hope he can stay but if he carries this attitude, I'm ready for the next generation of Texans football w/out AJ. Nothing can be worse than last season.
 
However many weeks and hundreds of posts into this drama, and the best I can muster is a shrug. AJ is a great player, no doubt. But with all that greatness, the team has won two playoff games ever. They've had more losing seasons with him than winning ones. He's just a WR.

And are Houstonians really that attached to the guy? I mean, he makes no bones about his heart being in Miami. And that's fine, but I reserve my "Earl/Dream/Bum" status for guys that have their heart here.
 
eriadoc said:
However many weeks and hundreds of posts into this drama, and the best I can muster is a shrug. AJ is a great player, no doubt. But with all that greatness, the team has won two playoff games ever. They've had more losing seasons with him than winning ones. He's just a WR.

And are Houstonians really that attached to the guy? I mean, he makes no bones about his heart being in Miami. And that's fine, but I reserve my "Earl/Dream/Bum" status for guys that have their heart here.
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I'm not really attached to any of these guys.
 
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