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thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
On the OL .... They've spent a boat load of assets on that line. There's talent there.
Agreed. No way around that argument. I think we’ve past the point where we can blame lack of OL talent.

I expressed my disgust at Watson running in circles behind the LOS a couple of games ago. Not once, but three times in the same game. Ridiculous.

I just don’t understand his reluctance to attack the LOS. I was happy to see him make big gains with his legs Sunday. I hope to see more of the same the rest of the season.

We have no chance of winning out if he’s not willing/prepared to “any means necessary” the rest of the season.

I know you don’t want us to win out & I understand. But if DW4 is the guy we need him to be, he needs to have that mentality.

Otherwise, he’s a very talented mediocre QB.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Huh. Lol

Oh boy

A top 10 quarterback being mediocre because he’s not taking off like you think he should.

Just the other day I seen Wilson running around in the pocket the same way Watson does sometimes. I’ve also see Rodgers do that a bunch over his great career.

If this team wants to win out. The defense needs to step the bleep up. That offensive line better get 200 times better in both pass pro and in the running game. You can not put this heavy load on Watson. Yes he’s going to have to play out of his mind. But the entire team will have to take it up a notch or 10.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Just the other day I seen Wilson running around in the pocket the same way Watson does sometimes. I’ve also see Rodgers do that a bunch over his great career.
What I’m talking about is not that thing they do. I like it when Watson does that & it works. I’m talking about literally circles. 360 degrees. It was sickening.


If this team wants to win out. The defense needs to step the bleep up.
I’m not talking about the defense. I’m not even talking about the team. I’m talking about Watson’s mindset. Is he going to do everything in his power to win it all?

If we lose another game & he has less than 15 yards rushing, I’m changing sides.

You can not put this heavy load on Watson.

Absolutely. He can’t win the rest of the games on his own. I’m not saying he’s a mediocre QB if we don’t win out.

I’m saying he’s got to leave it all on the field
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Agree. They spent money on assets but the ROI is terrible. Maybe it's unfair to judge them with Devlin still in the building, but the OL has been one of the biggest disappointments this season. Look at Scharping. He's a 2nd round pick who has been replaced by a journeyman 5th rounder.
Last year I thought rookie Scharping looked better than Fulton . Now he is coming off Covid I hope he's LG and someone replaces Fulton.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
What I’m talking about is not that thing they do. I like it when Watson does that & it works. I’m talking about literally circles. 360 degrees. It was sickening.



I’m not talking about the defense. I’m not even talking about the team. I’m talking about Watson’s mindset. Is he going to do everything in his power to win it all?

If we lose another game & he has less than 15 yards rushing, I’m changing sides.




Absolutely. He can’t win the rest of the games on his own. I’m not saying he’s a mediocre QB if we don’t win out.

I’m saying he’s got to leave it all on the field
I know what you are talking about and that’s exactly what I’ve seen the two that I mentioned do. Shots even Flacco did that last night and got clocked.

Watson is balling out right now. His teammates needs to step up period.

Man you don’t want your quarterback running like that. And all because he doesn’t shouldnt sway you to flip flop like that. Again this is too much attention directed at a individual player verse what the true problem/issue is.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Some of these have some basis of fact......but that shoe fits every NFL QB when their OL and running game have successfully sunk to shite status in a particular game. Texans have been slowly sinking in shite status since before Watson's arrival.....like 18 years.

I think a very fair thing to do, hold off on the constant negativity until Watson has been given some things.....like an OL, running game, and solid offensive coaches. Giving him these much needed things on offense may go a long way in improving the weaknesses you listed. Until we have something to measure against, there isn't a person on this board who has a clue as to how this would play out. All I know.....I want to see what the difference could be.
We're going to get to see what the difference is with the new regime.

Unless the things I listed change you can expect more of the same old same old.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
So no to avg QB coach & OC?

Hard no to good QB coach, good OC?
I'm not following you,

I hope a new coaching staff can help DW4. Right now I have my doubts until proven otherwise. I'm just not a believer in the everything that's wrong with DW4's game is because of coaching.
 

KoolAid Sipper

Waterboy
What I’m talking about is not that thing they do. I like it when Watson does that & it works. I’m talking about literally circles. 360 degrees. It was sickening.

I’m not talking about the defense. I’m not even talking about the team. I’m talking about Watson’s mindset. Is he going to do everything in his power to win it all?

If we lose another game & he has less than 15 yards rushing, I’m changing sides.

I’m saying he’s got to leave it all on the field
He's already left a knee, a lung and an eye...I'm afraid to ask what else you want him to leave on the field :backsout:
 
Fulton has regressed too. They have been like you said the biggest disappointment for sure. Especially in the running game, in which they showed a lot of promise last season. Earl with this unit we can do away with cohesiveness and chemistry. Lol
At that point I lay the blame entirely at the feet of coaching. Every lineman we have had has regressed under Devlin. Howard was looking like a good pick at 23 his first season and better his second. More years with Devlin worse he gets. Hell maybe the reason Martin is so bad is because he’s been with Devlin the longest.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
At that point I lay the blame entirely at the feet of coaching. Every lineman we have had has regressed under Devlin. Howard was looking like a good pick at 23 his first season and better his second. More years with Devlin worse he gets. Hell maybe the reason Martin is so bad is because he’s been with Devlin the longest.
This is something that was pointed out years ago. I think it had to do with the philosophy that was employed. They wanted linemen that were very versatile. Meaning they had to play multiple positions. Then you add in the complexity of the offense O’Brien ran, I believe did more damage than good. Example Fulton was pretty darn solid at Center. He played that position a lot in KC and a few snaps here. O’Brien moved him to Guard. For some reason Martin was his man for this position. When he went down early in his career Mancz played there and actually played way better. Then they go out and draft two left tackles only to play them at guard.

But like you said it has to be coaching because these players been together for back to back seasons now. And yet they’re still struggling with certain stunts. Now I do give the opposing defenses credit for their well designed blitz and stunt packages.
 
This is something that was pointed out years ago. I think it had to do with the philosophy that was employed. They wanted linemen that were very versatile. Meaning they had to play multiple positions. Then you add in the complexity of the offense O’Brien ran, I believe did more damage than good. Example Fulton was pretty darn solid at Center. He played that position a lot in KC and a few snaps here. O’Brien moved him to Guard. For some reason Martin was his man for this position. When he went down early in his career Mancz played there and actually played way better. Then they go out and draft two left tackles only to play them at guard.

But like you said it has to be coaching because these players been together for back to back seasons now. And yet they’re still struggling with certain stunts. Now I do give the opposing defenses credit for their well designed blitz and stunt packages.
In practice it’s not uncommon to move linemen around to give them a better fill for the other positions and if someone does go down and you have to fill a more vital spot, for example Howard going in at LT when Tunsil was hurt, they aren’t going into it completely green.

Where the Texans F’ed up is that is only suppose to be in practice and each player know that it’s just to give them a feel for it in case it’s needed not that they might be making permanent changes game to game.
 

otisbean

Veteran
Contributor's Club
At that point I lay the blame entirely at the feet of coaching. Every lineman we have had has regressed under Devlin. Howard was looking like a good pick at 23 his first season and better his second. More years with Devlin worse he gets. Hell maybe the reason Martin is so bad is because he’s been with Devlin the longest.
100% agree. I can’t understand how he has kept his job.
 

welsh texan

All Pro
On the OL .... They've spent a boat load of assets on that line. There's talent there.

Tunsil's "The Best Pass Blocking LT In The League" .... supposedly (statistically he's damn good) at a cost of 2 #1 picks and a #2 to go with an average cap hit of $22m over 3 years.
Doesn't really appear he moves the needle .... that trade looks worse every day.

Tytus Howard First round pick and has been pretty solid.

Martin 2nd round pick (he's ass - can we cut this guy please?!).

Scharping 2nd round pick.

Fulton's been solid more often than not - his suck comes from being next to Martin.

Kelemete .... he runs hot an cold.

Point is , they have put a whole lot of assets towards protecting Watson ....
Apparently we were offered a 6th for Martin before the trade deadline but declined.
 

welsh texan

All Pro
FWIW Texans Unfiltered reported that Philadelphia offered a 6th round pick for Nick Martin.

Also reported a rumour that Bradley Roby feigned injury vs Green Bay a he was getting beat by Adams.

They also said Mike Adams was on a Panthers podcast last week and stated that there was a veteran leader in the secondary last year that killed the culture, only out for himself, never celebrating if anyone else made the play.
 

welsh texan

All Pro
On the OL .... They've spent a boat load of assets on that line. There's talent there.

Tunsil's "The Best Pass Blocking LT In The League" .... supposedly (statistically he's damn good) at a cost of 2 #1 picks and a #2 to go with an average cap hit of $22m over 3 years.
Doesn't really appear he moves the needle .... that trade looks worse every day.

Tytus Howard First round pick and has been pretty solid.

Martin 2nd round pick (he's ass - can we cut this guy please?!).

Scharping 2nd round pick.

Fulton's been solid more often than not - his suck comes from being next to Martin.

Kelemete .... he runs hot an cold.

Point is , they have put a whole lot of assets towards protecting Watson ....
Also spent assets on XSF, Davenport, Rankins.
Started off with Duane Brown, Brandon Brooks, Ben Jones also worth noting when considering what this line cost to build.

Apologies for my ‘hit and run’ I was listening to Texans Unfiltered before bed last night (been hectic recently, fell asleep at 8.30pm and slept through to my alarm). Didn't even think to specify I was talking about Nick Martin as I had OL on my mind responding to your post.
 

welsh texan

All Pro
Maybe they were deluded, or just misspoke?
Perhaps, they’ve been broadcasting for some time, though. I wouldn’t like to speak for or against the reliability of their info. Seems a strange one to say Philly specifically if they made it up though.
 
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JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Perhaps, they’ve been broadcasting for some time, though. I wouldn’t like to speak for or against the reliability of their info. Seems a strange one to say Philly specifically if they made it up though.
I don't think they made it up, just that they had their info wrong
 

welsh texan

All Pro
why are you saying the word argue. All I did was ask a simple question to see which games Watson basically padded his stats. Was Brady trying to pad his stats last night in a game in which the Saints dominated? This is something every team and quarterbacks does. But hey I won’t ask you anymore questions since you think I’m trying to argue with you
So today vs Cleveland is a perfect example of this phenomenon. Watson gets nothing going until the game is close to out of reach, he comes alive, makes some huge plays, but in the end it is just beyond us.

It isn’t strictly ‘garbage time’ or ‘padding stats’ but it is an ineffectual passing game for a majority of the game, stacking the chips heavily in the opponents favour, followed by some heroics that make it close.

Today the inclement conditions, lack of running game, drops by Cobb didn’t help Deshaun, but between him and Kelly they went away from what was working in the short game on the second drive, and failed to find longer throws.

Today the D crumbled when it mattered and Tim Kelly called an awful game, along with some shocking TO management from RAC. But Watson also didn’t make anything happen until the game was beyond us.
 

Decim8

Waterboy
FWIW Texans Unfiltered reported that Philadelphia offered a 6th round pick for Nick Martin.

Also reported a rumour that Bradley Roby feigned injury vs Green Bay a he was getting beat by Adams.

They also said Mike Adams was on a Panthers podcast last week and stated that there was a veteran leader in the secondary last year that killed the culture, only out for himself, never celebrating if anyone else made the play.
Who would that veteran player be? Absolute joke if it's true
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
So today vs Cleveland is a perfect example of this phenomenon. Watson gets nothing going until the game is close to out of reach, he comes alive, makes some huge plays, but in the end it is just beyond us.

It isn’t strictly ‘garbage time’ or ‘padding stats’ but it is an ineffectual passing game for a majority of the game, stacking the chips heavily in the opponents favour, followed by some heroics that make it close.

Today the inclement conditions, lack of running game, drops by Cobb didn’t help Deshaun, but between him and Kelly they went away from what was working in the short game on the second drive, and failed to find longer throws.

Today the D crumbled when it mattered and Tim Kelly called an awful game, along with some shocking TO management from RAC. But Watson also didn’t make anything happen until the game was beyond us.
No the Texans and Watson were able to drive down the Field in the first. If Cobb catches the pass on 3rd and GOAL he scores a Touchdown. They should’ve kicked a FG or called a better play on 4th and goal. So that’s a false statement on your part there bud.
 

CWTexansFan

King Deplorable
Contributor's Club
No the Texans and Watson were able to drive down the Field in the first. If Cobb catches the pass on 3rd and GOAL he scores a Touchdown. They should’ve kicked a FG or called a better play on 4th and goal. So that’s a false statement on your part there bud.
Lol, so delusional.
Oh wait, bwahahahahaha
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
So today vs Cleveland is a perfect example of this phenomenon. Watson gets nothing going until the game is close to out of reach, he comes alive, makes some huge plays, but in the end it is just beyond us.

It isn’t strictly ‘garbage time’ or ‘padding stats’ but it is an ineffectual passing game for a majority of the game, stacking the chips heavily in the opponents favour, followed by some heroics that make it close.

Today the inclement conditions, lack of running game, drops by Cobb didn’t help Deshaun, but between him and Kelly they went away from what was working in the short game on the second drive, and failed to find longer throws.

Today the D crumbled when it mattered and Tim Kelly called an awful game, along with some shocking TO management from RAC. But Watson also didn’t make anything happen until the game was beyond us.
Please PM Mollywhopper this post.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
So today vs Cleveland is a perfect example of this phenomenon. Watson gets nothing going until the game is close to out of reach, he comes alive, makes some huge plays, but in the end it is just beyond us.

It isn’t strictly ‘garbage time’ or ‘padding stats’ but it is an ineffectual passing game for a majority of the game, stacking the chips heavily in the opponents favour, followed by some heroics that make it close.

Today the inclement conditions, lack of running game, drops by Cobb didn’t help Deshaun, but between him and Kelly they went away from what was working in the short game on the second drive, and failed to find longer throws.

Today the D crumbled when it mattered and Tim Kelly called an awful game, along with some shocking TO management from RAC. But Watson also didn’t make anything happen until the game was beyond us.
If we had a running back we can hammer in the morning. We can hammer in the evening. We can Hammer all day long. If we had a running back!
 

welsh texan

All Pro
So we didn’t drive down the field in first fn quarter.
You know TB that one really nice drive is really infuriating me. It was like a hot knife through butter nice easy quick throws, there was even a hot route behind a blitz that i can’t think of an example of us executing in recent memory.

It’s like Tim Kelly was trolling us, that one drive is a really nice example of actually, Watson is perfectly capable of running a balanced offense, can play from under centre, can make quick reads and get the ball off quick, can still run for the first down himself.

So why was it that the rest of the game we went back to the crap we saw? I don’t get it at all.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
You know TB that one really nice drive is really infuriating me. It was like a hot knife through butter nice easy quick throws, there was even a hot route behind a blitz that i can’t think of an example of us executing in recent memory.

It’s like Tim Kelly was trolling us, that one drive is a really nice example of actually, Watson is perfectly capable of running a balanced offense, can play from under centre, can make quick reads and get the ball off quick, can still run for the first down himself.

So why was it that the rest of the game we went back to the crap we saw? I don’t get it at all.
That’s a really good question, I screamed at the TV, why did you change the play calling Kelly, you dumb bleep. Those were like running plays for them and it was working. That’s that Bill O’Brien crap all over again.

In order for them to get that stank out of the room. They will have to get rid of all of those coaches, Easterby and whoever O’Brien left.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
That’s a really good question, I screamed at the TV, why did you change the play calling Kelly, you dumb bleep. Those were like running plays for them and it was working. That’s that Bill O’Brien crap all over again.

In order for them to get that stank out of the room. They will have to get rid of all of those coaches, Easterby and whoever O’Brien left.
It's not just football scheme, they have bought into it since Obrien brought his mindset here.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
You know TB that one really nice drive is really infuriating me. It was like a hot knife through butter nice easy quick throws, there was even a hot route behind a blitz that i can’t think of an example of us executing in recent memory.

It’s like Tim Kelly was trolling us, that one drive is a really nice example of actually, Watson is perfectly capable of running a balanced offense, can play from under centre, can make quick reads and get the ball off quick, can still run for the first down himself.

So why was it that the rest of the game we went back to the crap we saw? I don’t get it at all.
The really nice drives tend to happen when they're in the 2:00 min drill or 2 scores or more behind in the 2nd half.
 


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