TejasTom
All Pro
Posey on an end-adens throws to Jean for a touch down.
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3rd Round DeVier Posey WR Ohio State
- Thread starter TexansFanatic
- Start date
Posey on an end-adens throws to Jean for a touch down.
That's what I like about Posey.
badboy has been watching too much footbal, it's easy to confuse one guy from another; heck, a lot of the receivers in this draft class look similar to one another!
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Larry Fitzgerald sponsors a WR camp that I think Cris Carter & Jerry Rice help with. I can't recall if any of our draft picks have attended before ... I wonder why???
Seems like you'd want your rookies to spend some time with those greats ... ?
ChampionTexan
Hall of Fame
Have you suffered multiple concussions?
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Daim bramage.
I may or may not have already posted this cutup: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEkBl91EJsk
No even moderately high WR pick since Jacoby Jones down?
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
I don't know ... I've never read mention of our guys going to Fitz's camp & wondered why we wouldn't encourage that.
drs23
Veteran
Thanks for posting. DeVier is a damn good interview and really sharp. I was impressed his "cerebral approach" to the game.
Can't wait to learn from Andre. Imagine that?
GP
Go Texans!
Here's an SI.com article on Posey, specifically the Texans' choice of him, and a few screen shots that they analyzed.
Pretty decent article. Here's an excerpt:
And...
Pretty decent article. Here's an excerpt:
The 6-foot-2, 211-pound Posey has a high quota of playmaking ability and, if he’s single-covered while teams pay attention to Johnson, looks like he can find some seams. The play below comes from Ohio State’s win over Miami in 2010, with Pryor at QB.
Posey ran a pretty simple corner route, but in the process managed to both beat the press coverage on the line and accelerate into space beyond the deep safety.
And...
Posey’s there with space, but Pryor’s throw sailed a bit. Worse yet, for our specific study, Posey short-armed his catch attempt, no doubt hearing the footsteps from the closing safety.
That’s an issue that comes up again and again with Posey. He’ll go over the middle, he might even make some catches in traffic - he scored against Indiana in 2009 on a play similar to this one, where he plucked the ball and secured it before being rocked at the goal line. But he’ll drop some passes that he shouldn’t and he will shy from contact at times.
There were two examples of that from Ohio State’s 2010 opener against Marshall. Posey scored twice in that game, so this all emphasizes his up-and-down performances. In the second quarter, on a deep ball from Pryor, Posey kept floating long, allowing Marshall’s safety to slip underneath him and bat a pass away. Then, to open the fourth, Posey sat down against zone coverage and Pryor hit him in the numbers - Posey flat-out dropped it.
Houston will hope for more consistency from Posey as an NFL rookie. Will the Texans get it?
badboy
Hall of Fame
My apologies to board as I stand corrected. I did think it was Posey with the party/name issues. Thanks for heads up.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Classic darkhorse. under the radar/studied among 2012 WR class. what Kubiak likes is his ability to create separation in & out of breaks. DeVier possess the upside needed to succeed in the NFL making him a great value with a mid 3rd rd. pick. Posey killed the Ducks in 2010 Rose Bowl he could not be covered, caught everything thrown to him 8 receptions 101 yards, 12.6 yards per catch & game winning TD. He is the type of receiver who excels in the redzone, combination of creating space & awareness, knowing how to help the QB. Toughness over the middle is one reason they took Martin, who is more of a slot WR, in 4th also great value considering he will return kicks as well.
I'll tell ya' ... these writers (Chris Burke, in this instance)... they like to find fault and something to write about, at times they just don't watch enough tapes and/or don't watch it closely enough - understandable, as they had to write about a lot of different players, they skimmed through the tapes.
In doing so, they did themselves a disservice.
Burke got several things wrong:
- Route running is Posey's strong suite.
- Catching the ball in traffic is not a bad part of his game.
Think about it... A guy with no deep speed that can't run route and is afraid of going in the middle... Would there be a team stupid enough to draft such a guy in the third round?
I can get to the specific play(s) when I have some time, but I don't think it's really necessary.
I agree, but to be fair I don't think he was saying that is who Posey is but rather he has shown a tendency to do those things.
And I don't even know if it's a tendency really. Just a couple of not so great moments.
But I agree with your point that he has shown the ability to do those things more than he has shown to not do them.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see how he adjusts to the NFL.
Very Nice breakdown of Posey's Game
Click on the link for a 76 style breakdown. While I don't agree with a few things he said, I think a lot of people are just unsure of what to make of Posey. Having a true QB throwing the ball to him will improve his game drastically I believe though.
Click on the link for a 76 style breakdown. While I don't agree with a few things he said, I think a lot of people are just unsure of what to make of Posey. Having a true QB throwing the ball to him will improve his game drastically I believe though.
TejasTom
All Pro
The problem is the writer sometimes describes the play all wrong; therefore, the conclusion he drew from that play is incorrect.
Start with the "not so good" part, Chris Burke brought up a play in the Sugar Bowl as followed:
"It’s a good start to the play, with Posey beating tight coverage at the line and getting inside the corner covering him. However, that corner had deep safety help, which means Posey and Pryor had to run everything to perfection to complete a slant pattern.
That’s not quite what happened.
Posey’s there with space, but Pryor’s throw sailed a bit. Worse yet, for our specific study, Posey short-armed his catch attempt, no doubt hearing the footsteps from the closing safety.
That’s an issue that comes up again and again with Posey. He’ll go over the middle, he might even make some catches in traffic - he scored against Indiana in 2009 on a play similar to this one, where he plucked the ball and secured it before being rocked at the goal line. But he’ll drop some passes that he shouldn’t and he will shy from contact at times."
......
That was not what happened, Burke!
Posey lined up a couple yards outside the numbers.
The Buckeyes ran a 4-vertical pattern with Posey the lone receiver on the right; the Razorbacks were in man coverage with a single deep safety.
Posey ran a seam route (not a slant).
He opened up the CB by faking an outside release and beat him to the inside.
Posey started to look for the ball around the 15yd-mark from the LOS.
This is where the ball should have been aimed at; somewhere between 15-18 yards to avoid the safety.
However, the ball sailed high as it was thrown to 22-23 yards.
Pryor locked onto his target too soon; he never moved the safety with his eyes; this allowed the safety to converge quickly.
Remember that it was a 4-vertical against a single deep safety.
All Pryor had to do is to look straight downfield (he didn't) at the safety to hold him there for a little bit.
Or failing that, he could have just thrown the ball a couple of yards shorter and Posey would have had an easy catch.
The ball sailed high; Posey reached out with one hand, but it was just too far away.
I don't get how Burke can say that Posey "short-armed" his catch attempt on an overthrown ball.
He even chose the "best" camera angle to try to fool people into believing his point.
And with that he concluded that Posey short-armed it because he was "no doubt" hearing footsteps from the closing safety.
No Burke, the guy who needs more consistency is you!
Start with the "not so good" part, Chris Burke brought up a play in the Sugar Bowl as followed:
"It’s a good start to the play, with Posey beating tight coverage at the line and getting inside the corner covering him. However, that corner had deep safety help, which means Posey and Pryor had to run everything to perfection to complete a slant pattern.
That’s not quite what happened.
Posey’s there with space, but Pryor’s throw sailed a bit. Worse yet, for our specific study, Posey short-armed his catch attempt, no doubt hearing the footsteps from the closing safety.
That’s an issue that comes up again and again with Posey. He’ll go over the middle, he might even make some catches in traffic - he scored against Indiana in 2009 on a play similar to this one, where he plucked the ball and secured it before being rocked at the goal line. But he’ll drop some passes that he shouldn’t and he will shy from contact at times."
......
That was not what happened, Burke!
Posey lined up a couple yards outside the numbers.
The Buckeyes ran a 4-vertical pattern with Posey the lone receiver on the right; the Razorbacks were in man coverage with a single deep safety.
Posey ran a seam route (not a slant).
He opened up the CB by faking an outside release and beat him to the inside.
Posey started to look for the ball around the 15yd-mark from the LOS.
This is where the ball should have been aimed at; somewhere between 15-18 yards to avoid the safety.
However, the ball sailed high as it was thrown to 22-23 yards.
Pryor locked onto his target too soon; he never moved the safety with his eyes; this allowed the safety to converge quickly.
Remember that it was a 4-vertical against a single deep safety.
All Pryor had to do is to look straight downfield (he didn't) at the safety to hold him there for a little bit.
Or failing that, he could have just thrown the ball a couple of yards shorter and Posey would have had an easy catch.
The ball sailed high; Posey reached out with one hand, but it was just too far away.
I don't get how Burke can say that Posey "short-armed" his catch attempt on an overthrown ball.
He even chose the "best" camera angle to try to fool people into believing his point.
And with that he concluded that Posey short-armed it because he was "no doubt" hearing footsteps from the closing safety.
No Burke, the guy who needs more consistency is you!
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Exactly, rack him! MSR Gotta do a more credible job with SI.That was not what happened, Burke!
...
No Burke, the guy who needs more consistency is you!
Here's the play cued up & slow-mo: http://youtu.be/xEkBl91EJsk?t=3m54s If Burke had just listened to the commentator he'd have done a better job.
That's the one thing that jumped out at me more than anything watching these older cutups -- Pryor locks on worse than even Leinart, imo. It's like there's always only one WR in pattern. Makes a receiver's job a lot tougher.
Exactly! 76 did a much better job than saying what I disagreed with than I would have done. The thing about playing with inconsistent QB's who move around a lot is it sometimes gets receivers into some bad habits. Burke said that Posey isn't a good route runner, but that's just not true in my opinion. When you have an inaccurate QB who scrambles a lot you're not going to be used to the ball being delivered on time consistently.
That's why I'm excited to see what he's going to do in this offense. He won't have that problem here of worrying about QB's moving around and can simply play within the system. I've also seen him make some tough catches where he took big shots so I'm not worried about him shying away from contact either.
False Start
On # 69
Here he is at an autograph signing (I guess?) in his uni. Damn, that collar! 
Edit:
Another pic
Edit:
Another pic
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Premier
Rookie
just like arian fosters lack of speed and poor vision..
Blake
MMQB
drs23
Veteran
A rookie who played three games last year in college, on the second day of OTAs ?
Surely you jest?
badboy
Hall of Fame
not if we can find him a "bog" to play in.
b0ng
Bad Hombre
Interesting, I wonder who the 1's and 2's are with Johnson out.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
I'd imagine guys with experience in the system would currently be ranked highest: KW, Lestar Jean (1s) and then Juaquin Iglesias, Jeff Maehl (2s), and then Posey and Martin (3s), and then Jones, Holliday, and Jackson in no particular order.
b0ng
Bad Hombre
Well if DeVier Posey cannot beat out Jeff Maehle or Juaquin Iglesias then this will be a really bad pick. Same probably goes for Keshawn Martin.
With 2 days of OTAs it's normal to have the younger guys running with the younger guys while they learn the system. There is NO WAY that Posey enters camp not running with at least the 2's.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
My post wasn't about where they'll end up; my post is where they PROBABLY were when OTAs started. Until the rookies learn their routes, the guys that know the routes should have an advantage.
In a week, the whole list could be turned on its ear as guys learn the ropes and the offense and start to show what they can do.
drunkcookie
2 drunk 2 cook
I wanna say it's Walter and Jean running together right now...
Premier
Rookie
doubt maehl or iglesias stick around..
I think trindon is higher than you have him listed and no way is Iglesias ahead of the two draft picks. I doubt he even gets more reps in team drills.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
GP
Go Texans!
Outside of KW, what WR has Kubiak identified and acquired that really has contributed much of anything? I can't think of a name.
The WR spot has to get better. If we don't find a gem out of the bunch we've got right now...then I think we're potentially in trouble this year.
At some point, the offense has to rely on the WRs more than it has recently. We're basically a flavor of two scoops of Arian Foster, a dash of Ben Tate, and a pinch of Name-That-Texans-TE.
IF guys like Posey, Jean, Martin, and even Dweeb Jones find ways to REALLY contribute...this team is unstoppable in 2012. If not, I hope nothing happens to Arian Foster.
Outside of David Anderson (7th) , Jacoby Jones (3rd) and Trycycle Holliday (6th) and if you really wanna get technical Dorin Dickerson (7th) ..... What WR's has Kubiak drafted or traded for ??
The answer would be .... None.
To be fair to Kubiak , Jacoby Jones has all world talent .... Just no brain to go along with that talent. In his time with the Texans , Kubiak extracted as much as can be expected out Jones and his pea brain.
Anderson was solid if un-spectacular while with the Texans , making plays when given the opportunity.
They really havent had the luxury of drafting a WR high either .... Kubiak and Smith were saddled with a 2-14 team that was lacking of talent from the top of the roster to the bottom.
In fixing the rest of the roster , the WR position has been ignored .... yet we've seen the team produce back to back 4500 passing yard seasons with #80 , KW and <insert joke here> at WR .... and would likely have duplicated that last season if not for a series of injuries , their top two QB's out for 6 games and #80 missing 9 games , that would have broken lesser teams.
Technically we traded for mason last year.
...and we gave Bryant Johnson (picked @ #17 by AZ in 2003) an extended "looksee" to see if he could help.
...he didn't.
and I wonder why that is... he was a decent 3rd option for the Cards behind Boldin and Fitz. Had a 45 catch year with the Niners... Seems like he should have been the guy to step up. Except Kubiak kept trying to make Jones into something he wasn't; a #1 WR.
TejasTom
All Pro
I think there is an argument that you are both right, considering Mason's lack of production. Since he didn't have enough catches to trigger the conditional pick we got Mason for free.
The point is they have spent very few resources in the WR position since Kubiak took over .... Honestly they didnt do much to fill the position in the Capers / Casserly era either.
Here's a list of every WR drafted by the Texans - including the expansion draft.
Jermaine Lewis - 6th round of the expansion draft , originally drafted in the 5th round #153 in 1996 by Baltimore.
Avoin Black 16th round pick in the expansion draft , originally drafted in the 4th round #121 in 2000 by Buffalo
Jabar Gaffney 2nd round #33 in 2002.
Andre Johnson 1st round #3 in 2003
Sloan Thomas 7th round #211 in 2004
Jerome Mathis 4th round #114 in 2005
David Anderson 7th round #251 in 2006 - Kubiaks first draft.
Jacoby Jones 3rd round #72 in 2007
None in 2008
None in 2009
Trindon Holliday 6th round #197 in 2010
Dorin Dickerson 7th round #227 in 2010 - Technically a TE but they drafted him to play WR.
None in 2011
DeVier Posey 3rd round #68 in 2012
Keshawn Martin 4th round #121 in 2012
In Kubiaks first Six drafts he used two 7th rounders , a 6th and one premium pick at WR - that being Pea Brain in the 3rd round of 07.
Hard to say what he can and cant do with WR's when he hasnt really used any valuable resources on premium talent mainly because he was handed a roster lacking talent at so many positions.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
This is a pretty good point.
Let's go back a bit further. People always talk about how Kubiak/Shanahan:
1) Don't normally draft linemen early because they have odd requirements for the ZBS.
2) Don't normally draft RBs early because the system works with guys that are available later
Do they do the same thing with WRs?
First off, who were the Bronco's receivers during Kubiak's time?
He inherited Anthony Miller (5'11", 190#), 1st round pick of the Chargers in 88) and Mike Pritchard (5'10#, 188#), 1st round pick of the Falcons in 1991. Those were his guys in 1995, his first year there. But he brought Ed McCaffrey from San Francisco (6'5#, 215#) who'd originally been drafted by the Giants in the 3rd round in 1991. McCaffrey became a fixture in Denver. Also in 1995, the Bronco's picked up an UDFA named Rod Smith (6', 200#) who would have an HOF career with Kubiak. He didn't start until his 3rd year with the team and then was a perennial pro bowler. Ed Kennison (6'1", 201#), a #1 pick by the Rams, took over for McCaffrey when he was injured in 2001. But McCaffrey eventually lost his pick to Denver 1st round pick, Ashley LeLie (6' 3", 200#). LeLie had a couple of very good seasons under Kubiak, the best being a 54 catch/1084 yard season. But the wheels fell off when Kubiak left. He bounced around and was never able to regain his form.
As to who the Bronco's drafted as WRs... it's a load of late round crap and even when they drafted in the early rounds, the guys were scrubs.
5 - Patrick Jeffers, 6'3", 217#, 5 year marginal career
1 - Marcus Nash, 6'3#, 195#, 1 year career and busted
3 - Travis McGriff, 5' 8#, 185#, 3 years and 5 receptions
6 - Chad Plummer, 6'3", 223#, 2 years and no stats
3 - Chris Cole, 6', 195#, 3 years, 12 catches
5 - Muneer Moore, didn't make it from Richmond
7 - Leroy Fields, didn't make it from Jackson State
6 - Kevin Kasper, 6'1", 197#, 5 years, marginal player
1 - Ashley Lelie, 6'3", 200#, 7 years and a starter
5 - Herb Haygood, 5' 11", 193#, 1 year
5 - Adrian Madise, 5' 11", 215#, 1 year
2 - Darius Watts, 6'2", 190#, 2 years, marginal player
6 - Triandos Luke, 5'10", 190#, 1 year and 6 receptions
Not a great track record... until you throw Rod Smith into the mix.
I wonder how much input Kubiak had into this? I think he's drafted WR better here than Denver did when he was there.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
In a round about sort of way, they did.
Going into the draft, Smith said over and over that this draft was deep at WR. There were a lot of guys (off the top of my head: Randle, Toon, Sanu, etc.) who would have gone in the 1st-3rd round other years that dropped to later rounds because there were so many talented guys available OR because of character concerns.
Prior to his suspension, Posey was considered a 2nd round talent. A lot of people red-flagged him because of those suspensions as a "bad character" guy but on reviewing why he was suspended, he's really not. He's a very talented receiver that we basically stole because a lot of people slept on him.
Dwight Jones is possibly even more talented and has more potential than Posey except that he DOES have real character concerns. If he hadn't screwed around, he easily could have been drafted in the 2nd round.
Walterfootball had Jones AND K-Mart ranked higher than Posey although I think they were giving too much emphasis to Posey's suspensions.
So, in effect, we got 3 guys at WR who could be considered early round prospects, we just got them in later rounds. So that's a good deal, right?
