Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
It's already being paid upfront so it can't be spread. It isn't a signing bonus.
But there are several other ways to clear up cap space it necessary.
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
2015 Roster & cap FA returning
- Thread starter badboy
- Start date
It's already being paid upfront so it can't be spread. It isn't a signing bonus.
But there are several other ways to clear up cap space it necessary.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
One time Roster Bonus can be converted to a pro-rated bonus at the discretion of the team; they don't even need the approval from the player since it does not affect how it is received. But like mentioned above, should only be used as a last resort option. But I don't think they can do it after it has been activated. Watt's roster bonus has already become guaranteed. The Texans could gain $8 million in cap space if they did this with Watt's roster bonus.
Example from one of Joel Corry's articles:
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on...ve-teams-with-the-worst-salary-cap-situations
badboy
Hall of Fame
Never said I expected, it is an option to clear up space if needed. I think they intended to pay it the way it serves team needs and Watt could care less as he gets it either way.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
Interesting that Thad was signed through 2015. I didn't notice this. Why would the Texans sign a QB off the street to a 2 year contract? Is there something more there than we realize?
PapaL
Loose Screw
You mean like they planned on him being a part of the team next year and not the guy they signed after?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I wouldn't read too much into that. When they signed Lewis the incentive was to sign him for next season for a shot thru camp. Dude can be cut at any time with no repercussion. With Keenum the incentive was "and you get to start."
QB Mallet is a priority. Time to let Fitz go.
WR obvioulsy AJ needs to take a pay cut.
OL 8 mill is way to much for Myers. Time to move Jones over. Bring back
Newton at a reasonable price and draft a good young OT.
RB Might as well ride Foster till he gives out now.
TE Graham worth 4 million?? Not IMO. I would bring in a FA that doesn't break the bank. Someone like Virgil Green, TE, Denver Broncos. Should be fairly cheap and is young and a very good blocking TE. Graded by Pro Football Focus as the fourth-best run-blocking tight end in the NFL this season. With a 4.64-second 40-yard dash and 42.5-inch vertical jump, according to NFL.com, Green was one of the top performers among tight ends at the 2011 NFL Scouting Combine. Hasn't really had a chance to shine in Denver because of all the offensive weapons in front of him.
DEFENSE
DE Would like to see Jamison back.
NT Bring back Pickett and Sign BJ Raji in FA.
ILB Cushing should be asked to take a paycut or get cut. Rolondo Mclain would be my target. Dallas has a lot of players that will need to get paid. They can't afford them all.
OLB bring Reed back. He's not great but he is solid and priced right.
badboy
Hall of Fame
As of Monday Jan 5th 2015 I would pursue the following for free agency:
Mike Mitchell signed a five year, $25 million contract with the Pittsburgh Steelers on March 11, 2014. Mitchell (comparable 2014 stats to Lewis) received a $4.75 million signing bonus and $500,000 roster bonus as his guarantee. Base salaries are $750,000(2014), $2,000,000(2015), $5,000,000(2016), $5,000,00(2017), and $5,000,000(2018).[/QUOTE] He got bonus $4.75 + roster .5 + base .75 = first year $ 6 m but cap only $2.2 m I'd offer that to Lewis and Newton and sweeten a bit for Jackson. Maybe similar to 1.1 pick Clowney:
Team salary $ 109 + KJ $4 + Lewis $2.2 + Newton $2.2 + draft/PS $7 = $124.4 with cap total estimate $140 m. $15.6 for Mallet + back ups like Jamison, Ansah, Powe (I'd go with Pickett and Nix)Dent, etc. Mallett should not be signed for over $ 5 m '15 cap. Leaving apprx $10 m for vet FAs.
Mike Mitchell signed a five year, $25 million contract with the Pittsburgh Steelers on March 11, 2014. Mitchell (comparable 2014 stats to Lewis) received a $4.75 million signing bonus and $500,000 roster bonus as his guarantee. Base salaries are $750,000(2014), $2,000,000(2015), $5,000,000(2016), $5,000,00(2017), and $5,000,000(2018).[/QUOTE] He got bonus $4.75 + roster .5 + base .75 = first year $ 6 m but cap only $2.2 m I'd offer that to Lewis and Newton and sweeten a bit for Jackson. Maybe similar to 1.1 pick Clowney:
$14.5 bonus + base .42 = $14.7 first year but cap $4 m but entire guarantee $22 m. Offer a 5th year but not guaranteed if needed.
Team salary $ 109 + KJ $4 + Lewis $2.2 + Newton $2.2 + draft/PS $7 = $124.4 with cap total estimate $140 m. $15.6 for Mallet + back ups like Jamison, Ansah, Powe (I'd go with Pickett and Nix)Dent, etc. Mallett should not be signed for over $ 5 m '15 cap. Leaving apprx $10 m for vet FAs.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
Are we working with the Top 51 rule for this experiment?
badboy
Hall of Fame
no as my OP shows, only 46 players on roster prior to draft. Just a way to discuss money and possible moves. If you have something in mind to expand the discussion, go for it.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
OK guess I am just confused. Texans have 60 players under contract for 2015 at the moment. I will be using the Top 51 rule going forward.
I'm in favor of releasing Meyers, Graham, Thad Lewis, Clabo. Small salary reduction for Joseph. Reworking A. Johnson's contract to add one year to it with some GTD money. Could get the cap space up over $25m with those moves before signing anymore players.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Why not try to work something out with Myers?
TEXANRED
Texan-American
Why cut Meyers? He is kind of important and no one behind him to take his place. Do we need $25M in cap space for 2015? Texans top FA's to sign are Jackson, Reed, Newton, and Mallett. I don't know how accurate overthecap.com is but they have the Texans 2015 salary cap at around $11M for next year and $68M for 2016. http://overthecap.com/calculator/houston-texans/ That should be plenty of money to play with as long as someone in the FO plucks their head from their butt and start playing chess with the cap instead of checkers.
badboy
Hall of Fame
For names and monies I use the OTC link of 51 but no one thinks Clabo or Thad Lewis will be back. We know Quessenberry money will count but on non injury related status. Of the 60, we also know all of those not on roster game 1.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
That could be an option. I think Jones or Ferentz could take over for him.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
I don't think $11m is enough to re-sign Jackson, Reed, Newton, Mallett, K. Lewis, other free agents, and the 2015 draft class. And to take into account any players that get placed on IR during TC and preaseason.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I'd like to see more of Ferentz. I'm not a fan of Jones and think the biggest hole in his game is mental which will not be improved by moving him to C.
TEXANRED
Texan-American
Is there another Jones on the team or are you talking about #60? The second most important position on the OL given to Ben Jones? No thanks.
TEXANRED
Texan-American
But with $68 million to play with in 2016 and $113M in 2017 you could still pay your top FA's. They just won't get it until 2016 and 17. Guaranteed money is guaranteed money no matter what year they get paid in.
Plus, I am not sure how many people noticed, but in every playoff game this weekend there were ex Texans starting and making plays for their team (except the Indy game). We need to start keeping some of our players so we stop missing out on the playoffs. Especially with how horrible the last few draft classes have panned out. We can't afford to lose anyone else and expect to stay competitive.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
Understood. If the team can find a way to squeeze in some low salaries for 2015 and maybe bring in some roster bonus money in 2016, then maybe. The draft class will take up about $5m of that available $11m.
The way I see something will need to be done. Either through releases, or salary reductions. Hopefully avoid restructuring in the way of "kicking the can down the road".
Troy Chapman
Rookie
True. I think Ferentz could be the guy, just may not be ready for 2015. May need to keep Meyers around for another year if that is the case. Ferentz probably needs to add some weight, since he is similar to Meyer's size.
Honest question here, does Meyers play justify having the 4th highest cap charge and 3rd highest salary among centers in 2015?
DX-TEX
#TomSavageDontCare
I love Myers but he gets eaten alive by big nose tackles. Great center for ZBS but in a power scheme? He is vastly undersized
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I think he is toward the top for centers. He hasn't missed a game in forever. He's smart. I'd try to add 2 years to his contract and reduce that number to where he is more mid-pack.
Only one "e" by the way.
TEXANRED
Texan-American
Honest answer, I don't know. It is hard to gauge due to how the contracts are structured. If I looked at it as a whole, I believe that Myers is absolutely worth his $25M contract. Pouncey got a $44M contract, Mack $42M, Kalil $49M, Mangold $54M. Myers is appropriately paid for what he does. http://overthecap.com/position/center/
We are definitely not going to get a better center for less money. He may not be a physical beast but what he lacks in strength he makes up for in leadership and the mental side of the game.
TEXANRED
Texan-American
The only problem with that is he turns 34 in september. Adding two years puts him at 36, which 36 is fine in people years, but in NFL player years?
Maybe Ben Jones is the answer at center and that's why they drafted Su' A Filo. But then again Su had a hard time making it onto the field and when he did play he got hurt.
Who knows. This is turning into a very frustrating off season. Seems to be more what if's and we'll see than there are answers.
Nothing wrong with a 36 year old center. 36 at a skilled position... Now that's a different story.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
That's fair. I'd love to keep Myers if we can get the numbers down just a little. If we can't and Houston feels he is needed as is, then there are other ways to make room.
Myers, Cushing, Graham. A Johnson and Joseph all need to restructure or hit the road. None are producing like they should compared to their contracts. I'm a big AJ fan but I'm sick of seeing this team fall short. We need more talent and depth if we are going to get over the hump.
Number19
Hall of Fame
AJ will likely be McNair's call. I think he wants our future HOF'er to retire as a Texan.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
Not much room to restructure on Cushing since his salary is only $4 million. If you release him, would need to be a post June 1 cut to avoid being upside down.
According to the OP his salary is 8 million this year.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
His cap hit is $7.89 mil = $4 mil base salary, $1.597 mil signing bonus, $1.093 mil roster bonus, $1.2 mil option bonus.
His dead money if cut this year is $10.2 which could be divided as a June 1st but is a crud load of dead money.
Most teams sign big ticket FAs then find the money to pay them. I'd rather see the Texans do that once before I start cutting players just to free up money. Makes no sen sense to me to free up a lot of money to not use it.
Otherwise we'd just call McNair cheap.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
Yep. Side note, his roster bonus is a per active game bonus of $78,125. So that part is not included in his dead money at this time. Your dead money number is correct. Other sources have his dead money higher because of the roster bonus.
Speaking of which, noticed that Mike Pouncey with Miami has a large salary but can be cut with almost $8 mill cap savings. Mia is currently at 143 Mill so will have to trim the roster a bit.
Should we be interested in bringing him in as a replacement? I do think he gets cut
TEXANRED
Texan-American
So who are you going to pay to play center as good as Myers but pay out less money? Are you 100% sure Jones is better?
You guys want to save $6M? Cut Graham @$4M and Lechler @ $2M. You don't mess with the foundation of your house. Cut Fitzpatrick, that saves another $4M. Look, I just cut 3 non essential Texans and saved us $10M.
Now we want to cut Cushing? Of course he had an off year, he just finished having not one but two knee surgeries. Let's not do to him what we did to Ryans.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
One good thing, the Texans are in a comfortable spot salary cap wise. They do not have any large questionable roster bonuses due after the start of the league year. The Texans can easily sit and strategically plan it out. No rash moves need to be moved right away.
League year starts on March 10th. RFA and ERFA tenders will need to be given by 4pm EST that day. However they will need to resign any UFA players (if they want) prior to March 7th to avoid the player hitting the open market.
Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
It is always relevant to point out that there is a difference between Cap savings and Cap shifting. There is a time for each, but long term management of the Cap requires a balance between immediate and future needs. We should keep this in mind when we look at post June 1 cuts.
At this point, unlike some teams, I have not heard of any problems with cash flow being more than an afterthought when structuring the team's Cap.
At this point, unlike some teams, I have not heard of any problems with cash flow being more than an afterthought when structuring the team's Cap.
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
He keeps on getting blown up too!
I am no Jones fan. At least not at guard, but think you may be right about moving him to center unless as has been suggested he is not smart enough.
Too small, and too often getting blown up on key plays. Tripping up the QB or RB as he is pushed into the backfield.
Agreed
Yeah I think last year this was decided. I think McNair assured AJ he would retire a Texan. Not saying there will not be some reduction in salary, but my feeling is Uncle Bob will keep Dre until he retires in the next few years.
When there was a QB in the lineup who could get him the ball and was committed to doing so, he seemed like he old self. When there was a QB who was going to use him as a decoy every play, he seemed old and slow. Perhaps with Mallett in there starting training camp AJ will be rejuvenated and play more like his old self.
Norg
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
sometimes u got to cut old fan fav name players at least this team does its time to rebuild
why?
Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
Sometimes that is true. But not when keeping him costs less than cutting him.
welsh texan
You may say I’m a dreamer but I’m not the only one
I'm down with keeping him in that case, I just hope his offseason programme is sensible, he needs to start working smart rather than the (truly impressive, I might add) hardcore workouts he's used to employing. Get your body capable of seeing through an entire season of strain and then see what performance you can bring to the table at perhaps a lighter weight rather than going all out for size which his knee may not be able to support.
badboy
Hall of Fame
The purpose of thread was to create discussion and thought. Points: OP was salary cap numbers as stated, not base salary. We are not in a cap hell as some have thought. No reason to move or cut until we have a FA to sign. We have done this historically by using AJ to provide space, so it can be done again..just not with him, I hope. Someone mentioned maturing our "franchise QB" with a maturing center & I think that could be a disaster. A young QB needs as much stability and options to support him as possible and we already have young OGs as is, rather keep Myers. Also, you don't cut old FAV players unless you have someone to replace them. Also, cutting Lechler who is probably the most consistent, dependable player we have doesn't get my vote. Used to be said a punter can be had for nothing but we found that to be untrue. We have been fortunate with Shane and Matt Turk.
ghostlight
Veteran
Love this time of the cycle in the world of football. We learn much about our team players and our perceived value of them during this period. Thanks for all the numbers and suggestions. I'm starting to get excited about the free agency and draft talk and can't wait till the action starts.
TexansFTW
Veteran
If anyone cares Spotrac did an projected salary cap space of all the teams. They currently have the Texans at ~$7.5 MM
http://www.spotrac.com/research/nfl/projected-cap-space-for-all-2015-nfl-teams-502/
http://www.spotrac.com/research/nfl/projected-cap-space-for-all-2015-nfl-teams-502/
Just to point out to all that that figures a cap of $142M (I think it will be higher than that) and takes into acct the rookie drafted poll - comp picks.