What Grade Did Caserio Get on Watson Trade?

[Bluehen Texan]

I absolutely do not believe Watson's actions limited what the Texans got.

I believe thinking that it would limited what the Texans got.

We just disagree then.

 

[leebigeztx]

I don't think Nick can control contract negotiations between teams.

Nick had him under contract & it's that contract that's being traded.

Watson wasn't a FA. Contract negotiations shouldn't have been part of this at all. The attractive part of the trade was you had a young QB locked into a contract.

Russell Wilson didn't get a new contract, neither did Carson Wentz, neither did Matthew Stafford.

I could see Watson asking the Texans to allow contract negotiations so he could protect his money in the event he gets suspended. But he pulled a fast one & redid the whole thing.

Nick, who had him under contract should have allowed him to ask that it would be renegotiated after the trade. & let Nick negotiate a trade between 3 teams.

That's not what happened. I know. But Watson was under contract. That's all I'm saying

Well, maybe those guys need better agents. Your agent should try to squeeze every penny out of billionaire owned teams for the short span they have. Wilson, if nothing else should've redone his deal. Rodgers contingency upon retirement was about the money. You know as well as I don't nfl contracts aren't worth the paper they're written on unless it the g-money. Remember when McNair had that 50m p-5 bonus clause at the end of his contract when he was with the Titans? they basically knew that no way in hell they were going to pay him 50m. They reworked his contract and traded him to the Ravens. Thats the nfl. Owners are always lying saying what they can't do to field the best team possible. The Saints have as much cap room as the Texans and they're still packing Drew Brees money.

 

[thunderkyss]

TK this is where you’re not getting have the waiver of the NTC works.

Russell Wilson

The Texans let Watson do whatever he wanted. No one has ever been traded like this, even with a NTC.

This is the way the Texans did it. No one else has ever done it this way.

Did Russell Wilson parade around the country negotiating his trade? Did team owners fly to Seattle for a sit down with Russell Wilson?

Did you even think Wilson would be traded before Watson?

If they were Smart Atlanta should be working the phones right now negotiating a trade for Matt Ryan & his NTC, & you won't hear about it until it's done.

That's the way NTCs work outside of Houston.

Here's a list of teams that want you. Scratch off the teams you won't play for. & if it's only one team left, you write another list.

Then Watson & his team are out of the conversation until they're on a plane to whichever team gave you the best deal.

Russell Wilson

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

You can put players through a stress test to test injuries.I'm not complaining because obviously the owners signed off on trading him just as they signed off on trading Hopkins.

What are you talking about?

 

[thunderkyss]

The next is nix all the trades, keep Watson on the roster, watch him not play again while this time getting a huge paycheck and let this nightmare continue another year

Again, I wouldn't pay him. Let them resolve it in Arbitration after his playing/not playing is settled or he's traded.

Texans got lawyers too. Put them to work.

 

[thunderkyss]

We just disagree then.

I've got receipts. 4 teams at the table, Nick got exactly what he asked for.

Had he got less than what he asked your argument might have legs.

 

[thunderkyss]

Well, maybe those guys need better agents. Your agent should try to squeeze every penny out of billionaire owned teams for the short span they have. Wilson, if nothing else should've redone his deal.

I bet Wilson is kicking rocks right now.

But I doubt Carroll would have been as willing as the Texans to drop their drawers & assume whatever position Watson asked for.

This is not the only time a player with a NTC was ever traded. This isn't the first time either. It's the first time Houston ever did it. It's the first & only time it's been done like this

& after seeing what Denver gave for Wilson compared to what Houston got for Watson I don't see the benefit of letting Watson drive the bus.

Too many teams willing to give what Nick asked.

That Nick got what he asked for, I'm not at all disappointed in the trade.

But all these arguments that Nick was hamstrung or "this is the way it had to be".... all BS

 

[Texian]

Your post and what you said for a reminder.

You can exchange Watson for a 1 lb roast or a 3 lb roast. You can marinate however you like. Regardless the 3 lb roast will feed a lot more people (build a better team). I understand some folks are trying to be cute and are trying to make up a lot of excuses to justify Caserio's inconceivable blunder. It goes rather well with the Kool Aid.

 

[Texian]

I've got receipts. 4 teams at the table, Nick got exactly what he asked for.

Had he got less than what he asked your argument might have legs.

Nick had a $10 million dollar home for sale. He stuck a For Sale for $7 million sign in the front yard.

 

[Bluehen Texan]

I've got receipts. 4 teams at the table, Nick got exactly what he asked for.

Had he got less than what he asked your argument might have legs.

If he got less than what he asked he would have done a better job? Lol.

I got a receipt. 3 first rounders, a 3rd and a 4th. That’s what it is and I believe it could have been even much more if none of this massage pervert nonsense ever surfaced.
Maybe you can get a better deal on a brand new bow flex than others. But you can‘t get brand new bow flex money for a used stretched out one.

 

[TexansBull]

I bet Wilson is kicking rocks right now.

But I doubt Carroll would have been as willing as the Texans to drop their drawers & assume whatever position Watson asked for.

This is not the only time a player with a NTC was ever traded. This isn't the first time either. It's the first time Houston ever did it. It's the first & only time it's been done like this

& after seeing what Denver gave for Wilson compared to what Houston got for Watson I don't see the benefit of letting Watson drive the bus.

Too many teams willing to give what Nick asked.

That Nick got what he asked for, I'm not at all disappointed in the trade.

But all these arguments that Nick was hamstrung or "this is the way it had to be".... all BS

The Seahawks could’ve gotten a better deal from WFT but turned it down.

Wilson never threatened to my knowledge to sit out and not play. Wilson said this trade was initiated by Seattle’s FO but was a mutual agreement.

It is a much different scenario to have a player threaten to not play and collect 35 million dollars. That is being held hostage.

And it is different to have the same player that has value to be traded but could evaporate at a moment’s notice because of legal issues.

There is a lot different in those scenarios.

Cleveland paid 50% more than any other team had before in the past to guarantee the contract.

That is ludicrous on a player that can be still suspended, has to settle a civil case, or could still go to jail.

 

[Hervoyel]

I am simply pleased with the thought that this is, or should be over. It seems that those who are displeased with the haul see it as a clear sign that the Texans are still a “rudderless” organization. Those who are satisfied with the trade seem to feel like this is the first sign the Texans have shown in ages that they do indeed have a rudder at all. I lean toward the latter opinion. Maybe it’s just that I’ve grown accustomed to seeing great Texans players (or in some cases “formerly great”) sent on their way for little to nothing. I don’t know but I do think that this has dragged along for so long that seeing it end with something substantial is enough for me. If Watson is gone and the Texans have multiple chances to screw up in the first round for the next three years that seems like as good as it gets in this town.

 

[maverick512000]

Again, I wouldn't pay him. Let them resolve it in Arbitration after his playing/not playing is settled or he's traded.

Texans got lawyers too. Put them to work.

They would have to pay him otherwise they would be in breach of contract and would then have to pay him more. This wouldn’t go to arbitration this would go court. You’re exactly right Texans have lawyers and I promise you those lawyers were consulted and told the Texans you’re screw,Ed just get him out of here.

 

[thunderkyss]

Nick had a $10 million dollar home for sale. He stuck a For Sale for $7 million sign in the front yard.

I think he sold a $10M home for $10M dollars in a market that would have brought $12.5M

I don’t think it was valuation of the asset that was the problem. I think it was misreading the market. Thinking the other teams gavAsht about the civi suits.

 

[maverick512000]

Russell Wilson

The Texans let Watson do whatever he wanted. No one has ever been traded like this, even with a NTC.

This is the way the Texans did it. No one else has ever done it this way.

Did Russell Wilson parade around the country negotiating his trade? Did team owners fly to Seattle for a sit down with Russell Wilson?

Did you even think Wilson would be traded before Watson?

If they were Smart Atlanta should be working the phones right now negotiating a trade for Matt Ryan & his NTC, & you won't hear about it until it's done.

That's the way NTCs work outside of Houston.

Here's a list of teams that want you. Scratch off the teams you won't play for. & if it's only one team left, you write another list.

Then Watson & his team are out of the conversation until they're on a plane to whichever team gave you the best deal.

Russell Wilson

Yeah but you aren’t factoring in that Russell Wilson has more class and isn’t an egotistical diva. Wilson also didn’t sign a massive contract then demand a trade 4 months later. Wilson also doesn’t have 22 pending civil suits and escape criminal charges by the skin of his teeth. Wilson didn’t try and play NFL bachelor and make 4 teams interview for him to see who he would gift with his presence.

I get it to you it’s comparing apples to apples but what you are not factoring in is that one of the apples is completely rotten.

Edit: For a better example look at the way Ramsey got the trade he wanted or the way AB got out of playing on teams he didn’t like. If a player decides they are going to be a diva and they are talented enough that the league lets them get away with it all bets are off.

 

[thunderkyss]

That’s what it is and I believe it could have been even much more if none of this massage pervert nonsense ever surfaced.

It doesn’t seem anyone outside of Houston cared about the allegations. No one asked Nick to lower his ask.

 

[DBCooper]

Exactly and if ATL had met the $230MM GTD DW4 would be a Falcon today. Make no BS about it. I do know that what went on behind closed doors is the boys in the Kirby Boardroom got played or are just dumb as hell. Probably both.

Please come back to objectiveness man, when you do you make a lot of sense.

3 first round picks a third and a fourth is not being played at all.

Could they have gotten more? Who knows?

One fact is the dumbasses that run this team could have done a lot worse.

It’s something to rebuild this team and we got rid of the quitter that has baggage as far as you can stick your finger!

 

[thunderkyss]

Cleveland paid 50% more than any other team had before in the past to guarantee the contract.

That is ludicrous on a player that can be still suspended, has to settle a civil case, or could still go to jail.

Exactly. Once the criminal charges were nullified, no one cared about the civil suits. No one.

In our heads, we think it was a factor & so we shape our expectations.

Nobody cared that Watson didn’t play last season & was threatening not to play in 2023.

In Houston we saw those as issues, problems, hurdles. Everyone else saw opportunity.

They were falling over each other to give us three 1s

 

[JB]

My post said nothing about buying beef, it only mentioned marinating it. Reading and COMPREHEND MUCH?

We were going by exactly what you typed...

Regardless the roast cost the same.

HONESTY TOO MUCH FOR YOU?

 

[thunderkyss]

They would have to pay him otherwise they would be in breach of contract and would then have to pay him more. This wouldn’t go to arbitration this would go court. You’re exactly right Texans have lawyers and I promise you those lawyers were consulted and told the Texans you’re screw,Ed just get him out of here.

I’m pretty sure it would have gone to arbitration.

I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t cost the Texans anymore money

with Watson refusing to play you could argue he was in breech first, which is why it would go to arbitration. Or court, same thing.

He’s going to get his money. Just not now.

 

[TexansBull]

You can exchange Watson for a 1 lb roast or a 3 lb roast. You can marinate however you like. Regardless the 3 lb roast will feed a lot more people (build a better team). I understand some folks are trying to be cute and are trying to make up a lot of excuses to justify Caserio's inconceivable blunder. It goes rather well with the Kool Aid.

You are too smart for me. This analogy still makes no sense to me and what you are trying to get across. Sometimes these things fall fat.

Have you ever considered you have an emotionally inherit bias against Caserio that clouds your ability to objectively look at anything he does? I suspect this has to do the Texans not hiring Eliot Wolf. But so many teams have passed on him there is more to that story.

All that takes away from anyone being able to take you serious when you start typing away.

It is one thing to be objective than another to be always negative.

You have valuable insight. You can see that from your draft posts. Think about how you word things.

There was a post you made about the Falcons turning the screws into the Texans. You can’t back and edited it to add a line “time to return the favor.”

One poster replied back it was two different regimes. I was about to before I caught that last sentence. Then I thanked you for the information.

A few words can change how your message is received.

Food for thought.

 

[JB]

C'mon man, you're smarter than this. The Falcons would have been enormously better with DW4. And next year they have an abundance of salary cap space.

DW4 is better than Ryan if he plays all 17 but not that much better to make them an instant contender

 

[maverick512000]

I’m pretty sure it would have gone to arbitration.

I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t cost the Texans anymore money

with Watson refusing to play you could argue he was in breech first, which is why it would go to arbitration. Or court, same thing.

He’s going to get his money. Just not now.

See that’s the thing he never technically refused to play. If he had failed to report to mandatory training camp or the games then you have a case but he never did. Texans were the ones that benched him all year and didn’t push the issue. I personally think that was a mistake but it’s one I can see why they would make because the other choice was a mistake to. A true damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation.

Statements made to the media about never playing again mean absolutely nothing, it’s if you actually violate the terms of the contract and Watson was careful not to.

 

[thunderkyss]

Wilson also doesn’t have 22 pending civil suits and escape criminal charges by the skin of his teeth.

Nobody with this hanging over his head should have leverage over anyone.

$230M says at least one team was desperate for his services. Leverage Texans

Four teams ante up three 1sts just to sit at the table. Leverage Texans

Every argument you make is a reason the Texans should have had more leverage, not less.

Wilson didn’t try and play NFL bachelor and make 4 teams interview for him to see who he would gift with his presence.

That was on the Texans. No other player ever traded with a NTC put on such a circus. This is not the way it’s been done in the past. It’s not the way it was done 5 days before.

this is more of the Texans finding new ways to screw themselves.

 

[Texansphan]

Nobody with this hanging over his head should have leverage over anyone.

$230M says at least one team was desperate for his services. Leverage Texans

Four teams ante up three 1sts just to sit at the table. Leverage Texans

Every argument you make is a reason the Texans should have had more leverage, not less.




That was on the Texans. No other player ever traded with a NTC put on such a circus. This is not the way it’s been done in the past. It’s not the way it was done 5 days before.

this is more of the Texans finding new ways to screw themselves.

I agree with the bulk of your post - just curious about the last sentence?
Seems to me they wanted to play hot potato and found a player/victim.

 

[thunderkyss]

See that’s the thing he never technically refused to play. If he had failed to report to mandatory training camp or the games then you have a case but he never did. Texans were the ones that benched him all year and didn’t push the issue. I personally think that was a mistake but it’s one I can see why they would make because the other choice was a mistake to. A true damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation.

Statements made to the media about never playing again mean absolutely nothing, it’s if you actually violate the terms of the contract and Watson was careful not to.

We don’t know what he told Culley but I’m pretty sure his intentions were made clear in that meeting.

we know he wasn’t playing. The Texans can argue whatever & not pay him. Right or wrong the matter won’t be resolved anytime soon

they paid him $10M for nothing. Paying him $35M doesn’t seem as though it would have been an issue for the Texans.

Not as big an issue as it would have been for Watson. & that’s the point. Not if they win or lose

 

[TexansBull]

Exactly. Once the criminal charges were nullified, no one cared about the civil suits. No one.

In our heads, we think it was a factor & so we shape our expectations.

Nobody cared that Watson didn’t play last season & was threatening not to play in 2023.

In Houston we saw those as issues, problems, hurdles. Everyone else saw opportunity.

They were falling over each other to give us three 1s

I agree. We held onto our perceptions. Nick may have too.

Could Nick have gotten more? It is possible. I agree with what you are saying.

There is a sucker born ever minute. Cleveland more than proved that.

When two parties agree to a deal and feel it good for both of them that makes a good deal.

I have no sellers remorse. My bias confirms that.

 

[thunderkyss]

I agree with the bulk of your post - just curious about the last sentence?
Seems to me they wanted to play hot potato and found a player/victim.

I really shouldn’t have said it that way. I don’t think the Texans got screwed. They set a price, they got that price.

My only problem is with the argument that this is the way it’s done.

At the very least we know there were three teams Watson was willing to play for. Carolina, New Orleans, Atlanta.

“Will you waive the NTC for these three teams?” That should have been the only question asked. If he says no to any two, we shelve the trade talks to a later date & get on with the draft, free agency, & clearing cap room.

 

[thunderkyss]

I agree. We held onto our perceptions. Nick may have too.

Could Nick have gotten more? It is possible. I agree with what you are saying.

There is a sucker born ever minute. Cleveland more than proved that.

When two parties agree to a deal and feel it good for both of them that makes a good deal.

I have no sellers remorse. My bias confirms that.

Agreed on all points

 

[KA4Texan]

I am simply pleased with the thought that this is, or should be over. It seems that those who are displeased with the haul see it as a clear sign that the Texans are still a “rudderless” organization. Those who are satisfied with the trade seem to feel like this is the first sign the Texans have shown in ages that they do indeed have a rudder at all. I lean toward the latter opinion. Maybe it’s just that I’ve grown accustomed to seeing great Texans players (or in some cases “formerly great”) sent on their way for little to nothing. I don’t know but I do think that this has dragged along for so long that seeing it end with something substantial is enough for me. If Watson is gone and the Texans have multiple chances to screw up in the first round for the next three years that seems like as good as it gets in this town.

I'm normally on the pessimistic side of Texans actions... regarding this trade though I have not suddenly become optimistic.

I simply believe 100% that the Browns will regret this trade more than we will and that is why even though I would have preferred to see more.... I consider it a win no matter what the Texans do with the picks.

I believe the odds of those picks working out are higher than the odds DW stays content in Cleveland and doesnt become a big problem for them.

Because of that belief I am able to applaud NC and thankful we can move on from the cancer known as DW.

 

[TexansFight]

Hey Jimmy, Hey Andrew, Congratulations on coming to terms with DeShaun and that record setting offer.

Listen, I think we can finish this up in matter of minutes here. As you know Nick Caserio's original ask was only a minimum that got your foot in door and allowed you to speak with Deshaun. Now that we are here in the 9th inning, all that is left to do is hammer out our agreed compensation.

I'm not going to ask for another record setting deal. The bar has been set and the market has been set with the Russell Wilson trade to the Broncos. I think we all can agree on that. That's were I want to go and where we should start. I think we can do this in 5 minutes. OK, you got pens and pads ready? This is what I need to make this thing happen and will close the deal:

2022 your 1st RD pick #13 and your 2nd RD pick #44. In 2023, your 1st and 2nd RD picks. Because DeShaun is 7 years younger than Russell and will play in 200 games for you, 100 more than Russell will play for the Broncos we have to have your 2024 1st RD pick. That covers the draft picks.

Now on to the players that will wrap this all up:

Baker Mayfield. You took away our nightmare and headache and we can do the same for you.

Our Head Coach Lovie Smith is partial to one of two on your defense, LB Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoraj or SS Grant Delpit. And finally the guy that can put this all to bed, backup DT Tommy Togai. If you don't like this we can start over with Myles Garrett instead of Baker Mayfield?

This puts us on par with the Wilson trade here. I'm not going to try and one up you and do one better than the Wilson trade. If you want some time to think it over I understand. I just want you to know our asking price is not going down, it will only go up. Tomorrow a 2025 1st RD will be added to the deal. If you don't agree to our asking price then we will not trade DeShaun Watson to you and when I hang up my next call will be to Athur Blank and the Atlanta Falcons. I'm sure Arthur would love a chance to get back in this thing. Arthur may have a change of mind just like you did.

What's that, your fine with the proposal. We can have Delpit. OK then we can draw up the paperwork and send it in to the NFL? OK then you guys got yourself one hell of a franchise QB. Congratulations!

Now that is exactly why I know you’d a much better job. That’s how a real NFL GM like John Schneider would have gone about in making this trade not the idiots we have running things.

 

[Dejaview]

You can exchange Watson for a 1 lb roast or a 3 lb roast. You can marinate however you like. Regardless the 3 lb roast will feed a lot more people (build a better team). I understand some folks are trying to be cute and are trying to make up a lot of excuses to justify Caserio's inconceivable blunder. It goes rather well with the Kool Aid.

Lol, oh please. PLEASE. You are just making it worse.

 

[Texian]

Now that is exactly why I know you’d a much better job. That’s how a real NFL GM like John Schneider would have gone about in making this trade not the idiots we have running things.

Well Nick probably did call them and said,

Nick: Well guys you know we have to approach this one day at time and we have to stick to the process when we are evaluating players. Because you have to take into consideration everything that's going on.

Haslam: Hey Nick we accepted your original offer.

Nick: Oh, OK, well then that's good, that's what I wanted to confirm, so we are good then. OK I don't have anything to add to that.

Haslam: BYE Nick!

 

[maverick512000]

I really shouldn’t have said it that way. I don’t think the Texans got screwed. They set a price, they got that price.

My only problem is with the argument that this is the way it’s done.

At the very least we know there were three teams Watson was willing to play for. Carolina, New Orleans, Atlanta.

“Will you waive the NTC for these three teams?” That should have been the only question asked. If he says no to any two, we shelve the trade talks to a later date & get on with the draft, free agency, & clearing cap room.

I won’t speak for anyone else TK but I’ve never said or implied that this is the way it’s done only that I don’t believe it could have been differently given the situation. It’s like being in a locked room with just a steak and a spoon and being told you can’t leave till you cut up and eat the steak. Everyone knows you don’t use a spoon and you don’t want to use a spoon but because of the situation you have to use a spoon. Sure you could sit there and refuse to do anything till someone brings you a knife and fork but you are still locked in the room and you don’t know if anyone ever will bring you that knife and fork before it’s to late.

Watson and his agent locked the Texans in a room and said here’s your steak and here’s your spoon.

 

[Texian]

Have you ever considered you have an emotionally inherit bias against Caserio that clouds your ability to objectively look at anything he does?

Yes I have and no don't have a bias. Nick has earned every single criticism. Twice I applauded Nick decisions. The first when he traded Roby, Although he did get short changed on that trade as well. (starting to see a pattern here) The other is when he didn't trade DW4 before the trade dead line. I knew there would be more suitors and said there would be 1 owner/GM who could not resist the temptation. What I didn't know (but I really did) is that Nick didn't know how to play the game.

Now, have you taken into consideration that you are a homer, and that in your eyes, Nick Caserio can do wrong and you have an unabashed crush on Nick Caserio? Let's review objectively the how and why's Caserio has earned so many criticisms in a such a short time. Should we start with the Culley hire?

Caserio FUBARS Extraordinaire:

1/7 - Texans hire Nick Caserio.
Jan thru Apr Caserio refuses to take calls from any teams about Deshaun Watson. That's what GMs do is take calls, not ignore them.

1/27 - Caserio hires David Culley first opening, last hire. Caserio's first hire is the worst HC hire in 2021. Before hiring Culley, Caserio had hired all assistant coaches.

3/2 - Resigns David Johnson to a $6MM contract (makes no sense)

3/11 - Caserio restructures Cooks contract. borrows $2.5MM from 2022, 2023, 2024 ($7.5MM). Restructure also cancels last year of contract. Cooks contract now expires after 2022 season.

3/20 -Caserio restructures Tunsil contract. By borrowing $10MM from future caps ($5MM 2022; $5MM 2023)

3/22 - Caserio trades for Shaq Lawson restructures contract, then trades Lawson to Jets, creates $1.8MM in Dead Cap. This really is a bonehead move.

3/23 - Caserio trades for Ryan Izzo. 8/31 Caserio cuts Izzo. - wasted draft pick
Caserio trades for Ryan Finley. 5/24 - Caserio cuts Finley - another wasted draft pick

3/24 - Caserio restructures Mercilus contract. 10/19 - Caserio cuts Mercilus creating $7MM dead cap in 2022

3/30 - Caserio restructures Cunningham 4 year contract. Borrows $5.6MM from 2022, 2023, 2024. 12/8 - Nick cuts Cunningham

4/29 - NFL Draft. Caserio uses (8) 2021 draft picks and (2) 2022 draft picks to draft (5) players. Don't forget Nick has already used 2 other draft picks on cut players.

7/26 - Caserio trades for Anthony Miller. 10/6 - Caserio cuts Miller - another wasted draft pick

9/9 - Caserio trades Roby to Saints, restructuring contract to eat $8.9MM in salary ($4.8MM in 2022). Value of 2nd rd pick, only gets a 3rd rd pick.

Nick Caserio has created over $37MM in 2021 dead cap money. As a result Caserio had to restructure (5) contracts to create over $35MM in order to sign a bunch of over the hill 30 year olds to 1 year contracts in order to fill the roster.

Today Caserio responsible for $51MM in reduction of 2022 salary cap thru dead cap he created. He started 2021 with $0 dead cap money in 2022, now has over $50MM.

Texans only had 27 players under contract in 2022, that's 10 players less than the avg team.

This is a mess, a clown show, a dumpster fire, absence of intelligent thought, lacking common sense and logic. An exercise in buffoonery, Tom Foolery, menopause brain, lacking in basic skills in accounting and economics.

Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If Nick Caserio had made the following moves (below) they would've been $48MM UNDER the cap. That's $48 MILLION UNDER THE CAP. They would not of had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $35MM in contract restructuring, $37MM in Dead Cap in 2021 and would've added a 2nd rd draft pick. - TOTAL FISCAL IRRESPONSIBILITY

B. McKinney	Release		$7.00m
D. Johnson	Release		$6.90m
Z. Fulton	Release		$3.00m
Du. Johnson	Release		$5.15m
B. Dunn	Release		$3.25m
B. Cooks	Trade		$12.00m
J. Watt	Release		$17.50m
Total Saved			$54.80m

This is how 2022 started:


After hearing the Dolphins fired Flores, Caserio started off the year by firing Culley. Since McDaniels had no interest in the Texans (I wonder why) Nick was going to hire the ex-Patriot Flores. Oops, Flores files a lawsuit against the NFL and the Texans. So after 3 interviews Caserio was ready to hire a person with no coaching experience as the new head coach, Josh McKown. Except the lawsuit would've made that an absolute PR nightmare for the Texans and the NFL. Caserio's only the other option was Jonathan Gannon who withdrew after being told he could not hire is own coaching staff. At which point Cal McNair, Cal McNair dammit, had to step in and hire Lovie Smith to finally put an end to all of this madness. Whew. That's 2 head coaching searches that turned into 2 nightmare horror stories.

and then there is the DW4 trade where Nick Caserio was able to get .70 on the dollar.

STAY TUNED.......DEVELOPING.......

 

[thunderkyss]

Watson and his agent locked the Texans in a room and said here’s your steak and here’s your spoon.

Exactly. It’s like they said grab your ankles & the Texans didn’t ask why until they felt something was out of place.

you won’t ever see anything like this again unless the Texans piss off another QB.

 

[michaelm]

No one asked Nick to lower his ask.

How do you know this? Is it just your assumption?

 

[michaelm]

Exactly. Once the criminal charges were nullified, no one cared about the civil suits. No one.

In our heads, we think it was a factor & so we shape our expectations.

Nobody cared that Watson didn’t play last season & was threatening not to play in 2023.

In Houston we saw those as issues, problems, hurdles. Everyone else saw opportunity.

They were falling over each other to give us three 1s

A team like Cleveland, built to win now, and making a trade like this going all in to win now should absolutely care about the civil suites and any effect they might have on the length of Watsons suspension.

If he's suspended for the majority of 2022, it's basically a lost a season for them, and their Super Bowl hopes.
What does their salary capabilities look like in 2023? What will their roster look like?

They should definitely care about every aspect that might impact Watsons availability.

 

[leebigeztx]

The Seahawks could’ve gotten a better deal from WFT but turned it down.

Wilson never threatened to my knowledge to sit out and not play. Wilson said this trade was initiated by Seattle’s FO but was a mutual agreement.

It is a much different scenario to have a player threaten to not play and collect 35 million dollars. That is being held hostage.

And it is different to have the same player that has value to be traded but could evaporate at a moment’s notice because of legal issues.

There is a lot different in those scenarios.

Cleveland paid 50% more than any other team had before in the past to guarantee the contract.

That is ludicrous on a player that can be still suspended, has to settle a civil case, or could still go to jail.

He's not going to jail. The most can happen is lose games and checks. Doesn't make him a better person character wise, buy we have to stop making up stuff

 

[maverick512000]

za


Let me ask you a question and see how smart you are - if you have $1 in your pocket today is it worth more or less than a $1 in your pocket next year? If you can answer that question correctly, you’ll know why Texian and I are right.

Because neither one of you understands how investments and economics work?

 

[Bluehen Texan]

It doesn’t seem anyone outside of Houston cared about the allegations. No one asked Nick to lower his ask.

Why do you say nobody outside of Houston cares? There are some Cleveland fans that would disagree with you and some Saints and Panthers fans glad that they didn’t get the not so shiny new toy.

By the way has it occured to you that Nick read the situation correctly and therefore started the negotiations at the fair market value? Is that in the realm of possibility? Perhaps he would have held on to Watson and dealt with whatever backlash if he didn’t get what he thought was fair market value. Sometimes the fair asking price is the best one.

A million dollar home that is subsequently found to be on a cancer causing land fill is no longer a million dollar home.

Nobody outside Houston cares about the character of the leader of their hometown team? The offers would have been higher and more teams would have gotten involved if they didn’t care. Coulda, shoulda, woulda Johnny come lately master negotiators around here..

 

[Texian]

Please come back to objectiveness man, when you do you make a lot of sense.

3 first round picks a third and a fourth is not being played at all.

Could they have gotten more? Who knows?

One fact is the dumbasses that run this team could have done a lot worse.

It’s something to rebuild this team and we got rid of the quitter that has baggage as far as you can stick your finger!

What part of the Russell Wilson trade do you not understand? And the $230 MILLION GUARANTEED?

 

[thunderkyss]

Why do you say nobody outside of Houston cares?

6 teams were ready to give Nick three 1st round picks. Nobody is a bit hyperbole, but for all intents & purposes, it fits.

There are some Cleveland fans that would disagree with you and some Saints and Panthers fans glad that they didn’t get the not so shiny new toy.

Right. The mistake was thinking those people would be at the negotiating table

By the way has it occured to you that Nick read the situation correctly and therefore started the negotiations at the fair market value? Is that in the realm of possibility?

I believe he did. Like I said, he asked for what he wanted. He got what he wanted. I don’t have any complaints about the deal.

My argument is that the way it was done was not the only way to do it, Watson didn’t put Nick in a box, & the Texans weren’t hamstrung because of the civil cases or Watson’s “leverage”

There was most likely some self imposed internal reasoning why the Texans did it this way, but I can’t think of a good reason.

 

[Dakota]

Yes I have and no don't have a bias. Nick has earned every single criticism. Twice I applauded Nick decisions. The first when he traded Roby, Although he did get short changed on that trade as well. (starting to see a pattern here) The other is when he didn't trade DW4 before the trade dead line. I knew there would be more suitors and said there would be 1 owner/GM who could not resist the temptation. What I didn't know (but I really did) is that Nick didn't know how to play the game.

Now, have you taken into consideration that you are a homer, and that in your eyes, Nick Caserio can do wrong and you have an unabashed crush on Nick Caserio? Let's review objectively the how and why's Caserio has earned so many criticisms in a such a short time. Should we start with the Culley hire?

Caserio FUBARS Extraordinaire:

1/7 - Texans hire Nick Caserio.
Jan thru Apr Caserio refuses to take calls from any teams about Deshaun Watson. That's what GMs do is take calls, not ignore them.

1/27 - Caserio hires David Culley first opening, last hire. Caserio's first hire is the worst HC hire in 2021. Before hiring Culley, Caserio had hired all assistant coaches.

3/2 - Resigns David Johnson to a $6MM contract (makes no sense)

3/11 - Caserio restructures Cooks contract. borrows $2.5MM from 2022, 2023, 2024 ($7.5MM). Restructure also cancels last year of contract. Cooks contract now expires after 2022 season.

3/20 -Caserio restructures Tunsil contract. By borrowing $10MM from future caps ($5MM 2022; $5MM 2023)

3/22 - Caserio trades for Shaq Lawson restructures contract, then trades Lawson to Jets, creates $1.8MM in Dead Cap. This really is a bonehead move.

3/23 - Caserio trades for Ryan Izzo. 8/31 Caserio cuts Izzo. - wasted draft pick
Caserio trades for Ryan Finley. 5/24 - Caserio cuts Finley - another wasted draft pick

3/24 - Caserio restructures Mercilus contract. 10/19 - Caserio cuts Mercilus creating $7MM dead cap in 2022

3/30 - Caserio restructures Cunningham 4 year contract. Borrows $5.6MM from 2022, 2023, 2024. 12/8 - Nick cuts Cunningham

4/29 - NFL Draft. Caserio uses (8) 2021 draft picks and (2) 2022 draft picks to draft (5) players. Don't forget Nick has already used 2 other draft picks on cut players.

7/26 - Caserio trades for Anthony Miller. 10/6 - Caserio cuts Miller - another wasted draft pick

9/9 - Caserio trades Roby to Saints, restructuring contract to eat $8.9MM in salary ($4.8MM in 2022). Value of 2nd rd pick, only gets a 3rd rd pick.

Nick Caserio has created over $37MM in 2021 dead cap money. As a result Caserio had to restructure (5) contracts to create over $35MM in order to sign a bunch of over the hill 30 year olds to 1 year contracts in order to fill the roster.

Today Caserio responsible for $51MM in reduction of 2022 salary cap thru dead cap he created. He started 2021 with $0 dead cap money in 2022, now has over $50MM.

Texans only had 27 players under contract in 2022, that's 10 players less than the avg team.

This is a mess, a clown show, a dumpster fire, absence of intelligent thought, lacking common sense and logic. An exercise in buffoonery, Tom Foolery, menopause brain, lacking in basic skills in accounting and economics.

Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If Nick Caserio had made the following moves (below) they would've been $48MM UNDER the cap. That's $48 MILLION UNDER THE CAP. They would not of had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $35MM in contract restructuring, $37MM in Dead Cap in 2021 and would've added a 2nd rd draft pick.

B. McKinney	Release		$7.00m
D. Johnson	Release		$6.90m
Z. Fulton	Release		$3.00m
Du. Johnson	Release		$5.15m
B. Dunn	Release		$3.25m
B. Cooks	Trade		$12.00m
J. Watt	Release		$17.50m
Total Saved			$54.80m

This is how 2022 started:


After hearing the Dolphins fired Flores, Caserio started off the year by firing Culley. Since McDaniels had no interest in the Texans (I wonder why) Nick was going to hire the ex-Patriot Flores. Oops, Flores files a lawsuit against the NFL and the Texans. So after 3 interviews Caserio was ready to hire a person with no coaching experience as the new head coach, Josh McKown. Except the lawsuit would've made that an absolute PR nightmare for the Texans and the NFL. Caserio's only the other option was Jonathan Gannon who withdrew after being told he could not hire is own coaching staff. At which point Cal McNair, Cal McNair dammit, had to step in and hire Lovie Smith to finally put an end to all of this madness. Whew. That's 2 head coaching searches that turned into 2 nightmare horror stories.

and then there is the DW4 trade where Nick Caserio was able to get .70 on the dollar.

STAY TUNED.......DEVELOPING.......

Alternate viewpoint - Nick tried desperately to rectify varying degrees of pain points in a situation he inherited, not created. Then was humble enough to cut bait and move on once those minor decisions for situations he did not create did not pan out. I care little about the coaching hires made, give me the 2022 and 2023 draft before my jury is out in NC.

I get the appeal and the self gratification that goes along with taking the non-homer position, but dang that’s some fine pessimism if I’ve ever seen it.

 

[thunderkyss]

Alternate viewpoint - Nick tried desperately to rectify varying degrees of pain points in a situation he inherited, not created.

Good point



Except, at every opportunity Nick chose the objectively worse decision.

 

[DBCooper]

What part of the Russell Wilson trade do you not understand? And the $230 MILLION GUARANTEED?

uhhh I understand we didn’t have Russell Wilson and I understand we aren’t the dumbasses paying that quitter.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

See that’s the thing he never technically refused to play. If he had failed to report to mandatory training camp or the games then you have a case but he never did. Texans were the ones that benched him all year and didn’t push the issue. I personally think that was a mistake but it’s one I can see why they would make because the other choice was a mistake to. A true damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation.

Statements made to the media about never playing again mean absolutely nothing, it’s if you actually violate the terms of the contract and Watson was careful not to.

One very big factor in not forcing him to play, it would have to have happened before the regular season or he would be worthless for at least half of the season. And if he feigned injury in preseason, he would have had to be placed on IR with no chance of being designated to return the rest of the season. A player on IR cannot be traded. He needed to simply ride the pine to be able to be tradeable during the 2021 season.

 

[Dakota]

Good point



Except, at every opportunity Nick chose the objectively worse decision.

That’s far from the truth. I could think of way worse decisions that would’ve been objectively worse. That’s just your subjective take on things.

 

[Earl34]

Yes I have and no don't have a bias. Nick has earned every single criticism. Twice I applauded Nick decisions. The first when he traded Roby, Although he did get short changed on that trade as well. (starting to see a pattern here) The other is when he didn't trade DW4 before the trade dead line. I knew there would be more suitors and said there would be 1 owner/GM who could not resist the temptation. What I didn't know (but I really did) is that Nick didn't know how to play the game.

Now, have you taken into consideration that you are a homer, and that in your eyes, Nick Caserio can do wrong and you have an unabashed crush on Nick Caserio? Let's review objectively the how and why's Caserio has earned so many criticisms in a such a short time. Should we start with the Culley hire?

Caserio FUBARS Extraordinaire:

1/7 - Texans hire Nick Caserio.
Jan thru Apr Caserio refuses to take calls from any teams about Deshaun Watson. That's what GMs do is take calls, not ignore them.

1/27 - Caserio hires David Culley first opening, last hire. Caserio's first hire is the worst HC hire in 2021. Before hiring Culley, Caserio had hired all assistant coaches.

3/2 - Resigns David Johnson to a $6MM contract (makes no sense)

3/11 - Caserio restructures Cooks contract. borrows $2.5MM from 2022, 2023, 2024 ($7.5MM). Restructure also cancels last year of contract. Cooks contract now expires after 2022 season.

3/20 -Caserio restructures Tunsil contract. By borrowing $10MM from future caps ($5MM 2022; $5MM 2023)

3/22 - Caserio trades for Shaq Lawson restructures contract, then trades Lawson to Jets, creates $1.8MM in Dead Cap. This really is a bonehead move.

3/23 - Caserio trades for Ryan Izzo. 8/31 Caserio cuts Izzo. - wasted draft pick
Caserio trades for Ryan Finley. 5/24 - Caserio cuts Finley - another wasted draft pick

3/24 - Caserio restructures Mercilus contract. 10/19 - Caserio cuts Mercilus creating $7MM dead cap in 2022

3/30 - Caserio restructures Cunningham 4 year contract. Borrows $5.6MM from 2022, 2023, 2024. 12/8 - Nick cuts Cunningham

4/29 - NFL Draft. Caserio uses (8) 2021 draft picks and (2) 2022 draft picks to draft (5) players. Don't forget Nick has already used 2 other draft picks on cut players.

7/26 - Caserio trades for Anthony Miller. 10/6 - Caserio cuts Miller - another wasted draft pick

9/9 - Caserio trades Roby to Saints, restructuring contract to eat $8.9MM in salary ($4.8MM in 2022). Value of 2nd rd pick, only gets a 3rd rd pick.

Nick Caserio has created over $37MM in 2021 dead cap money. As a result Caserio had to restructure (5) contracts to create over $35MM in order to sign a bunch of over the hill 30 year olds to 1 year contracts in order to fill the roster.

Today Caserio responsible for $51MM in reduction of 2022 salary cap thru dead cap he created. He started 2021 with $0 dead cap money in 2022, now has over $50MM.

Texans only had 27 players under contract in 2022, that's 10 players less than the avg team.

This is a mess, a clown show, a dumpster fire, absence of intelligent thought, lacking common sense and logic. An exercise in buffoonery, Tom Foolery, menopause brain, lacking in basic skills in accounting and economics.

Texans started 2021 season with 54 contracts and $6MM OVER the cap.

If Nick Caserio had made the following moves (below) they would've been $48MM UNDER the cap. That's $48 MILLION UNDER THE CAP. They would not of had to resort to mortgaging the future to the tune of OVER $35MM in contract restructuring, $37MM in Dead Cap in 2021 and would've added a 2nd rd draft pick.

B. McKinney	Release		$7.00m
D. Johnson	Release		$6.90m
Z. Fulton	Release		$3.00m
Du. Johnson	Release		$5.15m
B. Dunn	Release		$3.25m
B. Cooks	Trade		$12.00m
J. Watt	Release		$17.50m
Total Saved			$54.80m

This is how 2022 started:



After hearing the Dolphins fired Flores, Caserio started off the year by firing Culley. Since McDaniels had no interest in the Texans (I wonder why) Nick was going to hire the ex-Patriot Flores. Oops, Flores files a lawsuit against the NFL and the Texans. So after 3 interviews Caserio was ready to hire a person with no coaching experience as the new head coach, Josh McKown. Except the lawsuit would've made that an absolute PR nightmare for the Texans and the NFL. Caserio's only the other option was Jonathan Gannon who withdrew after being told he could not hire is own coaching staff. At which point Cal McNair, Cal McNair dammit, had to step in and hire Lovie Smith to finally put an end to all of this madness. Whew. That's 2 head coaching searches that turned into 2 nightmare horror stories.

and then there is the DW4 trade where Nick Caserio was able to get .70 on the dollar.

STAY TUNED.......DEVELOPING.......

Wow! If this isn't an online article you copied, I have to give you credit for the effort and details.

 

[leebigeztx]

I bet Wilson is kicking rocks right now.

But I doubt Carroll would have been as willing as the Texans to drop their drawers & assume whatever position Watson asked for.

This is not the only time a player with a NTC was ever traded. This isn't the first time either. It's the first time Houston ever did it. It's the first & only time it's been done like this

& after seeing what Denver gave for Wilson compared to what Houston got for Watson I don't see the benefit of letting Watson drive the bus.

Too many teams willing to give what Nick asked.

That Nick got what he asked for, I'm not at all disappointed in the trade.

But all these arguments that Nick was hamstrung or "this is the way it had to be".... all BS

The owner should've stepped in and fired Carroll and kept Wilson. Minus Wilson, Carroll is a losing coach with old antiquated logic about new football.