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Texans Schemes?

R

RT22

Waterboy
Trying to identify what do the Texans primarily run on the backend of the defense ie (cover one, cover 3) and what do they run on the OL ie (zone run, power). Just really would like to understand this as we continue in FA and up to the draft. Thanks in advance
 
RT22 said:
Trying to identify what do the Texans primarily run on the backend of the defense ie (cover one, cover 3) and what do they run on the OL ie (zone run, power). Just really would like to understand this as we continue in FA and up to the draft. Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
They block mostly outside zone in the RPO sets but also block power and inside zone at different times. I think personnel wise, they're going to look for zone blockers as this is what they brought in last year and it makes more sense (at least to me) that you're going to have more success having a zone blocker block a power scheme the few times we do it, than you would having a power blocker block a zone scheme (which we do more frequently). The secondary is anyone's guess for what we'll be looking for. In 2017, we played man coverage 4th most in the league (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-man-v-zone-which-nfl-team-ran-each-the-most-in-2017) and in 2018 we were in the bottom third of teams that played man coverage (https://patriotswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/28/patriots-rank-no-1-in-man-defense-percentage/). I was surprised to see that we played that much man in 2017 because I've always felt that RAC has favored a softer zone to keep the play in front of the db's and not give up the big play. But I think it can be explained by RAC being more apt to adopt the coverage to the talent he has. The thing that seems to stay consistent is how he likes to move people around pre-snap to disguise coverage. I'm really hoping that we're looking for db's that will enable us to get back to playing more man and specifically more physical cb's that can play press coverage well. We'll see what they're thinking soon enough.
 
Max said:
They block mostly outside zone in the RPO sets but also block power and inside zone at different times. I think personnel wise, they're going to look for zone blockers as this is what they brought in last year and it makes more sense (at least to me) that you're going to have more success having a zone blocker block a power scheme the few times we do it, than you would having a power blocker block a zone scheme (which we do more frequently). The secondary is anyone's guess for what we'll be looking for. In 2017, we played man coverage 4th most in the league (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-man-v-zone-which-nfl-team-ran-each-the-most-in-2017) and in 2018 we were in the bottom third of teams that played man coverage (https://patriotswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/28/patriots-rank-no-1-in-man-defense-percentage/). I was surprised to see that we played that much man in 2017 because I've always felt that RAC has favored a softer zone to keep the play in front of the db's and not give up the big play. But I think it can be explained by RAC being more apt to adopt the coverage to the talent he has. The thing that seems to stay consistent is how he likes to move people around pre-snap to disguise coverage. I'm really hoping that we're looking for db's that will enable us to get back to playing more man and specifically more physical cb's that can play press coverage well. We'll see what they're thinking soon enough.
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2017 they had to play mostly man because Vrabel was (unsuccessfully) blitzing so much... they didn't have the personnel to be good at it
 
Max said:
They block mostly outside zone in the RPO sets but also block power and inside zone at different times. I think personnel wise, they're going to look for zone blockers as this is what they brought in last year and it makes more sense (at least to me) that you're going to have more success having a zone blocker block a power scheme the few times we do it, than you would having a power blocker block a zone scheme (which we do more frequently). The secondary is anyone's guess for what we'll be looking for. In 2017, we played man coverage 4th most in the league (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-man-v-zone-which-nfl-team-ran-each-the-most-in-2017) and in 2018 we were in the bottom third of teams that played man coverage (https://patriotswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/28/patriots-rank-no-1-in-man-defense-percentage/). I was surprised to see that we played that much man in 2017 because I've always felt that RAC has favored a softer zone to keep the play in front of the db's and not give up the big play. But I think it can be explained by RAC being more apt to adopt the coverage to the talent he has. The thing that seems to stay consistent is how he likes to move people around pre-snap to disguise coverage. I'm really hoping that we're looking for db's that will enable us to get back to playing more man and specifically more physical cb's that can play press coverage well. We'll see what they're thinking soon enough.
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They had an offensive line setup for zbs, but the coach dismantled it.
 
RT22 said:
Trying to identify what do the Texans primarily run on the backend of the defense ie (cover one, cover 3) and what do they run on the OL ie (zone run, power). Just really would like to understand this as we continue in FA and up to the draft. Thanks in advance
Click to expand...

51dtyFL7x6L._SX348_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg
 
JB said:
Yeah pretty much... Texans have been apprentices for 16 (going on 17 years now. Sure wish they would take and pass that final test
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Gotta change the way they do business to accomplish this.
 
This is old, but gives good insight into the Texans 3-4 scheme and Crennel's preference for big LBs and DLinemen.

McKinney: 6'4", 260 lbs
Cunningham: 6'3", 235 lbs
Blackson:6'4", 318 lbs
Reader: 6'3", 335 lbs

Houston Texans: Insights into the Defense of Romeo Crennel
JEFFERY ROYFEBRUARY 14, 2014


Crennel runs an old-school version of the 3-4, where a lineman attacks the man in front of him instead of shooting the gap in between. The goal is to draw one or more double-teams so that the linebackers don’t have to tangle with offensive linemen in order to make plays.

This is the essence of the two-gap approach, and it requires the D-linemen to hold the block, read the play and then react. It also places a premium on plus-sized players in the trenches who can demand that kind of attention.

The prototypes were former Patriots defensive end Richard Seymour (6’5”, 310 lbs) and nose tackle Ted Washington (6’5”, 375 lbs). No one appreciated the benefits of having these goliaths up front more than fellow Patriot and inside linebacker Ted Johnson, the evening host on Sports Radio 610 in Houston.

In a conversation with Johnson, he said this preference even extends to the second level. “Crennel likes an ‘old school’ 3-4: big middle linebackers and big outside linebackers who can jam receivers and drop into pass coverage.”


(more at the link, but outdated) https://bleacherreport.com/articles...ns-insights-into-the-defense-of-romeo-crennel
 
JB said:
Meyers retired, Jones wasn't special, Newton got injured, Brooks was lazy (according to the Texas medical staff), Brown got into a nonsensical debate with the owner and Wade Smith was done
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Nah, I tend to agree with LeeB here.
Myers only retired because the Texans chose not to pick up his contract, and he didn't want to start anew.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...yers-released-after-eight-seasons-with-texans

Last time I read, Jones is ranked #12 by PFF while the Texans still can't find a feasible replacement.

The Texans simply didn't want to pay either BB or DB.

The failure to maintain/develop a functional Oline rests with O'Brien period.
 
Max said:
They block mostly outside zone in the RPO sets but also block power and inside zone at different times. I think personnel wise, they're going to look for zone blockers as this is what they brought in last year and it makes more sense (at least to me) that you're going to have more success having a zone blocker block a power scheme the few times we do it, than you would having a power blocker block a zone scheme (which we do more frequently). The secondary is anyone's guess for what we'll be looking for. In 2017, we played man coverage 4th most in the league (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-man-v-zone-which-nfl-team-ran-each-the-most-in-2017) and in 2018 we were in the bottom third of teams that played man coverage (https://patriotswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/28/patriots-rank-no-1-in-man-defense-percentage/). I was surprised to see that we played that much man in 2017 because I've always felt that RAC has favored a softer zone to keep the play in front of the db's and not give up the big play. But I think it can be explained by RAC being more apt to adopt the coverage to the talent he has. The thing that seems to stay consistent is how he likes to move people around pre-snap to disguise coverage. I'm really hoping that we're looking for db's that will enable us to get back to playing more man and specifically more physical cb's that can play press coverage well. We'll see what they're thinking soon enough.
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Even with the loss of Bouye, RC tried to stay with man coverage in 2017, with poor results.
The Texans were dead last in points allowed.

It's no surprise that they went with more zone coverage in 2018, especially when they played KJax at safety at the beginning of the year.
They just don't have the personnel to play man.
 
76Texan said:
Even with the loss of Bouye, RC tried to stay with man coverage in 2017, with poor results.
The Texans were dead last in points allowed.

It's no surprise that they went with more zone coverage in 2018, especially when they played KJax at safety at the beginning of the year.
They just don't have the personnel to play man.
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JB was right about playing more man in 2017 because of the blitz. We were sending BMc up the gut quite a bit that year to generate interior pressure. Last year they had JD play that role and dropped BMc into coverage more. Adding a player that can generate interior pressure is going to help guys stay at their more natural positions. I agree with you about the personelle to play man. I don't think it's unreasonable that a few more guys can still be added to the team this offseason that can make this defense really fun to watch next year.
 
Thank you for the good questions and answers. I really enjoy watching the team play but have little knowledge about the schemes. I find this to be a very interesting discussion.
 
JB said:
Meyers retired, Jones wasn't special, Newton got injured, Brooks was lazy (according to the Texas medical staff), Brown got into a nonsensical debate with the owner and Wade Smith was done
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Jones was nothing special as you said, but he's better than Martin and was groomed to replace Myers. Brooks has been a top rated lineman for the Eagles. According to PFF, Brown has been rated no lower than 8th since his 3rd yr in the league. Have we just witnessed what Solder and his replacement got these last 2 yrs? Carry on
 
leebigeztx said:
Jones was nothing special as you said, but he's better than Martin and was groomed to replace Myers. Brooks has been a top rated lineman for the Eagles. According to PFF, Brown has been rated no lower than 8th since his 3rd yr in the league. Have we just witnessed what Solder and his replacement got these last 2 yrs? Carry on
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Agreed

But Brown/Brooks didn't want to play here.

They saw Martin as an upgrade over Jones, which he would've been had it not been for the ankle injury. I hope they draft an OG and let Fulton/Martin fight it out for the C position and there's no way Martin should be guaranteed a starting position after his performance last yr.
 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed

But Brown/Brooks didn't want to play here.

They saw Martin as an upgrade over Jones, which he would've been had it not been for the ankle injury. I hope they draft an OG and let Fulton/Martin fight it out for the C position and there's no way Martin should be guaranteed a starting position after his performance last yr.
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Brown wanted to get paid, Brooks told you how the coach treated him.
 
Max said:
They block mostly outside zone in the RPO sets but also block power and inside zone at different times. I think personnel wise, they're going to look for zone blockers as this is what they brought in last year and it makes more sense (at least to me) that you're going to have more success having a zone blocker block a power scheme the few times we do it, than you would having a power blocker block a zone scheme (which we do more frequently). The secondary is anyone's guess for what we'll be looking for. In 2017, we played man coverage 4th most in the league (https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-man-v-zone-which-nfl-team-ran-each-the-most-in-2017) and in 2018 we were in the bottom third of teams that played man coverage (https://patriotswire.usatoday.com/2018/12/28/patriots-rank-no-1-in-man-defense-percentage/). I was surprised to see that we played that much man in 2017 because I've always felt that RAC has favored a softer zone to keep the play in front of the db's and not give up the big play. But I think it can be explained by RAC being more apt to adopt the coverage to the talent he has. The thing that seems to stay consistent is how he likes to move people around pre-snap to disguise coverage. I'm really hoping that we're looking for db's that will enable us to get back to playing more man and specifically more physical cb's that can play press coverage well. We'll see what they're thinking soon enough.
Click to expand...
WHAT????
 
JB said:
Meyers retired, Jones wasn't special, Newton got injured, Brooks was lazy (according to the Texas medical staff), Brown got into a nonsensical debate with the owner and Wade Smith was done
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About time someone shut this whole “o-line was dismantled” bs. The truth is nobody knew Brooks would turn it around, and nobody saw Duane Brown going public with his personal attacks and racism accusations of Bob McNair. That was stuff out of the coach’s control.
 
Mangler said:
About time someone shut this whole “o-line was dismantled” bs. The truth is nobody knew Brooks would turn it around, and nobody saw Duane Brown going public with his personal attacks and racism accusations of Bob McNair. That was stuff out of the coach’s control.
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Well, if there was one move on the OL they got right it would be easy to knock the "dismantled bs"

But they haven't got one of the five spots "fixed." I hope they got LG (Rankin), RG (Fulton), & RT (Henderson) fixed well enough but we don't know from what we've seen to date & it's been 5 years.

So they (we) might not be right about dismantling the OL, but it ain't far from wrong.
 
thunderkyss said:
Well, if there was one move on the OL they got right it would be easy to knock the "dismantled bs"

But they haven't got one of the five spots "fixed." I hope they got LG (Rankin), RG (Fulton), & RT (Henderson) fixed well enough but we don't know from what we've seen to date & it's been 5 years.

So they (we) might not be right about dismantling the OL, but it ain't far from wrong.
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Bwhahaha exactly .
 
thunderkyss said:
Well, if there was one move on the OL they got right it would be easy to knock the "dismantled bs"

But they haven't got one of the five spots "fixed." I hope they got LG (Rankin), RG (Fulton), & RT (Henderson) fixed well enough but we don't know from what we've seen to date & it's been 5 years.

So they (we) might not be right about dismantling the OL, but it ain't far from wrong.
Click to expand...

Remember 1 of those yrs the previous GM didn't try to fix the OL either thru FA or the draft.

The next yr the New GM didn't have the picks to fix the OL and went (In Texans tradition) on the CHEAP backup route.

One yr you had Brown/Smith/Myers/Brooks/Newton.

So it was really only 2 yrs the former GM neglected the OL.
 
steelbtexan said:
Remember 1 of those yrs the previous GM didn't try to fix the OL either thru FA or the draft.

The next yr the New GM didn't have the picks to fix the OL and went (In Texans tradition) on the CHEAP backup route.

One yr you had Brown/Smith/Myers/Brooks/Newton.

So it was really only 2 yrs the former GM neglected the OL.
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2014-17 they spent 2 2nds, a 4th & a 7th.

2014 there were no changes. 2015 the only change was adding X. Clark was also brought in. 2016 was the start of big change with Mancz being drafted, Clark starting and Allen brought in. 2017 Martin was drafted/started for injured Mancz and Giacomini brought in.

They made efforts.

Games started by the departed:
Allen 4
Clark 13
Giacomini 0
X 8

Brown 9 (after trade), 16
Jones 16, 16, 16
Myers 0
Brooks 14, 16, 16
Newton 0

They tried but made poor decisions. Keep Brown, Jones & Brooks and 2 2nds, a 4th and a 7th would have been plenty of investment. Whose calls those were we don't know.
 
infantrycak said:
2014-17 they spent 2 2nds, a 4th & a 7th.

2014 there were no changes. 2015 the only change was adding X. Clark was also brought in. 2016 was the start of big change with Mancz being drafted, Clark starting and Allen brought in. 2017 Martin was drafted/started for injured Mancz and Giacomini brought in.

They made efforts.

Games started by the departed:
Allen 4
Clark 13
Giacomini 0
X 8

Brown 9 (after trade), 16
Jones 16, 16, 16
Myers 0
Brooks 14, 16, 16
Newton 0

They tried but made poor decisions. Keep Brown, Jones & Brooks and 2 2nds, a 4th and a 7th would have been plenty of investment. Whose calls those were we don't know.
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How many 1sts did the former GM spend on the OL in 12 yrs?

He half assed invested.

And just like now with the CB's and what Gaine is doing, he replaced departed FA's with other FA's and drafted guys to replace departed FA's. This is doing nothing more than spinning their wheels.

As I've said before nothing has changed in the Texans org and this comes from Ownership/Olson.
 
steelbtexan said:
And just like now with the CB's and what Gaine is doing, he replaced departed FA's with other FA's and drafted guys to replace departed FA's. This is doing nothing more than spinning their wheels.

As I've said before nothing has changed in the Texans org and this comes from Ownership/Olson.
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It's about value and improving team. KJ and HB were good players, not great. Good against the run but poor in coverage. Texans got younger and improved in coverage and the off-season isn't over. Still 8 picks in the draft and lots of FA time to go. Stop panicking... it's 4-1-19
 
JB said:
It's about value and improving team. KJ and HB were good players, not great. Good against the run but poor in coverage. Texans got younger and improved in coverage and the off-season isn't over. Still 8 picks in the draft and lots of FA time to go. Stop panicking... it's 4-1-19
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You consider Roby an upgrade?

Why, he flat out sucked as a CB2 last yr and now he's signed on to be a CB1. But hey, I guess he's better because he runs faster.
 
steelbtexan said:
You consider Roby an upgrade?

Why, he flat out sucked as a CB2 last yr and now he's signed on to be a CB1. But hey, I guess he's better because he runs faster.
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Yeah he had a bad year last year... Hope he improves to what he showed 2 years ago. He didn't sign as CB1. Yeah younger faster is better. And it's 4-1, not 9-1
 
steelbtexan said:
Remember 1 of those yrs the previous GM didn't try to fix the OL either thru FA or the draft.
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Yeah. I just said they. I have no more love for the last guy as I do the new guy. Like you said, white boy Rick.

steelbtexan said:
You consider Roby an upgrade?

Why, he flat out sucked as a CB2 last yr and now he's signed on to be a CB1. But hey, I guess he's better because he runs faster.
Click to expand...

Since they signed Roby & let Kjax walk I assume they consider it an upgrade. If we had anyone at all healthy last season he would have started outside ahead of Kjax. That's what they thought about him.

But, I don't know what they plan to do with Roby. For all I know they're still going to target a guy who can start day 1 in the draft. Then Roby isn't here to replace Kjax, he's here to replace Sharice.
 
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