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2017 Houston Texans Official OTA's, Minicamp, and Training Camp Thread

I would not rule out Weeden as the #2. But his major deficiency throughout his career including with the Cowboys leading to the Texans pick up is that he does poorly under pressure.............that he plays scared. With the very limited game time with the Texans, I don't know that I've been able to appreciate that.
 
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Nothing about Brandon Weeden says he can get the job done lol. And also off one practice during the first week and second practice of OTAs the media got to see,They said Brandon looked the best. Some people are eating that up thinking he's the answer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Number19 said:
Only in your sense of fandom.

I believe most of us see the build of this team and what we accomplished last year; and believe if we had a bit more production out of the QB position, we would be an even better team. I believe most of us believe Oz was the bottom of the barrel. You obviously think poorly of Weeden, but I believe many, if not most, think he would represent an improvement over Oz.

It would not be the end of the season, before it even started, if Weeden were to win out.
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Regardless of what I personally think of Weeden the facts speak for themselves. If Weeden is the best QB on the roster coming out of TC, the Texans are in trouble.

As bad as Os was, Weeden was still sitting right where he should
 
JB said:
Regardless of what I personally think of Weeden the facts speak for themselves. If Weeden is the best QB on the roster coming out of TC, the Texans are in trouble.

As bad as Os was, Weeden was still sitting right where he should
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We may be in trouble, but Weedon is still a better QB than Osweiler in my book.
He has had another year in this system now so will be much better than Osweiler.
 
Jadmakaveli said:
...They said Brandon looked the best. Some people are eating that up thinking he's the answer. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I don't know who "some people" are.

The observations from these early OTA's do nothing more than establish the base line from which to evaluate future progress.

Yes, I am in Weeden's corner. But I want the best QB starting; I have a sense that other factors are in play and this may not be how things work out. But still, whoever is the starter, I'll be pulling for the team.
 
JB said:
Being better than Os is now some ringing endorsement?
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Right. Osweiler was so bad we're settling for just being better than Os?Being better than Os is not the bar I'm looking to get over. Hoyer is better than Os, Fitz is better than Os, and I don't want either one of those guys.

Sure, you can argue we still got 9 wins out of Os and with better QB play than that guy gave us, we should do better, but again, Fitz, who was better than Os, still got you 9 wins, Hoyer, who is better than Os, got you 9 wins.

Hoping for better than Os at the position isn't going to get you very far, IMO. Let's set the bar at good as or better than Schaub. That's when you can start talking 3 or 4 more wins above 9, and a deeper playoff run.

Bill O'Brien can win 9 games a year with crap at QB with that crap ranging from Fitz crap to Osweiler crap. No one wants to go Osweiler bad, and it wouldn't take much to play better than that, but that lesser level of crap (Fitz, Hoyer) still isn't good enough. We need to get out of the crap level altogether.
 
Number19 said:
Meaning what? How are we in trouble?
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Meaning we'll waste 2017 trying to prove he can win a Super Bowl. & if the Texans are hard headed enough they'll find some way to resign both Weeden & Savage.

They'll start next season's OTAs with Weeden as the incumbent. Some reporter just wanting to start sht will report Savage is clearly the best QB on the team. Then he'll get the opportunity to prove he's not very good.

Then finally in 2019, Deshaun Watson will get to prove he isn't any better than Weeden, still. & we'll look for a new QB in 2020.

However, if we were honest & admit Weeden is far & away the best QB on the team, we'd be better off scraping the current lot get TBow & Vince in here & stop fcking around.
 
thunderkyss said:
...However, if we were honest & admit Weeden is far & away the best QB on the team...
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Remains to be seen. This determination won't be made until after the final preseason game. However, if Weeden proves to be the best QB on the team, he should start. If Savage improves to the point of pulling even with Weeden, maybe he's earned the right to start, with the age factor being the determining factor.

At the conclusion of this coming season, an attempt to sign either Weeden or Savage should be made. Otherwise we go into the 2018 off season with an unproven second year QB and nothing else.

Weeden's age is actually a positive. If he becomes our starter, it's for the short term, with Watson being groomed as our future starter. This provides the time to draft another QB next year and prepare him to be our backup after Watson becomes our starter.

Savage is the joker. If the team is committed to Watson as our future, then Savage is gone after this season. So why play him over Weeden, unless he clearly surpasses Weeden. If Savage plays well and we commit to him being our future, Watson becomes an expensive backup or trade bait. But in this case, I see Smith's ego coming into play. After the Oz mistake, will the organization admit a second mistake in drafting Watson? I don't think so. I think Waton is our future QB.

This makes Savage a lame duck Texan.

It makes more sense for Weeden to be our QB this year and to resign him to a short contract after the season.

If you make Watson our starter this year, then both Weeden and Savage are likely gone. And you have no experience behind Watson going into the 2018 season. You face the strong possibility of being out of the playoff picture for the next two or three years, minimum.
 
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Weeden and Savage are the saving Grace of experience? Okay. I'd bet you could find better experience on the yearly QB trash heap. Savage has zero TDs in all his years people .. zero! You want to hitch your trailer to a 5th year guy on probability, then I'd rather do it on a first year guy.

Brandon Weeden? Sigh.
 
Number19 said:
Remains to be seen. This determination won't be made until after the final preseason game. However, if Weeden proves to be the best QB on the team, he should start.
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I think we've gone too far down a rabbit hole we never should have.

Point: we don't know who the best QB on the roster is.

Point: the Texans have named Savage the starter for 2017... maybe they believe Savage to be the best.

Point: a reporter opined that Weeden looked most comfortable on day 2 of OTAs.

I think it's obvious what happens in the practice field is only part of the reason the Texans have identified Savage as the best option.

You're stuck on some reporter's opinion.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
I would not rule out Weeden as the #2. But his major deficiency throughout his career including with the Cowboys leading to the Texans pick up is that he does poorly under pressure.............that he plays scared. With the very limited game time with the Texans, I don't know that I've been able to appreciate that.
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Savage doesn't do well under pressure either. Go look back at the preseason game against the Cowboys. And look at the Bengals game last season.

So I wouldn't rule Weeden out for the #1 spot either.
 
Yeah as really think that Weeden who is pretty good under pressure despite being a backup could be #1 for now.
 
We are just going to have to let OTA's and the off-season play out. At the moment, Obie's got Savage in the QB1 spot so there must be some sound reasoning behind him doing this. Reporters got a glimpse on Day 2 and that was pretty much it. Having the opportunity to view 1 practice and come away with a 3 day summary is pretty foolish. O'Brien hasn't changed his opinion on who his QB1 after the first round of OTA's and seems just fine with Savage going into the second round of OTA's as his QB1...no changes.

O'Brien has the benefit of watching the QB's for the whole day and every day. He certainly isn't going to be swayed by the opinions of sports writers who get an opportunity to watch a practice here and there. In the end, sports writers are just like us...some have played the game and some have not but what they have is 2 eyes and a brain...which help them form an opinion. Like us, their chances of ever getting to run or coach an NFL team are never going to happen but like us, they're allowed to form an opinion. I like how my eyes and brain work in forming my opinions. Mostly I try to remain neutral and leave the emotions out. I take what I read with a grain of salt but like to watch the actions of the FO, coaches and players since actions almost always speak louder than words.
 
sandman said:
Remember these exact same conversations about Keenum? Fans around these parts love the 3rd string emergency QB even more than the backup.
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We as fans have been forced into this type of cheering based on the below average play of QB1 and QB2 lately. Folks in the Watson camp may want to see him wind up as QB3 since current history shows that everyone should be screaming his name by Week 6.

I do believe that was one of the reasons Keenum got released...to avoid the distractions if the season wasn't progressing as planned and fans might begin the Keenum chants, but in the end it didn't stop RS from getting him out of that deer stand to come in and manage a couple of very necessary victories. Before the howls can begin, I stated managed not "lead" the Texans to victories.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
We as fans have been forced into this type of cheering based on the below average play of QB1 and QB2 lately. Folks in the Watson camp may want to see him wind up as QB3 since current history shows that everyone should be screaming his name by Week 6.

I do believe that was one of the reasons Keenum got released...to avoid the distractions if the season wasn't progressing as planned and fans might begin the Keenum chants, but in the end it didn't stop RS from getting him out of that deer stand to come in and manage a couple of very necessary victories. Before the howls can begin, I stated managed not "lead" the Texans to victories.
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Possibly. I don't believe the average fan in the stands dissects the Texans like posters here do, and Keenum went 0-8 as a starter the previous season, so not sure that I agree that there would have been Keenum chants when the team was struggling.

To bring this back to Weeden and OTA's. It is clear that Bill O'Brien does not see Weeden the same way that some posters here do. Is that right or wrong? Doesn't matter, because as the HC he has made the decision to go with Savage to start the season.

I'm not saying that people can't have opinions that they like Weeden better than Savage. Just saying that some are making statements like (paraphrasing and hyperbole) "If Weeden is better in OTA's and pre-season then he MUST be the starter" when we all know that OB isn't going to do that. Anymore than he was going to make Savage the starter over Hoyer or Brock the last two seasons.
 
sandman said:
...To bring this back to Weeden and OTA's. It is clear that Bill O'Brien does not see Weeden the same way that some posters here do. Is that right or wrong? Doesn't matter, because as the HC he has made the decision to go with Savage to start the season.

I'm not saying that people can't have opinions that they like Weeden better than Savage. Just saying that some are making statements like (paraphrasing and hyperbole) "If Weeden is better in OTA's and pre-season then he MUST be the starter" when we all know that OB isn't going to do that. Anymore than he was going to make Savage the starter over Hoyer or Brock the last two seasons.
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Actually, unless you believe all the "coach speech", how true is this assessment. Certainly, on the current position board, Savage is thumb tacked in as #1. But, not just QB, any position, if a player shows he is the better player, why would OB not start or play his best player at any given position? Ego? Or loyality? Or is the puppet master pulling the strings?

Your assessment just makes no sense to me. It may be true but I just can't comprehend any coach making a deliberate decision not to play his best players.

I've also said on numerous occassions that come the first game, I'll be behind the coach's decisions.
 
I hope O'Brien pulls his head out his arse.

The QBs that had the best won-lost records under him were third string or not-deemed worthy ; always the last ones he'd start.

If you like Watson, don't jinx him, LOL.
 
76Texan said:
I hope O'Brien pulls his head out his arse.

The QBs that had the best won-lost records under him were third string or not-deemed worthy ; always the last ones he'd start.

If you like Watson, don't jinx him, LOL.
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Maybe the Texans should move Watson to third string. :kitten:
 
I think it is stupid to even consider who our starter should be based on a small sample size of OTA's. Training camp and preseason games are a ways off and we can then formulate an knowledgeable opinion on who looks best and is our personal favorite to start the season as our top Qb. Same goes for other positions on the team and the battles that will be taking place.

OTA's really don't mean squat. It is nice to get updates and all because we are all so very ready for football to begin again and the wait is agonizing. However let's give this thing some time.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
I think it is stupid to even consider who our starter should be based on a small sample size of OTA's. Training camp and preseason games are a ways off and we can then formulate an knowledgeable opinion on who looks best and is our personal favorite to start the season as our top Qb. Same goes for other positions on the team and the battles that will be taking place.

OTA's really don't mean squat. It is nice to get updates and all because we are all so very ready for football to begin again and the wait is agonizing. However let's give this thing some time.
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Agree with your first paragraph. I don't think that OTAs don't mean anything though. It's a crash course for the new guys and a refresher for the vets. It is nice to get updates. I'd like to see Watson struggle actually. Then, I know they are really preparing him and aren't planning to redshirt him. He should struggle. If I heard that he was not, I'd worry that they weren't putting enough on him. A rookie QB should struggle in their first NFL season, especially in OTAs.
 
Number19 said:
Actually, unless you believe all the "coach speech", how true is this assessment. Certainly, on the current position board, Savage is thumb tacked in as #1. But, not just QB, any position, if a player shows he is the better player, why would OB not start or play his best player at any given position? Ego? Or loyality? Or is the puppet master pulling the strings?

Your assessment just makes no sense to me. It may be true but I just can't comprehend any coach making a deliberate decision not to play his best players.

I've also said on numerous occassions that come the first game, I'll be behind the coach's decisions.
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How true is this assessment? Two years ago, after Weeden led a comeback win against the Colts and won his only start, OB went right back to Hoyer after he cleared protocol. Last year they went all-in on Brock, which is a testament to what he thought of both Savage and Weeden. Not to mention that Weeden was actually the QB in two Texans wins, and Savage at that point had about half of a game under his belt, yet Savage was #2 all season long. The only time Weeden was active was when Savage was hurt and didn't make a single attempt on the year. This year, they draft Watson and name Savage the starter early in the off-season.

Honestly, how am I supposed to impartially and without player-fan bias analyse all of that? OB has made it clear through his personnel decisions that Weeden is not the answer. Again, right decision or wrong decision? Hard to say. But a decision has clearly been made. Savage has a chance to be a long term answer for this team and OB is going to find that out, because he is invested in Savage now more than ever. Worst case he is a stop-gap until Watson is ready. But he has to find out what he has in Savage, so there is no way he is giving a soon-to-be-34 year old first round bust the starting nod. He is OB's health insurance policy this year on Savage.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
I think it is stupid to even consider who our starter should be based on a small sample size of OTA's. .
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I agree with the premise, but... there should be a definite starter before training camp & since none of our guys have any "body of work" to speak of, what are you going to do?

Weeden has more tape than Savage does. Unfortunately for him, & the Weeden fans, it's mostly bad tape.

Still, we're picking between two guys the Texans had on the roster when they decided to bring Osweiler in to start. Two guys that were on the roster when the Texans decided to trade up & bring in the QB of our future.

It doesn't matter if the Texans pick Savage or Weeden. The Texans don't believe either is good enough to take this team where we want to go.
 
sandman said:
How true is this assessment? Two years ago, after Weeden led a comeback win against the Colts and won his only start, OB went right back to Hoyer after he cleared protocol. Last year they went all-in on Brock, which is a testament to what he thought of both Savage and Weeden. Not to mention that Weeden was actually the QB in two Texans wins, and Savage at that point had about half of a game under his belt, yet Savage was #2 all season long. The only time Weeden was active was when Savage was hurt and didn't make a single attempt on the year. This year, they draft Watson and name Savage the starter early in the off-season.

Honestly, how am I supposed to impartially and without player-fan bias analyse all of that? OB has made it clear through his personnel decisions that Weeden is not the answer. Again, right decision or wrong decision? Hard to say. But a decision has clearly been made. Savage has a chance to be a long term answer for this team and OB is going to find that out, because he is invested in Savage now more than ever. Worst case he is a stop-gap until Watson is ready. But he has to find out what he has in Savage, so there is no way he is giving a soon-to-be-34 year old first round bust the starting nod. He is OB's health insurance policy this year on Savage.
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I'd like to see comment on my post yesterday at 12:24. Savage is not a stop gap past this season. Either we sign him to an Oz contract or he's gone. Weeden's age is a positive because he's short term - if you believe Watson is our future QB. If you think ahead to the 2018 season, we are going into that season with a second year unproven QB - and no other QB with experience. Have you thought of this? Or does it not concern you? Should the organization even be thinking "long term"?
 
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TexansSeminole said:
Agree with your first paragraph. I don't think that OTAs don't mean anything though. It's a crash course for the new guys and a refresher for the vets. It is nice to get updates. I'd like to see Watson struggle actually. Then, I know they are really preparing him and aren't planning to redshirt him. He should struggle. If I heard that he was not, I'd worry that they weren't putting enough on him. A rookie QB should struggle in their first NFL season, especially in OTAs.
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Peyton Manning struggled big time with 28 interceptions his rookie year. Ouch. People on here would lose their freaking minds if Watson threw 28 picks. Can you hear the bust chant? Or I told you he should sit his first season.
 
Number19 said:
I'd like to see comment on my post yesterday at 12:24. Savage is not a stop gap past this season. Either we sign him to an Oz contract or he's gone. Weeden's age is a positive because he's short term - if you believe Watson is our future QB. If you think ahead to the 2018 season, we are going into that season with a second year unproven QB - and no other QB with experience. Have you thought of this? Or does it not concern you? Should the organization even be thinking "long term"?
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Savage will more and likely be gone after this season. Weeden might be the willy old vet for a few more years. Watson will be the face after this season
 
We
Texansballer74 said:
Savage will more and likely be gone after this season. Weeden might be the willy old vet for a few more years. Watson will be the face after this season
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Weeden's contract will also be up. The gamble is whether he will get an offer from another club with the opportunity to challenge for a starting spot. Or will he be willing to settle for a cush backup roll, pulling down a cool million for carrying a clipboard.
 
PapaL said:
They are about the same age now. Why not?
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Same age but Gannon had a whole lot more experience by the time he got to the Raiders (11 years), to Weeden's 4 years.

And I forget why Weeden was a 29 year old rookie. Did he play baseball or something?
 
Speedy said:
Same age but Gannon had a whole lot more experience by the time he got to the Raiders (11 years), to Weeden's 4 years.

And I forget why Weeden was a 29 year old rookie. Did he play baseball or something?
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I think he played in the MLB for ~4 or 5 years prior to entering the NFL.
 
chenjy9 said:
Forgive me for being obtuse, but is anyone here actually fretting about that?
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  1. be constantly or visibly worried or anxious.
    "she fretted about the cost of groceries"
    synonyms: worry, be anxious, feel uneasy, be distressed, be upset, upset oneself, concern oneself;More

  2. 2.
    gradually wear away (something) by rubbing or gnawing.
    "the bay's black waves fret the seafront"


    Perhaps there was some hyperbole involved. Personally, I don't fret about anything the Texans have going on. Especially these days.
 
TxnsJuggernaut said:
I think it is stupid to even consider who our starter should be based on a small sample size of OTA's. Training camp and preseason games are a ways off and we can then formulate an knowledgeable opinion on who looks best and is our personal favorite to start the season as our top Qb. Same goes for other positions on the team and the battles that will be taking place.

OTA's really don't mean squat. It is nice to get updates and all because we are all so very ready for football to begin again and the wait is agonizing. However let's give this thing some time.
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It's the off-season... we should discuss?
 
thunderkyss said:
I agree with the premise, but... there should be a definite starter before training camp & since none of our guys have any "body of work" to speak of, what are you going to do?

Weeden has more tape than Savage does. Unfortunately for him, & the Weeden fans, it's mostly bad tape.

Still, we're picking between two guys the Texans had on the roster when they decided to bring Osweiler in to start. Two guys that were on the roster when the Texans decided to trade up & bring in the QB of our future.

It doesn't matter if the Texans pick Savage or Weeden. The Texans don't believe either is good enough to take this team where we want to go.
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I agree with your post with the exception of the first sentence. Please no more QB's decided in "closed" practices. Rotate the playing time if necessary but give them the preseason playing time to sort it out
 
Texansballer74 said:
Peyton Manning struggled big time with 28 interceptions his rookie year. Ouch. People on here would lose their freaking minds if Watson threw 28 picks. Can you hear the bust chant? Or I told you he should sit his first season.
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People on here would have gone ballistic Manning's rookie year... and imagine the outcry if Rodgers would have sat three years for the Texans... talk about a wasted pick
 
Number19 said:
I'd like to see comment on my post yesterday at 12:24. Savage is not a stop gap past this season. Either we sign him to an Oz contract or he's gone. Weeden's age is a positive because he's short term - if you believe Watson is our future QB. If you think ahead to the 2018 season, we are going into that season with a second year unproven QB - and no other QB with experience. Have you thought of this? Or does it not concern you? Should the organization even be thinking "long term"?
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It doesn't matter what I think the Texans should do. I'm providing my opinion into what the Texans are doing. Right or wrong. My opinion or not. The Texans, based on their actions, are not tapping Weeden for the QB1 slot.

And no, the decision to not have Weeden be QB1 - or give him his "fair" chance - does not concern me in the least bit. Because Weeden is Fitz or Hoyer. Just like Savage is Mallett or Brock. I've seen three years worth of OB trying to make the next Brady out of retreads and projects.
 
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