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Injury Thread

CloakNNNdagger said:
That's difficult to tell. But that is probably essentially a moot point in that the same ill-advised ego-driven decision to return so early will be the driving force to continue play. The longer he plays having poor control of his core, the more the chance for a significant compensatory injury. Unfortunately, my guess is that. like last year, there is a good chance that Watt plays until something happens where he's no longer able to walk. I hope I'm wrong.
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That's the problem, you're never.
 
DocBar said:
CnD, what are your thoughts on Duane Brown returning to practice?
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As I've posted many times, his injury is an extremely difficult one to just come back from at all......especially for a huge lineman who needs to place extreme stress on that quad virtually every play as he repeatedly meets resistance against another large player while pass blocking and run blocking.

The group of 50% of NFL players that were able to come back from this injury usually were able to return to play by 6-8 months. This now is almost 9 months post surgery. His prognosis will not be known until he is on the field in regular game play. He is certainly not considered to be "ahead of schedule" for return. But what we don't really know is why............just being extra careful (which has never been the Texans approach)?...........or is his rehabbing going slower than expected? What I hope is not going on now is that the Texans are pushing an unexpectedly slow rehab to meet an artificial deadline.........trying to get him back before week 6 or 7 when people would be questioning why he wasn't placed on PUP reserve to begin with (meanwhile losing a valuable usable spot open for an additional player on the roster). We will all be watching this play out together.
 
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Makes you wonder if him getting fewer snaps (and no offensive plays) over past couple years could have made a difference
 
Watching him getting tossed around through 3 games was really wierd. He was a nonfactor more often than not and I think his pride ended up not only hurting him, but ultimately hurting the team. Sucks.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
That's difficult to tell. But that is probably essentially a moot point in that the same ill-advised ego-driven decision to return so early will be the driving force to continue play. The longer he plays having poor control of his core, the more the chance for a significant compensatory injury. Unfortunately, my guess is that. like last year, there is a good chance that Watt plays until something happens where he's no longer able to walk. I hope I'm wrong.
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On Sunday in response to Seegara's question following Watt's poor performance, he asked (Is it too late if Watt sits down right now?) I think we now know the answer.

The man speaks the truth, maybe the McNair's need to join TT so they will significantly upgrade their medical knowledge at a discounted rate.
 
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Malloy said:
Unfortunately I think they know... but are willing to take the chance on a player...

Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb...... dumb....
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Then when the franchise is mired in mediocrity 3 yrs from now and there's cap issues because they borrowed against Watt's contract and are paying him like the best player in the NFL, I hope we revisit this decision that was ultimately approved by McNair.
 
Texans' Cushing returns to practice after missing 2 games with torn MCL
Dan Wilkins Sep 28, 2016 12:02 PM
Reinforcements are on the way for a Houston Texans defense now working without its star player.

Veteran linebacker Brian Cushing made his return to practice Wednesday after missing the last two games with a torn MCL suffered in the regular-season opener.

Reports immediately following the injury revealed an expected recovery timeline of six weeks. While he'll presumably be worked into the mix with caution, and it's thus entirely possible that he remains on the sidelines for Sunday's game against the Tennessee Titans, getting back on the field is a sign that he could be cleared far sooner than anticipated.

Houston's defense needs all the help it can get following news that perennial All-Pro defensive endJ.J. Watt will miss an extended period of time after re-injuring his back.

Cushing would provide just that if healthy, sliding back into his starting linebacker spot alongsideBenardrick McKinney.
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I missed your post CnD when he got hurt. For some reason i was thinking you said 6 weeks? If so, this seems "rushed"
 
Wolf said:
I missed your post CnD when he got hurt. For some reason i was thinking you said 6 weeks? If so, this seems "rushed"
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It's definitely rushed. I had a partially torn MCL after an amatuer MMA fight.

I didn't start even light drilling for a month afterwards. Didn't feel normal for another month after that.

And that was relatively minor. He could have had a more significant tear that would require a longer recovery.

But what's new with this team?!
 
JamTex said:
Sorry Doc. Didn't see it.
If he is out 6 weeks of no practice, does it mean his return should be after the week 9 Bye?
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His injury was originally reported as a Grade II MCL tear. This injury usually takes a 2-4 week return to play. But I found it curious that even though reported as a Grade II, it was simultaneously reported as a 6 week return to play..........a length of time more commonly assigned to a Grade III MCL. It is true, as I posted previously, that there can be variability in return from this type of injury depending on various factors. I believed the longer estimated return time was probably due to wanting to be somewhat conservative due to his extensive history of major lower limb injuries including multiple ACL and patellar tendon ruptures. Cushing's return to practice for a Grade II MCL tear falls in the lower range of the expected 2-4 week return (2 weeks and 3 days), and I would have to question if especially in Cushing's case, this has not been again hastened because of the Texans present state of affairs. With this last injury, his mobility in general and lateral cutting ability in specific is likely to further affect his already compromised agility. And this is not to even mention the risk of re-injury and compensatory injury commonly associated with a premature return.
 
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JB said:
Does that mean when you sprain an ankle, you really tore something?
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Absolutely............a Grade I ankle sprain is more of a stretching tear of groups of small ligament fibers (sometimes at the microscopic level only) ...........a Grade II sprain is any gross tear that has not totally disrupted the ankle ligament.............and a Grade III is a complete rupture (separation) of the ligament.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
How long have I been trying to point out that his grossly premature return was inadvisable, ego-driven and likely ultimately to not end well?
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Thousands of sick or injured people go to work every day while under the advisement of their doctors to stay home. I've done it. Partly because I didn't want to lose my job, be replaced. I also didn't want to let my boss down.

Brett Favre got his chance to start for an injured Dan Majikowski and played 253 consecutive regular season games partly because of how he got the starting job to begin with.

You may be right, maybe it was Watt's ego that kept him from taking it easy. But I see it another way. The myth is a player won't lose his starting role because of injury. Happens all the time. The way Dak Prescott is playing Romo may never start again for the Cowboys. Nobody is irreplaceable.

Just my two cents worth from a regular guy. If I were a doctor I'd probably be able to look at it from a different POV.
 
banned1976 said:
Thousands of sick or injured people go to work every day while under the advisement of their doctors to stay home. I've done it. Partly because I didn't want to lose my job, be replaced. I also didn't want to let my boss down.

Brett Favre got his chance to start for an injured Dan Majikowski and played 253 consecutive regular season games partly because of how he got the starting job to begin with.

You may be right, maybe it was Watt's ego that kept him from taking it easy. But I see it another way. The myth is a player won't lose his starting role because of injury. Happens all the time. The way Dak Prescott is playing Romo may never start again for the Cowboys. Nobody is irreplaceable.

Just my two cents worth from a regular guy. If I were a doctor I'd probably be able to look at it from a different POV.
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For us it's a game... for the players it's a job
 
banned1976 said:
Thousands of sick or injured people go to work every day while under the advisement of their doctors to stay home. I've done it. Partly because I didn't want to lose my job, be replaced. I also didn't want to let my boss down.

Brett Favre got his chance to start for an injured Dan Majikowski and played 253 consecutive regular season games partly because of how he got the starting job to begin with.

You may be right, maybe it was Watt's ego that kept him from taking it easy. But I see it another way. The myth is a player won't lose his starting role because of injury. Happens all the time. The way Dak Prescott is playing Romo may never start again for the Cowboys. Nobody is irreplaceable.

Just my two cents worth from a regular guy. If I were a doctor I'd probably be able to look at it from a different POV.
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Do people tell you that you might be the best at your job in the world? Does Papa John and HEB pay you millions of dollars and all the meat you can eat? Do you have folks asking you for your signature? Do they pay thousands of dollars to wear your clothes? Did your doctor tell you that your back is broken and the type of work you do could leave you in a wheel chair and you went to work anyhow? Are you on television all the time and little girls ask you to marry them and old women marvel at your biceps? You are a regular guy but Watt is not. He has not been regular since high school.
 
banned1976 said:
Thousands of sick or injured people go to work every day while under the advisement of their doctors to stay home. I've done it. Partly because I didn't want to lose my job, be replaced. I also didn't want to let my boss down.

Brett Favre got his chance to start for an injured Dan Majikowski and played 253 consecutive regular season games partly because of how he got the starting job to begin with.

You may be right, maybe it was Watt's ego that kept him from taking it easy. But I see it another way. The myth is a player won't lose his starting role because of injury. Happens all the time. The way Dak Prescott is playing Romo may never start again for the Cowboys. Nobody is irreplaceable.

Just my two cents worth from a regular guy. If I were a doctor I'd probably be able to look at it from a different POV.
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I appreciate your take, but I guarantee you that Watt was not in any position to worry about his job if he had extended his return by a month or even more. In fact, he would have had a better chance of that not happening. Because of his relatively recent rash of injury history, everyone should have been patient with his rehab in order to maximize his potential for performance and longevity (both of which by the very nature of his injuries and his size and his position played was bound to realistically be compromised permanently) when he did return. But because his supporting staff of doctors', trainers' and coaches', as well as his own unrealistic expectations, he finds himself in a position much more untenable than just missing a few extra games, and very possibly ultimately changing the course of his career.
 
Maybe the mods can move the last few posts to the JJ back thread because this isn't the place for a discussion of if he should have been preve
CloakNNNdagger said:
I appreciate your take, but I guarantee you that Watt was not in any position to worry about his job if he had extended his return by a month or even more. In fact, he would have had a better chance of that not happening. Because of his relatively recent rash of injury history, everyone should have been patient with his rehab in order to maximize his potential for performance and longevity (both of which by the very nature of his injuries and his size and his position played was bound to realistically be compromised permanently) when he did return. But because his supporting staff of doctors', trainers' and coaches', as well as his own unrealistic expectations, he finds himself in a position much more untenable than just missing a few extra games, and very possibly ultimately changing the course of his career.
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But what 20 something didn't think he was invincible and knew himself better than anyone else?
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
That's why you have non-20 something doctors, trainers and coaches supposedly giving you non-20 something guidance.:foottap:
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Yeah and we all know how we all listen to the doctor's.... assuming they told him the entire story and he took the risk on his own... what else could they do? Just like my doctor to repeatedly telling me to stop smoking, he can't force it on me
 
JB said:
Yeah and we all know how we all listen to the doctor's.... assuming they told him the entire story and he took the risk on his own... what else could they do? Just like my doctor to repeatedly telling me to stop smoking, he can't force it on me
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Believe me, team doctors (as opposed to doctors in the real world) have much more power over players actions than most realize............unless they are unsupported or pressured and/or overruled by those above........or below them.......
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
Believe me, team doctors (as opposed to doctors in the real world) have much more power over players actions than most realize............unless they are unsupported or pressured and/or overruled by those above........or below them.......
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The Team Doctors were responsible for keeping Nick Saban from signing Drew Brees in Miami.
 
Yeah and the Saints and Drew Brees went to a Super Bowl in 2010 remember?
 
Cushing is thinking of returning early. Pain tolerance and structural integrity have little to do with each other. A fully healed MCL has much more resilience than a mostly healed MCL. This is where I question NFL medical staffs. I've personally lied to PBR and PRCA trainers about my level of pain/discomfort. Those trainers had nothing to gain from clearing me, but they did. I think NFL players have too much influence on the medical/training staff's.
 
DocBar said:
Cushing is thinking of returning early. Pain tolerance and structural integrity have little to do with each other. A fully healed MCL has much more resilience than a mostly healed MCL. This is where I question NFL medical staffs. I've personally lied to PBR and PRCA trainers about my level of pain/discomfort. Those trainers had nothing to gain from clearing me, but they did. I think NFL players have too much influence on the medical/training staff's.
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There is a lot of objective information about an injury that a physician can gain without relying on a player/s subjective response......physical exam (stability, swelling, range of motion, etc), electromuscular testing, radiologic imaging, functional testing (walking, hopping, jumping). And when all information is in, the known natural healing/rehab period necessary for the injury to become functionally safe should bring in a semblance of common sense into the decision to return to play. Yes, there does indeed exist that isolated example of a "miraculously" short return to play from injuries (such as in the case of Adrian Peterson), but when most players and doctors and coaches try to defy the natural course of the healing process, the outcome tends to become marred with setback and failure.
 
Texian said:
PDS ‏@PatDStat 6m6 minutes ago
Jonathan Grimes expected to miss a month with cracked fibula. http://www.scout.com/nfl/texans/story/1712143-jonathan-grimes-expected-miss-month… #Texans

Hey Doc, doesn't that seem a little quick to recover?
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This sounds like a stress fracture. Even though it is a non weight bearing bone, it usually requires at least a 6 week rehab since there are so many leg muscle attachments that can place strong torque on the bone with increasing activity, risking extending the stress fracture line and possibly leading to overt bone fracture line separation.
 
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