How much is Andre worth to you?

[kingtexan]

He wanted to be traded to a contender and everyone insisted they he stay and called him an ass for wanting to leave. Now you expect him to take a pay cut after forcing him to stay.

I heard that was something his uncle brought up as an offer, not the team as a request.

http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexan...ake-pay-cut-to-remain-with-texans/#29401101=0

 

[Troy Chapman]

He wanted to be traded to a contender and everyone insisted they he stay and called him an ass for wanting to leave. Now you expect him to take a pay cut after forcing him to stay.

Yes. He wouldn't get more on the open market than what he would get here after a reduction in salary.

 

[badboy]

We're not? Not trying to be a smart ass, but I'm not a capologist like some in here.

According to sportrac, we have about $9 mil in cap space for next season. I'd like to see us re-sign Mallet & KJ, at least, which will take more than 9mil just for them two. Then there's guys like Lewis, Manning, Dent, Pickett & Newton whom I'd like to see back as well.

First, the 2015 cap has not been identified so we have no clue how much cap space will exist. The rumors are anywhere from 140-160 million per team. 2nd the source you are looking at lists the 2014 roster not what the 2015 roster could look like. Are you familiar enough with the 2014 roster that you can say "I don't expect/want this guy back"? If so, then you can eliminate $ lowering the possible 2015 team salary. I think most would agree that players like Clabo ($1.3), Posey ($ .9) and Thad Lewis ($.75) should not return. That is minimal but $3 m + Fitz $3.875 = $6.875 m and that is more than enough for Mallett or KJ and probably could get you Pickett and Powe also. That also leaves your $ 9 million.

On a positive note our dead money will drop from $ 21 million to just over $602,000 barring any new moves. If Smith gets blamed for getting us into cap hell last 2-3 years, should he not get credit for getting us out?

 

[TEXANRED]

Smart teams don't overpay for sentimental reasons. Do what it takes to win on the field, period. That's what the team is there to do, win.

The Texans haven't tried to win in 13 years, why should they start now? Plus AJ is still a top 10 WR in the league. It's not his fault that the one down year he had was due to bad QB play.

 

[Texecutioner]

Honestly? You truly do not understand it?

No, not in the realm that many in here clearly say they do. When you want a guy on the team at the expense of the franchise from being able to improve or you'd want your franchise to pay double or triple what the guy is worth knowing that it could very likely hold the team back, then your goals for the team really aren't for it to be the best that it can be. Your goals are more for that individual player's presence. That is not fair to the rest of the guys on the team that are looking to go all of the way in my opinion. Players get older and they lose their value. It happens with all players. As a kid, when I wasn't rooting for the Oilers I rooted for the 49ers and was a huge Montana fan. I hated them for getting rid of Montana, because I thought it was a year to early, but deep down I knew they were probably doing the smart thing and what was best for the franchise at the time. They didn't do wrong by Montana. It is a sport and it is a business. They had a slightly younger guy in Young that was great and had more years left and they still won a SB with Young. They thought about the entire franchise instead of one player even though they had the best QB of all time at that particular time. I also enjoy rooting on my favorite players when they join other teams. It creates a new interest to watch them in a new situation. I enjoyed watching Montana on the Chiefs. A certain part of me has always wanted to see what AJ would look like on another team as well since the majority of the time he has been on the Texans, they have been awful. I've barely gotten to see him play at all in the playoffs, and I feel pretty let down and jaded by that. I always will honestly.

 

[Texecutioner]

He is under contract so pay him. If he wants to help by restructuring great.

As long as he shows up as a leader and not the little ***** he was last off-season I hope he retires a Texan.

He had every right to be ticked off and to want to be somewhere else. I totally understood that. What I didn't understand is why he was so dumb about how he tried to do it. He had no chance of forcing the Texans to do anything that late in the off season. If AJ had tried to get off of the team before the draft, he wouldn't have been here this season and would have gotten his wish more than likely.

He wasn't acting like a little ***** though. That is ridiculous considering what he has had to deal with on this franchise with poor coaching, bad QB's, and an incompetent leadership from upper management. His mistake was waiting to long to break.

 

[thunderkyss]

No, not in the realm that many in here clearly say they do. When you want a guy on the team at the expense of the franchise from being able to improve or you'd want your franchise to pay double or triple what the guy is worth knowing that it could very likely hold the team back, then your goals for the team really aren't for it to be the best that it can be. Your goals are more for that individual player's presence. That is not fair to the rest of the guys on the team that are looking to go all of the way in my opinion. Players get older and they lose their value.

First, I think something should be done with Andre's cap number. I'm old school & don't think any player should ever have a cap number in excess of $10M other than a franchise QB... but I'm beginning to realize it happens more & more nowadays.

Secondly, I think his detractors have done a poor job of "proving" how much Andre is worth.

Third, the Texans generally aren't big players in the FA market, the only time they've shown willingness to go after top tier FAs is when they believed they were title contenders. That's not the case now, so I've got to ask if you're freeing up money, what are you freeing it up for?

Fourth, I doubt there is a player on this team who believes they stand a better chance of winning if Andre is not on this team.

 

[ObsiWan]

AJ had ~30% of team targets this year. I'd very much like to have him back, but I need more information...

Will we be buying any free agent WRs? Who?

Will we be drafting any WRs? (How have we prioritized one -- what round?)

Will we be adding a Move TE with good SAQ?

Will we be adding a SlotWR?

What's the final cap number going to be?

Thanks.

I'll add one more question: Who will be getting him the ball? Mallett? Fitzpatrick (it's not impossible)? Savage? Who?

 

[JB]

I'll add one more question: Who will be getting him the ball? Mallett? Fitzpatrick (it's not impossible)? Savage? Who?

umm, Fitzpatrick gets the ground the ball at AJ's feet

 

[steelbtexan]

Agree with bolded, however we can add the speed and retain AJ. He's still quality and we're not hurting for cap room. Add Davante Parker and move AJ to slot

Depends on what you do with that 9 mil worth of cap room.

Not saying I want the Texans to add him, but Cobb for 7-8 mil for 4 yrs and drafting Parker then adding a RT like Fisher in the 2nd rd would not help this offense. Plus you would have $$$ left over to find a vet LB/S. I understand the AJ love, but there's no denying that cutting AJ's salary and bringing in new blood would be in the best long term interest of the on the field product.

Not so much from a sentimental/marketing aspect.

 

[JB]

Depends on what you do with that 9 mil worth of cap room.

Not saying I want the Texans to add him, but Cobb for 7-8 mil for 4 yrs and drafting Parker then adding a RT like Fisher in the 2nd rd would not help this offense. Plus you would have $$$ left over to find a vet LB/S. I understand the AJ love, but there's no denying that cutting AJ's salary and bringing in new blood would be in the best long term interest of the on the field product.

Not so much from a sentimental/marketing aspect.

I don't see anyway GB let's Cobb get away

 

[steelbtexan]

First, the 2015 cap has not been identified so we have no clue how much cap space will exist. The rumors are anywhere from 140-160 million per team. 2nd the source you are looking at lists the 2014 roster not what the 2015 roster could look like. Are you familiar enough with the 2014 roster that you can say "I don't expect/want this guy back"? If so, then you can eliminate $ lowering the possible 2015 team salary. I think most would agree that players like Clabo ($1.3), Posey ($ .9) and Thad Lewis ($.75) should not return. That is minimal but $3 m + Fitz $3.875 = $6.875 m and that is more than enough for Mallett or KJ and probably could get you Pickett and Powe also. That also leaves your $ 9 million.

On a positive note our dead money will drop from $ 21 million to just over $602,000 barring any new moves. If Smith gets blamed for getting us into cap hell last 2-3 years, should he not get credit for getting us out?

I'm not a cap expert, tell me how are they in relation to the rest of the division? Can they afford to add 2 mid level FA's in addition to re-signing KJ/Brooks/Newton/Lewis. If the answer is yes then they are in great shape. Otherwise they are treading water and either 1. more mediocrity will continue or Smith will have to draft like he never has before. What do you think is most likely to happen?

My 2 mid level FA's are Virgil Greene/Justin Durant.

Meanwhile the McNair's will continue to keep on cashing those checks.

 

[JB]

Meanwhile the McNair's will continue to keep on cashing those checks.

I'm sure they have direct deposit

 

[Norg]

not 16m that's 4 sure

 

[steelbtexan]

Not a dime, but I don't own the team.

Make it rain Bob/Cal/Rick.

 

[Marshall]

Smart teams also rework their top players deal especially when they can still produce good numbers. AJ may not be top 3, but he is still a very good player in this league. Just reduce his salary.

Extend at a reduced rate to bring down the cap hit. It also leaves AJ in a better position to retire on his terms rather than on financial ones. I hate to see a HOF player just playing to get the deferred money.

 

[Scooter]

legends decline, but at their worst they're still legends. andre may not be worth 15 million on the field - but he's worth 5 mil in the community, 5 mil on the sidelines and 5 mil on the field. as essentially "THE" original texan, as potentially the first Texans hall of famer (especially if he stays with one team), the cap impact fails to outweigh everything else. especially when it's obvious he can still turn it on when he believes in what we're doing.

i'll bet my tickets, if andre wants to play for us, he'll put up another 1200+ yard season.

 

[gary]

Andre would be the first Texan to play his whole career here I would like to see that happen. Hopefully it will.

 

[EllisUnit]

legends decline, but at their worst they're still legends. andre may not be worth 15 million on the field - but he's worth 5 mil in the community, 5 mil on the sidelines and 5 mil on the field. as essentially "THE" original texan, as potentially the first Texans hall of famer (especially if he stays with one team), the cap impact fails to outweigh everything else. especially when it's obvious he can still turn it on when he believes in what we're doing.

i'll bet my tickets, if andre wants to play for us, he'll put up another 1200+ yard season.

Oh no doubt, as he showed us in the last game of the season. He can still play !

 

[Texecutioner]

legends decline, but at their worst they're still legends. andre may not be worth 15 million on the field - but he's worth 5 mil in the community, 5 mil on the sidelines and 5 mil on the field. as essentially "THE" original texan, as potentially the first Texans hall of famer (especially if he stays with one team), the cap impact fails to outweigh everything else. especially when it's obvious he can still turn it on when he believes in what we're doing.

i'll bet my tickets, if andre wants to play for us, he'll put up another 1200+ yard season.

No WR in the NFL is worth 15 mill a season, much less an aging WR who is on the decline.

Thank god you are nowhere near the front office of this organization.

 

[infantrycak]

No WR in the NFL is worth 15 mill a season, much less an aging WR who is on the decline.

Thank god you are nowhere near the front office of this organization.

You need to look a little closer at this. He's getting paid $10. Much of the remainder is the Texans taking what was supposed to be salary in the past and converting it to bonus to not account for it until now. That's on the front office not AJ. In fact, it would be a HUGE mistake for an organization to do that and then follow your logic and use it against the player. That would discourage other players from doing it when the Texans want flexibility.

For example, JJ has a roster bonus due of $10 mil this year. Say the Texans want to sign a 1st rate ILB FA and need to ask him to convert that to a prorated bonus freeing up $8 mil this year to do so but increasing his cap hit in future years $2 mil per. If you're JJ you may very well tell them f'k off, you'll forget I did this for you later on and hold my high cap against me.

So hopefully, thank God the front office isn't thinking as simplistically as you.

 

[Texecutioner]

You need to look a little closer at this. He's getting paid $10. Much of the remainder is the Texans taking what was supposed to be salary in the past and converting it to bonus to not account for it until now. That's on the front office not AJ. In fact, it would be a HUGE mistake for an organization to do that and then follow your logic and use it against the player. That would discourage other players from doing it when the Texans want flexibility.

For example, JJ has a roster bonus due of $10 mil this year. Say the Texans want to sign a 1st rate ILB FA and need to ask him to convert that to a prorated bonus freeing up $8 mil this year to do so but increasing his cap hit in future years $2 mil per. If you're JJ you may very well tell them f'k off, you'll forget I did this for you later on and hold my high cap against me.

So hopefully, thank God the front office isn't thinking as simplistically as you.

What you are posting has nothing to do with what I just posted. There are people in here saying, "I don't care what you pay the guy, because he is my hero." 15 Mill, 20 Mill, he is our baby!

I'm sorry, but that is the exact type of thinking that I would want no type of profitable business or front office of any company listening to. Hell, that kind of reputation is what Mcnair was known for for years that used to get guys like you so chippy around here when Bob would say things like "we're on the right track." Lol! That is the thing I hate the most about many Texans fans is that so many are a lot more concerned about having some country club organization where they feel like they have a "god fearing coach" or a family team, and could care less about what the results are. That is the exact same reason so many of you wanted Kubiak here for an eternity even after he went 6-10 and 2-14 even. You guys get stuck on someone and damn the rest of the organization who is working their tails off to achieve success. It's completely selfish.

You don't pay any player just any kind of money in this sport. There are to many moving pieces on every play that have to make things work. There is an offense and a defense in case you forgot. You have to field 11 guys on the field that are adequate and you have to pay them all. You don't throw away multiple Mills on players in the 15 Mill range, because they were elite several years ago. Any person who has followed smart organizations in football knows that you pay a guy for "what you expect him to do in the future" and not what he has done in the past. I hope the organization here understands that. Many of you guys have never learned that even through watching franchises like the Oakland Raiders, the Redskins, and the mistakes the Texans have made. Sorry, but a lot of us are wanting to see a consistent winning team.

AJ will never see 15 mill a year. The team will very likely ask him to restructure. It is just a matter of how much and where they can meet to terms. McClain has stated recently that AJ still wanted out of here though. I'm not sure where he is at personally, but I hope he is back. I just want it to be a fair deal for what he is expected to do in the future, and until we get an adequate QB, his value won't be anywhere near as high. This team will stay as a defensive team that has to run the ball a lot and make minimal mistakes. That is something you guys just haven't seemed to figure out. Until you get that QB in here over paying for an aging receiver is one of the worst things you could do.

 

[infantrycak]

Lots of "you guys" and no substance.

 

[thunderkyss]

He's getting paid $10. Much of the remainder is the Texans taking what was supposed to be salary in the past and converting it to bonus to not account for it until now.

That's correct. There are actually two extensions being accounted for on his 2015 cap number. One adds another $4M or so & the other adding $2M. The former ($4M) will be "paid off" in 2015, leaving only $2M on 2016.

With that in mind, if the Texans can reduce his 2015 compensation to $5M, his new cap number would be $11M in 2015 & a similar deal would work out to $7M in 2016.

 

[gary]

AJ should rework his deal it's not like he needs more money with everything he does off the field but he might just prefer a team with a better QB. It's up to him we'll see.

 

[JB]

AJ should rework his deal it's not like he needs more money with everything he does off the field but he might just prefer a team with a better QB. It's up to him we'll see.

From his point of view, why should he rework his deal?

Only reason I see is if he wants to stay and wants to help out the team...


... again!

 

[gary]

From his point of view, why should he rework his deal?

Only reason I see is if he wants to stay and wants to help out the team...


... again!

He may not and I would not fault him if not. There a good chance I would but I am not him. Probably just wishful thinking on my part more than anything else but if he is gone next season then so be it.

 

[ObsiWan]

What you are posting has nothing to do with what I just posted. There are people in here saying, "I don't care what you pay the guy, because he is my hero." 15 Mill, 20 Mill, he is our baby!

think of it as 10 mil in salary for this year and cashing 6 mil in post-dated checks he earned previously but agreed not to cash until 2015/2016.

...and where did anyone say anything about $20 mil?

 

[thunderkyss]

What you are posting has nothing to do with what I just posted. There are people in here saying, "I don't care what you pay the guy, because he is my hero." 15 Mill, 20 Mill, he is our baby!

The rest of us are ignoring that guy.

 

[JB]

think of it as 10 mil in salary for this year and cashing 6 mil in post-dated checks he earned previously but agreed not to cash until 2015/2016.

...and where did anyone say anything about $20 mil?

This doesn't fit the script for some who want to penalize him cuz the Texans owe him money. Makes you wonder how they would conduct a business.

Responsible and trustworthy? Yeah, probably not.

 

[Texecutioner]

AJ should rework his deal it's not like he needs more money with everything he does off the field but he might just prefer a team with a better QB. It's up to him we'll see.

I don't think he should have to at all. A contract is still a contract. The NFL allows teams to restructure contracts and release players as well. That is all just part of the business. I have no qualms with AJ wanting to get all of the money on his contract even if it was $25 Mill a season.

It just comes down to what is best for the entire team, and not just one person on that team. The objective is to pay your players what they are worth moving forward, not what they were worth in the past. In many cases teams simply can't get out of contracts that are no longer lucrative for the organization as a whole to get better. They just have to stick it out for another year or so. The Chicago Bears are very likely in that situation with Cutler right now. I don't think the Texans are with AJ though. If the Texans were to somehow get a really good QB on their roster for next year that can really sling it, then over paying AJ around 10 Mill for next year isn't that big of a problem. It becomes a minor one. They likely won't though, and either way they are probably going to ask him to restructure.

 

[JB]

I don't think he should have to at all. A contract is still a contract. The NFL allows teams to restructure contracts and release players as well. That is all just part of the business. I have no qualms with AJ wanting to get all of the money on his contract even if it was $25 Mill a season.

It just comes down to what is best for the entire team, and not just one person on that team. The objective is to pay your players what they are worth moving forward, not what they were worth in the past. In many cases teams simply can't get out of contracts that are no longer lucrative for the organization as a whole to get better. They just have to stick it out for another year or so. The Chicago Bears are very likely in that situation with Cutler right now. I don't think the Texans are with AJ though. If the Texans were to somehow get a really good QB on their roster for next year that can really sling it, then over paying AJ around 10 Mill for next year isn't that big of a problem. It becomes a minor one. They likely won't though, and either way they are probably going to ask him to restructure.

You don't think Mallett is that guy?

 

[Texecutioner]

think of it as 10 mil in salary for this year and cashing 6 mil in post-dated checks he earned previously but agreed not to cash until 2015/2016.

...and where did anyone say anything about $20 mil?

It was 15 Mill as an example saying they would have no problem paying that. I used a little exaggerated sarcasm since 15 Mill was obviously way over the top as it is. No WR would be worth $15 mill. When you read up and down the thread though, you see a ton of weird things being stated as they don't care how much they pay him, simply because they love the guy as if there aren't a ton of other guys you have to pay as well to build a winning organization. Part of my point was that if you care more about this player's wealth than you do at improving a roster on a new regime, then that is pretty much saying you don't care that much about the team being able to get better and to take that next step as a whole. I don't think anyone wants AJ gone or to go somewhere else (I'm sure some will take my comments and mis quote them though), but there are always limits for every player at every point in his career.

Based on the justifications I have heard in this thread and the other AJ thread earlier this season though, some in here would probably have no problem paying Watt something like $40 mill a season. Yeah, sounds crazy, but I wouldn't put it past some people based on their reasoning and what is more important to them which is the certain players, certain coaches, and obviously not the team as whole.

 

[Texecutioner]

You don't think Mallett is that guy?

Why would I think Mallet is that guy? He has played two games in his whole career. One was a good start, and the other was awful, but he was hurt in the 2nd one. Either way, we have almost nothing to make any decisive judgement on. My answer is I don't know. I certainly wouldn't bank on it though. If there is no evidence to suggest that he is, then no way. POssibly he could be, but we have no way of knowing. Don't forget that Keenum had one of the best two starts numbers wise in NFL history, but still lost every game and looked horrible after that. You need to see a good long stretch of games before you can really have a true idea of what a QB has. Unfortunately we didn't get to see what Mallet had, and that was a real bummer. That being said, QB is still our biggest need.

 

[gary]

I don't think he should have to at all. A contract is still a contract. The NFL allows teams to restructure contracts and release players as well. That is all just part of the business. I have no qualms with AJ wanting to get all of the money on his contract even if it was $25 Mill a season.

It just comes down to what is best for the entire team, and not just one person on that team. The objective is to pay your players what they are worth moving forward, not what they were worth in the past. In many cases teams simply can't get out of contracts that are no longer lucrative for the organization as a whole to get better. They just have to stick it out for another year or so. The Chicago Bears are very likely in that situation with Cutler right now. I don't think the Texans are with AJ though. If the Texans were to somehow get a really good QB on their roster for next year that can really sling it, then over paying AJ around 10 Mill for next year isn't that big of a problem. It becomes a minor one. They likely won't though, and either way they are probably going to ask him to restructure.

Shorter contracts seem like a better way to go. NFL, NBA, MLB, it does not matter you know going in players are only going to get older and decline more and more. Why sign them to an eight to ten year deal when they only digress as they get older? Ten years later no player is worth the heavy back end of a loaded contract anymore.

 

[EllisUnit]

AJ restructured many times to help out the team, now that all that restructuring money needs to be paid here at the end you guys want him to restructure and take less. So in other words when you are the #1 WR in the NFL you should never try to restructure and help your team cause they will screw you when you are no longer #1. Although your still damn good.

Man a lot of you would have a hard time keeping employees.

 

[pamperofirpo]

That's correct. There are actually two extensions being accounted for on his 2015 cap number. One adds another $4M or so & the other adding $2M. The former ($4M) will be "paid off" in 2015, leaving only $2M on 2016.

With that in mind, if the Texans can reduce his 2015 compensation to $5M, his new cap number would be $11M in 2015 & a similar deal would work out to $7M in 2016.

According to OvertheCap.com, Andre has a base salary of $10.5 in 2015 and a base salary of $11.5 in 2016. He has pro-rated signing bonus figures of $4,644,583 in 2015 and $2,675,000 in 2017 plus roster bonuses (post June 1) of $1,000,000 in each of 2015 and 2016.

It seems there are two paths: 1) Ask Andre for a pure paycut. This is not likely in my opinion 2) Ask Andre to restructure (much like Brady and other QBs have done). This might extend the contract by one year, and spreads out the cap hit, while guaranteeing Andre a larger percentage of the money left on the deal.

Andre has stated he'd like to play 15 seasons. That would be through 2017.

One possible restructure might be: 1) Reduce his base salary to $2.5M for each of 2015-16, and add another $2.5M for 2017. 2) Convert $15M in base salary reductions over 2015-16, into a signing bonus for 2015-17: this would be a $5M/year pro-rated INCREMENTAL bonus on top of his existing pro-rated signing bonuses (which can not by rule be reduced). The result would be something like:

2015: $2.5M Base + $4.64M + $1.00M + $5.0M = $12.14M (vs $16.14M)
2016: $2.5M Base + $2.68M + $1.00M + $5.0M = $11.18N (vs $14.68M)
2017: $2.5M Base + $5.0M = $7.50M (vs no contract in place today)

This lowers our cap hit by $4M in 2015 and by $3.5M in 2016.
Our exposure in 2017 would only be for $5M (signing bonus pro-ration).

Personally I could live with this, even though it's above market.
By comparison, Andre's cap hit number in 2014 was $15.64M.

Thoughts? Capology experts - is this feasible?

 

[JB]

Why would I think Mallet is that guy? He has played two games in his whole career. One was a good start, and the other was awful, but he was hurt in the 2nd one. Either way, we have almost nothing to make any decisive judgement on. My answer is I don't know. I certainly wouldn't bank on it though. If there is no evidence to suggest that he is, then no way. POssibly he could be, but we have no way of knowing. Don't forget that Keenum had one of the best two starts numbers wise in NFL history, but still lost every game and looked horrible after that. You need to see a good long stretch of games before you can really have a true idea of what a QB has. Unfortunately we didn't get to see what Mallet had, and that was a real bummer. That being said, QB is still our biggest need.

Unless we make a trade for an established elite QB, we're gonna have questions about the position a minimum of one more year. There is no quick and easy way to do it. If we retain Mallett, we can only hope he's the guy. If he's not, then we hope the next one is (either a pick or Savage or FA).

Same can be said for lots of positions every year, but QB is most important and glaring.

A few years back it was the RB that we were hoping to find a good one

 

[Texecutioner]

Unless we make a trade for an established elite QB, we're gonna have questions about the position a minimum of one more year. There is no quick and easy way to do it. If we retain Mallett, we can only hope he's the guy. If he's not, then we hope the next one is (either a pick or Savage or FA).

I have no problem retaining Mallet. I think he will be one of the best potential guys to roll the dice on, but up to a certain point of course. At the end of the day he has done nothing in his career and is a career back up. He shouldn't be demanding much money I'd hope. I'd like to think he'd want to be here more than anywhere else since he knows the system and will have a strong chance to win the job. That being said, I hope the team doesn't think that we should sign him and stop hunting. He could end up being really bad or slightly above average which is not good enough for me. I believe you need a really good QB to be able to win a SB. Your guy needs to be top 10.

A few years back it was the RB that we were hoping to find a good one

We had needs all over the place at that time. RB is one of he easiest positions to fill though honestly. A RB's success depends greatly on the O line any way. There are always a lot of great teams around the league that have average RB's that are adequate enough, but usually those are teams with strong QB play. A need at RB is nowhere close to having a need at QB.

 

[JB]

I have no problem retaining Mallet. I think he will be one of the best potential guys to roll the dice on, but up to a certain point of course. At the end of the day he has done nothing in his career and is a career back up. He shouldn't be demanding much money I'd hope. I'd like to think he'd want to be here more than anywhere else since he knows the system and will have a strong chance to win the job. That being said, I hope the team doesn't think that we should sign him and stop hunting. He could end up being really bad or slightly above average which is not good enough for me. I believe you need a really good QB to be able to win a SB. Your guy needs to be top 10.

Or, your defense has to be dominant with a QB that takes care of the ball

 

[Texecutioner]

Or, your defense has to be dominant with a QB that takes care of the ball

It is a lot harder to win that way though. It is possible, but so very few teams end up winning in consistent years that way or ever make it to the SB. The Ravens and the Bucs did. The Bears got to the SB with Grossman as well.

The Seahawks had Wilson who has a nice arm, but has wheels that can really make a ton of plays to move the ball. He is a much bigger exception. I would never want the Texans to go that route. The majority of SB appearances are teams with either elite QB's or very good ones.

 

[JB]

It is a lot harder to win that way though. It is possible, but so very few teams end up winning in consistent years that way or ever make it to the SB. The Ravens and the Bucs did. The Bears got to the SB with Grossman as well.

The Seahawks had Wilson who has a nice arm, but has wheels that can really make a ton of plays to move the ball. He is a much bigger exception. I would never want the Texans to go that route. The majority of SB appearances are teams with either elite QB's or very good ones.

Agreed, but those are so very hard to find. About 25 teams are looking, and some never find

 

[Runner]

Agreed, but those are so very hard to find. About 25 teams are looking, and some never find

Some are looking in the wrong places.

 

[JB]

Some are looking in the wrong places.

And some don't realize it takes binoculars... or at least opening the eyes

 

[thunderkyss]

Or, your defense has to be dominant with a QB that takes care of the ball

You're better off getting both. Tom Brady won three Super Bowls taking care of the ball while his defense & Kicker did what they were supposed to do.


So did Russell Wilson, so did Joe Flacco.

Trent Dilfer, same thing. Only the other guys were younger.


That QB has to be able to make plays when his team needs him to. The typical "game manager" won't do.

 

[badboy]

I'm not a cap expert, tell me how are they in relation to the rest of the division? Can they afford to add 2 mid level FA's in addition to re-signing KJ/Brooks/Newton/Lewis. If the answer is yes then they are in great shape. Otherwise they are treading water and either 1. more mediocrity will continue or Smith will have to draft like he never has before. What do you think is most likely to happen?

My 2 mid level FA's are Virgil Greene/Justin Durant.

Meanwhile the McNair's will continue to keep on cashing those checks.

Interested in why you are concerned about other teams cap? Brooks Reed needs to go, give his 2.5 Ts to Simon. I look at Pitts' Mike Mitchell safety contract.

S Mike Mitchell signed a five year, $25 million contract with the Pittsburgh Steelers on March 11, 2014. Mitchell (comparable 2014 stats to Lewis) received a $4.75 million signing bonus and $500,000 roster bonus as his guarantee. Base salaries are $750,000(2014), $2,000,000(2015), $5,000,000(2016), $5,000,00(2017), and $5,000,000(2018).

He got bonus $4.75 + roster .5 + base .75 = first year $ 6 m but cap only $2.2 m I'd offer that to Lewis and Newton and sweeten a bit for Jackson. Maybe similar to 1.1 pick Clowney:

Jadeveon Clowney, the number 1 overall pick of the 2014 NFL draft, signed a $22,272,998 contract with the Houston Texans on June 6, 2014. The entire contract is fully guaranteed and contained a $14,518,544 signing bonus. Clowney’s roster bonuses are due the 5th day of training camp.

$14.5 bonus + base .42 = $14.7 first year but cap $4 m but entire guarantee $22 m. Offer a 5th year but not guaranteed, if needed.

Team salary $ 109 + KJ $4 + Lewis $2.2 + Newton $2.2 + draft/PS $7 = $124.4 with cap total estimate $140 m. $15.6 for Mallet + back ups like Jamison, Ansah, Powe (I'd go with Pickett and Nix)Dent, etc. Mallett should not be signed for over $ 5 m '15 cap. Leaving apprx $10 m for vet FAs.

 

[JB]

You're better off getting both. Tom Brady won three Super Bowls taking care of the ball while his defense & Kicker did what they were supposed to do.


So did Russell Wilson, so did Joe Flacco.

Trent Dilfer, same thing. Only the other guys were younger.


That QB has to be able to make plays when his team needs him to. The typical "game manager" won't do.

Duh

And if you think Dilfer was anything buy a "game manager" you didn't watch enough of his career.

And Flacco wasn't thought highly of until that improbably playoff run, and many didn't think much of him afterwards. He didn't look all that good in the regular season for the next couple years.

Of course if you could get a Brady and have a dominant defense you have a much better chance of winning it all. But if you have the defense you can do without the Elite QB. Ask Eli, he's got 2 rings but has never been considered elite. He got extremely lucky one year and both years it was mainly the defense getting hot at the right time.

And if the sun shines at night people could see easier

 

[infantrycak]

Flacco had 11 tds, 0 ints, 280 ypg and a QB rating of 118 during their SB post season. He was anything but a game manager who got a ring.

 

[thunderkyss]

Duh

And if you think Dilfer was anything buy a "game manager" you didn't watch enough of his career.

The point is none of these "great" QBs are winning Super Bowls. Instead, the Super Bowl is more likely to be won by really strong teams rallying around a young QB.

We've got a nice team, hopefully it will be stronger next season. We just need that young QB to rally around.

 

[JB]

Flacco had 11 tds, 0 ints, 280 ypg and a QB rating of 118 during their SB post season. He was anything but a game manager who got a ring.

And what were his regular season stats that year, which is what I referenced...

You may have missed the key word "until"