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Houston Texans @ Arizona Cardinals, 7:30 PM **Official GameDay Thread** Preseason Gam

Thomas buys time ...wide open guy in endzone. Have no clue what happened there. Not even enough to speculate about who shoul have been there.

Another penalty on the extra point by us.

My goodness. Penalties would have looked worse in stat sheet had cardinals actually accepted more if them.
 
Team doesn't look nearly as disciplined as I expected. Penalties mainly, but also some bad choices in field of play.

I wonder if they instructed all kicks to be brought out just to get work on them because some of these should clearly have not been brought out.
 
Good throw by savage there.

Next play, sacked. Maybe could have moved I. Pocket better but that was clearly on oline.

Next play, safety. RB and rt didn't look good there. Basic blitz and we didn't pick it up.

Think Dennis Johnson was thinking chip and get out in route and wasn't true to his primary responsibility.

Still couldn't see savage much. Game over.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Not sure how much I can take away from this point in the game as far a decision making goes. Can still see basic things like guys getting physical beat and how qb's are spinning the ball.
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I don't think Keenum or Savage got enough snaps to learn anything. Normally, starting QBs don't play the entire 1st half of the opening preseason game.
 
Overall, the Main things that I saw in the game was penalties. That absolutely killed us. Mistakes are going to be made but with that many penalties it just magnifies the missed throws, and bad decisions and missed coverage.

I thought fitz had one really, really bad moment. The pick at the end if the half. Can't do that. Keenum looked crisp, savage had a nice throw. Didn't really get to see much if the qb's. We ran the ba a bunch and we didn't have the ball long.

We need more talent on the back end. That just is what it is. D line looked solid. Run game was good. Pass rush from outside was poor from everyone not named clowney.

I would cut Mercilus and I'd be ok with cutting Harris if someone else had looked half way decent back there. Maybe Harris can be better at safety...I don't know. But that pass interference was just dumb.

Merciless, any of the guys we have can at least do what he did and some if them a but better. Wouldn't complain if we moved on from either or both.

I'd give keenum some first team looks just because he looks more talented than fitz, and as the veteran bus driver fitz can't make that throw he did to end the half. But I don't think fitz was awful overall. He made some nice throws and did some good things. Again...was hard to really see the offense because of the shitload of penalties.

On the team overall, I expect to see improvement as we go a long. Penalties have to get cut down though. Not sure what they'll do about the deep pass defense though. Maybe with Joseph it'll be better.

I'm not nearly as concerned as I was reading the thread yesterday though. Again, I think if we cut down in those penalties we'll look a lot better. I seriously don't think we had an offensive drive without multiple penalties. Defense and special teams weren't far behind.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Overall, the Main things that I saw in the game was penalties. That absolutely killed us. Mistakes are going to be made but with that many penalties it just magnifies the missed throws, and bad decisions and missed coverage.

I thought fitz had one really, really bad moment. The pick at the end if the half. Can't do that. Keenum looked crisp, savage had a nice throw. Didn't really get to see much if the qb's. We ran the ba a bunch and we didn't have the ball long.

We need more talent on the back end. That just is what it is. D line looked solid. Run game was good. Pass rush from outside was poor from everyone not named clowney.

I would cut Mercilus and I'd be ok with cutting Harris if someone else had looked half way decent back there. Maybe Harris can be better at safety...I don't know. But that pass interference was just dumb.

Merciless, any of the guys we have can at least do what he did and some if them a but better. Wouldn't complain if we moved on from either or both.

I'd give keenum some first team looks just because he looks more talented than fitz, and as the veteran bus driver fitz can't make that throw he did to end the half. But I don't think fitz was awful overall. He made some nice throws and did some good things. Again...was hard to really see the offense because of the shitload of penalties.

On the team overall, I expect to see improvement as we go a long. Penalties have to get cut down though. Not sure what they'll do about the deep pass defense though. Maybe with Joseph it'll be better.

I'm not nearly as concerned as I was reading the thread yesterday though. Again, I think if we cut down in those penalties we'll look a lot better. I seriously don't think we had an offensive drive without multiple penalties. Defense and special teams weren't far behind.
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ok now that THAT is over....
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Overall, the Main things that I saw in the game was penalties. That absolutely killed us. Mistakes are going to be made but with that many penalties it just magnifies the missed throws, and bad decisions and missed coverage.

I thought fitz had one really, really bad moment. The pick at the end if the half. Can't do that. Keenum looked crisp, savage had a nice throw. Didn't really get to see much if the qb's. We ran the ba a bunch and we didn't have the ball long.

We need more talent on the back end. That just is what it is. D line looked solid. Run game was good. Pass rush from outside was poor from everyone not named clowney.

I would cut Mercilus and I'd be ok with cutting Harris if someone else had looked half way decent back there. Maybe Harris can be better at safety...I don't know. But that pass interference was just dumb.

Merciless, any of the guys we have can at least do what he did and some if them a but better. Wouldn't complain if we moved on from either or both.

I'd give keenum some first team looks just because he looks more talented than fitz, and as the veteran bus driver fitz can't make that throw he did to end the half. But I don't think fitz was awful overall. He made some nice throws and did some good things. Again...was hard to really see the offense because of the shitload of penalties.

On the team overall, I expect to see improvement as we go a long. Penalties have to get cut down though. Not sure what they'll do about the deep pass defense though. Maybe with Joseph it'll be better.

I'm not nearly as concerned as I was reading the thread yesterday though. Again, I think if we cut down in those penalties we'll look a lot better. I seriously don't think we had an offensive drive without multiple penalties. Defense and special teams weren't far behind.
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That pass would've been caught if #89 didn't give up on it. He quit on his route. Very obvious in the replay from midfield.

I'm not sure what to take away from this game on offense. Missing key starters, new offense, vanilla game plan, Arizona was throwing everything they had at the Texans. I'm really looking at game 3 before I do any serious judging.

I don't think the defense looked a damned bit different than last year's, with the exception of Clowney. Seriously.

I would take a look at Merci on ST's before I cut him. He might be a good fit there.
 
Lucky said:
I don't think Keenum or Savage got enough snaps to learn anything. Normally, starting QBs don't play the entire 1st half of the opening preseason game.
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I know Fitz took the entire first half...He played quite a bit more than what I would've expected.

Entire top was - Texans: 17:53 Cards: 42:07

That's not much time to work with. We didn't even average 5 mins a Quarter with the ball.

Penalties...Not a single third down conversion..

Where can I see just how many penalties were committed offensively...
 
DocBar said:
That pass would've been caught if #89 didn't give up on it. He quit on his route. Very obvious in the replay from midfield.
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I still don't like that pass. Too much traffic. Too risky all things considered. You are finally in the opponents territory...end of the half...haven't scored any points yet...

Fitz was feeling pressure, the receiver was in a crowd...

I'm not a fan of that decision.

If you don't have a lot to hang your hat on from a talent standpoint and you're supposed to be the heady vet that knows the offense, steadies the team...makes good decisions...

I don't want to see you take those chances. JMO.
 
People are still trying to defend and find the positives in "Fitzmagic" LOL

There is not enough hot sauce in the world to make that sh!t sandwich taste good.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
I still don't like that pass. Too much traffic. Too risky all things considered. You are finally in the opponents territory...end of the half...haven't scored any points yet...

Fitz was feeling pressure, the receiver was in a crowd...

I'm not a fan of that decision.

If you don't have a lot to hang your hat on from a talent standpoint and you're supposed to be the heady vet that knows the offense, steadies the team...makes good decisions...

I don't want to see you take those chances. JMO.
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If is a big word. A couple of very large "ifs" on that play.

Fitz is the "heady, can pick up offenses" guy, not the "heady, knows the offense guy". Not defending Fitz, but the pass was catchable and in the right place IF the WR had finished his route.
I'm watching TV replay, so I don't have a good idea of the other WR's, pass/scramble options for the whole play. All I know is the 2nd worst outcome that could happen did happen. That doesn't make it the wrong decision. Go back to last season's Matt Schaub and you'll see the wrong decisions. I didn't see that from the Texans QB's last night.

Keenum deserves a look at #1, though.
 
DocBar said:
If is a big word. A couple of very large "ifs" on that play.

Fitz is the "heady, can pick up offenses" guy, not the "heady, knows the offense guy". Not defending Fitz, but the pass was catchable and in the right place IF the WR had finished his route.
I'm watching TV replay, so I don't have a good idea of the other WR's, pass/scramble options for the whole play. All I know is the 2nd worst outcome that could happen did happen. That doesn't make it the wrong decision. Go back to last season's Matt Schaub and you'll see the wrong decisions. I didn't see that from the Texans QB's last night.

Keenum deserves a look at #1, though.
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Overall I don't think Fitz played as badly as a lot of people are saying. On his last drive he actually was playing well until that pick.

I also agree that I'd like to see Keenum get some snaps with the 1's. He looked more comfortable than he did last season. He actually played from within the pocket on the limited chances he got.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Next play, fitz buys time steps up, throws strik to Thomas. Good play.
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If you're talking about the one he side-armed, that's the only throw I saw all night with any zip on it. If he can get that kind of velocity on all his throws, he may be allright, but that stuff he was floating out there, he's going to throw a lot of picks.
 
Just out of curiosity, was I the only one that thought that the continuous number of back-to-back Watt commercials were somewhat over the top?
 
JCTexan said:
I was personally loving the "it's a new era in Houston Texans football" commercials while they were getting pummeled 32-0. :smiliepalm:
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I especially liked when O'brien would say "a new culture" and then it would go back to the game and you would see the 20+ to 0 score. Felt almost like the same culture to me.
 
I will wait until after the third game before I kick the boss's poodle.

Have to admit to my disappointment though.

Giving up first downs on third and long has become a Houston Texan trademark.


:coffee:
 
So I figured I'd watch the game again, with no bias, total objectivity. Guys on the radio (Koch & Braddock) said the left side of the line looked solid & I wanted to go back & watch just the OL.

That lasted all of two snaps.

Still, I get to the part where Cromartie catches a tipped ball. The Cards are on our 13 yard line & had to settle for a field goal... strange, I didn't remember a possession where we didn't allow a TD.

Funny thing though, no Swag, no Harris, no Kj, no Clowney, no Watt.

The Cards run the same play Palmer & Fitz scored on earlier, Clemons still completely asleep, with absolutely no idea what's going on around him. But Albert Mack has enough snap & quickness to recover from his outside position to dive in & knock the ball out of the receivers hands at the last minute.

The second play, the Cards just screwed up. Stanton has to hunt down the RB (more or less) to make him take the ball. Crick is able to get off his block & keep Taylor in the backfield long enough for the cavalry to come in. Chris Clemons gets the credit for the tackle.

Third down, Stanton has time to throw, Brown is wide open, but the ball sails, Keo feigns a tackle, we get lucky.

Nothing really to feel good about, just thought it was interesting that our first (& maybe only) "stop" came with no starters in the game... & I see very little difference between Keo & Swagg.
 
EllisUnit said:
I especially liked when O'brien would say "a new culture" and then it would go back to the game and you would see the 20+ to 0 score. Felt almost like the same culture to me.
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In what sense? I don't remember a single game, preseason or otherwise, as obviously lop-sided as this one.
I'm not ready to chuck the whole season, but this game was putrid. No point in sugar-coating it. I saw a visible lack of talent and some very confused football players. Almost like Wade was back coaching the defense. That defense looked exactly like Wade's. Piss poor pass rush and worse coverage behind it.
 
thunderkyss said:
So I figured I'd watch the game again, with no bias, total objectivity. Guys on the radio (Koch & Braddock) said the left side of the line looked solid & I wanted to go back & watch just the OL.

That lasted all of two snaps.

Still, I get to the part where Cromartie catches a tipped ball. The Cards are on our 13 yard line & had to settle for a field goal... strange, I didn't remember a possession where we didn't allow a TD.

Funny thing though, no Swag, no Harris, no Kj, no Clowney, no Watt.

The Cards run the same play Palmer & Fitz scored on earlier, Clemons still completely asleep, with absolutely no idea what's going on around him. But Albert Mack has enough snap & quickness to recover from his outside position to dive in & knock the ball out of the receivers hands at the last minute.

The second play, the Cards just screwed up. Stanton has to hunt down the RB (more or less) to make him take the ball. Crick is able to get off his block & keep Taylor in the backfield long enough for the cavalry to come in. Chris Clemons gets the credit for the tackle.

Third down, Stanton has time to throw, Brown is wide open, but the ball sails, Keo feigns a tackle, we get lucky.

Nothing really to feel good about, just thought it was interesting that our first (& maybe only) "stop" came with no starters in the game... & I see very little difference between Keo & Swagg.
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Im rewatching the game now...and we ran that 3 safety look more than a few times with lewis, clemons and swearinger on the first 2 drives ....it's become apparent that they want swag where he is; down in the box covering the short routes. However clemons and lewis.....most of those 3rd down conversions were b/c those guys were out of position and/or werent closing down gaps fast enough.

On the first TD, clemons jumped the wrong route giving up the inside help he was supposed to be giving harris...the 1st 3rd down conversion he gave up the over the top help he was supposed to be giving swag... The cbs and swag are expecting help and those guys are no where to be found and are late to the party every single time.
 
Mr teX said:
Im rewatching the game now...and we ran that 3 safety look more than a few times with lewis, clemons and swearinger on the first 2 drives ....it's become apparent that they want swag where he is; down in the box covering the short routes. However clemons and lewis.....most of those 3rd down conversions were b/c those guys were out of position and/or werent closing down gaps fast enough.
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It's like they have absolutely no anticipation. Part of facing the QB, they should be able to see when he loads up, anticipate when the ball will be released, then get into position to make a play, INT, PDef, or a tackle for little to no gain.

But these guys had no idea where the ball as until the receiver was running past them with the ball in their hands.
 
Mr teX said:
Im rewatching the game now...and we ran that 3 safety look more than a few times with lewis, clemons and swearinger on the first 2 drives ....it's become apparent that they want swag where he is; down in the box covering the short routes. However clemons and lewis.....most of those 3rd down conversions were b/c those guys were out of position and/or werent closing down gaps fast enough.

On the first TD, clemons jumped the wrong route giving up the inside help he was supposed to be giving harris...the 1st 3rd down conversion he gave up the over the top help he was supposed to be giving swag... The cbs and swag are expecting help and those guys are no where to be found and are late to the party every single time.
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I agree.

I mean I'm not sure what was supposed to be the coverage on that TD.
The Texans looked to be in zone, probably a 3-4.

i can't see any inclination of man coverage there.
If, and I think they were, in zone, the safety committed himself too soon.
 
76Texan said:
I agree.

I mean I'm not sure what was supposed to be the coverage on that TD.
The Texans looked to be in zone, probably a 3-4.

i can't see any inclination of man coverage there.
If, and I think they were, in zone, the safety committed himself too soon.
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During the broadcast there are really good end zone shots from the back of the defense on both the 1st 3rd down conversion and the 1st TD. I don't think there's any question they were in zone on the 1st 3rd down conversion. This is where you see Clemons drifting towards the single WR side on the left before coming over to help DJ late.

You sort of see the same thing on the 1st TD where Clemons and DJ both initially jump the TE coming across their faces but then try to get over late to Fitzgerald on the slant. The only difference here is that I think DJ was right in initially jumping the TE...those shallow drag/out types of routes are what he'd been covering the entire drive. Clemons however should've stayed put and squeezed down that window on Fitzgerald.

could the db's do a better job of jamming the WR's at the LOS? sure but if you've ever played in a zone coverage scheme you know that the biggest thing that makes or breaks it is trust. & if the db's can't trust that their help is going to be there it slows them down in terms of their reaction time and getting themselves into their position b/c they are constantly checking to make sure people are where they're supposed to be before they hand off the WR.

Also, the biggest thing i saw in this game was that the db's are watching the qb's eyes too much which is causing them to drift out of position instead of just staying put in their zones and localizing to the closest WR to them.

Ironically, Keo looked a bit better than either of those 2 did..
 
Mr teX said:
Im rewatching the game now...and we ran that 3 safety look more than a few times with lewis, clemons and swearinger on the first 2 drives ....it's become apparent that they want swag where he is; down in the box covering the short routes. However clemons and lewis.....most of those 3rd down conversions were b/c those guys were out of position and/or werent closing down gaps fast enough.

On the first TD, clemons jumped the wrong route giving up the inside help he was supposed to be giving harris...the 1st 3rd down conversion he gave up the over the top help he was supposed to be giving swag... The cbs and swag are expecting help and those guys are no where to be found and are late to the party every single time.
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That was the impression I got from watching the game.

No way to know for sure, but I think some people get a narrative and just run with it.


Too many absolutes when know one really knows what's going on with those coverages. Sometimes the players themselves aren't really sure/haven't got a good feel for what their 'help' is going to do. Some of this stuff comes with experience.
 
Put the film on, bro

Linebacker and safety pass discipline

If something hit me immediately on tape, it was the linebackers and safeties inability to force any of the Cardinals quarterbacks into difficult throws.
Case in point...

1st Quarter, 12:40 left

1st and Five, Ball on the Cardinals 45 yard line.



QB Carson Palmer faked a run into the line to his left. S D.J. Swearinger was hovering near the line of scrimmage to Palmer's right, the opposite side. Swearinger started forward, toward the line of scrimmage (LOS), even though he was on the backside of the play. He should've gotten a little depth first then moved toward the line of scrimmage.

Why? Because in getting up in the mix, he's too deep into the LOS just in case he has to redirect into pass coverage. Sure, play action is supposed to fool run defenders but with better discipline, safeties and linebackers can redirect back to their respective areas. Swearinger may have been in man coverage but his man blocked the edge, so he's free to help on crossers and shallow routes coming to his side.

Either way, Cardinals TE Rob Housler crossed the formation from the other side and ran into the void that was created when Swagg darted into the fray at the LOS. ILB Mike Mohamed was fooled too and all he could've done was collide with Housler anyway, but that would've helped. So Housler got a free release, ran past both inside linebackers and was seven yards deep with no one in sight. Swagg was now in no man's land but he eventually looked for the crossing route. Unfortunately, it was way too late. By the time the ball is thrown, Housler was wide open and down the sideline for a 40-yard gain. Trust me, Swearinger is being asked to do a lot in this defense, but better discipline could've potentially eliminated a wide open option.
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xtruroyaltyx said:
Overall I don't think Fitz played as badly as a lot of people are saying. On his last drive he actually was playing well until that pick.

I also agree that I'd like to see Keenum get some snaps with the 1's. He looked more comfortable than he did last season. He actually played from within the pocket on the limited chances he got.
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Other than that Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?

Sorry, that just gave me a chuckle.
 
DocBar said:
Put the film on, bro
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I know he's a rookie, but there was one play where Jadaveon attacked the running back with that quick first step, then realized he was supposed to be covering the TE.

It was pretty funny. One minute he's 4 yards into the backfield, then he turns around & starts sprinting for the end zone.

So yeah, there was a lot of confusion about who was supposed to do what.

I don't think the starting line-ups are set yet, & once they get that figured out, a lot of the confusion will solve itself.
 
thunderkyss said:
I know he's a rookie, but there was one play where Jadaveon attacked the running back with that quick first step, then realized he was supposed to be covering the TE.

It was pretty funny. One minute he's 4 yards into the backfield, then he turns around & starts sprinting for the end zone.

So yeah, there was a lot of confusion about who was supposed to do what.

I don't think the starting line-ups are set yet, & once they get that figured out, a lot of the confusion will solve itself.
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I was quite impressed with JDC. I was not a fan of the pick, but he's been everything you could want in a 1st rounder.

I though he did OK in coverage for his 1st time out against another team.
 
speedfreek said:
To think that 6 months
ago people were saying we could be a 10 win team just
reloading and with the easiest schedule in the NFL..
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I was saying that before Saturday... then it looked like OB was more invested in Fitzpatrick than I initially believed.
 
speedfreek said:
Wonder how long it takes before the mantra goes from
"it's just the first preseason game" to "well, it's just
the first year for a rebuilding team"

because that's where this is headed. To think that 6 months
ago people were saying we could be a 10 win team just
reloading and with the easiest schedule in the NFL..
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Man, you are Debbie Downer on steroids! Every single post you make these days is negative. I wonder what your viewpoint would be if the guy in your avatar had been retained as HC or DC? Maybe you're a little butt hurt and biased?

Personally, I have no real expectations for the season. I have dreams of 19-0 and nightmares of 0-16. I expect reality to be more in the middle.

Someone on here nailed it earlier: expect ugly wins early in the season and the team to gel as the season goes on. I'd probably rephrase that to ugly losses with a win or two thrown in.
:worldpeace:
 
Maybe just fire OB now...

Hopefully before pre-season is over we can find a coach that can kill it in one of these games.
 
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