Clowney, then what?

[TexansFTW]

Swearinger doesn't seem to think this will be a problem.

I remember just last year we had an influential ex teammate vouching for another guy because of their college days.

In that situation Andre was vouching for Ed Reed to get on the team. Well, Ed basically stole like $8.5 million from the Texans. It's OK though because I think Rick Smith is getting the money back for McNair by stealing it from his truck $50K at a time.

I do hear you though, it's just this is my first thought that came to mind.

 

[steelbtexan]

With their history of absolute failure in that department .... are you really comfortable with them making that decision ?!?

Just too damn many questions come along with Clowney IMO .... health , motor , lack of tangible production (3 sacks).


Just listen to #80 .... trade the damn pick.

I would be all for trading the pick if the price is right.

I look at his 2012 production/play more than his 2013 play.

This is all a moot point. Manziel is going to be the pick. He's already hob nobing around with Cal/Rick. Manziel is a really smart guy.

 

[Corrosion]

I would be all for trading the pick if the price is right.

I look at his 2012 production/play more than his 2013 play.

This is all a moot point. Manziel is going to be the pick. He's already hob nobing around with Cal/Rick. Manziel is a really smart guy.

Id much rather gamble on a QB than any other position simply because of the impact a truly elite QB can have upon a franchise. Get it right with a QB and you are in the playoffs for the next decade , get it right with a DE .... and you have a solid defense for the next 5 years. No QB .... No playoffs , no shot at a

Get it wrong with either .... and we do it again next year.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Back in mid December 2013, I posted this.

Clowney has been dealing with the bone spur(s) of his foot since high school. He also missed time for this problem last season and this season, he has played lame. We don't know if it is a single spur or multiple spurs....if it is a heel spur or ankle spur. If it is an isolated spur, surgery may cure him. If multiple spurs, as chronic as it has been, it could very well be a reflection of significant arthritic changes. Unfortunately, like usual, we have little information to work with. One thing I can pretty well tell you is that if he has surgery after the season, he won't be at the Combine, and teams will likely have to make a decision on what they've seen so far. He should be ready to go for the 2014 season no matter was his pathology is. His performance will be dictated by the extent of the pathology that required attention. I don't like the fact that this has been a chronic problem already.......in a very young player.........a pass rusher that needs no compromise of any type with his ability to push off.

Now Clowney has announced that he has chosen to forgo surgery, not only before the Combine, but also afterwards (unless his new team tells him to undergo it)

Many foot bone spurs are totally asymptomatic. Ten % of the general population would be found to have foot bone spurs incidentally on MRI and never know it. Only 5% of bone spur problems cannot be handled nonsurgically. It is important to understand that the most common foot bone spurs are heel spurs. These bone spurs are not primary growths, they are secondary outgrowths in inflammatory response to repetitive/overuse/chronic trauma of tendons, ligaments, plantar fascia and/or a reflection of underlying progressive arthritis. Heel bone spurs specifically usually are part of a plantar fasciitis or Achilles tendinitis inflammatory source. The 5% that are even considered for surgical treatment (as in the case of Clowney), suffer from continuous unrelenting pain and/or tenderness. The surgery must not only address the spur itself, but it must be able to successfully address the cause of the bone spur formation (by not only removing the bone spur, but also releasing the plantar fascia, releasing pressure on the small nerves in the area, etc.). If the source(s) are not even addressed or cannot be corrected/controlled, a long-term, potential debility may be in the cards.

I like Clowney. But I question his decision not to have surgery immediately after the close of last season. I have no doubt that if serious recommendation was made for surgical intervention, as it was, that this was very likely a significant contributor to the probable false impression he was "taking off plays throughout last season.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Although small bone spurs may be found anywhere in the foot,

the most troublesome are a result of plantar fasciitis

or a result of achilles tendinosis/tendinitis

 

[Playoffs]

...But I question his decision not to have surgery immediately after the close of last season. I have no doubt that if serious recommendation was made for surgical intervention, as it was, that this was very likely a significant contributor to the probable false impression he was "taking off plays throughout last season.

If he has surgery after the draft, how long until he's good to practice/play?

 

[steelbtexan]

Id much rather gamble on a QB than any other position simply because of the impact a truly elite QB can have upon a franchise. Get it right with a QB and you are in the playoffs for the next decade , get it right with a DE .... and you have a solid defense for the next 5 years. No QB .... No playoffs , no shot at a

Get it wrong with either .... and we do it again next year.

If there was a QB worth gambling on at 1-1 I would be in agreement with you. I would rather gamble on a Garappolo at 2-1 than any of the top 3 at 1-1. There's not much difference between them. IMHO

 

[pirbroke]

Draft Clowney, then we win.

 

[thunderkyss]

Id much rather gamble on a QB than any other position simply because of the impact a truly elite QB can have upon a franchise. Get it right with a QB and you are in the playoffs for the next decade , get it right with a DE .... and you have a solid defense for the next 5 years. No QB .... No playoffs , no shot at a

Get it wrong with either .... and we do it again next year.

How long have the Cowboys been trying to figure out if Romo is the right guy? His numbers are right there with the elite guys. But he hasn't been to anymore play-off games than Matt Schaub.

 

[infantrycak]

How long have the Cowboys been trying to figure out if Romo is the right guy? His numbers are right there with the elite guys. But he hasn't been to anymore play-off games than Matt Schaub.

To the contrary, the Cowboys haven't been trying to figure that out at all. They have been very dedicated to him. They just gave him a new contract which essentially means he will retire a Cowboy.

But what was the point you were trying to make?

 

[thunderkyss]

If there was a QB worth gambling on at 1-1 I would be in agreement with you. I would rather gamble on a Garappolo at 2-1 than any of the top 3 at 1-1. There's not much difference between them. IMHO

Agreed. Too many QBs will be available at 2-1 to be worried about missing out on Bridgewater, Manziel, Bortles, & Carr. Those guys will probably be fine QBs in the league for years to come. But so will Murray, so will Metenberger, so will Fales.

Then there are the guys you can/might gamble on... Garropolo, Boyd, Morris, Smith, Shaw, Matthews, Renner, Thomas.

This is a great QB draft in terms of quantity. No elites, but several good quality prospects.

 

[thunderkyss]

To the contrary, the Cowboys haven't been trying to figure that out at all. They have been very dedicated to him. They just gave him a new contract which essentially means he will retire a Cowboy.

But what was the point you were trying to make?

Well, let's see. Corrosion said, "If you've got a QB, you're in the play-offs for the next 10 years with a chance to win the Lombardy every year. Just having a great defense doesn't even get you to the play-offs."

Then I said, "What about the Cowboys & Romo. How long have they been messing with him? He hasn't been to the play-offs any more than Schaub."

Maybe I meant that Romo doesn't like Chinese food in January.

 

[infantrycak]

Agreed. Too many QBs will be available at 2-1 to be worried about missing out on Bridgewater, Manziel, Bortles, & Carr. Those guys will probably be fine QBs in the league for years to come. But so will Murray, so will Metenberger, so will Fales.

Then there are the guys you can/might gamble on... Garropolo, Boyd, Morris, Smith, Shaw, Matthews, Renner, Thomas.

This is a great QB draft in terms of quantity. No elites, but several good quality prospects.

This all the QBs are equal stuff is bunk. Please show me the draft class that produced 7 just fine QBs much less you left off your boy so make that at least 8.

 

[thunderkyss]

This all the QBs are equal stuff is bunk. Please show me the draft class that produced 7 just fine QBs much less you left off your boy so make that at least 8.

Most likely only 4 of the 8 will be considered a quality starter. Maybe only 3 of the 8. But I don't know which 3, or 4. & even though "every body else" has Carr & Bortles up there in the first, as one of the "quality prospects" I don't. I only mention them to be polite. So that 8 is only 6.

Maybe all 6 make it, but I doubt it.

 

[infantrycak]

Then I said, "What about the Cowboys & Romo. How long have they been messing with him? He hasn't been to the play-offs any more than Schaub."

The Cowboys have 0 losing seasons where Romo was the starter for the majority of the season, i.e. they have been in the playoff picture to the end every year. And he has been to the play-offs 1 more time.

 

[Corrosion]

If there was a QB worth gambling on at 1-1 I would be in agreement with you. I would rather gamble on a Garappolo at 2-1 than any of the top 3 at 1-1. There's not much difference between them. IMHO

I do think there is a pretty significant difference between Manziel & Bridgewater and all the rest. Those two have special skills that the rest of the QB's in this draft just don't have which cant be taught nor learned.

Those guys don't come without questions of their own .... but they are far less significant than the questions Clowney comes with.

How long have the Cowboys been trying to figure out if Romo is the right guy? His numbers are right there with the elite guys. But he hasn't been to anymore play-off games than Matt Schaub.

With Dallas the problem isn't Romo .... Its Jerrah.

They don't have a coach , they have a yes man.

They don't have a GM , they have an owner playing Madden .... in real life.


Romo has been set up to fail from day one.

 

[IDEXAN]

Well, let's see. Corrosion said, "If you've got a QB, you're in the play-offs for the next 10 years with a chance to win the Lombardy every year. Just having a great defense doesn't even get you to the play-offs."

It's pretty obvious that right now the 2 best teams in the NFL are the Seahawks and the 49ers, and they are comparable teams in that they both have tremendous defense while their QBs, though certainly effective, aren't
rated among the NFLs best. So I'd have to say that Corrosion's view is invalid.

Then I said, "What about the Cowboys & Romo. How long have they been messing with him? He hasn't been to the play-offs any more than Schaub."

I'm a Romo fan, but I think Jerry is gonna have to retool in N.texas very soon which will probably include replacing the soon to be mid-thirties Romo. Actually I think Manzeil and the Cowboys would be a good match, maybe Jerry can trade up this year again.

 

[Corrosion]

It's pretty obvious that right now the 2 best teams in the NFL are the Seahawks and the 49ers, and they are comparable teams in that they both have tremendous defense while their QBs, though certainly effective, aren't
rated among the NFLs best. So I'd have to say that Corrosion's view is invalid.

You are looking at a very narrow band of time .... Take a look at the last decade or two instead. I think my point is validated over time.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

If he has surgery after the draft, how long until he's good to practice/play?

It really depends on what the underlying pathology is and what surgery is required...............could (legitimately) be anywhere from 6-10 weeks to walk comfortably and anywhere from 12 to 16 weeks before a full return to play, if the surgery is successful. Chronic pain can still limit production, and there can be about a 15% failure and/or recurrence rate.

 

[leebigeztx]

I would be all for trading the pick if the price is right.

I look at his 2012 production/play more than his 2013 play.

This is all a moot point. Manziel is going to be the pick. He's already hob nobing around with Cal/Rick. Manziel is a really smart guy.

I posted a link to his 4 sack game in 2012. I would like you to tell me what do you see even in the 4 sack game.

 

[infantrycak]

It's pretty obvious that right now the 2 best teams in the NFL are the Seahawks and the 49ers, and they are comparable teams in that they both have tremendous defense while their QBs, though certainly effective, aren't
rated among the NFLs best. So I'd have to say that Corrosion's view is invalid.

LOL now that is selling a storyline. Russell Wilson's 1st two seasons have both been over 100 QB rating. Find another example of that. Kaep's 93.8 on his two seasons. That doesn't take into account the rushing they have added. You are way, way underselling the value of those two.

 

[IDEXAN]

LOL now that is selling a storyline. Russell Wilson's 1st two seasons have both been over 100 QB rating. Find another example of that. Kaep's 93.8 on his two seasons. That doesn't take into account the rushing they have added. You are way, way underselling the value of those two.

Russell's a third round pick and therefor there's no reason for us to waste the top pick on this Draft when we can use our second or third on a QB and still get one of the best defensive prospects in the Draft in a generation which would give us a big step up towards establishing a top defense.
This Draft is littered with good QB prospects in the later part of the first round and second round so there's no point in "overpaying" for a smart azz little runt who's game won't make it in the NFL. Truth is I maybe see Manziel
competing against Vince Young in the Canadian league in a couple years.

 

[steelbtexan]

I posted a link to his 4 sack game in 2012. I would like you to tell me what do you see even in the 4 sack game.

Cant find the post with the link.

 

[IDEXAN]

You are looking at a very narrow band of time .... Take a look at the last decade or two instead. I think my point is validated over time.

Don't take it personal Corrosion, but I think you are mistaken here because the model for success in this league for now and in the future is in San Fran and the Pac NW.

 

[infantrycak]

Russell's a third round pick and therefor there's no reason for us to waste the top pick on this Draft when we can use our second or third on a QB

You ever heard "the exception proves the rule?" You don't get it.

Russell proves nothing other than it is exceptional to be able to get top end performance out of a 3rd round QB.

But if you are going to play that silly game it still doesn't work because the exceptions are more abundant for DEs.

Michael Strahan - 2nd
Jared Allen - 4th
Robert Mathis - 5th
Elvis Dumervil - 4th
Charles Haley - 4th

 

[The Pencil Neck]

You ever heard "the exception proves the rule?" You don't get it.

Russell proves nothing other than it is exceptional to be able to get top end performance out of a 3rd round QB.

But if you are going to play that silly game it still doesn't work because the exceptions are more abundant for DEs.

Michael Strahan - 2nd
Jared Allen - 4th
Robert Mathis - 5th
Elvis Dumervil - 4th
Charles Haley - 4th

This is why I hate the "this guy's not worth being taken at 1-1" mindset.

In 2006, our options were Reggie Bush, Matt Leinart, Vince Young, and Mario Williams. D'Brickashaw Ferguson would have been acceptable but surprising in that spot.

Most people agree that we made the "right choice" with Mario Williams.

But did we?

If you look at QB's from that draft, Jay Cutler has easily been the most productive. If we had taken him at 1-1, people would have freaked out.

In terms of pure productivity, we should have taken Jahri Evans (4th round, pick 108). He's been All Pro 4 years and to the Pro Bowl for 5. Other guys that we should have taken would have been Nick Mangold (1st round, pick 29), Brandon Marshall (4th round, pick 119), or Haloti Ngata (1st round, pick 12). Or even Maurice Jones-Drew (2nd round, pick 60)! In terms of leadership, we would have been better off taken Demeco Ryans with our first pick.

You've got to look at it in terms of... which pick is going to do the most to improve our team. Is Clowney going to make our team that much better?

I don't think so. You look at teams who've put together great defensive lines and many of them haven't ended up doing all that much. How many Super Bowls did the Purple People Eaters win? 0. How many championships did the Fearsome Foursome win? 0. How much has Jared Allen helped the Minnesota Vikings? How much has having a bunch of great players on the line helped the Lions?

If we go Clowney, I won't be expecting a lot except mediocrity unless they can make some draft picks later in the draft that will contribute more to our success. They'll have to pull a Tom Brady or Russell Wilson out of thin air.

 

[Lucky]

If there was a QB worth gambling on at 1-1 I would be in agreement with you. I would rather gamble on a Garappolo at 2-1 than any of the top 3 at 1-1. There's not much difference between them. IMHO

The problem is, how do you know Garoppolo will be there at 2-1? The only draft position that the Texans know for sure who will be there is 1-1.

 

[beerlover]

The problem is, how do you know Garoppolo will be there at 2-1? The only draft position that the Texans know for sure who will be there is 1-1.

Pretty easy solution, take BPA. Go for best available QB next pick or specifically target one to either move up or back. Not like a team is locked into a slot, always takers, movers & shakers.

 

[steelbtexan]

This is why I hate the "this guy's not worth being taken at 1-1" mindset.

In 2006, our options were Reggie Bush, Matt Leinart, Vince Young, and Mario Williams. D'Brickashaw Ferguson would have been acceptable but surprising in that spot.

Most people agree that we made the "right choice" with Mario Williams.

But did we?

If you look at QB's from that draft, Jay Cutler has easily been the most productive. If we had taken him at 1-1, people would have freaked out.

In terms of pure productivity, we should have taken Jahri Evans (4th round, pick 108). He's been All Pro 4 years and to the Pro Bowl for 5. Other guys that we should have taken would have been Nick Mangold (1st round, pick 29), Brandon Marshall (4th round, pick 119), or Haloti Ngata (1st round, pick 12). Or even Maurice Jones-Drew (2nd round, pick 60)! In terms of leadership, we would have been better off taken Demeco Ryans with our first pick.

You've got to look at it in terms of... which pick is going to do the most to improve our team. Is Clowney going to make our team that much better?

I don't think so. You look at teams who've put together great defensive lines and many of them haven't ended up doing all that much. How many Super Bowls did the Purple People Eaters win? 0. How many championships did the Fearsome Foursome win? 0. How much has Jared Allen helped the Minnesota Vikings? How much has having a bunch of great players on the line helped the Lions?

If we go Clowney, I won't be expecting a lot except mediocrity unless they can make some draft picks later in the draft that will contribute more to our success. They'll have to pull a Tom Brady or Russell Wilson out of thin air.

The Steelers Joe Greene DL was pretty good

Raiders Howie Long DL, Not bad

49ers Micheal Carter Haley DL could play a little.

Oilers Culp/Bethea yep

 

[steelbtexan]

The problem is, how do you know Garoppolo will be there at 2-1? The only draft position that the Texans know for sure who will be there is 1-1.

If after the combine/pro days if you think he might be picked in the 25/32 range then you trade up and pick him. Most mocks I've seen have him going in the 3rd. Although that could be because draftniks haven't seen him play.

Garoppolo reminds me of Romo.

 

[Lucky]

If after the combine/pro days you think he might be picked in the 25/32 range then you trade up and pick him.

You say that, but there's nothing that forces a team to trade with you. If you're going to pass on a QB at 1-1, you have to be confident that there will be enough depth at the position where there is likely someone at 2-1. I guess my point is, that there is a gamble either way you look at it.

 

[steelbtexan]

You say that, but there's nothing that forces a team to trade with you. If you're going to pass on a QB at 1-1, you have to be confident that there will be enough depth at the position where there is likely someone at 2-1. I guess my point is, that there is a gamble either way you look at it.

Agreed, I'm a risk taker at heart.

The Pats would be a possible trade partner.

They probably will be looking at TE's ASJ or Amaro will probably be there at 33.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

The Steelers Joe Greene DL was pretty good

Raiders Howie Long DL, Not bad

49ers Micheal Carter Haley DL could play a little.

Oilers Culp/Bethea yep

How many SBs did Culp and Bethea win together? 0? Howie Long was a 2nd round pick and he played on a team that won 1 SB? You're making my point for me.

My point is that having one or two great players on your defensive line doesn't mean you're going to have a good team. That doesn't mean that some good teams don't have a great defensive line (like the Steel Curtain.)

For all his talent, Clowney may or may not turn out to be anything special. Even if he turns out to be an absolute monster, that one piece is not going to go very far in turning us around.

 

[infantrycak]

You say that, but there's nothing that forces a team to trade with you. If you're going to pass on a QB at 1-1, you have to be confident that there will be enough depth at the position where there is likely someone at 2-1. I guess my point is, that there is a gamble either way you look at it.

The other thing is steelb has been saying the Texans need a minimum of 3-4 starters out of their top 4 picks. You are working at cross purposes to spend 2 of those on one guy. It's an option but they aren't consistent approaches.

 

[Texian]

You say that, but there's nothing that forces a team to trade with you. If you're going to pass on a QB at 1-1, you have to be confident that there will be enough depth at the position where there is likely someone at 2-1. I guess my point is, that there is a gamble either way you look at it.

Agree, if you pass or trade back there is a high probability you miss out. QB is the most important position on every team. If your team does not have a playoff caliber QB on the roster, IMHO, you really should want to draft the very best QB in the draft. That is the very best way to counter Andrew Luck twice a year. Clowney is not going to beat Luck twice a year just like Mario couldn't beat Peyton Manning. A good QB has a much better chance of neutralizing Luck.

 

[IDEXAN]

You ever heard "the exception proves the rule?" You don't get it.

Russell proves nothing other than it is exceptional to be able to get top end performance out of a 3rd round QB.

But if you are going to play that silly game it still doesn't work because the exceptions are more abundant for DEs.

Michael Strahan - 2nd
Jared Allen - 4th
Robert Mathis - 5th
Elvis Dumervil - 4th
Charles Haley - 4th

You're overcomplicating this so listen up: Texans screwed it up when they took a QB with their 1.1 instead of Peppers in '02, but then learned their lesson and got it right when they chose DE Mario with their 1.1 in '06. 'Nuff said.

 

[Texian]

You're overcomplicating this so listen up: Texans screwed it up when they took a QB with their 1.1 instead of Peppers in '02, but then learned their lesson and got it right when they chose DE Mario with their 1.1 in '06. 'Nuff said.

who is this Nuff fellow?

 

[Texecutioner]

You're overcomplicating this so listen up: Texans screwed it up when they took a QB with their 1.1 instead of Peppers in '02, but then learned their lesson and got it right when they chose DE Mario with their 1.1 in '06. 'Nuff said.

Your little hind sight history revision means absolutely nothing. Mario was practically a bust here and was never a constant pass rushing threat. The Texans were pretty awful with him for years and pretty much irrelevant. There was nothing learned from not getting Peppers. There was nothing learned by getting Mario either. As Pencil Neck pointed out, you have a build an entire team and entire line. One great pass rusher isn't going to solve anything. How you could continue saying that crap when we all just witnessed a 2-14 team with Watt on this Dline is beyond rationality honestly. You just witnessed how silly that notion is. The Texans were garbage because they had a terrible O line and Carr. There is no underlying lesson in any of those situations. And at the end of the day this whole conversation is surrounding one of the most over hyped lazy asses coming out of college history that managed 4 sacks last season. It damn sure isn't surrounding a player that is anything like Julius Peppers.

 

[Uncle Rico]

I find it funny that at the time of the teams inception EVERYONE was saying how great a QB Carr would be, "he had all the tools, the gun, the legs, he can throw a ball into a trash can in the corner of the endzone from 40 yards a way for petes sake!!" a no brainer.

Now, all these years later people ridicule the move and make it seem like it was a stupid decision by the franchise. Hindsight right? Peppers did turn out to be the better pro. How many rings did he win by the way? Carr is the one who's had the last laugh if you ask me.

 

[IDEXAN]

Your little hind sight history revision means absolutely nothing. Mario was practically a bust here and was never a constant pass rushing threat. The Texans were pretty awful with him for years and pretty much irrelevant. There was nothing learned from not getting Peppers. There was nothing learned by getting Mario either. As Pencil Neck pointed out, you have a build an entire team and entire line. One great pass rusher isn't going to solve anything. How you could continue saying that crap when we all just witnessed a 2-14 team with Watt on this Dline is beyond rationality honestly. You just witnessed how silly that notion is. The Texans were garbage because they had a terrible O line and Carr. There is no underlying lesson in any of those situations. And at the end of the day this whole conversation is surrounding one of the most over hyped lazy asses coming out of college history that managed 4 sacks last season. It damn sure isn't surrounding a player that is anything like Julius Peppers.

#16 Mario Williams
Total earnings: $33.2 million
Salary/winnings: $32.9 million
Endorsements: $250,000

Williams signed a $100 million, six-year free agent deal with the Buffalo Bills in March that includes $50 million in guaranteed money. The Houston Texans controversially chose Williams ahead of Reggie Bush with the number one overall draft pick in 2006, but Williams thrived in Texas with 53 sacks and two Pro Bowl appearances in six years.
http://www.forbes.com/pictures/mli45igdi/16-mario-williams/
****
THE 100 MILLION DOLLAR BUST, RIGHT ?

 

[infantrycak]

I find it funny that at the time of the teams inception EVERYONE was saying how great a QB Carr would be, "he had all the tools, the gun, the legs, he can throw a ball into a trash can in the corner of the endzone from 40 yards a way for petes sake!!" a no brainer.

Now, all these years later people ridicule the move and make it seem like it was a stupid decision by the franchise. Hindsight right? Peppers did turn out to be the better pro. How many rings did he win by the way? Carr is the one who's had the last laugh if you ask me.

You might be able to make that argument some places. Not here. The debate over Carr and Peppers was epic.

 

[Texecutioner]

Carr is the one who's had the last laugh if you ask me.

Nomination for most ridiculous post of the year for sure.

 

[Texecutioner]

#16 Mario Williams
Total earnings: $33.2 million
Salary/winnings: $32.9 million
Endorsements: $250,000

Williams signed a $100 million, six-year free agent deal with the Buffalo Bills in March that includes $50 million in guaranteed money. The Houston Texans controversially chose Williams ahead of Reggie Bush with the number one overall draft pick in 2006, but Williams thrived in Texas with 53 sacks and two Pro Bowl appearances in six years.
http://www.forbes.com/pictures/mli45igdi/16-mario-williams/
****
THE 100 MILLION DOLLAR BUST, RIGHT ?

YOu post one of the dumbest contracts in NFL history by one of the top 3 dumbest franchises in the NFL and you think that you somehow made a point? Lol!


Go back to the drawing board. Mario Williams hasn't done squat to make the Bills a winner. That team is still a mess and that contract they gave him was horribly stupid. It will detract them from being able to add plenty of pieces they'll need in the future as well. Not that Mario won't be cut several years before it's over any way.

 

[Texecutioner]

You might be able to make that argument some places. Not here. The debate over Carr and Peppers was epic.

Carr will down as one of the worst busts in NFL history and Peppers will probably be elected into the HOF. Yet somehow this same guy who gets off on saying radical statements in here for post responses says that Carr got the last laugh. I can smell a troll from miles away with an argument like that.

 

[Uncle Rico]

Funnier to try and be insulted by a foul mouth, whiskey induced poster 'from the inner ring' ... maybe around here in this round table of the best Texans fan posters in the galaxy was the Peppers vs Carr debate epic and two sided.

In the real world the Texans made the smart move. Didnt pan out, not so much for Carrs inability, if not for Capers turning him into a crash dummy.

Last laugh = 1 or 2 rings is it?

But for some hall of fame accolade trumps a championship, I have a good idea which potty mouthed good ol boy around here was in Peppers' camp.

"mr I dont care what Andre Johnson says, thinks or does, Im Texan fan #1 and the only thing i care about is wins, I mean going to hall of fame, I mean ... LMAO.

 

[Texecutioner]

Funnier to try and be insulted by a foul mouth, whiskey induced poster 'from the inner ring' ... maybe around here in this round table of the best Texans fan posters in the galaxy was the Peppers vs Carr debate epic and two sided.

In the real world the Texans made the smart move. Didnt pan out, not so much for Carrs inability, if not for Capers turning him into a crash dummy.

Last laugh = 1 or 2 rings is it?

But for some hall of fame accolade trumps a championship, I have a good idea which potty mouthed good ol boy around here was in Peppers' camp.

"mr I dont care what Andre Johnson says, thinks or does, Im Texan fan #1 and the only thing i care about is wins, I mean going to hall of fame, I mean ... LMAO.

Do you honestly think that being a troll makes you relevant? Suggesting that a career back up that got ran out of town and never challenged for a starting position ever in his career ever again somehow equating to getting the last laugh over a guy who was a complete stud defensive player of the year and a guy who actually played in a SB is just troll material. That's what you are good for. You like writing stuff like this to get responses. You got one now. Pat yourself on the back.

 

[steelbtexan]

The other thing is steelb has been saying the Texans need a minimum of 3-4 starters out of their top 4 picks. You are working at cross purposes to spend 2 of those on one guy. It's an option but they aren't consistent approaches.

If they like Garappolo and trade back into the bottom of rd 1 to take him you would likely have to trade rd 2/3rd rd picks to get him. I believe if you do your homework you can find a std at 4-1. Or you could trade back into the 3rd by trading 4/5th rd picks to get the player you want in the 3rd.

You could also trade a 2015 2nd for a 2014 3rd. Which is what I would try to do since this draft is so deep in talent. That way you could have a draft that you could add the 3/4 players that you covet in this yrs draft and all it would really require would probably be a 2014 5th and a 2015 2nd.

Rd.1 Clowney
Rd. 1. Garoppolo
Rd.3. James
Rd.4 Ellis

Example: That's 4 players that would really help this team immediately. Will Rick do something like this? Not a chance.

 

[IDEXAN]

YOu post one of the dumbest contracts in NFL history by one of the top 3 dumbest franchises in the NFL and you think that you somehow made a point? Lol!


Go back to the drawing board. Mario Williams hasn't done squat to make the Bills a winner. That team is still a mess and that contract they gave him was horribly stupid. It will detract them from being able to add plenty of pieces they'll need in the future as well. Not that Mario won't be cut several years before it's over any way.

You may think it's "one of the dumbest contracts in NFL history", but it's what Mario got in an open market for his services from a buyer ready, willing, and able to pay for said services. Money talks.

 

[Texecutioner]

You may think it's "one of the dumbest contracts in NFL history", but it's what Mario got in an open market for his services from a buyer ready, willing, and able to pay for said services. Money talks.

The entire point being made earlier was that one guy on a D line isn't going to make or break any team. A great QB can and will. Mario was never a great Dlineman. He was never in the runnings for defensive players of the year. He was often injured, lacked explosiveness on a consistent basis, and disappeared a lot. The Texans sure as hell weren't going to pay him that kind of money and that right there is pretty alarming considering the fact that the Texans will lock guys up who deserve it. No one even questions if they will lock up Watt and he is everything Mario never could be. And even with Watt the Texans went 2-14 this season. Clowney is a guy who wasn't even an impact player this season when all eyes were on him to perform. That is a perfect example of a guy who will disappoint when the big moments are there.

 

[steelbtexan]

Agree, if you pass or trade back there is a high probability you miss out. QB is the most important position on every team. If your team does not have a playoff caliber QB on the roster, IMHO, you really should want to draft the very best QB in the draft. That is the very best way to counter Andrew Luck twice a year. Clowney is not going to beat Luck twice a year just like Mario couldn't beat Peyton Manning. A good QB has a much better chance of neutralizing Luck.

If there was only a QB in this draft like the one you're describing.