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State of the O-line

steelbtexan said:
Nothing at all to do with a QB struggling to learn and the QB being inaccurate. But you're right, BOB should go away from his offense and run Watson's college offense unil he gets hurt so this will shorten the learning curve.
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Didn’t Texans hire a QB guru, Carl Smith?

Mechanics are off, maybe Watson is hurt and trying to play through it?

Play-calling should be on new OC Tim Kelly. It’s still O’Brian’s offense but he’s not making the calls but Kelly.

Pumped picks and dollars into the OL. Same results.

Watson is getting hit well after the ball is out and not one single roughing the passer is called. This adds a toll to make clear headed decisions allowing doubt and anxiety to creep in.

Compounding all this is a head coach who is unable to adjust and adapt to other teams figuring out O’Brian’s game plan, making it easier to tee off pressure on Watson.

:deadhorse
 
He looked exactly the same to me early last year when we all excused it as him still getting over his ACL and then later the rib/lung injury.

IDK but it could be that doubt creeps in if you take away his option to run.

He isnt seeing his hot routes at all and it causing difficulty.

I know Hopkins and Fuller both had the dropsies in previous games so maybe a little uncertainty creeps in on the 2 long bombs he missed on?

I have no faith that OB will get canned anyway, he's played worse than this with fewer excuses lined up in previous years.
 
welsh texan said:
He isn't seeing his hot routes at all and it causing difficulty.
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He's not seeing them because he's not looking for them early enough. He's always looking for a big play. Then they get behind on down and distance and the defense cranks up the pressure and he cant get thru the first two before he's running for his life. He's making that bad OL worse by putting them behind in down and distance so often.

He's got to learn when to take those risks and when to take the easy 5 yards and move on to the next play.

Most are complaining about OB , today , other than one bad play , it wasn't on him. Watson was just bad. Didn't see openings and threw poor balls on others.


I have no faith that OB will get canned anyway, he's played worse than this with fewer excuses lined up in previous years.
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I have no faith that OB will get canned either …. we're stuck with him for another year at the least.
 
steelbtexan said:
Not defending BOB at all,he called a terrible game. But Watson has a bad case of happy feet. How do you get that out of him?
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Get the man an OL, OL Coach who can actually coach, and a HC who can actually script an NFL gameplan with the cognizant understanding that he may need to make an in-game adjustment to his prized gameplan.

OB may find himself being viewed as a true villain in Houston if he somehow destroys Watson before his Club Option season. I'm not trying to hate on OB just for the sake of hating on him, but damn he hasn't done anything to advance the overall play of the Texans in his 6 seasons at the helm. His personnel decisions, gameplans, and game management skills or lack thereof have befuddled even the most novice of football fans.
 
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Thorn said:
Maybe if he wasn't leading the league in getting sacked for the 2nd year in a row he wouldn't be picking up bad habits.
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If it walks like David Carr, tipity taps his feet like David Carr, and gets hit like David Carr........then it must be the David Carr saga being relived once again by the Texans organization who will have crushed the NFL hopes of not one but two NFL Franchise QB's in their short 17 year existence.
 
steelbtexan said:
If he's inaccurate and slow processing that's not a coaching issue. But BOB did call a terrible game today. 23 pts in 2 home games. Just flat out terrible. Just start running Watson's college offense until he gets hurt is my answer, since apparently he cant run a pro offense and you're right if BOB doesn't do this it's on the coaching.
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Steelbtexan, you and I see a lot of things on the same field but I have no idea at this juncture of Watson's NFL career if he can or cannot run an NFL offense. OB's been here far longer than Watson and he's yet to develop a single QB into a viable QB who looks like they could run an NFL offense.......OB's NFL offense.

OB is blowing through QB's like someone who drank the water in Mexico would toilet paper. His inability to establish a viable NFL offense has been glaring. His inability to identify the fact that he's never built a successful NFL OL is screaming from the highest mountain tops b/c he cannot or will not find an OL Coach who is competent. Bottom line, he hasn't figured out this NFL HC'ing gig and now he wants to wear the GM hat as well while still running the offense as the de facto OC. OB has never surrounded himself with the best possible coaches.....Crennel wasn't his choice but the organizations so he cannot even claim this one morsel of possible upside. OB comes off as a man who always wants to be the smartest guy in the room and will micromanage the crap out of people to ensure they never forget who the smartest guy in the room is.

It's simply time for the Texans to cut ties with OB and hire a top notch front office and let them bring in a new HC and staff.
 
welsh texan said:
He looked exactly the same to me early last year when we all excused it as him still getting over his ACL and then later the rib/lung injury.

IDK but it could be that doubt creeps in if you take away his option to run.

He isnt seeing his hot routes at all and it causing difficulty.

I know Hopkins and Fuller both had the dropsies in previous games so maybe a little uncertainty creeps in on the 2 long bombs he missed on?

I have no faith that OB will get canned anyway, he's played worse than this with fewer excuses lined up in previous years.
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Note to OB.....typical NFL Hot Routes do not occur 20+ yards downfield.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Steelbtexan, you and I see a lot of things on the same field but I have no idea at this juncture of Watson's NFL career if he can or cannot run an NFL offense. OB's been here far longer than Watson and he's yet to develop a single QB into a viable QB who looks like they could run an NFL offense.......OB's NFL offense.

OB is blowing through QB's like someone who drank the water in Mexico would toilet paper. His inability to establish a viable NFL offense has been glaring. His inability to identify the fact that he's never built a successful NFL OL is screaming from the highest mountain tops b/c he cannot or will not find an OL Coach who is competent. Bottom line, he hasn't figured out this NFL HC'ing gig and now he wants to wear the GM hat as well while still running the offense as the de facto OC. OB has never surrounded himself with the best possible coaches.....Crennel wasn't his choice but the organizations so he cannot even claim this one morsel of possible upside. OB comes off as a man who always wants to be the smartest guy in the room and will micromanage the crap out of people to ensure they never forget who the smartest guy in the room is.

It's simply time for the Texans to cut ties with OB and hire a top notch front office and let them bring in a new HC and staff.
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I said they should've cleaned house when Kubiak was fired. Then said they should've cleaned house when RS left. Now it is what it is.

I also said Watson would be a middle of the pack QB when he was drafted. After 6 games I said I misjudged Watson and that he had potential to be a top 5 QB. Last yr I thought Watson played well despite injury and lack of talent on offense. This yr Watson has run hot and cold with his accuracy and being able to read defenses. I thought he figured things out after the Charger game when it came to seeing the middle of the field, but it looks like I was wrong.

Watson right now looks shellshocked and confused. So the best thing to do is change back to the offense they ran the 1st 6 games and do what Watson is most comfortable doing. Injury risk be damned.
 
steelbtexan said:
I said they should've cleaned house when Kubiak was fired. Then said they should've cleaned house when RS left. Now it is what it is.

I also said Watson would be a middle of the pack QB when he was drafted. After 6 games I said I misjudged Watson and that he had potential to be a top 5 QB. Last yr I thought Watson played well despite injury and lack of talent on offense. This yr Watson has run hot and cold with his accuracy and being able to read defenses. I thought he figured things out after the Charger game when it came to seeing the middle of the field, but it looks like I was wrong.

Watson right now looks shellshocked and confused. So the best thing to do is change back to the offense they ran the 1st 6 games and do what Watson is most comfortable doing. Injury risk be damned.
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We agreed on the first point even back then.

We agreed on the second point during and after the draft. Minds were changed when OB had to improvise to help Watson when he was forced to send him in as a rookie. Got him comfortable and we all enjoyed an offensive explosion.

As for the third point, instead of working with the success Watson enjoyed as a rookie, OB decided to widdle far too much wood from his horse and wound up with a sharp stick.....then proceeded to stick it in his eye.
If OB could take a step back, he could craft a gameplan much in the same vein as the one used for 7 games 2 years ago, only he can do more quick routes to get the ball out of Watson's hands quicker to reduce the need to take off and run.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
We agreed on the first point even back then.

We agreed on the second point during and after the draft. Minds were changed when OB had to improvise to help Watson when he was forced to send him in as a rookie. Got him comfortable and we all enjoyed an offensive explosion.

As for the third point, instead of working with the success Watson enjoyed as a rookie, OB decided to widdle far too much wood from his horse and wound up with a sharp stick.....then proceeded to stick it in his eye.
If OB could take a step back, he could craft a gameplan much in the same vein as the one used for 7 games 2 years ago, only he can do more quick routes to get the ball out of Watson's hands quicker to reduce the need to take off and run.
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This is why I think they need to go back to the offense they ran those 1st 7 games. Because it's obvious to me Watson cant figure out how to run a pro style offense.
 
otisbean said:
After listening to Watson explain the coverages Carolina played during the game and how they wanted to attack those coverages, I don’t think Watson is the issue.
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What do you think the issues were? There were receivers open in the middle of the field. BOB did call a crappy game though. Seems like you should be able to attack those defenses by running the ball off tackle.

There's also a big difference in knowing what defense they're in and being able to recognize this and how to attack it when chaos is all around you.

There's a reason Watson was working on the field with his personal QB coach after the game.
 
amazing80 said:
Man I’ve never seen someone try to pound their chest on an issue like you. We have one constant in this organization and it surely isn’t Watson.
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What am I pounding my chest about?

I just said BOB should let Watson go back to the offense he's most comfortable in so the offense will be more successful than running a pro style offense.
 
I'd like to see Watson play on a pro offense first. I don't consider O'Brien's offense a real offense
 
TheKDog said:
I'd like to see Watson play on a pro offense first. I don't consider O'Brien's offense a real offense
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I think it's about as offensive as an offense can get... reminds me of the Pastorini led offense's pre Earl
 
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steelbtexan said:
What do you think the issues were? There were receivers open in the middle of the field. BOB did call a crappy game though. Seems like you should be able to attack those defenses by running the ball off tackle.

There's also a big difference in knowing what defense they're in and being able to recognize this and how to attack it when chaos is all around you.

There's a reason Watson was working on the field with his personal QB coach after the game.
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He was working on deep ball accuracy after the game, and make no mistake, I think Watson has to play better. I felt like in his post game speech he recognized he needs to improve. I think teams recognize Watson wants to go deep and they’re defending that. I think BOB should take advantage of this in his play calling and design. One of the things that Kubiak did really well was scheming guys open. I have not seen that with BOBs offense, at least not with any consistency.

I know Wade Smith has said repeatedly that our blocking schemes ask the OL to do things that are really difficult. I wonder if BOB is making things difficult for as well Watson. I don’t know. For me it’s tough to see things on a regular tv broadcast, I need the all 22. I remember Barber commenting multiple times where Watson was holding the ball that there was no where to throw

Seth asked a great question, would Deshaun be further along in his progression if he was playing for Reid, Kubiak, Payton, ect.. (there’s a bunch of guys we could name) vs BOB? He went on to say BOBs scoring offense without Brady has been very mediocre. I feel like that’s what we are watching, mediocre FB
 
otisbean said:
He was working on deep ball accuracy after the game, and make no mistake, I think Watson has to play better. I felt like in his post game speech he recognized he needs to improve. I think teams recognize Watson wants to go deep and they’re defending that. I think BOB should take advantage of this in his play calling and design. One of the things that Kubiak did really well was scheming guys open. I have not seen that with BOBs offense, at least not with any consistency.

I know Wade Smith has said repeatedly that our blocking schemes ask the OL to do things that are really difficult. I wonder if BOB is making things difficult for as well Watson. I don’t know. For me it’s tough to see things on a regular tv broadcast, I need the all 22. I remember Barber commenting multiple times where Watson was holding the ball that there was no where to throw

Seth asked a great question, would Deshaun be further along in his progression if he was playing for Reid, Kubiak, Payton, ect.. (there’s a bunch of guys we could name) vs BOB? He went on to say BOBs scoring offense without Brady has been very mediocre. I feel like that’s what we are watching, mediocre FB
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Devlin sucks as an OL coach.

Watson would probably be further along because Kubiaks offense doesn't allow for audibles really and the QB doesn't have to make the protection calls. But can they win a championship that way? Nope, have you noticed that the more cerebral QB"s are the ones that win championships?

Truth is Watson's suffering growing pains on the job. I thought he made progress last week, obviously I was wrong. Hopefully he gets it soon, I'm starting to have my doubts that he's progressing. This is why they should go back to the offense he's comfortable with.
 
steelbtexan said:
Devlin sucks as an OL coach.

Watson would probably be further along because Kubiaks offense doesn't allow for audibles really and the QB doesn't have to make the protection calls. But can they win a championship that way? Nope, have you noticed that the more cerebral QB"s are the ones that win championships?

Truth is Watson's suffering growing pains on the job. I thought he made progress last week, obviously I was wrong. Hopefully he gets it soon, I'm starting to have my doubts that he's progressing. This is why they should go back to the offense he's comfortable with.
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I think it’s important to remember Watson still hasn’t played 2 full seasons worth of games. He does need to grow and improve, there’s no question about that. I guess my main point is, I’m questioning if BOB is the right man to help with that progression. In reality he’s only had true success in “his” offense with the best QB of all time. Perhaps BOB is just making things more complicated than it needs to be.

While Kubiak the HC hasn’t had as much success, the OC has 4-5 SB rings if I’m not mistaken.
 
otisbean said:
I think it’s important to remember Watson still hasn’t played 2 full seasons worth of games. He does need to grow and improve, there’s no question about that. I guess my main point is, I’m questioning if BOB is the right man to help with that progression. In reality he’s only had true success in “his” offense with the best QB of all time. Perhaps BOB is just making things more complicated than it needs to be.

While Kubiak the HC hasn’t had as much success, the OC has 4-5 SB rings if I’m not mistaken.
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Won two super bowls as OC and one was head coach. Also did a pretty impressive job as Ravens oc in one year. And of course built some good offenses here.

Waiting for OBrien to just have one good offensive year
 
TheKDog said:
Won two super bowls as OC and one was head coach. Also did a pretty impressive job as Ravens oc in one year. And of course built some good offenses here.

Waiting for OBrien to just have one good offensive year
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now we come to the crux of it
 
TheKDog said:
Won two super bowls as OC and one was head coach. Also did a pretty impressive job as Ravens oc in one year. And of course built some good offenses here.

Waiting for OBrien to just have one good offensive year
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The epitaph on BoB's tombstone when he's ultimately fired from here will read much the same way as Kubiak's did when he left here.

Largely a mediocore record..
routinely getting wrecked by teams above .500...
Disappointing losses that u should win..
Can't beat NE in a game that matters..
Stubborn/stupid playcalling
Bad game management...

But hey, he had some "good" offenses here!

Why anyone bothers to draw lines of distinction between the 2 at this point is beyond comprehension.


Now, getting back on topic..The o-line isn't playing all that bad...DW4 is making them look worse by holding onto the ball a bit too long. A few of those sacks & hits, its clear that the line expected the ball to be gone & I was listening to John & Lance this morning, they were estimating that at least 5 of those sacks were on DW4. He's getting happy feet back there watching the rush.
 
Mr teX said:
The epitaph on BoB's tombstone when he's ultimately fired from here will read much the same way as Kubiak's did when he left here.

Largely a mediocore record..
routinely getting wrecked by teams above .500...
Disappointing losses that u should win..
Can't beat NE in a game that matters..
Stubborn/stupid playcalling
Bad game management...

But hey, he had some "good" offenses here!

Why anyone bothers to draw lines of distinction between the 2 at this point is beyond comprehension.


Now, getting back on topic..The o-line isn't playing all that bad...DW4 is making them look worse by holding onto the ball a bit too long. A few of those sacks & hits, its clear that the line expected the ball to be gone & I was listening to John & Lance this morning, they were estimating that at least 5 of those sacks were on DW4. He's getting happy feet back there watching the rush.
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Agreed

The question is how do they get rid of those happy feet and watching the rush?
 
Hmmmmm. Should I show the tape and say the same thing I've said a hundred times before but say it louder? Or adjust the offense to shorten the game, get Watson moving, get one of the best receiving backs in the game involved in the passing attack and get defenses to back off from bringing the house? I think I'll yell louder.
 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed

The question is how do they get rid of those happy feet and watching the rush?
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The strategy defenses are employing against DW4 is they want to keep him in the pocket on 3rd and long situations. So if you can limit those types of situations, you're ok. I would call more things designed to get him out of the pocket. I would do a little bit of what Nagy does with Trubisky...roll the pocket more & get DW4 some easy rhythm throws on 1st down out on the edge. This would also give DW4 the option to use his feet...which he seems to want to do anyway. This would also kind of help the offense from getting behind in the chains at times and out of obvious passing situations where the defense can pin their ears back & get after him.
 
Max said:
Hmmmmm. Should I show the tape and say the same thing I've said a hundred times before but say it louder? Or adjust the offense to shorten the game, get Watson moving, get one of the best receiving backs in the game involved in the passing attack and get defenses to back off from bringing the house? I think I'll yell louder.
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They did all that yesterday & have been doing it. Especially employed the short game in the Jax game.
 
Mr teX said:
They did all that yesterday & have been doing it. Especially employed the short game in the Jax game.
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They got Watson out of the pocket and got Duke involved in the passing game? A huge part of shortening the game is targeting Duke in the backfield which they simply aren't doing. They should have 4-5 plays designed to do just that.
 
Getting hurried on 20 plays is not about the QB "holding it too long" ... getting knocked down another 10 plays is not about the QB "holding it too long" .. getting sacked 6 times has something to do with the QB "holding it too long" and giving up 2 sacks on the first drive of the game has NOTHING to do with the QB "holding it too long"

Mancz was ASS yesterday, he gave up a sack early and set the tone for a horrible game by the entire offensive line.

Tunsil committing rookie mistakes in the endzone by jumping offsides was a killer. Just cannot happen from a guy who everyone here is crowning our "LT of the future, worth 2 first rounders .. etc"

Martin gave up a sack.

Rookies actually played OK, but the defense was in blitz mode and there was nothing implemented strategically to help those guys up front. They did the best you could and it came down to sheer numbers on several sacks.

Yes, Deshaun held the ball too long on a few plays, Yes, Deshaun overshot a couple of scoring plays.

Still Deshaun gives us the best chance to win, and he he does so in spite of Bill OBriens maniacal strangle hold on this franchise. How many audibles did we see Watson call at the line yesterday? Is WAtson too dumb to kill a play and run something 'better' or is OBrien just ruling with an iron fist?
 
Max said:
They got Watson out of the pocket and got Duke involved in the passing game? A huge part of shortening the game is targeting Duke in the backfield which they simply aren't doing. They should have 4-5 plays designed to do just that.
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All we used was the short passing game against Jax. Duke is a 3rd down back so his touches are limited as it is..yet he has had more or less 3 targets a game EVERY game this season in addition to his carries out of the backfield. The 1 game he only had 1 target was the Jax game...the TD pass play DW4 missed him on. Furthermore, Duke & Hyde combined for 8 total targets in the pass game yesterday. It is being done. Yesterday, Carolina sat on all the short stuff...Ronde Barber mentioned how Carolina was doing that during the broadcast.

The only thing i agree with you on is getting Watson out of the pocket more.
 
Uncle Rico said:
Mancz was ASS yesterday, he gave up a sack early and set the tone for a horrible game by the entire offensive line.
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agreed..



Uncle Rico said:
Still Deshaun gives us the best chance to win, and he he does so in spite of Bill OBriens maniacal strangle hold on this franchise. How many audibles did we see Watson call at the line yesterday? Is WAtson too dumb to kill a play and run something 'better' or is OBrien just ruling with an iron fist?
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Noone here is denying DW4 gives us the best chance to win...But he has to play better & he knows that. Furthermore, the only thing separating the right or "better" play as you say and the wrong/shitty play is execution. The offense failed horrendously in that yesterday & DW4 would be the 1st to tell you that.

& FYI, 90% of the time we run that WR screen ya'll just love....that's an audible by DW4. :spin:
 
steelbtexan said:
I said they should've cleaned house when Kubiak was fired. Then said they should've cleaned house when RS left. Now it is what it is.

I also said Watson would be a middle of the pack QB when he was drafted. After 6 games I said I misjudged Watson and that he had potential to be a top 5 QB. Last yr I thought Watson played well despite injury and lack of talent on offense. This yr Watson has run hot and cold with his accuracy and being able to read defenses. I thought he figured things out after the Charger game when it came to seeing the middle of the field, but it looks like I was wrong.

Watson right now looks shellshocked and confused. So the best thing to do is change back to the offense they ran the 1st 6 games and do what Watson is most comfortable doing. Injury risk be damned.
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True you said that but you're still giving him a pass. You are not giving him the Rick Smith treatment. Why?

Like Optimistic stated, he's going through quarterbacks at a record pace. And yet you're calling out Watson .
 
Mr teX said:
agreed..





Noone here is denying DW4 gives us the best chance to win...But he has to play better & he knows that. Furthermore, the only thing separating the right or "better" play as you say and the wrong/shitty play is execution. The offense failed horrendously in that yesterday & DW4 would be the 1st to tell you that.

& FYI, 90% of the time we run that WR screen ya'll just love....that's an audible by DW4. :spin:
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I'll humor you with a response since in the other thread I found your darling explanation to why Watson is struggling VS OBrien needing a "smarter" QB or whatever the talking point is this week to excuse ShitChin.

Deshaun can only run what OBrien calls. IF (not even sure you're correct on the stats about audibles, but I'll dig around or you can provide the data for analysis) what you say about him killing the first play in order to run a bubble screen, then THATS THE FOOTSTEPS TALKING - same **** started to happen with Carr. This guy is getting his sht pushed in every week because the offense is designed for SLOW DEVELOPING PASSING CONCEPTS. Maybe if Deshaun is killing into a bubble screen its because the main play is garbage, and thats probably the only other "accepted" check down he has??

I'd love to think that Watson has full control of the offense and that he's been given free reign to call what needs to be called when he see's a play wont work, but even you would be able to disagree with that ... Wouldnt you?

You go great lengths to cover for O'Brien, but even you guys should know you are running out of excuses.
 
The book on obrien will be one of the worst and most disastrous coaches in nfl history.

Kubiaks book is he was a good coach who immediately won a super bowl and had a good nfl career after leaving.

I'm not sure obrien will get a head coaching job in the nfl after this
 
TheKDog said:
The book on obrien will be one of the worst and most disastrous coaches in nfl history.

Kubiaks book is he was a good coach who immediately won a super bowl and had a good nfl career after leaving.

I'm not sure obrien will get a head coaching job in the nfl after this
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Hey OBrien will forever be a trivia question we should all be able to answer.

Who is the only NFL coach in history to lose 2 timeouts on one play. LOL
 
Uncle Rico said:
Getting hurried on 20 plays is not about the QB "holding it too long" ... getting knocked down another 10 plays is not about the QB "holding it too long" .. getting sacked 6 times has something to do with the QB "holding it too long" and giving up 2 sacks on the first drive of the game has NOTHING to do with the QB "holding it too long"

Mancz was ASS yesterday, he gave up a sack early and set the tone for a horrible game by the entire offensive line.

Tunsil committing rookie mistakes in the endzone by jumping offsides was a killer. Just cannot happen from a guy who everyone here is crowning our "LT of the future, worth 2 first rounders .. etc"

Martin gave up a sack.

Rookies actually played OK, but the defense was in blitz mode and there was nothing implemented strategically to help those guys up front. They did the best you could and it came down to sheer numbers on several sacks.

Yes, Deshaun held the ball too long on a few plays, Yes, Deshaun overshot a couple of scoring plays.

Still Deshaun gives us the best chance to win, and he he does so in spite of Bill OBriens maniacal strangle hold on this franchise. How many audibles did we see Watson call at the line yesterday? Is WAtson too dumb to kill a play and run something 'better' or is OBrien just ruling with an iron fist?
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I'm going with both.

Watson is still learming and is too scared to audible out of plays BOB calls.

Watson's biggest failings 1. Failure to make right OL calls 2. Holds ball too long 3. Fails to look at the middle of the field 4. Accuracy 5. Needs to improve in reading Blitz 6. Deadly happy feet.

BOB's faults

1. Hard headedness/Failure to put Watson in positions to succeed. Roll outs and short passing game would help.
2. TO usage is horrible 3. Has BOB ever won a challenge?
 
Texansballer74 said:
True you said that but you're still giving him a pass. You are not giving him the Rick Smith treatment. Why?

Like Optimistic stated, he's going through quarterbacks at a record pace. And yet you're calling out Watson .
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Because other than Hoyer I think those were RS QB picks. Plus RS was horrible in the draft.
 
TheKDog said:
Lol why would Rick bring New England retreads in?
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If BOB really wanted Mallett you think they would've waited until the end of TC to bring him in?

Now that you mention it that's exactly the type of move I would expect RS to make. Hoyer is the guy BOB wanted as a placeholder.
 
steelbtexan said:
If BOB really wanted Mallett you think they would've waited until the end of TC to bring him in?

Now that you mention it that's exactly the type of move I would expect RS to make. Hoyer is the guy BOB wanted as a placeholder.
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I don't see how that proves obrien didnt mallet. He named him starter two separate times. They also extended him.

This was after obrien told keenum he sucked to his face
 
Uncle Rico said:
I'll humor you with a response since in the other thread I found your darling explanation to why Watson is struggling VS OBrien needing a "smarter" QB or whatever the talking point is this week to excuse ShitChin.

Deshaun can only run what OBrien calls. IF (not even sure you're correct on the stats about audibles, but I'll dig around or you can provide the data for analysis) what you say about him killing the first play in order to run a bubble screen, then THATS THE FOOTSTEPS TALKING - same **** started to happen with Carr. This guy is getting his sht pushed in every week because the offense is designed for SLOW DEVELOPING PASSING CONCEPTS. Maybe if Deshaun is killing into a bubble screen its because the main play is garbage, and thats probably the only other "accepted" check down he has??

I'd love to think that Watson has full control of the offense and that he's been given free reign to call what needs to be called when he see's a play wont work, but even you would be able to disagree with that ... Wouldnt you?

You go great lengths to cover for O'Brien, but even you guys should know you are running out of excuses.
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Lol...qb's don't go to the LOS with the full playbook at their disposal smart guy. At most they go up there with 3 plays (Manning) & they check into the best 1. All 3 could work..... or none could work. Fact is, That WR screen is a common thing you see in a number offenses. qb typically check into it when they come up to the LOS & sees the DB's way off of the WR, you audible to that, get that quick & easy 3-4 yards with very little risk. It's an extended handoff basically. I've seen NE do it alot over many a seasons & its a staple in pretty much every college air raid offense. The "footsteps" have literally nothing to do with it.

You keep talking about these slow developing concepts but you don't have **** to back it up with...The Jax game all we did was employ the short stuff. Show me a breakdown of DW4's attempts or something. Yesterday, we started off with alot of the short stuff...Ultimately though, if you can't hit a team deep, CB's will start driving on the underneath stuff. Yesterday in particular, Carolina played a defense designed to largely take away the deep stuff...which meant the CB's would be even more bold in driving on the short game b/c they don't have to worry about being beat deep. So if the deep stuff isn't really there & the short stuff is gone, what else is there buddy? If you guessed "intermediate" you would be correct. But...Intermediate takes time to develop like the deep stuff..& Carolina banked on that which is why all the pressure was there.

Kuechly i believe was also playing mind games with DW4. Carolina would show something, DW4 audibles, Keuchly would audible to something else...great MLB's tend to do that to qbs.
 
TheKDog said:
I don't see how that proves obrien didnt mallet. He named him starter two separate times. They also extended him.

This was after obrien told keenum he sucked to his face
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He really wanted Hoyer. Hoyer wasn't a placeholder, because that job belonged to Fitz. Once OB found out Hoyer sucked, he wanted Mallet.

I don't think OB was interested in Mallet until NE knew they couldn't keep him.

Anyway, OB isn't a good coach period, because 6 years later his offense still looks the same no matter who is under center.
 
Bwhahaha so he didn't hand picke Mallett or Savage. He didn't have a hand in picking up Fitzpatrick. Ok

And too be honest that does not matter. Bottom line is his system sucks
 
Corrosion said:
He's not seeing them because he's not looking for them early enough. He's always looking for a big play. Then they get behind on down and distance and the defense cranks up the pressure and he cant get thru the first two before he's running for his life. He's making that bad OL worse by putting them behind in down and distance so often.

He's got to learn when to take those risks and when to take the easy 5 yards and move on to the next play.

Most are complaining about OB , today , other than one bad play , it wasn't on him. Watson was just bad. Didn't see openings and threw poor balls on others.




I have no faith that OB will get canned either …. we're stuck with him for another year at the least.
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Spoke to 2 people who watched Watson working with the QB coach after the game............he was essentially mostly practicing long throws...............that's not what he needed to be working on after a game like Sunday's.
 
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