why are we switching to a 3-4?

[dalemurphy]

More Talk from Wade.

Thanks, TK. good information.

For those who can't/don't want to listen. Here's some interesting stuff:

1. Wade would like to move Glover Quin to FS. He liked him as a FS coming out of college, complimented his work in the slot this year, and called him "competitive" at CB.

2. Also likes Shaun Cody. Cody will clearly be involved in the NT rotation, from the way it sounded.

3. Relatively unimpressed with Mario Williams. He doesn't say that but he refuses to compare him to Reggie White, Bruce Smith, or Elvin Bethea... He said that he expects Mario to getter better and better... and, it sounds to me that he doubts Mario's work ethic/desire by the way/tone he answers those questions.

4. Every time he compliments the effort of the defensive players, he is also taking a subtle jab at how poor the coaching/scheming has been.

5. Mentioned the Denver game and Daryl Sharpton without prompting. I'm guessing some things really stood out to him in that game.... One of them being Sharpton, I think.

 

[HOU-TEX]

Thanks, TK. good information.

For those who can't/don't want to listen. Here's some interesting stuff:

1. Wade would like to move Glover Quin to FS. He liked him as a FS coming out of college, complimented his work in the slot this year, and called him "competitive" at CB.

2. Also likes Shaun Cody. Cody will clearly be involved in the NT rotation, from the way it sounded.

3. Relatively unimpressed with Mario Williams. He doesn't say that but he refuses to compare him to Reggie White, Bruce Smith, or Elvin Bethea... He said that he expects Mario to getter better and better... and, it sounds to me that he doubts Mario's work ethic/desire by the way/tone he answers those questions.

4. Every time he compliments the effort of the defensive players, he is also taking a subtle jab at how poor the coaching/scheming has been.

5. Mentioned the Denver game and Daryl Sharpton without prompting. I'm guessing some things really stood out to him in that game.... One of them being Sharpton, I think.

1. He did not say he wanted to move him to FS. Barry mentioned Wade saying he liked Quin at FS coming out of College. He said he could teach him a few things to make him a better CB, but will wait til they hit the field before determining his position.

2. He did say he liked Cody's motor

3. Other than not wanting to compare Mario with HOFers, not one thing you mention here is correct. And honestly, other than knowing your history concerning Mario, I can't see how a normal person could come to such a conclusion.

4. He did compliment the players for effort, but he also gave coaches credit for getting them to play like that. He never really took a jab at scheme, but then again, does he really need to? He's here, they aren't.

5. He admired the way Sharpton played through a shoulder injury in the Denver game. Didn't mention performance.

Way to listen between the lines, murphster. Ha

 

[JB]

Thanks, TK. good information.

For those who can't/don't want to listen. Here's some interesting stuff:

1. Wade would like to move Glover Quin to FS. He liked him as a FS coming out of college, complimented his work in the slot this year, and called him "competitive" at CB.

2. Also likes Shaun Cody. Cody will clearly be involved in the NT rotation, from the way it sounded.

3. Relatively unimpressed with Mario Williams. He doesn't say that but he refuses to compare him to Reggie White, Bruce Smith, or Elvin Bethea... He said that he expects Mario to getter better and better... and, it sounds to me that he doubts Mario's work ethic/desire by the way/tone he answers those questions.

4. Every time he compliments the effort of the defensive players, he is also taking a subtle jab at how poor the coaching/scheming has been.

5. Mentioned the Denver game and Daryl Sharpton without prompting. I'm guessing some things really stood out to him in that game.... One of them being Sharpton, I think.

I'm not sure you heard the same podcast I did. If so, you got something totally different out of it than I did. He doesn't compare Mario to hof'ers because Mario is still young. He applauded his game and his effort.

He was directly asked about moving Quinn to FS and said no, it's too early to say that. He thought he could teach Quinn some stuff and that he good be a very good corner.


edit: Hou-Tex beat me to it.

 

[infantrycak]

1. He did not say he wanted to move him to FS. Barry mentioned Wade saying he liked Quin at FS coming out of College. He said he could teach him a few things to make him a better CB, but will wait til they hit the field before determining his position.

2. He did say he liked Cody's motor

3. Other than not wanting to compare Mario with HOFers, not one thing you mention here is correct. And honestly, other than knowing your history concerning Mario, I can't see how a normal person could come to such a conclusion.

4. He did compliment the players for effort, but he also gave coaches credit for getting them to play like that. He never really took a jab at scheme, but then again, does he really need to? He's here, they aren't.

5. He admired the way Sharpton played through a shoulder injury in the Denver game. Didn't mention performance.

Way to listen between the lines, murphster. Ha

What he said. Sheesh the quoted translation wasn't even close.

 

[Ndevine7]

Say we draft Von Miller and sign Aubrayo Franklin in FA. This could be our starting front 7...

what are your thoughts about occasionally having cushing at olb. I could see him being a lesser clay

 

[BigBull17]

Why does nobody like Quinn at FS? He would be very good at that position. His major flaw is lacking speed. That's hard to coach.

 

[BSofA04]

What do you think of putting Mark Anderson at the WOLB spot, instead of Von Miller?

Is he not athletic enough to play OLB?

I would think he & Barwin would be our OLBs...... maybe even Sharpton, because he needs to be on the field more as well. We've got options.

Mark and Jesse Nading (who also have been mentioned at switching to OLB) would be a good possibility but I have no idea how they'll adjust to standing up and occasionally covering a TE/flats/etc. Conventional wisdom says that converted DE's can't handle they hybrid LB position but you never know!

Assuming Wade thinks they'll be able to handle this, then we probably draft another position of concern (NT, secondary). The picture is my ideal situation because you know the strengths and weakness of Von Miller playing OLB. I think A&M has him listed as a "Joker" for his position but after watching him in the Cotton Bowl, there's no reason to think his skills won't translate to OLB in a 3-4 scheme.

 

[BSofA04]

what are your thoughts about occasionally having cushing at olb. I could see him being a lesser clay

Personally, I see him as a beast of a tackler BUT...in 2010 he was poor at changing his direction when in pursuit of the football. In other words, his play in space regressed from 2009. IMO, unless he unleashes the Brian Cushing of 2009, he'll be better off making the majority of the tackles at the Mike position with DeMeco helping him at the Mo. He worked well beside DeMeco and could benefit from having the QB of the defense to lead him. He'll still make sacks at the Mike, just not 12-14 sacks like Clay Matthews who is sensational at OLB.

 

[infantrycak]

Conventional wisdom says that converted DE's can't handle they hybrid LB position but you never know!

Many if not most 3-4 OLB's are converted college DE's.

 

[Ndevine7]

Personally, I see him as a beast of a tackler BUT...in 2010 he was poor at changing his direction when in pursuit of the football. In other words, his play in space regressed from 2009. IMO, unless he unleashes the Brian Cushing of 2009, he'll be better off making the majority of the tackles at the Mike position with DeMeco helping him at the Mo. He worked well beside DeMeco and could benefit from having the QB of the defense to lead him. He'll still make sacks at the Mike, just not 12-14 sacks like Clay Matthews who is sensational at OLB.

I think alot of the defense regressed after DeMeco went down. Cush is a freak athlete and i think that he could be a lesser clay or wade could make him into a ware type player. This is if we dont get a olb in the draft because IMO drafting von miller would make this convo irrelvent because barwin and him could hold down the olb while cush and ryans hold down the middle

 

[BSofA04]

Many if not most 3-4 OLB's are converted college DE's.

Which is the reality. Elvis Dumervil and DeMarcus Ware comes to mind, but when I think of typical 3-4 OLB I think Clay Matthews, James Harrison, Suggs, etc. It all depends on if the coaching staff think Nading and Anderson can play at a high level and not become a liability. Von Miller is just my preference.

 

[BSofA04]

I think alot of the defense regressed after DeMeco went down. Cush is a freak athlete and i think that he could be a lesser clay or wade could make him into a ware type player. This is if we dont get a olb in the draft because IMO drafting von miller would make this convo irrelvent because barwin and him could hold down the olb while cush and ryans hold down the middle

If we don't draft an OLB in the draft in the earlier rounds, we still might see Cushing in the middle with Anderson/Nading at the other OLB. But if what you think about Wade making Cushing a beast on the outside comes true, I would love to see that happen! Right now, I don't see it.

 

[infantrycak]

Which is the reality. Elvis Dumervil and DeMarcus Ware comes to mind, but when I think of typical 3-4 OLB I think Clay Matthews, James Harrison, Suggs, etc. It all depends on if the coaching staff think Nading and Anderson can play at a high level and not become a liability. Von Miller is just my preference.

Harrison and Suggs played DE in college. Conner Barwin is the classic you are looking for. Not arguing against Von Miller at all.

 

[Ndevine7]

Harrison and Suggs played DE in college. Conner Barwin is the classic you are looking for. Not arguing against Von Miller at all.

Barwin and miller manning the outside could be a great duo that could result in a lot of sacks in years to come

 

[JB]

Barwin and miller manning the outside could be a great duo that could result in a lot of sacks in years to come

I would rather see Barwin & Cushing on the outside, and get some one to pair with Ryans (or replace him in the middle if he doesn't come back to his previous form).

 

[Ndevine7]

I would rather see Barwin & Cushing on the outside, and get some one to pair with Ryans (or replace him in the middle if he doesn't come back to his previous form).

there isnt a top notch ilb in the draft this year and there isnt a nt worthy of being drafted at the 11th spot. who are you going to go with in the first round?

 

[JB]

there isnt a top notch ilb in the draft this year and there isnt a nt worthy of being drafted at the 11th spot. who are you going to go with in the first round?

I dont know. It's still early. Right now I would think maybe Paea or Fairley or Dareus or Quinn or Amukamura may be there. All depends on who is there and if we have had a FA period to sign some help.

 

[Ndevine7]

I dont know. It's still early. Right now I would think maybe Paea or Fairley or Dareus or Quinn or Amukamura may be there. All depends on who is there and if we have had a FA period to sign some help.

i would love to get amukamura but he is too good of a prospect and if he falls dallas cant pass up on him. Fairley is unbeliveable and is a top 3 pick and possibly the number one pick overall. Paea stock has fallen alot and is a mid to end first round pick(could trade down to get him). Dareus and Quinn are possiblities as well as Miller. Dareus is a hybrid de/dt and i dont know how effective he will be in the 3-4(Cleveland also has a need and he could be taken before us). Quinn and Miller are both olb/de hybrids that will be perfect for the 3-4 scheme but imo quinn will be drafted earlier then we pick leaving Von Miller as our choice.

 

[JB]

Point is that it's way to early to tell what the rankings should be and who may be there. The Texans always seem to select somone that is not the favored mock pick for them.

With a new defensive staff coming in, they have to evaluate and find out who they have and where they will play. I just don't think we should move Cushing to the inside because Miller may be there when we pick. I saw one mock where Miller went #5 and Fairley fell to us.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

Point is that it's way to early to tell what the rankings should be and who may be there. The Texans always seem to select somone that is not the favored mock pick for them.

With a new defensive staff coming in, they have to evaluate and find out who they have and where they will play. I just don't think we should move Cushing to the inside because Miller may be there when we pick. I saw one mock where Miller went #5 and Fairley fell to us.

The thing is: Wade is all about modifying his defense based on the skills and abilities of the players in his defense.

I think how guys get shuffled is going to depend on who we get in FA and who we end up drafting.

I have a feeling this year that our draft may be more BPA than Needs Based.

For years, we've drafted for defense hoping that the talent of the players would offset the questionable coaching while Kubiak's offense has usually taken a backseat because of the belief that Kubiak could make something out of less talented players. Wade could give us that same sort of confidence in our defense.

I would not be surprised if we took a WR if the right FS, CB, NT, or OLB were not available.

 

[JB]

The thing is: Wade is all about modifying his defense based on the skills and abilities of the players in his defense.

I think how guys get shuffled is going to depend on who we get in FA and who we end up drafting.

I have a feeling this year that our draft may be more BPA than Needs Based.

For years, we've drafted for defense hoping that the talent of the players would offset the questionable coaching while Kubiak's offense has usually taken a backseat because of the belief that Kubiak could make something out of less talented players. Wade could give us that same sort of confidence in our defense.

I would not be surprised if we took a WR if the right FS, CB, NT, or OLB were not available.

That's what I was trying to say, but you nailed it! Thanks!

edit: Or a TE...

 

[beerlover]

I dont understand why we will be switching to a 3-4. like someone posted in another thread, the secondary is the same in the 4-3 and 3-4 defense. Now we need to add a nose tackle, outside linebacker, and maybe even a Devensive end to our many needs this offseason. It seems like a horrible time to make a transition from 4-3 to 3-4 because of the lockout and will probably give Kubiak an excuse for if we dont make the playoffs next season. The players were drafted for a 4-3 and it sucks that some of them might not find a spot in the 3-4 defense. I trust Wade Phillips and i think he knows what hes talking about but i think he said some of the stuff to please Mcnair and may not even believe it himself.

have you reached a satisfactory answer to your question after four pages of response?

Here is my

Texans needed immediate results by hiring a proven experienced defensive coordinator, this extends to the war room & free agency. It's a great opportunity for both Wade & the Texans. From comments in his presser to understanding his background Wade has an excellent track record of putting players in positions to succeed, he will maximize players potential. The Texans will continue with most of the same players, hence they will be a smaller, quicker front seven than most traditional 3-4's. emphasis will be on speed & abiltiy to react quicker, call it a hybrid 3-4 something Texans played around with a little before Barwins injury.

 

[thunderkyss]

Here's a blast from the past article, about Wade going to Dallas.... I like the premise.

SAN ANTONIO – There is one significant upgrade that could alter the Cowboys' fortunes this season. There is one overriding reason that Wade Phillips is the new sheriff in town.

Sacks.

Discuss....

 

[thunderkyss]

Sorry.

This one (Cupcake from Hell) is even better. it even includes a semi-detailed pdf graphic about Wade's 3-4, check it out.

Two of the key players in the Philips 3-4 are DeMarcus Ware and the strong safety. The Phillips defense calls for Ware to pin his ears back and go after the QB on most plays and rely on the strong safety to provide coverage on three receiver sets. The problem last year was grossly inadequate strong safety play. We knew it, the other teams knew it and Wade knew it. The other teams attacked that weakness and in trying to compensate for it, we sacrificed some other strengths. Have we upgraded our strength at the strong safety position enough to make a difference? With Gerald Sensabaugh I believe we have. Sensabaugh will give us much better pass coverage than we have seen in recent years from our strong safety.

 

[Dutchrudder]

Sorry.

This one (Cupcake from Hell) is even better. it even includes a semi-detailed pdf graphic about Wade's 3-4, check it out.

I think if the Texans draft Von Miller, he will become the Demarcus Ware of the Texans' Wade defense. We need a sack artist on one side, and a bunch of run stuffers in support (Ryans, Cushing, Sharpton). Potential, we have lots of it... I just hope it works out

 

[thunderkyss]

I think if the Texans draft Von Miller, he will become the Demarcus Ware of the Texans' Wade defense. We need a sack artist on one side, and a bunch of run stuffers in support (Ryans, Cushing, Sharpton). Potential, we have lots of it... I just hope it works out

We've got Bawin & Anderson.....

I think I'm missing what you are saying.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

Sorry.

This one (Cupcake from Hell) is even better. it even includes a semi-detailed pdf graphic about Wade's 3-4, check it out.

Two of the key players in the Philips 3-4 are DeMarcus Ware and the strong safety. The Phillips defense calls for Ware to pin his ears back and go after the QB on most plays and rely on the strong safety to provide coverage on three receiver sets. The problem last year was grossly inadequate strong safety play. We knew it, the other teams knew it and Wade knew it. The other teams attacked that weakness and in trying to compensate for it, we sacrificed some other strengths. Have we upgraded our strength at the strong safety position enough to make a difference? With Gerald Sensabaugh I believe we have. Sensabaugh will give us much better pass coverage than we have seen in recent years from our strong safety.

That means that Bernard Pollard is no longer our strong safety.

Unless Wade thinks he can coach him up.

 

[HOU-TEX]

That means that Bernard Pollard is no longer our strong safety.

Unless Wade thinks he can coach him up.

He wasn't able to coach Roy Williams up. Pollard's the same type of player

 

[GP]

have you reached a satisfactory answer to your question after four pages of response?

Here is my

Texans needed immediate results by hiring a proven experienced defensive coordinator, this extends to the war room & free agency. It's a great opportunity for both Wade & the Texans. From comments in his presser to understanding his background Wade has an excellent track record of putting players in positions to succeed, he will maximize players potential. The Texans will continue with most of the same players, hence they will be a smaller, quicker front seven than most traditional 3-4's. emphasis will be on speed & abiltiy to react quicker, call it a hybrid 3-4 something Texans played around with a little before Barwins injury.

I liked what we were doing in the preseason, specifically I think it was the Cardinals and Cowboys preseason games...where we DID have lots of different looks on defense.

I don't necessarily think Barwin's injury is what killed those different looks. It's like it just died or something. Like it was used for fun, and then BOOP! it's gone. How can one player's absence on the field cause it to die?

 

[The Pencil Neck]

He wasn't able to coach Roy Williams up. Pollard's the same type of player

Yeah, I know.

 

[Ndevine7]

I liked what we were doing in the preseason, specifically I think it was the Cardinals and Cowboys preseason games...where we DID have lots of different looks on defense.

I don't necessarily think Barwin's injury is what killed those different looks. It's like it just died or something. Like it was used for fun, and then BOOP! it's gone. How can one player's absence on the field cause it to die?

Barwins loss hurt the dl depth alot and the reason they were able to do alot of those different looks was due to the athleticism of barwin and mario

 

[steelbtexan]

Because.

Now shut up and buy a jersey.

LOL

And a Cap

Since they're on the right track and everything. Isn't it time to upgrade your seats? Price increase? You can afford it, Economy !!!! Eshonomy!!!!

 

[thunderkyss]

Barwins loss hurt the dl depth alot and the reason they were able to do alot of those different looks was due to the athleticism of barwin and mario

Not only that, we got Nading & tried to do the same thing....... he ended up on IR shortly after.

Not only did our back-ups get hurt, but our back-ups back-up got hurt.

& it wasn't just Barwin...

Bullman, Nading, Bing, Demeco, Barber..

& Mario got hurt somewhere around week 6 or 7 IIRC.... it was a bad year for the defense.


Now, I agree. 9 years into this thing. 5 years with Kubiak, we should have enough depth to handle injuries.... & I think we did. If FBush or Gary Kubiak would have played the aggressive style they brought these guys into play, they more than likely would have done much better.

Hopefully Wade won't scare so easily.

 

[dalemurphy]

Not only that, we got Nading & tried to do the same thing....... he ended up on IR shortly after.

Not only did our back-ups get hurt, but our back-ups back-up got hurt.

& it wasn't just Barwin...

Bullman, Nading, Bing, Demeco, Barber..

& Mario got hurt somewhere around week 6 or 7 IIRC.... it was a bad year for the defense.


Now, I agree. 9 years into this thing. 5 years with Kubiak, we should have enough depth to handle injuries.... & I think we did. If FBush or Gary Kubiak would have played the aggressive style they brought these guys into play, they more than likely would have done much better.

Hopefully Wade won't scare so easily.

As you know, I'm a Smithiak defender. However, one of the issues with the defensive depth was poor personnel decision-making. It was a huge mistake to keep Nading over Tim Jamison. It was also a huge mistake to retain Okam over Deljuan Robinson. And, considering they already knew about Mario's sports hernia, they should've paid to get Aaron Schobel in there. Finally, they should've repaired Mario's hernia in July or August and had a healthy Mario for the final 2+ months of the season.

and, don't get me started on the secondary!

 

[JB]

As you know, I'm a Smithiak defender. However, one of the issues with the defensive depth was poor personnel decision-making. It was a huge mistake to keep Nading over Tim Jamison. It was also a huge mistake to retain Okam over Deljuan Robinson. And, considering they already knew about Mario's sports hernia, they should've paid to get Aaron Schobel in there. Finally, they should've repaired Mario's hernia in July or August and had a healthy Mario for the final 2+ months of the season.

and, don't get me started on the secondary!

I know Okam is playing in Tampa... can you remind me again where DelJuan is playing? And Schobel was nowhere close to football shape. Why sign him when he couldn't see the field...

 

[Carr Bombed]

Ummmm, no we don't.

Phillips doesn't run a two gap 3-4.

For years people have been banging on about needing a big fat DT.... I'm starting to think if some people have a taste for large men.. if so here's a little something for ya....

I'll take the fat midget FTW...

He's small in size, but he looks like he has alot of fight in him.

 

[drs23]

I'll take the fat midget FTW...

He's small in size, but he looks like he has alot of fight in him.

He's your's!

 

[dalemurphy]

I know Okam is playing in Tampa... can you remind me again where DelJuan is playing? And Schobel was nowhere close to football shape. Why sign him when he couldn't see the field...

All I know about Deljuan is that he was the Texans best DT when he was on the field in 2008. For reasons beyond comprehension, he wasn't even given an opportunity to compete for a roster spot in 2010. Why keep Okam if you are going to cut him mid-season?

Schoble determined only to play for the Texans if he played in 2010. The Texans wouldn't pay him what he was wanting. They also passed on Raheem Brock, who had like 8 sacks, or so in 2010... instead, they went after Ogunleye and Kelsay first.