This is a pretty ridiculous thread. When the Texans drafted Barwin, we all knew he was a project. The whole idea is that with Smith, he doesn't need to be an every down guy. He can learn the position while still contributing with his athleticism on passing downs and after a couple years in the league, be an every down guy.
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When will Connor Barwin turn the corner?
- Thread starter Big Lou
- Start date
noxiousdog
Rookie
No, we got Barwin to put pressure on the quarterback on obvious passing downs. If that pressure comes directly from Barwin or from scheming is irrelevant.
This is the difference between our old crappy defense and where we're headed. It's not about just sending four D-Linemen and hoping they can put pressure on the QB, it's about changing up defensive looks, disguising your blitzes, and generally confusing the offense so you're not predictable.
Barwin can bring pressure, but the threat of him bringing pressure is also useful.
Even though Barwin only has one sack he has made his presence felt in the pass rush mode . He has batted down a number of passes as well.
He has performed slightly below my expectations so far. Part of this has to do with Mario being injured.
Barwin will improve as the year goes on. IMO
He has performed slightly below my expectations so far. Part of this has to do with Mario being injured.
Barwin will improve as the year goes on. IMO
GP
Go Texans!
Two running backs were available: Green(e) from Iowa and Glen Coffee.
I think there was a DB or safety also available, IIRC, that I would have liked to give a whirl had I been making the pick for us.
So, about 4 players we could have taken instead of Barwin. Before people say that those two RBs are not exactly ripping it up in the NFL right now, I'd like to say that they are both good caliber RBs--And our running back situation is sketchy with the fluctuating productivity that Slaton is giving us. Having an extra, GOOD quality running back is not a bad thing.
I see why the pick was made, though: We need to pressure the QB with a d-lineman, and do it better-faster-stronger. I see the "faster" in Barwin, not so sure I see the better and the stronger in him.
In a 3-4 scheme, I think this guy would thrive.
TimeKiller
Guest
It's not a waste of time and you can take your emoticon and shove it.
I'm not going to scour the entire draft and cherry pick other players taken in that round and then try to project how they would do on our team in our system...that's a waste of time.
I didn't ask you to scour the entire draft, just the 2nd round AFTER Barwin was taken. If Barwin was a bad pick to you then who wouldn't have been? An astoundingly simple question, if it's too much for you then please duck it again.
The only thing high risk about CB is his lack of experience at the position.
Philosophize with me here, before the draft at DE our depth goes as such: Mario Williams
Tim Bulman
? Cochran released, McClover IR ?
Right? I like Tim Bulman but he's not a 1st string DE. Even after signing ASmith Bulman is the only backup worth a damn. When you plan to rely on the DL as much as this defense does going to war with 3 DEs is a big no-no. Point being DE wasn't loaded with talent like it is now. I know DE wasn't the most pressing need but turning a blind eye to the draft situation so that you can try (fail) to prove a point is bad message boarding.
And it's especially not a waste of time because with how you've criticized Barwin not having a better option *or at least AN OPTION* to discuss otherwise just means you are complaining to complain.
GP- He is used like a 3/4 guy a lot. Stand up rushing, occasionally drops in coverage, primarily a rusher. Pay extra attention to how they line up next time you see him in.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
Yeah, it IS a waste of time...
I'm not going to go back to last years draft and try to project on how "player x" would be doing in this system......based on what he's doing in his system this year.
I'll list positions instead, RB and Olineman.....before the Barwin pick, I wanted a RB (I was high on Greene) or a Olineman. Either one could be the difference between a 4-3 season and a possible 5-3 or even 6-1 season.
BTW, I don't "duck questions" here either. I just don't like hindsight crap.
GP
Go Texans!
No, I'm talking about him being in a strictly 3-4 system. As an every-down linebacker.
I am fully aware that we sometimes throw out a different "base" look from time-to-time.
I'm not THAT dense. Dadgum....
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
No, I'm talking about him being in a strictly 3-4 system. As an every-down linebacker.
I am fully aware that we sometimes throw out a different "base" look from time-to-time.
I'm not THAT dense. Dadgum....
His size isn't an issue to be successful as a 4-3 DE. He's going to be playing around 260 lbs and has a good frame. Heck, Indy has two DEs that weigh under 250 lbs. The issue is that if/when Barwin becomes an every down player, Mario will have to play the strong side more often... Frankly, I think that's his best position anyway.. But, even then, they can play all sorts of games with alignment on passing downs. I think Barwin's sack at Cincy came off the edge of the RT.
TimeKiller
Guest
Only waste of time I see is criticizing without a single thought for some type of correction.
Shonn Greene would've been nice. He's playing backup btw. Coffee, also would've been and only started in the wake of Gore's injury. Back to backup role.
Levitre, Unger, Loadholt (We have a RT anyway) have all been starting every game. I was pretty high on Unger but the difference between them and Caldwell is pretty thin IMO. AP makes Loadholt look like a genius for being a huge guy. Any of those guys would've been fine picks.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/draft-2009/04/26/steals.reaches/index.html
Guess who is listed as a steal? That's right: Connor Barwin.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
What's your problem...
I don't have to "insert" player A instead of player B to be able to criticize the decision of selecting a project player in the second round. Barwin or no Barwin......I'm just against selecting a project player in the second round, what's so hard to understand about that? I don't see why so many people are having such a difficult time understanding that I just don't like picking up project players on the first day of the draft. We don't even have to get into who's available.....I can guarantee you there were a ton of non-project players with very high ceilings in the second round. There's already enough risk involved with the draft without the team adding more risk selecting project players/tweeners on the first day of the draft.
BTW Greene is a backup, because he plays with Thomas Jones and same with Coffee and Gore. Also teams need multiple backs and many run multiple back systems (which is why the Jets had NO PROBLEM spending a second round pick on a "backup" RB...) so it doesn't really matter if they would've been a backup here. They would still be contributing, but that is is seperate issue, because I've said before I don't think any good back could be highly productive behind this Oline, which is why if I had to make the pick I would've chose to upgrade the line.
P.S.
I don't base my opinions off of what articles say....I think we all learned about that after 2006.
BTW, one of their "reaches" Derek Cox has been one of the better rookie corners in the draft......so...
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dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Actually you make a good point... I will go back and do some cherry-picking on Carr Bombed's behalf:
1st round: Brian Cushing (immediate impact, probowl level LB)
2nd round: a hall of fame caliber interior lineman- not sure who, but that's the organization's problem
3rd round: a hall of fame caliber RB- again, I don't know who, but not my problem
4th round: a Champ Bailey'esque CB... Sure Quin is starting and playing well, but I like elite players in the 4th round
4th round: Haynesworth-like DT... I have no idea why the Texans decided not to do that and went TE instead?
5th round: James Casey- Carr Bombed is okay with this one but I'd like to see a more productive 5th rounder.
6th round: We could've used a safety in the mold of Ed Reed here but they went with an undersized CB.. uggh!
7th round: How about the next Tom Brady here? they take a safety instead. Sometimes I have to question the organization's desire to win!
Why are people so quick to ***** about threads when inserting thier own slant and ignoring the simple question?!?!? If it weren't for threads like these, we'd all be sitting at our computers saying "hey'd you see that catch, you know the one when the QB threw it and the reciever caught it?"
I don't recall ever putting any kind of assertion that this was a good or bad pick, other than the fact that a first day pick was used, but I digress.....
vanknights2002
Practice Squad
Looks good when he speed rushes nut expect him to get better the more time he gets. Remember this is is second year playing DE. Some of you guys were saying he would go in the first.Second he is a reach but the upside is there.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
What the hell are you talking about? I didn't say anyting like that. Seriously if all you are going to do is pop off with sophomoric posts then there's no point in even continuing this debate.. Seriously you sound like a upset child who had his daddy insulted. ****, all I did was question the decision to draft a project player in the second round... LOL, but yeah I forgot..."YOU'RE" the one who's open to other people's opinions
What a joke.Hey how about I make a post like dalemurphy...
HOW DARE ANYBODY QUESTION THE ALMIGHTY FO....Whatever they say is right and even if later on it's wrong......IT'S STILL RIGHT.. It's not even open for debate. If Rick Smith says so, it is law!!! and if you don't obey the law, you are just a bunch of insufferable whiners!!!
All hail Rick Smith!!!
^^^ See how that works....now where does that kind of crap get us in this discussion?
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dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
What the hell are you talking about? I didn't say anyting like that. Seriously if all you are going to do is pop off with sophomoric posts then there's no point in even continuing this debate.. Seriously you sound like a upset child who had his daddy insulted. ****, all I did was question the decision to draft a project player in the second round... LOL, but yeah I forgot..."YOU'RE" the one who's open to other people's opinions
Hey how about I make a post like dalemurphy...
HOW DARE ANYBODY QUESTION THE ALMIGHTY FO....Whatever they say is right and even if later on it's wrong......IT'S STILL RIGHT.. It's not even open for debate. If Rick Smith says so, it is law!!! and if you don't obey the law, you are just a bunch of insufferable whiners!!!
All hail Rick Smith!!!
^^^ See how that works....now where does that kind of crap get us in this discussion?
I don't know where it gets us. I thought mine was funnier though.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
Look we're just going to have to agree to disagree.....I don't have the energy to continue on with this thread (My rockets game is about to tip off) and I really don't want to get into a mud slinging contest over a difference of opinion, when in the end we're all shooting for the same goal. We're all Texan fans here.
TimeKiller
Guest
So your hangup is the word "project"?
So it's okay for Greene and Coffee to be backups but not Barwin because the word "project" was invoked? Gotcha.
Besides, we all know no C or G would've been picked to replace the best C to ever play the game.
What the alphabet would look like without Q and R?
spurstexanstros
Texans Rising
During the draft talk I was venting my frustration about drafting yet another DE I predicted something that came true. I said that the Texans should have drafted a rb with their second round pick. The last thing the Texans needed was yet another DE especially after signing a high priced DE in Antonio . My prediction was that the Texans should prepare for the event that Steve Slaton had a sophomore slump or got injured the Texans would need help at the running game. I said that drafting a DE and not a running back with the second round pick would cost the team the playoffs.
Sure enough...my fears came to life. Steve Slaton had a sophomore slump with turnovers and teams game planning for him. What made it worse was that any backup they had for him failed just as miserably. The Texans lost games because they could not get one yard for a TD (3 games). I advocated drafting Shonn Greene or Glenn Coffee ( both were available when we reached on Barwin)
As I watched the game on Sunday night and saw Shonn Green pound the Bengals defense ( a decent one) costing the Texans a shot at the playoffs, another question popped in my mind that I asked the "Barwinistas" When this decision to draft a DE with this pick cost us games and the playoffs are you still gonna be glad we drafted Connor Barwin?
Well Barwinistas? are you?
( I dubbed supporters of that pick Barwinistas because they ripped those opposed to it viscously and criticized our football knowledge. however there were a few that disagreed; SWT and myself...and some others I cant think of at the moment)
Sure enough...my fears came to life. Steve Slaton had a sophomore slump with turnovers and teams game planning for him. What made it worse was that any backup they had for him failed just as miserably. The Texans lost games because they could not get one yard for a TD (3 games). I advocated drafting Shonn Greene or Glenn Coffee ( both were available when we reached on Barwin)
As I watched the game on Sunday night and saw Shonn Green pound the Bengals defense ( a decent one) costing the Texans a shot at the playoffs, another question popped in my mind that I asked the "Barwinistas" When this decision to draft a DE with this pick cost us games and the playoffs are you still gonna be glad we drafted Connor Barwin?
Well Barwinistas? are you?
( I dubbed supporters of that pick Barwinistas because they ripped those opposed to it viscously and criticized our football knowledge. however there were a few that disagreed; SWT and myself...and some others I cant think of at the moment)
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Glenn Coffee has done jack. There is no way you can say having him would have changed anything this year. Shonn Greene on the same number of carries has run better than Moats (and .2 ypc better than Foster) but also has 3 fumbles to his credit. Greene and Foster are the same size. Maybe Greene would have made a difference, maybe.
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
I honestly feel that during that stretch that you stated about not being able to get one yard, no RB would've been able to. Foster's recent success is from a group that finally had a season behind them.
In no way can you compare the Jets line to ours because theirs will win 9 times out of ten. Coffee - I was pro Coffee all day on this board but he hasn't really made a difference over there in San Fran.
In no way can you compare the Jets line to ours because theirs will win 9 times out of ten. Coffee - I was pro Coffee all day on this board but he hasn't really made a difference over there in San Fran.
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Goldensilence
hipster elite
Ok well Marcus time to collect.
As per NFL.com Final stats for Barwin
18 tackles, 12 Solo and 6 assists, 3.5 sacks (though some argue it should be 1 more), 4 passes defensed, and one fumble recovery.
Someone will throw out that "well he leads all rookies that play part time!" Awesome.
My problem isn't necessarily Conor Barwin's production, which I guess conditions considered isn't bad. My problem is drafting a pass rushing specialist in the second round after signing a DE to a big contract. This team had holes that were bigger then this. IMO I think we could've gotten the same production from Nading, Bulman, and Jamison.
For kicks I went and looked at Bulman's stats from last year.
18 tackles, 11 Solo and 7 Assists, 4 Sacks, and no passes defensed.
I guess we gained 4 passes defensed for a second rounder.
Meanwhile we could've used to pick to plug serious holes on the interior of the OL with Max Unger or Andy Levitre. Who started for Seattle and Buffalo respectively.
As SpursTexansAstrons pointed out, as well as I have before, Shonn Greene would've looked nice in a Texans uni as well as LeSean McCoy. I guess for fair sake had Foster been inserted well before the last few games we would've gotten a similar boost, I think though with second rounder in tow Kubiak's hand would've been forced much sooner.
Though many people before the draft stated that they wouldn't touch William Moore with a 10 foot pole he would've been a much more welcome addition then watching Busing chase people.
It's not unrealistic expectations that I set that Barwin couldn't meet, really after taking him I thought well any production at this point would be a bonus considering the pick is wasted. When you're a team pushing for the playoffs with a few glaring needs you can't afford to take project players early.
Do I hope he develops into an unstoppable force? Sure, yes as a Texans fan I want all my draft picks to succeed wildly because we depend on them to. I just don't see him breaking out like say Elvis Dumerville anytime soon.
As per NFL.com Final stats for Barwin
18 tackles, 12 Solo and 6 assists, 3.5 sacks (though some argue it should be 1 more), 4 passes defensed, and one fumble recovery.
Someone will throw out that "well he leads all rookies that play part time!" Awesome.
My problem isn't necessarily Conor Barwin's production, which I guess conditions considered isn't bad. My problem is drafting a pass rushing specialist in the second round after signing a DE to a big contract. This team had holes that were bigger then this. IMO I think we could've gotten the same production from Nading, Bulman, and Jamison.
For kicks I went and looked at Bulman's stats from last year.
18 tackles, 11 Solo and 7 Assists, 4 Sacks, and no passes defensed.
I guess we gained 4 passes defensed for a second rounder.
Meanwhile we could've used to pick to plug serious holes on the interior of the OL with Max Unger or Andy Levitre. Who started for Seattle and Buffalo respectively.
As SpursTexansAstrons pointed out, as well as I have before, Shonn Greene would've looked nice in a Texans uni as well as LeSean McCoy. I guess for fair sake had Foster been inserted well before the last few games we would've gotten a similar boost, I think though with second rounder in tow Kubiak's hand would've been forced much sooner.
Though many people before the draft stated that they wouldn't touch William Moore with a 10 foot pole he would've been a much more welcome addition then watching Busing chase people.
It's not unrealistic expectations that I set that Barwin couldn't meet, really after taking him I thought well any production at this point would be a bonus considering the pick is wasted. When you're a team pushing for the playoffs with a few glaring needs you can't afford to take project players early.
Do I hope he develops into an unstoppable force? Sure, yes as a Texans fan I want all my draft picks to succeed wildly because we depend on them to. I just don't see him breaking out like say Elvis Dumerville anytime soon.
Jackie Chiles
Veteran
When its all said and done Barwin is going to have a better career than either of those RBs, I believed it when we drafted him, I believe it now. If you are going to play the what if card, what if Barwin has 8-10 sacks next year? I think he is going to make a quantum leap next season.
dc_txtech
All Pro
Exactly, it will be 2-3 more years before we know what the right decision was.
RagingBull
Hall of Shame
I wanted them to take Max Unger. Would have made a bigger difference this year than Barwin I think.
stingray
Hall of Fame
I thought you of all people, with your screen name, would understand how sometimes you have to develop a player. Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker are two great examples. Different sport but good example. Those two were taken late and were given time to develop. Look how they turned out. I'm not saying that Connor will be great but he has the tools. It's an investment.
And yeah, maybe Shonn Green could have put us over the top and in the playoffs but I rather take a chance on Barwin for this team to potentially be great later rather than just decent now..
A decent running back can be had pretty much any round. We now have Foster and Slaton. Maybe a late round big back to compliment and we are good.
spurstexanstros
Texans Rising
I said that then to...especially when in the third they took a center...my response was if you needed a center then why not take the best one in second round?
Comparing Tony and Manu to Barwin is totally different.
Tony was an immediate impact player but needed to be polished and has grown from a rookie. Barwin was in no way an impact player for the Texans. He had his moments but the game did not come down to his performance.
Manu on the other hand was a revolution unto himself..he changed the way the NBA looked at foreeign players and in fact I believe Manu is the best foreign player ever.(now not so much) Barwin is not the best DE ever and he didnt make plays his rookie year that led to playoff wins..so no on that as well.
As for a decent rb can be found in any round...then why didnt we find one last year? That was a lame excuse in the draft and so was the line..we will find one in FA...we didnt. And I cant believe anyone on here is wiling to mortgage our running game on Foster and Slaton...if so we would be making the same mistake.
Well, if you want to collect, collect. Your post reeks of to much 20/20 hindsight. And there way too many on here besides you that didn't like a certain pick, and then when the season is over, jump in here and rant and rave how you were right, and they were wrong.
If you want to declare Barwin a bust after one season, fine if it makes you feel better, but I think I'll wait a couple of years.
And there's this typical "meanwhile we could have done this, or done that". Typical 20/20 hindsight, "I know more than they know" bullshit. Give it a rest.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Conner Barwin turn the corner? What's the hurry? We're still waiting on Amobi Okoye to turn a corner so I haven't even started thinking about when Barwin will turn the corner.
Seriously though he'll show up next year. I really do expect that. He needs increased playing time to make an impact and he'll get it. One more training camp and this season under his belt and he'll be fine.
Since it's been a couple of years though I have no qualms about calling Amobi the bust that he is. 10th overall and no impact whatsoever. You could get his level of play from a street free agent and NFL minimum wage.
Seriously though he'll show up next year. I really do expect that. He needs increased playing time to make an impact and he'll get it. One more training camp and this season under his belt and he'll be fine.
Since it's been a couple of years though I have no qualms about calling Amobi the bust that he is. 10th overall and no impact whatsoever. You could get his level of play from a street free agent and NFL minimum wage.
New_Texans
Rookie
Connor Barwin had a typical rookie season...up and down...what the hell were you guys expecting? He went in the 2nd round had 4 sacks and actually applied pressure when he didn't run himself out of a play.
Remember that Mario Williams dude? He had around 4 sacks his rookie year and then oh...yeah double digits the next two seasons and then nearly again this past season while playing with a bummed out shoulder.
Give the kid time.
Remember that Mario Williams dude? He had around 4 sacks his rookie year and then oh...yeah double digits the next two seasons and then nearly again this past season while playing with a bummed out shoulder.
Give the kid time.
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Ask yourselves this question.
If everyone had known then what they know NOW, do you think for one second that Brian Cushing would have fallen to the 19th pick?
Here's another.
If everyone had known then what they know NOW, do you think for one seond that Demeco Ryans would have fallen to the 2nd round?
Drafts are what we all thought they were . . . crap shoots!!!!
Sometimes you roll 7s, sometimes you roll snake-eyes.
If everyone had known then what they know NOW, do you think for one second that Brian Cushing would have fallen to the 19th pick?
Here's another.
If everyone had known then what they know NOW, do you think for one seond that Demeco Ryans would have fallen to the 2nd round?
Drafts are what we all thought they were . . . crap shoots!!!!
Sometimes you roll 7s, sometimes you roll snake-eyes.
spurstexanstros
Texans Rising
its not that it is...we could be a playoff team if drafting decsions went a different way...and here is the example.
It is not 20/20 hindsight..alot of us saw this coming and got ripped ridiculously.
I just want them to not make the same draft mistakes...draft a rb... secondary help and some ol back ups..."For the love of God no more DE's"
spurstexanstros
Texans Rising
You dont draft projects or tweeners with the first or second round pic. 2nd round are high value picks and we needed a high value player. We didnt get that with Barwin.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Teams like Pittsburgh, New England, and Philadelphia draft projects in the 1st and 2nd rounds all the time.. Perhaps they don't know what they are doing.
By the way, that project was a pretty effective player for this team this year.
Ndevine7
Rookie
You do draft projects in the first or second round if you feel that they have the potential. Not everyone you draft is gonna be a bonafide starter there first season. We got lucky with Demeco and Cushing. In the limited time Barwin saw he was impressive and with another full training camp under his belt he could be a high quality player next year. Was Mario a bust cause he had a poor first season?
stingray
Hall of Fame
Tony Parker an immediate impact player? He averaged 9 points and shot 41% his first year? Yeah, that's a great impact!! LOL!
Yeah, And you are talking about Manu now because if they knew now what they didn't know then, he would have picked in the top three. You are acting like the Spurs knew he was going to do what he did. Come on man, you can't have it both ways. The Spurs have also missed on many other foreign and project players that they drafted. They just hit on Manu and Tony, and that's all you need to do is hit on a couple of projects.
Also, Manu didn't change the way the NBA looks at foreign players. Drazen Petrovic did that. Drazen was on his way to have just as good or better career than Manu but he was killed in a car accident. And I hope you meant that Manu is the greatest player to come from a foreign league because as the best foreign born player, Manu is not even close. That title belongs to Hakeem Olajuwon. Manu couldn't shine Hakeems shoes.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Perhaps it was also a mistake to draft a high impact player in the 4th round?(Glover Quin) Because, you are supposed to draft projects in rounds 4 and 5, right?
Ndevine7
Rookie
im guessing owen daniels was a poor pick in the 4th round we shouldve drafted a project
stingray
Hall of Fame
I think you just made my point.
And noTony Parker was not an immediate impact player. He averaged 9 points and shot 41% his first year? Yeah, that's a great impact!! LOL!
Yeah, And you are talking about Manu now because if they knew then what they know now, he would have picked in the top three. You are acting like the Spurs knew he was going to do what he did. Come on man, you can't have it both ways. The Spurs have also missed on many other foreign and project players that they drafted. They just hit on Manu and Tony, and that's all you need to do is hit on a couple of projects.
Also, Manu didn't change the way the NBA looks at foreign players. Drazen Petrovic did that. Drazen was on his way to have just as good or better career than Manu but he was killed in a car accident. And I hope you meant that Manu is the greatest player to come from a foreign league because as the best foreign born player, Manu is not even close. That title belongs to Hakeem Olajuwon. Manu couldn't shine Hakeems shoes.
Barwin had a Typical rookie year.
If Mario hadn't gotten hurt he probably would havehad more sacks. I'm looking forward to seeing if Barwin can make the typical rookie to 2nd year jump.
A good offseason and I think he will.
Greene was drafted before our 2nd rd pick. So that is a moot point.
Coffee didn't do squat. If you want to talk Unger that's a different conversation.
But Barwin has as much potential as anybody we could have drafted at that point in the 2nd rd. IMO
If Kubes had played Foster earlier in the season this season may have turned out differently.
Foster looked about as good as Greene and better than Coffee but it took Kubes a whole season to see what he had in Foster.
Kubes love for C.Brown knew no bounds this season.
If Mario hadn't gotten hurt he probably would havehad more sacks. I'm looking forward to seeing if Barwin can make the typical rookie to 2nd year jump.
A good offseason and I think he will.
Greene was drafted before our 2nd rd pick. So that is a moot point.
Coffee didn't do squat. If you want to talk Unger that's a different conversation.
But Barwin has as much potential as anybody we could have drafted at that point in the 2nd rd. IMO
If Kubes had played Foster earlier in the season this season may have turned out differently.
Foster looked about as good as Greene and better than Coffee but it took Kubes a whole season to see what he had in Foster.
Kubes love for C.Brown knew no bounds this season.
spurstexanstros
Texans Rising
But can Hakeem shine Manu's three rings?..lets save the Spurs rockets rivalry smack for when the Rocketts matter in the playoffs...ummmm when #21 retires...or the proper thread.
anyways back to the topic...with the second round pick in the NFL you need to take a highvalue pick. NBA's second round far different than NFL not same value.
What is the expiration date on first round picks before you start mentioning the "B word"?
I'm just curious, because I'm starting to feel like Rip van Winkle waiting for Amobi to become...errr...develop into that player deserving of a first round pick.
But I suppose three years is too soon, simply because we are a 'benefit of the doubt' fanbase/franchise. We gave HWSNBN five years to prove he was a gigantic bust.
You are not really comparing the Texans to the Steelers, Patriots, or Eagles, right?
We are not a team that has the depth that allows you to afford picking project players in the first round. JMO
Jackie Chiles
Veteran
If we hadn't drafted Barwin last year we would have had to get a pass rusher in the first or second round in this next draft. Heck, I'd like to see us grab a DT early with some pass rush ability. As much as all of you naysayers don't want to believe it Barwin made an impact this season and was part of the reason our defense made a big jump. We invested our two premium picks on defense and it paid off this year. What kind of production is going to be enough to satisfy you next season?
What?
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
You would rather us act like the Lions and Browns in the draft since we have similar records this decade?
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
I think Hakeem is fine with his two rings and NBA MVP trophy in his home. The Spurs must have enjoyed being knocked out by the Mavericks, in the FIRST round, so quickly last year, huh? Hakeem > Manu, no question.
And give Barwin time. He's shown some great flashes this year. Amobi had a good rookie season, but so did Mario... We'll wait and see what direction he takes.