Wish to make a one time donation? Make it here.

Welcome to the Texans, OT Laremy Tunsil.

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Attitude may not be the right word.
This is Foster:

And I'm with him.
living in a reaction based society having the wherewithal to pick and choose who is worthy of your energy; especially in a harmfully negative way as in squabbling over cultural divides; is almost a necessity of our times. Arian has that "these old dogs will never learn new tricks" attitude, but doesnt want to attack someone that doesnt even seem to understand how wrong they are. I cant even fathom growing up in a time where you had to use seperate restrooms. Separate water fountains. It pains me to see how many people still long for those days. I want to believe we live in better times.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
OK, good.
To be honest, I don't remember where and when and how the name come about.
(I'm 61, not that young anymore, and too much reading on various subjects, from travel, cooking, business, history, geography, law, science, literature, fictions - from Stephen King to Dean Koontz, whats that guy's name who's famous for all the military and spy stuffs?)

But basically, it stemmed from either the 4 or 3 man front to counter the offense.
..........

You have 5 offensive linemen, and in the old days, a RB and a FB, plus the QB, a TE, and two receivers as a base scheme on offense.

Let's say the TE and the FB stay to block. That's 7 men (along with the 5 linemen).

So the defense usually counters with a 4-3 or 5-2 front.
(7 defenders in the box).

With 2 receivers, it makes sense to have 2 CBs.

That left 2 safeties.
If you want to defend the pass, especially like in a 3rd and long situation, you keep both safeties back.

With a 4-man front, it's only natural that you drop the 3 LBs back along with the 2 CBs in a 5-man zone (if you want to play zone).

With a 3-man front, you can bring the WILB up to rush, and the SILB back (he's facing the LB, for simplicity).
You now have a 4-man front and a 5-2 zone.

The 5 zones are also designed to counter the routes that the offense can run from various formations.

For simplicity sake, the TE can run a quick hook, up 5 yards and stop/turn.
The LB can drop back in the hook zone to defend this route.
The MLB takes care of the middle hole, with an eye on the FB (but also on the TE in case he runs a quick shallow crossing route.)

So on and so forth.

The priority of the 52 zone is to prevent the deep pass.
Theoretically, you have two safeties to help out the 2 CBs on the two receivers - one or both can be a deep threat.

With variations of the routes run by the offense, the 52 can morph into cover 4 (and a host of cover 3), depending on the scheme and the defensive play call.

It's really interesting to read and learn (with video aids) over the years.
I started to learn at the end of the 2006 season.
It's fascinating.
So fascinating that I declare football is the best sport game on earth.

I downloaded playbooks (both NFL and NCAA) and started to learn.

Let's say the offense line up in the standard offset I formation, with a RB and a FB.
And they have a TE (the Y) next to the RT, with a receiver on either side (X on the weakside left, Z on the strong side right.)

And I try to learn what the offense can do out of that base formation, via the playbooks.
And I started to question and look for how the various defenses counter them.

I was semi-retired somewhere between 08 and 09.
I started spending about 360 days a year to watch, read, and learn.
I was more studious than when I was in college.
I went to sleep learning football.
I woke up with thoughts about plays and formations.

I had numerous playbooks in my car.
While I drove, I had my thought about a certain play.
What if this, what if that.

I spent more time learning football than I did on my double-major in college (Electrical Engineering and Computer Engineering, while also taking business and economy courses).

I had worked for UH System for about 5 years, so I took the advantage to be a "professional student" that never use the degrees.
(I came out and open my own small business - not for money, just for the independence).

The bottom line is it allowed me the free time to learn about football.
At one time, I had said that it's a joy to share the knowledge about the football we come to love.

It's never about being right.
Like when I "defended" KJax and Chris Myers.
It was about appreciation for the players they are.
Or with the misconception that Foster had fumbilitis in college (which mr tex still harps on - I bet you he didn't even see many of those fumbles.)

It's rather sad.
What happens to not guilty until proven?

You just read that the guy "fumble" the ball; you never see how it happened.

Similarly, with a QB's interception; not all of them are the same.
When a guy throw a hail-mary just before the half or at the end of the game is not the same.

When it's 3rd and 29 at midfield, an INT downfield is just like a punt.

A lot of times, i bring up stats, but trust me, I vested those stats more carefully than most.
I do generalize at times, but overall, I do not screw up the integrity of the data - it's just not me.

Thank you for reading, and for the love of the game - whatever is left of it.
The 52 Monster Defense
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Question, you keep mentioning the RPO, and stating that perhaps DW should’ve kept the ball more often. To me it sounds like you’re describing the zone-read option


I believe the RPO is where the QB reads the LB and either gives to the RB if the LB stays back or pulls it and throws it to the vacated area if the LB crashes down, ala how the Eagles beat the Patriots with Nick Foles at QB. Foles was never a threat to run the FB.
It's a combination of what you're describing. Sometimes he needs to pull it and run other times he he needs to pull it and throw to the TE/WR on that side of the field. Hence: The name RPO. (You already know this so I cant understand why you would ask me this question) What he doesn't need to do is run the inside dive 15 times in a half.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Attitude may not be the right word.
This is Foster:

And I'm with him.
Good for you.

Attitude is exactly the right word and 1 of the reasons he was an UDFA.

Example: he is in the Kaep crowd and the Kaep crowd is bad for business. He looks at players like they're slaves and Owners are the plantation bosses.

In a way he's correct, but this just in, everybody that works for somebody else fits in this category. (One of the reason You and I chose to work for ourselves.) The boss calls the shots and if the employees have an issue with that then they can go find another job/Field to work in.) This actually has nothing to do with race. Why do you think the McNair's kept RS and his incompetence around so long? Very simply he made them $$$$ and was good for business.

Uncomfortable truth is employees are a means to an end. (That's exactly how the Texans org has been run since 2002.) Along the way the employees work to feed their families etc... if they aren't happy with the $$$$ or job they have they are free to move on. AF wants it both ways he wants the huge amount of $$$$ he made that will take care of his grandchildren's grandchildren and he wants say in when/where he works within his field. Business doesn't work that way in the NFL because the NFL is a monopoly, but hey if AF truly had this conviction he could've used the $$$$ that he made off of his rookie contract and opened up his own business where he accepts the risks and he gets to cal the shots. But AF would rather b!tch than accept that risk.
 
Last edited:

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Yup..not hard to grasp. The biggest play of the Buffalo playoff game...3rd and 18, DW4 checked it down to a wide open Duke who was about 8-10 yards short of the 1st upon catching the ball. Duke went and made the play himself.

He's got great skill guys around him, he has to learn to trust them more & let them make plays too.
Same goes for the OL. He has to trust them that if the defense is gonna give up the big play, trust that the OL will be able to contain a 4 man rush.

I don't want Watson to become a "Check-down Charlie". Take what the defense gives. In that particular play, there was no blitz. It was a 4 man rush. And the secondary was playing alot of underneath coverage, which means he knew Nuk was eventually going to get open over the top. In that case, I want him to trust his line, trust his feet to make a play. (if anything, criticize DW for missing that throw)

Now if the Bills blitz'd in that situation, I agree, he has to find his open man quickly.

You bring up that Duke play. Once again, the Bills rush 4 and the OL couldn't create a good pocket. If DW looked to quickly make a play in that case, he should have hit Carter who was sitting around 12 yards short of the 1st. Instead, he escaped the pocket and bought some time. That extra time made the secondary back up more, giving just enough room Duke needed to get to that 1st down line.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Same goes for the OL. He has to trust them that if the defense is gonna give up the big play, trust that the OL will be able to contain a 4 man rush.

I don't want Watson to become a "Check-down Charlie". Take what the defense gives. In that particular play, there was no blitz. It was a 4 man rush. And the secondary was playing alot of underneath coverage, which means he knew Nuk was eventually going to get open over the top. In that case, I want him to trust his line, trust his feet to make a play. (if anything, criticize DW for missing that throw)

Now if the Bills blitz'd in that situation, I agree, he has to find his open man quickly.

You bring up that Duke play. Once again, the Bills rush 4 and the OL couldn't create a good pocket. If DW looked to quickly make a play in that case, he should have hit Carter who was sitting around 12 yards short of the 1st. Instead, he escaped the pocket and bought some time. That extra time made the secondary back up more, giving just enough room Duke needed to get to that 1st down line.
DW4 is having problems quickly going through his progressions. So the answer is only give him a couple of reads and if they aren't there then take off running
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
That would help because the OL isn't consistently giving enough time to get to that 3rd read.
They dont always give him time for a 3rd read, but often they do. Part of it is DW4's still learning to speed up going through his reads. Example: Brees/Brady/Rodgers/Wilson and even Mahomes go through their much faster which requires less time for the OL to hold up in pass pro.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Defenses are too good for qb's to be able to consistently sit back there without moving. most of the time its on the qb to buy that time to get to that 3rd read by shuffling up, back, left or right...even if the routes are short. You have to have a truly dominant o-line on par with the 90's Dallas o-line to expect your o-line to hold their blocks consistently long enough for the qb to sit back there and get to his 3rd read without really having to move some...
 

House of Pain

Waiting this thing out
I'd actually argue that you love the misery

Here you are trying to convince yourself that one of the dumbest people in the NFL football didn't mortgage a ton of the team's future for a guy he'll also have to over pay after he also failed horribly in building the offensive line, but his logic as a GM is all of a sudden without question? Mistake #1 as a Texan fan. Trying to make yourself believe that a constant failure as a team leader and HC isn't making foolish moves to hurt this team still and that this one move is going to make them better every year as you just put it is "asking for the misery." I know that this team isn't going to win squat with O'Brien, and I also saw how foolish that move was and how selfish it was on his part "just to save his job" and what do you know at the end of the year he got an extension to be the General Manager even further even after humiliating himself in the playoffs again. You're holding out hope and strong faith that this disaster that Cal McNair brought onto the fans is going to somehow work itself out and correct its path. The signs have shown again and again it is not. You're going to have to keep dealing with the rejection of OB's decisions and why they are not measuring up. I think that is a much stronger misery to absorb.
I actually would argue that you and some of the other posters had difficulty comprehending what I wrote.

TL;DR

I stated:
-Majority of fans were having a fit in the preseason/offseason that we should protect Watson at all costs and we were 'too cheap'
-We over paid
-Our OL is serviceable (meaning won't get him killed by having MATT KHALIL at LT)
-OL will continue to get better as they play together more because the talent is there
-Have to protect Watson at all costs because without him we are back to the drawing board
-Some of you like misery

What I didn't state:
-These were good moves
-We didn't overpay and should have plenty of draft capital left over to fill holes on defense
-Any sort of positive statements about O'Brien as a HC or GM or in any capacity
-I believe that these moves get us closer to a championship or fixing the institutional problems with the Texans ownership and management

We have the talent to protect Watson. Coaching needs improvement but it's easier to find a better coach that to make an untalented player get talent. Please read more closely next time.

I still stand by my statement about posters on TT loving misery.
 

otisbean

Veteran
Contributor's Club
It's a combination of what you're describing. Sometimes he needs to pull it and run other times he he needs to pull it and throw to the TE/WR on that side of the field. Hence: The name RPO. (You already know this so I cant understand why you would ask me this question) What he doesn't need to do is run the inside dive 15 times in a half.
For me, when I think RPO, I think more about what Philly did against the Pats in the SB. To my eye, I don’t see us run this version often. I see us running more of Modified triple option where DW can hand off, run it himself or throw to the TE. Usually Watson was rolling to his right. Philly would RPO more from the pocket with Foles which is what I’d like to see with Watson. Our version was effective in some games however it often looked like we had spacing issues with too many players too close to each other- this was a common issue for us in our passing game throughout the season. I guess long story short, I don’t think of an RPO as a QB run/throw option as much as an option version of play action, where the QB either gives the ball or pulls and throws to the vacated area. So when you’re saying DW needs to run it more on RPOs it’s confusing. Hopefully my explanation makes sense
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
For me, when I think RPO, I think more about what Philly did against the Pats in the SB. To my eye, I don’t see us run this version often. I see us running more of Modified triple option where DW can hand off, run it himself or throw to the TE. Usually Watson was rolling to his right. Philly would RPO more from the pocket with Foles which is what I’d like to see with Watson. Our version was effective in some games however it often looked like we had spacing issues with too many players too close to each other- this was a common issue for us in our passing game throughout the season. I guess long story short, I don’t think of an RPO as a QB run/throw option as much as an option version of play action, where the QB either gives the ball or pulls and throws to the vacated area. So when you’re saying DW needs to run it more on RPOs it’s confusing. Hopefully my explanation makes sense
We are on the same page, you just did a better job of describing what we both want than I did.

There still needs to be the threat of DW4 keeping it though. How many times did he keep the ball on the RPO's last year? Not many, I don't know if BOB told him not to keep it or not but if so then that version of the RPO offense will never be successful against top tier defenses.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
"you really dont want your quarterback to run" ... literally the very first thing he said. LOL

 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
"you really dont want your quarterback to run" ... literally the very first thing he said. LOL

NFL blocked the video

But I dont want my QB running alot because it increases the chances of him getting hurt. Of course if it comes down to running and winning or throwing from the pocket and losing I say run your butt off and let the chips fall where they may.
 

Earl34

Veteran
"you really dont want your quarterback to run" ... literally the very first thing he said. LOL

Good find and an interesting twist on the basic RPO concept. The closest play I've seen to what Pederson is teaching was the red zone play in Watson's first year. It was an RPO with Hopkins in the slot and was used inside the 5 yard line. I think there are differences between RPOs and zone reads.

I also find it funny that posters claim Wentz is a big, strong arm OB type QB. Yet, Pederson who is a better offensive coach than O'Brien has Wentz running RPOs and not sitting in the pocket and standing tall.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
What else can we say about Tunsil? Either he reup with us or not. We do know the contract he will receive from either us or some other team will be massive. Hopefully this time we don't strikeout.
 

banned1976

American
Tunsil is going to get paid by the Texans or some other team.

The Texans will step up to the plate. They pay their own guys.
Depends. The Texans have let plenty of “home grown” guys slip out of their grasp recently (since O’Brien came on board). Just on the o-line 3 immediately jump to mind - Jones, Brooks, and Brown. Being that the Texans didn’t actually draft Tunsil, that could work in his favor, as far as staying here that is.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Depends. The Texans have let plenty of “home grown” guys slip out of their grasp recently (since O’Brien came on board). Just on the o-line 3 immediately jump to mind - Jones, Brooks, and Brown. Being that the Texans didn’t actually draft Tunsil, that could work in his favor, as far as staying here that is.
That was when RS was in charge. Brown was a Bob McNair directive.

Since BOB's been running things he's re-signed Martin/Mercilus and traded Clowney. So you could be correct but dont worry, Tunsil will be re-signed.
 

banned1976

American
That was when RS was in charge. Brown was a Bob McNair directive.

Since BOB's been running things he's re-signed Martin/Mercilus and traded Clowney. So you could be correct but dont worry, Tunsil will be re-signed.
Both of which they were overpaid (in my opinion) and together they account for a whooping 27.7 million in dead cap for 2020. Neither Martin nor Mercilus are worth 11 and 10.5 million a year. Their performance over the course of the season proved that. They’re both going to have to improve...if they even can.

My worry is the Texans are going to wind up overpaying guys O’Brien likes personally. Never mind the pesky little detail of talent deficit, they “keep battling”. They get beat but hey, they tried hard.

That’s the problem with a HC assuming the GM job. There’s zero checks and balances. I don’t care who the HC is, the two positions should be separate. It’s like in manufacturing the Director of Manufacturing is also the Director of Quality. It usually doesn’t work.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Both of which they were overpaid (in my opinion) and together they account for a whooping 27.7 million in dead cap for 2020. Neither Martin nor Mercilus are worth 11 and 10.5 million a year. Their performance over the course of the season proved that. They’re both going to have to improve...if they even can.

My worry is the Texans are going to wind up overpaying guys O’Brien likes personally. Never mind the pesky little detail of talent deficit, they “keep battling”. They get beat but hey, they tried hard.

That’s the problem with a HC assuming the GM job. There’s zero checks and balances. I don’t care who the HC is, the two positions should be separate. It’s like in manufacturing the Director of Manufacturing is also the Director of Quality. It usually doesn’t work.
Agreed about Mercilus/Martin

There's good reason to be worried.

JJ/Belichick/Parcells etc.... would disagree with you.
 
True Dat ! The young man and his agent have the Texans by the ying-yang.
Us and pretty much any other team that hasn’t already had to pay through the nose for a LT. QBs, LTs and top tier CB and DE have become the positions that you have to pay first. Oh you have your outliners like Zeke in Dallas but overall those positions are the game changers. Trouble we have is the two biggest, QB and LT, are going to hit either at the same time or at best back to back. Usually teams try to spread the damage around but that didn’t work out for us.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Us and pretty much any other team that hasn’t already had to pay through the nose for a LT. QBs, LTs and top tier CB and DE have become the positions that you have to pay first. Oh you have your outliners like Zeke in Dallas but overall those positions are the game changers. Trouble we have is the two biggest, QB and LT, are going to hit either at the same time or at best back to back. Usually teams try to spread the damage around but that didn’t work out for us.
I have the perfect solution............give them both everything they want...........and pay them big money with big bills

1582523302536.png
1582523360572.png
1582523416165.png
1582523518084.png
1582523639303.png
 

zshawn10

All Pro
Interesting discussion this morning between LZ and Granoto regarding Tunsil and Watson:
Evidently, Tunsil has already turned down a contract offer from the Texans that would have made him the highest paid OLman in the league. Gulp.

The more interesting part was discussing whether Watson and Tunsil realize (and maybe they do) how much they might genuinely hamstring this franchise’s ability to not only retain other key players but also surround them with winning talent. Yes, we talk about it frequently here. But they were coming at it from the player’s perspective. How does a player balance a desire to win against getting PAID?

Texans meet with Pro Bowl left tackle Laremy Tunsil's agent, several others @KingTunsil78 https://t.co/cjZFh9gmci
— Aaron Wilson (@AaronWilson_NFL) February 28, 2020
One of the Texans’ major offseason goals is locking up one of their cornerstone players: left tackle Laremy Tunsil. Tunsil could become the highest-paid offensive lineman in the NFL and top Philadelphia offensive tackle Lane Johnson’s $72 million deal that includes $55.845 million guaranteed and averages $18 million per year.

Tunsil is expected to aim for a deal averaging at least $19 million to $20 million per year, according to league sources not authorized to speak publicly. Although contract negotiations with Tunsil haven’t heated up yet as he approaches the final year of his rookie contract with a current $10.35 million base salary for 2020, the Texans have held preliminary discussions about their best offensive lineman. The AFC South champions met with Tunsil’s agent, Jimmy Sexton of Creative Artists Agency, this week at the NFL scouting combine, according to sources.

The Texans already made a hefty investment of draft capital to land Tunsil via a blockbuster trade with the Dolphins that involved sending away a pair of first-round picks and a second-rounder. Tunsil, the Texans’ first offensive lineman to be named to the Pro Bowl since left tackle Duane Brown in 2014, allowed just three sacks last season and had an 89.9 pass blocking grade, according to Pro Football Focus. That ranked him second in the NFL behind Ravens left tackle Ronnie Stanley. Tunsil also ranked first in the NFL with 18 penalties with three declined and a dozen false starts.

The Texans want to be proactive about negotiating long-term contract extensions for players like Tunsil, quarterback Deshaun Watson and inside linebacker Zach Cunningham. Watson, a Pro Bowl selection, is now eligible for a blockbuster long-term contract extension with a price range of $38 million annually under a contract worth at least $190 million. Talks for Watson aren’t expected to pick up until later in the offseason. The Chiefs are expected to make quarterback Patrick Mahomes the highest paid player in the league. "Watson, Tunsil, Cunningham, I would say the sooner we can get some of those deals done the better," Texans coach Bill O’Brien said. "We want those guys on the football team for a long time. That’s the way I feel about it. Deshaun Watson, we want him here in Houston for his whole career. I love Deshaun Watson, everything that he’s about. "I would say Laremy and Zach, all those guys, anytime you can solidify your team earlier in someone’s contract, that can be a good thing for your football team. We’re working through all those different things daily."

Meanwhile, the Texans met with several other representatives for pending unrestricted free agents. That includes defensive lineman D.J. Reader, running back Carlos Hyde, tight end Darren Fells, long snapper Jon Weeks, kicker Ka’imi Fairbairn, running back Taiwan Jones, linebacker Barkevious Mingo and cornerback Phillip Gaines as well as restricted free agent linebacker Dylan Cole, according to sources.

The market for Reader is expected to be extremely expensive and he would be difficult to retain if he hits free agency with a market of $11 million to $13 million in average annual compensation anticipated and multiple NFL teams interested in the 6-3, 347-pound former Clemson standout, according to sources. "D.J. Reader has been a really good player for us," O’Brien said. "We’re in the process of talking to a lot of different players for us that are headed into free agency. Hopefully, we’re able to keep as many people as we can."
 

ATXtexanfan

Hall of Fame
Interesting discussion this morning between LZ and Granoto regarding Tunsil and Watson:
Evidently, Tunsil has already turned down a contract offer from the Texans that would have made him the highest paid OLman in the league. Gulp.

The more interesting part was discussing whether Watson and Tunsil realize (and maybe they do) how much they might genuinely hamstring this franchise’s ability to not only retain other key players but also surround them with winning talent. Yes, we talk about it frequently here. But they were coming at it from the player’s perspective. How does a player balance a desire to win against getting PAID?
If the texans traded the house for you, why settle for LT money? Why not qb money? What are the Texans gonna do? Let you hit free agency for LT money and you pick where you play?
 

thunderkyss

It's good to be me... again.
Staff member
Contributor's Club
DW4 is having problems quickly going through his progressions. So the answer is only give him a couple of reads and if they aren't there then take off running
If only it were that simple.

If we were 2-6 & just trying to get something going, yeah. But our situation where Watson looks brilliant some moments & not so much others, I'd like to get at & address the root of the problem.

The play caller being vaguely involved during the week hinders the process of meshing two minds to work as a cohesive unit.

Like I said in another thread, I hope Carl Smith gets more involved in the scouting & game planning, then he & Kelly can work with Watson & iron out all the offensive miscues.
 

thunderkyss

It's good to be me... again.
Staff member
Contributor's Club
That would help because the OL isn't consistently giving enough time to get to that 3rd read.
I wonder if at times he's starting on the wrong read. I mean depending on the read he gets at the line, he should have an idea of how the play called will stress that defense.

After the snap if the defense doesn't do what Watson expected he may his first read may throw off the timing of the whole thing. So when we see open receivers he's on another step of his progression.

There are times when the OL doesn't give him time, but not as often as it's being made out to.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Interesting discussion this morning between LZ and Granoto regarding Tunsil and Watson:
Evidently, Tunsil has already turned down a contract offer from the Texans that would have made him the highest paid OLman in the league. Gulp.

The more interesting part was discussing whether Watson and Tunsil realize (and maybe they do) how much they might genuinely hamstring this franchise’s ability to not only retain other key players but also surround them with winning talent. Yes, we talk about it frequently here. But they were coming at it from the player’s perspective. How does a player balance a desire to win against getting PAID?
Some weeks ago I posted a contract offer for tunsil at five years 91.5 or about 18.2 / so I think we're really close and it would still be money left over to sign other free agents. No one should get freaky at this point they're not that far apart in my opinion but just wait and see.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
Interesting discussion this morning between LZ and Granoto regarding Tunsil and Watson:
Evidently, Tunsil has already turned down a contract offer from the Texans that would have made him the highest paid OLman in the league. Gulp.

The more interesting part was discussing whether Watson and Tunsil realize (and maybe they do) how much they might genuinely hamstring this franchise’s ability to not only retain other key players but also surround them with winning talent. Yes, we talk about it frequently here. But they were coming at it from the player’s perspective. How does a player balance a desire to win against getting PAID?
Texans and their ignorant player retention policies have only themselves to blame for this pickle they find themselves in. The Tunsil trade being the most idiotic b/c of the trade capital given up w/o having a deal in hand for an extension. Tunsil and his agent have the Texans by the shorthairs and everyone knows it. The Texans are screwed in regards to this negotiation. Tunsil will wind up leaving the Texans for better money and the Texans will be standing there with their pickles in their hands trying to figure out how they will put a positive spin on what just happened.

I will preface this with a, "I know it wont happen" but If I were in charge of this shite show......it would be time to tear down this empire of false hope and start over while eating plenty of dead money along the way. Scrap it all and lick the wounds during the recovery period. The Texans are too far away from the top SB contenders (in reality) and trying to play catch-up with little reasonable cap space and handicapped drafts in 2020 and 2021.....this is exacty why the Texans cannot make up the difference. It doesn't help when a couple of supremely valuable 2021 UFA have the team bent over a barrel and could account for a massive chunk of their available cap if re-signed.

I'd start by calling the GM, HC and OC into Cal's office and letting them know that the GM and HC will be given a new 5 year clock. Why? Because Cal doesn't possess the balls to tell OB you're ducking fired. At the same time, since Cal is totally sold on him, he's going to give OB the leadway to rebuild the franchise exactly the way he would like to see it done.....and then hopefully hold him accountable for the results.

It would start by TRADING ALL ASSETS....that would be the priority of the day and many more thereafter.

Watson (Returns 4 solid picks between 2020/21. 1 being inside the top 5 of 2020)
Hopkins (Returns 3 solid picks between 2020/21)
Stills (Retruns 1 pick n 2020)
Tunsil (Returns 2-3 solid picks between 2020/21)
Martin (Returns a solid 3 sheets of McDonads Coupons.....1 pick)
Fulton (Same as Martin)
Watt (Returns a solid 2 picks)
Mercilus (Returns a solid 2 picks)
McKinney (Returns a solid 2 picks)
Cunningham (Returns 1-2 picks)
Kelemete (Same as Martin and Fulton)
Fuller (Returns 1-2 picks)
Coutee (Returns a pick......maybe from the Cardinals....Conditional at that.)

There should be enough meat left on those bones to rebuild the 2020 and 2021 drafts.

Let the UFA's move on after qualifying offers so the team could recoup some COMP Picks in return.

3 years of drafted players and inexpensive bridgers would do the job while their replacements develop. 4th year, be open to compete for talented UFA to fill holes while hopefully enjoying some playoff success. 5th year should be nut-cutting time for OB's efforts.

I'd re-sign in 2020:

McCarron- QB
Fairbairn- K
Addae- S
Jones- RB
Weeks- LS
Adams- OLB

In all honesty, I could live with a sell-off provided the Texans had a real plan in place as to how they would rebuild their franchise. Oh, if a player is showing the ability to outplay his contract......get him signed well before he becomes an UFA.
 
Last edited:

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
I, for one am sure glad you're not in charge of this shite show
Then I'm glad that I'll never have to read a negative comment or any post(s) of disappointment from you regarding this shite-show going forward. You're evidently very satisfied with the current results.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Then I'm glad that I'll never have to read a negative comment or any post(s) of disappointment from you regarding this shite-show going forward. You're evidently very satisfied with the current results.
You don't have to read any of my comments at all. I feel free to express my opinion regardless of how you take it

I'm not satisfied with it at all, but do you really trust OB to get it right enough you want to give him ANOTHER 5 years to attempt to do so?
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
You don't have to read any of my comments at all. I feel free to express my opinion regardless of how you take it

I'm not satisfied with it at all, but do you really trust OB to get it right enough you want to give him ANOTHER 5 years to attempt to do so?
JB, giving OB a clean slate doesn't harm the team one way or another. If he fails as GM and HC with the current crop.....they'll leave as their times arrive and the only thing the Texans would get in return are COMP Picks. That doesn't salvage the damage already done. If OB signs Watson and Tunsil with both insisting on receiving full market value.....that's going to leave little to no wiggle room.

Sorry about my abrasive rebuttal but I'm only voicing an opinion of complete change b/c OB has to either be exposed as a fraud or the next best thing. Having him work with players he may not be fully onboard with....will only lead to continued excuses and him constantly having a golden parachute to save his arse. Make him fully responsible for building a team he has always envisioned. That will require cap and draft resources......in which the Texans are in short supply of.

By the way, I always like reading your post(s) even if we have differing opinions.
 
Last edited:

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
If only it were that simple.

If we were 2-6 & just trying to get something going, yeah. But our situation where Watson looks brilliant some moments & not so much others, I'd like to get at & address the root of the problem.

The play caller being vaguely involved during the week hinders the process of meshing two minds to work as a cohesive unit.

Like I said in another thread, I hope Carl Smith gets more involved in the scouting & game planning, then he & Kelly can work with Watson & iron out all the offensive miscues.
The problem is that there's much disagreement on what the root of the problem is.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
JB, giving OB a clean slate doesn't harm the team one way or another. If he fails as GM and HC with the current crop.....they'll leave as their times arrive and the only thing the Texans would get in return are COMP Picks. That doesn't salvage the damage already done. If OB signs Watson and Tunsil with both insisting on receiving full market value.....that's going to leave little to no wiggle room.

Sorry about my abrasive rebuttal but I'm only voicing an opinion of complete change b/c OB has to either be exposed as a fraud or the next best thing. Having him work with players he may not be fully onboard with....will only lead to continued excuses and him constantly having a golden parachute to save his arse. Make him fully responsible for building a team he has always envisioned and that will require cap and draft resources......in which the Texans are in short supply of.

By the way, I always like reading your post(s) even if we have differing opinions.
Luckily the cap is going to have a significant increase so there should be plenty of $$$$ even after signing DW4/Tunsil. They have to find a couple of starters this yr in the draft. (Doesn't matter which side of the ball, but if they can fix the secondary I will be very happy with this offseason.

There's also a late rd coverage LB that I like alot. Davion Taylor (Colorado) He's a little undersized at 6'0 228 LBS but he can really run and started football late so there's much room for improvement.
 

ArlingtonTexan

Moderator
Staff member
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
JB, giving OB a clean slate doesn't harm the team one way or another. If he fails as GM and HC with the current crop.....they'll leave as their times arrive and the only thing the Texans would get in return are COMP Picks. That doesn't salvage the damage already done. If OB signs Watson and Tunsil with both insisting on receiving full market value.....that's going to leave little to no wiggle room.

Sorry about my abrasive rebuttal but I'm only voicing an opinion of complete change b/c OB has to either be exposed as a fraud or the next best thing. Having him work with players he may not be fully onboard with....will only lead to continued excuses and him constantly having a golden parachute to save his arse. Make him fully responsible for building a team he has always envisioned. That will require cap and draft resources......in which the Texans are in short supply of.

By the way, I always like reading your post(s) even if we have differing opinions.
I just think gutting everything and giving OB 5 new years to accomplish anything is the wrong way to go. IMHO, he has 2 years to accomplish and then he's gone if he hasn't shown results. I think Cal is giving him just enough rope to hang himself
 

House of Pain

Waiting this thing out
I would try to make him an offer, and if he just keeps refusing, just franchise him. That's what a competent franchise would do so I may be asking too much.

And I know some of you will claim that he'll just sit out or whatever, but other teams will take notice of a player (Tunsil) that is being offered the highest contract in the league at their position and refuses to sign with that team. How many seasons do you think Tunsil will sit out? Then again, as seen with the Clowney situation, do the Texans brass even have the stomach to do something like that?
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
JB, giving OB a clean slate doesn't harm the team one way or another.
It harms them if he's still in the building having an affect on anything they do moving forward. If I'm in charge of this shit show, he's the 1st one out the door. You're talking about stripping it down and starting over with a new 5 year window....he's the one who got you to that point. He has set this franchise back enough as it is. He can NOT be apart of a tear down and rebuild.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
It harms them if he's still in the building having an affect on anything they do moving forward. If I'm in charge of this shit show, he's the 1st one out the door. You're talking about stripping it down and starting over with a new 5 year window....he's the one who got you to that point. He has set this franchise back enough as it is. He can NOT be apart of a tear down and rebuild.
You would have fired him after yr 1 and re-hired Kubiak.

This is the 1st offseason where BOB's calling all of the shots and you want to fire him after yr 2? LMAO
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I just think gutting everything and giving OB 5 new years to accomplish anything is the wrong way to go. IMHO, he has 2 years to accomplish and then he's gone if he hasn't shown results. I think Cal is giving him just enough rope to hang himself
Unless the bottom falls out BOB will be here for another 4-5 yrs. What the A&M/DW4 only fans need to do is just except this and hope for improvement. Personally I dont think BOB will ever championship and certainly not with DW4 at QB.

Best we can hope for is Kelly going to the RPO full bore and DW4 staying healthy running it. Then maybe the Texans will have an outside shot at a championship.
 


Top