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Welcome to Houston Lonnie Johnson Jr.

Funny how the Texans took only 1 player last draft in Akins from the Senior Bowl they were coaching but their first 3 picks this year were all Senior Bowl standouts.
But this year they drafted Senior Bowl guys in the 1st and 2nd round while in '18 Texans had nothing higher than a 3rd rounder, i.e. more ammo this year.
Sure glad I held on to my Sen Bowl game recording.
 
But this year they drafted Senior Bowl guys in the 1st and 2nd round while in '18 Texans had nothing higher than a 3rd rounder, i.e. more ammo this year.
Sure glad I held on to my Sen Bowl game recording.

True. Justin Reid, Coutee, Rankin were taken at positions of need and highly rated despite not playing in Senior Bowl. Duke Ejiofor was recovering from labrum surgery.
 
Yeah, I'm not seeing it...

I keep looking to love one of these prospects but I'm not really wowed by any of them so far.
True. Justin Reid, Coutee, Rankin were taken at positions of need and highly rated despite not playing in Senior Bowl. Duke Ejiofor was recovering from labrum surgery.
Ejiofors recovery may have determined whether they took a pass rusher higher in this draft. I hope he pays dividends this season.
 
Ejiofors recovery may have determined whether they took a pass rusher higher in this draft. I hope he pays dividends this season.

I think Jaylon Ferguson was in play at 86 but Ravens took him in front. Texans and Ravens showed most pre draft interest in Ferguson bringing him in multiple times for workouts/visits. Very similar player to Ejiofor minus the shoulder injury. Would have been interesting adding him to the pass rush arsenal but not meant to be. Warring and his superior athleticism added to the TE position a nice consolation :)
 
If we actually play more press this year then he will be set up to succeed. If we keep playing off then he's going to struggle.

Going by how Crennel called the defense last year.....

THIS!!!! 100% this!! I hope this guy doesn't struggle with the faster receivers. I'm worried about this pick to be honest, but I will wait and see how he does the next couple of years to know for sure. It will be a challenge for him playing under Crennel IMO.
 
This is like a Casserley draft in which that they go away from the name guy to pick some lesser known guy they like . It better work or the new guys will have a much better choices when they take over .

Honestly, outside of Watson, when has the Texans ever really drafted the most name familiar player? Even Watt and Hopkins in relative terms weren't most name or popular players... Pretty consistent history, even the Texans have gotten the right guy.
 
We needed a FAST (4.3ish speed) cornerback to defend against TY's semiannual TD fest, so what do we get.....a big, dumb, SLOW cornerback.
 
Lonnie is not a walk in and shut down the opposing team's #1 WR CB. There were none of those in this draft. However, there were plenty of guys drafted in the 2nd/3rd round that have the talent to develop into "that guy" eventually while being solid players for their team as rookies. Lonnie is one of those guys and he's unlike any CB we've had on the roster with his size and athleticism. He was rarely tested in coverage and only allowed 18 catches this season.

Biggest weakness imo is taking improper angles in run defense and locating the ball to cause INTs instead of PDs. Both are easily correctable with proper coaching. He only played 2 years of D1 football. Ceiling is sky high.
 
https://www.chicagotribune.com/spor...onnie-johnson-texans-gary-20190428-story.html

A life-changing conversation
For a period in 2016, it appeared Johnson would give up on college and return to Gary.

He committed to Ohio State out of high school but didn’t qualify academically, so he started his college career at San Bernardino (Calif.) Valley College in 2014. It was one of the worst years of his life, he said, as he struggled with living expenses and being away from his parents, who were separating.

He moved the next season to Garden City (Kansas) Community College, which while in the “middle of nowhere” at least provided him with a meal plan so he could eat. The school also had a coach who changed Johnson’s trajectory.

Johnson played multiple positions in high school but was recruited to college as a wide receiver. Garden City coach Jeff Sims asked him to move to cornerback full time in 2015. He had five interceptions that season, his first coming when Nora spent her rent money to drive 13 hours to see him play.

But his grades still weren’t up to par, and Sims let Nora know he would send Johnson home if he didn’t make a change. Nora, who works two jobs as a bus driver and one as a track coach, had a talk with her son.

“I told him, ‘If college is not what you want to do, you can come home, but just know that you’re going to have to do what I’m doing, which is working two jobs,’” Nora said. “The minute I said that, Lonnie was like, ‘You’re working two jobs?’ And he started bawling these tears. And then I started crying. And he went back to college.

“The next week Coach Sims called me and said, ‘I don’t know what you said to him, but whatever you said to him, in one week this boy has done a (180).’ It really changed his life. It really did.”

Johnson sat out his 2016 season to focus on academics, “one of the hardest things” for somebody whose world revolved around athletic competition.

“It was the family,” Jon’Vea said. “If we didn’t care, he would’ve come back home. He was this close to calling it a wrap and coming back home. We definitely pressed him on.”

In 2017, Johnson qualified to go to Kentucky, and Nora still remembers the look of contentment in his eyes when he stepped onto the field during his official visit. He earned a starting spot in time for the last five games of his junior season and had his first career interception in the Citrus Bowl against Penn State as a senior. He graduated in December, finished his football career with 64 tackles and 12 pass breakups and earned an invitation to the Senior Bowl, where he first met with the Texans.
 
It would have been better to draft a guy from the Wildcats front line.


I’m not liking what i see on tapes with LJ.
He needs some serious works.
 
It would have been better to draft a guy from the Wildcats front line.


I’m not liking what i see on tapes with LJ.
He needs some serious works.
I'll reserve my final opinion when I see him in a real game. He's got lots of potential. But as you stated, he's got lots to work on. He earned a PFF 72.0 coverage grade and allowed an 84.0 passer rating when targeted in 2018, ranking outside the top-50 draft-eligible FBS cornerbacks in both categories.
 
I'll reserve my final opinion when I see him in a real game. He's got lots of potential. But as you stated, he's got lots to work on. He earned a PFF 72.0 coverage grade and allowed an 84.0 passer rating when targeted in 2018, ranking outside the top-50 draft-eligible FBS cornerbacks in both categories.
As suspected his coverage skills are, he’s a bigger liability in run support.

This is why they have the term work-out warrior.
 
As suspected his coverage skills are, he’s a bigger liability in run support

I would say he's average in Run support. He was dominate in press man at the senior bowl, but you don't see it in Game tape. He is rarely in press coverage and when he is he gives up the inside way to easily. He is not the CB you want changing directions quickly. To me he can be a solid #2 who is match up Corner. All of the Corners in this draft have question marks.
 
I would say he's average in Run support. He was dominate in press man at the senior bowl, but you don't see it in Game tape. He is rarely in press coverage and when he is he gives up the inside way to easily. He is not the CB you want changing directions quickly. To me he can be a solid #2 who is match up Corner. All of the Corners in this draft have question marks.
Sorry, I have to disagree about run support.
From what I saw on the tapes, he’s a clear liability.
 
The discussion on 610 was he was very physical at the senior bowl man handling receivers at the LOS so seems he can play press. Story was the receivers were plain beat up after him and another CB got done with them, so I liked hearing that
That’s exactly what I wanted. I’m sick of these 10 and 12 yard cushions. I’m hoping they can correct a couple of his technique issues that allow fast Wide receivers to get behind him quickly and leave him behind. See his game tape against DK Metcalf.
 
TBH... I feel like Justin Reid and Lonnie aren't really going to be the best of friends and i'd bring someone in to mentor Lonnie because he could EASILY fall into a "slump" just off the fact that people tend to want to put the blame on the "strong-minded" individual and Lonnie CANNOT transform this secondary on his OWN.

Other than that, I loved the pick and the fact that he is from Gary, Indiana means the Texans are really contributing to offering opportunity to persons who aren't supposed to have those opportunity (statistically)

TBH tho I feel like he's one of those "address the need but let him walk" sorta picks... If you REALLY wanted him to flourish.. Bring in someone similar in build

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If you pay attention... he didn't believe being drafted until the pick actually came out! Once the pick came out, what happened? He didn't hug someone close to him 1st.. He KNOWS he gots HIMSELF to thank for being drafted and you have a complete "WILLING" player, which means he's COACHABLE and my only problem with Lonnie is that he looks too serious... I'd bring a guy in that can loosen him up...

As it stand currently, the Texans are sitting at #6 in positional spending at Cornerback between #4 Vikings and #6 Lions and we DO NOT have the production from our secondary to adequately argue that we should be sitting at #6 in positional spending at Corner...
 
If you pay attention... he didn't believe being drafted until the pick actually came out! Once the pick came out, what happened? He didn't hug someone close to him 1st.. He KNOWS he gots HIMSELF to thank for being drafted and you have a complete "WILLING" player, which means he's COACHABLE and my only problem with Lonnie is that he looks too serious... I'd bring a guy in that can loosen him up...

As it stand currently, the Texans are sitting at #6 in positional spending at Cornerback between #4 Vikings and #6 Lions and we DO NOT have the production from our secondary to adequately argue that we should be sitting at #6 in positional spending at Corner...

Making a lot of assumptions there captain.
 
TBH... I feel like Justin Reid and Lonnie aren't really going to be the best of friends and i'd bring someone in to mentor Lonnie because he could EASILY fall into a "slump" just off the fact that people tend to want to put the blame on the "strong-minded" individual and Lonnie CANNOT transform this secondary on his OWN.

Other than that, I loved the pick and the fact that he is from Gary, Indiana means the Texans are really contributing to offering opportunity to persons who aren't supposed to have those opportunity (statistically)

TBH tho I feel like he's one of those "address the need but let him walk" sorta picks... If you REALLY wanted him to flourish.. Bring in someone similar in build

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="
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:thinking:
That’s the strangest evaluation I’ve ever read. EVER!
 
Lonnie is not a walk in and shut down the opposing team's #1 WR CB. There were none of those in this draft. However, there were plenty of guys drafted in the 2nd/3rd round that have the talent to develop into "that guy" eventually while being solid players for their team as rookies. Lonnie is one of those guys and he's unlike any CB we've had on the roster with his size and athleticism. He was rarely tested in coverage and only allowed 18 catches this season.

Biggest weakness imo is taking improper angles in run defense and locating the ball to cause INTs instead of PDs. Both are easily correctable with proper coaching. He only played 2 years of D1 football. Ceiling is sky high.


These guys...

Long speed is so overrated for the cb position. if you have length, technique & instincts you can be a dominant cb in the league.....which LJJ does have. Speed its just a bonus when you have an absolute specimen like a Patrick Peterson type. But even then its only a bonus if that specimen has the right technique down pact & instincts to go with it. See exhibit A, philip buchanon for someone with blazing speed but shitty technique & 0 insitincts. Apart from that, i wouldn't get too caught up in his 40 times. His technique was just bad..dude came out the blocks & pretty much stood straight up, that's a no no when you're in the drive phase of a sprint. You can see that manifest itself in his backpedal as well at the combine; That's usually a habit taller guys have though & i suspect that learning to stay lower in the backpedal will make or break him.

To me he's a slightly less polished Jimmy Smith of the Ravens. But him as he is now is better than trotting a Shareece Wright's bum ass out there. Instant upgrade to the cb corps imo.
 
Draft Analysts Take on Lonnie Johnson Jr.

Lance Zierlein (Read More Here) of NFL.com described that Johnson is very capable of being a starting cornerback. Johnson is very long and tall with a plethora of advantageous physical traits, benefiting him as a cornerback. Also, Johnson is very smooth in his backpedal, making him a very fluid player, being able to mirror and match the man he is guarding. However, some significant weaknesses that Zierlein points are that Johnson lacks consistency and ball skills. His run defense needs plenty of improvement. Also, he has below average instincts and route anticipation. However, if Johnson can “hone [on] his ball skills and finds the right scheme fit,” he would be able to be a top end starter for the Houston Texans.

Matt Miller’s scouting report (Read More Here) presents a similar situation about Lonnie Johnson. With a very high ceiling and incredible length and size, he can reroute receivers due to his large size. Besides, Lonnie Johnson is a threat to opposing offenses with his intense aggressiveness that accompanies his length and strength. Miller states that Lonnie Johnson is very competitive that has a great work ethic as an alpha dog athlete. However, a weakness for Lonnie Johnson is his run defense as he is often reluctant to tackle in the run game. Johnson struggles to keep up with receivers who have top-end speed. Deflections and interceptions are rare of Johnson as he has a problem locating the football. Although Lonnie Johnson is a very physically gifted play, he struggles with both production and consistency. However, with good coaching and proper fixing of his skills, Miller predicts that Johnson can easily be a Number 1 corner and is even a Pro-Bowl caliber player. Miller also compares Johnson to Chris McAlister, a three-time Pro Bowler.

Lonnie Johnson is viewed similarly (Read More Here) by the CBS Sports Staff. He is a tremendously athletic player that intimidates others. He has a long frame that is very attractive to NFL Teams. His size and toughness prevent him from being tough to beat deep. However, Johnson needs to “do a better job of tackling “ and needs to play with more consistency. The CBS Sports Staff concludes that Johnson offers excellent upside and potential. However, if he can fix his mistakes and hone on his skills, he can be a quick starter and even possibly a Pro Bowler.
 
The fact that pro day times are notoriously inaccurate..?

"accuracy" is relative here.

I've seen his 40 times range from 4.40 - 4.58. So him running a 4.39 is not far fetched if the right set of circumstances are present & a pro day is the perfect set up to achieve these times for obvious reasons.

Bottom line is If you don't like a guy, chances are you're going to want to believe he's closer to that 4.5. If you believe the opposite, then most likely you'll think he plays closer to that 4.4. From what i've seen, he's closer to that 4.4 & he's only going to play more towards that with an NFL S&C program helping him develop physically.
 
TBH... I feel like Justin Reid and Lonnie aren't really going to be the best of friends and i'd bring someone in to mentor Lonnie because he could EASILY fall into a "slump" just off the fact that people tend to want to put the blame on the "strong-minded" individual and Lonnie CANNOT transform this secondary on his OWN.

Other than that, I loved the pick and the fact that he is from Gary, Indiana means the Texans are really contributing to offering opportunity to persons who aren't supposed to have those opportunity (statistically)

TBH tho I feel like he's one of those "address the need but let him walk" sorta picks... If you REALLY wanted him to flourish.. Bring in someone similar in build

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="
" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Lonnie certainly appears to be a complicated young man who grew up in the difficult and challenging environment of Gary, IN which for many years has been among
the most violent cities in the country.
But anywayt it seems the logical person to fill the mentor roll would be JJoe.
 
Draft Analysts Take on Lonnie Johnson Jr.

Lance Zierlein (Read More Here) of NFL.com described that Johnson is very capable of being a starting cornerback. Johnson is very long and tall with a plethora of advantageous physical traits, benefiting him as a cornerback. Also, Johnson is very smooth in his backpedal, making him a very fluid player, being able to mirror and match the man he is guarding. However, some significant weaknesses that Zierlein points are that Johnson lacks consistency and ball skills. His run defense needs plenty of improvement. Also, he has below average instincts and route anticipation. However, if Johnson can “hone [on] his ball skills and finds the right scheme fit,” he would be able to be a top end starter for the Houston Texans.

Matt Miller’s scouting report (Read More Here) presents a similar situation about Lonnie Johnson. With a very high ceiling and incredible length and size, he can reroute receivers due to his large size. Besides, Lonnie Johnson is a threat to opposing offenses with his intense aggressiveness that accompanies his length and strength. Miller states that Lonnie Johnson is very competitive that has a great work ethic as an alpha dog athlete. However, a weakness for Lonnie Johnson is his run defense as he is often reluctant to tackle in the run game. Johnson struggles to keep up with receivers who have top-end speed. Deflections and interceptions are rare of Johnson as he has a problem locating the football. Although Lonnie Johnson is a very physically gifted play, he struggles with both production and consistency. However, with good coaching and proper fixing of his skills, Miller predicts that Johnson can easily be a Number 1 corner and is even a Pro-Bowl caliber player. Miller also compares Johnson to Chris McAlister, a three-time Pro Bowler.

Lonnie Johnson is viewed similarly (Read More Here) by the CBS Sports Staff. He is a tremendously athletic player that intimidates others. He has a long frame that is very attractive to NFL Teams. His size and toughness prevent him from being tough to beat deep. However, Johnson needs to “do a better job of tackling “ and needs to play with more consistency. The CBS Sports Staff concludes that Johnson offers excellent upside and potential. However, if he can fix his mistakes and hone on his skills, he can be a quick starter and even possibly a Pro Bowler.


They're basing his unwillingness to come up & tackle & run support consistency on 1 damn game against Georgia where he kinda got caught looking in the backfield on 1 that led for a TD & another play he broke down a little too early & gave up the outside edge to the RB. Every other situation i've seen dude come up & make pretty solid hits.
 
"accuracy" is relative here.

I've seen his 40 times range from 4.40 - 4.58. So him running a 4.39 is not far fetched if the right set of circumstances are present & a pro day is the perfect set up to achieve these times for obvious reasons.

Bottom line is If you don't like a guy, chances are you're going to want to believe he's closer to that 4.5. If you believe the opposite, then most likely you'll think he plays closer to that 4.4. From what i've seen, he's closer to that 4.4 & he's only going to play more towards that with an NFL S&C program helping him develop physically.

I'm not itching to bash the kid. You've got me mistaken. I'm just pointing out what's a pretty known truth about pro day results - they're infamously skewed toward the local kids. Meanwhile he's got an official machine time, that he was by all good reason as prepared as could be for, that showed a significant increase. Who's really trying to face facts here?
 
They're basing his unwillingness to come up & tackle & run support consistency on 1 damn game against Georgia where he kinda got caught looking in the backfield on 1 that led for a TD & another play he broke down a little too early & gave up the outside edge to the RB. Every other situation i've seen dude come up & make pretty solid hits.
End of thread.
 
I'm not itching to bash the kid. You've got me mistaken. I'm just pointing out what's a pretty known truth about pro day results - they're infamously skewed toward the local kids. Meanwhile he's got an official machine time, that he was by all good reason as prepared as could be for, that showed a significant increase. Who's really trying to face facts here?
Virtually all pro day timed performances should be regarded as suspect. I say virtually because over the years I actually recall only one, maybe only two Draft participants who's pro day 40 was not faster than his combine time.
 
I'm not itching to bash the kid. You've got me mistaken. I'm just pointing out what's a pretty known truth about pro day results - they're infamously skewed toward the local kids. Meanwhile he's got an official machine time, that he was by all good reason as prepared as could be for, that showed a significant increase. Who's really trying to face facts here?


I gotcha man, I'm just pointing out the difference in how we see things. For instance, you say his combine 40 showed a "significant increase"...but can we really say that its an increase? Alot of his game film that he's being judged on is him playing at his homefield stadium. So to me, it would stand to reason that the pro day 40 time in a setting where he's most comfortable is a little better approximation of his speed than 2 one-offs at the NFL combine in unfamiliar territory & a certain amount of stress.

Those machines & scouts don't take into account things like the jitters of interviewing with 30 teams for the job of your life, running in an unfamiliar enviornment & the general uneasiness of the entire NFL combine poke & prod process.

Apart from that i'm mainly just saying people shouldn't be surprised to see huge discrepancies in sprint times. Most of these guys get all of that NFL stuff recorded so by the time their pro day hits, they've course-corrected.
 
I gotcha man, I'm just pointing out the difference in how we see things. For instance, you say his combine 40 showed a "significant increase"...but can we really say that its an increase? Alot of his game film that he's being judged on is him playing at his homefield stadium. So to me, it would stand to reason that the pro day 40 time in a setting where he's most comfortable is a little better approximation of his speed than 2 one-offs at the NFL combine in unfamiliar territory & a certain amount of stress.

Those machines & scouts don't take into account things like the jitters of interviewing with 30 teams for the job of your life, running in an unfamiliar enviornment & the general uneasiness of the entire NFL combine poke & prod process.

Apart from that i'm mainly just saying people shouldn't be surprised to see huge discrepancies in sprint times. Most of these guys get all of that NFL stuff recorded so by the time their pro day hits, they've course-corrected.

Ya, you'd almost think that being in an unfamiliar environment with unfamiliar conditions might be just the kind of job interview to gauge someone who won't be in control of where they play at home or where they play on the road or who they play with or against ... as ultimately it's a neutral environment, control condition to see who can prepare and come in as ready as possible to show who can be the best pro available. Gotta imagine that these kids are more than well aware of these kinds of things heading into such an important part of their professional lives.

And so yes, we can certainly say that a 4.52 vs a 4.39 is a significant increase. Those are the numbers, not lying and everything. And it's not relative - everyone runs the same distance, they know well in advance when they'll be performing, and they know exactly what the stakes are.

The discrepancies aren't because it's just different for different dudes. The whole known buggaboo about pro days is exactly what I'd mentioned earlier - guys embellish results for their kids to inflate their stock. This has been happening and exposed for generations now. And it's almost to be expected given the gravity of the situation. But if you're not taking pro day numbers with an incredibly dense grain of salt then you're honestly kind of kidding yourself and willfully ignorantly trying to paint dudes in the light you'd prefer them to be viewed in.

And just ftr, I kinda like Johnson. He's a guy I could easily root for and genuinely hope he proves any haters wrong. But I'm not going to blind myself to the kinds of things that may well give him a hard time adjusting to this league. He's got his work cut out for him, but I'm hoping that his positive traits, of which he appears to have several, and his competitive demeanor will drive him to the kind of success that will allow us all to look back on this thread and have a good laugh.
 
Ya, you'd almost think that being in an unfamiliar environment with unfamiliar conditions might be just the kind of job interview to gauge someone who won't be in control of where they play at home or where they play on the road or who they play with or against ... as ultimately it's a neutral environment, control condition to see who can prepare and come in as ready as possible to show who can be the best pro available. Gotta imagine that these kids are more than well aware of these kinds of things heading into such an important part of their professional lives.

And so yes, we can certainly say that a 4.52 vs a 4.39 is a significant increase. Those are the numbers, not lying and everything. And it's not relative - everyone runs the same distance, they know well in advance when they'll be performing, and they know exactly what the stakes are.

The discrepancies aren't because it's just different for different dudes. The whole known buggaboo about pro days is exactly what I'd mentioned earlier - guys embellish results for their kids to inflate their stock. This has been happening and exposed for generations now. And it's almost to be expected given the gravity of the situation. But if you're not taking pro day numbers with an incredibly dense grain of salt then you're honestly kind of kidding yourself and willfully ignorantly trying to paint dudes in the light you'd prefer them to be viewed in.

And just ftr, I kinda like Johnson. He's a guy I could easily root for and genuinely hope he proves any haters wrong. But I'm not going to blind myself to the kinds of things that may well give him a hard time adjusting to this league. He's got his work cut out for him, but I'm hoping that his positive traits, of which he appears to have several, and his competitive demeanor will drive him to the kind of success that will allow us all to look back on this thread and have a good laugh.

It’s also to be expected that the skeptical nature of the entire draft process is to lump in every instance of a guy improving his time significantly at his pro day as just home cooking by his home town folks and it’s simply not true. a bad start, something you’re prone to do in uncomfortable settings, can easily add as much as .21 seconds to your 40 time bro. I don’t need to tell you that that’s significant and taking half of that from LJJ’s worst 40 time puts Him as a low 4.4.

Furthermore, coaches and scouts alike bring their own stopwatches to these things so they don’t really trust the combine or pro day results either. There’s also a reason Teams fight for homefield/court advantage and There’s something to be said for being able to perform comfortably and at your best in your familiar surroundings.

But we can agree to disagree.
 
Is there some idiosyncrasy of college ball that makes this OK?

35 year old JJo had 59 solo, 68 combined tackles and almost a PD per game last season.

The really cool answer would be, "Lonnie Jr was so good with his coverage skills that teams didn't even throw his way" ...somehow I am not typing that with confidence.
 
Is there some idiosyncrasy of college ball that makes this OK?

35 year old JJo had 59 solo, 68 combined tackles and almost a PD per game last season.

Nope his scouting report mentioned he didn't make a ton of plays given his size and athletic traits. He's a project.
 
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