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Week 10: Cleveland You Have A Problem

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
yup... BOB made sure of that. Trade away one of our best players, trade away our draft capital, sign players to dumb contracts. He knew he was going down, so he decided to take the Texans with him.
How many yrs before this excuse becomes invalid?

BTW, I happen to agree with you.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Everyone knows... bad weather games are won on the ground. Plain & simple.

Browns Rushing
41 rushes for 231 (5.6 ypc)

Texans Rushing
22 rushes for 90 yards (4.1 ypc)

Texans don't have the personnel to win this type of game. Plain & simple.

Despite that, a possible Texans win was erased by one play. The Cobb drop that would have resulted in a TD. Make that play, and very good chance Texans eek out an ugly victory.
 
yup... BOB made sure of that. Trade away one of our best players, trade away our draft capital, sign players to dumb contracts. He knew he was going down, so he decided to take the Texans with him.
I don’t think it was malicious I just think he was in over his head and desperate to save his job as HC so he did things not looking long term because coaches pretty much never look long term. There was no reason for anyone to think he would be fired after 4 games or even a bad season because in the past anytime the team did bad he got promoted.
 
Everyone knows... bad weather games are won on the ground. Plain & simple.

Browns Rushing
41 rushes for 231 (5.6 ypc)

Texans Rushing
22 rushes for 90 yards (4.1 ypc)

Texans don't have the personnel to win this type of game. Plain & simple.

Despite that, a possible Texans win was erased by one play. The Cobb drop that would have resulted in a TD. Make that play, and very good chance Texans eek out an ugly victory.
Considering Browns were well on their way to winning by just a field goal I’m not sure even that TD would have done it. Made it less embarrassing sure but I still think Browns would have won. They have a running game and playing in their stadium with weather they are use to. We have tackling dummies in uniforms and great weather that the team has been “practicing” in.

In the long run I don’t think it came down to plays at all I think the Texans quit pretty much from the time they got on the field and Browns just wanted it more. And by ore I mean at all.
 

Texazan

Our HOF 34
Blame isn't really the issue. Just need to do better going forward.
Yep, “gotta coach better, gotta play better” ok you get the sarcasm....I don’t disagree but it’s no different then when you see kids going wild in the grocery store and what do we do? That’s right, blame the parents. The parents enabled that bad behavior. Ownership let this happen so no matter how much can be pinned on BOB we’re not here if not for their incompetence.
 
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There are ALOT of things we can blame OB for but having a team that has just given up is not one of them.
This is the same team from the 0-4 start (arguably with a more open playbook). If BOB lost the locker room, has their team leader get in a heated argument about the system, it's because they've given up on him.

Like wise OB is not calling bad time outs
All of 2019's start was criticizing his bad time out usage usually at the end of first halves, to the point where he was getting pissed about it being addressed in his pressers.

bad plays or making the team completely unprepared.
In 2019, they averaged 2.9 pts in the first quarter, which was ~30th in the league. They were 1/16 in first possession touchdowns, and surpassed 7pts in the first quarter only 1 time. The Bills wild card game started out 0-16. They were unprepared to hold a lead in the Chiefs playoff game. This team has a reputation for starting unprepared, and was/is a team that usually gave you one half of good play.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Everyone knows... bad weather games are won on the ground. Plain & simple.

Browns Rushing
41 rushes for 231 (5.6 ypc)

Texans Rushing
22 rushes for 90 yards (4.1 ypc)

Texans don't have the personnel to win this type of game. Plain & simple.

Despite that, a possible Texans win was erased by one play. The Cobb drop that would have resulted in a TD. Make that play, and very good chance Texans eek out an ugly victory.
Thank you DT
 

Decim8

Waterboy
If this happens it will b because of pure luck.

Like I've always said, I would rather be lucky than good, because all of the good people keep talking about how lucky I am.

I'm just kidding, although I'm quite thankful that I've been very blessed.
We could use a bit of luck tbh. The only positive I get from losing out the rest of the season is that it guarantees a clean up of all the coaching staff/easterby (hopefully)
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
We could use a bit of luck tbh. The only positive I get from losing out the rest of the season is that it guarantees a clean up of all the coaching staff/easterby (hopefully)
Getting rid of OB early has guaranteed Easterby's job security for at least this year
 
This is the same team from the 0-4 start (arguably with a more open playbook). If BOB lost the locker room, has their team leader get in a heated argument about the system, it's because they've given up on him.


All of 2019's start was criticizing his bad time out usage usually at the end of first halves, to the point where he was getting pissed about it being addressed in his pressers.


In 2019, they averaged 2.9 pts in the first quarter, which was ~30th in the league. They were 1/16 in first possession touchdowns, and surpassed 7pts in the first quarter only 1 time. The Bills wild card game started out 0-16. They were unprepared to hold a lead in the Chiefs playoff game. This team has a reputation for starting unprepared, and was/is a team that usually gave you one half of good play.
What does anything in 2019 have to do with yesterdays embarrassment? No seriously are you really giving them a pass because they and OB were bad in 2019 so its ok for them to be bad in 2020? Even your argument on them giving up makes no sense. Ok they gave up on him I agree but he's not there so what "We are going to keep giving up because he was here for the first 4 games". If it was me and I had a coach I didn't like and wanted gone and then he was I would play that much harder because I would want to show that he was the problem and without him we can function as a team.

So whats next are we going to start claiming that the reason they are still bad is because they all have PTSD from being coached by OB and we should just be proud that they find the will to still put on their helmets and go out onto the field?
 

KoolAid Sipper

Waterboy
Martin and DJ is 4.6M between the 2, WFV is not under contract
I was using WFV as money available since I was quoting a post. Yes, he's not under contract after 2020. In true Texans style I would wager they end up over paying him if he makes it through the season without missing time to injuries. You're right for 2021 it is 4.6M for Nick and David, I mistakenly used after 2021 for Nick.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
 
I was using WFV as money available since I was quoting a post. Yes, he's not under contract after 2020. In true Texans style I would wager they end up over paying him if he makes it through the season without missing time to injuries. You're right for 2021 it is 4.6M for Nick and David, I mistakenly used after 2021 for Nick.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
They can't overpay him as they have no money, we are going to be taking the cheapest players we can find just to be under cap.
 

Texazan

Our HOF 34
You have a chance to energize the fan base with a new coach and GM and yet you chose to further deflate the whole thing by standing pat and rolling with RAC. That Sounds like something that moron Cal would do.
and the excuse is because of COVID, LOL they're trying to CHEAP out, you're going to lose the opporunity to hire the best coach because you're trying to save money? How then do you expect to hire a GM?? You have no intention. Preacher and RAC folks....pathetic. Test them and do the face to face. What a bunch of BS.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Considering Browns were well on their way to winning by just a field goal I’m not sure even that TD would have done it. Made it less embarrassing sure but I still think Browns would have won. They have a running game and playing in their stadium with weather they are use to. We have tackling dummies in uniforms and great weather that the team has been “practicing” in.

In the long run I don’t think it came down to plays at all I think the Texans quit pretty much from the time they got on the field and Browns just wanted it more. And by ore I mean at all.
That is fair, we never know. But just specifying there were plays to be made, that could have led to a victory for the Texans.
  • The Cobb drop
  • Missed FG
  • Failure to stop a 3rd & 18 conversion (which led to a TD on that series)
I'm not gonna get into speculation about the Texans simply not wanting it. Failure to run the ball, stop the run, or poor tackling has been a problem since game 1. These aren't things that came out of nowhere just for this game.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
I don’t think it was malicious I just think he was in over his head and desperate to save his job as HC so he did things not looking long term because coaches pretty much never look long term. There was no reason for anyone to think he would be fired after 4 games or even a bad season because in the past anytime the team did bad he got promoted.
Agree. IMO, this is why I don't like the idea of the HC also being the GM... especially a HC that is on a hot seat. Just an extremely poor decision by McNair.
 

Earl34

All Pro
Agree. IMO, this is why I don't like the idea of the HC also being the GM... especially a HC that is on a hot seat. Just an extremely poor decision by McNair.
The worst part about this decision is that the majority of NFL owners and even knowledgeable NFL fans know making your HC the GM is a bad decision. Then compound it giving that title to a guy who lacks the experience and temperament to do the job and you get the GM you deserve.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
The worst part about this decision is that the majority of NFL owners and even knowledgeable NFL fans know making your HC the GM is a bad decision. Then compound it giving that title to a guy who lacks the experience and temperament to do the job and you get the GM you deserve.
I'm ok, in rare occasions, of making the HC the GM. But these are rare situations when you have a really good HC FIRST. You don't take a mediocre HC and make him GM.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Good game yesterday. Definitely not the high scoring affair we all thought it was going to be. Obviously the weather was a huge issue.

I think it's tough to evaluate a game like that. I think with our best OL coming back and Chubb coming back, the conditions definitely favored our style of play over yours.
Definitely. That was the type of game the Texans are horrible at. I'm actually quite surprised the game was as close as it was.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
That is fair, we never know. But just specifying there were plays to be made, that could have led to a victory for the Texans.
  • The Cobb drop
  • Missed FG
  • Failure to stop a 3rd & 18 conversion (which led to a TD on that series)
I'm not gonna get into speculation about the Texans simply not wanting it. Failure to run the ball, stop the run, or poor tackling has been a problem since game 1. These aren't things that came out of nowhere just for this game.
Falling behind 2 scores in the 4th qtr and having an attempted comeback fall short has been a constant though.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
The worst part about this decision is that the majority of NFL owners and even knowledgeable NFL fans know making your HC the GM is a bad decision. Then compound it giving that title to a guy who lacks the experience and temperament to do the job and you get the GM you deserve.
Jimmy Johnson says hi !!!
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Everyone knows... bad weather games are won on the ground. Plain & simple.

Browns Rushing
41 rushes for 231 (5.6 ypc)

Texans Rushing
22 rushes for 90 yards (4.1 ypc)

Texans don't have the personnel to win this type of game. Plain & simple.

Despite that, a possible Texans win was erased by one play. The Cobb drop that would have resulted in a TD. Make that play, and very good chance Texans eek out an ugly victory.
Dan Marino says if its snowing, I'm throwing. The Texans are like a bad counter puncher. Why not line up in 11 personel, up teampo/nk huddle and find the mismatch? Its frustrating to see them play slow because of the weather.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Good game yesterday. Definitely not the high scoring affair we all thought it was going to be. Obviously the weather was a huge issue.

I think it's tough to evaluate a game like that. I think with our best OL coming back and Chubb coming back, the conditions definitely favored our style of play over yours.
This play should be in the playbook anytime the Texans are 3rd or 4th and short. Kelly, combined with whomever else doesn't have a clue about play design and scheme.
 

Attachments

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
How many yrs before this excuse becomes invalid?

BTW, I happen to agree with you.
Better coaching and this is a 9 win team instantly. From oline to dline to scheme. I saw the same thing as I heard on the radio today on that disaster of a 4th down play. Why would both tackle setup and allow the de to knife inside if they weren't told to do so? Especially Tunsil, a all pro type of LT. Makes no sense except coaching which we can agree Devlin is garbage
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Better coaching and this is a 9 win team instantly. From oline to dline to scheme. I saw the same thing as I heard on the radio today on that disaster of a 4th down play. Why would both tackle setup and allow the de to knife inside if they weren't told to do so? Especially Tunsil, a all pro type of LT. Makes no sense except coaching which we can agree Devlin is garbage
Agreed

Hope you're right about being a 9 win team, but I dont see it. The talent is really lacking on all levels of the defense and the offense is inconsistent at best. Hopefully the new regime can bring the best out of the offense and the defense can hit on 2 or 3 guys in the draft and add 2 or 3 guys to the defense in FA.

If you traded Watt/Cut N.Martin/Johnson's/dont re-sign WFV/Stills and could sign 1 big FA (Von Miller coming off injury and 2 mid level guys like William Jackson and a cover LB like Williamson or Alex Anzelone in FA would you do it?
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Agreed

Hope you're right about being a 9 win team, but I dont see it. The talent is really lacking on all levels of the defense and the offense is inconsistent at best. Hopefully the new regime can bring the best out of the offense and the defense can hit on 2 or 3 guys in the draft and add 2 or 3 guys to the defense in FA.

If you traded Watt/Cut N.Martin/Johnson's/dont re-sign WFV/Stills and could sign 1 big FA (Von Miller coming off injury and 2 mid level guys like William Jackson and a cover LB like Williamson or Alex Anzelone in FA would you do it?
This just me. Watt is being paid for past production which happens to guys like Watt. He's on pace for 7 sacks and the fewest qb hits in his career. That production is worth 7m a year. He can still be a good player on a good team, but talent needs to be injected and developed. The problem on this defense is Whitney, Mckinney, the secondary, Scarlett and Cunningham. Even with that, I think 85% is coaching. Whitney is shot, Mckinney even before injury was shot (too many false steps) , Cunningham is a missed tackle machine now, Scarlett is a special teams player. In the secondary, Murray is a special teams player, Hargreaves is a zone corner, we don't know what Lonnie is and Reid took a step back imo. I haven't made it to my evaluation of college players yet, but I do know the gm and position coaches need to be able to evaluate and develop both quickly. I missed the WFV part, I wanted Metcalf to replace him in the draft. The way cfb passes the ball now, you can get wr in 3rd and 4th rd. I also wanted the kid in Washington to replace Fuller. I don't think you add Von without JJ being here already. If you want to add Von with JJ, that makes more sense to me
 

Earl34

All Pro
Jimmy Johnson says hi !!!
If you had to pull from the 90s, then my point stands. Jimmy, Belichick, Parcells. Who else? It's a bad idea. Especially when a HC hasn't accomplished much or is inexperienced. By the way, didn't you advocate for O'Brien to have control of personnel sooner than last year? You still think that would have been a good idea?
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
This play should be in the playbook anytime the Texans are 3rd or 4th and short. Kelly, combined with whomever else doesn't have a clue about play design and scheme.
This is still Bill O'Brien's offense, his design, his scheme. That's why it barely moved the needle for me when Kelly was given play calling. You can order different items from the Denny's menu, but it's the same cook making that stuff.

They still can't create mismatches, game plan, adjust, all of those same things that were going on with OB here. That's because it's the same offense, with the same lame ass coaches coaching it. That won't change until you dump this scheme and get something that actually works.
 

SnakeEyes

Waterboy
It’s been 13 years since the Texans have lost to Cleveland. Romeo Crennel was the Browns coach that day. Browns get the victory once again, 23-20 on a mucky field.
I think you time traveled and just added 10pts to each team!

On a side note and the topic of the thread. The Browns are winning this year. So, a W isn't a shocker.
 

CWTexansFan

King Deplorable
Contributor's Club
Good game yesterday. Definitely not the high scoring affair we all thought it was going to be. Obviously the weather was a huge issue.

I think it's tough to evaluate a game like that. I think with our best OL coming back and Chubb coming back, the conditions definitely favored our style of play over yours.
Good point. Also, we have a shitty team.
 

Texazan

Our HOF 34
That is fair, we never know. But just specifying there were plays to be made, that could have led to a victory for the Texans.
  • The Cobb drop
  • Missed FG
  • Failure to stop a 3rd & 18 conversion (which led to a TD on that series)
I'm not gonna get into speculation about the Texans simply not wanting it. Failure to run the ball, stop the run, or poor tackling has been a problem since game 1. These aren't things that came out of nowhere just for this game.
The lack of game plan, scheme to create mismatches, the bonehead TOs, its like BOB never left. The system and the staff suck. Case in point, first time down, kick the FG, put points on the board, feel good about it, it's windy and you're close in so match CLE's FG....BUT if you do go for it fine then have a play ready. Spread out and empty the backfield? No motion? Just have Watson run up the ass of maybe the worst run blocking team in the game right now. Made no sense when you have a QB like Watson and a shiit OL.

So now you've gone for it for it a few times, great, so why on earth do you change your mind and try a 46 yard FG in the swirling wind? Just no plan and certainly no in game awareness. (maybe RAC feared another shiit call by Kelly?) I know I'm AC QBing but I didnt like anything about those calls before they hiked the ball.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
This just me. Watt is being paid for past production which happens to guys like Watt. He's on pace for 7 sacks and the fewest qb hits in his career. That production is worth 7m a year. He can still be a good player on a good team, but talent needs to be injected and developed. The problem on this defense is Whitney, Mckinney, the secondary, Scarlett and Cunningham. Even with that, I think 85% is coaching. Whitney is shot, Mckinney even before injury was shot (too many false steps) , Cunningham is a missed tackle machine now, Scarlett is a special teams player. In the secondary, Murray is a special teams player, Hargreaves is a zone corner, we don't know what Lonnie is and Reid took a step back imo. I haven't made it to my evaluation of college players yet, but I do know the gm and position coaches need to be able to evaluate and develop both quickly. I missed the WFV part, I wanted Metcalf to replace him in the draft. The way cfb passes the ball now, you can get wr in 3rd and 4th rd. I also wanted the kid in Washington to replace Fuller. I don't think you add Von without JJ being here already. If you want to add Von with JJ, that makes more sense to me
I'm looking forward to your college evals.

I've already started digging into some college players. A few that have stuck out to me are the other Alabama CB Josh Jobe, LSU LB Jabril Cox, UAB Edge Jordan Smith any of these guys would be steals in the 3rd RD. I would trade up for Cox.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
If you had to pull from the 90s, then my point stands. Jimmy, Belichick, Parcells. Who else? It's a bad idea. Especially when a HC hasn't accomplished much or is inexperienced. By the way, didn't you advocate for O'Brien to have control of personnel sooner than last year? You still think that would have been a good idea?
I wanted one guy to be responsible for the final calls. No more of the committee BS. So yes, I was happy that if there was failure (There was) we knew exactly who that failure fell upon.

BTW, Hopkins wasn't BOB's call, that was an ownership call.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
I wanted one guy to be responsible for the final calls. No more of the committee BS. So yes, I was happy that if there was failure (There was) we knew exactly who that failure fell upon.

BTW, Hopkins wasn't BOB's call, that was an ownership call.
You do realize you contradict yourself in the same post?

You wanted one guy to be responsible for final calls, but the very next line, you say BOB didn't have final call.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
You do realize you contradict yourself in the same post?

You wanted one guy to be responsible for final calls, but the very next line, you say BOB didn't have final call.
He made the final calls on deals

The McNair's were behind the Hopkins trade.
 

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans 4-3...Post OB!!!!!
He made the final calls on deals

The McNair's were behind the Hopkins trade.
OK, Cal called OB to his office....informed he had had enough of Hopkins and wanted him on the next flight out of Houston. Reiterating, damm the return.....just get him and his baby momma's out of the club house.

OB walked out of Cal's office with hs tail between his legs and few sniffles knowing his next call was to Arizona for his next prison shower re-enactment.
 
If you had to pull from the 90s, then my point stands. Jimmy, Belichick, Parcells. Who else? It's a bad idea. Especially when a HC hasn't accomplished much or is inexperienced. By the way, didn't you advocate for O'Brien to have control of personnel sooner than last year? You still think that would have been a good idea?
You could make the argument that Belichick isn't that good of a GM. He's good at fleecing teams but he has had some huge misses in the draft.
 


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