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USC Proday (40) open to public (results inside)

wow what a wild thread..

All I can say is Bush didn't hurt himself with this workout.. people can argue and pin for or against if this was impressive or not.. I say he did what he needed to do to be a top 5 pick.

What I am hoping is either a) we take him or b) his workout got some team hot to trot for him and wanting badly to make a deal because frankly N.O. with the Brees deal stole some of our bargaining power if we were to trade down. This helps our trade scenario IMO if we were to go that route.

If we take Bush #1 I'll be happy .. If we trade down and gain some picks and possibly get (I went blank) the TE Davis??? ..that guy had some speed and strength also
 
Hulk75 said:
This guy ran a 4.3 40 yard dash and it was on a electronical timer, so that would mean he really ran a 4.25, Holy Crap(sorry) but that is crazy. Even more crazy is that he weighted in at 202 and put up 24 reps of 225lbs, that is amazing.
Click to expand...

Electronic timers are very accurate, if an e-timer clocked him at 4.33 then he ran a 4.33.

The 24 reps really impressed me more than anything. :cool:
 
Tale Gator said:
Electronic timers are very accurate, if an e-timer clocked him at 4.33 then he ran a 4.33.

The 24 reps really impressed me more than anything. :cool:
Click to expand...
The E-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29

He ran on turf so they added .08 to his times.

As I've stated before, everyone who's seen the guy knows he's fast.

I agree the BP numbers are what stands out.
 
What's the story on the sub 11 foot long jump? How is it Carl Lewis had a near 30 foot long jump? These must be completely different types of long jumps, eh?
 
TexansFanatic said:
What's the story on the sub 11 foot long jump? How is it Carl Lewis had a near 30 foot long jump? These must be completely different types of long jumps, eh?
Click to expand...
Lewis had a running start.
 
bad said:
The E-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29

He ran on turf so they added .08 to his times.

As I've stated before, everyone who's seen the guy knows he's fast.

I agree the BP numbers are what stands out.
Click to expand...

No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.
 
tulexan said:
No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.
Click to expand...

So then wouldn't the .08 distort the times even more with human timers considering they are already inaccurate. That may be true for those who stop to early but then how can that apply to someone who doesn't stop on time or like the article you pointed out said start with their index finger and not their thumb.

I think bad had it right otherwise why add the .08 if not to compensate for what is considered a fast track.
 
All of you enhance your calm. Shipleys or Krispy Kreme it makes no difference. They're all donuts and they all rule. Niether one is better. They're both excellent in different ways. If you live in a town where you've got both then you're living in heaven.

Of course if you live in a town where all you have is Dunkin' Donuts you're in hell and there's nothing the rest of us can do to help you. Sorry about that.

That's all I've got to say about that.
 
Let me get my spiel on this whole situation in here; I don't see how anybody can argue against Bush's measureables, as far as his ability to pull away in the open field. However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue, he only carried the ball 20+ times his final year at USC. Since DD will be here, I'm not concerned about that. Although Bush's 24 reps of 225 is incredible (if the stat is real, haven't seen it listed on NFL.com) anyone who scouts talent will tell you that football is played with your legs (or base). Runners drag tacklers with their legs, not their chest.

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs. I have never heard anyone mention this quality for Bush in college, and I don't see any reason why it would start in the pros. Make no mistake, he would rather juke a guy his own size than run through him. His speed and agility made it possible for him to run through arm tackles in college, and he should continue that to some extent; but he also has a tendency to stop and look to cut across field when a defender is in his path, resulting in him going backward or not getting the extra yard. I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I think it was also observed that against a fast defense (Texas) Bush was a seconday weapon in the sense that White tired out the defense first with power running, allowing Reggie to beat everyone to the corner.
Basically, Bush is lightning in a bottle, but not instant offense; he will not be a short yardage back, or get the "tough" yards like top backs who wear out defenses do. If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...
 
tulexan said:
No the electronic timers had him at 4.33 and 4.37. The whole "deduct .08 seconds from the time" thing is because almost all other pro day events were done by hand timers which are about .08 seconds faster than electronic timers because the timers either start late or end early because it all depends on the reaction times of the human timer.
Click to expand...
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?
 
bad said:
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?
Click to expand...

They were different tracks so the deductions varied......I think.
 
As I understand it, and I might be wrong, the e-timers clocked him at 4.25 and 4.29. For official times, they add or subtract time for the surface run on and/or wind factor (ie. wet grass vs. astroturf). In this case, they added .08 seconds, making official times 4.33 and 4.37. The whole .08 seconds for hand timing is irrelevant, but that argument would only make his numbers faster.

Basically, he's fast, but we all knew that. Anyone get any info on his running back drills and wide receiver skills?
 
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement

Crazy4Texas said:
If Reggie comes out under 200 lbs people are going to have to get realistic about him being a NFL RB.

Truth about Sunday, if both of Reggie (gale sayers) Bush 40's are not below 4.4 I truly feel it is going to hurt his draft status.
Click to expand...

also further down in the same post

Crazy4Texas said:
I hope Reggie runs under 4.4 because he has had more time to prepair than any other RB in this draft. If he is able to run 4.35 at 205 to 210 I say he is worthy of #1 pick, if he has to drop down to 190-195 to run 4.35 then he has no chance at RB but could be a good #2 reciever for some team.
Click to expand...

Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206

Crazy4Texas said:
The Truth will come out Sunday! If he comes in under 205 there is going to be trouble. What the guy runs in the 40 at 195 and 205 will not be the same! Clinton Portis was a small back in Denver, and they traded his behind! I don't think Kubiak wants to take that route again. Bush has to be 205 or heaver and under 4.4. If he does, he earns that top pick, if he does not I say trade down!
Click to expand...

Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds I don't know what to say, I've lost 4 pounds in the course of one day. Again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329


Crazy4Texas said:
One thing is for sure, If The RB does not do well, ESPN will deff. not mention it. He should run mid 4.4 and ESPN will make it sound like he broke the speed barrier! I hope he runs in the 4.3 range, he has had more time to prep than any onther player in this years draft and to give a poor performance with the time he has had to prep would be very bad for the guy.
Click to expand...

Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )

On a side note I find it absolutely hillarious that in some of your posts you try to make a point that we should compare Reggie Bush's 40 time to WRs and DB, because your not comfortable with his weight.

But wait thats exactly what you did with VINCE YOUNG:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308183#post308183

Crazy4Texas said:
First off, NFL.com has it written that Matt is said to not be running the 40, my guess is because he has 5.0 speed but should that mattter if his arm is extremely accurate and very strong shoot he had better stats his Senior Year than his Jnr Year when he won the hiesman. Regardless, the media wont attack him like they did Young when he was choosing to opt. out of running the 40.

Bush is working out as a reciever ??? I though he was a Running Back??? If Reggie comes out under 200 lbs people are going to have to get realistic about him being a NFL RB.

Truth about Sunday, if both of Reggie (gale sayers) Bush 40's are not below 4.4 I truly feel it is going to hurt his draft status. Ladaninon Tomlinson, the closest comparison to reggie Bush, ran a 4.38 at 5'10 221 lbs thats 20 lbs more than Reggie Bush. Check the facts yourself and while your there look at the recievers and inspect Chad (riverdance) Johnsons stats http://espn.go.com/melkiper/s/2001/0227/1113401.html
If you look at this web site you will also see LT's numbers and you will also see that Vince Young and WR Chad Johnson have something in common they both posted 4.58 40 yrd dash. I guess that should bring some perspective to people questioning Vince Young's 40 being a slow time unless you people think that Chad Johnson is slow. I hope Reggie runs under 4.4 because he has had more time to prepair than any other RB in this draft. If he is able to run 4.35 at 205 to 210 I say he is worthy of #1 pick, if he has to drop down to 190-195 to run 4.35 then he has no chance at RB but could be a good #2 reciever for some team.

T.J. Duckett is the closest comparison as a power back like Lyndale White, T.J. at 250 ran times of 4.45 in the 40 and had a v-jump of 37 with 25 reps at 225. I will set a standard of T.J.'s marks for White. Check my numbers http://www.nfl.com/draft/2002/individual_workouts.html
Oh while on this page check David Carrs number in the 40 4.79 plus evaluate that the year of of Carrs draft and you will see Carr was #1 QB out of probably the most terrible bunch of QB talent to ever come out of a NFL draft at QB! Just the facts!

I hope Reggie comes through, but if he flops, I think we should trade down.
Click to expand...
 
Carr Bomb said:
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement



also further down in the same post



Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206



Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds. Having said that yet again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329




Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )
Click to expand...

lol. Well done Carr Bomb.
 
For all of you people sayin Bush is a system guy, only put up big numbers cause of his school right? Who in a USC uniform put up bigger numbers? Anyone know Clinton Portis.. about the same size....same speed...not as strong though, he was in Denver, putting up big numbers in a big system. He goes to Washington, horrible o-line, still does good, and last year, better oline, did alot better, and is still a great rb. I think Bush is a better version of Portis.. that's just my opinion.
 
Oh and did I add... Portis was in the same system that Bush will be in if he comes to the Texans? ............. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.. and wait, Portis was a second round pick. Nobody expected 1500+ first 2 seasons.. come on.
 
TreWardTxn said:
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue,

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs.

I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I

If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...[/QUOTE]

TreWardTxn === Just some thoughts...

Did you ever see Barry Sanders play? First, you had to catch him, as he was also a great cutback runner with speed. And, I don't recall anyone ever being concerned with his weight.

Bush is a natural cutback runner. He is not a power back. He doesn't need to drag players an extra 2 yards. I don't know how much you have seen him play. But watching him seems to make concerns melt away. I just don't think you want to try to drive your Ferrari through a chain link fence to see how far you can drag the fencing. You can use your truck for that. But your truck isn't going to win the race.

As far as losing ground to make more yards.... maybe you didn't see Mathis (with his speed) do the same thing on kick offs and outrun these same pros. In fact, he used that same ploy more than once to make it down the field. And I hope Bush doesn't "break that habit".

Reggie Bush has made a career of overcoming doubters expectations. Hopefully, he will continue that in the NFL. If so, we will all be happy campers.
Click to expand...
 
can we just agree that Bush is an oversized Warrick Dunn with better hands...

i think thats the closest comparison to any NFL player. he is just 2 inches taller and 22 pounds heavier.
 
ESPN is about to show highlights of Reggie's workout if anyone is interested.

I will try to post a review of it.
 
bad said:
If I were any more confused right now I'd be a Titans fan.

First we have this:

They ran outdoors on AstroTurf, which was a fast surface. All 40-yard dash times were clocked electronically, which historically adds about .08 of a second to the actual time. For instance, if someone ran the 40 in 4.50 seconds, it really means he ran it in about 4.42 seconds.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/9353513

And this:

There were 26 teams represented, with a total of 50 NFL people, including position coaches from the Browns and the Buccaneers. It's the start of a West Coast swing for scouts. The players ran outside on a wet grass field due to rain. The players were told that .05 would be subtracted from their times because of the poor conditions. Wind was not a factor.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/analysis/individual_workouts#fresno

And in case you're still not confused, there's this.

Grizzled track coaches love to say that the "clock doesn't lie." Well, it does in football.
Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.
The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second -- in this case 4.4 -- and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

http://www.usoc.org/11611_32384.htm

Can we just say he's fast and leave it at that?
Click to expand...


I like that. This 40-time is getting really confusing. And to actually think RB ran the 40 in the 4.25 range is crazy. That's a groundbreaking NFL combine time and writers would be talking all day long about it. I'm pretty sure scouts really don't believe RB ran a 40 in 4.25 legitamitely. Either way, he's fast, and this was a time we all expected out of him. He didn't do anything to hurt his draft status today. Putting 5 more pounds to his frame would have been nice, but to protect his draft status, his 40 time couldn't be compromised at all.
 
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.
 
jacquescas said:
can we just agree that Bush is an oversized Warrick Dunn with better hands...

i think thats the closest comparison to any NFL player. he is just 2 inches taller and 22 pounds heavier.
Click to expand...
Tony Dorsett was 5'11 197lbs.
 
LOS ANGELES -- Scheduled to be the guest of honor at Petco Park on Monday, Reggie Bush strongly hinted that the first pitch of the San Diego Padres' 2006 season will be a curveball.


AP Photo/Ric Francis
Reggie Bush's 40-yard sprint was timed at about 4.37 seconds.

An interesting choice by the Southern California tailback and Heisman Trophy winner, since he delivered nothing but fastballs during the Trojans' "pro day" workouts Sunday afternoon, a session in which Bush clearly cemented his status as the first overall selection by the Houston Texans in the April 29 draft.


Working in front of about 150 scouts and personnel officials, a group that included four head coaches and several general managers, Bush was surgically proficient in every drill in which he participated. He posted an eye-opening 40½-inch vertical jump, performed a very solid 24 repetitions on the standard 225-pound bench press, and was clocked in the 40-yard sprint in 4.37-4.41 seconds, according to a few scouts. The electronic times for Bush were a little quicker, in the 4.33-4.37 range.


In the on-field drills, Bush demonstrated burst out of the backfield. And while there weren't as many balls directed to him as he had hoped during Matt Leinart's throwing session, he caught the ball well.


The Courtship of Reggie Bush
LOS ANGELES -- The wooing of Reggie Bush by the Houston Texans, already an ardent courtship by the franchise which owns the top overall selection in the draft, will progress to the next level later this week.

ESPN.com has learned that the Southern California tailback and Heisman Trophy winner will meet with Texans officials, including owner Bob McNair, in Houston on Thursday. As part of a full day of activities, Bush's agent, Joel Segal, will huddle with Dan Ferens, who handles the Texans' contract negotiations.


Because they hold the top pick in the April 29 draft, the Texans may commence contract negotiations at any point and may, in fact, speak with more than one player. It is not known if the Texans will initiate talks with Segal on Thursday, but it will not be surprising if the two sides use the meeting to get some sort of feel for each other's financial expectations.


Sources confirmed the Texans will meet Friday with quarterback Vince Young. Unlike Bush, the University of Texas star will perform on-field drills for the Texans staff.


The Texans, who aren't likely to trade the first pick, prefer to have the No. 1 choice under contract, or at least with a contract agreement, before the draft begins.


Bush will not do any on-field drills on Thursday. Instead, the day will be more of a get-acquainted visit, in which Bush will meet with coaches and team officials. That process has already begun, as Bush dined on Saturday night with Texans officials at a Beverly Hills steak house.

-- Len Pasquarelli


"Probably not the absolute perfect day that everybody wants to have at one of these things," Bush told ESPN.com after the nearly four hours of drills. "But I felt good. I feel like I came in here today as the No. 1 guy, and I think I'm leaving the same way. So, in that sense, it's pretty satisfying. Now I can kick back and go to the beach for a few days. For me, well, I think I'm walking out of here a winner for the day."


Probably not the biggest winner, though, since Bush's draft status wasn't going to change at all based on Sunday's audition. Unless, of course, he fell on his face in every drill.





Not as tight as LenDale White, the other half of the USC tailback tandem, and the man who holds the school record for touchdowns. Still nursing a sore hamstring he said he sustained at the combine sessions in Indianapolis nearly six weeks ago, White looked soft and performed only in the bench press drill, where he eked out just 15 lifts. He rarely removed his track suit and, when he did, White looked soft. He weighed in at 244 pounds, six pounds heavier than he was at the combine.


White didn't seem concerned about not being able to work out. "I'm the only true big back in the first round, and people who want the physical runner are going to have to look at me," he said.


Several personnel directors emphasized, though, that time is running out on White, who has yet to be timed in the 40.


"At some point, and real soon, he's got to take off that warm-up suit and run," said one of the head coaches on hand. "No one has a 40-time on him and that's not good."

Len Pasquarelli is a senior NFL writer for ESPN.com.




Adjust Font Size:
 
infantrycak said:
Don't play that game--Dorsett was hit by guys like Jack Lambert.
Click to expand...

Don't forget "The Assassin" Jack Tatum, Hell he KO'ed EARL
 
TreWardTxn said:
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue...
Click to expand...

It can't be a fact if it hasn't happened yet.

I'm not a spelling/grammar police sort of guy, but can I just say that the amount of misinformation and the number of blatantly false statements in this thread is appalling to me.

A few notes for any youngsters who may be reading the board:

1. Don't believe everything you read on the internet (or copy and paste into a message board). Learning how to tell the difference between good and bad information is a valuable skill.

2. If you don't know something, don't pretend that you do in order to win an arguement. That sort of attitude just discourages you from learning more about the subject.

3. Believe it or not: someday you'll get so old that you think a long-winded rant may actually do some good...
 
I feel sorry for the UT fans that are represented by you. Honestly, I asked you in another thread but I'm not sure if I ever got an answer (I could have missed it?), but what will you do if Vince isn't drafted? Will you change teams?
 
Carr Bomb said:
Okay I just got off work and checked out this thread and I have to point out one of the biggest flip floppers.

First of all this fellow poster says:

Crazy4Texas past statement



also further down in the same post



Now granted, he wasn't at your bench mark 205 pounds, but does 4 pounds really make a difference whether or not to pass on a player, hell I had the flu last weak and lost 7 pounds, this is absolutely ridiculous, but wait it goes on.

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308206#post308206



Again if your willing to dismiss a player over a measly four pounds I don't know what to say, I've lost 4 pounds in the course of one day. Again Bush lived up to your standard and ran Well under 4.4.

Don't worry Texan fans it goes on:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=307329#post307329




Wow in this post there was no magical 205 pound standard in your post, in fact he met a exceeded all you expectations and still you don't think he had a impressive pro day. I don't know what to say.

In every post you never expected RB to run better than a 4.3 and said you'll be content with that type of performance. You even went as far to say he would justify being the #1 pick if he ran a 4.3 (but of course thats only if he weighed a extra 4 pounds :rolleyes: )

On a side note I find it absolutely hillarious that in some of your posts you try to make a point that we should compare Reggie Bush's 40 time to WRs and DB, because your not comfortable with his weight.

But wait thats exactly what you did with VINCE YOUNG:

http://www.houstontexans.com/fan_zone/messageboards/showthread.php?p=308183#post308183
Click to expand...

Carr_Bomb,

You are the man. This is the best post I have ever seen about a Troll.
 
swzhx0.jpg


Wow, Bush is a Tron fan -- I for one did not know that. :shocked
 
Tejaspro said:
TreWardTxn said:
However, it is a fact that his weight will be an issue,

That said, it is Bush's running style that causes me the most concern. Great backs fall forward and get the extra two yards, the difference between 3rd and 2, and a fresh set of downs.

I think it is also fair to say that Bush will not have the kind of success with stopping, and cutting clear across field as he did in college, and hopefully he will break that habit. I

If he can make up this lack of production in the running game with receiving (screens should be deadly) then maybe he will meet expectations (about 1500 yards), but will likely otherwise fall short ...[/QUOTE]

TreWardTxn === Just some thoughts...

Did you ever see Barry Sanders play? First, you had to catch him, as he was also a great cutback runner with speed. And, I don't recall anyone ever being concerned with his weight.

Bush is a natural cutback runner. He is not a power back. He doesn't need to drag players an extra 2 yards. I don't know how much you have seen him play. But watching him seems to make concerns melt away. I just don't think you want to try to drive your Ferrari through a chain link fence to see how far you can drag the fencing. You can use your truck for that. But your truck isn't going to win the race.

As far as losing ground to make more yards.... maybe you didn't see Mathis (with his speed) do the same thing on kick offs and outrun these same pros. In fact, he used that same ploy more than once to make it down the field. And I hope Bush doesn't "break that habit".

Reggie Bush has made a career of overcoming doubters expectations. Hopefully, he will continue that in the NFL. If so, we will all be happy campers.
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Yes I've seen Barry Sanders play, which is why I know Bush is nothing like Barry. First of, Barry had the lowest center of gravity of any running back ever, Reggie runs upright. He was 5'8'' and still weighed a good 200 when he entered the league. One of his thighs was the size of Bush's torso, he was a much harder player to tackle once he was contacted. Bush is not Barry. Bush doesn't even run like Portis, who has more mass for his frame, and is a much more patient runner who picks his way through cracks rather than looking for a hole to blow through or run around the corner.

Please don't compare running plays to punt returns, they are completley different plays and is the one area where cutting across the field can work occassionaly if good blocks are made; which is why if Bush is drafted, I wouldn't want to see our $60 M investment returning punts, but it is the most NFL ready part of his game.

As for your Ferrari-truck metaphor...that is my point exactly, if the finish line for the race your're in is behind a fence, then what good is gonna do you to have the Ferrari? You need something to do the heavy work, and unless Bush can add this element to his game, he will disappoint. Even guys like Faulk (who Bush has been compared to) were much more physical runners and regularly broke tackles from LBs and S.
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clandestin said:
It can't be a fact if it hasn't happened yet.

I'm not a spelling/grammar police sort of guy, but can I just say that the amount of misinformation and the number of blatantly false statements in this thread is appalling to me.
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You're correct; Reggie Bush's weight (and lack of carries) are pertinent issues. It seems quite certain that it will continue to be so, because even more stout rookie RBs have had problems with this in years past. Sorry for the shortcut...
 
Any back that can boast 24 reps at 225 and run a sub 4.4 is pretty special. He is a very solid all around athlete, that can block if need be, something that DD does not do very well. There is no Vince Young in the equation for us folks, sorry to burn you orange.
 
I am ready to take him with the #1 pick. With a 4.33 forty and his excellent bench press showing, I am convinced he is the guy to be a playmaker. No longer will a running back of ours get caught from behind. Any thoughts? :ok:
 
i really don't think his bench presses equate to the field near as much as the other drills he chose not to perform would have. but i don't blame him for not doing them....he can do all that in the personal workouts. but like i said....i was the first to point out how incredible that bench press number was for his size. only a few people at that size have ever came close to that number in the combine.....and well of course crazy4texas apparently.
 
Ibar_Harry said:
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.
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You got it. I was thinking the same thing. Actually, I was wondering why the Texans were bring in both Vince and Reggie for personal visits? He's why IMO. Maybe they are playing one against the other? If you watch Bush and Vince carefully you will see two very competitive and successful young men. I believe their competitive spirits are playing right into the Texans' plans. Let me be clear, I am 100 percent for Vince, and I think he is best player in college football period, but here's what I think is going on. Again IMO, I believe the Texans has decided to go with Bush with the first pick in this years' draft, however, if they can't get him to agree to a contract before the draft than they are going to draft Vince Young. Because Vince likely would take less money. I can see it playing out like this, they know that Vince would love to stay in Houston and about 50 percent of theirs fan base would love for them to draft him. On draft day, It would go something like this, Kubes would said that after Vince came in for his one-one personal workout, I fell in love with this guy's ability and his upside and that's why we drafted him. Another thing that's clear to me is that the Texans has told Bush's people that Reggie is their guy, why else would this guy be saying that he 99.9 percent sure that he'd be the top pick? So, I hope Reggie has smart people around him because he's going to need them.

:superman:
 
Ibar_Harry said:
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.
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I do not laugh as this is what I would be doing if I were Ferens as well. He does have leverage and should be using it.
 
Ibar_Harry said:
From what Pas said I'm beginning to think the Texans are playing a game with Bush and Young. Is it possible the one who wants the least dollars will be the choice. You might laugh at that, but it certainly looks like they are playing one against the other.
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I don't think this is the case at all. There is no justification for taking Vince Young with the #1 pick. You don't base your decision on where the player is from, which is pretty much the only reason why the Texans would take him. The only reason why they are even aknowledging him is to save face with the Longhorn fans.

If the Texans were interested in replacing Carr then we would be bringing in Cutler and Leinart as well.

Reggie will leave on Thursday as our pick and most likely with at least the basic parameters of a contract in place.

Casserly basically said yesterday after the pro day yesterday that he and Kubiak have seen enough with Bush to make their decision.

Vince will be brought in on Friday to save face and so they can look like they are covering all bases before making their decision.
 
Haha. It's a moot point to mention who Reggie has been compared to. He has been compared to any RB who weighs less than 220 pounds and has had seasons of 1000+ yards. He definitely needs to add a lil bulk to him... but if he puts on 20 or more pounds he wont be able to show off his cutting ability... its easier to get brought down when your waist is an inch larger on either side. Hehehe.
 
tulexan said:
I don't think this is the case at all. There is no justification for taking Vince Young with the #1 pick. You don't base your decision on where the player is from, which is pretty much the only reason why the Texans would take him. The only reason why they are even aknowledging him is to save face with the Longhorn fans.

If the Texans were interested in replacing Carr then we would be bringing in Cutler and Leinart as well.

Reggie will leave on Thursday as our pick and most likely with at least the basic parameters of a contract in place.

Casserly basically said yesterday after the pro day yesterday that he and Kubiak have seen enough with Bush to make their decision.

Vince will be brought in on Friday to save face and so they can look like they are covering all bases before making their decision.
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I think bringing Vince here is also an effort to scare Oakland and Arizona into talking trade. I agree, though, that it's unlikely to happen. And certainly, we are not drafting him with the first pick.
 
ESPN USC pro day article

"Working in front of about 150 scouts and personnel officials, a group that included four head coaches and several general managers, Bush was surgically proficient in every drill in which he participated. He posted an eye-opening 40½-inch vertical jump, performed a very solid 24 repetitions on the standard 225-pound bench press, and was clocked in the 40-yard sprint in 4.37-4.41 seconds, according to a few scouts. The electronic times for Bush were a little quicker, in the 4.33-4.37 range.

In the on-field drills, Bush demonstrated burst out of the backfield. And while there weren't as many balls directed to him as he had hoped during Matt Leinart's throwing session, he caught the ball well."

I highly recommend watching the video footage.
 
Ive been out a while,(my wife having our first baby and another Texan fan) could someone give me an update on how Bush did? what he ran?..............
 
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