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The Texans needs to be working out more kickers

Texecutioner said:
I started this thread saying we needed to bring more kickers in TO TRY OUT.
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You've based your entire argument on the assumption that Rackers is "having trouble". He had, what, one miss in regulation and then hit the game winner? Since when did it become a requirement that guys hit 60% of 50+ yard FGs? Sitting around wishing for a guy like that is like us wishing we had a safety like Ed Reed. Those guys are rare because they're the best.

So, sorry, I can't get on board with the idea that Rackers is a problem. If he starts missing 40-yarders consistently, then yeah. But until then we've got lots more to worry about.

I was about to throw the TV out into the yard when Kubiak punted, but in retrospect it's clear it was the right decision. And one other thing: just because he made the decision doesn't mean he was happy about it, but he still made it.
 
Jeff S. said:
You've based your entire argument on the assumption that Rackers is "having trouble". He had, what, one miss in regulation and then hit the game winner? Since when did it become a requirement that guys hit 60% of 50+ yard FGs? Sitting around wishing for a guy like that is like us wishing we had a safety like Ed Reed. Those guys are rare because they're the best.

So, sorry, I can't get on board with the idea that Rackers is a problem. If he starts missing 40-yarders consistently, then yeah. But until then we've got lots more to worry about.
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Good post...Good points...
 
For more perspective, in 4 more seasons Vinatieri has tried 17 less kicks over 50 yards and has made a lower % of those at 45.5.
 
Jeff S. said:
You've based your entire argument on the assumption that Rackers is "having trouble". He had, what, one miss in regulation and then hit the game winner? Since when did it become a requirement that guys hit 60% of 50+ yard FGs? Sitting around wishing for a guy like that is like us wishing we had a safety like Ed Reed. Those guys are rare because they're the best.

So, sorry, I can't get on board with the idea that Rackers is a problem. If he starts missing 40-yarders consistently, then yeah. But until then we've got lots more to worry about.

I was about to throw the TV out into the yard when Kubiak punted, but in retrospect it's clear it was the right decision. And one other thing: just because he made the decision doesn't mean he was happy about it, but he still made it.
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I find it pretty silly that so many people say that they wanted to throw the remote at the wall or what not because they hated the decision by Kubes, but all because it worked in that particular game everything is fine. To me that is a big flip flop. You either were for it or you weren't. Waiting to see what happened afterward to make your call on that is silly to me, because if the Redskins would have gone right down the field and won that game I feel like you would have been bashing Kubes at that point then. But since it worked he's a genius for it. I don't get behind that. Be decisive about what you think is right in a game. Sometimes teams get lucky and win despite bad decisions, but that will never be the majority of the time. I stand by my thoughts that Kubes should have gone for it regardless of what happened after the fact. On the road when your defense isn't playing well, you go for the win in my opinion.

Yeah, I want a kicker who the coach can trust to hit a 50 yarder in OT. That's what I want. I've seen enough football over the years to know that there will be a ton of games where games come down to what team can hit those important FG's at the end of it. I already watched this team miss the playoffs last season because everyone ignored the problems that Brown was having and said the same stuff you're saying now.

And one more time so some don't get confused. I'm not suggesting that the Texans cut Rackers. Never said that once. I'm not even totally suggesting that Rackers is a problem really. My problem is that if the HC doesn't feel confident in him at the end of a game for a 50 yarder, then look for someone else that you will have confidence in. Maybe you find him, maybe you don't, but I'd like to have a guy on the roster or ready to go that can go in there and make those big kicks if Rackers continues to miss and we're in situations where Kubes is afraid to use him to win a game.
 
Texecutioner said:
I find it pretty silly that so many people say that they wanted to throw the remote at the wall or what not because they hated the decision by Kubes, but all because it worked in that particular game everything is fine. To me that is a big flip flop. You either were for it or you weren't. Waiting to see what happened afterward to make your call on that is silly to me, because if the Redskins would have gone right down the field and won that game I feel like you would have been bashing Kubes at that point then. But since it worked he's a genius for it. I don't get behind that. Be decisive about what you think is right in a game. Sometimes teams get lucky and win despite bad decisions, but that will never be the majority of the time. I stand by my thoughts that Kubes should have gone for it regardless of what happened after the fact. On the road when your defense isn't playing well, you go for the win in my opinion.
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I disagree with your conclusion on the punt but generally agree with the above statements that coaching shouldn't be decided in hindsight. Of course that applies to negative plays as well. Chris Brown tosses a TD last year and basically nobody claims it was a bad coaching decision.
 
infantrycak said:
I disagree with your conclusion on the punt but generally agree with the above statements that coaching shouldn't be decided in hindsight. Of course that applies to negative plays as well. Chris Brown tosses a TD last year and basically nobody claims it was a bad coaching decision.
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I would have totally said that, because all year I said that Brown had no business even being on our roster, much less being in the game at important times. He never showed anything on this team, and Kubes refused to acknowledge it. I hated Having Chris Brown here and had just as much of a problem with him getting GL carries at the end of those games as well that he messed up earlier on in the season.

I hear what you're saying though, and yeah I see a lot of people doing that in here all of the time. If you looked at the game day threads there were all sorts of people flaming the hell out of Kubes when he decided to punt, and were even talking about posting "fire Kubiak threads." Had the Skins won that game on their kick, I can guarantee you there would have been an uproar, but since we ended up winning most of those same people have no problem with it anymore. That's a flip flop where you decide what you like in hind sight. I just have my particular philosophy that you need to have a kicker that you can trust, and I'm probably in the minority but I feel like kickers are very important positions in football even if they only strut out on the field for a few times in a game. Those few times usually end up determining who wins or loses those close games. People like to make fun of kickers and act like they're a bunch of whimps and like they're not important, but they're very important.
 
Texan_Bill said:
Shayne Graham is only 9 of 18 from beyond 50.
Adam Vinatieri is 10 of 22

Rackers 19 of 39


I'm not a betting man, but I know enough to not like those odds.
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Texan_Bill said:
The funny part is Kris Brown is actually over 50% from 50 yards. (18 of 33)
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infantrycak said:
Folks are really overplaying this Rackers can't hit long thing:

Rackers 19 of 39, 48.7% from over 50 yds.
Brown 18 of 33, 54.5% from over 50 yds.

So he has the leg but is marginally less accurate long. But then again he is almost 10% more accurate from 40-49 yes.



Believe I mentioned it was practice. In any event, being in the game doesn't make their legs weaker it makes their aim more shaky.
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infantrycak said:
For more perspective, in 4 more seasons Vinatieri has tried 17 less kicks over 50 yards and has made a lower % of those at 45.5.
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CAK, that was all so page 1... ;)
 
Texecutioner said:
On the road when your defense isn't playing well, you go for the win in my opinion.
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But at that time the defense was playing well...Kubes said he felt like his defense was hot and he was going to trust them..

Even with the bad punt, it worked...

Defense held them to a 50+ yard FG attempt. He was right.
 
Rackers missed the first due to a shitty hold. It was almost completely sideways. I wouldn't have wanted Brown to try it from that distance,u miss an u lost due to field position

Sent from my DROIDX
 
Rey said:
But at that time the defense was playing well...Kubes said he felt like his defense was hot and he was going to trust them..

Even with the bad punt, it worked...

Defense held them to a 50+ yard FG attempt. He was right.
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You mentioned this earlier and that is relevant I'd say about the defense and how I said that I didn't trust our secondary that had gotten burned all day. They were playing better "at the time" of the game. I'll give you that. I still didn't trust them though and I wouldn't in the same situation again if the game was similar. I'd still want to go for the win. Just because we ended up okay in this game, doesn't mean the same result would happen in the next one. That's my philosophy when you have a young defense with a secondary like we have. I'd still want to put my trust in Rackers to win it if I chose him to be my guy. We could trust Brown for years and I liked having him a lot until last season. Again, kickers are important players to me. They decide games all of the time.
 
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Texecutioner said:
I find it pretty silly that so many people say that they wanted to throw the remote at the wall or what not because they hated the decision by Kubes, but all because it worked in that particular game everything is fine. To me that is a big flip flop.
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Nope. I wanted to throw my remote at the time, but I was wrong. The reason I was wrong is NOT because it worked out OK, but because I didn't know all the factors: Rackers' health, his practice kicks before the game, his lifetime avg for 50+yd kicks. I was also mistaken about where the spot would be (I was still thinking it was LOS).

All the kickers with a big leg and a proven record were already signed. So by definition the guys you would bring in to try out are going to be unproven. And then you're gambling on a guy with little or no experience, unless you're talking about keeping two kickers and that ain't happening.

There's no free lunch.
 
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The Skins won the game so the D did not hold them on the one drive Gary saved the game by calling time.
 
Worst idea ever.

Our kicker is fine, Kubiak made the right choice, that shouldn't even be up for debate.

Serious overreacting.
 
In a related subjecy, I heard Cowboys kicker David Buehler missed 4 FG's in practice today, all inside 40. Kris Brown may be in Reliant this Sunday..... as a 'Gurl.
 
meh.....six of one half dozen of another.

We all know damn well no matter which kicker they kept we'd find a reason to *****.
 
So our kicker just hit the game winning FG on OT on the road and you want us to work out more kickers!?
:backsout:

Last time I checked he also has not missed a FG in the first two games, this was not about Rackers as a kicker not being able to make the kick. It was a coaching decision that Kubiak would have made, whoever our kicker was.
 
imatexan said:
So our kicker just hit the game winning FG on OT on the road and you want us to work out more kickers!?
:backsout:

Last time I checked he also has not missed a FG in the first two games, this was not about Rackers as a kicker not being able to make the kick. It was a coaching decision that Kubiak would have made, whoever our kicker was.
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He missed his first try in the 'skins game... a 47 yarder.
 
I've always said that if you have to win the game on the leg of your kicker, and you ask him to nail a deep FG from beyond the 40-yard-line...then you can't whine when he misses.

I'd do away with ALL field goals, if it were up to me. I'd say make the opening kickoff a punt. It opens up an extra roster spot, too. No extra points, and no field goals. You gotta' go for 2 on every TD. The insanity of field goals is the only thing holding NFL back from being an even better professional sport.

How many titles are won or lost, how many playoff spots are won or lost, etc., because of a field goal kicker? It's brutal.

So I say this: If a guy is good from <50 yards, then he's OK as an NFL kicker. He's decent. He's good enough. Because it's a crap shoot after 50 yards. And that means your offense and defense didn't play a good enough game to make the outcome on its own shoulders and not on the leg of a kicker.

I don't cringe when Neil trots onto the field. If he misses, he isn't going to go Vince Young on us and start getting all depressed.
 
dc_txtech said:
Rackers is 5/18 from 50+ over the last 4 seasons. Do you really want him lining up to kick a 53 yarder?
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I didn't make it past this post, but I think this is the point of the original post. You are going to have to make 50+ yarders from time to time. If you don't have a guy that can do that (better than 5/18 at least) then you need to find one who can.

It worked out this time. It's kinda like the halfback pass. Had it worked, great call. If it doesn't, look out.

This is a game where there's always going to be second guessing, even if it works out in the end. The decision, under those circumstances, may have been the right one to make at that time, but at some point during this season you are going to need a 50+ yarder. And you need someone you can feel comfortable with to make that kick. If that's not Rackers, then he's not the guy.
 
Work out more kickers? If anything, the Texans need to workout more punters. Their love affair with Matt Turk is dumbfounding. He's not special in distance or placement. Turk should have had competition in camp.
 
I'm just saying....this thread comes after he makes a game winning field goal and his only miss was a 47 yarder. We're not talking about trading for Vince Young because Matt Schaub threw an interception amidst his monster passing day.
 
Kubes also mentioned that the wind was against that kick in that direction and that kickoffs going that way had been coming up short for both kickers. So, your 53 yard field goal may have virtually been something more like 58.
 
Lucky said:
Work out more kickers? If anything, the Texans need to workout more punters. Their love affair with Matt Turk is dumbfounding. He's not special in distance or placement. Turk should have had competition in camp.
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That was my initial thought on seeing the thread as well.
 
infantrycak said:
Folks are really overplaying this Rackers can't hit long thing:

Rackers 19 of 39, 48.7% from over 50 yds.
Brown 18 of 33, 54.5% from over 50 yds.

So he has the leg but is marginally less accurate long. But then again he is almost 10% more accurate from 40-49 yes.



Believe I mentioned it was practice. In any event, being in the game doesn't make their legs weaker it makes their aim more shaky.
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Yes, but 5-18 over the last 4 seasons ~28%
Kris Brown was 9-14 over that timeframe ~ 64%

I don't know if he lost confidence or had an injury but something happened that caused Rackers to stop being successful from 50+. He was 14-21 in his first 6 seasons ~67%

Speedy said:
I didn't make it past this post, but I think this is the point of the original post. You are going to have to make 50+ yarders from time to time. If you don't have a guy that can do that (better than 5/18 at least) then you need to find one who can.

It worked out this time. It's kinda like the halfback pass. Had it worked, great call. If it doesn't, look out.

This is a game where there's always going to be second guessing, even if it works out in the end. The decision, under those circumstances, may have been the right one to make at that time, but at some point during this season you are going to need a 50+ yarder. And you need someone you can feel comfortable with to make that kick. If that's not Rackers, then he's not the guy.
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I respectfully disagree, the Cardinals won the division back to back years and went to a Super Bowl while only kicking 1 50+ yard FG over the course of 2 seasons.
 
I think having a kicker that can kick it far is better when you have an average to below average offense. My theory, whether it's wrong or not, is that we have an elite offense and should easily be able to move the ball to inside the 30. Being on the 30 gives you a 47 yard FG attempt. If we start on our 20 yard line... that's only 50 yards to move (roughly 3 or 4 first downs).

If you're attempting a decent number of 50+ FGs in a year that means your offense isn't moving the ball as well as it should. We shouldn't have that problem. Move the ball as close as possible and have a RELIABLE and ACCURATE kicker... that's the recipe for a Championship!!
 
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