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Texans for DEFENSE with #1 pick....

With such a HIGH pick and we can trade back to essentially any spot. I want the BEST DEFENSE player regardless of position....

In your opinons WHO IS THE BEST D PLAYER REGARDLESS OF POSITON?
 
teams double Mario Williams and single block Lawson. He's quick but I'm not sure how he would handle NFL Tackles.
 
Texas_Thrill said:
Brooks has been HURT way too much the past two seasons. I can't even remember a mock I've seen lately that has him in the 1st round anymore.

Which means he could be a steal in the 2nd with our first pick. I live in charlottesville and most of the year he was in a situational pass rush mode and only played OLB so I"m a bit wary of his coverage ability.

IS babin BIG enough to play END?
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Babin is 6-2 259 lbs. which is plenty big enough to play DE in a 4-3.

YoungTexanFan said:
Brooks is the next Arrington, Poluz is the next Urlacher.
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Brooks does not have the freakish combination of size, strength, and speed that Arrington had, not to mention Arrington was a legitimate consideration for the #1 overall pick, which Brooks is not and has never been. I don't see Poluz equating to Urlacher but maybe.
 
260 is light weight when you are taking on 320 offensive takles. I mean even Dwight Freeney is 270 but is LIGHTING in a bottle and babin aint no freeney.
 
MorKnolle said:
Brooks does not have the freakish combination of size, strength, and speed that Arrington had, not to mention Arrington was a legitimate consideration for the #1 overall pick, which Brooks is not and has never been. I don't see Poluz equating to Urlacher but maybe.
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No kidding on the first part...and not a good comparison with the second part - so I agree with both of your dissenting comments. Urlacher was a S in College and was much more highly thought of than Poluz.
 
:twocents: Babin lost about 15-20 lbs to become an OLB . Thats where he made his money because I think he ran a 4.6 at the combine and Dom fell in luv .
 
If Babin gains his weight back and we do switch to a 4-3 which I hope we do not, but he will be more effective I think. He plays alot like Kyle Vanden Boch in the 3point stance. He works hard and is not that athletic. He will be ok at DE, but I doubt he will be great. Poluz and Brooks are not close to Arrington or Urlacher, maybe they hit DJ Williams and Vilma, but I doubt that also. AJ Hawk and Greenway are right now considered the best LBs in the draft and I dont think they should get drafted above 9 or 10. Unfortunately this is a defensive draft and not overly high on the quality O players other than O-line. WR and RB are a little slim this year. Jay Cutler from Vanderbilt has impressed me though, the kid has a cocky, psycho, gunslinger quality about him. reminds me of J.P. Losman a little. Also YTF do you really think Manny Lawson will go in the first. The guy will gain 5-10 lbs and be just as fast, but I still see him as a second rounder. Like Vinny said most of Lawson's action comes from the amount of attenton paid to Mario. Will be an interesting offseason.
 
That's a lot of weight to ask babin to gain back. 30-40 LBs in one off-season. He'd lose whatever quickness he had for sure.

Vilma and Williams are two of the best young LB's in the game right now. We don't even have anything that would compare to them.

Hawk could be good for us in either 4-3 or 3-4. at the OLB spot. I think he's a sensible pick and not having to pick for a system. The kid is fast I mean he did keep up with VY when they played Texas if you recall.
 
Texas_Thrill said:
That's a lot of weight to ask babin to gain back. 30-40 LBs in one off-season. He'd lose whatever quickness he had for sure.

Vilma and Williams are two of the best young LB's in the game right now. We don't even have anything that would compare to them.

Hawk could be good for us in either 4-3 or 3-4. at the OLB spot. I think he's a sensible pick and not having to pick for a system. The kid is fast I mean he did keep up with VY when they played Texas if you recall.
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Babin won't need to gain 30-40 pounds. He is already 259 and that alone should be sufficient for a 4-3 DE, but if they have him add 10 more pounds to become 270 again then it shouldn't be that big of a deal for him. I don't think he'll be an elite DE or anything, but he'd be a functional one, and like I said before if we do switch to a 4-3 then we'll need to add another DE in free agency or the draft (preferably a more athletic pure pass rusher like John Abraham of the Jets or Mario Williams from college) because Babin is the only guy on our team that can play 4-3 DE right now. Hawk could help us and we do need LB help, but Wong and Greenwood are locked down with their large contracts so we can't move them. If we stay in a 3-4 then we'll have Peek, Orr, and Babin battling for two LB spots, and if we switch to a 4-3 then Babin will move to DE and Peek and Orr will battle for the last LB spot, so I don't see a new LB fitting in real well this season, and with so many other needs to address and the potential to bring in 2-3 stud OL in this year's draft, I don't think we'd use a 1st-3rd round pick on a LB this year.
 
MorKnolle said:
because Babin is the only guy on our team that can play 4-3 DE right now.
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nope...Walker is the best 4-3 DE on the roster right now....he can play a strongside DE. I think he played there at Jacksonville at times. Walker is the best pass rusher of all our defensive linemen. We need a weakside DE for the QB's blind side if we go 4-3....Peek isn't going to cut it as an elite edge guy....a situational pass rusher may be all he will flat line at.
 
I really don't see Walker playing DE in a 4-3 any more, possibly in his younger years but now I don't see him being able to do that.
 
Coach C. said:
If Babin gains his weight back and we do switch to a 4-3 which I hope we do not, but he will be more effective I think. He plays alot like Kyle Vanden Boch in the 3point stance. He works hard and is not that athletic. He will be ok at DE, but I doubt he will be great. Poluz and Brooks are not close to Arrington or Urlacher, maybe they hit DJ Williams and Vilma, but I doubt that also. AJ Hawk and Greenway are right now considered the best LBs in the draft and I dont think they should get drafted above 9 or 10. Unfortunately this is a defensive draft and not overly high on the quality O players other than O-line. WR and RB are a little slim this year. Jay Cutler from Vanderbilt has impressed me though, the kid has a cocky, psycho, gunslinger quality about him. reminds me of J.P. Losman a little. Also YTF do you really think Manny Lawson will go in the first. The guy will gain 5-10 lbs and be just as fast, but I still see him as a second rounder. Like Vinny said most of Lawson's action comes from the amount of attenton paid to Mario. Will be an interesting offseason.
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I really do think he will rise up more than any player after the combine. He is a physical FREAK!! Some team will fall in love with their prototypical 3-4 OLB convert.
 
Babin would be decent at best. I mean DE is what he played in college so he does have some experience with the position. I just wonder if how he would be against the RUN.

Well my pick on a trade-back at this point his JIMMY WILLIAMS teamed with DUNTA'S INFERNO. :yahoo:
 
Texas_Thrill said:
That's a lot of weight to ask babin to gain back. 30-40 LBs in one off-season. He'd lose whatever quickness he had for sure.

Vilma and Williams are two of the best young LB's in the game right now. We don't even have anything that would compare to them.

Hawk could be good for us in either 4-3 or 3-4. at the OLB spot. I think he's a sensible pick and not having to pick for a system. The kid is fast I mean he did keep up with VY when they played Texas if you recall.
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Meh, I'm not crazy about AJ Hawk. He's an intense player, a FAST player, but put a big body in front of him and he's got problems. I don't think he's strong enough to take on NFL guards or tackles. He had a couple of sacks tonight against ND, but he was pretty much handed Brady Quinn on a platter. Anytime he had to take on a blocker he was pretty much taken out of the play, save for a couple of plays where he got blocked into the ball carrier.
 
Texas_Thrill said:
Babin would be decent at best. I mean DE is what he played in college so he does have some experience with the position. I just wonder if how he would be against the RUN.

Well my pick on a trade-back at this point his JIMMY WILLIAMS teamed with DUNTA'S INFERNO. :yahoo:
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I think Babin plays the run pretty well. He still needs some bulk to play DE though.

I heard Jimmy Williams was in-between CB and safety. If he's slow enough to be considered a safety, then he does us no good at corner because our guys get burned enough already. Unless of course speed is not the reason...
 
big homey said:
I think Babin plays the run pretty well. He still needs some bulk to play DE though.

I heard Jimmy Williams was in-between CB and safety. If he's slow enough to be considered a safety, then he does us no good at corner because our guys get burned enough already. Unless of course speed is not the reason...
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It is for his natural size and ball hawking ability. He is a better version of huff...roughly.
 
big homey said:
I think Babin plays the run pretty well. He still needs some bulk to play DE though.

I heard Jimmy Williams was in-between CB and safety. If he's slow enough to be considered a safety, then he does us no good at corner because our guys get burned enough already. Unless of course speed is not the reason...
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I think Babin could switch to a 4-3 DE without really bulking up at all, although adding a little extra muscle wouldn't hurt if he can do it without losing speed. Peek would have to gain at least 10-15 lbs. to move back to a 4-3 DE if we decided to put him there.
 
Williams is 6'3 215 and runs a 4.47 (conservative estimates from last year.)

Remember he's only been playing corner for 2 years. Extreme amount of upside here. A hitter like Dunta was coming out of college. Sometimes goes for the big hits and misses however.

How many teams get to say they have two shutdown corners? If Buc gets his life together even moderately we can move him to nickel where he doesn't have to be as responsible tackling.

DEFENSE DEFENSE......WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS.
 
Switching Babin to a 4-3 is not that big of deal, there are tons of sub 280 pound DE's in this league. Walker, Payne, Robaire, and Babin is probably the best lineup, pretty much the same thing the 3-4 defense that we had under Capers was. People tend to think that the 4-3 and the 3-4 are like worlds apart, it's really nto that much different. And in almost every long passing down we were playing the 4-3, or more like a nickle-4-2. Even then we weren't able to do much with the current coverage personnel.
 
Walker, Payne, Smith, and TJ aren't really DEs in a 4-3, they would all be DTs. Babin could play DE, Peek could if he gained 10-15 lbs., otherwise he could be a situational pass rusher like Mathis for the Colts. If we switch to a 4-3 I'd definitely think about getting Mario Williams in the 1st round of the draft (obviously after trading down) to be a future dominant DE for us.
 
You know I would look at Mario and go with Jimmy Wiliams if I was going to go that route. I think in the second round you can get Manny Lawson who may rise and get into the first, but he reminds me so much of Demarcus Ware. He would be a solid pass rusher, I think peek, but taller, I think he weighs 10lbs less though.
 
Well I would like to see the o-line addressed in 2 and 3 but I"m definitely for J. WIlliams in the 1st.

Mario seems to be real good but are people projecting him to be an OLB?
 
Texas_Thrill said:
Well I would like to see the o-line addressed in 2 and 3 but I"m definitely for J. WIlliams in the 1st.

Mario seems to be real good but are people projecting him to be an OLB?
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I sure hope no-one is projecting him as an OLB.
 
Why are we even talking about a 4-3 defense when we dont even have a 4-3 coach. Until we find that we should put our thought in a 3-4 d.
 
You're right, but there are way more 4-3 coaches than 3-4 coaches which is why everyone is speculating we will switch to a 4-3.
 
I would be happy with a 3-4 (assuming it is run properly unlike Fangio did), and our team is built more for a 3-4 right now so it might take another year until we can switch to primarily running a 4-3 defense if that is our ultimate goal. Most of the coaches that we are looking at have experience in a 4-3 so I'm guessing we'll eventually switch to that.
 
With which are we better?

In a 4-3:
DT- TJohnson
DT- Robaire - BU DT Payne, DeLoach
DE- Walker
DE- Babin - BU DE Peek?
OLB- Wong
MLB- Greenwood
OLB- ?? Orr?

It looks like we would be a little weak at DE and one OLB spot
But, our DTs would be strong and Wong/Greenwood would be playing in their best spots. (and our #1 picks Babin and Johnson get to start at the same time as our expensive DL Walker and Robaire)

3-4:
DE - Robaire, Johnson
NT- Payne, Deloach
DE- Walker
OLB- Orr
OLB- Babin, Peek
ILB- Wong
ILB- Greenwood, Polk

We are not getting any production from the OLBs in this D now.

To me, it just seems that everyone is out of position in the 3-4. I vote to switch to a 4-3.
 
I;m going to have to say that we should stick with a 3-4 only if it is run the right way and not the vanilla piece of dung we saw when Fangio was running it.
 
SESupergenius said:
I;m going to have to say that we should stick with a 3-4 only if it is run the right way and not the vanilla piece of dung we saw when Fangio was running it.
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The only problem with running it again is most coaches dont use a 3-4
So they most likly dont know how to use it either.
 
Then tell me of all the coaching PROSPECTS that have been mentioned for us....are any of them linked with the 34 or the 43?
 
All I can say is HUFF looked amazing last night taking on that big TE.

Is griffin a senior? I wouldn't mind picking him up with a 3rd if we have it.
 
Ced Griffin is, but the other is a junior. Also if we hire Kubiak he will turn the defense over to a qualified DC. Right now there are some interesting prospects to move up. I have heard names from Chizik-UT to Singletary-SF. Not sure how it will pan out, but Chizik runs a 4-3 and Singletary is versed in the 3-4 and 4-6.
 
Do we have personnel for a 46? I wouldn't mind seeing it come back to Houston.

I've definitely left the Jimmy Williams Camp since I heared he bumped the ref in the game. What was that about?

I really loved what I saw out of HUFF last night though I"m not sure we could trade back that far or if we would trade back that far.
 
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