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Texans DE J.J. Watt undergoes back surgery (out for season 9/27)

Bill O'Brien: 'Arrow pointing toward' J.J. Watt playing in Week 1
2:44 PM CT
  • Sarah BarshopESPN Staff Writer

HOUSTON -- Houston Texans defensive end J.J. Watt could play in the team's season opener against the Chicago Bears on Sept. 11.

Watt had back surgery in late July and has been on the preseason physically unable to perform list since then, but coach Bill O'Brien said Friday that "the arrow is pointing toward" the star defensive end's return in the season opener.

"I would say we're heading in the right direction," O'Brien said. "He certainly feels much better, obviously than he did two weeks ago. I don't think we're at the point today where we're going to say, 'we're going to activate him right now.' But I know that it looks decent for him to be able to play in the first game."

Derek Newton (hamstring) and Duane Brown (quadriceps) during training camp. Newton was in pads during Thursday's preseason finale against the Cowboys, though he did not play.

O'Brien said Newton should be ready to practice this week and play against the Bears, but that he would likely not be able to play in the whole game because he missed almost all of training camp with the injury.

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I'm not feeling to comfortable hearing about Watt returning week 1. O-Brien's wording is still non-committal and I hope this is only a coach trying to muddy the waters for an opposing team.

As far as Newton, as a big man rehabbing from a severe hamstring injury, he may return just as intimidating to the opposing team week 1 as he was standing on the sideline with his pads on this last game.
 
It's my hope the Texans will not play Watt or Newt in this game. If Brown passes his physical, they need to bring him back very slowly as well. If the Texans do play Watt and Newt against the Bears, I certainly hope they will put a snap count on both of them (a very low one) and bring them back very slowly.
 
JamTex said:
It's my hope the Texans will not play Watt or Newt in this game. If Brown passes his physical, they need to bring him back very slowly as well. If the Texans do play Watt and Newt against the Bears, I certainly hope they will put a snap count on both of them (a very low one) and bring them back very slowly.
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Everyone was excited to hear that Watt passed his conditioning test. So I wanted to present an example of an NFL conditioning test:

******************************************************************************
The 300-Yard Shuttle Run

For this test, you need 50 yards of running room.

Start at the goal line.
Run to the 50-yard line. Touch the line.
Run back to the goal line. Touch the line.
Perform the down-and-back sequence three times for a total of 300 yards.
Rest for two minutes.
Repeat the 300-yard sequence.
Rest for two minutes and repeat the 300-yard sequence once more.

The goal is to complete each of your three Shuttle Runs under a certain time based on the position you play. Here are the time targets some might use:

Position Players: complete each Shuttle Run in 58 seconds or less.
Small Linemen: complete each Shuttle Run in 64 seconds or less.
Big Linemen: complete each Shuttle Run in 68 seconds or less.

*************************************************************************
From team to team, this will have some small variations. But they typically total ~1000 yards with some broken up to 25 instead of 50 yard down-and-back sequences, and with some variations of the expected target times.

Any 40 year old off the street in decent shape (not football shape) should be able to pass these conditioning tests.

Watt passing his test has little to do with his preparedness to perform, and perform especially safely, on the field. His limitations and potential risks after his microdiscectomy surgery (moreso if he is returned to action too soon) will be related to his being forcibly bent backwards at the lumbar level when being blocked or rushing against resistance, and when using twisting spin rushing moves or when he is twisted by opposing OLinemen. Note that conditioning exercises do not in any way test/simulate or predict Watt's ability to tolerate any of these aforementioned movements/stresses which he will be repeatedly exposed to in game conditions.
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
Watt passing his test has little to do with his preparedness to perform, and perform especially safely, on the field. His limitations and potential risks after his microdiscectomy surgery (moreso if he is returned to action too soon) will be related to his being forcibly bent backwards at the lumbar level when being blocked or rushing against resistance, and when using twisting spin rushing moves or when he is twisted by opposing OLinemen. Note that conditioning exercises do not in any way test/simulate or predict Watt's ability to tolerate any of these aforementioned movements/stresses which he will be repeatedly exposed to in game conditions.
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That is absolutely alarming, to say the least. I'm getting the feeling that JJ has become his own worst enemy.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Everyone was excited to hear that Watt passed his conditioning test. So I wanted to present an example of an NFL conditioning test:

******************************************************************************
The 300-Yard Shuttle Run

For this test, you need 50 yards of running room.

Start at the goal line.
Run to the 50-yard line. Touch the line.
Run back to the goal line. Touch the line.
Perform the down-and-back sequence three times for a total of 300 yards.
Rest for two minutes.
Repeat the 300-yard sequence.
Rest for two minutes and repeat the 300-yard sequence once more.

The goal is to complete each of your three Shuttle Runs under a certain time based on the position you play. Here are the time targets some might use:

Position Players: complete each Shuttle Run in 58 seconds or less.
Small Linemen: complete each Shuttle Run in 64 seconds or less.
Big Linemen: complete each Shuttle Run in 68 seconds or less.

*************************************************************************
From team to team, this will have some small variations. But they typically total ~1000 yards with some broken up to 25 instead of 50 yard down-and-back sequences, and with some variations of the expected target times.

Any 40 year old off the street in decent shape (not football shape) should be able to pass these conditioning tests.

Watt passing his test has little to do with his preparedness to perform, and perform especially safely, on the field. His limitations and potential risks after his microdiscectomy surgery (moreso if he is returned to action too soon) will be related to his being forcibly bent backwards at the lumbar level when being blocked or rushing against resistance, and when using twisting spin rushing moves or when he is twisted by opposing OLinemen. Note that conditioning exercises do not in any way test/simulate or predict Watt's ability to tolerate any of these aforementioned movements/stresses which he will be repeatedly exposed to in game conditions.
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I would think there are 2 main issues with regards to JJ's return to play:

1) how long does the disc take to heal from the surgical repair at the injury site? I'd love to hear your thoughts Doc.

2) How much strength does JJ have in core and how well can he stabilize his spine? I'm guessing some of this would depend on how much muscle was cut during surgery. Stuart McGill has some base level tests for core stability:http://tbrezins.wixsite.com/corestabilization1/get_involved

Perhaps they could use a tensionmyograhy machine :https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensiomyography

Additionally, as Doc mentioned the conditioning test is absurd for a football player as it doesn't even measure the type conditioning needed for FB. I would test a DL/OL with a series of short sprints (maybe 20yds), either uphill or against resistance (pushing or pulling a weighted sled) with a 35 sec recovery between sets. They would have to be able to achieve a set number of sprints with their heart rate below anaerobic threshold to demonstrate they are in FB shape. I'd also have them perform an aerobic fitness test as well. Ever wonder why guys get gassed during a long drive in a game? Hint, their aerobic system isn't up to snuff
 
otisbean said:
I would think there are 2 main issues with regards to JJ's return to play:

1) how long does the disc take to heal from the surgical repair at the injury site? I'd love to hear your thoughts Doc.

2) How much strength does JJ have in core and how well can he stabilize his spine? I'm guessing some of this would depend on how much muscle was cut during surgery. Stuart McGill has some base level tests for core stability:http://tbrezins.wixsite.com/corestabilization1/get_involved

Perhaps they could use a tensionmyograhy machine :https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensiomyography

Additionally, as Doc mentioned the conditioning test is absurd for a football player as it doesn't even measure the type conditioning needed for FB. I would test a DL/OL with a series of short sprints (maybe 20yds), either uphill or against resistance (pushing or pulling a weighted sled) with a 35 sec recovery between sets. They would have to be able to achieve a set number of sprints with their heart rate below anaerobic threshold to demonstrate they are in FB shape. I'd also have them perform an aerobic fitness test as well. Ever wonder why guys get gassed during a long drive in a game? Hint, their aerobic system isn't up to snuff
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The newer approach to microdiscectomy is to try to avoid actually cutting through the back muscles and actually cutting through the midline fascia connecting the right and left vertically-oriented back muscles, then peeling the muscles off of the vertebra. Then, in order to access the affected nerve root, ligaments connecting the adjoining vertebrae must be excised, and a small window of bone must be removed. All of these areas must be given time to heal in order to be totally rehabbed. A football player like Watt will have atrophied muscle to a significant extent due the actual trauma to the tissues in addition to the time required to allow for the more dormant, less strenuous part of his rehab.

This is a very simple animation [only 1 minute 23 seconds long......and no blood :)] that should help MB members better visualize/conceptualize this surgery:
Lumbar Spine Posterior Discectomy Micro-discectomy neuro-surgery 3D animations

Non athletes now are allowed to go back to light duty work as soon as 2 weeks postoperatively. However, following a microdiscectomy, most surgeons will limit bending, lifting, or twisting for six weeks to prevent a recurrent lumbar disc herniation. Unfortunately, because the disc covering has a poor blood supply, healing of the defect where the inner material of the disc extruded may take three to four months to scar over and reinforce the closure of the defect. Therefore, restricting activity, especially in the case of an athlete, for only six weeks after microdiscectomy back surgery would not be expected to prevent a recurrent problem.

No matter how much microdiscectomy is lauded, the resultant "deflation" of the previously normal cushioning disc leaves its anatomy abnormal and more susceptible to future problems than before the herniation. And let's not forget Watt is also coming off of bilateral sports hernia surgery (which, as I have posted in the past, has been associated with significant underlying hip pathology in most cases) which would bring his core into additional question.
 
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Texans DE J.J. Watt could barely walk after the end of the 2015 season
11:39 AM CT
  • i

    Sarah BarshopESPN Staff Writer
http://www.espn.com/blog/houston-te...-barely-walk-after-the-end-of-the-2015-season
 
Brother Derek made the Chargers final roster. I look forward to watching him try to pass protect against his brother.
 
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Back in my playing days the shuttle run 300 used to be sideline to sideline.
No idea why I'm giving the fyi but there it is.
 
DocBar said:
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/17487980/during-rehab-jj-watt-houston-texans-wondered-play-again
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This made me laugh. He's all surprised...just like we are when something our medical staff doesn't turn out to be career ending.


And that morning I did it. I called him right away and sent him a video and I was like, 'look.' And so then I got up and tried some other stuff, and I actually did up-downs in the room, right there and I sent him a video of it. And I was like, dude, it worked.

"Everything that we did worked. And from that point forward, as soon as you get that little bit of light, it's full steam ahead, and that's what's awesome."
Click to expand...
 
Now that it's been confirmed that his back is still not right and that he's out for likely the season, the question is whether or not the Texans knew about it and just injected him hoping for the best at the beginning of the season or that he actually "reinjured" it in week 3.

As I was saying, my source was not likely to be incorrect, so my money is on the fact that they knew he still had significant issues and sent him out there anyway, likely after an injection.

Why the hell would the Texans do that?
 
TexansSeminole said:
Now that it's been confirmed that his back is still not right and that he's out for likely the season, the question is whether or not the Texans knew about it and just injected him hoping for the best at the beginning of the season or that he actually "reinjured" it in week 3.

As I was saying, my source was not likely to be incorrect, so my money is on the fact that they knew he still had significant issues and sent him out there anyway, likely after an injection.

Why the hell would the Texans do that?
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All about the almighty dollar. Watt sells tickets.
 
I don't get it. I really don't. I've been bringing this up for years now, and many others have as well, but what the hell do our doctors and trainers actually do?

We have the least effective training staff in the NFL. We constantly miss on draft picks and FAs that have injury red flags, we constantly have players get re-injured or suffer injuries related to a previous injury, and we constantly throw guys back on the field before they are healed from injury.

It was mentioned multiple times before the season started. Why was Watt given the green light to play so soon?

Seriously, what do they actually do?
 
bah007 said:
I don't get it. I really don't. I've been bringing this up for years now, and many others have as well, but what the hell do our doctors and trainers actually do?

We have the least effective training staff in the NFL. We constantly miss on draft picks and FAs that have injury red flags, we constantly have players get re injured or suffer injuries related to a previous injury, and we constantly throw guys back on the field before they are healed from injury.

It was mentioned multiple times before the season started. Why was Watt given the green light to play so soon?

Seriously, what do they actually do?
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They're not "football guys"
 
TexansSeminole said:
Now that it's been confirmed that his back is still not right and that he's out for likely the season, the question is whether or not the Texans knew about it and just injected him hoping for the best at the beginning of the season or that he actually "reinjured" it in week 3.

As I was saying, my source was not likely to be incorrect, so my money is on the fact that they knew he still had significant issues and sent him out there anyway, likely after an injection.

Why the hell would the Texans do that?
Click to expand...

Because they are the McNair's and that's what they do. Short term gain/long term pain, gotta keep cashing those checks. AJ (Hamstring clipped never the same) Foster (Bringing him back too soon) Clowney (Made him play on a hurt knee that lead to microfracture surgery hurting his career) Great FA signings (Reed) This says nothing about oldies but goodies like Dominic Davis/Charles Spencer/Ryan Young. Oh I almost forgot the 1st player in Texans history. (Boselli)

Do y'all see a trend here?
 
steelbtexan said:
Because they are the McNair's and that's what they do. Short term gain/long term pain, gotta keep cashing those checks. AJ (Hamstring clipped never the same) Foster (Bringing him back too soon) Clowney (Made him play on a hurt knee that lead to microfracture surgery hurting his career) Great FA signings (Reed) This says nothing about oldies but goodies like Dominic Davis/Charles Spencer/Ryan Young. Oh I almost forgot the 1st player in Texans history. (Boselli)

Do y'all see a trend here?
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So McNair is now overriding the medical staff? Got anything to back that up besides your McNair hate because you could do better than everyone?
 
bah007 said:
I don't get it. I really don't. I've been bringing this up for years now, and many others have as well, but what the hell do our doctors and trainers actually do?

We have the least effective training staff in the NFL. We constantly miss on draft picks and FAs that have injury red flags, we constantly have players get re-injured or suffer injuries related to a previous injury, and we constantly throw guys back on the field before they are healed from injury.

It was mentioned multiple times before the season started. Why was Watt given the green light to play so soon?

Seriously, what do they actually do?
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Well they certainly have a history. Fact is CND has a better track record predicting injuries than the Texans medical staff and he's got much less information.

As for what do they do? Alot of 2nd surgeries. Also what they do is make alot of $$$$.
 
JB said:
So McNair is now overriding the medical staff? Got anything to back that up besides your McNair hate because you could do better than everyone?
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It's his team, his medical staff and after 14 yrs he has made no changes so I would say he's got no problems with how his medical staff handles his investments. (Players) Especially after the list of misdiagnosis made to a laundry list of players.

No hate here brother, just calling like it is.
 
I hope J.J. makes a speedy recovery and allows himself to get fully healthy. I hope we'll see him back to his normal self soon.

With that being said, I am so frustrated that this franchise wasted arguably one of the best defensive linemen ever because they couldn't find a competent QB.
 
steelbtexan said:
It's his team, his medical staff and after 14 yrs he has made no changes so I would say he's got no problems with how his medical staff handles his investments. (Players) Especially after the list of misdiagnosis made to a laundry list of players.

No hate here brother, just calling like it is.
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Your words and posting history belie you friend
 
We have CnD here on Texanstalk that regularly updates us on the realities of our team's injuries, and I believe everything he has ever speculated to us to come to fruition or worse. This was to be expected, as doc predicted. It pisses me off and makes me less of a fan that the Texans/NFL allow **** like this to happen.
 
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JB said:
Your words and posting history belie you friend
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Just because I disagree with the way the franchise is being run and think $$$$ comes before winning doesn't mean I hate the MCNair's. Tell me what in their history proves me wrong? If you respond I will answer and then move on to another discussion.

But look at the injury history, CND's predictions how they've come true and tell me $$$$ doesn't come before the teams/players welfare. I know we always disagree on this topic but look at the team from the begining until now and the more things remain the same.
 
I'm gonna place the blame on JJ here.
Just my opinion but JJ wanted to keep his 'played every game' stat because he's foolish.
He straight up and down admitted that he knew it wasn't in his best interest to rush back and was warned he could easily be in a wheelchair by 50 but he said he didn't care right now in his 20s because that's his mindset as of now. He said be may regret that thinking later in life but right now he doesn't care.

I wonder how he feels about it as of today.
 
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Hang on to your butts**, I'm about to be a ray of sunshine (yeah me). Obviously Watt's the best defensive player on the planet and changes games. However, I think we've got enough talent at the ends to stay afloat on defense, especially if Smith still has anything in the tank. Mercilus and Clowney aren't Watt, but together they're shaping up to be a formidable tandem. Inside McKinney is a REALLY good interior blitz option (not a huge fan of the rest of his game, but this is a real strength). Wilfork is still the heavy inside, and Antonio Smith is so much better than he ever got credit for. The sky might not be falling.

Of course I'm wrong at least as often as I'm right, so combined with how little I think of our offense, we could very well end up with the #1 pick.

**That statement didn't take into consideration that Sonny posted ahead of me lol.
 
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That sucks for you guys. Watt is a an incredible talent and still young. Here's hoping he gets right, but these are the types of injuries that are hard to return from.
 
Sonny said:
I'm gonna place the blame on JJ here.
Just my opinion but JJ wanted to keep his 'played every game' stat because he's foolish.
He straight up and down admitted that he knew it wasn't in his best interest to rush back and was warned he could easily be in a wheelchair by 50 but he said he didn't care right now in his 20s because that's his mindset as of now. He said be may regret that thinking later in life but right now he doesn't care.

I wonder how he feels about it as of today.
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You're going to allow someone who has been the "greatest show on earth" to make decisions greatly impacting a billion dollar enterprise? Sure, listen to his opinion and then do what it best for the team and in turn the player. Watt is 27 and seems fairly mature but he also is caught up in the "hero role" "face of team" etc. His age and maturity isn't the issue..the "greatest show on earth" is. McNair and staff seem to be caught in "we got to win now" which also reflects most fans POV. The fact you are correct "right now he doesn't care" is why he should have input but not the final decision. Someone needs to be in charge of Texans; Bob McNair, Junior, Ric Smith or O'Brien and I do not care whom but it needs to happen sooner rather than later.

JJ Watt playing himself out of the season and perhaps his career is bad. What would be worse is Watt to be only a rung on a long ladder of medical circumstances that could have been handled much, much better.
 
awww man this really sucks first Cushing now Watt

Well I hope he gets better and healthy .... that's all u can say ...Next man Up .... : (

on the flip side this deff changes things I thought we would see JJ watt has a Texan his entire career but maybe now Our team which mimics the patriot way no one is safe and would let JJ watt walk once his contract is up or trade him if the offer is right ..... this sucks
 
Even if JJ decided after having received accurate information, which seems unlikely at this point, that he wanted to play anyway, it is the team's duty to not allow it. It is not JJ's fault. The team failed him and honestly appear to have knowingly put him in a position in which he would be likely to hurt himself further when he was already significantly injured.

Amazing dysfunction within this organization.
 
Texans used up JJ Watt like they used up Foster. Anyone surprised? Much less, anyone surprised that Watt and Foster went along with it? Football players have a very short active career. Best get used to life after Watt, because like Foster, when he comes back, he'll never be the same.
 
He got eight plays off. What more could they do? :rolleyes:

Watt initially underwent back surgery during the offseason. The recovery lasted into training camp with the Texans placing Watt on the Physically Unable to Perform list at the start of camp. The team, however, activated Watt right before the start of the regular season. Watt not only suited up for Week 1, but played 49 of 57 defensive snaps. The back injury continued to bother him into Week 2 and he was limited in practice leading up to the game. According to Rapoport, Watt may have re-injured his back in Week 3 against New England.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...is-back/ar-BBwImzj?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp

 
Looking at this season only, Watt was not himself in three games. Reality says his 2016 effort can be replaced elsewhere to a certain extent. Of course a healthy Watt is OMG, whoopee! He is not healthy. I think Covington and Still will be productive. Also our linebackers will pick up slack; not saying Watt's sack capability will not be missed but RAC gets to earn his paycheck now.

Don't know what is there in free age agency, but Spotrack our cap space at $7 m and OTC at $9 m and that is a decent salary for right player if that player exists.

It is okay to pout, whine, complain, gripe ... it doesn't change anything now. What is Texans approach now?
 
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