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Texans are winning back fans with OPTIMISM!!

My post is strictly in defense of Kubes and why you do not beilieve that he has done nor will do anything right for this team
 
Bobo said:
Capers had a fine record with the Texans and you can't deny that since so many people were talking playoffs last year and wouldn't be saying that if the first three years were failures. As far as the assistants go, I didn't hear any complaints during the first three years. They were bad one year and they got the axe. If the Texans had Cowher or Holmgren as their coach, I guess they would have fired them too and lost out on the SB. Doesn't sound like such a bright idea to me.
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Many people were calling for Fangio's head prior to last season - and yes he had a "fine record" up to a point. That point that they only won 2 games and were generally the worst team in the league for the entire season. Also realize that Capers did the same thing in Carolina...peaked early and then collapsed. I give him credit where credit is due - 4 wins in the first season were nice. It was also nice to see progress - however when progression ends and total incompetence takes over, there isn't much else that can be done. That Cowher and Holmgren argument is a poor comparison...definitely the exception to keeping coaches that have bad years. I guess Dallas should have kept Dave Campo, they were sort of on their way up.

You can't tell me you looked at a team last year and saw a good team that just got some bad breaks - because it was a total collapse. And I blame a total collapse more on the coaching than any individual player.
 
wolf123 said:
I respect the fact that you have been enjoying the game for so long and have a plethora of football knowledge, but I do not agree with your bias toward Capers. I was also at the KC game and I witnessed the "fire" that they had, but I have also seen the outbursts by the players attacking the coaching staff and the system that they are supposed to be buying into; and who is responsible for the staff and the system?, None other than the HC, Capers who did nothing to fix it. I agree that the Texans previous 3 seasons were encouraging with a consatnt improvement which had me hoping for something really respectable last season, but you should also notice that Holmgren and Cowher's worst seasons of 6-10 were better than 3 of the 4 first season records the Texans had.

Also, in response to Kubiac targeting a C in the draft, you were just complaining about how old Flanagan is and the fact that we needed someone younger, how is drafting one not helping the situation. And also, McKinney is being moved to G as you know and he will not be regarded as a backup C, if anyone is it would be Hog.

All Ckw5814 was saying is give Kubes some leeway here. He's not making all the mistakes you keep trying to point out. If anything you keep contradicting yourself in your points regarding methods Kubiac should have employed to address the huge problem at OL.
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You seem to be one of the many who don't know the difference between expansion teams and established teams. That puzzles me. As for drafting a center, why would you need Flanagan if you are going to burn a pick on one anyway? That makes no sense. They need help throughout that line and they draft someone into the same position they supposedly have already fixed? Don't you see the confusion there? As for McKinney, folks move around all the time within the line when there is an injury. McKinney can both start at one position and move over to another in case of injury -- happens all the time. Um, yes, Kubiak is making mistake after mistake already -- and you just mentioned a couple of them. I am certainly not contradicting myself. It is Kubiak who is contradicting himself when he goes out and gets a TE out of FA and then burns a pick for a position he supposedly has already fixed. Then again, that's not the first time he's done that.
 
ledzeppelin269 said:
Many people were calling for Fangio's head prior to last season - and yes he had a "fine record" up to a point. That point that they only won 2 games and were generally the worst team in the league for the entire season. Also realize that Capers did the same thing in Carolina...peaked early and then collapsed. I give him credit where credit is due - 4 wins in the first season were nice. It was also nice to see progress - however when progression ends and total incompetence takes over, there isn't much else that can be done. That Cowher and Holmgren argument is a poor comparison...definitely the exception to keeping coaches that have bad years. I guess Dallas should have kept Dave Campo, they were sort of on their way up.

You can't tell me you looked at a team last year and saw a good team that just got some bad breaks - because it was a total collapse. And I blame a total collapse more on the coaching than any individual player.
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The fact that you claim that keeping coaches like Holmgren and Cowher around after bad seasons before they went to the SB are "exceptions" seems to indicate that you would have fired them if it was up to you. Thanks, you've just proven my point.
 
Bobo said:
A.) Yep, you have a lot to learn. But stay with it -- the ride is a fun one. B.) I answered your question -- you must learn to read carefully. C.) If you're going to try for sarcasm, you might work at it a bit before you go public with it. It certainly isn't working too well for you here. D.) 6-10 for a team like the Steelers or Seahawks is a lot worse than 2-14 for an expansion team. Maybe you'll learn that later on in life as well. E.) A city that expects to win now with an expansion team is a city with unrealistic expectations. F.) Not sadly for me that Capers got fired. Sadly for you, sadly for the city of Houston and sadly for every football fan that wanted the Texans to win. And that's life in the real world. Keep your nose to the grindstone and maybe you'll learn that lesson.
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Thanks for the pep talk Mr. Bobo. I really will take your words to heart and keep my nose to the grindstone. And please tell me what was so different with his line in Carolina. Expansion team, no? Yes I admit the guy has the potential to coach and he has shown it. And 4-12, 5-11, 7-9, and 2-14 would not be considered good seasons anywhere. Mike Holmgren and Bill Cower have a proven track record. Capers has a proven track record that says fired after four seasons by the Carolina Panthers and fired after four seasons by the Houston Texans. But alas, it is a waste of my time to endlessly debate with you, especially when it will probably never make a difference anyway. All I'm trying to do is give you some hope for this season. Life is what you make it. When it gives you lemons, make lemonade. I can only show you the door, but you'll have to walk through it Mr. Bobo. My life won't end if the Texans do poorly, for a life based simply on a game played once a week is doomed to be a fairly meaningless life. But it sure will be cool if we can wreck shop on all our foes on Sundays. :fans:
 
wolf123 said:
My post is strictly in defense of Kubes and why you do not beilieve that he has done nor will do anything right for this team
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By looking at the many mistakes he has already made thus far -- mistakes I have already detailed.
 
Bobo said:
You seem to be one of the many who don't know the difference between expansion teams and established teams. That puzzles me. As for drafting a center, why would you need Flanagan if you are going to burn a pick on one anyway? That makes no sense. They need help throughout that line and they draft someone into the same position they supposedly have already fixed? Don't you see the confusion there? As for McKinney, folks move around all the time within the line when there is an injury. McKinney can both start at one position and move over to another in case of injury -- happens all the time. Um, yes, Kubiak is making mistake after mistake already -- and you just mentioned a couple of them. I am certainly not contradicting myself. It is Kubiak who is contradicting himself when he goes out and gets a TE out of FA and then burns a pick for a position he supposedly has already fixed. Then again, that's not the first time he's done that.
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McKinney has repeatedly been graded as one of the weakest links of the line. His position before coming to Houston was LG - Capers was the one using the "Best 5" philosophy that ended up playing people out of position.

Flanagan is in his early 30s and while offensive lineman can often play longer than other positions, he isn't a young player by NFL standards. Unless Kubiak becomes convinced that Hodgdon can play well enough/stay healthy, if a C that the scout team really likes in the BPA on the board, it would only make sense to take him. In summary: There's no harm in signing Flanagan as it brings a lot more stability to the line, Sherman has coached him before, it puts McKinney back into his better position, and it gives Hodgdon/a rookie more time and teaching to learn the pro position before Flanagan decides to hang up the cleats.

Kubiak must have faith in Putzier considering how long he coached him. Our TE position needed a little more life in it, and while Putzier isn't an elite TE it atleast removes the weakness tag.
 
Ckw5814 said:
Thanks for the pep talk Mr. Bobo. I really will take your words to heart and keep my nose to the grindstone. And please tell me what was so different with his line in Carolina. Expansion team, no? Yes I admit the guy has the potential to coach and he has shown it. And 4-12, 5-11, 7-9, and 2-14 would not be considered good seasons anywhere. Mike Holmgren and Bill Cower have a proven track record. Capers has a proven track record that says fired after four seasons by the Carolina Panthers and fired after four seasons by the Houston Texans. But alas, it is a waste of my time to endlessly debate with you, especially when it will probably never make a difference anyway. All I'm trying to do is give you some hope for this season. Life is what you make it. When it gives you lemons, make lemonades. I can only show you the door, but you'll have to walk through it Mr. Bobo. My life won't end if the Texans do poorly, for a life based simply on a game played once a week is doomed to be a fairly meaningless life. But it sure will be cool if we can wreck shop on all our foes on Sundays. :fans:
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His previous three years were considered good records for expansion teams. Like I said, maybe with a few more years of following the game you'll understand this.
 
Kubiak must have faith in Putzier considering how long he coached him. Our TE position needed a little more life in it, and while Putzier isn't an elite TE it atleast removes the weakness tag.
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The belief that Kubiak has faith in Putzier doesn't encourage me one bit. The Texans need to hold the TE in to block to help the OL until it gets in order. To remove the TE from that equation is pure folly.
 
Bobo said:
The belief that Kubiak has faith in Putzier doesn't encourage me one bit. The Texans need to hold the TE in to block to help the OL until it gets in order. To remove the TE from that equation is pure folly.
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And who's going to do that? Rivers? We already have Bruener, but he can't be counted on to catch. Maybe we can put Joppru out in a wheelchair (better yet, pop in a 300 hp "Scooter") and maybe he can run down the blitz before it gets there.

And this doesn't stop them from drafting a TE that can do both. Nothing is set in stone - not to mention if a TE is going to stay in all the time, we can just play with 6 OL and put Wand on the end.
 
Bobo said:
Um, I am a season ticketholder and I think that gives me the right to speak forthrightly about the team I am paying my money to -- whether I cheer for it or not. And I think even the Texans would agree to that. I am not anti-Texans now. I am just neutral. I will not go to Reliant stadium and root against them. I just won't cheer for them or buy their merchandise. I am a hardcore fan, though -- a hardcore fan of the NFL. I have been that way for years and always will be. If I lived in Carolina or Cincy or Cleveland, I would try to get season tickets just to watch the games. I may not care about the team at all, but I love watching the NFL in person. I was a Texans fan for four years and I felt awful last year everytime they lost -- probably even worse than Capers felt. Honestly. But they have lost me this year. I don't dislike them -- I just don't care about them. They still get my season ticket money, but that's it. Well, they may get more dough for that $3 bottled water and that $4.50 hot dog. But no more bringing radios to the game, no more shirts on "Battle Red Day," no more getting hoarse at games, no more high fiving the other folks around me. Just a nice Sunday afternoon at the stadium watching NFL football. Sure, you may be right that it's more fun to have a little emotion invested in a team. But sorry, the emotion is no longer there. I actually am sorry about that -- it feels like I have lost a friend. But it's just not there anymore. I don't even listen to the radio or watch the TV when the coach is on -- heck, I don't even know what he sounds like and not too sure of what he looks like. I simply don't care about him, and if I don't care about him, I can't really get excited about where the team is going.
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I don'y understand why you repurchased season tickets knowing who the coach was and your thoughts on the team. I am completely baffled. But you are entitled to your opinion,strange as it may seem to most of us.If the Texans win 3 of their first 5 games would you contemplate slacking up on the franchise a lil' ? PLEASE!
 
Bobo said:
His previous three years were considered good records for expansion teams. Like I said, maybe with a few more years of following the game you'll understand this.
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Do you totally ignore this past season? Yes, we did well in our first three seasons, but you can't deny the total collapse by our team this past year. As a past poster said, there are only two groups to blame: coaches or players. Dom Capers showed he had the players to maintain a fairly decent record for an expansion team. Yet, for some reason it all fell apart this year. So who was it Mr. Bobo? Was it the coaches or the players? I'm assuming you will say the players, but why the collapse this year? Did the players just stop playing or are they just not any good? And if they did stop playing, why did they decide to quit? Did they have a problem with something? Were they not motivated? And why if Dom and Casserley were working together did such a pitiful team get assembled with excellent draft picks and free agency? As we have shown this season, despite what your opinion is, we can pick up good free agents: Moulds (presumably), Flanagan (seasoned vet who might actually teach our youngins on the team a thing or two; very suprised you don't like him), and Sam Cowart (very much like Flanagan). Suprisingly you seem to think very highly on the age factor as far as understanding the game of football, yet you seem to neglect this when choosing your free agents. Perhaps Weaver (a guy who has at least played in a Super Bowl), Flanagan, and Cowart can teach our guys some things, after all with age comes understanding.
 
Bobo said:
The OL hasn't been addressed at all except for Flanagan. It's basically the same guys they had last year.
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Ok...so this is why Kubiac hasn't done anything right...i got ya...but wait...

Bobo said:
I honestly think we should leave FA alone when it comes to the OL unless the guy available fits the Texans needs. Good OL are more valuable in the NFL nowadays than RBs since you need a tandem of five of them to succeed and every good one is valuable. Teams are very hesitant to part with the good ones nowadays.
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Ok...so if FA isn't the way for Kubes to show his credibility as a HC for the Texans, then what else? You also said that...

Bobo said:
7.) Kubiak added an old guy (Flanagan)to the line who won't be around long and will just have to be replaced before the Texans regain competitive status.
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But then you said that...

Bobo said:
As for drafting a center, why would you need Flanagan if you are going to burn a pick on one anyway?
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How is providing a C through the draft to learn the ropes from a ProBowl vet who has been signed to improve the Texans of today a bad thing. How is that wasting a pick, you're preparing for the long term. Also, selecting an OT/OG would be a strong move to compete for the positions available this year.

I hear what your arguing but your setting your arguments up with no posibility of Kubes winning, that is called BIAS.
 
ledzeppelin269 said:
Maybe we can put Joppru out in a wheelchair (better yet, pop in a 300 hp "Scooter") and maybe he can run down the blitz before it gets there.
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i'm not taking him anywhere......

it's kinda sad how one guy ruined a perfectly good, and fun filled thread. i'm a pessimist by nature, but the koolaid's looking pretty good. we got the head coach that should've been hired in 02, our staff has atleast 5 rings (kubiak, sherman, & reeves), we've regained a couple veteran talents that are going to get the most out of the guys on the field, we've done well to address holes through FA, and after all of that we still have the top overall pick (and two 3rds) in one of the best looking drafts in years. last year was going to be bad, everyone knew it but some were afraid to admit it. this year's filled with potential. i've harped on O-line enough, but after the draft & june 1st cuts, i expect we'll have atleast 1 more starter and i'll be ringing the cowbell as loud as anyone.

my glasses arent rose colored .... they're steel blue.
 
Scooter said:
i'm not taking him anywhere......

it's kinda sad how one guy ruined a perfectly good, and fun filled thread. i'm a pessimist by nature, but the koolaid's looking pretty good. we got the head coach that should've been hired in 02, our staff has atleast 5 rings (kubiak, sherman, & reeves), we've regained a couple veteran talents that are going to get the most out of the guys on the field, we've done well to address holes through FA, and after all of that we still have the top overall pick (and two 3rds) in one of the best looking drafts in years. last year was going to be bad, everyone knew it but some were afraid to admit it. this year's filled with potential. i've harped on O-line enough, but after the draft & june 1st cuts, i expect we'll have atleast 1 more starter and i'll be ringing the cowbell as loud as anyone.

my glasses arent rose colored .... they're steel blue.
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Honestly, I have to admit that I didn't know at all until I got clued in during preseason. When they promoted Pendry, I new we were definitely screwed.
 
Every fan is optimistic, that is the point of being a fan. We all sit and pontificate and hope that this year will be our year, hopefully we get what we want, but the odds are usually not in our favor. Winning fans back seems weird to me, because I dont think our recent horrid season really lost the Texans any fans. They simply decided not to watch the horrid product.
 
Sure is a lot more of emotion put into this thread than on the football field from a fan that is to sit unemotional and just eat hot dogs and drink and not care if they win or lose. Ya know I watched the Astros for 35 years not get to the World Series but every game was exciting. I pulled for them no matter what just like the Oilers. A fan like this would not have fun with me at a Texan game because when they score I'll be a jumpin and a yellin. I used to live in Houston but where I live now I would love to go to at least to one Texan game.You see I live for today and tomorrow not for yesterday. There have been many team decisions that I did not agree with but what can you do but support them unless you got some big NFL power that can change it.:texflag:
 
If you are concerned about the Texans just remember that The Packers were the folly of the league when they hired the Offensive Cordinator from the Giants in the late 50's I think . They became one of the greatest teams in history .

The pathetic Steelers hired a young coach in 1969 and ended up being the team of the 70's . They could possibly have been the best team ever . I think this was Noll's first and only head coaching job .

When did the 49ers hire Bill Walsh ... late 70's . They were a bad team that became a dynasty . Point is you have to be bad sometimes to get great talent but if it all falls into place the Texans may one day be mentioned with the above teams .:yahoo:
 
Bobo said:
I may not care about the team at all, but I love watching the NFL in person. I was a Texans fan for four years and I felt awful last year everytime they lost -- probably even worse than Capers felt. Honestly. But they have lost me this year. I don't dislike them -- I just don't care about them.
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Sorry, man, but what I see in this statement is pure fairweather 'fan'. When they put up a winning record (only a matter of time), I'm sure you'll be one of the first on the bandwagon, proudly proclaiming that you were a season ticket holder from the beginning. :ok:

You're in love with coach that has had one winning season in eight years of head coaching experience, has never been to a Superbowl as a player or a coach, and I have to wonder what you would have thought of Capers before he coached Carolina. His pre-HC resume was nothing compared to Kubiak's current resume. Capers is a defensive coach that has consistently put out some of the worst defenses I've ever had the displeasure of following.

You say you felt awful last year (worse than the HC? doubtful), but you're able to completely disengage your devotion in one off-season. Which is it? Either you have emotional investment in a team, or you don't.

Are you this pessimistic at your true team's board? (yeah, we know who you are.) Or do you just reserve this spite and venom for the Texans?

Whatever. Folks, listen to Herv (first page) and don't feed the troll. He feeds off of your aggravation.
 
Rubix Kube said:
That explains everything! He is now on ignore.
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I tried that. It would have worked too, if people would stop putting his (or her) quotes in their posts.

I can't put everyone on ignore. Of course, if it works for the Commander-In-Chief...
 
Rubix Kube said:
That explains everything! He is now on ignore. Please try and not to quote him because I will see his post anyway.
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No problem. I spent all of last night going back and forth with Bobo and all I can gather is he is either totally ignorant and wants something to whine about or he's just trying to :stirpot: . Back to the optimism thread. I believe this year has the chance to be the best in the Texans short history, after all 7-9 isn't exactly an ideal season. I have faith in Kubiak, Carr, Davis, AJ, Cowart, Putzier, etc. and believe we can turn this team around. We've got the pieces to the puzzle and most NFL gurus would tend to agree. FA has been a success for the first time and the draft could be even more successful if some of these guys live up to their hype, namely Bush. By the way, anybody know what his 40 time was today?
 
Ckw5814 said:
No problem. I spent all of last night going back and forth with Bobo and all I can gather is he is either totally ignorant and wants something to whine about or he's just trying to :stirpot: . Back to the optimism thread. I believe this year has the chance to be the best in the Texans short history, after all 7-9 isn't exactly an ideal season. I have faith in Kubiak, Carr, Davis, AJ, Cowart, Putzier, etc. and believe we can turn this team around. We've got the pieces to the puzzle and most NFL gurus would tend to agree. FA has been a success for the first time and the draft could be even more successful if some of these guys live up to their hype, namely Bush. By the way, anybody know what his 40 time was today?
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Haha, I must have posted over 50 times with rebuttals to his abstract view on Kubiak and the Texans.

All we need to do is secure a couple Offensive Lineman in the draft, grab a DE and make sure our secondary is in check. With that done, we will recieve no less than an A+ for this offseason, and will begin to work towards the next modern dynasty!

Too optimistic, maybe? There is only one way to find out. Wake me up when Training Camp ends.
 
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