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State of the O-line

ObsiWan said:
I've seen no proof that those other teams operated differently than the Texans. Maybe their coaching staffs are just flat better.
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Maybe you need to look at the moves the Jags made last season signing Campbell/Bouye in FA.

Pats- Signing Gilmore in FA and trading for Cooks

Philly- Signing Jeffery/Torrey Smith/Trading for Ajayi/Signing our very on Brooks and Wiesnewski (SP?) in FA.

Vikings- Reiff/Remmers in FA along with guys that came in very handy in FA like Keenum (Who is the Texans backup QB) and Murray when Cook went down. Would you say Murray would be the best RB on the Texans roster today.

Tell me again what did the Texans do last offseason in FA? This off season they've made moves but all of their FA moves have been 2nd tier FA's.

The contenders make major FA moves, the Texans ?
 
steelbtexan said:
Maybe you need to look at the moves the Jags made last season signing Campbell/Bouye in FA.

Pats- Signing Gilmore in FA and trading for Cooks

Philly- Signing Jeffery/Torrey Smith/Trading for Ajayi/Signing our very on Brooks and Wiesnewski (SP?) in FA.

Vikings- Reiff/Remmers in FA along with guys that came in very handy in FA like Keenum (Who is the Texans backup QB) and Murray when Cook went down. Would you say Murray would be the best RB on the Texans roster today.

Tell me again what did the Texans do last offseason in FA? This off season they've made moves but all of their FA moves have been 2nd tier FA's.

The contenders make major FA moves, the Texans ?
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Look at how long it took them though. You continue to prop them up when they've been in the gutter for so darn long. They had the money and high draft picks to build.
 
steelbtexan said:
Maybe you need to look at the moves the Jags made last season signing Campbell/Bouye in FA.

Pats- Signing Gilmore in FA and trading for Cooks

Philly- Signing Jeffery/Torrey Smith/Trading for Ajayi/Signing our very on Brooks and Wiesnewski (SP?) in FA.

Vikings- Reiff/Remmers in FA along with guys that came in very handy in FA like Keenum (Who is the Texans backup QB) and Murray when Cook went down. Would you say Murray would be the best RB on the Texans roster today.

Tell me again what did the Texans do last offseason in FA? This off season they've made moves but all of their FA moves have been 2nd tier FA's.

The contenders make major FA moves, the Texans ?
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What you're overlooking (or maybe ignoring) is those moves could have fallen flat if the respective coaching staffs hadn't put those players in positions to succeed.
You and me both have seen what looked like good F/A moves that turned out badly because the coaches weren't part of the selection/decision process (see the Osweiler move McNair ordered Smith to do w/o O'Brien's buy-in) and the F/A didn't fit what the coach needed.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Look at how long it took them though. You continue to prop them up when they've been in the gutter for so darn long. They had the money and high draft picks to build.
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The biggest thing about the Jags is they put Coughlin in charge. Coughlin gave them an identity/direction and they aren't going away any time soon.

Tell me about the rest of the teams that competed in the conference championship games and compare them to how the McNair's do business.
 
steelbtexan said:
The biggest thing about the Jags is they put Coughlin in charge. Coughlin gave them an identity/direction and they aren't going away any time soon.

Tell me about the rest of the teams that competed in the conference championship games and compare them to how the McNair's do business.
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Again look at how long it took them. We also had the same defensive identity. Other than that the Jaguars are still skit on the offensive side.
 
ObsiWan said:
What you're overlooking (or maybe ignoring) is those moves could have fallen flat if the respective coaching staffs hadn't put those players in positions to succeed.
You and me both have seen what looked like good F/A moves that turned out badly because the coaches weren't part of the selection/decision process (see the Osweiler move McNair ordered Smith to do w/o O'Brien's buy-in) and the F/A didn't fit what the coach needed.
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Very true, which is why hopefully the Gaine/BOB relationship will help solve this problem. They all learned under the Parcells tree just like Coughlin did. I did really like the Fulton signing, he has toughness the OL is missing. A definite Parcells/Coughlin type of signing. I wonder about the Henderson signing but Gaine/Devlin are putting their reputations on the line with Henderson since they worked with him in Buffalo.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Again look at how long it took them. We also had the same defensive identity. Other than that the Jaguars are still skit on the offensive side.
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How long did it take the Eagles/Vikings to fix their QB/OL/WR positions. I will give you a clue, 1 offseason.
 
Hard to fix QB position when the line sucks or can’t keep him clean enough to stay on the field. Durability is more of an issue than I can ever remember? I think what we have is a lunch pale group of wanna be overachievers who lack elite footspeed, and skill set to excell in pass pro but can do enough in the run game, with right play calling, to be competitive in every game Watson is healthy.
 
steelbtexan said:
How long did it take the Eagles/Vikings to fix their QB/OL/WR positions. I will give you a clue, 1 offseason.
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You can't say it took just one season to put in the "fix" unless every player in those positions was obtained during that one season. Otherwise those were simply the last pieces in a process that was on-going.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Now you act like they've been on their skit. Both of those teams are up and down. Especially the Eagles. Come on man
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They aren't going to be up and down anymore since Kelly left the building.

It's like you're making excuses/reasons why the Texans cant be as good as the teams I listed. The Texans have Watson/a good WR core. The Eagles have Wentz and a good receiving core. The Eagles rebuilt their Ol in one offseason thru the draft/FA. Hopefully the Texans can do that next offseason.

The Eagles also traded for a RB they needed. (Texans need another RB?) The Eagles needed a CB? Traded for Darby and signed Robinson in FA, drafted Douglas. (Texans would you say they are weak at CB? Will they make a trade to upgrade these positions? Doubtful)

How long did it take the Eagles to rebuild from the Kelly yrs? 2.

Why because they were aggressive and willing to sign top tier FA's/Make trades to fill holes and they made all of these moves last offseason and won a SB.

Tell me again what moves in FA did the Texans make in FA last offseason. What top tier FA's did they sign this offseason even though they had the cap room. I dont care about Solder anymore,
they didn't make the top offer and he signed elsewhere. Did they move on from rejection and shoot for other top tier FA's at other positions of need like OG/CB/RB?

I'm tired of typing on this subject. If you cant see the difference in the way the 2 orgs operate then no amount of my typing is going to change your mind.
 
ObsiWan said:
You can't say it took just one season to put in the "fix" unless every player in those positions was obtained during that one season. Otherwise those were simply the last pieces in a process that was on-going.
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Agreed,

But last offseason was the most telling of the differences between the orgs. Usually it takes three yrs. Go back and look at the differences in the way the orgs that I listed have been run the last 3 yrs compared to the Texans.
 
steelbtexan said:
They aren't going to be up and down anymore since Kelly left the building.

It's like you're making excuses/reasons why the Texans cant be as good as the teams I listed. The Texans have Watson/a good WR core. The Eagles have Wentz and a good receiving core. The Eagles rebuilt their Ol in one offseason thru the draft/FA. Hopefully the Texans can do that next offseason.

The Eagles also traded for a RB they needed. (Texans need another RB?) The Eagles needed a CB? Traded for Darby and signed Robinson in FA, drafted Douglas. (Texans would you say they are weak at CB? Will they make a trade to upgrade these positions? Doubtful)

How long did it take the Eagles to rebuild from the Kelly yrs? 2.

Why because they were aggressive and willing to sign top tier FA's/Make trades to fill holes and they made all of these moves last offseason and won a SB.

Tell me again what moves in FA did the Texans make in FA last offseason. What top tier FA's did they sign this offseason even though they had the cap room. I dont care about Solder anymore,
they didn't make the top offer and he signed elsewhere. Did they move on from rejection and shoot for other top tier FA's at other positions of need like OG/CB/RB?

I'm tired of typing on this subject. If you cant see the difference in the way the 2 orgs operate then no amount of my typing is going to change your mind.
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Why should I tell you something you already know. You have to wait and see if those moves will benefit this team. Those teams you mentioned made moves that we all had to see if those players would help those teams out. No one and I mean no one predicted the Eagles to win the SB. The Vikings addition with a little Keenum magic (luck) helped them out in their quest. The Jaguars have been picking from the top of the liter just like the Browns for quite some time. Both team has not had a player to spend big time money on, so they had the financial revenue to acquire top FA.

The Texans are building, they have solid talent on both sides of the ball. Especially when healthy. We will see if their offensive line additions will pan out for them. Give it until week 8 before dooming them failures.
 
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steelbtexan said:
Agreed,

But last offseason was the most telling of the differences between the orgs. Usually it takes three yrs. Go back and look at the differences in the way the orgs that I listed have been run the last 3 yrs compared to the Texans.
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you are the most irrational poster I've ever seen. you in one instance want to say we are on the right track with Ob and gaine. you say Rick Smith screwed up this team and it will take multiple off season to fix. then you want to go on a tirade because they didnt fix every single issue in 1 off season without their top 2 picks?

honestly just gi follow those other teams you wont be missed here
 
steelbtexan said:
Very true, which is why hopefully the Gaine/BOB relationship will help solve this problem. They all learned under the Parcells tree just like Coughlin did. I did really like the Fulton signing, he has toughness the OL is missing. A definite Parcells/Coughlin type of signing. I wonder about the Henderson signing but Gaine/Devlin are putting their reputations on the line with Henderson since they worked with him in Buffalo.
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But that's nonsense! KC didn't re-sign Fulton so he's trash! Backups from other teams are all backups for a reason!
 
ObsiWan said:
I've seen no proof that those other teams operated differently than the Texans. Maybe their coaching staffs are just flat better.
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Trying to be optimistic, we have the "flat" down and trying to get the better. Hey Thurs football!! Edit after reading all of posts: how can we have final eval of last off season until end of season or player bites the dust? So far Davenport making me ok with not having Solder. Reportedly rest of line better than last season. Sure lot's of 'ifs' but what isn't?
 
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infantrycak said:
BS. It finally came together. You don't only count the last year of a process.
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It's over a three year span.

But look at the draft and fa signings and tell me you can't see a difference in the way these teams do business and the Texans do business.

Start with their backup QB's and finish with how they rebuilt their ol compared to the Texans.
 
infantrycak said:
No they did not.

LT 2016 draft
LG 2016 FA
C 2011 draft
RG 2016 FA
RT 2013 draft
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Looks like they spent money an draft picks over the last three years on premium fa"s and draft on the ol to me.

Lane Johnson, Brooks, Weisnewski.

Tell me again what the Texans did? 1st round picks and a scew up by The Texans medical staff with Brooks. # again.
 
steelbtexan said:
Looks like they spent money an draft picks over the last three years on premium fa"s and draft on the ol to me.
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5th round on LT. 6th round on C. 1st round on RT 4 years ago, not 3.

Stefen Wisniewski's contract is $2.67 mil per year. That is not premium. Brooks was a mid level signing and you know it. $8 mil avg compared to $13.3 for Norwell. So one premium player, the 1st round pick 4 drafts before SB under Kelly/Roseman not Pederson.
 
steelbtexan said:
Looks like they spent money an draft picks over the last three years on premium fa"s and draft on the ol to me.

Lane Johnson, Brooks, Weisnewski.

Tell me again what the Texans did? 1st round picks and a scew up by The Texans medical staff with Brooks. # again.
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After hearing what Brooks thinks of OB, it wasn't very likely that Brooks could've been kept anyway.
 
infantrycak said:
5th round on LT. 6th round on C. 1st round on RT 4 years ago, not 3.

Stefen Wisniewski's contract is $2.67 mil per year. That is not premium. Brooks was a mid level signing and you know it. $8 mil avg compared to $13.3 for Norwell. So one premium player, the 1st round pick 4 drafts before SB under Kelly/Roseman not Pederson.
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Johnson 1st rd pick
Wiesnewski 1st rd pick
Kelce Late rd pick developed
Brooks premium FA.
Peters was an all pro LT before tearing his ACL. Eagles thought enough of him to bring him back despite cap issues.
V- Developed backup = To Davenport hopefully.

I would say the Eagles have invest and paid their OL instead of letting them walk like the Texans do. In fact they added to their OL with a couple of all pro/former all pro OG's.

Remind me again what the Texans have invested in their OL in FA/Draft.
 
Totally fake way to look at it. E.g. the Eagles didn't spend a 1st on Wisniewski. He was let go by Oakland and the Jags prior to being a cheap FA.

And you said 3 years. They obtained exactly zero premium guys 2015-17.
 
infantrycak said:
Totally fake way to look at it. E.g. the Eagles didn't spend a 1st on Wisniewski. He was let go by Oakland and the Jags prior to being a cheap FA.

And you said 3 years. They obtained exactly zero premium guys 2015-17.
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The Raiders did.
 
infantrycak said:
Totally fake way to look at it. E.g. the Eagles didn't spend a 1st on Wisniewski. He was let go by Oakland and the Jags prior to being a cheap FA.

And you said 3 years. They obtained exactly zero premium guys 2015-17.
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Brooks?

My point stands, the yrs may not be correct but they invested.

Lets focus on what the Texans did on the OL during I'll give you a 4 yr period compared to the Texans and I believe you will see where the issue is.
 
DocBar said:
After hearing what Brooks thinks of OB, it wasn't very likely that Brooks could've been kept anyway.
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True,

But they could've invested that $$$$ in a really good OG. Instead somebody chose Allen LOL What a joke of an org.
 
Best of luck to Quessenberry. A great story which unfortunately ends here for the Texans. There was lots of excitement when seeing him finally out there playing. But I always felt that the analysis of his play was too forgiving. His disease and treatments as I always suspected took a great toll on his strength, reflexes and performance that many looked past because we all wanted him to succeed.
images
 
TheRealJoker said:
Kendall Lamm makes this team... lets hope that changes prior to game one!
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Is Lamm really better than Jones-Smith?

I saw plenty from Lamm to hope we could do better there. I didn't see enough of JJS to know if he could be the answer, but reviews of him from college gave me hope that if healthy, he might stick.

Was is experience vs rookie? Was it health/injury concerns? Was it because they plan to upgrade after cuts anyway? (I hope) Or is Lamm really just better?

I had hoped JJS offered more developmental upside even if he was behind Lamm now, and we would go with the future upside.

I also know there is injury history with JJS, but don't know how much of an issue that is now.

I really hadn't seen anything from JJS to base my hopes on - they were just hopes. I did
 
Bull Durham said:
Is Lamm really better than Jones-Smith?

I saw plenty from Lamm to hope we could do better there. I didn't see enough of JJS to know if he could be the answer, but reviews of him from college gave me hope that if healthy, he might stick.

Was is experience vs rookie? Was it health/injury concerns? Was it because they plan to upgrade after cuts anyway? (I hope) Or is Lamm really just better?

I had hoped JJS offered more developmental upside even if he was behind Lamm now, and we would go with the future upside.

I also know there is injury history with JJS, but don't know how much of an issue that is now.

I really hadn't seen anything from JJS to base my hopes on - they were just hopes. I did
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I think JJS having practice squad eligibility and Lamm having knowledge of system gave him the knod... but I hope that he is never activated if he isn’t outright upgraded prior to game 1.
 
infantrycak said:
Sure, 1 training camp where he's 3rd string and flipping sides in a new system. I'm sure he got all sorts of coaching attention to rule that out.
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You're probably right. But I will bet that you see him bounce around until he quickly fades away. He had plenty of opportunity with the Texans
 
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