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Sam Bradford traded to Vikings
- Thread starter TheRealJoker
- Start date
Scooter
Funky
"Superbowl hopes alive". If the Vikings were consistent, or just 'keep it together behind center and we can win', I MIGHT be able to see this trade. They've had 2 winning seasons out of the past 6. Those were 3 years apart, and lost in the wild-card round both times. The Vikings haven't proven themselves as much of anything. A first round pick for Bradford says they're insanely desperate and also wildly overestimate their impact as a franchise. OR they think Teddy is finished and expect to need Bradford for more than 2 years (forgetting that he's half in a wheel chair already) as they search for a new quarterback.
Either way, I find zero reason it would cost a first rounder for Bradford, and dang sure not a conditional 4th as well. For all Bradford's done in the league, a conditional 4th would be more reasonable.
Either way, I find zero reason it would cost a first rounder for Bradford, and dang sure not a conditional 4th as well. For all Bradford's done in the league, a conditional 4th would be more reasonable.
chicagotexan2
Easterby = Little Finger/Cal = Fredo Corleone
I suppose if Bridgewater is unable to return they need a plan to move forward but to hitch thier hopes Bradford who is the definition of brittle is nuts.
I don't think the Vikings decided Bradford was worth a 1st & a 4th. People hung up on Bradford's "value" are looking at it all wrong. Take his name out of it. Take his history out of the equation. The Vikings were looking for a starting QB 13 days from the start of the season. Hell yeah they were desperate. More than that, they found out how ill prepared they were if something were to happen to Teddy.
If this happened four months ago, yeah maybe they could have gotten Keenum for much less. The Rams would have had time to prepare Jared Goff, or Sean Mannion as their starter. But now, no way they give Keenum up for anything short of a 1st & a 2nd, or something way beyond his "value."
It's also unreasonable to think anyone would give up their backup at this point in time for anything short of a blockbuster deal.
They got a QB who was slated to start the season for another team. Yeah, it cost them a lot. But with a little more than a week from game 1, that's what it's going to cost to get anyone who could reasonably be considered a starter. Mallett, Geno, Kaepernick.. outside of the timing no one would consider paying a 1st & 4th for any of them. These are most likely the guys available to the Vikings. Regardless which one they chose "people" would have this same reaction.
Sure, they probably should have got Savaage/Weeden for less, but unless they have a Texans Homer in their front office, they wouldn't even considered it.
Would you like to be the GM who tells his fanbase (you know all those season ticket holders) we're just gonna sh*t-can this season (and maybe part of the next one) because *I* didn't want to pay the 1st and 4th for an experienced starter who could possibly salvage it?
Scooter
Funky
I'd would rather be the GM that stuck to what he said just the day before 'we're not going to panic and mortgage the future'. Bradford wanted out and the Eagles were open to moving him. Even if he were my target (he wouldn't have been), I would've hung up the phone and waited until they were willing to negotiate for a deal that wasn't the worst kind of isht - bat.
But what incentive would the Eagle possibly have for lowering their price. They already said Bradford would be the starter until Wentz is ready. And even if Wentz starts opening day (I've heard he might but that makes no sense given his inexperience AND sore ribs) the Eagles still wouldn't in a rush to dump Bradford in case Wentz isn't up to snuff.
Meanwhile, AP's useful football career, along with Minnesota's season, is slipping away game by game while you sit by the phone doing nothing.
Texian
Hall of Fame
I don't fault Spielman for trading for Bradford, I do fault Spielman for putting himself in that position.
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That's probably fair. He had chances to upgrade the #2 QB spot for sure.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
If your starting QB goes down your season is done. Situations like The Rams with Kurt Warner and the Patriots with Tom Brady pretty much never happen, but they did in those instances. The % of getting a lotto QB like that when you have him as your backup is way to rare. You may have a serviceable backup, but the minute the Vikings lost Bridgewater they were toast. And what made them think they were SB bound any way with Bridgewater. He has shown potential and all, but nothing that serious. I don't recall anyone giving them some high shot at a SB before he got hurt.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Same thing that made McNair think the Texans were SB contenders with Case Keenum????
Backup QBs are like starting QBs, about half of them give you a better chance of winning than the other half.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
What makes you think that Mcnair thought that about Keenum? I highly doubt he ever thought that highly of Keenum. I think he was more sick of seeing statue stepping noodle armed Schaub throwing more TD's to the other team than he was a believer in Keenum. Keenum had an outstanding pre season that year so a lot of folks (Including myself) were just dying to see if any of that would have translated into the regular season. I knew it was a long shot, but I was so tired of seeing Sloth, that Keenum's presence brought a new excitement in a season that was already done with. Unfortunately, his allure died within about 3 games after watching him in regular games other than the fanatics that never would let go of the Keenum dream. Hell, some of them still exist. Lol!
Texian
Hall of Fame
At the press conference where McNair fired Kubiak, when he was asked if the Texans were rebuilding, McNair quite angrily and very emphatically said no that this team was a playoff team and that Case Keenum would be their starter.
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infantrycak
Hall of Fame
For the remainder of the season.
Texian
Hall of Fame
McNair did not say that. That is your interpretation.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
That's what any thinking person would understand. A new coaching staff was going to come in. The only reasonable expectation was they would evaluate the QB position. And oh look, when they did Keenum was gone not just as starter even.
McNair has always portrayed himself as "just a fan". Obviously, just a fan that can actually do what he wants with the team, even if that means making goofy decisions as an enamored fan (i.e. Ed Reed, David Carr 5th year, Case Keenum, etc). So in that regard, I think he's about as dumb as the rest of us fans.
HOPEFULLY, the O'Brien era put an end to that kind of decision making process with the exception of maybe demanding a better QB after that 30-0 Hoyerable playoff debacle.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Clearly you're not the thinking person that you think you're. Clearly you don't know McNair. You would think that after McNair insisted Kubiak spend his first year and also paid a $10 million bonus to fix David Carr that you would've learned. Apparently you didn't. At the time McNair insisted he had a SB contender what QB did he have in mind besides Keenum? He didn't!
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The Broncos winning the Super Bowl. Seattle winning the Super Bowl & San Francisco getting so close so often with amazing defenses & above average run ģames makes teams like Minnesota (& at one time Houston) think they can win it all with suspect QB.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Its possible, yes but it is very unlikely. Its a reason that every season there is at least one elite QB in the SB. They're that important. I don't think that Minnesota was as good as those teams. However, the season hasn't started yet and I can't say that I know that for sure. There are always surprise teams like Carolina from last year or Carolina the year they almost beat the Patriots in the SB but came up short due to Brady getting the ball last. I'd actually add the Carolina team led by Jake Delhome to your list.
Texian
Hall of Fame
Of the 50 Super Bowls about 5 games or 10% ended in the anomaly that you speak of. You can add Baltimore and Tampa Bay to your list.
That's one way to look at it. Or you could look at the last five or six.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
The only teams that I would say that qualify as winning with straight defense were the Broncos, Ravens, Bucs, and the 85 Bears. The 85 Bears had Walter Payton who is quite a bit better than this year's AP will be. I'm not sure why you would compare the Vikings defense to any of those either. There have been a few teams that went to the SB and lost like the Bears that lost to the Colts, but again that is really bad formula to think you can win a SB with. It is way to rare. If it was that easy, then teams wouldn't care about the QB position that much. They'd all just ask their defenses up.
I think you could add the Seahawks to that list. Wilson didn't lose them games but it was the defense that got them to and won them the SB
Point is that with a solid defense and a good running game the Vikes have a better shot to make noise in the playoffs with Bradford than with Shaun Hill. I mean surely no one is arguing that they should have sat on their hands and stood pat with Shaun Hill....? Are they??
I think the Vikings defense was 4th or 5th in points. It's not me comparing their defense to Super Bowl winning defenses, that's the media. But I believe they're expecting the defense & Teddy to take another step.
& no one is taking the QB out of the equation. Fitz & Hoyer won't take any of these teams to the Super Bowl. Russell Wilson did his part, but he wasn't the QB he is now. Kaepernick was limited as well in some areas. & we know Peyton was but a shadow of himself.
I don't think Sam Bradford can get the Vikings to the Super Bowl, I'm assuming (as most of the media is) the Vikings do. No other reason for them to give up what they did to get him.
We sound like Cowboy fans, going back 30 years.
Scooter
Funky
I'm going to have to go with Texian on this one - it most certainly sounded like McNair had hitched his wagon to Keenum. I'm not sure how that's a point of contention when in the same press conference the owner fires the head coach and names the starting quarterback. He probably would've been our starting 2013 quarterback (much like the Carr scenario), had Keenum done better than 0-8 and been in the media as a point of contention between management and staff. If there was even a hint of Keenum being heir apparent, McNair would've made him mandatory. Ironically I think Keenum might have actually been ready to start in 2013 if he was left to the coaches, because I said a million times he shouldn't see more than exploratory reps that year - he was close, but NOT ready to start.
By the way, Keenum is currently starting. We've gone through Hoyer, Yates, Mallett, Weeden, Savage, BJ Daniels, Fitzpatrick and Keenum himself in 2 years. I'm on team 'SteelB' when it comes to mismanagement from McNair.
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Scooter
Funky
Peyton's only Superbowl in Indy - his last rank defense during the regular season were the highlight of the postseason - they faced Rex Grossman and the Bear's defense. Green Bay had one good defensive year and have been stuck in the mud since. Giants front 4 won a superbowl twice. The Saints defense won a Superbowl in such a dirty fashion that it got their coaching staff suspended. The Patriots' dynasty was lead by an incredible defense and some kid trying not to screw up at quarterback ... they went dry for a long time with the top offense, until half of their defense was first rounders recently got them over the hump (combined with more shenanigans). Steelers twice. Ravens twice. Every year 2of3 or 3of4 games by the top playoff teams are won by shutting down the opponent - sometimes offset by one game in a shootout.
We can go back further. Joe Montana was the man ... but do you remember his defense lead by Ronnie Lott? The greatest show on turf had one of the greatest defenses.
Most of these teams had solid or at least competent quarterbacks, but playoff games and Superbowls on the whole are won on defense. There are Trent Dilfer games and Montana drives, but for the most part it's offensive line, ball control and defensive superiority.
Edit: and apparently I'm being argumentative at this point - one of those nights.
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A lot of us wanted him fired for suiting Schaub instead of Yates as the back up. It very well could have been that McNair was just as tired of seeing Schaub as many of us.
We all knew Keenum wasn't going to win that game.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
This entire post is full of so much fail and revisionist history that it isn't even worth the time to break down each team you falsely described. No one ever said having a strong defense wasn't extremely important. The point was that trying to win with a defense only strategy is a bad strategy that rarely ever plays out and wins it all. No one said it couldn't be done. It can, but the %'s based on history is extremely low. Having a balanced team is the most important way to build a team. Elite QB's are in the SB pretty much every year which usually means they have an elite offense from that season. If those teams don't have a strong defense at all, they fail quite a bit in the big show though. Thats where the balance comes in, and usually puts those teams over the top.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Another post full of absolute BS.
We've gone through Fitzpatrick one season, and then Hoyer/Mallet the next. Every other QB you mentioned started purely based on injury as any backup has to do on every NFL team that exists.
That is as stupid as suggesting that Kubiak rolled the dice and wanted Sage Rosenfels as our starter and then had a brain lapse and thought Yates could be the guy or Ragone just to make some false rhetoric about Kubiak. GTFO of here.
FYI
The Vikings defense scored 2 TDs in the 25-16 win over the Titans.
Titans win the game 16-11 without those scores.
The Vikings defense scored 2 TDs in the 25-16 win over the Titans.
Titans win the game 16-11 without those scores.