CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Now, that's REAL comforting!
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Reliant Turf and Meineke Car Care Bowl
- Thread starter Koolaid Time
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Now, that's REAL comforting!
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
I for one nearly passed out when Cushing went down and then into the locker room. To see him return to the field was a huge relief.
I know they can go to longer cleats after a little warm up action. Why don't they seem to make that adjustment when the field is slippery like that?
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
Not true. Cowboys Stadium has Field Turf and they host a ton of other events there. It can happen at Reliant. They need to $$ up and change that crappy field already. We've had enough phantom injuries on that field.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
There is a difference between a "slippery" field and a torn up field. Shorter studs can be used for hard and dry surfaces and longer studs on wet and sloppy fields. But when some of the field is different that another portion of the field (as is the case with a torn up field), then one length of cleat is not optimal for all of the different conditions found on the same field.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Exactly. This would make sense if they played the entire game between the hash marks but they don't. If anything it would make me wonder what it must be like to run on solid turf and then transition to the spongy mess left over from the bowl game.
The tray system does not work. That seems obvious to me at this point. They need to either modify how they're doing it or find an entirely different answer to this problem.
TheMatrix31
Hall of Fame
Makes sense. Pretty crappy.
GP
Go Texans!
Small high schools in West Texas have a field turf system.
McNair should nut up and do it.
mexican texan
Practice Squad
I wonder how they do it at the Alamodome, they have both of those events there. I think the SA rodeo is before the Houston one, and they also host other events like concers, monster trucks, and supercross.
Nawzer
Alienz
I was literally shocked at how poor the field condition was. It was a minor miracle that more guys didn't get injured during the game. The just have to replace this system they have because it's embarrassing but more importantly dangerous for the players. I hope for the playoff game the Texans will have a great field to play on.
paycheck71
Hall of Fame
I've heard repeatedly that players prefer natural grass surface to any artificial surface, including the new Field Turf. I'm not an expert by any stretch, but it seems from watching the Texans games the the playing surface is not consistent from tray to tray at Reliant. I wish they had a system similar to what they have in Phoenix where they replace the entire field at once. Since that's impossible at Reliant, I wonder if it would help if as much of the field was replaced as possible in the same configuration that it was "growing" in the parking lot.
BTW, I'm not sure that money is the problem here. I wouldn't be surprised if maintaining the natural grass field at Reliant was more expensive than buying Field Turf.
BTW, I'm not sure that money is the problem here. I wouldn't be surprised if maintaining the natural grass field at Reliant was more expensive than buying Field Turf.
TimeKiller
Guest
The dirt painted green looked fine.
The grass was in pretty bad shape though....
The grass was in pretty bad shape though....
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Time lapse VIDEO of Cardinals Stadium field grass being replaced. (read blurb beneath video) And keep in mind that the Cardinal's grass lays more naturally on a foot of sand, rather than a couple of inches of whatever.
BTW, does anyone really believe that the Reliant would give up the revenues generated by the parking fees for all events that go on during the season to house an extra field?
[Just as an interesting aside, here is timelapse of Reliant Stadium as grounds crews convert the stadium from soccer to football for a Houston Texans preseason game. Made from alomst 5000 digital photos taken over 40 hours.]
TimeKiller
Guest
They sure as hell won't use the revenues to pave over that mudhole in the yellow lot. If they expect me to pay for parking on mud, dirt or grass again I'll be parking 20 feet from the stadium on the only nice grass to be found. They could just...you know, OPEN the stadium and get some sun in there but who am I to want outdoor football on a 65 degree cloudless day?BTW, does anyone really believe that the Reliant would give up the revenues generated by the parking fees for all events that go on during the season to house an extra field?
It's kinda sad that the practice fields look nicer than the gameday field. Last Sunday was the first time I've ever been able to see every square pallet on the field. What's really sad is that they saw fit enough to spray paint the midfield but not the edges. What did the edges do to them?
The Texans and Houston Rodeo were partners in the implementation of financing the construction of the stadium.
If you look at the endcap of each isle, you will either see a Texans logo or a Houston Rodeo logo. The rodeo actually has more event dates than the Texans, as well. They are concentrated in a 3-4 week period, though, instead of a full football season.
The Houston Rodeo is not going anywhere, nor should they go anywhere. Huge tourist draw for the city, too.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Austex
Practice Squad
Hopefully they wont use the same vacant lot they've been getting the turf from for the new field.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Officials say Reliant Stadium in playoff shape
Posted on January 6, 2012 at 1:01 am by David Barron (Chronicle)
From its roof to its grass field, Reliant Stadium is prepared, say stadium officials, for Houston’s first NFL playoff game since 1994.
Contrary to the 2005 World Series, when Major League Baseball overruled the Astros’ desire to close the Minute Maid Park roof, the Texans are in control of Reliant Stadium’s retractable roof Saturday, when temperatures are expected to be in the 60s under partly cloudy skies.
Texans policy calls for the roof to be open if the temperature is above 50 degrees and below 80. The team is 15-6 under coach Gary Kubiak with the roof open (1-0 in 2011) and 14-13 under Kubiak (4-3 in 2011) with the roof closed.
Reliant’s portable grass field, which took a pounding in the back-to-back Texas A&M-Northwestern and Texans-Titans games last week, was reassembled Thursday with fresh stock from the stadium’s supply of trays topped with Tifway 419 Bermuda grass.
Seamless transition
SMG, which manages the Reliant Park complex, has the equivalent of 2.4 football fields sectioned into eight-foot-square trays, each about 3½ inches deep with 4½ inches of sand and sod on top. A regulation football field contains about 1,250 trays, said Reliant Park general manager Mark Miller.
The field is rolled after the trays, each of which weighs about 3,500 pounds, are put in place, and workers then check the field in an effort to eliminate seams.
Unlike most elements of Reliant Stadium, the field has not been universally acclaimed. It ranked in the middle of the pack in the NFL Players’ Association’s 2010 field safety survey, placing seventh among 18 entries on the list of best grass fields and 11th on the list of worst grass fields.
New England coach Bill Belichick was sharply critical of the field’s condition when receiver Wes Welker suffered a season-ending injury in a 2009-10 game, and former coach Tony Dungy, now an analyst with NBC Sports, said the Colts were “definitely concerned about the injury factor” during his years in Indianapolis.
Artificial turf in offing?
In the 2010 NFLPA survey, 71 percent of Texans players rated the field as excellent or good, with the remainder describing it as fair to poor.
Miller remains interested in acquiring a portable artificial turf field for Reliant so SMG can bid for the University Interscholastic League championship games, which were held on Cowboys Stadium’s artificial turf this season.
“If I could find the money (about $1.5 million for the field and the equipment needed to maintain it and move it in and out of the stadium), I’d buy it tomorrow,” he said. “I want to get into the rotation for those (high school) games.”
Miller said SMG’s grass fields made it through the punishing drought of 2011 in relatively good order by replacing rainwater with irrigation. While Reliant Park complied elsewhere with city water conversation measures, it watered its grass fields daily.
“Any landscaper will tell you that the field probably does better with natural rainwater, but we didn’t see any significant impact,” he said.
Posted on January 6, 2012 at 1:01 am by David Barron (Chronicle)
From its roof to its grass field, Reliant Stadium is prepared, say stadium officials, for Houston’s first NFL playoff game since 1994.
Contrary to the 2005 World Series, when Major League Baseball overruled the Astros’ desire to close the Minute Maid Park roof, the Texans are in control of Reliant Stadium’s retractable roof Saturday, when temperatures are expected to be in the 60s under partly cloudy skies.
Texans policy calls for the roof to be open if the temperature is above 50 degrees and below 80. The team is 15-6 under coach Gary Kubiak with the roof open (1-0 in 2011) and 14-13 under Kubiak (4-3 in 2011) with the roof closed.
Reliant’s portable grass field, which took a pounding in the back-to-back Texas A&M-Northwestern and Texans-Titans games last week, was reassembled Thursday with fresh stock from the stadium’s supply of trays topped with Tifway 419 Bermuda grass.
Seamless transition
SMG, which manages the Reliant Park complex, has the equivalent of 2.4 football fields sectioned into eight-foot-square trays, each about 3½ inches deep with 4½ inches of sand and sod on top. A regulation football field contains about 1,250 trays, said Reliant Park general manager Mark Miller.
The field is rolled after the trays, each of which weighs about 3,500 pounds, are put in place, and workers then check the field in an effort to eliminate seams.
Unlike most elements of Reliant Stadium, the field has not been universally acclaimed. It ranked in the middle of the pack in the NFL Players’ Association’s 2010 field safety survey, placing seventh among 18 entries on the list of best grass fields and 11th on the list of worst grass fields.
New England coach Bill Belichick was sharply critical of the field’s condition when receiver Wes Welker suffered a season-ending injury in a 2009-10 game, and former coach Tony Dungy, now an analyst with NBC Sports, said the Colts were “definitely concerned about the injury factor” during his years in Indianapolis.
Artificial turf in offing?
In the 2010 NFLPA survey, 71 percent of Texans players rated the field as excellent or good, with the remainder describing it as fair to poor.
Miller remains interested in acquiring a portable artificial turf field for Reliant so SMG can bid for the University Interscholastic League championship games, which were held on Cowboys Stadium’s artificial turf this season.
“If I could find the money (about $1.5 million for the field and the equipment needed to maintain it and move it in and out of the stadium), I’d buy it tomorrow,” he said. “I want to get into the rotation for those (high school) games.”
Miller said SMG’s grass fields made it through the punishing drought of 2011 in relatively good order by replacing rainwater with irrigation. While Reliant Park complied elsewhere with city water conversation measures, it watered its grass fields daily.
“Any landscaper will tell you that the field probably does better with natural rainwater, but we didn’t see any significant impact,” he said.
I'm tired of Dungy's yapping about the Texans. Dude is starting to annoy me as much as Casserly does with his spewage.
I think if it was truly a legit concern, McNair would have it taken care of accordingly.
Players have spoken, Dungy, and you're full of it.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
I dug up a copy of the entire 2010 NFL PLAYERS PLAYING SURFACES OPINION SURVEY
It answers many questions. It can possibly clear up many misconceptions.........straight from the players themselves.
It answers many questions. It can possibly clear up many misconceptions.........straight from the players themselves.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
From CnD's link there is a big one right off the bat for folks calling for field turf.
More likely to cause injury - grass 15.9%, turf 82.4%
More likely to cause soreness and fatigue - grass 9.2%, turf 89.1%
More likely to shorten career - grass 7.6%%, turf 89.7%
81.8% of Texans want to play on grass with 12.1% wanting turf.
More likely to cause injury - grass 15.9%, turf 82.4%
More likely to cause soreness and fatigue - grass 9.2%, turf 89.1%
More likely to shorten career - grass 7.6%%, turf 89.7%
81.8% of Texans want to play on grass with 12.1% wanting turf.
yep, exactly. Every poll I have seen reveals that players overwhelmingly prefer natural grass over any type of artificial field.
So that right there puts Reliant in a good place, and then to rank 7th when voted on by players? That says a lot to me.
Sad to read Dungy say that when the RCA Dome was Astroturf until 2005. Talk about hypocrisy at it's finest! I have never read anything from a player defending Astroturf.
Look at this press release from a Colts website about the upgrade to field turf:
Dutchrudder
Hall of Fame
Thanks for the link, that was interesting. I really wonder what the differences among astroturf fields are. I can't imagine it's that big of a deal.
And the player rankings for grass fields:
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
CAK and DB..........your comments are exactly why I posted the actual survey, which I previously pointed out these 2010 player perceptions grass vs turf back in a spring thread.
It is the upkeep of the grass that then becomes the very important factor that separates the good, the bad, and the ugly and distinguishes one field from another.
It is the upkeep of the grass that then becomes the very important factor that separates the good, the bad, and the ugly and distinguishes one field from another.
My oldest son has played on Reliant's field a couple of times, and his thoughts as an offensive lineman is that it is the nicest field he's played on behind Texas A&M's Kyle Field (which is dern near manicured to perfection). His thoughts, fwiw.
paycheck71
Hall of Fame
I think that's the key with the Reliant field. It looks torn up sometimes. But even with that, it was ranked by the players higher than several outdoors grass fields. I will take a decently kept grass field over any artificial substitute.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
I understand that but isn't your oldest son in college? That implies to me at least that Saturday the turf is better than on Sunday which makes sense if a game was played on it the day before.
Every year we start talking about how bad Reliant's turf is or looks and every year we hear that players prefer grass and that Reliant's turf is rated highly by players (exactly how varies every year).
Every year we see a game where the field looks like a horror story though (usually that's the game that starts this thread) and every year it seems like something happens to a player to make us all start worrying that the field isn't right.
This is just something that you might find interesting. It's from an interview with Bum that I linked to the other day over in another thread. The interview in it's entirety can be found here
Linked Interview said:
Players are always going to think that grass is better for them to play on than any artificial surface because frankly early implementations of AstroTurf were bad and poorly maintained AstroTurf has been blamed for a lot of injuries. I think that no matter what you come up with it will always lose out to natural grass whether it's actually worse or not.
I predict we'll be swapping trays out until someone decides it's too much trouble, too expensive, or that the field was responsible for some very high-profile player's injury and then a change will happen whether players want that change or not.
Until then we'll talk about it every year and the discussion will look a lot like this one.
paycheck71
Hall of Fame
Field looking good for tomorrow...
@HoustonTexans Kickoff at Reliant Stadium is less than 24hrs away. Who's ready? pic.twitter.com/ihh1SgSi
@HoustonTexans Kickoff at Reliant Stadium is less than 24hrs away. Who's ready? pic.twitter.com/ihh1SgSi
I understand your perspective, but I'm curious. How many injuries have been confirmed as due to the grass at Reliant?
Not talking about Belichick's or Dungy's statements. But looking at Andre Johnson, dude was just running and fell. He did not trip on a seam or get caught in a divet.
I'm really wondering if our perception as fans is all that relative. Just because something doesn't look pretty on a HD tv doesn't mean it's a bad playing surface.
It's been a decade now. How many injuries are 100% confirmed due to Reliant's grass? Beyond fan speculation, I think there would be something out there that is tangible.
When talking about my son, I specifically asked him about the seams and rumors of different feels with each tray. He said you could not tell where the seams were at and the field never felt soft or hard in different parts. I think the grounds crew at Reliant know that they are charged with taking care of a playing surface for multi-millionaire athletes.
If it was as bad as many are saying, then we would see grass-related injuries at every home game. But I'm not perceiving it in any sort of way, and players are voting that it's a nice field. I think player opinions carry far more weight than opinions of fans who have never been on the field.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
amazing80
Hall of Fame
I dont think the problem is with our surface, I think it is the way it is "seamed" together. On the bad days you literally see patches of sod out there patched together. I know it will be hard to imitate what Arizona has, but we need something SIMILAR to that, ONE field set in place not tons of small patches pieced together.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
I think it's just too late to do anything about that. I keep thinking that deeper trays might help along with more trays. A giant greenhouse to keep them in and grow them in maybe? maybe there is some other grass they can use that might root deeper?
Arizona had a great idea with the giant sliding field. Wish we had thought of that.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Just an FYI. Space and cost of space was not a factor. The Cardinals' stadium was built out in the middle of the dessert where the land was undeveloped, plentiful and cheap to begin with. Not only that, but an Arizona family (the Hurleys have owned a large chunk of this part of the Arizona dessert since the early 1900's) actually donated 15 acres for the multipupose stadium with its extra rollout field space.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Bingo. I think a lot of fans are unhappy with the way the field looks and are heaping on a potential injury risk argument to try to bolster their case. I frankly don't care much about the appearance but there are certainly lots of outdoor natural grass stadium particularly up north which look far worse. Seriously people ***** about the wussification of football and now moan about the field not being pretty enough.
