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OL Coach Cole Popovich

Another issue for me is it doesn't help my worries that the internal scouting for the o-line is awful.

We're all basically hedging and hoping that some scheme change and simply a new pair of eyes at OC changes everything. I think that's rather optimistic.

To be blunt I fully expect to see 4 of the exact same regulars we just watched playing on the o-line and we'll probably see similar results. I'm an optimist at heart and am hoping for improvement but I think there's going to be a ceiling to how much can be achieved.
 
Sweech said:
To be blunt I fully expect to see 4 of the exact same regulars we just watched playing on the o-line and we'll probably see similar results. I'm an optimist at heart and am hoping for improvement but I think there's going to be a ceiling to how much can be achieved.
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I think that's a legitimate fear.

LT - Tunsil is overpaid based upon his production, which is no longer Pro Bowl level, IMO. That doesn't mean Laremy is easily replaced. Maybe Fisher could move over to the left side. Maybe. But do you really want to look for another Tackle or move Howard back?

LG - Howard is the incumbent and he's overpaid for the position and the production. Once a decent athlete, injuries have slowed him. I can see the Texans thinking Howard can hold the position down, but something has to be done with that contract.

C - If I could pick a position to change on the line, Center would be it. I think Scruggs and Patterson are depth pieces, but the Texans may think one can emerge.

RG - I think Shaq Mason must go. He isn't athletic enough in any scheme. But Popovich has coached Mason for 7 of Shaq's 10 seasons in the league. Maybe Coach Pop (I can say that, I hate the Spurs) thinks Mason still has something left? I hope not.

RT - I think Fisher is the guy here and should remain at the position. I know Blake had snaps on both sides his rookie year. But he needs reps on one side so he can master it.

I think at least 3 additional offensive linemen need to be brought in to at least compete. Some combination of vets and high to mid round picks. That's what I think. But can I see a scenario where the Texans are comfortable with their talent and feel the line needs tinkering with the scheme and coaching? Unfortunately, yes.
 
Sweech said:
Another issue for me is it doesn't help my worries that the internal scouting for the o-line is awful.

We're all basically hedging and hoping that some scheme change and simply a new pair of eyes at OC changes everything. I think that's rather optimistic.

To be blunt I fully expect to see 4 of the exact same regulars we just watched playing on the o-line and we'll probably see similar results. I'm an optimist at heart and am hoping for improvement but I think there's going to be a ceiling to how much can be achieved.
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I'm thinking they add a couple of pieces to the OL in FA/Draft.

Give them time, surely they can see the issues.
 
badboy said:
Like others, his podcast followers thinks he is. He rubs shoulders with others who know little but he hopes someone drops a crumb of info he can announce to his followers.
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Actually, one of them - the host - is an actual creditialed member of the media. Has full access and goes to press conferences. That's legitimate access that gives their podcast credibility.
 
houstonspartan said:
Actually, one of them - the host - is an actual creditialed member of the media. Has full access and goes to press conferences. That's legitimate access that gives their podcast credibility.
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So he gets to actually be in the room and hear what is being said and then those in the room video and we get to actually watch the video and hear what was said?
 
badboy said:
So he gets to actually be in the room and hear what is being said and then those in the room video and we get to actually watch the video and hear what was said?
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Your question confused me. Basically: He is a member of the media. He has full access to the Texans. He is not just another podcaster.
 
Sweech said:
I think they might add 1 starter tops and the rest will be signed/drafted as backups.
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You're probably right, but after last year I'm hoping they sign one starter in FA and draft another starter high in the draft. That way they can cut the dead weight and still have quality depth on the OL. Something that's been badly lacking. I'm hoping after last year they learned the virtues of having quality depth on the OL.
 
steelbtexan said:
You're probably right, but after last year I'm hoping they sign one starter in FA and draft another starter high in the draft. That way they can cut the dead weight and still have quality depth on the OL. Something that's been badly lacking. I'm hoping after last year they learned the virtues of having quality depth on the OL.
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Don't know how active we'll be in free agency. As of yesterday, OTC has the Texans in the red by approx $100k. So the team will be making moves, some players will be cut, but right now we're just speculating, and maybe wishing, what moves will be made. But who, or how good, will be available for the Texans to sign? Will they be any better than the player to be replaced? Best option for improvement in the OL will be through the draft. Our first round pick? Maybe the second pick? How likely is it that a mid- round pick will start? We've invested in the OL the last couple of drafts. We have Fisher, Scruggs, Patterson and Broeker in the wings. How likely is it that Howard will be traded or released? More likely he'll be on the team and starting in '25, but what position?

The prognosis for this next season, from today's prospective, is not incourageing. Popovich has his work cut out for him.
 
Number19 said:
Don't know how active we'll be in free agency. As of yesterday, OTC has the Texans in the red by approx $100k. So the team will be making moves, some players will be cut, but right now we're just speculating, and maybe wishing, what moves will be made. But who, or how good, will be available for the Texans to sign? Will they be any better than the player to be replaced? Best option for improvement in the OL will be through the draft. Our first round pick? Maybe the second pick? How likely is it that a mid- round pick will start? We've invested in the OL the last couple of drafts. We have Fisher, Scruggs, Patterson and Broeker in the wings. How likely is it that Howard will be traded or released? More likely he'll be on the team and starting in '25, but what position?

The prognosis for this next season, from today's prospective, is not incourageing. Popovich has his work cut out for him.
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They can make cap space if they want too. Look at how the Eagles structure their contracts as a guide.
 
cland said:
I think out best bet is that Tricky Nicky handles the OL this year like he did DL last year. Hopefully he'll bring in some misfit toys that all gel into a cohesive unit.
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A lot easier to do on d-line than o-line.

Random gem o-linemen that are just sitting around are pretty hard to find.
 
I see them signing one mid level FA and one draft pick, probably middle round type but could be higher. Depends on who falls and all that.

I see them restructuring Tunsil again. I think Howard is a better RT than G, but presently Howard is a better LG than anyone else currently available. Im not sure if they will/should restructure. I doubt a trade as nobody wants to take his contract. His overall status is something to keep an eye on, depending on other moves. I don’t think he is guaranteed to be here…but I’d say likely.

Fisher should get first shot at locking down RT. If here…Howard may also compete for that spot….again depending on any new pieces inside.I hope Fisher wins.

I see Kenyon Green as an easy cut. Total bust pick by Nick. His worst choice as GM. Move on.

At C…like Lucky, I’d love a big upgrade, but I don’t see it. I think Patterson and Juice fight it out.

Once we get thru the draft and any FA signing…all of this will come into better focus.
 
Sweech said:
A lot easier to do on d-line than o-line.

Random gem o-linemen that are just sitting around are pretty hard to find.
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I agree, in terms of the Oline has to build consistency across the whole 5, but he did bring in George Fant in 2023 who did a solid job. (Looking back, bringing him back for another season would have made a difference in 2024.)

If he can find a low cost starter in the IOL, it would give the team a lot more flexibility.
 
Porky said:
I see them signing one mid level FA and one draft pick, probably middle round type but could be higher. Depends on who falls and all that.

I see them restructuring Tunsil again. I think Howard is a better RT than G, but presently Howard is a better LG than anyone else currently available. Im not sure if they will/should restructure. I doubt a trade as nobody wants to take his contract. His overall status is something to keep an eye on, depending on other moves. I don’t think he is guaranteed to be here…but I’d say likely.

Fisher should get first shot at locking down RT. If here…Howard may also compete for that spot….again depending on any new pieces inside.I hope Fisher wins.

I see Kenyon Green as an easy cut. Total bust pick by Nick. His worst choice as GM. Move on.

At C…like Lucky, I’d love a big upgrade, but I don’t see it. I think Patterson and Juice fight it out.

Once we get thru the draft and any FA signing…all of this will come into better focus.
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I know most didn’t like the trade idea, but something has to be done b/c Tunsil is not the long term answer at LT. Howard and Mason just haven’t been good enough to justify the contracts they’ve been given.

The three don’t represent the future so break it off before it gets any more expensive.

Again, trade Tunsil to the highest bidder before the draft. Cut Howard and Mason after June 1st b/c no one will trade for them. Take the estimated 43.5M in cap space and invest some of that money towards the OL.

LT- Jackson (Rams) and OC- Kelly (Colts) would be better pieces for the OL than those removed.

Draft LG- Jackson (Ohio State)

2025 OL:
LT- Jackson
LG- Jackson (R)
OC- Kelly
RG- Scruggs or Patterson
RT- Fisher

This OL would be light years better than the crap the Texans have been running out there for years.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I know most didn’t like the trade idea, but something has to be done b/c Tunsil is not the long term answer at LT. Howard and Mason just haven’t been good enough to justify the contracts they’ve been given.

The three don’t represent the future so break it off before it gets any more expensive.

Again, trade Tunsil to the highest bidder before the draft. Cut Howard and Mason after June 1st b/c no one will trade for them. Take the estimated 43.5M in cap space and invest some of that money towards the OL.

LT- Jackson (Rams) and OC- Kelly (Colts) would be better pieces for the OL than those removed.

Draft LG- Jackson (Ohio State)

2025 OL:
LT- Jackson
LG- Jackson (R)
OC- Kelly
RG- Scruggs or Patterson
RT- Fisher

This OL would be light years better than the crap the Texans have been running out there for years.
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Yeah, not gonna happen

It must be this time of year again like death and taxes, it's trade Tunsil time of year. Thing is once again this off-season Tunsil isn't getting traded. Obviously management views Tunsil differently than the bean counters around these parts.

I wish I could find last years post where I said the same exact thing. It would probably save time. Take faith knowing that someday y'all will be right.
 
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cland said:
I agree, in terms of the Oline has to build consistency across the whole 5, but he did bring in George Fant in 2023 who did a solid job. (Looking back, bringing him back for another season would have made a difference in 2024.)

If he can find a low cost starter in the IOL, it would give the team a lot more flexibility.
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I just mean free agency as a whole is easier to acquire good to great d-line than it is good to great o-line.

Or even good budget contributors.

There's just not really a lot of talent at o-line floating out around there.
 
Sweech said:
I just mean free agency as a whole is easier to acquire good to great d-line than it is good to great o-line.

Or even good budget contributors.

There's just not really a lot of talent at o-line floating out around there.
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There are some solid guys out there in FA. But if you want premium OL talent you've gotta draft it. The Eagles were real smart to draft Juergens a season before Kelce retired. It gave Juergens a chance to get his feet wet while playing with a bunch of vets so there was less pressure on him.
 
steelbtexan said:
Yeah, not gonna happen

It must be this time of year again like death and taxes, it's trade Tunsil time of year. Thing is once again this off-season Tunsil isn't getting traded. Obviously management views Tunsil differently than the bean counters around these parts.

I wish I could find last years post where I said the same exact thing. It would probably save time. Take faith knowing that someday y'all will be right.
Click to expand...

My view is totally different. See, I didn’t like the trade for Tunsil to begin with. O’Brien gave up way too much. The reality, the OL has remained as piss-poor as ever. Tunsil as it turned out was not the difference maker, just a simple arc blocker….that’s it. I believe he’s more respected for what he did negotiating his own contract versus what he does on the field.

This may explain why I don’t need a season to start talking about ways to get his arse off the Texans.

On a side note….no way you would ever consider trading Tunsil and replacing him with LT- Alaric Jackson? Not only is Jackson the more complete LT, he’s coming in with knowledge of the new OC’s system. I could think of worse moves.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
My view is totally different. See, I didn’t like the trade for Tunsil to begin with. O’Brien gave up way too much. The reality, the OL has remained as piss-poor as ever. Tunsil as it turned out was not the difference maker, just a simple arc blocker….that’s it. I believe he’s more respected for what he did negotiating his own contract versus what he does on the field.

This may explain why I don’t need a season to start talking about ways to get his arse off the Texans.

On a side note….no way you would ever consider trading Tunsil and replacing him with LT- Alaric Jackson? Not only is Jackson the more complete LT, he’s coming in with knowledge of the new OC’s system. I could think of worse moves.
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12.1 % pressure rate vs league avg 22%.

At least you're honest, you didn't like the trade to begin with. One player doesn't make an OL and an O lineman shouldn't be judged by how others on the OL perform. You cant say Tunsil doesn't play injured, he played 2 yrs ago on a knee that needed surgery and last yr on an ankle most guys wouldn't have played on. He still played at a high level despite these injuries. There's a reason Tunsil is considered one of the top 5-7 LT's in the NFL regardless of how posters on this MB view him. Why wouldn't a team just sign Alaric Jackson in FA rather than pay draft capital and have to pay Tunsil. After all isn't the main complaint that Tunsil is overpaid?

I would like a list of posters who dont like Tunsil for whatever reasons and a list of posters who didn't like the Tunsil trade to begin with.

I'll bet you those 2 lists matchup pretty well.
 
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I thought BOB gave up too much to get Tunsil and said so at the time, but it’s water under the bridge from a draft capital standpoint, so my current umbrage with Tunsil is unrealated to what we gave up to bring him here. That’s on OB who is no longer here…thank God.

Now it’s about his cap number vs. his play, intangibles, and leadership, or lack thereof.

To put it in simple terms, his play and what he brings in any intangibles is not even close to his salary number. If he made half of what he does…we’d be close to what I view as fair value.

No question, I’d trade him for whatever I could get. 100% that is what I would do. What are the odds the Texans agree and do so…less than 5%. Maybe closer to 1%. Im under no illusions this will happen. This is a message board so we we get to play amateur GM and share our own ideas. Differing ideas is what makes it fun.
 
Porky said:
I thought BOB gave up too much to get Tunsil and said so at the time, but it’s water under the bridge from a draft capital standpoint, so my current umbrage with Tunsil is unrealated to what we gave up to bring him here. That’s on OB who is no longer here…thank God.

Now it’s about his cap number vs. his play, intangibles, and leadership, or lack thereof.

To put it in simple terms, his play and what he brings in any intangibles is not even close to his salary number. If he made half of what he does…we’d be close to what I view as fair value.

No question, I’d trade him for whatever I could get. 100% that is what I would do. What are the odds the Texans agree and do so…less than 5%. Maybe closer to 1%. Im under no illusions this will happen. This is a message board so we we get to play amateur GM and share our own ideas. Differing ideas is what makes it fun.
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So we have 1 that didn't like the trade and would trade Tunsil.

I would say he's paid about right. Top 10 LT's get paid. As far as intangibles go, no amount of intangibles are going to make Green a better player, or Scruggs smarter. Although Howard is an avg player, did you notice how Tunsil's play picked up after Patterson started playing C and Howard started playing LG. Even playing on a bad ankle his play picked up, so I would say your intangibles eval is off base.

I'm hoping they draft Booker or Jackson to play LG and signing Becton or Fries in FA and then you'll see chemistry pickup. Do I think Caserio will do this, nope.
 
steelbtexan said:
12.1 % pressure rate vs league avg 22%.

At least you're honest, you didn't like the trade to begin with. One player doesn't make an OL and an O lineman shouldn't be judged by how others on the OL perform. You cant say Tunsil doesn't play injured, he played 2 yrs ago on a knee that needed surgery and last yr on an ankle most guys wouldn't have played on. He still played at a high level despite these injuries. There's a reason Tunsil is considered one of the top 5-7 LT's in the NFL regardless of how posters on this MB view him. Why wouldn't a team just sign Alaric Jackson in FA rather than pay draft capital and have to pay Tunsil. After all isn't the main complaint that Tunsil is overpaid?

I would like a list of posters who dont like Tunsil for whatever reasons and a list of posters who didn't like the Tunsil trade to begin with.

I'll bet you those 2 lists matchup pretty well.
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I believe the Texans could simply enter the bidding war for LT- Alaric Jackson’s services since he’s an UFA.

There’s a few teams hunting for a LT, since Tunsil is highly recognized by NFL teams, Texans should get multiple teams bidding on his services with a very palatable return in draft picks.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I believe the Texans could simply enter the bidding war for LT- Alaric Jackson’s services since he’s an UFA.

There’s a few teams hunting for a LT, since Tunsil is highly recognized by NFL teams, Texans should get multiple teams bidding on his services with a very palatable return in draft picks.
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Why wouldn't those teams bid for Jackson instead of bidding for Tunsil?
 
The 2019 off season was weird. In Jan 2019, RT Seantrel Henderson was signed to a 1 year extension even though he was coming off a broken ankle and before that suffered from Crohn's disease. Then in March 2019 we signed another often injured tackle, Matt Kalil. The draft comes around and we took 2 tackles, Howard and Sharping in the first 2 rounds. About 6 weeks later our GM was fired. Then 1 week before the start of the 2019 season, we send a 2020 1st, 2021 1st and 2nd and 2 players for Tunsil, Stills, a 2020 4th and a 2021 6th. I didn't like the bounty given up for Tunsil at the time but he was head and shoulders above what we had.
 
badboy said:
For the same reasons I have given you repeatedly. That's why I say you have Tunsil vision
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I wasn't asking you, I'm looking for OT's response

If a team likes both Jackson and Tunsil they should just sign Jackson and save the picks. Use those picks to fill other holes on their team. I'm not the one with Tunsil vision, I'm the one that's being realistic and not doing back flips trying to trade Tunsil like you do EVERY off-season.
 
KoolAid Sipper said:
The same reason why you would rather keep Tunsil vs signing Jackson and trading Tunsil. :littlelol:
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I'm good with signing Jackson and trading Tunsil depending on how much money they can save. Tunsil is the better player though.

If you were another team would you rather

Trade for Tunsil with his contract, say Chicago trading 1-10, and 2-39 plus a 4th. Versus signing Jackson and keeping the picks.

1. You trade for Tunsil and pay him 23 mil per year for the next 3 years and you have to extend him another 3 yrs. Plus you lose picks.

2. Say you pay Jackson 20 mil per yr over 5 yrs = 100 mil. Then draft

1-10 Banks, 2-39 Zabel, 4- 74 Edge Brayden Swinson LSU.

So if you're the Bears you either end up with Jackson/Banks/Zabel Swinson or you trade for Tunsil and just end up with Tunsil. If a GM made this trade for Tunsil they should be fired.
 
steelbtexan said:
I'm good with signing Jackson and trading Tunsil depending on how much money they can save. Tunsil is the better player though.

If you were another team would you rather

Trade for Tunsil with his contract, say Chicago trading 1-10, and 2-39 plus a 4th. Versus signing Jackson and keeping the picks.

1. You trade for Tunsil and pay him 23 mil per year for the next 3 years and you have to extend him another 3 yrs. Plus you lose picks.

2. Say you pay Jackson 20 mil per yr over 5 yrs = 100 mil. Then draft

1-10 Banks, 2-39 Zabel, 4- 74 Edge Brayden Swinson LSU.

So if you're the Bears you either end up with Jackson/Banks/Zabel Swinson or you trade for Tunsil and just end up with Tunsil. If a GM made this trade for Tunsil they should be fired.
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Oh I never said you are wrong and I highly doubt Tunsil is traded. But I also think Tunsil would go for less than a 1st, 2nd and a 4th unless OB channels his inner force to some team in the NFL. When we signed those two hospital bed FA tackles in 2019 and drafted 2 rookies, there were other options in FA: Daryl Williams and Trent Brown.
 
KoolAid Sipper said:
Oh I never said you are wrong and I highly doubt Tunsil is traded. But I also think Tunsil would go for less than a 1st, 2nd and a 4th unless OB channels his inner force to some team in the NFL. When we signed those two hospital bed FA tackles in 2019 and drafted 2 rookies, there were other options in FA: Daryl Williams and Trent Brown.
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All I was saying is if a team thinks Jackson is a better value/player than Tunsil they will just sign Jackson and keep their picks.
 
steelbtexan said:
I wasn't asking you, I'm looking for OT's response

If a team likes both Jackson and Tunsil they should just sign Jackson and save the picks. Use those picks to fill other holes on their team. I'm not the one with Tunsil vision, I'm the one that's being realistic and not doing back flips trying to trade Tunsil like you do EVERY off-season.
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And OT will probably respond. All of us including you frequently reply when someone asks direct question of someone else. You're just being silly. You have gone from absolutely no way trading Tunsil to being willing to take 10 , 39 and a round four. Again you asked if a team likes Tunsil and Jackson, why take Laremy and gives the picks. Again, if a team did value them equally they would not. The point I and others have repeated, is Tunsil is better than Jackson. Jackson brings you things that the Texans need that Laremy does not.

I and others will continue to voice ways to improve the Houston Texans. Laremy Tunsil is one of our few tradable assets that could bring a huge haul to improve our team.
If I did not value him or want him on the team, I would take an approach like @Porky .
 
badboy said:
And OT will probably respond. All of us including you frequently reply when someone asks direct question of someone else. You're just being silly. You have gone from absolutely no way trading Tunsil to being willing to take 10 , 39 and a round four. Again you asked if a team likes Tunsil and Jackson, why take Laremy and gives the picks. Again, if a team did value them equally they would not. The point I and others have repeated, is Tunsil is better than Jackson. Jackson brings you things that the Texans need that Laremy does not.

I and others will continue to voice ways to improve the Houston Texans. Laremy Tunsil is one of our few tradable assets that could bring a huge haul to improve our team.
If I did not value him or want him on the team, I would take an approach like @Porky .
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Like I said, if I'm another team and I value Jackson like you do, then I sign Jackson and use the picks to fill in other holes on the team.
 
steelbtexan said:
Like I said, if I'm another team and I value Jackson like you do, then I sign Jackson and use the picks to fill in other holes on the team.
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But obviously they do not value Jackson as I do as I have not seen nor presented any evidence that the Bears or Cleveland prefer him over Tunsil. There are numerous suggestions that they are interested in Trey Smith so if they were interested in Jackson, we would probably see that also.

It was not that long ago on this board that many did not think we would get more than two round ones for a guy named Watson.
 
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