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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
It's still a free game.
Look at how persistent steelb was at criticizing Rick Smith. :)
Not after RS 1st yr.

After 3 or so yrs of terrible drafting you could tell RS wasn't the guy to bring a championship to Kirby.

You've already made your determination on Caserio even though he didn't have high picks to work with and a bunch of trash to take out.

I guess you are much more clairvoyant than I am. Dammit give me those lotto numbers now, I need them for tonight. Stop screwing with me and give them up. I'm ready to retire on my own private island.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
Not after RS 1st yr.

After 3 or so yrs of terrible drafting you could tell RS wasn't the guy to bring a championship to Kirby.

You've already made your determination on Caserio even though he didn't have high picks to work with and a bunch of trash to take out.

I guess you are much more clairvoyant than I am. Dammit give me those lotto numbers now, I need them for tonight. Stop screwing with me and give them up. I'm ready to retire on my own private island.
“After 3 or so years of terrible drafting.”

Most important part. After that time period they are who they are.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Not after RS 1st yr.

After 3 or so yrs of terrible drafting you could tell RS wasn't the guy to bring a championship to Kirby.

You've already made your determination on Caserio even though he didn't have high picks to work with and a bunch of trash to take out.

I guess you are much more clairvoyant than I am. Dammit give me those lotto numbers now, I need them for tonight. Stop screwing with me and give them up. I'm ready to retire on my own private island.
Why do you keep insist that I have made the conclusion on Nick Caserio?

I document his moves. I said I like a few, but not so much others.
But I still said, I'll wait to see how they turn out.
When they do, I put it in my notes.
I think that's how it's supposed to be, and not jumping to a conclusion, right?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Why do you keep insist that I have made the conclusion on Nick Caserio?

I document his moves. I said I like a few, but not so much others.
But I still said, I'll wait to see how they turn out.
When they do, I put it in my notes.
I think that's how it's supposed to be, and not jumping to a conclusion, right?
I'm still waiting on those lotto numbers

5 mins to go.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
30 years ago I was starting my senior season of basketball in college. I worked in the NBA for a few years. Using this board's logic, I'm basically Daryl Morey. I should probably go find a Rockets message board and enlighten all of them.
I waited tables once, had my own successful business selling kitchen knives with multiple people under me, and have a business administration degree. When I go tell Tillman how he should be running Laundry’s, I will pass your name to him about the Rockets. But you may be over qualified.
 

sandman

Brexit Advisor
I waited tables once, had my own successful business selling kitchen knives with multiple people under me, and have a business administration degree. When I go tell Tillman how he should be running Laundry’s, I will pass your name to him about the Rockets. But you may be over qualified.
Thanks. Make sure he knows I have spreadsheets. That's the deal maker right there.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
I think Caserio had to have a Plan A and Plan B when he arrived.

Plan A:
In the event Watson returned, Caserio had to have a team that could compete and within reason of the 2021 cap restraints.

Plan B:
Have a backup plan that kicks the rebuild into gear should Watson stay away from the team and Taylor turns out not to be the answer. Unfortunately, Taylor’s injury may have kicked this rebuild into the he now b/c the losses moved this team too far away from competing for the AFCS crown. Caserio could very well be running the scorched earth part of the plan in an effort to ensure the team has the right pick location to start the rebuild. I believe Caserio will try to make good deals before the deadline and focus on moving the remaining big contract players in the 2022 off-season. That band-aid some wanted to yank off this season will probably need to wait until 2022. One thing is for certain…..potential playoff teams are beginning to get hit with the injury bug and the Texans are in a position to be sellers.
My question is why he didn't force Watson hand and get into his money if he refused to play?
 

OptimisticTexan

2021 Building Block 1 / Go Texans
My question is why he didn't force Watson hand and get into his money if he refused to play?
…..as CnD has mentioned, it would be well within his rights to feign injury then ride it out for as long as he continued to say the injury prevents him from doing his job. Texans would have to pay his 2021 salary.

The nastiest of parts for this situation is what lies over the horizon of the 2021 season……Watson’s 2022 guaranteed payday of 35M dollars. This will be a big ugly and very expensive pill to swallow if the Texans don’t find a team who will take on Watson and his situation. It may not be the most desirable deal but a deal nonetheless.
 

Speedy

Former Yeller Dweller
The nastiest of parts for this situation is what lies over the horizon of the 2021 season……Watson’s 2022 guaranteed payday of 35M dollars. This will be a big ugly and very expensive pill to swallow if the Texans don’t find a team who will take on Watson and his situation.
That just might put the Texans at a disadvantage. Teams knowing they need to get rid of him or pay him $35M not to play. Don’t want to accept our deal, then keep him and pay him $2M per game to sit instead of the $600k they’re doing now.

I'm wondering if it might actually be better to deal him now.

Either way, I don’t think the Texans get what they’re wanting.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
30 years ago I was starting my senior season of basketball in college. I worked in the NBA for a few years. Using this board's logic, I'm basically Daryl Morey. I should probably go find a Rockets message board and enlighten all of them.
it’s laughable b/c that dude is/was dead serious when he wrote that post lol.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
My question is why he didn't force Watson hand and get into his money if he refused to play?
Not a good look for several reasons. The franchise already has a bad rep around the league for how they've operated....at least over the last year or so but also b/c how they've handled their star players in the past too.

The best move was how NC handled it. Fans & media don't wanna hear that, but the reality is, it was the best move. They are the reason people watch games, they are the talent and you have to cater to these guys on some level. Strong-arming a player into doing things b/c you can is why there's bad blood between the players and owners/FO as it is. Bottom line is you catch more bees with honey than vinegar. How he handles DW4 isn't just about DW4, other players....more importantly other future FA's, see that too.
 

Hardcore Texan

Magnet Man
The way DJ31 turned down that block in pass pro, fumbled once, almost fumbled again, he should be next. He's playing because we're to assume the rookie can't pass pro. Well, the vet can't either.
No doubt.
I can't believe they put him back out there after the first screw up. He looked like he totally gave up on a few plays. He needs to be gone.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Not a good look for several reasons. The franchise already has a bad rep around the league for how they've operated....at least over the last year or so but also b/c how they've handled their star players in the past too.

The best move was how NC handled it. Fans & media don't wanna hear that, but the reality is, it was the best move. They are the reason people watch games, they are the talent and you have to cater to these guys on some level. Strong-arming a player into doing things b/c you can is why there's bad blood between the players and owners/FO as it is. Bottom line is you catch more bees with honey than vinegar. How he handles DW4 isn't just about DW4, other players....more importantly other future FA's, see that too.
Nobody noteworthy is coming to play for this organization regardless of how they handled the Watson situation. Get that pipe dream out of your head. The handling of Hopkins, Watson wanting out, JJ wanting out, and Esterbunny hanging around on the sidelines give players pause. Think about the best Texans ever and how they left the building. If they played hardball with Watson, which my stand, either he's going to play or the team getting into his money. If its a fake injury, they could've put him through stress test so rigorous that he would wish he was injured.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Not a good look for several reasons. The franchise already has a bad rep around the league for how they've operated....at least over the last year or so but also b/c how they've handled their star players in the past too.

The best move was how NC handled it. Fans & media don't wanna hear that, but the reality is, it was the best move. They are the reason people watch games, they are the talent and you have to cater to these guys on some level. Strong-arming a player into doing things b/c you can is why there's bad blood between the players and owners/FO as it is. Bottom line is you catch more bees with honey than vinegar. How he handles DW4 isn't just about DW4, other players....more importantly other future FA's, see that too.
Disagree just like I disagree how he handles the roster with the old Patriots and guys looking for their next payday playing undisciplined football
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Nobody noteworthy is coming to play for this organization regardless of how they handled the Watson situation. Get that pipe dream out of your head. The handling of Hopkins, Watson wanting out, JJ wanting out, and Esterbunny hanging around on the sidelines give players pause. Think about the best Texans ever and how they left the building. If they played hardball with Watson, which my stand, either he's going to play or the team getting into his money. If its a fake injury, they could've put him through stress test so rigorous that he would wish he was injured.
Yeah, that was under a different regime & we were told the same thing when all that crap hit the Browns a few years ago. Fact is You can't play hardball with players like that these days let alone a player of DW4's caliber. Furthermore, the ends don't justify the means in your scenario. There'd be far more damage done than what you would gain in whatever it is you think they'd gain. All you'd be doing is fanning the flames of what you claim the organization is already in enbroiled in.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Disagree just like I disagree how he handles the roster with the old Patriots and guys looking for their next payday playing undisciplined football
what exactly did you expect was gonna happen when he got here? That he'd build a contender in 1 offseason? That he'd be able to draft 6789687 pro bowlers with no 1st round pick in his 1st draft? That he was going to be able to lure all-pro's here in FA? If you did then you weren't being realistic. The shitshow he inherited wasn't going to be able to be cleaned up in 1 offseason even if he'd done everything exactly as how you and others nitpick and advocate he should've done. Everyone knew that & im sure he knows that. Doesn't mean he couldn't field a product that was at least competitive.
 

Texian

Hall of Fame
30 years ago I was starting my senior season of basketball in college. I worked in the NBA for a few years. Using this board's logic, I'm basically Daryl Morey. I should probably go find a Rockets message board and enlighten all of them.
Nah don't bother, if you were a senior and playing basketball then you weren't very good. Save the world from your Daryl Morey wanna be.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Yeah, that was under a different regime & we were told the same thing when all that crap hit the Browns a few years ago. Fact is You can't play hardball with players like that these days let alone a player of DW4's caliber. Furthermore, the ends don't justify the means in your scenario. There'd be far more damage done than what you would gain in whatever it is you think they'd gain. All you'd be doing is fanning the flames of what you claim the organization is already in enbroiled in.
Not true, the damage is already done. The damage was done when the owner gave control of the organization to the character coach which is unheard of. More damage was done when you, the gm didn't give real interviews to respected coaches like EB, Salah, Eberfluse, or even Staley. Instead, you hired fall guy puppets. A coach who didn't even pick his own staff. The severe damage is having a top 5 qb do some bs practice routine but don't play and then send the puppet out in front of the cameras and talk about the best opportunity to win with Taylor, Driskell, and Mills.
The Browns did it right for once, they hired a top shelf talent evaluator in John Dorsey who has a track record of finding top talent in any round. Go look at him in green bay, Philly, KC, and Cleveland. In the last 10 years with Caserio in whatever role he had, 0 pro bowlers drafted. Notice I didn't say all pro, I said probowlers.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
what exactly did you expect was gonna happen when he got here? That he'd build a contender in 1 offseason? That he'd be able to draft 6789687 pro bowlers with no 1st round pick in his 1st draft? That he was going to be able to lure all-pro's here in FA? If you did then you weren't being realistic. The shitshow he inherited wasn't going to be able to be cleaned up in 1 offseason even if he'd done everything exactly as how you and others nitpick and advocate he should've done. Everyone knew that & im sure he knows that. Doesn't mean he couldn't field a product that was at least competitive.
If the fans know the team is in a rebuild, most are ok with that. When you as the gm decide its a rebuild, you take the lumps in your honeymoon period. You dump every big contract of every player not performing and over 30 yrs old. You then sign and draft young players, young flameouts, and gain experience and losses . At the end of the year, you see who is worth keeping and resigning and you lay the foundation. Johnson, Whitney, Murray should've all been cut. I'm not tripping about keeping Cooks and Tunsil because they at least play to their contract mostly. I'm not tripping about KGH or KPL, but somewhere Wallow needs to play. Blacklock, Greenard, Lopez, and Ominehu should be getting the bulk of the snaps. Ingram is cool, but Phillips should be splitting carries getting experience. Howard should've stayed at RT and Sharpring should've stayed at lg. Amendola, Cannon,and Burkhead makes 0 sense on this roster. If you trade for Miller, why Amendola? Who keeps 5 rbs on the roster?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Not true, the damage is already done. The damage was done when the owner gave control of the organization to the character coach which is unheard of. More damage was done when you, the gm didn't give real interviews to respected coaches like EB, Salah, Eberfluse, or even Staley. Instead, you hired fall guy puppets. A coach who didn't even pick his own staff. The severe damage is having a top 5 qb do some bs practice routine but don't play and then send the puppet out in front of the cameras and talk about the best opportunity to win with Taylor, Driskell, and Mills.
The Browns did it right for once, they hired a top shelf talent evaluator in John Dorsey who has a track record of finding top talent in any round. Go look at him in green bay, Philly, KC, and Cleveland. In the last 10 years with Caserio in whatever role he had, 0 pro bowlers drafted. Notice I didn't say all pro, I said probowlers.
Lol, you're mostly going off of trivial subjective crap that really has no bearing on how anything can or will play out. Kubes hired his own staff. BoB hired his own staff. How'd that work out for us? Furthermore, i'm not sure what you're talking about with "real" interviews. Leslie Frazier was interviewed. So was Matt Eberflus, both before David Culley. EB was after but yes i will admit it was a token interview for the most part.

& the severe damage the top 5 qb did to himself. They could've just barred his ass from coming to to the practice facility and buried his ass......& then had the "puppet" shut down any talk about him. How do you think that would've played?

The Browns did it right for once, they hired a top shelf talent evaluator in John Dorsey who has a track record of finding top talent in any round. Go look at him in green bay, Philly, KC, and Cleveland. In the last 10 years with Caserio in whatever role he had, 0 pro bowlers drafted. Notice I didn't say all pro, I said probowlers.
The key phrase here "for once". Furthermore, if Dorsey was so great at his job, he'd still be doing those jobs. I've looked at Dorsey's track record & he truthfully wasn't much better if at all better than Rick Smith who was roasted around these parts for his failures in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
If the fans know the team is in a rebuild, most are ok with that. When you as the gm decide its a rebuild, you take the lumps in your honeymoon period. You dump every big contract of every player not performing and over 30 yrs old. You then sign and draft young players, young flameouts, and gain experience and losses . At the end of the year, you see who is worth keeping and resigning and you lay the foundation. Johnson, Whitney, Murray should've all been cut. I'm not tripping about keeping Cooks and Tunsil because they at least play to their contract mostly. I'm not tripping about KGH or KPL, but somewhere Wallow needs to play. Blacklock, Greenard, Lopez, and Ominehu should be getting the bulk of the snaps. Ingram is cool, but Phillips should be splitting carries getting experience. Howard should've stayed at RT and Sharpring should've stayed at lg. Amendola, Cannon,and Burkhead makes 0 sense on this roster. If you trade for Miller, why Amendola? Who keeps 5 rbs on the roster?
Listen to what you're saying dude. Just about everything you're advocating in this post was actually done & or is still in line to be done or can be. You're literally bitching about a few small moves here and there that didn't go how you thought they should. Greenard & Lopez are getting plenty of snaps...Blacklock would likely be getting the same but hes been hurt. Ominehu ain't getting snaps but if im not mistaken he's been in the coaches doghouse. Phillips is everyone's favorite rb b/c he's the back up...the whole back up qb syndrome thingy.

Cannon and Burkhead are vets..they make sense in that regard & Amendola got here after Miller got hurt. If Miller's healthy, Amendola's likely not even here.

You overestimate what you think fans want b/c its what YOU want & how you think things should've gone. Again, most already knew this was a rebuild. Didn't need NC or Culley to say that. Fact is nothing he has done to date has stymied or prevented this team from being able to build a solid foundation into a contender in the coming years.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Lol, you're mostly going off of trivial subjective crap that really has no bearing on how anything can or will play out. Kubes hired his own staff. BoB hired his own staff. How'd that work out for us? Furthermore, i'm not sure what you're talking about with "real" interviews. Leslie Frazier was interviewed. So was Matt Eberflus, both before David Culley. EB was after but yes i will admit it was a token interview for the most part.

& the severe damage the top 5 qb did to himself. They could've just barred his ass from coming to to the practice facility and buried his ass......& then had the "puppet" shut down any talk about him. How do you think that would've played?



The key phrase here "for once". Furthermore, if Dorsey was so great at his job, he'd still be doing those jobs. I've looked at Dorsey's track record & he truthfully wasn't much better if at all better than Rick Smith who was roasted around these parts for his failures in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
Oh Really? Where did Kelce, Kareem Hunt, Tyreke come from?
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Listen to what you're saying dude. Just about everything you're advocating in this post was actually done & or is still in line to be done or can be. You're literally bitching about a few small moves here and there that didn't go how you thought they should. Greenard & Lopez are getting plenty of snaps...Blacklock would likely be getting the same but hes been hurt. Ominehu ain't getting snaps but if im not mistaken he's been in the coaches doghouse. Phillips is everyone's favorite rb b/c he's the back up...the whole back up qb syndrome thingy.

Cannon and Burkhead are vets..they make sense in that regard & Amendola got here after Miller got hurt. If Miller's healthy, Amendola's likely not even here.

You overestimate what you think fans want b/c its what YOU want & how you think things should've gone. Again, most already knew this was a rebuild. Didn't need NC or Culley to say that. Fact is nothing he has done to date has stymied or prevented this team from being able to build a solid foundation into a contender in the coming years.
Cannon nor Burkehead ever made sense.
 

sandman

Brexit Advisor
The Browns did it right for once, they hired a top shelf talent evaluator in John Dorsey who has a track record of finding top talent in any round. Go look at him in green bay, Philly, KC, and Cleveland. In the last 10 years with Caserio in whatever role he had, 0 pro bowlers drafted. Notice I didn't say all pro, I said probowlers.
Meant to come back to this one. Caserio was in role since 2004, but if we are looking at the last 10 years (starting with 2019 draft since the 2020 draft only had two rookies that made the Pro Bowl) there were six draft picks that were selected to 12 Pro Bowls:

2019 - Bailey - 1 x First Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl (one of nine in draft that made Pro Bowl)
2013 - Collins - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl
2012 - Jones - 1 x Pro Bowl (not counting any awards as a Cardinal)
2012 - Hightower - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - McCourty - PFF All Decade Team, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - Gronk - NFL All Decade Team, NFL 100th Anniversary Team, 4 x First Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Then there were these that were also drafted during his tenure that made it to Pro Bowls:
2008 - Mayo - DROY, 1 x First Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2008 - Slater - 5 x First Team All Pro, 2 x Second Team All Pro and 9 x Pro Bowl
2007 - Merriweather - 2 x Pro Bowl
2006 - Gostkowski - NFL All Decade Team, 2 x First Team All Pro, 1 x Second Team All Pro and 4 x Pro Bowl
2005 - Mankins - NFL All Decade Team, 1 x First Team All Pro, 5 x Second Team All Pro and 6 x Pro Bowl
2004 - Wilfork - 1 x First Team All Pro, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Granted, not much has happened in the five-year stretch from 2014-18, but from 2004 through 2013 there were 11 players with a total of 40 Pro Bowl selections, 15 First Team All Pro, 16 Second Team All Pro, a DPOY, a few All Decade Teams and at least one HoF career that all happened on Caserio's watch. And that doesn't even count Cassel who got his Pro Bowl with the Chiefs or any of Jones' awards while with the Cardinals.

So if we are going to hold him accountable for what happened on his watch in 2014-18, then we give him credit for what happened on his watch in 2004-13.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
Meant to come back to this one. Caserio was in role since 2004, but if we are looking at the last 10 years (starting with 2019 draft since the 2020 draft only had two rookies that made the Pro Bowl) there were six draft picks that were selected to 12 Pro Bowls:

2019 - Bailey - 1 x First Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl (one of nine in draft that made Pro Bowl)
2013 - Collins - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl
2012 - Jones - 1 x Pro Bowl (not counting any awards as a Cardinal)
2012 - Hightower - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - McCourty - PFF All Decade Team, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - Gronk - NFL All Decade Team, NFL 100th Anniversary Team, 4 x First Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Then there were these that were also drafted during his tenure that made it to Pro Bowls:
2008 - Mayo - DROY, 1 x First Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2008 - Slater - 5 x First Team All Pro, 2 x Second Team All Pro and 9 x Pro Bowl
2007 - Merriweather - 2 x Pro Bowl
2006 - Gostkowski - NFL All Decade Team, 2 x First Team All Pro, 1 x Second Team All Pro and 4 x Pro Bowl
2005 - Mankins - NFL All Decade Team, 1 x First Team All Pro, 5 x Second Team All Pro and 6 x Pro Bowl
2004 - Wilfork - 1 x First Team All Pro, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Granted, not much has happened in the five-year stretch from 2014-18, but from 2004 through 2013 there were 11 players with a total of 40 Pro Bowl selections, 15 First Team All Pro, 16 Second Team All Pro, a DPOY, a few All Decade Teams and at least one HoF career that all happened on Caserio's watch. And that doesn't even count Cassel who got his Pro Bowl with the Chiefs or any of Jones' awards while with the Cardinals.

So if we are going to hold him accountable for what happened on his watch in 2014-18, then we give him credit for what happened on his watch in 2004-13.
During 2014-2018 the Patriots lost a first rounder and 4th due to deflate gate in 2016. Didn’t have a 3rd or 4th in 2018. Didn’t have a 1st, 2nd or 3rd in 2017. I am too lazy to look at any others.

Definitely more to the story about draft picks during 2014-2018.

But some people don’t want to look beyond the surface.
 

Earl34

All Pro
Meant to come back to this one. Caserio was in role since 2004, but if we are looking at the last 10 years (starting with 2019 draft since the 2020 draft only had two rookies that made the Pro Bowl) there were six draft picks that were selected to 12 Pro Bowls:

2019 - Bailey - 1 x First Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl (one of nine in draft that made Pro Bowl)
2013 - Collins - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 1 x Pro Bowl
2012 - Jones - 1 x Pro Bowl (not counting any awards as a Cardinal)
2012 - Hightower - 1 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - McCourty - PFF All Decade Team, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2010 - Gronk - NFL All Decade Team, NFL 100th Anniversary Team, 4 x First Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Then there were these that were also drafted during his tenure that made it to Pro Bowls:
2008 - Mayo - DROY, 1 x First Team All Pro and 2 x Pro Bowl
2008 - Slater - 5 x First Team All Pro, 2 x Second Team All Pro and 9 x Pro Bowl
2007 - Merriweather - 2 x Pro Bowl
2006 - Gostkowski - NFL All Decade Team, 2 x First Team All Pro, 1 x Second Team All Pro and 4 x Pro Bowl
2005 - Mankins - NFL All Decade Team, 1 x First Team All Pro, 5 x Second Team All Pro and 6 x Pro Bowl
2004 - Wilfork - 1 x First Team All Pro, 3 x Second Team All Pro and 5 x Pro Bowl

Granted, not much has happened in the five-year stretch from 2014-18, but from 2004 through 2013 there were 11 players with a total of 40 Pro Bowl selections, 15 First Team All Pro, 16 Second Team All Pro, a DPOY, a few All Decade Teams and at least one HoF career that all happened on Caserio's watch. And that doesn't even count Cassel who got his Pro Bowl with the Chiefs or any of Jones' awards while with the Cardinals.

So if we are going to hold him accountable for what happened on his watch in 2014-18, then we give him credit for what happened on his watch in 2004-13.
Wait a minute. Starting in 2004, Caserio was Director of Pro Personnel and Scott Pioli was Director/VP of Player Personnel. It appears when Pioli took the GM position with the Chiefs in 2009, Caserio replaced him.

Based on Pioli winning Executive of the Year in 2003 and 2007 and Caserio being Director of PRO personnel during that period, I think you might be giving Caserio credit for Pioli's drafts between 2004 and 2008. I might be mistaken, but I doubt Caserio went from a graduate assistant at Central Michigan in 2001 to a Patriots offensive coaching assistant in 2002 to a GM drafting Pro Bowlers in 2004.
 
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sandman

Brexit Advisor
Wait a minute. Starting in 2004, Caserio was Director of Pro Personnel and Scott Pioli was Director/VP of Player Personnel. It appears when Pioli took the GM position with the Chiefs in 2009, Caserio replaced him.

Based on Pioli winning Executive of the Year in 2003 and 2007 and Caserio being Director of PRO personnel during that period, I think you might be giving Caserio credit for Pioli's drafts between 2004 and 2008. I might be mistaken, but I doubt Caserio went from a graduate assistant at Central Michigan in 2001 to a Patriots offensive coaching assistant in 2002 to a GM drafting Pro Bowlers in 2004.
Yes, he was the Director of Pro Personnel 2004 before becoming the Director of Player Personnel in 2008. The original post that I responded to stated that regardless of Caserio's role in the Patriots org, there were no Pro Bowlers in the last 10 years which seemed an arbitrary time frame considering he had been the Director of Player Personnel for 13 years. I was simply showing the 10 year timeframe of the original argument, back to 2008 when he assumed Pioli's role and finally back to 2004 because he was directly working for Pioli at that point, albeit on the pro side.
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
Lol, you're mostly going off of trivial subjective crap that really has no bearing on how anything can or will play out. Kubes hired his own staff. BoB hired his own staff. How'd that work out for us? Furthermore, i'm not sure what you're talking about with "real" interviews. Leslie Frazier was interviewed. So was Matt Eberflus, both before David Culley. EB was after but yes i will admit it was a token interview for the most part.

& the severe damage the top 5 qb did to himself. They could've just barred his ass from coming to to the practice facility and buried his ass......& then had the "puppet" shut down any talk about him. How do you think that would've played?



The key phrase here "for once". Furthermore, if Dorsey was so great at his job, he'd still be doing those jobs. I've looked at Dorsey's track record & he truthfully wasn't much better if at all better than Rick Smith who was roasted around these parts for his failures in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.
yeah, and thought I would Never Ever say this, I miss Rick Smith. Not because of being any genius GM or anything but at least you could trust the man to take care of McNairs.

I can’t stand the Patriots or the Patriot way. I’m sure Rick had some lengthy discussions with Bob & Cal about bringing in Penn State Head Coach and former Patriot QB/OC coach just like they had about bringing in Kubiak. They didn’t want to repeat of Capers or thought Wade Phillips style not direction to go. In fact they may have been so damaged by the “Carr Affect” they vowed never to let that happen again.

It’s all BS and conjecture, we’re biting each other heads off, bickering about how this organization has been mishandled including our greatest assets, but instead of coming together with a common consensus, we need better football people in charge, we will continue to unravel, be irrelevant, until the right culture enters the building. Who that is, when, have no idea? Just know it’s not where it needs to be yet.

Fire Easterby Cal, that should be your first step.
 

FuzzyLogic

Mathematically Possible
If I knew all it took to be successful at something was to have been the HS QB, have/had a successful career, in a completely unrelated field, and watch someone else do it!... I think I'm ready...

I have watched every episode of House multiple times, I even own the series on BluRay and at 14 I removed every piece from Opearation and never touched the side, not once, no alarms. I got a buck knife, tweezers, rubbing alcohol and, and some q-tips any of you guys need anything removed, replaced, brain surgery, etc. just PM me. Half price what hospitals charge. Finally going to live my truth.

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Mangler

All Pro
yeah, and thought I would Never Ever say this, I miss Rick Smith. Not because of being any genius GM or anything but at least you could trust the man to take care of McNairs.

I can’t stand the Patriots or the Patriot way. I’m sure Rick had some lengthy discussions with Bob & Cal about bringing in Penn State Head Coach and former Patriot QB/OC coach just like they had about bringing in Kubiak. They didn’t want to repeat of Capers or thought Wade Phillips style not direction to go. In fact they may have been so damaged by the “Carr Affect” they vowed never to let that happen again.

It’s all BS and conjecture, we’re biting each other heads off, bickering about how this organization has been mishandled including our greatest assets, but instead of coming together with a common consensus, we need better football people in charge, we will continue to unravel, be irrelevant, until the right culture enters the building. Who that is, when, have no idea? Just know it’s not where it needs to be yet.

Fire Easterby Cal, that should be your first step.
Fire Easterby is your solution?
:toropalm:
 
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