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Marcellus Rivers

But, I always try to give the other guys the benefit of the doubt.

I totally agree with you though, Miller is consistent at not getting open. And I think its part of his lack of knowledge of holes in a defense of where to find the open spaces as well as his losing a step.
 
here is a quote from that cleveland message board...


The Texans are starting to TICK me off.

You read my mind.

Who havn't they signed this offseason. All I'm saying is they better stay away from Boulware or I may have to do what I allways swore I would never do again ...go to texas
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Its funny cause from our point of view we havn't signed anyone. who else did we steal from these cleveland fans, other than Rivers, Riley and Greenwood i'm having a tough time finding another free agent we signed. its funny how perception changes from team to team
 
Guys, I'm sorry, but I think it's kind of sad that everyone is taking Rivers, and making him sound like the savior of our tight end problems. He was another teams backup, he will probably wind up being our backup. He might be better than what we already have, but he probably won't, that's just the facts of life. I just hate to see everyone get all excited about someone comming in from another team, that wasn't great, and be expected by everyone else to be something great. Everyone is going to talk bad about him and talk bad about the Texans staff if he isn't, and they're saying up front that the guy isn't anything special. Just like with Bruener, nobody ever said that he was going to be all pro, he's a blocking tight end, that's all he's ever been, and he's really good at it, good enough that he's made a good career for himself at it. Taking a guy like Rivers, who in my openion, from what the I'm hearing from the articles, is ok at blocking, and ok at catching, doesn't make him a total package, it makes him an ok tight end. I've also heard on this board that all Antonio Gates, and Tony Gonzales are any good for is catching passes, I'm sorry guys but running backs don't rush for 1,700 yards with a tight end that can't block up on the line. Yes a great tight end can put an average offense into a whole new dimension, but it's not a requirement. The Stealers made some really good playoff runs, with the exact same tight end we have right now, playing the exact same role that he's playing right now. You don't have to have a pass catching tight end to beat the cover 2, you run at it, if they're in cover 2 their safeties aren't in the box, we ran poorly against the colts the first time we played them. The second time we played them the penalties killed us, any time you play the colts it's going to come down to running the ball, and not making mental mistakes, that's how new england kills them every time they face them. You have got to run the ball on the cover 2, and force them to bring the strong safety into the box, and then pass on them. If you have penalties, they don't have to worry with your running game, and if you're not running well, they don't have to worry with it. With the way we played against the cover 2 last year, we could have had Tony Gonzales on our team, and it wouldn't have done one bit of good. If you aren't good enough to run on them, you simply will loose the game, no way around it.
 
The fact still remains that he's more of a complete TE than the other two.

FACT 1 - Rivers blocks better than Miller

FACT 2 - Rivers catches and gets open more often than Bruener

Conclusion - He's a more complete TE than those two, whether he's an OK tight end or not...........he's still going to bring a slight level of guessing to the defense when he steps on the field. Since right now when we bring in Miller they know its probably pass, and when we bring in Bruener they know its probably run.

I don't know about you, but, I like it when the defense doesn't know when we're going to run or pass.
 
throwANDREtheBALL said:
The fact still remains that he's more of a complete TE than the other two.

FACT 1 - Rivers blocks better than Miller

FACT 2 - Rivers catches and gets open more often than Bruener

Conclusion - He's a more complete TE than those two, whether he's an OK tight end or not...........he's still going to bring a slight level of guessing to the defense when he steps on the field. Since right now when we bring in Miller they know its probably pass, and when we bring in Bruener they know its probably run.

I don't know about you, but, I like it when the defense doesn't know when we're going to run or pass.
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That pretty much sum'd it up
 
obviously Rivers isn't considered that great of a TE prospect since he has been on the market until now and most of us that weren't madden junkies couldn't really say who he was before that.

that being said it goes to show how weak our TE ranks really are.
 
throwANDREtheBALL said:
The fact still remains that he's more of a complete TE than the other two.

FACT 1 - Rivers blocks better than Miller

FACT 2 - Rivers catches and gets open more often than Bruener

Conclusion - He's a more complete TE than those two, whether he's an OK tight end or not...........he's still going to bring a slight level of guessing to the defense when he steps on the field. Since right now when we bring in Miller they know its probably pass, and when we bring in Bruener they know its probably run.

I don't know about you, but, I like it when the defense doesn't know when we're going to run or pass.
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No, the fact is that he may not block as well as Miller, and he may not catch as well as Bruener. The fact is that he's a career backup so for, and has a LOT to prove before you should put any hopes or dreams into him at all. You will also be one of the first ones to down him and the coaching staff for picking him up when he flops. Just because a guys ok on John Maden football doesn't mean the same is true in real life. Tight ends don't come around easily like running backs, the Texans won't get a good one untill they draft one, or develope a good athelete into one. If Rivers was worth having as young for a TE as he is, the Giants would've kept him, Shockey or no Shockey. This whole take someone elses 2'nd or 3'rd string football player and try to make him into our hero mentality has to stop, it's just silly.
 
Texan Dave said:
This whole take someone elses 2'nd or 3'rd string football player and try to make him into our hero mentality has to stop, it's just silly.
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I think this is part of us having to go through the expansion years where we had to make something out of nothing. It will be over soon.
 
El Tejano said:
I think this is part of us having to go through the expansion years where we had to make something out of nothing. It will be over soon.
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This is true, I guess everyone is going to have to learn to set the bar higher than that. This is year 4, their is no more expansion team, win or lose, expansion is no longer an excuse.
 
What are the chances that Matt Murphy will be a viable option? I do not know too much about him other than what I have read on the Texans website bio on him....tough, physical 6'5'' 260. I also saw that he had 5 receptions in the Orange Bowl so he must have pretty good hands. Could be a nice story and I could win the lottery.

As far as Marcellus Rivers is concerned, his bio is definitley lacking to say the least; and it is not like he has not had an ample opportunity given the multiple injuries to Shockey last year and also the pre-Shock years. Rivers will surely disappoint if you expect greatness and will not be much (if any) improvement over Bruener and Miller; at least based on his past 5 years of production with the Giants. The fact that Rivers is a good special teams player and he can provide needed depth at a reasonable price is likely the reason behind his signing. Certainly not that Marcellus Rivers was going to be a breakout tight-end this season, ala Antonio Gates last year, but a good signing none-the-less as it helps provide experienced depth. After all, he must have been doing something right if NY kept him for 5-years.
 
I don't think anyone is saying that Rivers is going to be a stud (I'm certainly not): the disagreement really seems to centre on just how inadequate you feel Bruener and Miller are.
 
Mr Shush said:
I don't think anyone is saying that Rivers is going to be a stud (I'm certainly not): the disagreement really seems to centre on just how inadequate you feel Bruener and Miller are.
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Yeah, I can understand that, I'm not defending them in any way. I'm just saying not to expect this guy to be any better at all, because he'll probably be worse, as impossible as it seems to be. The one thing everyone has to remember is that Bruener isn't a terrible tight end, he's just not a recieving tight end. Miller on the other hand, he's pretty terrible. Just remember that their's teams all over the NFL that are beating the cover 2 with their running game, not their tight end, the running game is the more sound way to beat the cover 2, and Bruener is perfect for that. I also read today that they've been working Wells at fullback, a fullback that can catch as good as Wells out of the backfeild will relieve the need for a pass catching tight end. Wells has the speed to make a diference at fullback, plus it will give you 2 guys who are proven to be capable of running a hundred yards in a game in the backfeild at the same time. Not saying that we'll be running the fullback trap or anything, but they just know that the ball can be put into his hands and he can hurt them with it.
 
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