bah007
Hall of Fame
Haha touché.
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Manning released
- Thread starter mussop
- Start date
Haha touché.
JCTexan
Hall of Fame
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
I too hope our rebuild, or should I say "new do", will be competitive and entertaining.
HOU-TEX
Ah, Football!
Couldn't be worse than last year....
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Manning is scheduled to also meet with the Chiefs on Thursday.....maybe one comes (Kendricks) in the door while one goes out the door (Manning).
imatexan
All Pro
I can understand that but where is this money going then because it certainly isn't going to pay other FA's because all of our signings so far have not been pricey in any way.
I'm just saying this year so far we continue to downgrade at every position. That doesn't mean we are not getting younger and paying less but Clemens is a downgrade over Manning for this year.
It is only a subject because the owner of the team specifically stated that it's not a rebuild.
Without that statement, most of us would think rebuild is obvious and not mention it.
Perhaps you should take up your point with the owner of the team.
My thoughts, as well.
Not my thoughts at all. In my mind, if I consider a team in rebuild mode, I'm more patient with the process. Rebuilding suggests years in the making and I think this is where the franchise is at right now.
Those that listen to Mr. McNair and expect a winning season might be disappointed. But, if they end up winning, then I'm pleasantly surprised.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Those that listen to Mr. McNair and expect a winning season might be disappointed. But, if they end up winning, then I'm pleasantly surprised.
One consoling point is if Mr. McNair continues to propagate this pattern of predicting great things for the next season.........one day, he's bound to be right!
I was thoroughly entertained last season. It took me a while to realize we weren't going to score any points in the second half... I think the first Jacksonville game.
From then on, I kept telling myself, "This is the game he learns to pick up the blitz."
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Not necessarily: see Browns, Cleveland.
Most of the time, probably. I don't really expect us to be very good, so I'm pretty patient from that perspective. I don't think we'll be forcing our will on anyone in the near future.
in 2014, I just expect us to not suck as bad as:
Buffalo (4-12) can't remember the last time they had a winning season
Cleveland (4-12) same, I think Belichick was their coach
Jacksonville (4-12)... it's been awhile since they had a winning season
Raiders (4-12)... look at their QB
Tennessee (7-9).... it's been a while since they had a winning season
Redskins (3-13)... they've got as many issues as we do
Dallas Cowboys (8-8)... they've got as many issues as we do
New York Giants (7-9)... They've got as many issues as we do
Steelers (8-8)... They've got as many issues as we do
That's 11 games against teams that are as bad as we are, or worse.
Those that listen to Mr. McNair and expect a winning season might be disappointed. But, if they end up winning, then I'm pleasantly surprised.
I'll be pleasantly surprised if we beat Indy, or Philly... if we win the division.
I'll be very disappointed if we're swept by the Titans & the Jags (again).
The bolded teams have something we are searching for, a solid, established starting QB. Two of them have multi-SB winning QBs. If this is the "QB-driven league" everyone says it is, their presence has to give them an edge.
And in those division games, I'm hoping for a home-&-home split (this year anyway) so that's six games I not be surprised if we lost.
I salute your optimism though. I just don't have it yet. .....maybe after training camp.
I hope you're right.
However, the last time the Texans won a game was in September. I'm still numb to the fact that this team experienced a 14 game losing streak. One day I will probably just explode in spontaneous maniacal laughter when the realization truly hits me.
I'm not good at predictions, so I won't even try. At this point, we do not even have a clue who will be the starting QB for the first game. It is tough to predict any type of success when there are so many unknowns.
That said, I have confidence in O'Brien (based on hope as a fan), so I just want to see a squad that is competitive. I saw a lot of quit last year, so an improvement to me would be a team that refuses to accept losing as a way of life. Beyond that, who they beat and what the final record will be is a complete mystery.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Agreed generally but one of those multi-SB winning QBs just turned in a 69.4 rating season. Let that sink in for a second - it's worse than Schaub's epically bad season.
I'd put it at two above average starters and two giant question marks.
Fair enough. Still, experience-wise anyway, they're ahead of us. At least until I see different.
First of all, I'm not saying we're going to win all 11 games. Just pointing out the teams we're playing have not had a lot of success lately.
Secondly, those teams with solid, established QBs.... c'mon. RG3 hasn't established jack (I'd love it if he were our QB, but that's another story), Romo doesn't know what a play off game is, much less a victory, Eli..... again, I wouldn't mind if he were our QB, or Ben for that matter, but it's been a struggle for them to get to 8-8 the past two years (both the Giants & the Steelers). Tell me they're further along on their rebuild than we are... it's a better arguement than the solidarity of their established QBs, but in the case of the Giants, Redskins, & Cowboys I'm not seeing it.
drs23
Veteran
Din't happen there, Lucy!
I'm with you on all the above. I'm not asking anyone to predict a winning season, or even our final W-L (not in this thread anyway)... alls I'm saying here, is that to be competitive in 2014, we just need to suck less than the 9 teams (11 games) I listed.
I'm not a Rick Smith fan. He hasn't proven to me that he's qualified to handle the responsibilities our owner seems to believe are in his wheelhouse. IMO, if we're not competitive with the Browns, Bills, or Raiders (we're talking a decade of suck), I'll be convinced he is not.
We lost 14 in a row last season. You'd think I'd be convinced of that now, but we've scapegoated Kubiak & Schaub and I have no problem believing it was their fault (even though Schaub only played in 6 games, winning two of them). Those excuses are gone now, I'm rooting for Teflon Rick.... really, I am. I'm betting we'll be competitive against this schedule.
drs23
Veteran
Me too. We'll find out if the problem was the former HC or the GM. Like Grammy always told me, "The proof is in the puddin".
I'm stoked waiting for our draft and next season!
...... the "(again)" was only meant for the Jags.
Beer and Metal
Buzzed Cacophony
It is only a subject because the owner of the team specifically stated that it's not a rebuild.
Without that statement, most of us would think rebuild is obvious and not mention it.
Perhaps you should take up your point with the owner of the team.
My thoughts, as well.
Not my thoughts at all. In my mind, if I consider a team in rebuild mode, I'm more patient with the process. Rebuilding suggests years in the making and I think this is where the franchise is at right now.
Those that listen to Mr. McNair and expect a winning season might be disappointed. But, if they end up winning, then I'm pleasantly surprised.
It's not a rebuild, it's a house flip.
You got your new guy in charge (head Coach), his main contractors (asst. coaches), and the money guy (GM).
Re do the kitchen (QB), put some good flooring and paint in the living spaces (offense), upgrade the bath and bedrooms (defense), and tweak the landscape (special teams).
If everyone's on the same page and knows what they're doing, I can see them be competitive fairly quickly.
drs23
Veteran
I'll give him this... a lot of the players he drafted somehow wound up 10-6 with the Philadelphia Eagles.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
To me, 30yr old high salaried guys need to play at or near pro bowl caliber to stick. OD has been done to me. He hasn't been able to split safeties in 4 yrs. Antonio was always solid and overrated on this board. He was not a 9m de in any scheme. If he was 3-4m ok,cool,but he wasn't. Wade Smith,Daniel Manning, same thing. I thought Wade should've been replaced at least this past season,but he didn't play well 2 yrs ago.
This is just washing out older more expensive guys and replacing them with younger cheaper guys. Core wise, I think the texans have a pretty good core. Its time for guys like Crick,Quess,Jones,williams,and williams to step up and play. The colts and redskins made the playoffs with holes all over the place 2 yrs ago. This league is setup to go 7-9,8-8,9-7. There isn't a lot of differece in talent from a 6-10 and a 10-6 team. Not to mention, the division doesn't have a dominant team and neither do the other 2 division they play. I think,even with a rookie qb to be 7-9 or 8-8. If things fall right,they could get to 9 maybe10 wins. I think RAC with the existing talent will get this team into top 10 defensively. That alone will make this team a lot better.
KC lost playoffs due to Kendricks giving up that long TD to T Y Hilton. KC is trying to get better than One and Done! so they kicked him out.... You think Manning is an upgrade with his injuries ? idk
Heck i would take playoffs with One and Done this season, may be not to the Colts, some other team, and then upgrade kendricks next season like KC.
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
I don't see it.
They gave up 45 points. I'm sure there's plenty of blame to go around.
I seem to recall Casserly & company having a similar mindset. We were 7-9 when he started making "get rid of the expensive old guys" moves. The next year we were 2-14.
Careful what you wish for.
I have a hard time calling RGIII solid and established. He's very much a work in progress.
You did indeed read that. It's on the Texans website.
nero THE zero
All Pro
Interesting.
Would certainly explain (aside from just being a good guy from all I could tell) the tenor of his comments upon departure.
I'll keep my fingers crossed in the most self-serving way imaginable for the market to not live up to Manning's expectations.
My point was that we don't have anyone on our current roster with even that level of success.
2012 Offensive RotY
led his team to 9-6 record.
in Fitzy's best seasons he topped out at 6 wins.
Yates' best year was his rookie year when he went 2-3; 3-4 if you count the playoff games.
Keenum is OH-fer 2013
And this game is about producing wins, right?
okay, I'll concede that RGIII is still a work in progress. ...and?
sandman
Brexit Advisor
Just because a QB is better than what the Texans have on the roster doesn't mean I would want them on the roster.
For example, for most of Eli Manning's career, he has been closer to Matt Schaub than to Tom Brady. 81% QBR for his career, poor TD:INT ratio, poor completion %, missed playoffs four out of last five years.
Matt Schaub has as many 12-win seasons as Eli, and both lost in the Divisional round of the playoffs. Eli has averaged 9 wins a season over his career, while Schaub averaged 8.
But he twice in 10 years rode a playoff hot streak to two fluke Super Bowls, and everyone points to him as a clutch QB who "just wins".
But
...in that fifth year he took his team to the Super Bowl and beat Tom Brady in the process.
When the bright lights came on and he was on the biggest stage in the NFL, Eli delivered. (with very possibly the luckiest damned catch since the Steeler's "Immaculate Reception")
Can we say that about Schaub...?
And I said "we" because I am a Schaub fan.
Still am. (well as much as I can be a fan of a non-Texan)
But the original post was in response to ThunderKyss's implication that there were 11 teams on our schedule that we have a 50-50 chance of beating because they're in a similar state of "rebuild" to us.
My point was four of those teams have "established" starting QBs. And by "established" I mean they've been there and taken their teams to winning seasons and/or playoff land.
The naked truth is as of this moment
We. Do. Not.
As such - and this is the only point I was making - that gives them something of an edge that we would be unwise to overlook.
That's his point. Matt Schaub was the better QB over those years. Better than Flacco as well, but... those guys have Super Bowls & we don't.
Just because the teams you mentioned have better QBs than we do, don't mean a whole lot. For all the good they are, they sure don't win a lot of games. & when we're talking about them being on our schedule next season, the fact that they are on those teams mean nothing.
We don't know who our QB is going to be, but our team has demonstrated more recently than they have with their "established" QBs, that they know how to win.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
This is the total disconnect for me. Can we say what about Schaub? - that he never had one of the NFL's luckiest catches made to avoid a playoff loss? Sure, but so what? How does that reflect on either QB. It was a poorly thrown desperation attempt which magically paid off due to the miraculous play of a never had more than 215 yds in a season, soon to be cut and out of the league WR. That's it.
What about winning the three other playoff games to even be in the position to chunk that prayer up in the first place?
...did I mention all three of those other wins were on the road?
Edit:
those could be considered "big stage auditions".
edit/edit:
Man we're bored.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
What about winning the three other playoff games to even be in the position to chunk that prayer up in the first place?
...did I mention all three of those other wins were on the road?
Edit:
those could be considered "big stage auditions".
edit/edit:
Man we're bored.
He played great in two of them and then marginal to crap in the 3rd that got them in the SB. Now Flacco really upped his game in the playoffs two years ago.
Yeah, we're bored.
Agreed
But after a decade I'm starting to question the McNair's commitment to building a long term on the field successful product.
You will never convince me that BoB McNair is as dumb as MB posters make him out to be when it comes to putting a successful product on the field.
Yeah, those are the type of guys that become billionaires.
Yes, the Texans are and should be in a rebuilding mode.
I've already conceded that the mere presence of those QBs doesn't mean we'll automatically lose those games. In fact, if Schaub was still here and running the offense he knows, I'd say we'd have a damn good chance of kicking their a$$es. (Flame on, Schaub haters). But truth is they have better quality at QB than we do. At least right now.
And as somewhat of an aside, how is it when I say the best athlete/player in the draft ISN'T one of the "wunderkind" QBs but Robinson or Watkins or Clowney or Matthews and that's where we should spend our 1-1 pick, I get shouted down with cries of "Ya gotta go QB because he'll have the biggest impact!"
Okay...QB = biggest impact guy. got it.
Then when I say, "We're behind the power curve QB-wise against some of the teams that are in a similar 'rebuild' state as we are, therefore they have an edge." You say, "the fact that they are on those teams mean nothing" Even though they've had more success (depending on how you measure it) than any of our current guys.
So which is it? Un-confuse me.
It depends on who you're talking to. At no time have you heard me say QB is so important that we've got to take one of these mid first rounder, early second round QBs with our #1 overall.
I've said many times I think Watkins is the best prospect in this draft bar none, but I want Robinson.
Tell me this. How would you feel if you were a Redskins fan & your team must went 3-13 & for all you know RG3 may never be the same again.
Or that you're sending Romo out there again after missing the play offs again with a team you stripped bare to get under the cap.
Or that you've missed the play offs the last two seasons like the Steelers did & you're now #3 in your division.
I like franchise QBs as much as the next guy, but I'd much rather be winning.
Then we're on the same page. ...well you know I want Robinson (or Matthews if we trade down and Rob is gone).
If RGII fails to recover, I've got Cousins to tide me over until I can find another guy
As a cowboy fan (ugh, it hurts to think that way) I'm stuck with Jerrah. I have no hope until he stops being delusional and stops playing GM and behind the scenes HC.
As a cocky Steeler fan I'd be "Everything runs in cycles. Chuck Knoll had slow years. So did Cowher. They bounced back and we WILL bounce back again." That's how they think. And historically, they haven't been far off.
No argument there either. That's why I'd rather build a solid core this year - especially with ELEVEN draft picks and the possibility to get even more - and if O'Brien can't develop one of the guys we'll have this year (Fitz, Case, Yates, whichever new-guy O'Brien thinks is worthy) then we snag a guy next year.
We'll have to.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
I can't believe this. How big a pay cut did they ask him to take?
http://overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=D...S&Team=Bengals
1 million base with a 100k bonus and another 500k in incentives. My guess was about right but thought the base would be at least 2 million.
The texans were asking him to come down to about 1.5 million or so based on report.
http://overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=D...S&Team=Bengals
1 million base with a 100k bonus and another 500k in incentives. My guess was about right but thought the base would be at least 2 million.
The texans were asking him to come down to about 1.5 million or so based on report.
It was probably a shock to Manning to see what he was worth on the open market. I wish he'd taken the paycut and stayed here.
Troy Chapman
Rookie
Yea maybe so. Thought he could get more on the open market but did not happen. Guessing he called ahead to KC to see what they would be offering since he stayed at Cincy to be the safety #3.