This guy didn't work out at the Combine due to swelling in his knee. From what I read at the time it was caused by working out to hard, whatever that is. Now he's also missed Cal's Pro Day workout due to knee injury. Does anyone have better info. or know what knee injury this guy has really suffered? He has a private workout scheduled for April 9th. Am I the only one beginning to think his knee injury might be more than some minor swelling since it's taking months to heal?
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Keenan Allen-WR
- Thread starter Wolf6151
- Start date
He had planned to skip the Cal's Pro Day.
I wonder who will throw for him at the private work out.
Perhaps he wants somebody better than Maynard, LOL.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Depends on whose rankings you're looking at.
I think Mayock has him at #4 behind Deandre Hopkins. Walterfootball has him #3.
PCL on his left knee. Allen is scheduled to visit the famous Dr. Andrews to check out the knee. Clearly, this is troubling to some teams. I think someone in the late 1st or early 2nd will get a steal, because Allen is the most polished, pro ready WR in this draft.
I thought that guy was Deandre Hopkins ?
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Allen is tops playing in/finding space, Hopkins I like better snatching it in coverage. Add them together and you get 85% AJ.
I'm very concerned about Allen's knee, though, and I'd like more info on what his ankle surgey was before the 2012 season too.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Feel like a broken record here, many people have their minds made up already who haven't actually even seen him play. You know that little hitch route that is so effective for Schaub to Johnson, where Andre creates yards after the catch? this is what Allen excells at as well. I've made pro comparisons but apparently people choose not to read or believe in what I'm trying to communicate. Failure on my part I guess, getting tired of this whole process, guess that's to be expected after going at it past 10 years, just usually more educated posters in draft forum. There should really be no confusion with this WR class
So it sounds like you are very big on Allen if you make any comparisons between him and AJ and would be delighted if the Texans got him ?Feel like a broken record here, many people have their minds made up already who haven't actually even seen him play. You know that little hitch route that is so effective for Schaub to Johnson, where Andre creates yards after the catch? this is what Allen excells at as well. I've made pro comparisons but apparently people choose not to read or believe in what I'm trying to communicate. Failure on my part I guess, getting tired of this whole process, guess that's to be expected after going at it past 10 years, just usually more educated posters in draft forum. There should really be no confusion with this WR class
I don't follow college ball very much at all so I'm interested in what guys like you think about Draft prospects especially for the Texans since you know the players coming out. I've not seen any of these guys play, so I'm all ears when it comes to evaluations of the WRs this year since the Texans need help there so badly.
Great player
But avg speed and knee/ankle injuries in college and avg speed to begin with = 2nd rd IMHO.
Feel like a broken record here, many people have their minds made up already who haven't actually even seen him play. You know that little hitch route that is so effective for Schaub to Johnson, where Andre creates yards after the catch? this is what Allen excells at as well. I've made pro comparisons but apparently people choose not to read or believe in what I'm trying to communicate. Failure on my part I guess, getting tired of this whole process, guess that's to be expected after going at it past 10 years, just usually more educated posters in draft forum. There should really be no confusion with this DWR class
Yeh I guess Gill Brandt has never watched film on Allen. Guess he isn't educated enough. From now on we all should just take your word for it. :vincepalm:
beerlover
Hall of Fame
beerlover
Hall of Fame
couple days ago- http://blogs.buffalonews.com/press-coverage/2013/03/road-to-the-draft-keenan-allen.html
I guess every fan base see something different, he compares him to a different Andre, Andre Reed who was their stud back in the day.
It's been awhile but what I remember, Reed was the Bills & Jim Kelly go to guy. Productive, dependable & capable of big plays. Both play a physical style & willing to go over the middle & take a hit without losing ball control. Of course that was then Keenan is like Andre Reed would be evolved with the game 20 years later. So it's a decent comp. very flattering actually. I would think most old Oilier fans would shutter to remember this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Comeback_(American_football)
I guess every fan base see something different, he compares him to a different Andre, Andre Reed who was their stud back in the day.
It's been awhile but what I remember, Reed was the Bills & Jim Kelly go to guy. Productive, dependable & capable of big plays. Both play a physical style & willing to go over the middle & take a hit without losing ball control. Of course that was then Keenan is like Andre Reed would be evolved with the game 20 years later. So it's a decent comp. very flattering actually. I would think most old Oilier fans would shutter to remember this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Comeback_(American_football)
This is a deep draft for WR. But, there are no superstars like AJ, Megatron, Green, etc.... To me the Texans shouldn't try to replace AJ in this draft, they should replace Kevin Walter. Get someone who can step in right away and play the #2 spot today and get AJ's replacement when there's someone with AJ's size and talent.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
This. People need to just stop talking about X guy has a chance of replacing AJ. If anyone from this draft class every produces like AJ it will be a fluke. This is a crud class of QB's so should be an easy class for WR's to not get pushed down. Instead nobody is being discussed as a top pick.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
nobody is suggesting this WR class has even a top 10 pick, what this class does have is several prospects who would compliment AJ now, be productive sooner than later & possibly become the Texans future #1 when Andre hangs em up. Nothing more or less, same can be said for QB position. I don't think there should be a top 10 QB prospect this year, like you said it's a crud class, but teams who need to address this particular position still will target player X because of weakness in that area, only so many with next level ability, supply & demand. We could argue rest of year what Texans priority position actually is, most seem to agree that WR positions align with grade & need. One could argue Matt Schaub is good enough to lead Texans to a Superbowl but he just needs another WR threat, so teams cannot just focus on taking Foster & Johnson out of the offense. Someone else might feel that it's on Schaub that he has weapons but fails to flash ability to extend plays under pressure, making QB an even greater need. Yet many others who follow Texans feel it will be a defensive selection, that the offense is not that far of the mark & besides addition of Reed lack pass rush with exodus of Barwin & injury to Cushing/Reed or disruptive nose guard to penetrate middle of offensive line who warrants double teams.
BL
I still think the Texans very likely will leverage the depth of this WR class and wait for the second round to take a receiver if the guy they want the most isn't on the Board at 27 or if there is no receiver they really want that badly anyway. Plus with 4 picks in the first 3 rounds (and 5 in the first 4), they might even draft 2 WRs within their top 4 or 5 picks. Up to now Rick Smith has not been the type to reach for a prospect or to move up in the Draft.
Mayock timed Allen at 4.71 and 4.75
http://fansided.com/2013/04/09/keenan-allen-runs-4-7-40-yard-dash-at-pro-day/
*****************************
Know he's been injured, but that is slow !
http://fansided.com/2013/04/09/keenan-allen-runs-4-7-40-yard-dash-at-pro-day/
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Know he's been injured, but that is slow !
Allen is obviously still injured. His agent shouldn't have let him run.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Yeah that's terrible...Mike Williams from USC terrible......but it backs up what i see from him when watch tape. People get quickness and fast mixed up. Allen's got slightly above average quickness...but he's not fast. That doesn't make for a great #1 or #2 imo.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Jerry Rice ran a 4.7, right?
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Jerry was actually faster....4.5-6 i believe...in any event, lol at comparing the GOAT wr to an incoming rookie with knee issues.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
According to reports, Jerry Rice ran a 4.71. And in your opinion, that doesn't make for a great #1 or #2.
Arian Foster also ran a bad 40 time... because he was injured and decided to run. I don't know if Keenan Allen is going to be any good or not. But you can't just look at a 40 time and figure it out. Especially a 40 time run by a guy that's injured.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
ehh, point taken..i'm just weary of drafting a guy that i feel isn't going to be able to separate with his long speed. cb's tend to want to sit on routes and jam you up at the LOS when they're not afraid of you running past them. To be able to get deep on a consistent basis with that kind of long speed you've got to be a technician as far as running routes is concerned. Jerry and Larry Fitzgerald come to mind...I don't see that with this kid.....imo of course.
Maybe i'm wrong....i didn't want the texans to draft JJ Watt..thought he was a lumbering, try-hard.....needless to say......................:vincepalm::mariopalm:
His movement are so sudden; as a CB they can't sit back in a cushion.
When they hesitate for a fraction, Allen has that second gear that will burn you before you know it.
Like Mayock said; watching the tapes he's a 4.55 guy all day long.
Personally, I think Allen is a low 4.5 guy, at least.
When they hesitate for a fraction, Allen has that second gear that will burn you before you know it.
Like Mayock said; watching the tapes he's a 4.55 guy all day long.
Personally, I think Allen is a low 4.5 guy, at least.
And that's what we'd miss with Allen. It's not everything, but it's important if you want a WR with enough speed to atleast make the deep safety fade a bit when he's going deep to help the corner over top. And Robert Woods gives you that, I'm sure hoping we have a chance to take him.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
Allen is probably a safe pick, but if he doesn't threaten deep I dont see a new dimension added. I'm looking for Hunter or Woods in the first, and Williams or Wheaton in the 2nd. I'm ok with selecting a boom or bust pick because at some point Posey will be comming back. I guess I think of that as a fail safe.
Who would be our starters today? Aj and....jean or martin? Am I missing someone? Seems to me we almost HAVE TO draft a wr early and another late for insurance.
Who would be our starters today? Aj and....jean or martin? Am I missing someone? Seems to me we almost HAVE TO draft a wr early and another late for insurance.
^^^^
This
Allen, slow injury prone= pass
I wouldn't have a problem drafting 2 WR's in rds 1-3. It's time to give Schaub the weapons he needs, so that we can find out if Schaub's the problem or the answer.
If speed is your primary concern then there are plenty in this draft such that you don't have to reach for any guy.
And I'm not saying the guys you look at late has nothing but speed.
This draft class is so deep at WR, there's no telling how their careers will end up.
If we take the TT Mock Draft as a barometer, I'm thinking at least one of the guys who have yet to be taken can end up being at least a solid #2 receiver some time down the road. When I have some time, I'll give their cases.
We're in round six now, and I just picked up Cobi Hamilton who has that upside.
And I'm not saying the guys you look at late has nothing but speed.
This draft class is so deep at WR, there's no telling how their careers will end up.
If we take the TT Mock Draft as a barometer, I'm thinking at least one of the guys who have yet to be taken can end up being at least a solid #2 receiver some time down the road. When I have some time, I'll give their cases.
We're in round six now, and I just picked up Cobi Hamilton who has that upside.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
I think some conferences are slower than others by far . A guy from the Big 12 tears it up , gets drafted high , and is ok at best . SEC and ACC guys seem to play faster .
Seems like a great plan to me.
I think they invest a 3rd on an OT also.
I'm going to do a mock draft soon and there should be WR's better than Jean/Martin available in rd 5. Unfortunately my mock will look alot like Corrosion's TT Mock Draft.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
But Jean Martin sounds like a pirate name .
I think WR does have a lot of depth with little separation between them . I could see them loving a player at one of the following , NT , OLB , WR , TE . I left of DE and ILB cause JJ and Cush will cost them and you'll have to spread out the money .
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
Yup. Dont want a guard out of the draft. I want somebody with tackle feet. I feel like if worse comes to worse you've got a starting guard out of brooks, jones, mondek, or even Newton if need be. I dont think you can plug brooks or jones in at tackle. So gimme a tackle in the 3rd or 4th.
I just timed Allen on this play in fastenough.90. BTW, that's 1st lock CB Desmond Trufant (#6) in pursuit.
I like Allen, and if healthy would make a great pick @27. But, he's not healthy. This team is has a window and I don't think it needs to swing for the fence with high risk picks, be it injury or character concerns. That's why I would lean at this point to DeAndre Hopkins or Robert Woods at WR. They both have the talent and the production to project as a solid #2 WR, at least. And using scouting terminology, they're "clean" prospects. I think the Texans have to go "clean".
I like Allen, and if healthy would make a great pick @27. But, he's not healthy. This team is has a window and I don't think it needs to swing for the fence with high risk picks, be it injury or character concerns. That's why I would lean at this point to DeAndre Hopkins or Robert Woods at WR. They both have the talent and the production to project as a solid #2 WR, at least. And using scouting terminology, they're "clean" prospects. I think the Texans have to go "clean".
badboy
Hall of Fame
What other injuries has he had? One injury does not make a player injury prone. You are going to have to come with some facts to support that. Keenan turns 21 April 27th which is another plus. He uses his hands as well if not better than any other WR. Doesn't matter how fast you are (and I am a speed guy)if you cannot catch the rock. Also, he is very good at running his route then breaking out past the defender. He has the skills to be a #1.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
How long has his leg (foot) injury been lingering? A chronic foot injury that hasn't gone away for months now has to be concerning. If the guy has to run a good route to get separation how much does it effect a safety's play? Does it stretch the defense for other players? I gotta be honest, i'll defer to those who've seen him play because i've only read scouting reports, but I want a guy with speed to burn. I want a guy who forces a defensive coordinator to compromise. We have plenty of guys who challenge short and intermediate. If thats all Allen does...I think we need to look somewhere else.
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
I think this bumps him down to 2nd round.
This close to the draft and still unable to answer the bell -- I can't invest a 1st in such a fluid injury status.
More reason to trade down.
See I'm thinking exactly the opposite. Posey sat out much of his last college season. Played little in his rookie year, then was injured. And now is looking at missing his 2nd pro season. If the Texans ever get anything out of Posey, that's the bonus. And that's why they need a sure thing in this draft.
badboy
Hall of Fame
He's been hampered by a posterior cruciate ligament injury throughout the draft process, but doctors now describe Allen's left knee as fully healthy after he re-injured it in January. Trainers told Mayock that Allen only has 75 percent to 80 percent of his explosion, but said "that's what comes last" in the healing process. Allen recently told The Sacramento Bee that he's only about 85 percent back.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap10...nan-allen-clocks-471-in-40-mayock-doesnt-care
I don't want to print entire article but no one seems to be posting what else Mayock said. Let's get it all on the table:
"Three months ago, I said -- if you watch this kid on tape -- if you like him, he's Anquan Boldin. If you don't like him, he's speed-deficient. So I don't really care what he runs in the 40. On tape, to me, he's a 4.55 guy all day long."
Mayock called Allen's 40 results "not a good time," but scouts and coaches told him they expect Allen to be faster down the road. What he gives you, according to Mayock, is "a big, powerful, wide receiver" who might go anywhere from No. 25 to No. 45 in the 2013 NFL Draft.
"I believe in his toughness and his hands," Mayock said, confirming that he would, indeed, "bang the table" for Allen (and in Mayock's universe, that's a compliment of the highest order).
There are individual talents everywhere.
How many teams does the SEC has?
The percentage may still be high, but they are not as far apart as one may think.
The Big 10, for example, has been producing a lot of draftable linemen.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
I was thinking more of WR / CB types .
I'm not knocking Allen (or Boldin). But Allen is not a similar type WR as Anquan Boldin. Not the Boldin of today or the Boldin of the 2003 draft. They're similar in that they both battled knee injuries during their respective draft periods. Boldin is much more physical, while Allen relies on quickness.
If I were going to compare a WR prospect to Allen, it would be former Seahawk Koren Robinson. Good size, but very quick with excellent run after catch ability. Unfortunately, drug issues and later a knee injury cut Robinson's career short. He could have been a Pro Bowl WR.