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Jeff Fisher OUT as Titans HC

Texecutioner said:
Like I said he's just as bad but for different reasons. Just because he doesn't shoot the bird at other fans and act like an ass in public doesn't make him any worse of an owner for a franchise if you're main goal is supposed to be about winning. Bob's actions since he's been here for 9 years now suggest that his main goal as an owner is strictly profit. It's not winning. So as a fan whose main goal to see their team win and become successful, I could care less about Mcnair or Bud or any other owner's net profits every season. All I or any other fan should care about is what actions the owner takes to make his team a winner and Bob hasn't shown a strong commitment there as far as I'm concerned so that puts him right there with guys like Bud, Ralph Wilson and Mike Brown and a few others in bad company.
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I think there is a fan of every team in the league that has said the same about their team owner. But I think that McNair tries very hard to have a winning team. He may be ignorant about what it takes, but he has shown he will spend the money. His problem is he has too much faith in a few people that are not as good as he thought they were.
 
Texecutioner said:
What? I've heard you rep Fisher as a great HC like a Gazillion times in the past in year. Fisher was one of your top examples as to why Kubiak should have been retained after season 3 and season 4 actually. You said that Kubiak could be this next great coach like Fisher or Tom Landry if he had more time to build and that was part of your argument many times.
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Go back to the "Team Fisher" thread... He (for some reason) gets more rep. than he deserves. However, when you look at his record, he's nothing spectacular. The only times you've seen me compare to Kubiak to Fisher was when it came to the consecutive 8-8 seasons.
 
kiwitexansfan said:
Nasty move by Adams to fire Fisher after all the head coaching jobs were filled.

Titans will be a worse team long term for this.
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And this is why Bob McNair is a better owner. Tex can say shooting the bird doesn't really matter, but what reputable coach wants to work for a owner like that or a guy who holds on to a lame duck coach almost a month after the season is over and then fires him where he doesn't have a legit shot to get another job? Coaches around the league aren't complete dumbasses and they do look at that stuff.

For as bad as Bob McNair is, he still has reputable coaches like Cowher who would be open to coach for him...why? Because he does have class and whether people want to admit it or not....class counts for something. Even in Bud Adams' wet dreams he'd never have a shot at a accomplished coach like Bill Cowher, because he's a freaking ass clown on top of being a horrific owner. Jeff Fisher was a nobody when Adams hired him and that's the type of coach he's going to have to hire again.....some nobody, just like Al Davis is forced to do all the time. Fisher turned out to be solid, but that doesn't mean the next guy will. All the retreads/proven head coaches like Gruden, Cowher, etc will look elsewhere to get jobs. For all the different mistakes McNair has made, he isn't going to scare away good coaches.
 
There's one place where Bob McNair can't even begin to compare to Bud Adams. That would be "Remaining Time as Owner".

You see, Bud's already been as good as he's going to be and at the same time he probably can't get much worse than he's been. The "silver lining" to being a fan of a Bud Adams owned team is that you're at the end of the road. Soon Bud will shake off this mortal coil and leave the team to his heirs or whoever they end up selling it too. In most cases one would say "Better the devil you know...." but in this scenario it's not like they can do much worse.

On the other hand if you're a Texans fan you've spent about 10 years watching Bob McNair figure out about 2% (apparently) of what he needs to know in order to be a merely acceptable NFL owner. He's healthy, apparently blessed with eternal patience, and seems to believe just about anything any of the other NFL owners will tell him. In short we're in for another 20-25 years of watching him try to get this done.

The Titans fans will suffer far less in the long run than we will.
 
GlassHalfFull said:
Answer this question, would Bud had given AJ his money last year???
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Is this your only example? really? Because AJ got paid?

What happened with Aaron Glenn? Sharper after he had a nice season for us early on? After that there isn't many to even mention because this franchise has been so bad at even having top talent to even resign. Care to bring up all of the free agents out there that could have helped this team year after year in to fill holes? Or what about so many of the talented guys that were on the trading blocks at times where we never made any type of move?

And Bud would not have had to pay AJ first of all. AJ was not being paid pennies for one. He was already making a nice salary and had several years on his contract. AJ was really in no position to negotiate for the most part. It's nice that he got paid more money because in his case he deserved it, but if you're going to pin a ribbon on Mcnair's chest for a no brainer situation on a guy like AJ, at least be objective and look at his lack of commitment at other positions whether it be in quality depth, hiring a competent HC, or in quality free agents that could fill desperate holes on this team.
 
I like Fisher but to me this was actually a smart move by the Titans. Radio will be gone. A coach whose act has gotten stale will be gone. They have talent on both sides. Bring in the right guy and and a vert QB and you might have a good mix to compete immediately. Maybe Bud saw the light. Sometimes answering questions is a bigger pain then asking them to yourself.
 
Hervoyel said:
There's one place where Bob McNair can't even begin to compare to Bud Adams. That would be "Remaining Time as Owner".

You see, Bud's already been as good as he's going to be and at the same time he probably can't get much worse than he's been. The "silver lining" to being a fan of a Bud Adams owned team is that you're at the end of the road. Soon Bud will shake off this mortal coil and leave the team to his heirs or whoever they end up selling it too. In most cases one would say "Better the devil you know...." but in this scenario it's not like they can do much worse.

On the other hand if you're a Texans fan you've spent about 10 years watching Bob McNair figure out about 2% (apparently) of what he needs to know in order to be a merely acceptable NFL owner. He's healthy, apparently blessed with eternal patience, and seems to believe just about anything any of the other NFL owners will tell him. In short we're in for another 20-25 years of watching him try to get this done.

The Titans fans will suffer far less in the long run than we will.
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Except I think I remember hearing that none of Bud Adams heirs want the team and in that market a sell could mean RELOCATION. Sorry, but I'd still take the stability of McNair (and hope for the best) over what's going on in TENN.
 
Carr Bombed said:
And this is why Bob McNair is a better owner. Tex can say shooting the bird doesn't really matter, but what reputable coach wants to work for a owner like that or a guy who holds on to a lame duck coach almost a month after the season is over and then fires him where he doesn't have a legit shot to get another job? Coaches around the league aren't complete dumbasses and they do look at that stuff.

For as bad as Bob McNair is, he still has reputable coaches like Cowher who would be open to coach for him...why? Because he does have class and whether people want to admit it or not....class counts for something. Even in Bud Adams' wet dreams he'd never have a shot at a accomplished coach like Bill Cowher, because he's a freaking ass clown on top of being a horrific owner. Jeff Fisher was a nobody when Adams hired him and that's the type of coach he's going to have to hire again.....some nobody, just like Al Davis is forced to do all the time. Fisher turned out to be solid, but that doesn't mean the next guy will. All the retreads/proven head coaches like Gruden, Cowher, etc will look elsewhere to get jobs. For all the different mistakes McNair has made, he isn't going to scare away good coaches.
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Again, he's not in the same mold as Bud Adams. Very different, but very similar results in the success column and much worse than Bud in the last 9 years. Bob hasn't been around the league near as long to show that his tendencies as a poor owner will continue down this same path or improve with shrewdness combined with a strong commitment to winning. We'll see what the future holds. But all we can do right now for discussion sake is compare his 9 years at this point and his 9 years have been dreadful and embarrassing to be frank. And according to Bob "We're on the right track." That last statement is the most disturbing part and none of Bud's middle finger antics scare me more than an owner who thinks that way in a 6-10 season of a 5 year regime. I just don't see how that type of attitude can even remotely be excused.
 
Texecutioner said:
Is this your only example? really? Because AJ got paid?

What happened with Aaron Glenn? Sharper after he had a nice season for us early on? After that there isn't many to even mention because this franchise has been so bad at even having top talent to even resign. Care to bring up all of the free agents out there that could have helped this team year after year in to fill holes? Or what about so many of the talented guys that were on the trading blocks at times where we never made any type of move?

And Bud would not have had to pay AJ first of all. AJ was not being paid pennies for one. He was already making a nice salary and had several years on his contract. AJ was really in no position to negotiate for the most part. It's nice that he got paid more money because in his case he deserved it, but if you're going to pin a ribbon on Mcnair's chest for a no brainer situation on a guy like AJ, at least be objective and look at his lack of commitment at other positions whether it be in quality depth, hiring a competent HC, or in quality free agents that could fill desperate holes on this team.
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I don't know why you pin this all on McNair instead of the people he hired. Do you really want him to be his own GM like Jerrah?
 
Texecutioner said:
Again, he's not in the same mold as Bud Adams. Very different, but very similar results in the success column and much worse than Bud in the last 9 years. Bob hasn't been around the league near as long to show that his tendencies as a poor owner will continue down this same path or improve with shrewdness combined with a strong commitment to winning. We'll see what the future holds. But all we can do right now for discussion sake is compare his 9 years at this point and his 9 years have been dreadful and embarrassing to be frank. And according to Bob "We're on the right track." That last statement is the most disturbing part and none of Bud's middle finger antics scare me more than an owner who thinks that way in a 6-10 season of a 5 year regime. I just don't see how that type of attitude can even remotely be excused.
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Again...when McNair gets the right guy in place that patience will pay off BIG TIME. I judge G.M.'s and coaches on wins and losses. I judge Owners on how they conduct themselves and how they represent their product which is what is going to make good coaches want to coach a certain team. Good reputable coaches don't want to coach for Bud Adams and while that might just be my opinion, we'll see who he's able to lure to that team. People look at the middle fingers, how he handled the Young and Fisher fiasco and I can almost guarantee you his options are going to be limited. If McNair was wise enough to move on from Kubiak this offseason, he would've been able to land a big name in here.....if he fires Kubiak next season, he'll still have the opportunity to land a big name in here. We'll see who Adams is able to pull from the bottom of the barrel. LOL, maybe he can hire Tom Cable
 
Cowher got to one Super Bowl (and lost) and two other AFC Championship Games before he got Roethlisberger; he did so with QBs Kordell Stewart and Neil O'Donnell.

Fisher got to one Super Bowl (and lost) and one other AFC Championship Game; he did so with QB Steve McNair.

I'm not saying Cowher sucks, nor am I saying that Fisher is a better coach. I'm saying that it took Cowher 14 seasons to win a Super Bowl and he only did so after getting his franchise QB; that can't be a coincidence, can it?

Cowher's regular season record blows Fisher's out of the water, no question about it. But Cowher also didn't take over a struggling franchise that was about to move three times in four years. If you want to count this one as an excuse in Fisher's favor and it carries no merit then you can throw that out. But I do think it's legit.

I like this:
Honestly what's the difference between Jeff Fisher the head coach and Wade Phillips the head coach? Will somebody please tell me, because the only difference I can see is the music city miracle and Wade's aw shucks personality.
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The beautiful thing about coaching is that your success is usually tied to the ability of your players. Of course you're going to have your coaches who are absolutely phenomenal player-development guys and make their own success. Look at Belicheck, he struggled through his tenure in Cleveland, then took over a rough NE team. What turned it around for Belicheck? Of course I'm not comparing Fisher to Belicheck, that would be asinine. But you get the point, Dungy didn't win one until he got Peyton Manning and it still took him a couple of years. Some guys do it through defense: was Ditka an outstanding coach? He won three playoff games in 13 years other than 1985, he won the Super Bowl with the best defense ever. What about Brian Billick? He won only a single playoff game outside of 2000, a year in which he had one of the best defenses ever assembled, and won his division only twice in nine years.

And this isn't supposed to be in support of Fisher. His record is mediocre and I agree that he is overrated. But if you want to be so adamant about Fisher's mediocrity and praise Cowher, look at their careers and think. If the one main goal is to win a Super Bowl, then Cowher doesn't destroy Fisher in terms of his career. If it's about winning in the regular season, then Fisher can't hold Marty Schottenheimer's jock (and you may not think he can, but Fish has a Super Bowl appearance in less time).
 
Bulluck53 said:
Cowher got to one Super Bowl (and lost) and two other AFC Championship Games before he got Roethlisberger; he did so with QBs Krodell Stewart and Neil O'Donnell.

Fisher got to one Super Bowl (and lost) and one other AFC Championship Game; he did so with QB Steve McNair.

I'm not saying Cowher sucks, nor am I saying that Fisher is a better coach. I'm saying that it took Cowher 14 seasons to win a Super Bowl and he only did so after getting his franchise QB; that can't be a coincidence, can it?

Cowher's regular season record blows Fisher's out of the water, no question about it. But Cowher also didn't take over a struggling franchise that was about to move three times in four years. If you want to count this one as an excuse in Fisher's favor and it carries no merit then you can throw that out. But I do think it's legit.

I like this:


The beautiful thing about coaching is that your success is usually tied to the ability of your players. Of course you're going to have your coaches who are absolutely phenomenal player-development guys and make their own success. Look at Belicheck, he struggled thorugh his tenure in Cleveland, then took over a rough NE team. What turned it around for Belicheck? Of course I'm not comparing Fisher to Belicheck, that would be asinine. But you get the point, Dungy didn't win one until he got Peyton Manning and it still took him a couple of years. Some guys do it through defense: was Ditka an outstanding coach? He won three playoff games in 13 years other than 1985, he wont the Super Bowl with the best defense ever. What about Brian Billick? He won only a single playoff game outside of 2000, a year in which he had one of the best defenses ever assembled, and won his division only twice in nine years.

And this isn't supposed to be in support of Fisher. His record is mediocre and I agree that he is overrated. But if you want to be so adamant about Fisher's mediocrity and praise Cowher, look at their careers and think. If the one main goal is to win a Super Bowl, then Cowher doesn't destroy Fisher in terms of his career. If it's about winning in the regular season, then Fisher can't hold Marty Schottenheimer's jock (and you may not think he can, but Fish has a Super Bowl appearance in less time).
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LOL, you just admitted that Fisher is a mediocre coach, but still want people to look at him in the same light as Cowher.

Bill Cowher is >>>>>>>>> than Jeff Fisher ever was and ever will be.

They aren't even remotely comparable so I'm not going to waste any more time entertaining that topic and it's not that I can't...I just don't feel like it. Again, not worth my time.
 
Carr Bombed said:
LOL, you just admitted that Fisher is a mediocre coach, but still want people to look at him in the same light as Cowher.

Bill Cowher is >>>>>>>>> than Jeff Fisher ever was and ever will be.

They aren't even remotely comparable so I'm not going to waste any more time entertaining that topic and it's not that I can't...I just don't feel like it. Again, not worth my time.
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Why are they not comparable? Please, waste your time so I can dive into that head of yours. I want you to convince me. I really don't see a huge difference in their careers before Cowher got Roethlisberger. If you want to cite regular season wins then take them. I want a Super Bowl and that's what coaches are measured by.

Before Roethlisberger, Cowher was getting the same flak as Manning often got before 2007. That he could win in the regular season but never win the big one. It's not a coincidence.

And, once again, this isn't about Fisher vs Cowher. It's about the myth that Cowher is a great coach. I would be upset if Cowher were to come to Nashville because it would be the same as Fisher. He wouldn't have a QB.

Hell, Cowher was 11-12 (0-1 playoffs) against Fisher in his career. WHEW!!! Cowher >>>>>>> Fisher!
 
best thing that happened with fisher is Eddie George got hurt and Fisher had to let McNair take over.. after that...Fisher was so much better with balance . however ... things got screwy with drafting of vince and not letting mcnair tutor him
(may or may not have helped but wouldn't have hurt being they were about the same coming into the league)
 
Wolf said:
best thing that happened with fisher is Eddie George got hurt and Fisher had to let McNair take over.. after that...Fisher was so much better with balance . however ... things got screwy with drafting of vince and not letting mcnair tutor him
(may or may not have helped but wouldn't have hurt being they were about the same coming into the league)
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Many in Nashville don't think McNair wanted that role anyway. Bud calling for VY is what put the franchise in this position, IMO at least. Fisher's case wasn't helped with the '08 playoff loss then the subsequent 0-6 start in '09, and now here we are.

.. and I supported the VY pick, and his first few years. After the Jags game I started to change my mind, then after the Washington debacle this year he was done in my book. Looking back though Bud screwed the Titans the moment he made that decision (sure you guys love that :lol: )
 
Bulluck53 said:
Why are they not comparable? Please, waste your time so I can dive into that head of yours. I want you to convince me. I really don't see a huge difference in their careers before Cowher got Roethlisberger. If you want to cite regular season wins then take them. I want a Super Bowl and that's what coaches are measured by.

Before Roethlisberger, Cowher was getting the same flak as Manning often got before 2007. That he could win in the regular season but never win the big one. It's not a coincidence.

And, once again, this isn't about Fisher vs Cowher. It's about the myth that Cowher is a great coach. I would be upset if Cowher were to come to Nashville because it would be the same as Fisher. He wouldn't have a QB.

Hell, Cowher was 11-12 (0-1 playoffs) against Fisher in his career. WHEW!!! Cowher >>>>>>> Fisher!
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:rolleyes: In 15 seasons as a head coach in the NFL, Bill Cowher only had 3 losing seasons and his worst record was 6-10. Like I said, I'm not going to get in a hour long debate between Bill Cowher and Jeff Fisher, because it's nonsense. Jeff Fisher is no where near Bill Cowher.
 
Again, you can have the regular season, and again, this is not a comparison between the two. How is Cowher a great coach?

If you want to end it fine... as long as I get the last word because that means I won.
 
kiwitexansfan said:
Is that right? Only 6 winning seasons?

Wouldn't have believed it if it weren't from such a reliable source and I wasn't too lazy to employ my google-fu.
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Yes. Only 6 winning seasons, he was BY FAR the most overrated coach in the NFL. The media portrayed him like he was a top tier coach in the league, but he wasn't.
 
Carr Bombed said:
Yes. Only 6 winning seasons, he was BY FAR the most overrated coach in the NFL. The media portrayed him like he was a top tier coach in the league, but he wasn't.
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Well, in all fairness, he did have 3 consecutive 8-8 seasons. :smiliedance:

So, he had 9 non-losing seasons.. :francis:
 
Bulluck53 said:
No doubt, but don't skirt the question.
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He was a very good head coach when he had capable play callers. He won with Elway, had success with Plummer, and the story was incomplete with Cutler. When he has a QB who can run his offense he's a very good coach.

I'm not skirting **** BTW..just don't feel the need to get baited into some asinine discussion on how Jeff Fisher compares to Bill Cowher. Nice try with the Mike Shanahan bait though....didn't work.
 
Bulluck53 said:
:gun: :wadepalm:
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What's the matter...truth hurts?

LMAO, how can anybody in their right mind actually think Fisher is a better coach than Bill Cowher or anywhere near the same level.. Oh wait I forgot, you don't even think he is...you just want to keep arguing on his behalf
:kubepalm: (See I can do a face palm also :) )
 
Carr Bombed said:
What's the matter...truth hurts?

LMAO, how can anybody in their right mind actually think Fisher is a better coach and Bill Cowher.. Oh wait I forgot, you don't even think he is...you just want to keep arguing on his behalf
:kubepalm: (See I can do a face palm also)
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The great think about this is that you are serious. I have said two or three times that this isn't about Fisher vs Cowher. Just that Cowher is not a great coach. I brought it up because someone, maybe you I don't know, said how much they want Cowher if Kubiak starts out slow next season. That sentiment was heard a few weeks back when half this board was pleading for McNair to let Kubiak walk and hire Cowher, but I don't believe I said anything then.

You think I'm arguing for Fisher because of the team I support. In reality I'm simply responding to a lot of your fellow fans willing to break the bank for Cowher under the assumption that he would be a savior.

Maybe it would help if I went back and changed the original post to, "The difference between Marty Schottenheimer and Cowher is Ben Roethlisberger and Dick LeBeau. Think about it."
 
A winning team is not just about the coach. It's about the whole staff and the players and the FO. If any of the three is not up to par, the team will struggle. A great coach is like a Lombardi or Walsh that can fit their system to the players they have.
 
JB said:
A winning team is not just about the coach. It's about the whole staff and the players and the FO. If any of the three is not up to par, the team will struggle. A great coach is like a Lombardi or Walsh or Bum Phillips that can fit their system to the players they have.
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Just sayin'!!! :runaway:
 
JB said:
A winning team is not just about the coach. It's about the whole staff and the players and the FO. If any of the three is not up to par, the team will struggle. A great coach is like a Lombardi or Walsh that can fit their system to the players they have.
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And most importantly the owner.

Not a Fisher fan,but having to deal with Bud and his cronies for 16 yrs. Fisher deserves a medal.
 
JB said:
A winning team is not just about the coach. It's about the whole staff and the players and the FO. If any of the three is not up to par, the team will struggle. A great coach is like a Lombardi or Walsh that can fit their system to the players they have.
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Stop defending Fisher, just stop.
 
Anyways...

How about this question. Who is rumored to be the replacement. I'm sure people are already talking about that. What are people saying in Tenn?
 
Wyatt has mentioned Mike Munchak as the "leading candidate." Personally I hope not. I would want an offensive mind but Munchak seems like he would be too much like Fisher, conservative. My mind went straight to Mangini when I heard this since they were already in DC talks. I don't think so now though since it sounds like Fisher made this decision. I would have hated Mangini.
 
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