JaMarcus Russell: Prototypical Bust

[DocBar]

Ryan Leaf. Tim Couch. Akili Smith. Andre Ware. Jeff George. Heath Shuler.

Some big name busts in recent NFL history. Lots of pre-draft buzz, created by some big games in college, some impressive workouts, but mostly just hype.

Strong arms, but not the greatest decision-makers. Quickly learned a simplified college offense, but struggled with a complicated pro offense with huge playbooks and a lot more reads.

The biggest thing they all have in common: no work ethic. Just not willing to put in the work needed to become the franchise player they were thought to one day become. Some of these guys didn't have the best work ethic just because of their personalities. Leaf and Couch were pretty aloof guys, and Smith had some problems there, too. You CAN'T succeed at the next level if you think you can get away with some of the things you do in college, simple as that. Then you have guys like Shuler who combined all of that with the fact that he held out for his entire initial training camp. That's not going to end well.

Onto JaMarcus Russell. He fits the mold. Almost perfectly. Strong arm, but not the best decisions on the field. Some good games throughout his career, but nothing spectacular. No one even considered him a top prospect till one game against a very weak Notre Dame defense, a game where he had several questionable throws, including an interception thrown into triple coverage. His work ethic has been questioned for a while now, as well as his general non-chalant attitude towards the team. When asked who he wants to play for, he said "Whoever picks first and whoever pays the most." Not exactly what you'd want to hear from a potential franchise QB.

I liked Vince Young as a prospect a lot more than Russell. And a lot of you know my feelings on Young pre-draft last year. I've never seen a more obvious QB bust in my life.

Believe in the "here after"? $$$ is what WE'RE ALL "here after". I've heard nothing of poor work ethic about JR. He made a few questionable throws in college, but I don't think it was an outrageous amount. Lokk at BQ. Mr. Heisman didn't make the best decisions I've ever seen in some of his games.
Oh, I forgot the time of year. Everyone is looking for the next "Bowie/Jordan" fiasco.

 

[Texan_Aggie222]

Wow, thats a lot of harsh judgment there for a QB that you haven't seen work out yet or be interviewed or even play in his first NFL game. Every QB was the potential to be a bust, and also a star. Its just what you make out of that potential. You can't label that person a bust until he actually has time to work with what he is given.

 

[sgntxnfn]

This thread is absolutely ridiculous. You, Kastofsna, are full of yourself. As Texan Aggie 222 said, he hasn't played an NFL game yet...I personally think that when the games are played, JaMarcus will prove he's better than pretty boy Quinn, as he has already proved in the Sugar Bowl. You act as if you are God. Let's just watch what happens.

 

[swtbound07]

the reason vince young is relevant in a jamarcus russell thread is that kastofsna has a history of looking foolish when prognosticating about a quarterback predraft. He was spouting drivel about young last year like "I'll bet you anything no team touches vince in the top 10" and "Young will probably fall to the second round". He will also make a prediction on about every side of the fence, so he can quote the one post of his that is right and say he knew it all along. The strongest indication that Russell will be an NFL success is that Kasty thinks he will bust. I don't think kastofsna could accurately predict what color the sky is or what he will have for breakfast tomorrow.

and just for grins, some classic kasty quotes from last year

i have never been wrong about anyone. ever

MJG is a future hall of famer. book it. i don't care what system he's in. he'll be one of those larry allen-esque lock-for-the-pro-bowl-every-year-even-when-he-sucks players.

leinart is the best player in the draft.

cutler is going #3 or #4.

the titans won't want young.

cutler is going in the top 4. titans or jets.

several former players like cutler most out of the top 3. i think a lot of teams agree with them.

it's either the titans or jets for leinart, folks.

nice draft for tennessee. managed to get the two most overrated players in the draft in the first two rounds..

no need to worry. he'll be a bust and will be out of the league in 3 to 4 years. (about vince young)

 

[Mr Shush]

Research by Football Outsiders' David Lewin suggests that the college stats which do the best job of projecting a highly drafted (round 1 or 2) quarterback's pro career are starts and completion percentage. Russell's career completion percentage is 61.9%. That includes his first season in the team, when it was 50.7%; last year it was up to 67.8%. He also started a pretty respectable number of games. I believe I'm right in saying that no first round quarterback with a completion percentage for his college career above 60% has ever been a bust in the NFL. I'd feel happier about Russell if he'd stayed in college for another season (pocket quarterbacks should always stay for their senior year), and as a rookie, coming from a great college team to a horrible NFL side - possibly even the Raiders - he might be in for a very rough ride indeed at first. Russell will be at the very least a decent NFL quarterback, and has a good chance to be much more (especially if he manages to stay out of Oakland).

 

[kastofsna]

Wow, thats a lot of harsh judgment there for a QB that you haven't seen work out yet or be interviewed or even play in his first NFL game. Every QB was the potential to be a bust, and also a star. Its just what you make out of that potential. You can't label that person a bust until he actually has time to work with what he is given.

ya see, that's the whole point. i'm looking at him as a player and individual and the history of other QB's like him and he projects to be a bust. PROJECTS.

 

[Lucky]

I'm not sure why people are so concerned about kastofsna's opinion. He's made his case, let the record stand for itself. No one gets it right on every player. No one.

BTW, here's what Pete Carroll said in regards to who his former assistant, new Raider head coach Lane Kiffen, might take with the first pick:

Carroll hinted at who he expects the Raiders to select with the first pick of the NFL Draft. He said that Kiffin prefers a vertical passing offense that suits LSU quarterback JaMarcus Russell better than Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn.

"The kid from LSU is exactly what they're looking for," Carroll said, "more so than the kid from Notre Dame."

 

[beerlover]

Of all the positions in football QB is the hardest by far to grade, I doubt anyone on this board is capable or has the ability to PROJECT how well a player will do in the league otherwise they would be working for some NFL team right now

 

[kastofsna]

I'm not sure why people are so concerned about kastofsna's opinion. He's made his case, let the record stand for itself. No one gets it right on every player. No one.

BTW, here's what Pete Carroll said in regards to who his former assistant, new Raider head coach Lane Kiffen, might take with the first pick:

kiffin has about as much of a say in who the raiders pick as you or i do.

 

[Lucky]

kiffin has about as much of a say in who the raiders pick as you or i do.

And Al Davis doesn't favor a vertical passing game? The reason he brought Kiffen in was to tutor a young QB. That's pretty obvious to most.

 

[kastofsna]

And Al Davis doesn't favor a vertical passing game? The reason he brought Kiffen in was to tutor a young QB. That's pretty obvious to most.

and they already have that young QB.

there's nothing "obvious" about this hire. the only thing that's "obvious" is the way al davis has done things for 40+ years. JUST WIN, BABY. not JUST REBUILD, BABY.

 

[Kaiser Toro]

Will someone please take the literal shovel out of his virtual hands.

 

[Texian]

kiffin has about as much of a say in who the raiders pick as you or i do.

I think the pick has already been decided and they picked Kiffin to go with the pick.

 

[kastofsna]

yep, kiffin will do great with calvin johnson.

 

[Second Honeymoon]

Ryan Leaf. Tim Couch. Akili Smith. Andre Ware. Jeff George. Heath Shuler.

Some big name busts in recent NFL history. Lots of pre-draft buzz, created by some big games in college, some impressive workouts, but mostly just hype.

Strong arms, but not the greatest decision-makers. Quickly learned a simplified college offense, but struggled with a complicated pro offense with huge playbooks and a lot more reads.

The biggest thing they all have in common: no work ethic. Just not willing to put in the work needed to become the franchise player they were thought to one day become. Some of these guys didn't have the best work ethic just because of their personalities. Leaf and Couch were pretty aloof guys, and Smith had some problems there, too. You CAN'T succeed at the next level if you think you can get away with some of the things you do in college, simple as that. Then you have guys like Shuler who combined all of that with the fact that he held out for his entire initial training camp. That's not going to end well.

Onto JaMarcus Russell. He fits the mold. Almost perfectly. Strong arm, but not the best decisions on the field. Some good games throughout his career, but nothing spectacular. No one even considered him a top prospect till one game against a very weak Notre Dame defense, a game where he had several questionable throws, including an interception thrown into triple coverage. His work ethic has been questioned for a while now, as well as his general non-chalant attitude towards the team. When asked who he wants to play for, he said "Whoever picks first and whoever pays the most." Not exactly what you'd want to hear from a potential franchise QB.

I liked Vince Young as a prospect a lot more than Russell. And a lot of you know my feelings on Young pre-draft last year. I've never seen a more obvious QB bust in my life.

Please add David Carr to that list of prototypical busts...he is the prototype of prototypical busts. No list of busts can be complete without him on the list.

 

[kastofsna]

Please add David Carr to that list of prototypical busts...he is the prototype of prototypical busts. No list of busts can be complete without him on the list.

i dunno, he doesn't have that "weird" personality thing. i.e. yelling at the media or fans or getting caught doing weird things at 3 in the morning. he's just a bust, lol.

 

[Huge]

of course it's delirious, and of course he didn't say that. he said the exact opposite in fact, that they WERE scramblers UNTIL they played at a high enough level to win a super bowl. those are the facts.

Actually, the facts are the Elway had 50 rushes the season he won his first Super Bowl. That's only 16 fewer then his career high for a season and 2 more than what he averaged each season for his career.

Honestly though, I share kastofsna's opinion about Russell. I'm a fan of the guy and like watching him play. But I just don't see him making it in this league. Especially if he goes to a team like Oakland.

'Course, I also feel the same way about Brady Quinn. So we can go back to disagreeing about most things.

 

[Dr. Toro]

Kast, I respect your opinion and your conviction... but I'm not sure how objectively you're willing to re-asess your own views. You've been talking about Al refusing to draft a QB in the first, about his insistence on never rebuilding... but just take a stroll with me down logic lane:

The Raiders have a decent WR corps with Moss (if he cares), Curry, and Porter (if he's behaving). Rookie WRs generally take a full year or two to start producing to potential... Moss was an exception, CJ may be an exception. Of the top NFL receivers right now, few of them had the rookie success that is expected of #1 picks. These guys took a while to start ballin like All-Pros.

Chad Johnson: Year 2
Marvin Harrison: Year 4
Reggie Wayne: Year 4
Roy Williams: Year 3
Donald Driver: Year 4
Lee Evans: Year 3
Anquan Boldin: Rookie year
Torry Holt: Year 2
TO: Year 3
Steve Smith: Year 3
Andre Johnson: Rookie year
Larry Fitzgerald: Year 2

Now I know CJ is a better prospect than all these guys (Williams, Holt, Fitzgerald, and Johnson are close) but Colston (projected TE) and Boldin (converted QB) were the most productive rookie receivers in recent memory and few people expected anything out of them.

Clearly, QB talent is a MUCH bigger concern than WR play for the Raiders. It's also highly probable that Russell throwing to Moss, Porter, Curry, and/or a 2nd rounder would be MUCH more productive than Andrew Walter throwing to CJ and whoever else stays around. So if all Davis wants is immediate production... why not Russell? See where I'm going?

Along the same lines... you've got some bird in your ear, telling you Russell is lazy. Yet there are a number of people in the know refuting this... maybe he looks lazy on tape... maybe things just come easy... the bottom line is the guy has a monster arm, quick release, and enormous size. He put up fantastic numbers in the SEC, regardless of what you think of ND. Dude is a beast... for him to be a bust, he needs to be even lazier than Vick... there's no way you know that for a fact.

Edit: Russell is out in Arizona with Percy Knox training for the draft.

 

[Texan_Aggie222]

ya see, that's the whole point. i'm looking at him as a player and individual and the history of other QB's like him and he projects to be a bust. PROJECTS.

Like Daunte Culpepper? Disregarding his recent problem with injuries, I think he is a pretty decent QB at the least, but thats just my opinion..........

 

[sgntxnfn]

Oops, looking back i kinda over-reacted about the difference in opinion.

 

[Maddict5]

Ryan Leaf. Tim Couch. Akili Smith. Andre Ware. Jeff George. Heath Shuler.

Some big name busts in recent NFL history. Lots of pre-draft buzz, created by some big games in college, some impressive workouts, but mostly just hype.

Strong arms, but not the greatest decision-makers. Quickly learned a simplified college offense, but struggled with a complicated pro offense with huge playbooks and a lot more reads.

The biggest thing they all have in common: no work ethic. Just not willing to put in the work needed to become the franchise player they were thought to one day become. Some of these guys didn't have the best work ethic just because of their personalities. Leaf and Couch were pretty aloof guys, and Smith had some problems there, too. You CAN'T succeed at the next level if you think you can get away with some of the things you do in college, simple as that. Then you have guys like Shuler who combined all of that with the fact that he held out for his entire initial training camp. That's not going to end well.

Onto JaMarcus Russell. He fits the mold. Almost perfectly. Strong arm, but not the best decisions on the field. Some good games throughout his career, but nothing spectacular. No one even considered him a top prospect till one game against a very weak Notre Dame defense, a game where he had several questionable throws, including an interception thrown into triple coverage. His work ethic has been questioned for a while now, as well as his general non-chalant attitude towards the team. When asked who he wants to play for, he said "Whoever picks first and whoever pays the most." Not exactly what you'd want to hear from a potential franchise QB.

I liked Vince Young as a prospect a lot more than Russell. And a lot of you know my feelings on Young pre-draft last year. I've never seen a more obvious QB bust in my life.

things that go BUMP in the night.....

tried to give you rep but couldnt..... nailed it