If McNair doesn't do something tomorrow he's a fool.

[Kaiser Toro]

Anyone in favor of keeping Capers should be forced to sit in his lockerroom so they can hear the same garbage before, during and after the game. When Keeshawn Johnson departed from Tampa Bay he exposed Chucky as being a slickster, well Capers is in the same boat only he is a so called NICE slickster. All yall fans that followed the Oilers for years should of known 4 years ago Capers was not a good coach. Why yall getting mad now. You got took by a SLICKSTER!!

Dude there is at least five other threads talking about the Slickster theory. Mods can we please purge, er, merge.

 

[Nighthawk]

You only make a midseason move if you have someone in-house that is a better choice.

Usually the fire Capers/Casserly immediately point of view start looks a little silly when people say who they would like to be the interim guys. And then it makes you say, yeah right.

This is nonsense. Nobody wants an inside guy to be anything but a holder of the keys, maybe somebody who might want to stay on as a position coach or something.

You fire now so as not to have to ***** foot around playing like Capers and Casserly and the rest of the Sorry Bunch have a chance in hell of staying on. You fire now to get a headstart on the future. You fire now because it's the honorable and straight up thing to do. You fire now because you declare in public that you're going another direction and you want to get started.

Nobody thinks you could HIRE until after the season (unless you got lucky with JJ, and even that would be, at best, done now, effective after the season), but it's painful and wasteful to prance around AS IF CAPERS AND CASSERLY were doing fine or COULD MAKE A COME BACK.

Because it's best for the team, the town, the fans, prospective coaches, the future of the franchise.

 

[Nighthawk]

Right now, we know that Palmer, Capers, and Fangio are the architects of the abomination we see on the field right now. You remove them all from the picture and install Marciano as HC, Hoke as DC, and leave Pendry as OC (as much as I feel he is just another problem).

And Casserly.

It's a ceremony, a public display, an acknowledgement of a team going in a new direction, a fresh start, something to care about for all of us together, something to invest in, a future.

Right now we're looking at a long stretch of meaningless games with a staff nobody cares about and players that are waiting to find out what their future might be.

Short of firing Capers and Casserly five weeks ago, firing them this week is the best thing McNair could do for his franchise.

 

[billtxus]

First of all, as has been stated, you dont fire GMs mid season ( the replacement wont be available until after the season), and firing Dom probably wouldn't accomplish anything now either.

Second do you realize who hired the current GM and coach? Do we know that he will do better next time? Do we know that he spends enough on assistant coaches ( I doubt it). In short just because Bob is a billionaire and a nice guy, does he know how to run a football team?

 

[barzilla]

It is very likely that if he doesn't hire JJ, McNair will at least consult with him to see who we should hire. Listen, I thought Casserly was a decent hire when we hired him. As far as Capers was concerned, I'm sure he was bowed over by his experience with the Panthers. Now, we just hire a GM and football coach without worrying about the expansion angle. Personally, I see any top notch football coach demanding that his assistants get paid the going rate. If we don't get a top notch coach then we know McNair is working on the cheap.

 

[Texans_Chick]

It is very likely that if he doesn't hire JJ, McNair will at least consult with him to see who we should hire. Listen, I thought Casserly was a decent hire when we hired him. As far as Capers was concerned, I'm sure he was bowed over by his experience with the Panthers. Now, we just hire a GM and football coach without worrying about the expansion angle. Personally, I see any top notch football coach demanding that his assistants get paid the going rate. If we don't get a top notch coach then we know McNair is working on the cheap.

If we don't get a top notch coach, it may be that they don't want the challenge of rebuilding.

Easy to be Phil Jackson, supergenius, when you have MJ or Shaq playing with you. Harder when those players go away.

We are going to have to overpay anyone we get, and there are some folks that just won't want to deal with our situation at any salary.

The same thing goes with free agents--hard to convince people to come to a losing situation.

The best things we have going for us are as follows:

1. Great facilities. Largest weightroom in the league. The practice bubble stuff etc.

2. Diverse urban city but places nearby that are country.

3. No state income tax.

4. Less expensive housing than some places.

5. An owner who is charming. (aka the anti-Bud).



Whoever we get has to be someone that appreciates challenges and wants to create his own traditions and has the belief that they can go into any situation and succeed. Not all coaches are like that. If you are a badass coach, you can cherry pick whatever job you really want. It is very likely that coaches could use the Texans job as a way to get paid more at their present jobs.

My preference is to get an established coach who will not be trying to learn up his first NFL head coaching job. Someone who can get free agents to want to play for him. There are any number of people who fit in that category but I can't think of too many of those folks who would want to come to our situation.

That's where the wheelbarrow full of money comes in--but even then, for some of those folks, that might not work either.

 

[billtxus]

I could understand firing Dom now in the context of looking at more of the players to figure out what they have. Right now Dom is trying to save his job, so he cares less about next year, and is desperately trying to win a few games. Realistically they season is over. So why not play Ragone and Banks a couple of games. We would find out more about Ragone, find out more about whether Carr is worth spending $8million on. Dom doesn't even put in Banks or Ragone for mop-up, its Carr every play.

The same is true for some of the other positions. Dom said if Buchanon is able to play Sunday he would start. Give me a break. I'd start Sanders to see what he could do. If the guy could tackle I'd leave him in for a while. The team might as well see what it has. No way Dom will do this.

You pretty much have to keep Charlie until the end of the year because there is no point having an interim GM. I think McNair is putting all this off because he doesn't know yet what he wants to do. I'm sure he is puzzled as we all are, how the same group that brought us three decent first years, has now failed so badly in the fourth.

 

[barzilla]

Texanschic,

That is true, but I think the comparison with the Phil Jacksons is not as apt because teams can be turned around in the NFL in two years if that. I agree it will take money, but I think some might demand control of player personnel as well. At least you might get a JJ saying he won't come back unless he has total control or have Casserly gone at the very least. Coach-GMs have had mixed results in the NFL, but as least when it goes wrong you know who to blame.

 

[infantrycak]

McNair won't do anything because he is not a good owner. His bark is bigger than his bite.

What have been McNair's failures? Not hindsight second guessing, but at the time should have known better moves.

 

[Ryan]

To ask a question, how do you star a thread on this message board?

 

[infantrycak]

To ask a question, how do you star a thread on this message board?

When you are in a thread, look to the upper right and you will see an option to Rate this Thread or something similar.

 

[Ryan]

yes but i cant start my own thread and i don't know how to do so.

 

[infantrycak]

yes but i cant start my own thread and i don't know how to do so.

Sorry, your post said star, not start so I thought you were trying to rate a thread. When you are looking at a forum look to the upper left of the thread list and there is a new thread button. It looks like a football and says new in the middle.

 

[Hervoyel]

McNair won't do anything because he is not a good owner. His bark is bigger than his bite.

That is maybe the most laughable thing I've read on this board in four years. Some of the things said back on the nfl2002 board were funnier but then the troll to poster ratio was much higher then.

I knew it wouldn't be long before the griping would go up to McNair.

 

[Texans_Chick]

Texanschic,

That is true, but I think the comparison with the Phil Jacksons is not as apt because teams can be turned around in the NFL in two years if that. I agree it will take money, but I think some might demand control of player personnel as well. At least you might get a JJ saying he won't come back unless he has total control or have Casserly gone at the very least. Coach-GMs have had mixed results in the NFL, but as least when it goes wrong you know who to blame.

True, turnarounds can happen fast in the NFL--what I am hoping for. I was just using the Phil Jackson example as just the most obvious situation of a guy who only has gone to the most cherry picked situations (except this year).

JJ has had all sorts of opportunities to come back to the NFL and has chosen not to. It will surprise the heck out of me if he comes here, whether he is offered the GM position or not.

I just think that we will have a hard time attracting a superstar experienced coach to our situation. It is more likely that those guys would use the Texans job as a way to make more money from their current situation or from another job.

I think that it is more likely we get a hungry for his first head coaching job kinda guy--sometimes that works, and sometimes that goes really wrong. It is not my first choice, but we may not get the pick of coaches because even though we are not an expansion team, our situation is more difficult than ones where the team has been around longer. There is no history of success. There is no loser team scheduling like they used to have. Teams keep their key free agents better than in the past because they have got more used to the cap.

I am just not very optimistic about a guy trying to figure out how to be a head coach for the first time whilst trying to figure out how to fix all our problems.

A history of success really does help a down team improve. A small example. Each year I go to the Texans Fashion Show. From what I understand, it is a charity thing that every NFL team does because it is required by league. (BTW, if you want to see and talk to the players, this is a best event to go to for the entire year because all the top players are in it, and they often visit with fans before and after the event).

Anyhow, I was talking to a player who came from a different team and he said he participated in his previous team's fashion show before. He was almost wistful in describing the other team's event, talking about how much larger it was than ours.

Of course, his previous team had been around for a long time and had success and a huge fan base, and the Texans event has gotten a little bigger over the years but is still pretty much mostly corporate sponsor types and a few fans. Who wants to go to a place without a huge hardcore base? The Texans have support, but it ain't very deep.

I guess my not very well described point is something that I just sense--that no matter how good or bad our fans are, there is no substitute for a history and tradition to build upon. Mack Brown understood that with Texas--reaching out to Darrell Royal first thing upon getting the job.

Hmmm, I don't think I am really saying what I mean on this. Let's just say that I will be more surprised for us to get the Uber coach that fixes all of our problems than I will for us to continue not doing well for a while. Cuz it ain't easy building from scratch.

 

[Texans_Chick]

Hey, if you look back...I've been griping about McNair since week 4. The longer he goes without firing Capers & Co., the more and more I think he is a bad owner. He talks like he is concerned about the team, but yet he hasn't taken any actions towards proving he's concerned. The owner of the Vikings has put more of an effort into fixing his team than McNair into his team, and I don't believe we have any sex-boat cruises going, do we? Like I said, his bark is bigger than his bite.

So the litmus test of whether he is a good owner is whether he decides to fire his coaches in the middle of the season without having a better replacement?

He did fire Palmer.

You don't know what actions he has taken because it may be some of those are best done behind the scenes.


Here is some basic reading material about bad owners. Houston has had its fair share, but Mr McNair's name should not be said in the same breath with theirs:

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/list/owners/010710.html

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/2001/0710/1224543.html


Bob McNair rates on my list of favorite people of all time. For obvious reasons.

 

[outofhnd]

Unless th future coach of the Texans is sitting on a couch somewhere eating Doritos whats the point of fireing him that means we give the job in the interim to Pendry, Fangio or another one of our assistants...

Personally I don't get whats happening according to everything I hear this team executes flawlessly in practice, but in games just crumbles... I put a lot of that on Palmer though... Its hard to break old habits especially bad habits..I think Palmers offense that he had the offense use is like making a 7 year old read war and peace... He seems to designed by thinking about what the defense would throw at him and failed to think bout how complex it would be for an offenseive player to pick up on it.

Keep in mind we are still running option routes on pass playsthat means Carr and the Rec. must see and recognize the same thing.. Which to me is just Horrific with the lack of protection... Not to mention you can practice but you can never have that timing between QB and WR with an offense like this because you first gotta think which way is he goin to go?

Pendry is making strides I know you laugh at that statement, but both turnovers and sacks have gone down since he took over the whole offense... However, we still do not have enough talent on offense mainly on the line... We do not have a game breaking tight end because he has to stay in and block on passing downs.. M. Rivers seems to be gettin a little better, but still doesnt seem to have a full grasp of the offense. Carr is starting to throw to different rec. than Johnson.. Bradford however I think will not be back next year, dont get me wrong he has improved some but he still is not the consistent rec. threat we need to take the double coverage off AJ. So we need OT, TE, #2 WR, thats 3 things right there not including picking up some quality depth.

Defensively Fangio is a man trying to save his job.. ever since seattle ive seen more blitz packages than I can ever remember seeing since this team took the field.. We need another DT/DE to have a good rotation. TJ is starting to really get off blocks better lately. I think our line gets wore out o quickly. We Need Some beter play from our LB core.. Definately need to look at getting another ILB or moving to a 4-3 scheme.. Babin does well against the run but doesnt shed blockers and get to the QB like he did in college on pass plays... Greenwood makes tackles however he is overly aggressive and out of position on the tackles so they usually occur 5 yards down he field. The Wong ILB experiment was an absolute failure... If capers is back next year... Move Orr to the inside as he seems o have a nose for the ball and does well just cannot beat the block... Peek seems to have the same problem as greenwood he gets pressure on passing plays but seems to try and get around a blocker on running plays causing yard gains.. he needs to take the blocker on and push him and fight thru him that way the back has to either cut back or string it out farther... Secondary speaking Robinson is our star.. Buchanon can definately take this time to go over the play book and figure out when he does and does not have safety help. Louis Sanders is ok but I havent seen enough of him he looks like a corner that is big and physical but looks kinda slow... Faggin is a pure nickel back as he doesnt look back and WR still seem to catch the ball on him... no matter what.. Safeties, we need to find a replacement for Coleman, as well as depth, Our strong safeties are ok CC Brown needs to put some muscle on and tackle better. Id like to see more physicality from them...

SO Offense we need - OT, TE, WR, stay with a group of 5 lineman.. and quality depth..

Defense - DT, 2 FS, Depth CB, Maybe another ILB or swap Orr for Wong and have babin just rotate in and out with Wong on the weak side.

If we get a new staff... I however would like to see this team line up in a 4-3 Defense

LDE - TJ - Babin
LDT - Seth Payne, Iaone,
RDT - Robaire Smith, Deloach or draft
RDE - Gary Walker, FA or Draft

LOLB - Wong, Orr, Anderson if Wong is gone.
MLB - Greenwood, Polk, Chamberlain
ROLB - Peek, Anderson,

LCB - D. Robinson, L. Sanders
RCB - Buchanon, D. Faggins
NB - D. faggins, J. Bell
SS - Earl, Brown
FS - Please draft someone, Coleman if we have to...

 

[barzilla]

I'm not sure if Buchanon is a viable corner at this point. No, I'm sure. He's not. The rest of the roster looks okay, but it's the same defense just reshuffled. We need playmakers.

I'm thinking more and more that Palmer was scapegoated out of there. Yeah, a lot was made of him not believing in maxprotect. What has it brought us? 1.2 second drops and three yard outs to our wide outs and a bunch of dump passes. Not addressing the OL was criminal, but giving into the hysteria was just as criminal. Yes, David Carr will survive the year, but we now have the most predictable offense in football (not the NFL, all of football).

 

[Runner]

Pendry is making strides I know you laugh at that statement, but both turnovers and sacks have gone down since he took over the whole offense...

To make a reducto ad absurdum argument, Pendry could vastly improve these offensive metrics by never passing the ball. Sacks would be completely eliminated and turnovers would be drastically reduced. No sacks, few turnovers - is that progress?

 

[ATX_Texan]

Personally I don't get whats happening according to everything I hear this team executes flawlessly in practice, but in games just crumbles... I put a lot of that on Palmer though... Its hard to break old habits especially bad habits..I think Palmers offense that he had the offense use is like making a 7 year old read war and peace... He seems to designed by thinking about what the defense would throw at him and failed to think bout how complex it would be for an offenseive player to pick up on it.

If Palmer was the only problem, why has the offense continued to regress since he was removed? How do we know they are "executing flawlessly" in practice? If they have bad habits in the game would not these same problems appear in practice? I believe you are seeing an example of the Capers’ offensive philosophy in action. He has this crazy notion that if his team executes flawlessly, the other team will not be able to stop him (which only works if you are the Steelers of the 70’s or the Cowboys of the 90’). The sad part is that the players are so undisciplined that bone headed penalties and mistakes are instead the norm. On top of that, you have an offense that is so predictable and unimaginative that any defensive coordinator can easily defeat it. Finally, you have a coaching staff that has demonstrated no ability to make any sort of adjustments to counteract what the opposing team is doing. Put this mess all together and you the so-called offense we are forced to endure week after week. Yet people here are more than willing to let Capers hang on to the end of the year out of fear that somehow the resulting anarchy from firing him will be so much worse than the current product.

 

[Bobo]

This team is gone, signed out, in the cloakroom, returned to sender, etc. No way to accept for another day the poor coaching and leadership here. McNair should fire Capers AND Casserly tomorrow and put Almost Anybody in as caretaker coach. Then he should declare the search for the new coach and GM open and pray to God Jimmy Johnson will meet with him. If Jimmy won't take the job, then maybe he can help McNair figure out who might.

Are you talking about the Texans, the Pittsburgh Steelers a couple of years ago or the SD Chargers of a couple years ago?

 

[Bobo]

McNair should fire Capers AND Casserly tomorrow and put Almost Anybody in as caretaker coach. Then he should declare the search for the new coach and GM open and pray to God Jimmy Johnson will meet with him. If Jimmy won't take the job, then maybe he can help McNair figure out who might.

Thank goodness he WASN'T a fool and didn't take your advice! As for Jimmy Johnson, that would be the stupidest thing he could do. He was run out of Miami for a reason, you know.

 

[CowboysTexansFan]

Jimmy Johnson wasn't run out of town in Miami. He quit for personal reasons, including the then recent death of his mother. He didn't win a Super Bowl in Miami, but his teams were in the playoffs most years.

He would be a great choice to replace the incompetent yokels we have in the GM and Head Coach positions right now.

 

[Bobo]

Jimmy Johnson wasn't run out of town in Miami. He quit for personal reasons, including the then recent death of his mother. He didn't win a Super Bowl in Miami, but his teams were in the playoffs most years.

He would be a great choice to replace the incompetent yokels we have in the GM and Head Coach positions right now.

His teams were crushed and embarrassed in the first round in Miami. He proved in Miami that he couldn't bring the magic of Dallas to Florida because Jones stayed in Dallas. If Johnson took over in Houston, it would be an unmitigated disaster. Guaranteed.

 

[CowboysTexansFan]

Yeah, right.

Johnson's teams may have gotten whipped in the playoffs, but we get whipped by the Chiefs and Titans at HOME in the regular season and are 1-9 right now. Anyone with a brain realizes that Johnson was the man who built the great Cowboys teams of the 1990's, not Jerry Jones. Look at what happened in Dallas after Johnson left and before Jones hired Parcells.

Johnson would get the Texans into the playoffs within 3 years. I'll take it.

 

[Texans Horror]

If Palmer was the only problem, why has the offense continued to regress since he was removed?

I'd argue that the problems started with the front line, which was being coached by Pendry. The line showed progress, but was eventually stunted by Pendry. Making him OC only made matters worse. Taking him and Capers out of the picture would most likely hinder the team's ability to win (not saying that Capers is doing any better). Removing the staff now, IMO, would at least send a message to the team that teh front office recognizes how screwed up everything is.

 

[Texans Horror]

Yeah, right.

Johnson's teams may have gotten whipped in the playoffs, but we get whipped by the Chiefs and Titans at HOME in the regular season and are 1-9 right now. Anyone with a brain realizes that Johnson was the man who built the great Cowboys teams of the 1990's, not Jerry Jones. Look at what happened in Dallas after Johnson left and before Jones hired Parcells.

Johnson would get the Texans into the playoffs within 3 years. I'll take it.

At this point, I'd be willing to take anybody as new HC next year. Is anybody's Junior High coach available?

 

[feebleminded]

I think Pendry sabotaged Palmer, giving him a ****** o-line and making it look as though it was Palmer's fault.

So they could all get fired???????????????????

 

[touttail]

God I would hate to watch , Faggins, Coleman, and PBurn for another season! They are pathetic!

bobby 119C:brickwall

 

[Hervoyel]

Thank goodness he WASN'T a fool and didn't take your advice! As for Jimmy Johnson, that would be the stupidest thing he could do. He was run out of Miami for a reason, you know.

I think you should research the circumstances surrounding Jimmy Johnson's time as coach of the Miami Dolphins and his leaving the job before you comment again on it.

Just a suggestion.

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

Jimmy Johnson got a big boost from the Herschel Walker trade . He built a fine team and probably got shafted out of his place in history by Jerry Jones .
With the Dolphins he had to work around a Dolphin icon in Marino . His draft picks did'nt pan out as well either ... Darrel Gardner 1st rd instead of Leon Lett 5th rd ?.

 

[bckey]

I think JJ or whoever takes over the Texans can have a sweet looking draft in 06 with a little manuvering. We already have a high 3rd rounder from New Orleans. We could trade down in the first and pick up at least 2 more high draft picks.

Someone that nobody has mentioned in this draft is Jimmy Williams. If we can somehow land an additional first round pick trading down then we could possibly draft Jimmy Williams and then take the best LT on the board after that. The Texans would come out of the first round set at CB for years (assuming Williams pans out in the pros) and fix a big problem on the OL too. The Texans would still have at least 3 picks (1 in the 2nd 2 in the 3rd) to fill needs at LB, TE, DL, and OL.

By trading down a little the Texans save on the cap by avoiding paying a huge salary to a #1 pick and fill more needs. If the Texans trade down I don't see them taking D'Brick because of the depth of LT in this draft. If they stay in their slot I think they will take D'Brick. Trading down seems like the best option for rebuilding a team.

 

[Kaiser Toro]

I think JJ or whoever takes over the Texans can have a sweet looking draft in 06 with a little manuvering. We already have a high 3rd rounder from New Orleans. We could trade down in the first and pick up at least 2 more high draft picks.

Someone that nobody has mentioned in this draft is Jimmy Williams. If we can somehow land an additional first round pick trading down then we could possibly draft Jimmy Williams and then take the best LT on the board after that. The Texans would come out of the first round set at CB for years (assuming Williams pans out in the pros) and fix a big problem on the OL too. The Texans would still have at least 3 picks (1 in the 2nd 2 in the 3rd) to fill needs at LB, TE, DL, and OL.

By trading down a little the Texans save on the cap by avoiding paying a huge salary to a #1 pick and fill more needs. If the Texans trade down I don't see them taking D'Brick because of the depth of LT in this draft. If they stay in their slot I think they will take D'Brick. Trading down seems like the best option for rebuilding a team.

This is a sound draft strategy and rationale.