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Front Office/HC/OC/DC who do you want?

Second Honeymoon said:
Holmgren and Cowher would be longshots. That's a given. Shanahan wont happen for obvious reasons.

Of the other proven winning candidates, that leaves Schotty and Gruden. Schotty would bring some quality coaches with him but is a little long in the tooth for me. Ask Bucs fan if they want Gruden back?

For some reason there seems to be this Gruden hatred but what has the guy done besides win? He took BRAD JOHNSON!! to the Super Bowl and WON IT!! Dungy couldn't do it and Gruden did. He also helped build and mold a Raiders team into a Super Bowl contender and once he left.....they went to hell. He leaves the Bucs this year, and they go from playoff contender to #1 overall pick contender.

Gruden would bring proven coaching staff that has already worked under him and he would bring some of the fire and passion and intensity that this current team so sorely lacks.

We would be lucky to have Jon Gruden as our coach. He is the best guy that we would have a realistic chance at grabbing.

Bring Bruce Allen as his GM partner, and fill in OC and DC with some good coaching.

And while you are at it, try luring a real difference maker to our team in Free Agency.
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I agree 100% on Gruden. People say he won with Dungy's team, but I didn't see Dungy win with that team. Dungy won with Peyton vs Grossman. I'll take Gruden. I wouldn't mind Schotty's son if Marty is on staff.
 
Second Honeymoon said:
so if the Texans hired a Super Bowl winning coach, you would be so angry that you would no longer be a fan because 'John Gruden Sucks'....Such loyalty is to be truly admired. gg

You are basically parroting what ESPN said about the reason he was fired when it was first reported. It caught people by surprise and no one knew the real reason so people built up the fact that he had problems with his players such as Keyshawn and he had an injury/surgery beef with Simeon Rice. Both guys not exactly team oriented. ESPN had to come up with a reason other than 'He ticked off the Glazers (owners) by asking to improve the team and coaching staff and the Glazers couldn't really afford to because they were so leveraged with buying Manchester United, the #1 sports franchise in the world.'

Gruden is an excellent coach with a proven track record and contrary to sheeple opinion, he gets along with his players very well. The players he ever had a problem with were locker room cancers like Keyshawn Johnson. Ask true gamers like Sapp and Brooks and Lynch and Barber and Alstott what they thought of Gruden.

You bring Gruden in and ask him to keep Bruce Matthews, Marciano, and Kollar (who looks to have found even a little something with Okoye). Let Gruden decide the rest of the staff's fate.
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Oh Vomit!!!!!! Gruden is a POS and there were plenty of other players than the ones you mentioned that had a beef with him. Like michael clayton and Chris Simms and Jeff Garcia to name a few. Also youre right he does have a proven track record, of mediocrity.

Hers a few tidbits about youre boy wonder coach to chew on.

“Well, Gruden has never groomed a young quarterback,” Sapp acknowledged. “He’s turned some into head cases.”
Exactly. The former Buccaneer QB I talked to on Saturday made the same point. His contention was that Gruden is a perfect fit for a veteran team, not a young rebuilding club.

Gruden, who was 39 when the Bucs beat Oakland in the Super Bowl, went 60-57 in seven seasons, including a 3-2 mark in the playoffs.

Gruden was a rising star when he was hired seven years ago to take over a team built by Tony Dungy, and led it to the Super Bowl win. But Gruden guided the Bucs to the postseason only two more times after becoming the youngest coach to win the NFL title in January 2003.
That wasn't nearly enough for the sons of owner Malcolm Glazer, who took their time before deciding they had seen enough of aging quarterbacks, mediocre drafts and a coach and general manager who often pinned the blame for poor finishes on injuries.

The 9-7 record this season gave Gruden consecutive winning records for the first time since arriving in Tampa Bay, yet still left the Bucs out of the playoffs for the fourth time in six years and prompted the Glazer family to reevaluate the direction of the franchise.
But since going 15-4, including the Super Bowl, in his first season with the Bucs, Gruden went 45-53 and made quick exits from the playoffs at home after winning division titles in 2005 and 2007.
This season's collapse continued a trend of playing poorly late in the year. Since winning the Super Bowl, Tampa Bay is 9-17 in the month of December.

For all the talk of Gruden being an offensive genius, the best finished the Bucs had in his tenure was 18th in scoring offense (three times). The average finish was 21st. Under conservative, play-it-safe Tony Dungy? 20th. Aside from one season, Gruden brought nothing of value to the Buccaneers franchise.

Gruden won a Superbowl with the Bucs in 2003 beating the Raiders (remember them?), but has since had a string of relatively mediocre seasons, including a collapse this year after starting 9-3. Nonetheless, his 9-7 record this year made for his first stretch of consecutive winning seasons since arriving in Tampa Bay.

Jon Gruden won a Super Bowl in his first season in Tampa Bay. In the next six seasons the Buccaneers went 0-2 in playoff games, missed the postseason four times and lost their final four games this season - including a loss at home to the Raiders in the season finale - to miss the playoffs after starting 9-3.

Gruden was 57-55 and was a favorite of television cameras, who captured his outsize facial expressions and made him a star with the nickname Chucky after the horror movie doll. But his recent playoff failures almost certainly figured heavily in the decision by the Glazer family, who famously fired Tony Dungy even though he took the Bucs to the playoffs four out of his last five seasons in Tampa.
When Dungy failed to win a Super Bowl, Gruden was brought in and promptly won with a team that was largely Dungy’s creation. Gruden was a disciple of Mike Holmgren, and his tenure was marked by a nearly constant obsession with the quarterback position. The Bucs won the 2002 Super Bowl with Brad Johnson, a journeyman who did not delight Gruden and sent him on a quest for a quarterback more like the ones he worked with as an assistant earlier in his career: Steve Young and Brett Favre.

Gruden cycled through, among others, Brian Griese, Chris Simms, Bruce Gradkowski and Jeff Garcia, annoying all of them at some point with his wandering eye. Despite Gruden’s reputation as an offensive guru - and particularly as a developer of quarterbacks - the Bucs never found consistency in the offense, relying almost exclusively on the defense for success.

In the wake of Jon Gruden's somewhat surprising exit from Tampa Bay, there have been quite a few reactions from players and analysts across the league. Mike Florio of Pro Football Talk cites a league source that claims several veteran players were fed up with Gruden being somewhat of a "turncoat," and telling guys one thing, and then going and doing the opposite.

Wide receiver Michael Clayton, for example, offered up this comment, courtesy of the St. Petersburg Times:
"How do you build a championship team with all the inconsistency? You have to do it the right way. I've always been a person who feels like you reap what you sow. You have to treat people fairly.'' When asked what he wished Gruden would've done differently, Clayton said, "It's about showing more confidence in your players. He was kind of a turncoat. He'd tell you one thing and then do something else.''

Some of the harshest criticism came from analysts Pete Prisco and Shaun King. Prisco offered up some scathing criticism of Gruden's revolving door at the quarterback position, which never really seemed to be settled this season.

"Jon Gruden never understood that it's the quarterbacks that drive NFL teams. And it cost him his job. Gruden was arrogant enough as a coach to think his schemes could overcome the lack of a quality quarterback."

Ouch. Tampa Bay entered the season with Jeff Garcia as its starting quarterback, and after he struggled in the season opener -- and also suffered an injury, which seemed to be open to debate as to how serious it really was -- Gruden turned the job over to Brian Griese for four weeks. After Griese struggled in his four starts -- and also suffered an injury -- the job became Garcia's again as the Buccaneers roared out to a 9-3 start, entering a Monday night contest in Carolina in control of their own destiny for a division title.

And that's where things started to go wrong.

From that point on, the Buccaneers' rock-solid defense turned into a gaping hole of futility, as they dropped their final four games of the regular season, including a Week 17 game, at home, against Gruden's former team, the Oakland Raiders.

Shaun King, currently an analyst with ESPN and a former Tampa Bay quarterback, said he wasn't surprised by Gruden's firing, and that it may have come a year or two too late.

I dont know why people like this guy. Hes a jerk and other than winning a Superbowl with someone elses team has done nothing but make stupid faces to make sure he got air time on T.V.. If we hire him it will be obvious that McNair isnt intelligent enough to ever make us a winner.
 
Marcus said:
No, it's not just you, TC.

Let me ask a question to all you coach-changers? Of the 1st year coaches that have their teams on a winning record, did you ever hear of them before?

Thought so.
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marcus, the fact that you are calling for more Kubiak means that Kubiak needs to go. this wont be the first time you have been wrong and it surely wont be the last. if it were up to you, we would probably still have Carr as QB and still blaming the OL, so excuse me if your opinion is worth doo-doo re: Texans.

as for the first year coaches, people had heard of Ryan, Spagnulo, Sporano, and McDaniel. Coach Smith in Atlanta was a guy that came out of nowhere and thats about it.

if you want to keep championing losers like Kubiak and Carr, feel free to do so, but to act like everything is fine and people who want a change are off-base is just ignorant and outs you as a homer and a Kubiak fanboy.
 
mussop said:
Oh Vomit!!!!!! Gruden is a POS and there were plenty of other players than the ones you mentioned that had a beef with him. Like michael clayton and Chris Simms and Jeff Garcia to name a few. Also youre right he does have a proven track record, of mediocrity.

Hers a few tidbits about youre boy wonder coach to chew on.

“Well, Gruden has never groomed a young quarterback,” Sapp acknowledged. “He’s turned some into head cases.”
Exactly. The former Buccaneer QB I talked to on Saturday made the same point. His contention was that Gruden is a perfect fit for a veteran team, not a young rebuilding club.

Gruden, who was 39 when the Bucs beat Oakland in the Super Bowl, went 60-57 in seven seasons, including a 3-2 mark in the playoffs.

Gruden was a rising star when he was hired seven years ago to take over a team built by Tony Dungy, and led it to the Super Bowl win. But Gruden guided the Bucs to the postseason only two more times after becoming the youngest coach to win the NFL title in January 2003.
That wasn't nearly enough for the sons of owner Malcolm Glazer, who took their time before deciding they had seen enough of aging quarterbacks, mediocre drafts and a coach and general manager who often pinned the blame for poor finishes on injuries.

The 9-7 record this season gave Gruden consecutive winning records for the first time since arriving in Tampa Bay, yet still left the Bucs out of the playoffs for the fourth time in six years and prompted the Glazer family to reevaluate the direction of the franchise.
But since going 15-4, including the Super Bowl, in his first season with the Bucs, Gruden went 45-53 and made quick exits from the playoffs at home after winning division titles in 2005 and 2007.
This season's collapse continued a trend of playing poorly late in the year. Since winning the Super Bowl, Tampa Bay is 9-17 in the month of December.

For all the talk of Gruden being an offensive genius, the best finished the Bucs had in his tenure was 18th in scoring offense (three times). The average finish was 21st. Under conservative, play-it-safe Tony Dungy? 20th. Aside from one season, Gruden brought nothing of value to the Buccaneers franchise.

Gruden won a Superbowl with the Bucs in 2003 beating the Raiders (remember them?), but has since had a string of relatively mediocre seasons, including a collapse this year after starting 9-3. Nonetheless, his 9-7 record this year made for his first stretch of consecutive winning seasons since arriving in Tampa Bay.

Jon Gruden won a Super Bowl in his first season in Tampa Bay. In the next six seasons the Buccaneers went 0-2 in playoff games, missed the postseason four times and lost their final four games this season - including a loss at home to the Raiders in the season finale - to miss the playoffs after starting 9-3.

Gruden was 57-55 and was a favorite of television cameras, who captured his outsize facial expressions and made him a star with the nickname Chucky after the horror movie doll. But his recent playoff failures almost certainly figured heavily in the decision by the Glazer family, who famously fired Tony Dungy even though he took the Bucs to the playoffs four out of his last five seasons in Tampa.
When Dungy failed to win a Super Bowl, Gruden was brought in and promptly won with a team that was largely Dungy’s creation. Gruden was a disciple of Mike Holmgren, and his tenure was marked by a nearly constant obsession with the quarterback position. The Bucs won the 2002 Super Bowl with Brad Johnson, a journeyman who did not delight Gruden and sent him on a quest for a quarterback more like the ones he worked with as an assistant earlier in his career: Steve Young and Brett Favre.

Gruden cycled through, among others, Brian Griese, Chris Simms, Bruce Gradkowski and Jeff Garcia, annoying all of them at some point with his wandering eye. Despite Gruden’s reputation as an offensive guru - and particularly as a developer of quarterbacks - the Bucs never found consistency in the offense, relying almost exclusively on the defense for success.

In the wake of Jon Gruden's somewhat surprising exit from Tampa Bay, there have been quite a few reactions from players and analysts across the league. Mike Florio of Pro Football Talk cites a league source that claims several veteran players were fed up with Gruden being somewhat of a "turncoat," and telling guys one thing, and then going and doing the opposite.

Wide receiver Michael Clayton, for example, offered up this comment, courtesy of the St. Petersburg Times:
"How do you build a championship team with all the inconsistency? You have to do it the right way. I've always been a person who feels like you reap what you sow. You have to treat people fairly.'' When asked what he wished Gruden would've done differently, Clayton said, "It's about showing more confidence in your players. He was kind of a turncoat. He'd tell you one thing and then do something else.''

Some of the harshest criticism came from analysts Pete Prisco and Shaun King. Prisco offered up some scathing criticism of Gruden's revolving door at the quarterback position, which never really seemed to be settled this season.

"Jon Gruden never understood that it's the quarterbacks that drive NFL teams. And it cost him his job. Gruden was arrogant enough as a coach to think his schemes could overcome the lack of a quality quarterback."

Ouch. Tampa Bay entered the season with Jeff Garcia as its starting quarterback, and after he struggled in the season opener -- and also suffered an injury, which seemed to be open to debate as to how serious it really was -- Gruden turned the job over to Brian Griese for four weeks. After Griese struggled in his four starts -- and also suffered an injury -- the job became Garcia's again as the Buccaneers roared out to a 9-3 start, entering a Monday night contest in Carolina in control of their own destiny for a division title.

And that's where things started to go wrong.

From that point on, the Buccaneers' rock-solid defense turned into a gaping hole of futility, as they dropped their final four games of the regular season, including a Week 17 game, at home, against Gruden's former team, the Oakland Raiders.

Shaun King, currently an analyst with ESPN and a former Tampa Bay quarterback, said he wasn't surprised by Gruden's firing, and that it may have come a year or two too late.

I dont know why people like this guy. Hes a jerk and other than winning a Superbowl with someone elses team has done nothing but make stupid faces to make sure he got air time on T.V.. If we hire him it will be obvious that McNair isnt intelligent enough to ever make us a winner.
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so because Chris Simms and Jeff Garcia were upset about playing time and because a loser like Clayton didn't like Gruden we are supposed to discount all the good word from REAL players like Sapp, Brooks, Barber, and the rest?

whatever, its sounds like Gruden stole your girlfriend or something else.

But at least you were able to cut and paste someone else's opinion. very impressive skills there. its obvious to anyone with a pulse that King has an axe to grind and is obviously bitter over not being named the starter.

This article slams Gruden for not having a good QB but the guy writing the article was one of the bad QBs that Gruden had. Gruden can be blamed for trying to go on the cheap with QBs but that is because he rarely drafted early enough to get a decent QB and anytime he did have decent QB play, his teams would do well.

you sure have a lot of negative things to say about other peoples ideas and opinions yet are woefully short of your own ideas. you probably want them to keep Kubiak and re-sign him to a new contract.
 
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Second Honeymoon said:
so because Chris Simms and Jeff Garcia were upset about playing time and because a loser like Clayton didn't like Gruden we are supposed to discount all the good word from REAL players like Sapp, Brooks, Barber, and the rest?

whatever, its sounds like Gruden stole your girlfriend or something else.

But at least you were able to cut and paste someone else's opinion. very impressive skills there. its obvious to anyone with a pulse that King has an axe to grind and is obviously bitter over not being named the starter.

This article slams Gruden for not having a good QB but the guy writing the article was one of the bad QBs that Gruden had. Gruden can be blamed for trying to go on the cheap with QBs but that is because he rarely drafted early enough to get a decent QB and anytime he did have decent QB play, his teams would do well.

you sure have a lot of negative things to say about other peoples ideas and opinions yet are woefully short of your own ideas. you probably want them to keep Kubiak and re-sign him to a new contract.
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So youre stooping to personal attacts? I guess you are backed into a corner intellectually.

Chriss Simms was jerked around by Gruden and it was well documented. There were many telling facts in my skillfull cut and paste job. To bad youre man crush on Chucky wont allow to acknowlege them.

Also love the word play like when you say "because a loser like Clayton didn't like Gruden we are supposed to discount all the good word from REAL players like Sapp, Brooks, Barber, and the rest?". Thats a real talent you have there adding words real and rest to make youre stance sound better, even though it really makes youre argument look weak to intelligent posters. Rest? Care to elaborate? Im sure you wont because there are just as many players that had bad things to say about him as there were players that had good things to say.

Show me another coach that had as many players dis him after he was let go than Gruden. Bet you cant.


Here is some facts for you.

After going 15-4, including the Super Bowl with the team Dungy built, in his first season with the Bucs, Gruden went 45-53 and made quick exits from the playoffs at home. The best finish the Bucs had in his tenure was 18th in scoring offense (three times). The average finish was 21st. Under conservative, play-it-safe Tony Dungy? And this is from the offensive master mind you think is so great? You consider that an excellent coach resume? THANK GOD youre not the Owner.

Another thing, you say I have a lot of negative things to say about other peoples ideas? Look at you!

Second Honeymoon said:
marcus, the fact that you are calling for more Kubiak means that Kubiak needs to go. this wont be the first time you have been wrong and it surely wont be the last. if it were up to you, we would probably still have Carr as QB and still blaming the OL, so excuse me if your opinion is worth doo-doo re: Texans.

if you want to keep championing losers like Kubiak and Carr, feel free to do so, but to act like everything is fine and people who want a change are off-base is just ignorant and outs you as a homer and a Kubiak fanboy.
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Mm mm mm, obviously you get backed into that corner alot. If you want to keep champoining a loser like Gruden, feel free to do so, but to act like everything is fine and people who dont want that loser are off-base is just ignorant and outs you as a Chuky lover and fanboy. :clap: :clap:

Youre move!:good:
 
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