Draft Grade - Round 1 DeAndre Hopkins

[76Texan]

I had no idea you were this greedy

I guess I didn't make it clear enough.

Let say we did the trade that the Patriots did; it would give us the following picks: 52 (2nd rd), 83 (third round), 102 (fourth round), and 229 (7th round).

We also have these picks: 57 (second round), 89 (third round), 95 (third round), and five other picks.

That's a total of two (2) second rounders, three (3) third rounders and seven (7) other picks.

From 52, to move up to the middle (48) is only 4 slots.
What I mean is that we should be able to use one or two mid and/or late round picks to move up 4-8 spots in the second round, keeping intact two second rounders and three third rounders (rather than 2 third rounders as I had stated.)

Not that we have to, but if we want to, we could.

 

[infantrycak]

I guess I didn't make it clear enough.

Let say we did the trade that the Patriots did; it would give us the following picks: 52 (2nd rd), 83 (third round), 102 (fourth round), and 229 (7th round).

We also have these picks: 57 (second round), 89 (third round), 95 (third round), and five other picks.

That's a total of two (2) second rounders, three (3) third rounders and seven (7) other picks.

From 52, to move up to the middle (48) is only 4 slots.
What I mean is that we should be able to use one or two mid and/or late round picks to move up 4-8 spots in the second round, keeping intact two second rounders and three third rounders (rather than 2 third rounders as I had stated.)

Not that we have to, but if we want to, we could.

Quote from the Panthers GM which I think applies superbly to this situation:

“No. Why not? . . . If I have a dollar, I’d rather have the dollar than the three dimes. That’s all there is to it,” Gettleman said. “There’s no, listen, when you trade back, you can think you’re smart, but there’s no guarantee, there are none. From my view, Star was too good to pass up. Why talk yourself out of somebody good, ‘Oh I’m going to be clever.

 

[ThaJokaa]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13cTixvMEos&feature=player_embedded

dude is a beast

 

[bckey]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13cTixvMEos&feature=player_embedded

dude is a beast

Thanks Jokaa! Hopkins is a beast. Watch the other video a TT poster named Yesterday posted on here about his hands.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1nHtKg5AQ0

I think the Texans were stunned that only Austin had been taken prior to their pick at 27. No brainer pick. At only 20 years old he can probably still beef up some more. This guy will be a play maker. Welcome aboard Hopkins!

 

[Blake]

I gave it a B, but really it should be an A. I like that they filled a need, and got a real football player. You cant argue with the pick unless you just prefer WR player A over WR player B. And that is based on the information you have, and not the information the Texans have. At least we didnt take a Center projected by most in the 3rd round.

 

[Dutchrudder]

I really like this pick, and I don't think the Texans had to hesitate to pick him, however I do think the Vikings offered their 2nd, 3rd and 4th to the Texans to move into that spot for Patterson. The Texans let the clock run down to about 2 minutes left when the pick was made, so you know they were discussing the trade back, but they used the pick instead. That tells me a lot about how much they wanted Hopkins, and I think he's a great fit for our offense, and should contribute from day 1. Great start to the draft, I just hope there's a run on WRs, QBs and Centers in the 2nd so that some good defensive guys fall to us.

 

[76Texan]

Quote from the Panthers GM which I think applies superbly to this situation:

Well, Bill Belichik would disagree and he has the record to prove it.

And it's not like I'm advocating trading down all the times. You do it when it makes sense. The Texans traded back last year, didn't they?

This year, if the Texans had made the trade that Belichik executed, with pick 52 and 83, they might be able to get 2 out of the 7 or 8 receivers remaining that a lot of TT draftniks would be happy with. Let them two compete with each other and the guys we currently have for the two spots next to AJ.

Hunter, Rodgers, Patton, Dobson, Allen, Woods, Wheaton are some of the names.
Or the Texans can use one pick for a WR and one for a choice of OT, pass rusher (DE or OLB), ILB, NT, safety.

And they still have the 102 pick for addl' depth and the extra seventh to take a flyer on a guy that is really raw or didn't have a clear position.

To me, that makes a lot of sense.

 

[Brandon420tx]

I gave it a B+. Only thing keeping it from being an A has nothing to do with Hopkins but more to do with the draft situation. It's a very deep WR draft, and I'm worried we won't be taking another one because we used our first on Hopkins (I'm a huge proponent of double dipping at WR this year)

I might have given an A to Sylvester Williams, or Matt Elam. If we pick up someone like Aaron Dobson or Cobi Hamilton with our 4th I'd consider this pick an A also.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I gave it a B+. Only thing keeping it from being an A has nothing to do with Hopkins but more to do with the draft situation. It's a very deep WR draft, and I'm worried we won't be taking another one because we used our first on Hopkins (I'm a huge proponent of double dipping at WR this year)

I might have given an A to Sylvester Williams, or Matt Elam. If we pick up someone like Aaron Dobson or Cobi Hamilton with our 4th I'd consider this pick an A also.

So... it's a B+ NOW. But if they do double-dip and take another WR later, then it could go to A?

 

[Brandon420tx]

Yes, It's my opinion and my grade. I want 2 WR's in this very talented WR pool of a draft and I believe they won't take another one because they've used their first on one. I said it had nothing to do with the player but with the situation. I really like Hopkins, I also really like 4-5 other receivers. Is there a problem with that?

 

[The Pencil Neck]

Yes, It's my opinion and my grade. I want 2 WR's in this very talented WR pool of a draft and I believe they won't take another one because they've used their first on one. I said it had nothing to do with the player but with the situation. I really like Hopkins, I also really like 4-5 other receivers. Is there a problem with that?

No problem. I just wanted to make sure I understood what you were saying.

I don't think I've ever seen a grade for a player contingent on drafting another player at the same position later in the draft.

 

[Brandon420tx]

I don't think I've ever seen a grade for a player contingent on drafting another player at the same position later in the draft.

I'm weird like that. There were very few options left available that would have been an A for me there. I feel like I reserve A's for players we absolutely steal. Whitney Mercilus last year for example (the sack fumble king of college). The only reason I don't consider this pick an absolute steal is because of the giant talent pool behind Hopkins. It's probably because I view the draft with an economics mindset and its like there is an inflation at WR this year.

 

[infantrycak]

Well, Bill Belichik would disagree and he has the record to prove it.

No he doesn't. Name the time Belichik had their top rated choice on the board at their top position of need and traded down - oops you can't do it because you have no idea if it ever happened.

The Texans traded back last year, didn't they?

Why yes they did because they thought they could trade back and STILL get the player they wanted - and they did. They did it with Duane Brown as well. That is an entirely different equation from throwing away any chance at your top rated prospect who you do not believe will be available if you trade back.

 

[thunderkyss]

I hate it. Freak'n Andre Johnson is going to start thinking he runs the team.

Is he going to STAY an "A" grade? I dunno. Lots of people were high on Keyshawn Martin in camp, and in preseason, and he sort of clammed up in the reg season.

I gave it an "A."

It wasn't just Martin, it was the whole team.

One of the questions I asked last offseason, was if Kubiak knew how to handle success. I seriously doubted we would match our 2010 performance. It's one thing when no one has any expectations.

But when you're thought of as "the best team in the league" I bet they could have made diamonds at Reliant. He & the team were too wound up. & that's why we saw Andre dropping TDs, Arian tripping over his own two feet, Schaub trying to act like Aaron Rogers..... & LeStar, KeShawn, & Posey flash & fade.

He knew it was the problem, he mentioned as much in December. Just couldn't do anything about it.... & that's troubling.

That's the way I see it anyway.

 

[Rey]

Why yes they did because they thought they could trade back and STILL get the player they wanted - and they did.

I don't know about getting THE player they wanted, but they got A player they wanted.


It's a gamble to trade back unless there are more than one players that you like because someone can always trade up in front of you.

For all we know the Texans could have had Jones rated higher than Merciless last year, but the Pats actually traded up above us last year and took him...But if they liked both of them then a trade back wouldn't have mattered as much to them.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I hate it. Freak'n Andre Johnson is going to start thinking he runs the team.



It wasn't just Martin, it was the whole team.

One of the questions I asked last offseason, was if Kubiak knew how to handle success. I seriously doubted we would match our 2010 performance. It's one thing when no one has any expectations.

But when you're thought of as "the best team in the league" I bet they could have made diamonds at Reliant. He & the team were too wound up. & that's why we saw Andre dropping TDs, Arian tripping over his own two feet, Schaub trying to act like Aaron Rogers..... & LeStar, KeShawn, & Posey flash & fade.

He knew it was the problem, he mentioned as much in December. Just couldn't do anything about it.... & that's troubling.

That's the way I see it anyway.

Wow.

I mean.

You make it sound like we finished 10-6 in 2011 and then the wheels came off in 2012.

So how did we handle success? We went 12-4 and won a game in the playoffs. That's pretty damned good. That's not as good as we would have liked but that doesn't mean it was some sort of monumental collapse under the pressure.

Kubiak has been involved with some pretty successful teams as an OC and as a QB. I don't think he has a problem handling success.

Now. Our team fell apart near the end of the season. Some guys that needed to step up didn't. Some guys who'd been playing well early in the season started to come apart at the end of the season.

You live and you learn from those experiences. We'll be a better team next year because of it.

At least, that's the way I see it.

 

[ASidd_1990]

A++

My favorite for us. AJ, Jr.

Playoffs, I will devour you!!!!

 

[infantrycak]

I don't know about getting THE player they wanted, but they got A player they wanted.


It's a gamble to trade back unless there are more than one players that you like because someone can always trade up in front of you.

Clearly you should have multiple options in mind. In both these instances the Texans were reported to have gotten exactly who they wanted.

But that wasn't the point - it was they were targeting someone or several people rather than just trading for trades sake.

 

[76Texan]

I don't know about getting THE player they wanted, but they got A player they wanted.


It's a gamble to trade back unless there are more than one players that you like because someone can always trade up in front of you.

For all we know the Texans could have had Jones rated higher than Merciless last year, but the Pats actually traded up above us last year and took him...But if they liked both of them then a trade back wouldn't have mattered as much to them.

If all the GMs think like ICAK, there would be no need for draft-day trade ever.

The reality is that it happens all the time.

ICAK, how do you explain what Belichik did yesterday when he pulled that trade?

 

[thunderkyss]

But that wasn't the point - it was they were targeting someone or several people rather than just trading for trades sake.

I like the pick. I wanted a true first rounder & I'm happy knowing that no one (well very few) people expected this guy to still be on the board.

But.. no one trades for trades' sake. If we could have moved down to the top of the second, get one of the guys we wanted & get another third & 4th & 5th.... that would be well worth it, especially if we can use those picks to trade up & get another guy they wanted.

 

[infantrycak]

If all the GMs think like ICAK, there would be no need for draft-day trade ever.

Total BS. I have in no way intimated never trade.

ICAK, how do you explain what Belichik did yesterday when he pulled that trade?

You really can't figure out an explanation? Oh, how about there was nobody on their board they were thrilled about so when they got the offer they took it whereas the Texans were happier with who was available to them than the picks and so reportedly turned down the same trade. Belichick didn't pull off anything. He is coach for a different team with different needs and circumstances.

By the way, nice way of avoiding the question above - name where Belichick has had exactly the player he wants and his greatest area of need and traded out of the position?

 

[Rey]

I really like Hopkins and I'm not upset that we didn't trade down at all.

It really comes down to what you want and what you need and how far you're willing to trade down.

For discussions sake we'll call Hopkins a Bear.

You can take the Bear to fight with you...

You can trade down and grab a couple of wild dogs....


Just depends on what you need and how you see the players. I don't really thin we need a bunch of picks tbh. I think we need high quality players.

I think 76 just wants more mid round picks in this draft and I agree with that, but instead of trading down, I'd rather trade up.

 

[76Texan]

Total BS. I have in no way intimated never trade.



You really can't figure out an explanation? Oh, how about there was nobody on their board they were thrilled about so when they got the offer they took it whereas the Texans were happier with who was available to them than the picks and so reportedly turned down the same trade. Belichick didn't pull off anything. He is coach for a different team with different needs and circumstances.

By the way, nice way of avoiding the question above - name where Belichick has had exactly the player he wants and his greatest area of need and traded out of the position?

The answer is obvious; nobody knows any team's board so there can never be an anwer unless you can get Belichik to really tell the truth.

For this year, the Patriots had a dire need to find an X receiver; I don't think anybody in the draft community think that such a guy currently exists on their roster.

They have got to rank the receivers in the draft just like any other position.
There's got to be one at the top of their list.
How can Belichik be sure that the guy he wants would last until the next pick?
He can't.

By your logic, he needs to make that selection instead of trading out of the first round.

 

[infantrycak]

Just depends on what you need and how you see the players. I don't really thin we need a bunch of picks tbh. I think we need high quality players.

I think 76 just wants more mid round picks in this draft and I agree with that, but instead of trading down, I'd rather trade up.

Now that I totally agree with. I would be moving as many of the low round picks as possible to upgrade earlier picks or get another mid.

 

[thunderkyss]

Just depends on what you need and how you see the players. I don't really thin we need a bunch of picks tbh. I think we need high quality players.

I agree. I can imagine the Texans putting their board together & going through their mock drafts & everytime saying, "Damn, if only Hopkins would be there." They may even tried to assemble a trade package that they were comfortable with to get him, but fought themselves to slow down.....

Then when he was there, probably a no brainer. They might have held out for a rich trade & the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th wasn't enough for them to drop out of the first... which is totally understandable.

Then when you consider they probably thought the Vikings were targeting their guy... no way.

 

[bckey]

I really like this pick, and I don't think the Texans had to hesitate to pick him, however I do think the Vikings offered their 2nd, 3rd and 4th to the Texans to move into that spot for Patterson. The Texans let the clock run down to about 2 minutes left when the pick was made, so you know they were discussing the trade back, but they used the pick instead. That tells me a lot about how much they wanted Hopkins, and I think he's a great fit for our offense, and should contribute from day 1. Great start to the draft, I just hope there's a run on WRs, QBs and Centers in the 2nd so that some good defensive guys fall to us.

Belichek traded with them 2 picks later and got a 7th thrown in also.

 

[TexansSeminole]

I agree. I can imagine the Texans putting their board together & going through their mock drafts & everytime saying, "Damn, if only Hopkins would be there." They may even tried to assemble a trade package that they were comfortable with to get him, but fought themselves to slow down.....

Then when he was there, probably a no brainer. They might have held out for a rich trade & the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th wasn't enough for them to drop out of the first... which is totally understandable.

Then when you consider they probably thought the Vikings were targeting their guy... no way.

With the way the draft was unfolding, I wouldn't think that they were more concerned with Hopkins going off the board than when the draft started. There were no signs that a run on WRs was imminent. As far as the Texans FO getting what they wanted, this draft seems to have fallen just about perfectly for them in the first round.

Now, the best thing for us is to have a run on QBs, RBs, WRs and maybe even CBs here in the 2nd round. There aren't alot of OLBs, ILBs, or RTs that I like with this 2nd rounder. Let's hope our guy at one of those positions, or at NT, is available.

 

[bckey]

With the way the draft was unfolding, I wouldn't think that they were more concerned with Hopkins going off the board than when the draft started. There were no signs that a run on WRs was imminent. As far as the Texans FO getting what they wanted, this draft seems to have fallen just about perfectly for them in the first round.

Now, the best thing for us is to have a run on QBs, RBs, WRs and maybe even CBs here in the 2nd round. There aren't alot of OLBs, ILBs, or RTs that I like with this 2nd rounder. Let's hope our guy at one of those positions, or at NT, is available.

This is what I think about last nights draft and hope for tonight. The Texans need a NT, ILB and OT. DE, Safety and OLB are somewhat lesser needs that are an injury away from being a huge need.

 

[TexansSeminole]

This is what I think about last nights draft and hope for tonight. The Texans need a NT, ILB and OT. DE, Safety and OLB are somewhat lesser needs that are an injury away from being a huge need.

When I look at it, we really are hurting at OLB pretty badly. The two guys we have are guys with a combined 3 years of experience, with literally nobody but Braman behind them. We've got to add several guys that can play at least a little bit this year. Whether that means two rookies or two FAs or a combination, we shall see.

DE is similar, in my opinion, just not as pressing. We need front 7 depth at every position basically.

 

[76Texan]

I really like Hopkins and I'm not upset that we didn't trade down at all.

It really comes down to what you want and what you need and how far you're willing to trade down.

For discussions sake we'll call Hopkins a Bear.

You can take the Bear to fight with you...

You can trade down and grab a couple of wild dogs....


Just depends on what you need and how you see the players. I don't really thin we need a bunch of picks tbh. I think we need high quality players.

I think 76 just wants more mid round picks in this draft and I agree with that, but instead of trading down, I'd rather trade up.

And I did mention that the Texans can always use their extra 4th-7th round picks to move back up into the middle of the second round if they want to.

But the three picks in the second, third, and fourth round that the Pats got should bring more value to the Texans than Hopkins by himself; I feel pretty strongly about that.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

And I did mention that the Texans can always use their extra 4th-7th round picks to move back up into the middle of the second round if they want to.

But the three picks in the second, third, and fourth round that the Pats got should bring more value to the Texans than Hopkins by himself; I feel pretty strongly about that.

I look at it like this.

If you have a particular guy you want and someone offers you to trade back, you've got to weigh what they're offering against how bad you want that guy and if you think he's going to be there when you get to pick. If you don't think he's going to be there and he's The Guy, then you don't trade back. You make your pick.

If you don't have The Guy but a bunch of guys you like or if you think you're the only one coveting your Guy so he'll still be there, go ahead and trade back.

I think the Texans looked Hopkins as The Guy and when he was there, they weren't going to risk losing him. I got no problem with that.

 

[ObsiWan]

I look at it like this.

If you have a particular guy you want and someone offers you to trade back, you've got to weigh what they're offering against how bad you want that guy and if you think he's going to be there when you get to pick. If you don't think he's going to be there and he's The Guy, then you don't trade back. You make your pick.

If you don't have The Guy but a bunch of guys you like or if you think you're the only one coveting your Guy so he'll still be there, go ahead and trade back.

I think the Texans looked Hopkins as The Guy and when he was there, they weren't going to risk losing him. I got no problem with that.

^^^^
This.

And apparently "The Guy" for Belichick was gone and he figured with a fist-full of extra picks he might uncover a viable substitute. Hence, he pulled the trigger on the trade.

 

[76Texan]

Grade A.
A starter in the late first round is just about what one should expect.
Why he dropped some balls is somewhat a mystery considering his big hands.
Hopkins actually played better (more explosive) than some of his test scores indicate.
It remains to be seen if that will hold true against NFL defenses.
That is probably part of his game that might hold him back from becoming a number one receiver, IMO.