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David Carr is 2nd.

You can twist the stats any way you want them. The fact of the matter is Carr and Co didnt put up points when we needed them. And the defense didnt stop the colts like we needed them to.

Point is, we got beat by a damn good team. And its no surprise that they are a damn good team. They were a good team last year, and will be every year that Manning is at the helm.

We are just going to have to be a better all around football team to win in this league, and that comes with great drafts, and great coaching/execution.
 
Double Barrel said:
"He's [Carr] got to play for four quarters," Kubiak said. "I'm gonna be on his butt until he becomes a four-quarter player."

In my mind, this quote from Kubiak speaks volumes over Carr's stats in two losses. :hmmm:
Click to expand...

It also shows, along with similiar comments that he made about Mario, that now it's a matter of playing good all the time rather than simply if they can play good at all.

That's movement in the right direction.
 
My 2 cents ....


Carr's numbers are pretty good overall . 40-53 , the 75.5% completion leads the NFL while being sacked 9 times . The #2 and 3 among completion percentage have a combined total of ONE sack , Rex Grossman, Chiago and Philip Rivers , San Diego Both of whom are over 70% .

No interceptions . One of only 5 opening day starters yet to throw a pick . With the poor pass protection he's had so far I'd say this is a miracle .

His 4TD's are tied for second most with three others . His 8.1 yard per attempt shows a nice improvement over his career avg. of 6.6 .


The numbers look pretty good on paper . The problem is he did this while the Texans went 0-2 . Its hard to point the finger at the QB when his numbers look this good , his pass protection has been so poor , the running game hasnt been remotely close to what was expected and the defense has given up an average of 33.5 points per game .

Carr has made lots of progress under Kubiak and I expect this to continue . He still has "Happy Feet" but with the 9 sacks over two games I'd expect that . But until the other aspects of the team improve we wont be able to guage how far Carr has really come . :ok:

:stirpot:
 
NFLforher said:
I don't recall Eli being sacked 200+ times, do you?

:yikes:
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he was sacked 9 times in a win...... that's the kind of things that put some QBs in the Elite crowd.... getting sacked by the same team 5 times, and loosing means you're just another QB.

don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming David Carr for this loss, or last weeks, or any loss in the Texans' history. I'm just saying if Carr is ever going to be a QB of Eli's caliber(sarcasm) he's got to do something that your avg QB can't do..... other than take 218 sacks, or whatever the count is. I can take 218 sacks and lose, it's not a big deal. (I honestly don't think I couldsurvive, but that's not the point).

My point is, if you want to point to David's QB rating, and say, "look, he can be elite", I will point to an elite QB, and say, "Let's see him do that"

& I'm not saying Eli is elite..... but he's a lot closer than David Carr.
 
Double Barrel said:
"He's [Carr] got to play for four quarters," Kubiak said. "I'm gonna be on his butt until he becomes a four-quarter player."

In my mind, this quote from Kubiak speaks volumes over Carr's stats in two losses. :hmmm:
Click to expand...

It says that Carr played one heck of a quarter, and Kubiak believes if he can do that for four quarters, we should win. I think it also says that Kubiak thinks he can turn Carr into a four quarter QB. I like this, as well as Carr played, Kubiak is still going to tear Carr apart.

I see it kind of like working out. You have to tear the muscle fibers in order for them to grow. I see Kubiak ripping apart the game and making Carr that much better overall.
 
Texans86 said:
It says that Carr played one heck of a quarter, and Kubiak believes if he can do that for four quarters, we should win. I think it also says that Kubiak thinks he can turn Carr into a four quarter QB. I like this, as well as Carr played, Kubiak is still going to tear Carr apart.

I see it kind of like working out. You have to tear the muscle fibers in order for them to grow. I see Kubiak ripping apart the game and making Carr that much better overall.
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It means David didn't help us win in the first three Qtrs... Some of the throws he decided to throw didn't put us in a position to be competitive.

Sure, the dropped balls didn't help..... but throwing a 5 yard on 3rd & 15, right after you threw a 4 yard pass on 2 & 20 ??

Sure, they might have had two safeties over the top, but a probowl QB is going to have to beat a probowl cover 2, or a probowl corner, or a probowl blitz every now and again. to not even challenge the Colts secondary is a little short of pathetic.
 
Hulk75 said:
Yea too bad Jeremy Shockey, Tiki Barber, Plexico (I am 6-5 throw it up to me when rushed) Burress were not on Carrs team when he first got in the league.

David Carr is better then Eli Manning.
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You have got to be kidding me? That is just a ridiculous statement and shows that more than a few Carr homers aren't even objective in their observations.

doug
 
I said this in a post before.. I almost wish Carr would have turned down the extention and went somewhere else now.

He can't and never will win in Houston...
reason 1...when his stats are good, it is all about Carr and he got his stats in garbage and blablabla..
reason 2..if his stats are bad and if the Texan happen to win..it is because yadayada won the game for the Texans ..


I mean If I wanted to I could pick out a stat about when we ran the ball and gained over 100 yards we lose... lets blame the RB on that...(Cowboys had a pretty good record when Emmit got 100 yards rushing)..well the Texans can't run and can't play defense right now.

People forget about the NFL and the parity that is going on.. you have to be clicking on all 3 phases...err well 4 phase of the game...ST,Offense,Defense, and coaching to win in this league.. you can't just win on talent alone like in the pre salary cap days
 
Second Honeymoon said:
You have got to be kidding me? That is just an *****ic statement and shows that more than a few Carr homers aren't even objective in their observations.

doug
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ditto for Carr haters (but you already knew that)
 
Texans86 said:
It says that Carr played one heck of a quarter, and Kubiak believes if he can do that for four quarters, we should win. I think it also says that Kubiak thinks he can turn Carr into a four quarter QB.
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You read a lot more into his quote than I do, but I like your optimistic thinking.

IMHO, a fifth year QB should not be at a point where he is questionable about being able to do his part to play well for four quarters. This particular Kubiak quote can be seen through a positive prism, but it can also be a reflection of some serious deficiencies, as well.

I still trust Kubiak's judgement, though, because he will either make or break Carr. His head coaching career will not be determined by the contract a player has with the team, so we know we'll have a good QB at the end of day...Carr or not.
 
Second Honeymoon said:
You have got to be kidding me? That is just an *****ic statement and shows that more than a few Carr homers aren't even objective in their observations.

doug
Click to expand...
troll.gif


I say that because I have yet to see anything positive come out
 
chuckm said:
ditto for Carr haters (but you already knew that)
Click to expand...

I am quite objective in my observations of Carr. Carr has never done anything of note in over 60 starts....thus my criticism holds weight. Dude is just not a good QB but whatever, I have given up trying to open your eyes to those facts. Now I will just point out blatantly ignorant statements such as the one I quoted from the guy with the Carr avatar...whatever his name was.

I am not worried, I have known that Carr has sucked since about halfway through Year2. Another year of horrible subpar QB play won't kill me if the previous 4 havent....there will be plenty of you homers around eating crow once the organization admits their mistake in drafting carr, starting carr, and re-signing carr....The object of football is to win championships and anyone who thinks Carr will get a sniff of the playoffs, much less the Super Bowl, are really drinking loads and loads of battlered koolaid....

but whatever, you have your opinion and I have mine...mine just happens to be right

Doug ftw
 
Wolf said:
I said this in a post before.. I almost wish Carr would have turned down the extention and went somewhere else now.

He can't and never will win in Houston...
reason 1...when his stats are good, it is all about Carr and he got his stats in garbage and blablabla..
reason 2..if his stats are bad and if the Texan happen to win..it is because yadayada won the game for the Texans ..


I mean If I wanted to I could pick out a stat about when we ran the ball and gained over 100 yards we lose... lets blame the RB on that...(Cowboys had a pretty good record when Emmit got 100 yards rushing)..well the Texans can't run and can't play defense right now.

People forget about the NFL and the parity that is going on.. you have to be clicking on all 3 phases...err well 4 phase of the game...ST,Offense,Defense, and coaching to win in this league.. you can't just win on talent alone like in the pre salary cap days
Click to expand...

Ok, how many games has Carr won for us? That's right, none. Needless to say, dude has cost us lots of games with his inconsistent and mistake prone QB play....guy still looks like a rookie...period
 
Second Honeymoon said:
Ok, how many games has Carr won for us? That's right, none. Needless to say, dude has cost us lots of games with his inconsistent and mistake prone QB play....guy still looks like a rookie...period
Click to expand...

Can you name a game that CARR specifically has cost us ?
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
From his statement at the weekly presser, so would his coach.
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From his statement in the chronic, so would Carr.

...His 123.7 passer rating ranks third in the NFL, but he knows it's tainted because of the fourth-quarter competition at Indianapolis.

"I didn't even know that, but I'd trade it for two wins in a heartbeat," Carr said about his rating....
Click to expand...
 
Carr hasn't won us any games with outstanding play, but he certainly hasn't cost us...
 
chuckm said:
Ok enough of that ...... back to the point at hand .... CARR SUCKS
Click to expand...

thanks chuckm...... this thread was going off topic fast....

Thanks for bringing us back to our senses....



:shades:
 
HJam72 said:
He's doing a lot better, but his numbers are a little inflated from throwing shorter passes...
Click to expand...
Carr has a "Yards per Attempt" of 8.06, ranking him 7th (possibly 8th, I don't know about this Longwell).
 
Second Honeymoon said:
Ok, how many games has Carr won for us? That's right, none. Needless to say, dude has cost us lots of games with his inconsistent and mistake prone QB play....guy still looks like a rookie...period
Click to expand...

9/8/02 - 2 touchdowns vs Dallas - win 19-10
10/27/02 - 1 TD at Jacksonville, 184 yds - win 21-19
9/7/03 - 1 TD, 266 yds at Miami - win 21-20
9/28/03 - 1 TD, 234 yds vs Jacksonville - win 24-20
9/26/04 - 1 TD, 233 yds at KC - win 24-21
10/3/04 - 1 TD, 228 yds vs Oakland - win 30-17
10/17/04 - 1 TD, 266 yds at Tennesee - win 20-10
10/31/04 - 1 TD, 276 yds vs Jacksonville - win 20-6
11/28/04 - 2 TD, 201 yds vs Tennesee - win 31-21
12/19/04 - 1 TD, 220 yds at Chicago - win 24-5
 
The QB rating is flawed. If Carr just threw screen plays all the time and had an 80% completion rate, his QB rating would be high as well. Obviously Carr hasn't been one of the top QB's thus far this season. He hasn't been in the bottom either. I'd put him right in the middle. It's nice that he has a good QB rating but the system isn't all it's meant to be. Had the Texans actually been in the game against Indy in the 4th quarter I doubt he would have thrown 3 TD passes. But I'm glad all the "Bench Carr, play Sage" posts and threads are gone.
 
blockhead83 said:
That's because he only has long passes in garbage time.

:sarcasm:
Click to expand...
And Manning's statisics came against our **** *** defense. They all count the same.

His performance shows what the passing offense is capable of if given time in the pocket.
 
Number19 said:
And Manning's statisics came against our **** *** defense. They all count the same.

His performance shows what the passing offense is capable of if given time in the pocket.
Click to expand...

We have a winner...Pay the man.:money:

:coffee:
 
Number19 said:
And Manning's statisics came against our **** *** defense. They all count the same.

His performance shows what the passing offense is capable of if given time in the pocket.
Click to expand...

I think you missed the :sarcasm:. I agree with you.
 
Number19 said:
And Manning's statisics came against our **** *** defense. They all count the same.

His performance shows what the passing offense is capable of if given time in the pocket.
Click to expand...

Actually, I tend to mildly disagree w/ this. I'm not saying that Manning was ever under dire pressure during the game, but IMO the major problem was that he got rid of the ball so quickly that our Dline never had much of a chance to put pressure on him.

That translates to...we had HORRIBLE coverage all day, so bad that Manning could snap the ball and throw to the endzone immediately for a TD almost before our Dline could start applying pressure.

A more accurate statement would be "His performance shows what the passing offense is capable of if playing against a FS that should probably be a linebacker":crutch:
 
Kaiser Toro said:
Good for Carr. Hopefully this goodness will help the team along the way. We need players that make other players better.
Click to expand...

One thing, IMO, that made Denver a great team was the subtle but effective and efficient play of their QB.

It's pretty simple: The other players tend to play beter when they don't have to worry about their QB and if he can "hang" or not. Once the RBs and WRs, and O-linemen and D-linemen and even the TEs can see that their Qb is not going to cost them the game, then they feel MORE free to play loose and to take risks.

The great teams may have "great" Qbs, but I think if we look closer at those teams, they ALL play better when someone at the QB is firmly entrenched as "the guy" and is leading the charge with confidence, saying "This is my huddle. I call the shots. I don't screw up, so therefore YOU can't screw up."

Maybe it's the method to the Kubiak "QB Mentoring" madness.

Looka' here: Jake's playing poorly and his team around him is also not doin' so good, are they? The confidence in Jake is eroding, and the other players are sinking, too.
 
gpshafer_1976 said:
The great teams may have "great" Qbs, but I think if we look closer at those teams, they ALL play better when someone at the QB is firmly entrenched as "the guy" and is leading the charge with confidence, saying "This is my huddle. I call the shots. I don't screw up, so therefore YOU can't screw up."
Click to expand...

When you peel it back this is exactly what a lot of fans and maybe some players are waiting for.

I think we are getting better in some facets of the game and am enjoying watching some guys develop and do things differently.
 
Second Honeymoon said:
Ok, how many games has Carr won for us? That's right, none. Needless to say, dude has cost us lots of games with his inconsistent and mistake prone QB play....guy still looks like a rookie...period
Click to expand...

if your gonna blame carr for the losses then start with the defence......defence wins games....if you ever played football or any other sort of contact sport e.g rugby league...then you will agree with this....its the defence thats costing us not carr
 
noxiousdog said:
9/8/02 - 2 touchdowns vs Dallas - win 19-10
10/27/02 - 1 TD at Jacksonville, 184 yds - win 21-19
9/7/03 - 1 TD, 266 yds at Miami - win 21-20
9/28/03 - 1 TD, 234 yds vs Jacksonville - win 24-20
9/26/04 - 1 TD, 233 yds at KC - win 24-21
10/3/04 - 1 TD, 228 yds vs Oakland - win 30-17
10/17/04 - 1 TD, 266 yds at Tennesee - win 20-10
10/31/04 - 1 TD, 276 yds vs Jacksonville - win 20-6
11/28/04 - 2 TD, 201 yds vs Tennesee - win 31-21
12/19/04 - 1 TD, 220 yds at Chicago - win 24-5
Click to expand...

Salient post - note the great run in 2004, before the Capers Crew messed up the offense - let's see what a year under Kubiak does :redtowel:
 
How can people compare the Giants win against the Eagles to the Texans loss against Colts?

If the either one of those fumbles had gone the other way in the Eagles/Giants game, the Giants lose. The Giants only even had a chance at the end of that game because of:

1A.) Recovering that fumble in the endzone (After one of the Eagles players knocked it into the endzone when he tried to slide (not fall on like your supposed to) into it.)
1B.) The Westbrook fumble.
2.) The loss of Kearse in overtime
3.) Buress is a big reciever who adjusted on that prayer that Eli threw up to win the game. Amazing catch.

So, with this in mind, if the Texans had some breaks (I admit that G. Earl made some great back to back plays to get the Texans the ball) we might still lose, but it wouldn't be that bad.

I still say that this team (Texans) will play better
For those who like to point out that most of his early throws were short passes I say this: if the short passes are there, I want him to throw it instead of forcing a worse throw. (Even on third, at least the recievers have a chance to make a play... after all, they are pro-bowlers) Short yards are better then no yards and turnovers, and since our running game is non existent the short throws can be used as substitutes to bring the safeties up. (I'm not saying thats what the Texans were trying to do). So I have 3 football philosophies. 1) Run to pass deep 2) Pass deep to run and 3) Pass short to pass deep.

Hopefully Samkon and Dayne can get us back to philosophy 1, because we don't have time to do philosophy 2, and I just now invented philosophy 3 and Kubiak might not know that one.
 
It looks like it is going to be the year of the defense in the NFL. Too bad Houston didn't get the memo. The D gave up a league worst 26 points a game last year and will be lucky to finish better than that this year. Until that number improves it doesn't matter who the QB is, they will not have a winning record and will continue to be bashed.

If Carr would have been fortunate enough to be traded to say a Chicago or Baltimore, he would be 2-0 and his YTD stats would be appreciated.
 
I never thought I'd say this but our offense is pretty good compared to our defense. Until last year's 2-14 flop, it's always been our defense that really helped us win games. Now it looks like we've got to count on our offense to win games. I'm amazed that our defense really does look that bad right now.

All of our blitzes the past 2 weeks have been picked up with ease. We could have sent in the whole barn and McNabb would still have ample time to throw. We really need to get our timing down on those blitzes cause these lineman are picking it up with ease.
 
chuckm said:
enough lip service .... where's my rep?
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I got negative rep for this post .... they didn't see fit to leave their name .... all they left was two words ..... they'll be filtered out so I'll translate ...

intelligent butt
 
chuckm said:
I got negative rep for this post .... they didn't see fit to leave their name .... all they left was two words ..... they'll be filtered out so I'll translate ...

intelligent butt
Click to expand...

Wasn't me..... I gave you the good stuff, & signed my name.....
 
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