David Carr 2nd best decision maker?

[TK_Gamer]

right and I guess 90% of the country identifying Ben's SB performance as the worst by a winning team means as much as 90% of the coaches saying Carr is a top notch prospect in the mold of Marino/Elway. the naysayers will allways find ammo to contradict the experts, and find the magic stat that shows they are right.

 

[infantrycak]

Dude get off it...... my post has nothing to do with Carr.......

Well then I sincerely apologize for the improper inference.

 

[Wolf]

wonder why they didn't include stats on running out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage?

seriously I am beginning to think stats are this

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0104926/quotes

Jack Eliot: I'm a World Series MVP!
Skip: That was four years ago, Jack. Last season, you hit .235.
Jack Eliot: LAST SEASON, I led this team in ninth-inning doubles in the month of August!

 

[HJam72]

Carr does a good job of limiting turnovers, considering what he's been through; but, that #2 ranking cannot be taken seriously. I feel like any ranking, no matter how good or bad, on him should have an asterisk beside it--badly coached, not protected, dropped balls, and yes, staring down receivers and taking sacks, instead of throwing it away.

I know that people don't want to hear this after 4 yrs., but, as far as I'm concerned, he gets a clean slate for one year. I'm gonna judge him almost completely on what happens from day one of training camp this year.

 

[Vinny]

wow, when did the Carr jihad go down? Everyone is touchy about Carr lately...I won't give my opinion on this topic....this thread is enough of a disaster.

 

[texan279]

wow, when did the Carr jihad go down? Everyone is touchy about Carr lately...I won't give my opinion on this topic....this thread is enough of a disaster.

Probably just because everyone has been without football for so long and it is now so close we can all taste it...

 

[TwinSisters]

Now where did you hear that? Are you suggesting that Cass subscribed to KC's service and filled the Texans roster like he would fill his fantasy team (the CASSanovas)?

You fellas here have been using KC Joyner's stuff to prop Carr up.

Casserly's endorsement has been on the FS site for awhile.

I hear about fantasy players complaining about how KC did them wrong on Carr because they paid KC for the not so helpful help.

I wouldn't go so far as to say what Casserly does, I imagine it has more to do with what he learned in Washington then anything else.

BUT 'don't' think that coaches or personnel men 'don't' use statistics from "fantasy" football sites to aid their decision making process. Jim Schwartz uses techniques developed by Football Outsiders.
--

I am not dissing KC Joyner either. I am just saying he has endorsed Carr for at least three years. That can be good or bad. And Casserly endorses KC Joyner. That tends to be more bad then good.

Casserly has a lot of friends though too...

 

[TK_Gamer]

wow, when did the Carr jihad go down? Everyone is touchy about Carr lately...I won't give my opinion on this topic....this thread is enough of a disaster.

I think the carr haters wanna get there last diggs in and most others dont wanna hear negatives to start the season. I dont really wanna hear it either. we had made some progress in the last week with some vanilla comments by some of the stronger carr critics, now the gloves are off again . just what we need as a team people , good work backing your team.

 

[Vinny]

BUT 'don't' think that coaches or personnel men 'don't' use statistics from "fantasy" football sites to aid their decision making process.

Football is not a sport like baseball where you can take stand alone stats and come to conclusions about talent. Football is one sport that must be eyeballed...and then you have to have people who know what they are looking at on top of it all.

 

[Lucky]

(Thanks Revolution for not bothering to read the MB much or heck even the whole thread but still feeling the urge to hit the negative rep button)

You can afford a little negative rep. Besides, you should know better than posting in a preseason David Carr thread.

Oops...I just broke my own rule.

How's this for I wonder if Joyner would consider the Carr 4th down pass to Bradford in the Jags game a "good" or "bad" decision?

 

[Kaiser Toro]

You fellas here have been using KC Joyner's stuff to prop Carr up.

How did I wind up on this side of the debate?

This must be what chaos feels like.

 

[TwinSisters]

well I mean in the past... not just this thread. If that was throwing it. I went back and saw it being pulled up in the Chicken Little epoch

 

[infantrycak]

How's this for I wonder if Joyner would consider the Carr 4th down pass to Bradford in the Jags game a "good" or "bad" decision?

Oh no you didn't.

Geez that can't be lucky at all.

 

[Lucky]

How did I wind up on this side of the debate?

The Alpha Carra Omega fraternity welcomes our newest member, KT. Your full-size David Carr poster (with circa 2004 hair) will be in the mail shortly.

 

[thunderkyss]

Well then I sincerely apologize for the improper inference.

no biggie........... we're all friends here.

 

[texan279]

The Alpha Carra Omega fraternity welcomes our newest member, KT. Your full-size David Carr poster (with circa 2004 hair) will be in the mail shortly.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Lucky again.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I didn't make this list so don't flame on me. Just posting what K.C. Joyner had to say. If you scroll down the list Carr is the second best decision maker behind only Tom Brady. I'm not saying I agree with what it says, I'm just posting it for the sake of argument.

This was on free ESPN insider.

Um... I'd like to see some of the components that went into this because it looks messed up to me. I'd like to see how many of each type of mistake were awarded to each QB. And if he missed 2 plays the year before... how do we know he didn't miss a bunch of other plays, too.

I like the fact that Carr doesn't throw a ton of interceptions. But he has taken sacks that he probably could have avoided, stared down some receivers, and made other mistakes. I'd like to see something at least moderately scientific that shows how many of those mistakes each QB made instead of some indefensible percentags. I would have expected Carr to be at the low end of the middle of the pack last year, not up at #2.

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

Playing DE for I dont know 10+ years I have a good view of batted down balls, batted down balls are nobodys fault its a great play by the dlineman unless the guy is standing in front of you and the QB throws the ball in your face, that is the only time it is the QBs fault, Lord Help me! WR dropping balls, WRs fault thats it.


Not all football related? Not all football related!!!!!! This is the freaking NFL not pee wee buddy buddy 2 hands on the back football, if thought he could not cut it for any football reason he would not be here, if he was so bad as some of you say he would not have a job in the NFL right now, maybe as a back up!!!!! BUT guess what I guess a head coach that that has many Superbowl rings thought he has the stuuf to be one of the best.
Anyone want to take stab for the 1,000,000,000 time why he could not throw the ball deep and or down the middle last year?

Let me see what I can find ..............







Anything else? They probably were just being nice though.

Actually, pretty much on par with what i expected you to do. Slanted to fit an agenda, but not irresponsible. Fair enough, even though there are harser criticisms available.

Just for the record before you attempt to label, I said that I think Carr is a very similiar QB to Jake Plummer upwards of two years ago if not longer. There are "oldtimers" who could back me up on this. The good side is that Carr is tough guy with mobility who could do fine when coached well and surrounded by good players. He can put nice stats and not screw up a good thing. Bad side, I am not convinced Carr improves the players around him or understands how to make a play with his arm when the chips are down. Not convinced that ladder two things can be taught, but at least Kubiak is pretty high on the guys who I think have a chance to teach if they are. W

I generally, don't post in Carr threads because I have not changed this bit for two years and will not until he does something to move me one way or another. Don't think he sucks; don't think him to be great. More Just Another Guy capable of starting in the NFL and not embarrassing a team.

 

[TexansLucky13]

wow, when did the Carr jihad go down? Everyone is touchy about Carr lately...I won't give my opinion on this topic....this thread is enough of a disaster.

Haha, yea this is definitely a chaos thread. I feel kinda bad for being in a weird mood earlier today and darting a swift one at infantrycak..... that is the root of this whole conflict. cak, I feel ya dude. As I said before, I know you aren't an anti-Carr dude. I still can't find that post that I was talking about though. Guess I will just have to apologize for "releasing the bull in the chinamans shop" (quote from Larry the Cable Guy). Shoulda known better than to post in a Carr thread again.... too much in one day.

 

[The Dude Abides]

Boy, I sure am glad I started this thread.

 

[Hulk75]

C'mon--take this out of the context of Carr and try to be objective about any old QB. Some knockdowns will be the "fault" of the QB if he throws it into an unengaged DLmen looking at him with time to reposition prior to being sacked. Some will be the ordinary gamble of trying to get the ball over a variety of engaged DLmen, one of whom manages to get a paw in the air at the right time and place. Remove the Carr agenda and it really is that simple--some can be avoided, some can't. The OLmen are also generally supposed to keep their guys engaged so they can't jump and that breaks down as well.

The primary problem with a sidearm delivery is inaccuracy left to right in addition to inaccuracy inherent to either on distance.

What you said is perfect, perfect!

OLineman open passing lanes, the QB cant be worried about a lineman getting his hand up there, he just has to throw it, your right.

That goes for every QB in the league and any QB in the world.

Your right like I said and you said, If the QB clearly has a guy in front of him and throws the ball right at the guy then yes it is all on the QB, BUT when the DLineman gets his hand up and makes a great play, what can you do?

 

[LBC_Justin]

You fellas here have been using KC Joyner's stuff to prop Carr up.

Casserly's endorsement has been on the FS site for awhile.

I hear about fantasy players complaining about how KC did them wrong on Carr because they paid KC for the not so helpful help.

I wouldn't go so far as to say what Casserly does, I imagine it has more to do with what he learned in Washington then anything else.

BUT 'don't' think that coaches or personnel men 'don't' use statistics from "fantasy" football sites to aid their decision making process. Jim Schwartz uses techniques developed by Football Outsiders.
--

I am not dissing KC Joyner either. I am just saying he has endorsed Carr for at least three years. That can be good or bad. And Casserly endorses KC Joyner. That tends to be more bad then good.

Casserly has a lot of friends though too...

I don't think he is endorsing Carr as much as Carr just so happens to rank high using his formula. Carr is a smart guy, smarter than Big Ben and Brett Farve. He plays smart, and he doesn't take very many risks....let me rephrase that....under the old coaching staff he was coached to not take risks, which went well with the "Keep it close" and "Play not to lose" mentality of the old staff. Had the Texans been gunning it down field I am sure he would have ranked some where near the middle of the road.

 

[hollywood_texan]

Tips at the line are great plays/smart plays by DLineman, that cant get to the QB/ for someone to get on here and tell me that knock downs are a QBs fault just shows me their football knowledge.

Read the entire thread before you just type stuff, I have a little experience with batting down footballs.

Sometimes its like teaching kids that have never played football before, it gives you a big headache after a while.

**** UNLESS ******* the QB throws the ball INTO the FACE of the DLineman or into his crouch it is not his fault, period thats it, no discussion, I am telling you from playing thats how it is.

I do, I consider the source every time you post.

By your definition, it is rarely the QB's fault for a tipped ball at the line. How many times does a QB throw a ball that hits a lineman in the face or the crouch anyway?

I disagree with you on this.

The size of the quarterback and his technique are extremely critical in tipped balls at the line. Furthermore, a good defensive lineman as you described can take advantage of a smaller quarterback and/or poor technique and bat more balls down than normal. Therefore, the bigger the QB and the better technique, fewer batted balls.

Every QB is going to have batted balls, but the key is to keep it low.

Carr has had a problem with batted balls because of poor technique. In other words he has had too many batted balls.

Also, I gave you little one on tipped balls by the receiver. Some of those may be the QB's fault. For example, if the QB over or under throws (or maybe leaves the WR hanging out like laundry) the receiver, and the receiver makes an attempt to catch the ball but only tips it, that is the QB's fault. However, if the QB makes a throw right on the money and tipped or whatever, not the QB's fault.

IMO, the QB is 80% responsible for the play on offense (this is assuming adequate coaching and play calling, which Carr didn't have under Capers). The best offensive line, running backs, and receivers cannot overcome poor quarterback play.

 

[thunderkyss]

What you said is perfect, perfect!

OLineman open passing lanes, the QB cant be worried about a lineman getting his hand up there, he just has to throw it, your right.

That goes for every QB in the league and any QB in the world.

Your right like I said and you said, If the QB clearly has a guy in front of him and throws the ball right at the guy then yes it is all on the QB, BUT when the DLineman gets his hand up and makes a great play, what can you do?

what he said does not agree with you.

IF I read him correctly, and the QB gambles and tries to throw the ball over a blocked lineman..... it was a bad decision by the QB....... great play by the DE, but the ball shouldn't have been thrown where the play could've been made at all.

 

[santo]

Just out of curiosity, is it Delhomme's fault for this pass:

Play of any camp thus far? During one practice in Spartanburg, Delhomme dropped back, looked right and tried to dump a screen. The operative word here, however, is tried. Enter Pro Bowl DE Julius Peppers. This freak of nature extended his left arm, caught the ball in his left hand like he would a tennis ball and kept his arm extended straight as he took it back for what would have been an easy yet jaw-dropping TD. Just not fair. DEs aren't supposed to be able to do things like this.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/5852122

this was taken from an article in msn sports page.

Just trying to understand if this would be a result of a quaterback making a mistake or a DE making a remarkable catch.

 

[infantrycak]

what he said does not agree with you.

IF I read him correctly, and the QB gambles and tries to throw the ball over a blocked lineman..... it was a bad decision by the QB....... great play by the DE, but the ball shouldn't have been thrown where the play could've been made at all.

Naw you are reading it a little differently than intended. QB's very frequently throw over engaged DLmen--they have to or 75% of passes wouldn't be thrown at all. Sometimes the DLmen is going to get disengaged enough to make a play on the ball. IMO that isn't the fault of the QB because those kinds of chances have to be taken.

HT is right that technique does effect the odds on a ball getting batted down. Fact is a sidearm or semi-sidearm delivery is known when these guys get drafted so JMO that's part of the package on draft day and after than it isn't worth complaining about--it also isn't bad decision making IMO, it is simply the way they play. Carr was known as a semi-sidearm QB, so is VY and he will have his effective height reduced because of it. Rivers is even more sidearm and will have the same issue. IMO it doesn't reflect bad decision making for any of them.

 

[thunderkyss]

The primary problem with a sidearm delivery is inaccuracy left to right in addition to inaccuracy inherent to either on distance.

 

[infantrycak]

Hey you can prioritize them however you want. IMO it goes accuracy and then balls batted down. Accuracy effects all 400 attempts in a season. Sidearm may add 3-6 balls batted down a season.

 

[Lucky]

HT is right that technique does effect the odds on a ball getting batted down.

And sometimes a QB needs to throw with a sidearm delivery to get a pass off. Brett Favre is a good example of a QB who can throw from multiple arm slots. In that case, it is a QB decision in how to release the pass without being deflected.

What hasn't been brought up is the responsibility of the offensive line to not only stop penetration, but to create passing lanes. An example of that would come from the Texans/Colts game in Indy, where the Colts O-line demolished the Texans defensive left front and allowed Manning to have perfect vision downfield on a TD pass to Harrison.

 

[hollywood_texan]

Just out of curiosity, is it Delhomme's fault for this pass:



http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/5852122

this was taken from an article in msn sports page.

Just trying to understand if this would be a result of a quaterback making a mistake or a DE making a remarkable catch.

Good example...

Looking forward to Mario Williams playing. By the way, Peppers could have been a Texan over Carr.

Back to the point though...

The issue of batted balls is how many times does it happen.

A QB is going to have batted balls just like a point guard is going to have turnovers. Minimizing the issue is what is at hand.

 

[thunderkyss]

Hey you can prioritize them however you want. IMO it goes accuracy and then balls batted down. Accuracy effects all 400 attempts in a season. Sidearm may add 3-6 balls batted down a season.

I'm just saying when I mentioned sidearm delivery, you told me it was all about accuracy.... when he mentioned sidearm deliever, it was a factor in batting balls down....

that's all.

 

[thunderkyss]

Just out of curiosity, is it Delhomme's fault for this pass:



http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/5852122

this was taken from an article in msn sports page.

Just trying to understand if this would be a result of a quaterback making a mistake or a DE making a remarkable catch.

when the play is being described as"DEs aren't supposed to be able to do that"

it ain't the QBs fault.

 

[infantrycak]

I'm just saying when I mentioned sidearm delivery, you told me it was all about accuracy.... when he mentioned sidearm deliever, it was a factor in batting balls down....

that's all.

No, I said what I just did--primarily. Accuracy IMO is the primary reason to have an classic delivery instead of a sidearm delivery. Wasn't trying to totally contradict you, just point out there was a more primary concern.

 

[thunderkyss]

No, I said what I just did--primarily. Accuracy IMO is the primary reason to have an classic delivery instead of a sidearm delivery. Wasn't trying to totally contradict you, just point out there was a more primary concern.

whatever...... we were talking about balls batted down...... I brought up a factor... you went off on a tangent, or decided to attack my football knowledge..... again....

 

[infantrycak]

whatever...... we were talking about balls batted down...... I brought up a factor... you went off on a tangent, or decided to attack my football knowledge..... again....

Attack your football knowledge? You asked a question.

Then enlighten us who have never played before.... what's the point in choosing passing lanes.... or having a high release, or trying to change a sidearm throwing motion??

Look it is even a double question mark question. You want to explain how answering your emphatic question was a tangent?

 

[Hulk75]

By your definition, it is rarely the QB's fault for a tipped ball at the line. How many times does a QB throw a ball that hits a lineman in the face or the crouch anyway?

I disagree with you on this.

The size of the quarterback and his technique are extremely critical in tipped balls at the line. Furthermore, a good defensive lineman as you described can take advantage of a smaller quarterback and/or poor technique and bat more balls down than normal. Therefore, the bigger the QB and the better technique, fewer batted balls.

Every QB is going to have batted balls, but the key is to keep it low.

Carr has had a problem with batted balls because of poor technique. In other words he has had too many batted balls.

Also, I gave you little one on tipped balls by the receiver. Some of those may be the QB's fault. For example, if the QB over or under throws (or maybe leaves the WR hanging out like laundry) the receiver, and the receiver makes an attempt to catch the ball but only tips it, that is the QB's fault. However, if the QB makes a throw right on the money and tipped or whatever, not the QB's fault.

IMO, the QB is 80% responsible for the play on offense (this is assuming adequate coaching and play calling, which Carr didn't have under Capers). The best offensive line, running backs, and receivers cannot overcome poor quarterback play.

You disagree with me?

I got a scholorship to play Definsive Line for 4 years. Had tryouts with pro teams and now play for a semi pro team and what I am telling you is wrong?, you dont agree.
Wether you agree with me or not, the way I said it, is the way it ACCTUALLY is on the field not what you think you see from the stands, I have played down on the line and still do, so when guys tell me "No your wrong"(about a possition I have played my whole life), Its like telling a pilot he does not know how to fly a plane.

And your right, taller QBs have less of a chance getting it knocked down, BUT as I said Offensive lineman are the ones that open passing lanes or SHOULD if they do there job, and when a DLineman jumps up for a ball the OLine is taught to put the DLineman on his back so they do not try it again.
Trust me QBs last thought is the DLinemans hands hitting the ball, he is watching the coverage, he should have 5 guys in front of him taking care of the rest.

 

[thunderkyss]

Attack your football knowledge? You asked a question.



Look it is even a double question mark question. You want to explain how answering your emphatic question was a tangent?

ok....... you're right....... I've got to start using the thing a little more often.

I honestly didn't expect an answer...... so I'm sure you can understand my surprise when I got one, and it wasn't the one I was looking for.

the poster I had quoted in that post was stating his opinion that balls batted down are never the fault of the QB.

I should've just came out and said...... "QBs are taught to utilize passing lanes, and release the ball high to increase passing effeciency, and avoid batted down balls."

my fault, once again excuse me.

 

[hollywood_texan]

You disagree with me?

I got a scholorship to play Definsive Line for 4 years. Had tryouts with pro teams and now play for a semi pro team and what I am telling you is wrong?, you dont agree.
Wether you agree with me or not, the way I said it, is the way it ACCTUALLY is on the field not what you think you see from the stands, I have played down on the line and still do, so when guys tell me "No your wrong"(about a possition I have played my whole life), Its like telling a pilot he does not know how to fly a plane.

And your right, taller QBs have less of a chance getting it knocked down, BUT as I said Offensive lineman are the ones that open passing lanes or SHOULD if they do there job, and when a DLineman jumps up for a ball the OLine is taught to put the DLineman on his back so they do not try it again.
Trust me QBs last thought is the DLinemans hands hitting the ball, he is watching the coverage, he should have 5 guys in front of him taking care of the rest.

I agree with you that it is offensive line's job to create some passing lanes as designed by the play. It is the QB's job to find those lanes and use them.

This is what I said, "Every QB is going to have batted balls, but the key is to keep it low."

Some QBs have more batted balls than others. To get the number down to a reasonable/manageable level, certain techinques are coached.

I don't have the stats on Carr and batted balls, but it seems he has more than the average in the league. Please let me know if observation is incorrect.

Getting to the average or a little lower is what I am saying. Which is what is what should be expected from Carr. I look at this batted ball thing similarily to a point guard in basketball related to turnovers. They are going to happen, but certain techniques and training can minimize the situations.

By the way, good luck in your quest!

I mean that sincerely...

 

[infantrycak]

I don't have the stats on Carr and batted balls, but it seems he has more than the average in the league. Please let me know if observation is incorrect.

% of incompletions due to batted balls:

Carr 7.2%

Bledsow 3.5%
Brady 2.6%
Brees 6.2%
Brunell 3.1%
Bulger 5.3%
Collins 4.9%
Culpepper 7.8%
Delhomme 8.7%
Favre 6.0%
Green 6.3%
Griese 6.5%
Harrington 5.6%
Hasselbeck 5.2%
Leftwich 7.1%
Losman 6.1%
P. Manning 2.7%
E. Manning 6.1%
McNabb 5.5%
McNair 4.3%
Palmer 6.7%
Plummer 7.3%
Big Ben 6.0%
Sims 13.1%
Smith 4.9%
Vick 4.6%

Carr is at the high end but not egregiously out of line like Sims. Given that for you are looking at a range of 5-15 for most QB's getting him down a point or two is 1-3 extra batted balls.

 

[hollywood_texan]

% of incompletions due to batted balls:

Carr 7.2%

Bledsow 3.5%
Brady 2.6%
Brees 6.2%
Brunell 3.1%
Bulger 5.3%
Collins 4.9%
Culpepper 7.8%
Delhomme 8.7%
Favre 6.0%
Green 6.3%
Griese 6.5%
Harrington 5.6%
Hasselbeck 5.2%
Leftwich 7.1%
Losman 6.1%
P. Manning 2.7%
E. Manning 6.1%
McNabb 5.5%
McNair 4.3%
Palmer 6.7%
Plummer 7.3%
Big Ben 6.0%
Sims 13.1%
Smith 4.9%
Vick 4.6%

Carr is at the high end but not egregiously out of line like Sims. Given that for you are looking at a range of 5-15 for most QB's getting him down a point or two is 1-3 extra batted balls.

Thanks!

Where did you find this?

I take it the 1-3 extra balls is for the entire season?

 

[infantrycak]

Thanks!

Where did you find this?

I take it the 1-3 extra balls is for the entire season?

Stats, Inc. Yeah, that would be over the course of a season.

 

[real]

% of incompletions due to batted balls:

Carr 7.2%

Bledsow 3.5%
Brady 2.6%
Brees 6.2%
Brunell 3.1%
Bulger 5.3%
Collins 4.9%
Culpepper 7.8%
Delhomme 8.7%
Favre 6.0%
Green 6.3%
Griese 6.5%
Harrington 5.6%
Hasselbeck 5.2%
Leftwich 7.1%
Losman 6.1%
P. Manning 2.7%
E. Manning 6.1%
McNabb 5.5%
McNair 4.3%
Palmer 6.7%
Plummer 7.3%
Big Ben 6.0%
Sims 13.1%
Smith 4.9%
Vick 4.6%

Carr is at the high end but not egregiously out of line like Sims. Given that for you are looking at a range of 5-15 for most QB's getting him down a point or two is 1-3 extra batted balls.

Would you consider batted balls more of an O-line problem or QB problem ?

 

[infantrycak]

Would you consider batted balls more of an O-line problem or QB problem ?

No way of quanitfying--I'd say this is one of those times stats will give you an idea of the overall magnitude of the problem combined and an idea of which teams are outliers. If you wanted to try to examine it more closely, seems to me you would have to put eyes on film. Doesn't surprise me at all that a smart QB plus good OL (Indy) results in a very low batted down rate.

 

[real]

No way of quanitfying--I'd say this is one of those times stats will give you an idea of the overall magnitude of the problem combined and an idea of which teams are outliers. If you wanted to try to examine it more closely, seems to me you would have to put eyes on film. Doesn't surprise me at all that a smart QB plus good OL (Indy) results in a very low batted down rate.

O.k...I get you...When i played in college my coach always said blamed it on us(the o-line) but he was an idiot...

 

[infantrycak]

O.k...I get you...When i played in college my coach always said blamed it on us(the o-line) but he was an idiot...

I wouldn't be surprised if he was also telling the QB's they were all their fault--out of your hearing of course.