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CJ Stroud year 2

Khelar said:
To be fair watching the game Richardson made a couple great throws that were dropped (partially because he put so much power behind the throw). There's a lot to work on and I don't know if he will be able to make it work but Richardson scares the hell out of me in Indy.
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It wont be this yr, but I view Richardson as Hurts in Stiechen's offense.
 
Mr teX said:
Have watched all these youngins in the PS and Richardson by far to me looks the worst. I’m not enamored with his physical gifts b/c i've seen it before. So all I see is a qb with shaky accuracy, 0 touch and ball placement. He’ll definitely need that LJ8 training wheels starter offense for his 1st few years in the hopes that he can grow from that..but i personally don't see him growing as a real passing threat after that. Like VY, He's just the latest version of that kid who has always been the superior athlete on the field and hence always been able to run away from his problems at the position. problem is few are ever able to have that way of playing the position translate all the way up to the NFL. You have to be elite at running the ball and lightening quick...... like Vick & LJ8 were/are for that to be the case....& he ain't that imo.
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This is a good thing for the Texans for the next 5 yrs.
 
Mr teX said:
Yup. I imagine its like soliders preparing for combat. You can shoot at paper targets and go thru simulation after simulation. But until you step on a real battlefield and your senses are under assault, you don't know how you're gonna react.
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Even in combat or civilian crisis, no one knows what their going to do until it hits. Muscle memory is a thing but that can freeze.
 
Mr teX said:
This. I've never understood why HC's run PS like they do. There should be a gradual ramp up for the starters all the way to week 1. a little in the 1st game, 1 qtr in the 2nd, 1 half to 3 qtrs in the 3rd and then Week 1. Instead, they arbitrarily play these guys in 2-3 games and then when week 1 hits and you've got teams wasting whole games getting guys in sync and on the same page...crap that should've been happening in the PS. Even when they had 4 games the starters wouldn't even play the last game so you've got this dead week in between the end of the PS and the start of the season.

I get the paranoia about potentially a starter getting hur in a meaningless game, but whether its in preseason or in week 1 or 2, you're still facing virtually the same risk. May as well just let these guys ramp up their play more in the PS to get the rust off so that you can hit the regular season running on all cylinders.
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Notice that Brady and Mahomes play more in the preseason than many starting QB's do and they're more successful early than most QB's are.
 
Khelar said:
There's no reason to question Nico Collins' hands at all. Don't believe he had a single drop last year.

To say Hutch and Dell are better at this point is insanity. He isn't a Hopkins jump ball type guy who will go up and make every contested catch which limits his ceiling but he's typically pretty solid and he gets more separation than people think. The long ball from CJ he had a step on his man and the ball was just a smidge underthrown which let the DB get a hand on it. For what it's worth also had a guy beat in the red zone last week that CJ didn't see. I feel pretty strongly that Collins is the best WR on the team at the moment.
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I do also, health will be the key for long term success. Collins is talented.
 
steelbtexan said:
This is a good thing for the Texans for the next 5 yrs.
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Eh… the Ravens are a threat to win the division if Jackson is healthy. The Eagles are a threat to win the NFCEast with Hurts pretending to be a QB.

Richardson doesn’t have to be a good passer to get his team to the playoffs if his coaches handle their business. Not in today’s NFL.
 
thunderkyss said:
Eh… the Ravens are a threat to win the division if Jackson is healthy. The Eagles are a threat to win the NFCEast with Hurts pretending to be a QB.

Richardson doesn’t have to be a good passer to get his team to the playoffs if his coaches handle their business. Not in today’s NFL.
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I love Hurts, he's a hard worker who's improved his game every yr. His accuracy has really improved.
 
Khelar said:
That's objectively not true. His arm is fine, I don't think his arm is anything that will hold an offense back or anything. But there are absolutely throws that guys like Richardson, Allen, Herbert, Jackson, Mahomes, etc can attempt that shouldn't be on Stroud's radar.
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CJ has good arm strength, and can make every throw in an NFL route tree. However, unlike some other QBs he also has a very smooth release and puts his passes where the WR is the only person who is going to catch it. True, he can be fooled still at times. But, that is true for any rookie QB. CJ just happens to have the gift of touch and accuracy. He has been showing it. He is not elite or anything yet but he will be in the conversation of accurate QBs if he keeps progressing well. I think we will likely see him on Sports Center and NFL Today with throws that you immediately have to re-watch to see how precise the pass was. Just my .02 cent on the last part. However, I think other members have seen it and probably will agree with time, he has that ability
 
SnakeEyes said:
CJ has good arm strength, and can make every throw in an NFL route tree. However, unlike some other QBs he also has a very smooth release and puts his passes where the WR is the only person who is going to catch it. True, he can be fooled still at times. But, that is true for any rookie QB. CJ just happens to have the gift of touch and accuracy. He has been showing it. He is not elite or anything yet but he will be in the conversation of accurate QBs if he keeps progressing well. I think we will likely see him on Sports Center and NFL Today with throws that you immediately have to re-watch to see how precise the pass was. Just my .02 cent on the last part. However, I think other members have seen it and probably will agree with time, he has that ability
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Having that ability is one thing, being able to use it successfully in the NFL is another. And only time will answer that.

Right now, Stroud is the best QB on the Texans roster and needs to start. I'd say the 2nd best is Case with Mills being in 3rd place. But I suspect it'll be Mills who is the actual backup to Stroud.
 
zshawn10 said:
except Richardson might be the least accurate starter in the league, Taylor won't be there to help him at all, and their O line is a mess
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The Colts are tanking this yr and as Hurts has proven after working with Stiechen, his accuracy can improve. Hurts wasn't accurate as a rookie and while I love Hurts he doesn't have near the talent that Richardson has. This will come down to Richardson's work ethic, if it's nearly as good as Hurts, then the Colts will have one of the top 5 QB's in the NFL.
 
steelbtexan said:
The Colts are tanking this yr and as Hurts has proven after working with Stiechen, his accuracy can improve. Hurts wasn't accurate as a rookie and while I love Hurts he doesn't have near the talent that Richardson has. This will come down to Richardson's work ethic, if it's nearly as good as Hurts, then the Colts will have one of the top 5 QB's in the NFL.
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Accuracy is a really tough thing to improve for QBs; I know everyone wants a Josh Allen type that is big, fast, can run, and throw but he's the outlier. He's one of the only QBs that I can remember that was not accurate in college and was after a couple of years in the pros but had to really change his mechanics and work hard. Richardson's WRs don't help him much either like Alec Pierce; dude has no seperation at all watching some of the Colts games this preseason
 
zshawn10 said:
Accuracy is a really tough thing to improve for QBs; I know everyone wants a Josh Allen type that is big, fast, can run, and throw but he's the outlier. He's one of the only QBs that I can remember that was not accurate in college and was after a couple of years in the pros but had to really change his mechanics and work hard. Richardson's WRs don't help him much either like Alec Pierce; dude has no seperation at all watching some of the Colts games this preseason
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It's what I call the "Deandre Hopkins effect" where a guy is incredibly good at football and is especially good at one of the fundamental basics - Catching for Deandre and ball placement/accuracy for Stroud but they get underrated because they don't have the "unteachable" tools of freakish athleticism.

I feel like people/scouts/talent evaluators get too caught up in thinking about the "teachable"/"unteachable" skills when the truth is those skills are somewhat unteachable too. You won't be able to teach some kid who runs a 4.3 40 but drops 50% of his passes to catch like Deandre. You just won't. Much the same way that Anthony Richardson will develop his accuracy I'm sure but it will never be as good as Stroud's is now and I'm sure his will improve as well.
 
steelbtexan said:
Hurts wasn't accurate as a rookie and while I love Hurts he doesn't have near the talent that Richardson has.
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Hurts was a 59% passer in the NFL in his 1st 2 seasons. Not good, not good enough anyway. This was after a collegiate career where Jalen threw over 1000 passes over 4 seasons with a 65% completion rate. Hurts one year jump from 2021 to 2022 is the greatest I've ever seen in the NFL.

Richardson was a 54.7% passer in less than 400 collegiate attempts. That's less than half the passes Hurts attempted with over 10% negative difference in completion percentage. Richardson is nowhere near the QB Hurts was coming into the NFL. And Hurts needed a lot of work.

Do you know who the last QB to throw for 54.7% or less in college that still went in the 1st round? Jake Locker in the 2011 draft (3 picks ahead of JJ Watt). Like Richardson, Locker tore up the combine with a 4.51 40 at 231 lbs. A 35.5" vertical with a 6.77 3 cone. So what if he was not accurate in college? They'll fix that in the pros. Athletes like Locker don't grow on trees. Did I mention that Locker ran for nearly 2000 yards and 29 TDs in college? How could he miss?
 
Lucky said:
Hurts was a 59% passer in the NFL in his 1st 2 seasons. Not good, not good enough anyway. This was after a collegiate career where Jalen threw over 1000 passes over 4 seasons with a 65% completion rate. Hurts one year jump from 2021 to 2022 is the greatest I've ever seen in the NFL.

Richardson was a 54.7% passer in less than 400 collegiate attempts. That's less than half the passes Hurts attempted with over 10% negative difference in completion percentage. Richardson is nowhere near the QB Hurts was coming into the NFL. And Hurts needed a lot of work.

Do you know who the last QB to throw for 54.7% or less in college that still went in the 1st round? Jake Locker in the 2011 draft (3 picks ahead of JJ Watt). Like Richardson, Locker tore up the combine with a 4.51 40 at 231 lbs. A 35.5" vertical with a 6.77 3 cone. So what if he was not accurate in college? They'll fix that in the pros. Athletes like Locker don't grow on trees. Did I mention that Locker ran for nearly 2000 yards and 29 TDs in college? How could he miss?
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I agree with you and I'm glad the Colts picked him. This should make the colts irrelevant for the next 5 yrs. But Stiechen saw the talent and thinks he can turn Richardson into a better version of Hurts. I hope he's wrong and the odds are against Richardson becoming what his talent level says he should become.

BTW, Locker didn't love football.
 
steelbtexan said:
I agree with you and I'm glad the Colts picked him. This should make the colts irrelevant for the next 5 yrs. But Stiechen saw the talent and thinks he can turn Richardson into a better version of Hurts. I hope he's wrong and the odds are against Richardson becoming what his talent level says he should become.

BTW, Locker didn't love football.
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I think it’s more that Irsay decided he can be the next Hurts and mandated the pick. Steichen is just another rookie HC agreeing with ownership to get the job. Remember when Kubiak told ownership he could fix Carr to get the job?
 
TheRealJoker said:
I think it’s more that Irsay decided he can be the next Hurts and mandated the pick. Steichen is just another rookie HC agreeing with ownership to get the job. Remember when Kubiak told ownership he could fix Carr to get the job?
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Hope you are right.
 
Thorn said:
Having that ability is one thing, being able to use it successfully in the NFL is another. And only time will answer that.

Right now, Stroud is the best QB on the Texans roster and needs to start. I'd say the 2nd best is Case with Mills being in 3rd place. But I suspect it'll be Mills who is the actual backup to Stroud.
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Very true my friend. And with a little bit of luck. Hopefully we will be talking about his ability week in and week out because he is playing amazing and dropping dimes to our WRs every Sunday
 
Lucky said:
Did I mention that Locker ran for nearly 2000 yards and 29 TDs in college? How could he miss?
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I never would have guessed it the way he played in the NFL. Imagine if he went to a team that featured his ability to run & made him part of the run game, like Baltimore with Lamar or Philly with Jalen.

Trying to turn these kids into something they're not is a non-starter & guys like Steichen don't even try.
 
Khelar said:
It's just the consistency with accuracy that will hold him back. It's an if but if he's able to become more consistent in that regard he will be an absolute terror.
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Or he's going to find a Deshaun Jackson, Tyreek Hill, Rob Gronkowski, or even a DeAndre Hopkins that will compensate for any accuracy issue he might have.

He's a piece of the puzzle.
 
steelbtexan said:
I agree with you and I'm glad the Colts picked him. This should make the colts irrelevant for the next 5 yrs. But Stiechen saw the talent and thinks he can turn Richardson into a better version of Hurts. I hope he's wrong and the odds are against Richardson becoming what his talent level says he should become.

BTW, Locker didn't love football.
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His talent level says he should convert to TE or WR.
 
thunderkyss said:

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Sure would’ve been more convincing if Janice and Hannah were the one’s being interviewed and when that question came up…..in unison, that Caserio guy came into “our” boardroom and stated the team was going to select Will Anderson at 2, and then we said, you shu-up b/c we’ve decided Stroud is going to be our pick…..now get out of here you little life-vest wearing man.

As stated in the past….Caserio and Ryans had a strategy as to how they were going to get a QB (Stroud) and Will Anderson in the same draft. I believe the McNair’s liked the strategy and gave it their blessing.
 
This man gonna die with this line..... put mills in there... let him dies instead

Mills is slightly thicker.. he might survive. Stroud is like stick man
 
Khelar said:

Lots of good in here. The QB School does agree that the long ball to Nico was a little misplaced. A reminder of how small the difference between a good QB and a great QB.
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When I saw that play with my own eyes, my instant reaction was that I couldn’t have placed it any better if I walked up and handed it to him. It was only the perfect coverage of the DB that prevented the completion.

But my initial reaction after listening to this guy’s critique was that he’s an idiot. After listening to him again awhile later, he’s still an idiot. Hopefully, the idiots who subscribe to his dude’s channel are leaving the ‘be realistic’ box checked.
 
Marcus said:
When I saw that play with my own eyes, my instant reaction was that I couldn’t have placed it any better if I walked up and handed it to him. It was only the perfect coverage of the DB that prevented the completion.

But my initial reaction after listening to this guy’s critique was that he’s an idiot. After listening to him again awhile later, he’s still an idiot. Hopefully, the idiots who subscribe to his dude’s channel are leaving the ‘be realistic’ box checked.
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idk about "idiot"...he breaks down film pretty well and explains routes and whats expected....on the throw to Nico...was it perfect? No...it was a bit underthrown and Nico not only had to slow down but also fade to sideline...was it a bad throw?? No, not at all...was a damn near perfect throw and w/ the ball being slightly underthrown it gave the db a chance to miraculously get his hand in there to disrupt the catch...
Will look forward to seeing more throws but hopefully with a reception to show for it in the upcoming games. When the timing and protection get better its going to be exciting to see and root for.
 
Marcus said:
When I saw that play with my own eyes, my instant reaction was that I couldn’t have placed it any better if I walked up and handed it to him. It was only the perfect coverage of the DB that prevented the completion.

But my initial reaction after listening to this guy’s critique was that he’s an idiot. After listening to him again awhile later, he’s still an idiot. Hopefully, the idiots who subscribe to his dude’s channel are leaving the ‘be realistic’ box checked.
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Far from an idiot... just a different perspective.

sd-sp-preps-football-patrick-henry-jt-osullivan-20190109
 
Marcus said:
When I saw that play with my own eyes, my instant reaction was that I couldn’t have placed it any better if I walked up and handed it to him. It was only the perfect coverage of the DB that prevented the completion.

But my initial reaction after listening to this guy’s critique was that he’s an idiot. After listening to him again awhile later, he’s still an idiot. Hopefully, the idiots who subscribe to his dude’s channel are leaving the ‘be realistic’ box checked.
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What is idiotic about this video?
 
DocBar said:
I thought Stroud did a pretty dang good job for his first game, especially with the pounding he took.
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It's getting harder to use the "small sample size" argument to defend Cj Stroud & his low S2 score. It's blatantly obvious that he struggles under pressure.

That said, overall I think he's made progress, handled the pressure better today than what we've seen so far. Still not good, but it looks like something he'll eventually overcome.
 
thunderkyss said:
It's getting harder to use the "small sample size" argument to defend Cj Stroud & his low S2 score. It's blatantly obvious that he struggles under pressure.

That said, overall I think he's made progress, handled the pressure better today than what we've seen so far. Still not good, but it looks like something he'll eventually overcome.
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Even not considering the lack of protection issues, compare his performance to Trevor Lawrence’s first time out, or any other QBs for that matter.

“Blatantly obvious he struggles under pressure”??

Umm…no, it wasn’t.
 
Marcus said:
Even not considering the lack of protection issues, compare his performance to Trevor Lawrence’s first time out, or any other QBs for that matter.

“Blatantly obvious he struggles under pressure”??

Umm…no, it wasn’t.
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They’re hooked on that since some book nerd pointed that out before the draft. And as you can see they’ll go to that BS S-2 crap every single game to validate what the book nerd stated.
 
CJ handled today well. Very encouraged by what I saw, but everyone on offense has something to work on.

For him? He needs to learn to give up on plays sometimes. He took some bad sacks today holding onto the ball when he could’ve just thrown it away.

He also had the tendency to get some happy feet & bailed out the pocket a lil too early at times. Kinda hard to hold this against him considering the beating he took today, but there were a few times I think he felt some phantom pressure and bailed before he had to. Sometimes you gotta stand in there and take that hit to get the ball downfield and scare defenses off blitzing you.

All correctable things..and if we can get him protected and he continues improve, he’s gonna be a great one.
 
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