NoBullTexan
Waterboy
Palmer game plans the way Capers tells him to. If you want blame, blame Dom Capers.
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Chris Palmer is too predictable.
- Thread starter footballguy69
- Start date
Carlton Thompson's article
Will Texans open up the offense?
Q: Carlton, do you foresee Chris Palmer opening up the offense this season?
John in Seagoville
A: John, I believe he will. Sundays game was a good example. The Texans spread the ball very well and moved up and down the field at will against the Chargers. They only punted twice. Other than hitting a few big plays in the passing game - and obviously the four turnovers - I thought the Texans had the right approach offensively. Believe me, John, no one wants to get the ball down the field more than Chris Palmer.
END
As for no killer instint in the 4th Quarter. I saw the Texans Offense bounce back from 3 turnovers and drive the ball to the end zone to score the tieing run. But a FUMBLE killed the drive. Now you see why fumbles are SO critical. Everybody forgets all the good that happened before a fumble on a drive and the fans begin to feel as If they are "playing not to lose" and dont have a "winning attitude". Personally I think its all a bunch of bunk.
Will Texans open up the offense?
Q: Carlton, do you foresee Chris Palmer opening up the offense this season?
John in Seagoville
A: John, I believe he will. Sundays game was a good example. The Texans spread the ball very well and moved up and down the field at will against the Chargers. They only punted twice. Other than hitting a few big plays in the passing game - and obviously the four turnovers - I thought the Texans had the right approach offensively. Believe me, John, no one wants to get the ball down the field more than Chris Palmer.
END
As for no killer instint in the 4th Quarter. I saw the Texans Offense bounce back from 3 turnovers and drive the ball to the end zone to score the tieing run. But a FUMBLE killed the drive. Now you see why fumbles are SO critical. Everybody forgets all the good that happened before a fumble on a drive and the fans begin to feel as If they are "playing not to lose" and dont have a "winning attitude". Personally I think its all a bunch of bunk.
Agree with your general intent but I'll add that if the play works, Palmer is rarely or never a hero - it's taken for granted - the player(s) get the credit - and in many cases the play is forgotten by Monday morning. If ANY play fails, especially running plays for less than a 4 yard gain (which comprise about 50% of all rushing plays for all teams on any given Sunday - and god forbid you run two in a row), then it's forever etched into memory - Palmer/Capers gets the blame for being conservative, unimaginitive, and keeping the playbook closed - and he/they should be fired.
RunninRaven
Practice Squad
I understand that people get tired of harping on the same things over and over. That's one of the downsides of football. With a week of time between games, you generally have run out of things to discuss by Saturday morning. But it just seems entirely pointless to me to focuss much on the coaching staff when, as others have pointed out, there is so very much we don't know. The Baxter run was one of the few playcalls where I think even the average fan can look at it and say "WTF, WHY?" and not be considered to be overreacting. No matter how you look at it, that play didn't make much sense. But in the entire football game, that is really the only legitimate playcall I have seen anyone in here bring up. That's pretty indicative of how difficult it is to pin fault on the coaching staff. We just don't know.
But on the other hand, in terms of the turnovers, we DO know. It's pretty matter-of-fact. Dominick doesn't have the ball. Dominick is handed the ball (or thrown), Dominick has the ball, runs, and then doesn't have the ball. Not many people to blaim there outside of Davis. I doubt we see a repeat. Same with Carr, but to a lesser degree. His situation didn't bother me as much. One INT was on a pass he was trying to force a bit with the time running out and the team trying to get into good FG range, if not a all out TD. The other was on a deflection at the LOS that just happened to launch into freaking orbit and enable the defense to get underneath it easily. That's some bad luck. But hey, it happens.
I feel I'm rambling here so I'll wrap it up. The long and short of it is, the only real, non-muddled, clear target for criticism in most cases (from the perspective of the fans) is the players and their execution. It doesn't seem fair, but it seems to be the way it is. I wish it was possible to sign up for some kind of cable package where you could listen in to the conversations the coaches and players have over their headsets. How awesome would THAT be?
Also, I seem to recall Davis having a couple huge runs being called back because of silly penalities. I hope the team cuts down on those tomorrow as well.
But on the other hand, in terms of the turnovers, we DO know. It's pretty matter-of-fact. Dominick doesn't have the ball. Dominick is handed the ball (or thrown), Dominick has the ball, runs, and then doesn't have the ball. Not many people to blaim there outside of Davis. I doubt we see a repeat. Same with Carr, but to a lesser degree. His situation didn't bother me as much. One INT was on a pass he was trying to force a bit with the time running out and the team trying to get into good FG range, if not a all out TD. The other was on a deflection at the LOS that just happened to launch into freaking orbit and enable the defense to get underneath it easily. That's some bad luck. But hey, it happens.
I feel I'm rambling here so I'll wrap it up. The long and short of it is, the only real, non-muddled, clear target for criticism in most cases (from the perspective of the fans) is the players and their execution. It doesn't seem fair, but it seems to be the way it is. I wish it was possible to sign up for some kind of cable package where you could listen in to the conversations the coaches and players have over their headsets. How awesome would THAT be?
Also, I seem to recall Davis having a couple huge runs being called back because of silly penalities. I hope the team cuts down on those tomorrow as well.
NoBullTexan said:
I am sure Capers and Palmer go over the game plan in general before the game but Im pretty sure Capers himself said Palmer has complete control over the play calling at game time. They script the first few plays and Palmer takes it from there based on the Texans situation.
aj. said:
LOL...good point A.J. I give some fans too much credit I guess. I know the coaches know better and hopefully the owner too. I was impressed with the 2 screen play calls that happened to come during an all out blitz from the Boltz. I wonder If Palmer picked up on something that tipped him off.
eriadoc
Texan-American
Regardless of who is in there to execute it, the practiced response to coverage on that play was ludicrous for the 4th Q with the game on the line. Any point in the game where we are ahead, sure, run it. If the play was supposed to be DD split out and you think that's a good call in the 4th Quarter, down by 7, then fine (I do, FWIW). However, you always have to consider plan B. If plan B is a FB dive at that point in the game, maybe a professional offensive coordinator should think about these things.
Overall, I agree that he did a fine job in the first half, but the Texans play "not to lose" far too often in the second half than they should. Play to win, guys. Perhaps if Palmer didn't already have a history of calling 3rd-and-long draw plays with the game on the line, the fans would be a tad more forgiving.
Overall, I agree that he did a fine job in the first half, but the Texans play "not to lose" far too often in the second half than they should. Play to win, guys. Perhaps if Palmer didn't already have a history of calling 3rd-and-long draw plays with the game on the line, the fans would be a tad more forgiving.
eriadoc
Texan-American
That's true of every OC in the NFL. However, I think you'll find that the number of times a FB dive "works" on 2nd-11 in the 4th Q with the game on the line is very negligible ... no matter which OC is calling it.
As for the turnovers, yes, they lost the game for us, for sure. However, at that point in the game, we were down by 7 with about seven minutes left to play. The turnovers had already been committed and we still had a very legitimate chance to win that game IN SPITE OF the turnovers. That series (the Baxter series) sent the message that the Texans were resigned to losing, whether they intended that message or not.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
It was second and 7 and not 2nd and 11. Also, it was a pass play that Carr checked out of to begin with. Tons of teams have run the ball on a 2nd and seven around mid-field over the years with more than half of the 4th quarter left. It's not unusual. I find it amazing the obsession over this.
eriadoc
Texan-American
If it was 2nd-7, then a run is not a ludicrous call, but please hand it to DD, not Baxter. As for where I am getting 2nd-11, that's what was displayed on the scoreboard in Reliant. I was sitting in section 137, end zone. The scoreboard reflected a loss of 1 on the pass in the flat to Baxter. I did TiVo the game, so I'll go back and verify.
Was the scoreboard incorrect? I guess with the glitches going on that day, I wouldn't be too surprised, hehe.
Was the scoreboard incorrect? I guess with the glitches going on that day, I wouldn't be too surprised, hehe.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
You can't hand the ball off to Davis when he is split out wide in a WIDE OPEN offensive set. The play call wasn't a conservative formation so blaming Palmer for being too conservative here is silly (just a comment in general and not directed at you eriadoc). I'm not in-love with the call either but this is all gotten to the absurd level when we break down one play over and over for a week and try to hang Palmer for this. Palmer called a pass and Carr checked down to a run. Carr could have stayed with the pass call. Carr figured it would work. That's good enough for me. The bottom line on this drive is we called 3 pass plays and we got 3 yards out of them when it was all said and done.eriadoc said:
Houston Texans at 8:34, (1st play from scrimmage 8:28)
1-10-HST 40 (8:28) 8-D.Carr pass to 47-J.Baxter to HST 43 for 3 yards (51-B.Leber).
2-7-HST 43 (7:57) 47-J.Baxter to HST 43 for no gain (99-I.Olshansky; 58-R.Godfrey).
Penalty on HST, Illegal Procedure, declined.
3-7-HST 43 (7:36) (Shotgun) 8-D.Carr sacked at HST 43 for 0 yards (95-S.Phillips).
4-7-HST 43 (6:51) 7-C.Stanley punts 53 yards to SD 4, Center-48-B.Pittman. 88-E.Parker to SD 17 for 13 yards (51-D.Polk, 32-J.Wells). (Punt hang time 4.9 seconds.)
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
why are u trying to crucify palmer? our offense had 4 turnovers and the deffense couldnt shut down tomlinson...how many defenses can? in regard to the turnovers...1 int---batted ball. palmers fault? no. 2nd int---carr had a lineman roll up his ankle. palmers fault? no. davis's fumbles...palmers fault? ummmm no. the turnovers were based on individual performances and not scheme flaws. needless to say the defenses' inabilities are not palmers fault.
without those turnovers the offense puts up great yardage. i dont blame palemer in any way. did he make questionable calls? yes. every coach calls questionable calls. but for the most part our offense did enough to win the game. u need to question fangio more then u do palmer.
i will say im discouraged by the ingame adjustments...the lack of a deep threat offense (u take what the defense gives u------not palmer's fault) and a lack of execution (capers fault?)
what i did like seeing was davis in the slot out wide outside the box.......seperate him from the linebackers and make a cb tackle him. i expect that to keep working and infact i give palmer props for those kind of calls as well as the ocassional supply of screens. carr did a nice job of utilizing more recievers as well.
i am NOT concerned about the offense. if u want to start criticing somebody it needs to be fangio or capers.........the defense will be our weak link this year.
without those turnovers the offense puts up great yardage. i dont blame palemer in any way. did he make questionable calls? yes. every coach calls questionable calls. but for the most part our offense did enough to win the game. u need to question fangio more then u do palmer.
i will say im discouraged by the ingame adjustments...the lack of a deep threat offense (u take what the defense gives u------not palmer's fault) and a lack of execution (capers fault?)
what i did like seeing was davis in the slot out wide outside the box.......seperate him from the linebackers and make a cb tackle him. i expect that to keep working and infact i give palmer props for those kind of calls as well as the ocassional supply of screens. carr did a nice job of utilizing more recievers as well.
i am NOT concerned about the offense. if u want to start criticing somebody it needs to be fangio or capers.........the defense will be our weak link this year.