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Are you guys still on board with hiring Nick Caserio as GM?

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Who handles the contract - I.e. the numbers for guaranteed, non-guaranteed dollars, years etc for the contract? The one who plans how much will go against the salary cap this year and future years? Has it been Rick Smith/Brian Gaine or is there someone behind the GM crunching the numbers?
usually the gm.

Olsen is the cap rules and numbers guru, but Olsen isnt a guy who scouts or decides who makes the roster. He should probably be giving OBrien an outlook on the cap situation over the next several years
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Yes they will have to count on young guys getting better. No guarantee Reader, Roby and Mercilus resign here.

The cap has not gone up $20m in the past 8 years, it's been around $10m increase and reports so far are that it will increase modestly. But that could change.

There is no guarantee you can just fill holes at CB and edge in the draft especially without a first round pick. It's a crapshoot. And reaching for need just puts them in a bigger hole
So they aren't going to re-sign any of their main FA's?

They have the picks but I agree nothing is guaranteed in life, particularly in the draft. See: KJo

But I like their odds after seeing how well they've done the last 2 yrs in the draft and in one of those they didn't have 1st/2nd rd picks just like in 2021. I know Gaine made those picks, but the scouting staff is still pretty much in place.

BTW, Have you heard the NFL/NFLPA are currently trying to hammer out a new CBA and estimates are that the new cap is going to be around 200 mil.

The future is bright regardless if you think so or not.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Who handles the contract - I.e. the numbers for guaranteed, non-guaranteed dollars, years etc for the contract? The one who plans how much will go against the salary cap this year and future years? Has it been Rick Smith/Brian Gaine or is there someone behind the GM crunching the numbers?
The GM tells Olson which FA's want to keep and Olson tells them how mach it will cost and then the GM figures out how they fit under the cap and who might need to be let go so they can keep the players the GM wants to keep.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
So they aren't going to re-sign any of their main FA's?

They have the picks but I agree nothing is guaranteed in life, particularly in the draft. See: KJo

But I like their odds after seeing how well they've done the last 2 yrs in the draft and in one of those they didn't have 1st/2nd rd picks just like in 2021. I know Gaine made those picks, but the scouting staff is still pretty much in place.

BTW, Have you heard the NFL/NFLPA are currently trying to hammer out a new CBA and estimates are that the new cap is going to be around 200 mil.

The future is bright regardless if you think so or not.
They might sign FAs, they might not. I don't know. But they have 87-92 in capspace, have to extend Watson and Tunsil (unclear if they get big raises the first year).

They have found two staters so far in each of the last two draft. Most guys are bench guys or don't work out, which is normal for all teams. And it's no guarantee that they hit on positions of need.
 

Rich Schmidt

Myopicone
They might sign FAs, they might not. I don't know. But they have 87-92 in capspace, have to extend Watson and Tunsil (unclear if they get big raises the first year).

They have found two staters so far in each of the last two draft. Most guys are bench guys or don't work out, which is normal for all teams. And it's no guarantee that they hit on positions of need.
I would say 3 is more the trend, then hope for some depth hits
Tytus, Max, Lonnie for 2019, Charlesd O looks like a depth steal and future starter
Reid, QT, Akins for 2018, just depth special teamers
DW4, Zach for 2017, Carlos Watkins as depth
Fuller, Martin Reader for 16
15 and 14, only guy left is McKinney, rosters really roll over!
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
They might sign FAs, they might not. I don't know. But they have 87-92 in capspace, have to extend Watson and Tunsil (unclear if they get big raises the first year).

They have found two staters so far in each of the last two draft. Most guys are bench guys or don't work out, which is normal for all teams. And it's no guarantee that they hit on positions of need.
You didn't address the new CBA and the increase in the cap. They should have the cap space to sign the FA's they want to keep.

I've already been through this with you, but last game from the 2018 draft the Texans starters from last game are Reid/Akins/Coutee and from this yrs draft the 2019 draft Howard/L.Jo/Scharping/Charlie O is play most of the snaps if he's not starting./You can count the Aggie FB as a starter if you want too or not.

Anywho the Texans have only have gotten 3 starters out of the last 3 drafts is false and you know better.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
The GM tells Olson which FA's want to keep and Olson tells them how mach it will cost and then the GM figures out how they fit under the cap and who might need to be let go so they can keep the players the GM wants to keep.


People are making this no GM situation worse than what it is @kdog. We know who we need to re-sign.

1. Watson (maybe)
2. Tunsil
3. Mercilus
4. Reader
5. Roby
6. Someone I forgot

When the season is over have the Watson call potential FAs to come play with us. He would be a great ambassador.

Sign the guys now during the season or after.

It’s really not that complicated when you have the intellectual capital already here managing the cap numbers and contract language. We 100 million in cap space potentially.

We are sitting really good.

With OBs new game plan, DW finding the short passes, RBs running angry, line protecting Watson, defense OK, and all we can complain about is injuries and our kicker things are looking good. Especially with Brady getting older everyday.

#optimism
 
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TheKDog

Hall of Fame
You didn't address the new CBA and the increase in the cap. They should have the cap space to sign the FA's they want to keep.

I've already been through this with you, but last game from the 2018 draft the Texans starters from last game are Reid/Akins/Coutee and from this yrs draft the 2019 draft Howard/L.Jo/Scharping/Charlie O is play most of the snaps if he's not starting./You can count the Aggie FB as a starter if you want too or not.

Anywho the Texans have only have gotten 3 starters out of the last 3 drafts is false and you know better.
The NFL cap is 188 million. So 200 is not a 20m increase
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame


People are making this no GM situation worse than what it is @kdog. We know who we need to re-sign.

1. Watson (maybe)
2. Tunsil
3. Mercilus
4. Reader
5. Roby
6. Someone I forgot

When the season is over have the Watson call potential FAs to come play with us. He would be a great ambassador.

Sign the guys now during the season or after.

It’s really not that complicated when you have the intellectual capital already here managing the cap numbers and contract language. We 100 million in cap space potentially.

We are sitting really good.

With OBs new game plan, DW finding the short passes, RBs running angry, line protecting Watson, defense OK, and all we can complain about is injuries and our kicker things are looking good. Especially with Brady getting older everyday.

#optimism
Hyde and Fells are also free agents. Cole is a restricted free agent.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
I would say 3 is more the trend, then hope for some depth hits
Tytus, Max, Lonnie for 2019, Charlesd O looks like a depth steal and future starter
Reid, QT, Akins for 2018, just depth special teamers
DW4, Zach for 2017, Carlos Watkins as depth
Fuller, Martin Reader for 16
15 and 14, only guy left is McKinney, rosters really roll over!
They really do roll over when you dont draft well in rds 3-6.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Hyde and Fells are also free agents. Cole is a restricted free agent.
These are vet min type guys.

Shouldn't be a problem bringing them back.

I trust Easterby/Olson/Caserio eventually to be able to manage the cap and how they structure the contracts much more than I do you're cap knowledge.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
These are vet min type guys.

Shouldn't be a problem bringing them back.

I trust Easterby/Olson/Caserio eventually to be able to manage the cap and how they structure the contracts much more than I do you're cap knowledge.
Caserio isn't available until after the draft.

Easterby is a chaplain and Olson is not a personnel guy
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
Go ahead and worry you're little head off.

Easterby is 100 times sharper than you are. Me too for that matter. Easterby isn't a team chaplain, he's upper mgmt. Are you really just trying to troll me?
The only thing that I would be concerned about that may be difficult to replace is Romeo Crennel. Who is going to replace him? Does he have an assistant he has been grooming over the years?
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
The only thing that I would be concerned about that may be difficult to replace is Romeo Crennel. Who is going to replace him? Does he have an assistant he has been grooming over the years?
Don't know

Vrabel was supposed to be the guy. Hopefully he's training up the next Vrabel.
 
Caserio isn't available until after the draft.

Easterby is a chaplain and Olson is not a personnel guy
You keep hammering this chaplain point home like that is suppose to be a knock against him. You have a problem with religious people Kdog? My grandfather was a pastor for 40 years, guess what he was also a pipefitter, a high school football coach, a mechanic and a tournament winning fisherman. Just because someone is a "chaplain" doesn't mean they don't have other skills or are not qualified for a job.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
You keep hammering this chaplain point home like that is suppose to be a knock against him. You have a problem with religious people Kdog? My grandfather was a pastor for 40 years, guess what he was also a pipefitter, a high school football coach, a mechanic and a tournament winning fisherman. Just because someone is a "chaplain" doesn't mean they don't have other skills or are not qualified for a job.
Not at all, I just don't like hiring someone for a job they aren't qualified for.

I think Christopher Nolan is a great director but I would be laughing at hiring the movie director as a gm
 

Rich Schmidt

Myopicone
Based on his past work he was a character coach not qualified to make personnel decisions. I think he's hired to have major input into that
All signs and public statements say he is basically the make it better guy. He is looking up and down the org to see what needs to improve and starting programmes to do that. Could be anything from the cafeteria to org structure and telling guys what they need to hear. This does not take DEEP football acumen, and actually people too deep in the weeds sometimes cannot see a better way. I actually think he knows how to give people feedback in a way they receive it. It is clear to me he told Cal some things that needed to be done differently and Cal is acting. I have no proof as they only talk about their little initiatives/programmes but seems to be happening. I don't get the feeling he is saying we need longer more physical people, BUT, I would not be surprised if he is not helping with traits needed to build a culture. Let's rate outcomes and see if this team becomes good, and sustainably good. Then we should just be happy with whatever voodoo is happening
 

Mangler

Veteran
The more I look through the roster, the more I hope we sign Caserio. We’re dang near almost complete, we just need to hit on a couple of decent corners, maybe one more pass rusher, and add depth to our O-line. Easterby came in and got Cal to semi-clean house, and we’re seeing the difference early on! If we can land the next piece (Caserio) I’m sure we will be even better! Good things are coming...
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
All signs and public statements say he is basically the make it better guy. He is looking up and down the org to see what needs to improve and starting programmes to do that. Could be anything from the cafeteria to org structure and telling guys what they need to hear. This does not take DEEP football acumen, and actually people too deep in the weeds sometimes cannot see a better way. I actually think he knows how to give people feedback in a way they receive it. It is clear to me he told Cal some things that needed to be done differently and Cal is acting. I have no proof as they only talk about their little initiatives/programmes but seems to be happening. I don't get the feeling he is saying we need longer more physical people, BUT, I would not be surprised if he is not helping with traits needed to build a culture. Let's rate outcomes and see if this team becomes good, and sustainably good. Then we should just be happy with whatever voodoo is happening
Belichick had enough respect for his opinions that he made it a point to have Easterby be present on all personnel meetings.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Offered the title Character Coach/Team Development, he accepted the challenge to be “the seeds and water of truth, love, and support to grow people and have them be encouragement-oriented.”

As team chaplain, Easterby heads Patriots Bible study sessions, which, for many years prior to his arrival, were player-led. Slater points out that this responsibility was difficult for them.

So, what exactly does Easterby do for the Patriots? He boils it down to this.

“How can I leave everyone I interact with better than I found them?”

Results may vary from person to person, but on this, there is consensus: Easterby is succeeding.

“He always says, in 10, 20 years, you get to know somebody, and then their name pops up on your phone,” Hollister explains. “Something’s going to come to mind when you think of that person. So, he asks us, ‘What are you doing to make sure that’s a positive thing?’”


https://www.patriots.com/news/you-don-t-know-jack-the-most-influential-patriot-you-ve-never-heard-of
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Yes but he is not the one deciding how much to offer. O'Brien and the personnel guys decide on that.
That's absolutely wrong...........Olsen has always negotiated the contracts and managed the cap............which includes how much is offered. He heads up Texans analytics.............others may input to him the player's level of importance by position and to the team, etc..........but he makes the determinations as to how much their $ value is and how much is offered.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
That's absolutely wrong...........Olsen has always negotiated the contracts and managed the cap............which includes how much is offered. He heads up Texans analytics.............others may input to him the player's level of importance by position and to the team, etc..........but he makes the determinations as to how much their $ value is and how much is offered.
So if he decides that tunsil is only worth $13 million and tunsil doesn't want to sign, that's it? Obrien won't tell him to offer more?

I find that hard to believe and I see nothing in his background that would make him the expert on how to value players. His entire experience is in football administration and cap rules, not in personnel and scouting

https://www.houstontexans.com/team/front-office-roster/chris-olsen


"Olsen served as the manager of labor operations with the NFL Management Council from 1999-2006, where he was responsible for reviewing and analyzing player contracts to ensure teams were in compliance with the Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) and salary cap, and provided assistance to club executives pertaining to player-related areas of the CBA."
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
So if he decides that tunsil is only worth $13 million and tunsil doesn't want to sign, that's it? Obrien won't tell him to offer more?

I find that hard to believe and I see nothing in his background that would make him the expert on how to value players. His entire experience is in football administration and cap rules, not in personnel and scouting

https://www.houstontexans.com/team/front-office-roster/chris-olsen


"Olsen served as the manager of labor operations with the NFL Management Council from 1999-2006, where he was responsible for reviewing and analyzing player contracts to ensure teams were in compliance with the Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) and salary cap, and provided assistance to club executives pertaining to player-related areas of the CBA."
others may input to him the player's level of importance by position and to the team, etc
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
So obrien is giving him some input onin Tunsils value but Olsen makes the final decision on what he's worth? A non football guy?

Don't buy it. I seriously doubt he is the one making the final call on a players value given he has no scouting experience. He handles the contract language and details and calling up and making the offers O'Brien wants him to make
 
So obrien is giving him some input onin Tunsils value but Olsen makes the final decision on what he's worth? A non football guy?

Don't buy it. I seriously doubt he is the one making the final call on a players value given he has no scouting experience. He handles the contract language and details and calling up and making the offers O'Brien wants him to make
Dude there are a lot of “non-football guy” that makes major decisions on every football team just like every other industry. You honestly think the CEO of Exxonmobil knows how to run a chemical plant or all the people calling the shoots in Dell how to build a computer or the board of directions of Ford how to fix a car?

You don’t need to be a football guy to do his job. You look at the level of production compared to others at similar positions and salary levels, difficulty in finding a replacement if needed and how it will fit into your overall budget. Then take input from the HC and GM, in this case one and the same, on the stuff you don’t know like locker room leadership or training camp improvements and yes even if the coach just wants to keep the player. Then based on all that you put an offer together and let the wheeling and dealing begin. No scouting knowledge or being a football guy required.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
So if he decides that tunsil is only worth $13 million and tunsil doesn't want to sign, that's it? Obrien won't tell him to offer more?

I find that hard to believe and I see nothing in his background that would make him the expert on how to value players. His entire experience is in football administration and cap rules, not in personnel and scouting

https://www.houstontexans.com/team/front-office-roster/chris-olsen


"Olsen served as the manager of labor operations with the NFL Management Council from 1999-2006, where he was responsible for reviewing and analyzing player contracts to ensure teams were in compliance with the Collective Bargaining Agreement (CBA) and salary cap, and provided assistance to club executives pertaining to player-related areas of the CBA."
You do realize this statement is about what he was doing thirteen (13) years ago and has very limited relevance to what he is doing today.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Analytics have entered all facets of football operations on more and more NFL teams. This is only one way.

*****************************************************************


Analytics is playing a role in Texans coach Bill O'Brien's decision making


By: Avery Duncan | October 18, 2019 9:00 pm ET

Last Sunday, the Houston Texans could have attempted a field goal with a struggling kicker (Ka’imi Fairbairn) to put away the Chiefs in Kansas City. Or they could have gone for it on 4th-and-3 to ensure a victory. Coach Bill O’Brien chose the latter.

O’Brien’s opting to go for it won the hearts of analytics website Pro Football Focus, who named him his decision as the AWS Decision of the Week. PFF gave Houston a 60% chance of converting, which would give them a 100% chance of winning. If they drilled the 45-yard field goal, they had a 92% chance of winning.

The Texans converted the 4th-and-3 and won the game. What went into O’Brien’s decision? Partially analytics, which helped him guide his decision, amongst other situational factors.

“I think you can use them as a guide, but once you get into the game, you’ve got to understand how the game is being played, everything from where the ball is, what defensive call you expect versus the personnel that you have in the game, what’s the score of the game, how many timeouts,” said O’Brien on Wednesday.

“There’s a lot that goes into it, but I certainly think that analytics, the projects that these guys do for us during the week, can definitely help guide us to make the best decision possible for the team on game day,” O’Brien continued.

Houston’s analytics department — led by Chris Olsen and helped by Russell Joyner — doesn’t make the decisions for the Texans. However, their findings do outlay context for O’Brien and Co., which can play a role in making tough choices.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
Analytics have entered all facets of football operations on more and more NFL teams. This is only one way.

*****************************************************************


Analytics is playing a role in Texans coach Bill O'Brien's decision making


By: Avery Duncan | October 18, 2019 9:00 pm ET

Last Sunday, the Houston Texans could have attempted a field goal with a struggling kicker (Ka’imi Fairbairn) to put away the Chiefs in Kansas City. Or they could have gone for it on 4th-and-3 to ensure a victory. Coach Bill O’Brien chose the latter.

O’Brien’s opting to go for it won the hearts of analytics website Pro Football Focus, who named him his decision as the AWS Decision of the Week. PFF gave Houston a 60% chance of converting, which would give them a 100% chance of winning. If they drilled the 45-yard field goal, they had a 92% chance of winning.

The Texans converted the 4th-and-3 and won the game. What went into O’Brien’s decision? Partially analytics, which helped him guide his decision, amongst other situational factors.

“I think you can use them as a guide, but once you get into the game, you’ve got to understand how the game is being played, everything from where the ball is, what defensive call you expect versus the personnel that you have in the game, what’s the score of the game, how many timeouts,” said O’Brien on Wednesday.

“There’s a lot that goes into it, but I certainly think that analytics, the projects that these guys do for us during the week, can definitely help guide us to make the best decision possible for the team on game day,” O’Brien continued.

Houston’s analytics department — led by Chris Olsen and helped by Russell Joyner — doesn’t make the decisions for the Texans. However, their findings do outlay context for O’Brien and Co., which can play a role in making tough choices.
I agree with this. Olsen does not make decisions, but I do think he lays the salary cap context for obrien and the rest of the personnel team to make decisions
 
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TheKDog

Hall of Fame
You do realize this statement is about what he was doing thirteen (13) years ago and has very limited relevance to what he is doing today.
On the Texans his main role has been football administration. He hasn't been out on the practice field, or watching film, or scouting guys. He doesn't have the experience to value guys. He knows the salary cap and contract rules


https://www.google.com/amp/s/texanswire.usatoday.com/2019/06/07/chris-olsen-perfect-texans-interim-gm-deal-jadeveon-clowney/amp/
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
On the Texans his main role has been football administration. He hasn't been out on the practice field, or watching film, or scouting guys. He doesn't have the experience to value guys. He knows the salary cap and contract rules


https://www.google.com/amp/s/texanswire.usatoday.com/2019/06/07/chris-olsen-perfect-texans-interim-gm-deal-jadeveon-clowney/amp/
You can't negotiate with players and their agents without knowing and understanding their value. If someone like O'Brien said I want such and such player, and the demands were entirely out of line, he's not going to be allowed to give away the farm at the detriment of the team and team finances. Such a conflict would only be over-ruled by the owner. With all teams, there are many times that players that a coach and GM may desperately want to retain aren't kept...............because they can't, as laid out by the head contract negotiator/salary cap manager.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
You can't negotiate with players and their agents without knowing and understanding their value. If someone like O'Brien said I want such and such player, and the demands were entirely out of line, he's not going to be allowed to give away the farm at the detriment of the team and team finances. Such a conflict would only be over-ruled by the owner. With all teams, there are many times that players that a coach and GM may desperately want to retain aren't kept...............because they can't, as laid out by the head contract negotiator/salary cap manager.
That's basically how I see it. OBrien has the most say but Olsen can inform him in how it affects finances. Owner can always step in.

Arguably we have given away the farm for Nick Martin, Tunsil and in the clowney trade. The guys who would have said that's not smart (gaine) are gone
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
The Texans failed in their pursuit of esteemed Patriots personnel executive Nick Caserio last spring, but league sources said it remains very likely that Caserio joins that franchise in a prominent role in 2020. Houston remains very interested in the key figure in New England's dynasty, and Caserio is a free agent after the season.
I keep reading here that Caserio won't be available until after the draft. That doesn't make sense. Contracts end after the league year. Caserio should be available for the FA period and the draft.
 

TheKDog

Hall of Fame
I keep reading here that Caserio won't be available until after the draft. That doesn't make sense. Contracts end after the league year. Caserio should be available for the FA period and the draft.
@TomPelissero: Nick Caserio's contract with the #Patriots is up after the 2020 draft, per sources. So after dropping pursuit of Caserio in light of contract issue, the #Texans' options now are: 1) Hire someone else as GM; or 2) Wait until next year. For now, I'm told the process will continue.
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
@TomPelissero: Nick Caserio's contract with the #Patriots is up after the 2020 draft, per sources.
But that doesn't make sense. Contracts don't run for a 3rd of the year. As we know from last summer's fiasco, Caserio's contract would not be enforceable because league rules allow executives to interview and accept offers for a high level position. I doubt any of those provisions (contract ending prior to end of league year or the ban on interviews) would pass NFL scrutiny if Caserio challenged them. If Caserio and the Texans still want to be together after the season, I don't think Belichick and the Patriots can keep it from happening.
 


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