Andre Johnson

[DaTruthExplodes]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

 

[PapaL]

OK, let's do a quick comparison here.

This year, so far, we have been targeting AJ on the average 6 times per game.
He caught 17 balls for 283 yards and 2 TDs in 5 games.

In 2010, in 13 games, AJ was target an average of nearly 11 times per game.
He caught 86 balls for 1,226 yards and 8 TDs

Similarly, in 2009, in 16 games, AJ was targeted nearly 11 time per game.
He caught 101 balls for 1,569 yards and 9 TDs.

From basic math, if AJ is being targeted as much as he did in 2009, he would end up having a better year than 2009.

Is it because that AJ can't no longer get open that we don't throw the ball to him as much? No. I rewatched the Jets game (with the all-22 and end-zone views) and this is what happened:

- On the first four pass attemptes by Schaub, AJ was double-teamed on all four.

- On the fifth pass - the TD to OD - AJ was also wide open underneath on a speed out route (that requires a hard jab step to the inside before cutting to the outside); AJ's cut was sharp and he could have gained at least 10 yards. But since O.D. was so side open deep, Schaub went to him for the TD.

- On the sixth pass, Cromartie did a good job not biting on AJ's double move; Schaub threw the ball away.

- On the seventh pass, AJ was ahead of the receiver on a shallow crossing route, but Schaub went to Foster because there was a LB in the middle of the field at the time AJ crossed the middle of the field.

- On the eight pass, Schaub threw an INT when he tried to fit the ball into double coverage. This is the exact post route that AJ had ran a couple of times earlier and the coverage was exactly the same (double-team.)

- On the ninth pass, AJ was open with a stop and go move as the CB gave him plenty of cushion; Schaub already went to Casey underneath for 5 yards.

- He was not on the field for the next pass.

- On the eleventh pass, AJ was triple-teamed on a similar post route. Schaub went to Casey for 7.

- On the twelfth pass, AJ was wide open on a deep in route, but Schaub had already decided to go quickly to Foster underneath for a 17-yd catch and run.
His sharp cut on this route cannot be denied. He got a ton of seperation from the DB. He left Cromartie in the dirt just as OD did on the TD pass. This one could have gone for at least twenty yards.

....

And so on and so on... You get the drift.

Great write up, seriously.

Rolling coverages and double triple teaming him isn't anything new. He's dealt w this when he was our only weapon and HWSNBN was the QB yet he still made plays. Maybe before Schaub would force more balls and AJ had to make a play - but not Schaub see's someone else wide open; I don't know. All I know is that when AJ is barreling through the secondary and dragging DBs w him we are damn near unstoppable. I want THAT guy back.

 

[run-david-run]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

And Kareem Jackson is the worst starting CB in the league....

 

[HJam72]

We all have to deal with the inevitable fact that we are getting older. AJ will have to do this as well, whether now or later. It wouldn't bother me at all if we had our next great receiver in a few years and AJ was the best #2 receiver in the game for a while.

I think CnD is right and I just hope that it will heal eventually, but he won't be the GOAT forever.

 

[Ryan]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

You mean in 2010 when he caught 1300 receiving yards on one leg? Ok then.

 

[kiwitexansfan]

Teams are putting a safety over the top on Andre... that's why you see this:



When your TE compares favorably to most of the big WR names of the year, it tells you 1) defenses are committed to taking away AJ and 2) AJ may be less able to beat double teams.

Let's see how the rest of the year shakes out before we put Andre in mothballs.

Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

 

[76Texan]

Great write up, seriously.

Rolling coverages and double triple teaming him isn't anything new. He's dealt w this when he was our only weapon and HWSNBN was the QB yet he still made plays. Maybe before Schaub would force more balls and AJ had to make a play - but not Schaub see's someone else wide open; I don't know. All I know is that when AJ is barreling through the secondary and dragging DBs w him we are damn near unstoppable. I want THAT guy back.

Well, we all saw what happened when Schaub tried to force that ball into double coverage in the Jets game.

For the most part, however, I think Matt had done a great job to find the open man rather than forcing the ball like before.

There were too many times that AJ had to win those balls in the past.
I think we don't have to do that now with a more mature Schaub.
Look at his QB rating; Schaub can find an open man most of the time.

I'd rather him go for the safe throws unless we really need him to.
So far we don't have to risk that, and it's great news!

BTW, no team has been able to stop us yet; knock on wood.
We made it hard for ourselves here and there; otherwise, it would have been a blow-out in each and every single game we've played so far.

 

[hradhak]

I'd agree that AJ is probably not the best he has been. Still, even at his best AJ has never been a player that beats you every game. He's had games with huge numbers and catches and others with little.

What bothers me more at this point is that we are getting no production from our trio of #3 receivers. Martin, Jean, and Posey have done nothing to inspire confidence. Their lack of production pretty much puts it all on the TEs, AJ, and KW

 

[kiwitexansfan]

I'd agree that AJ is probably not the best he has been. Still, even at his best AJ has never been a player that beats you every game. He's had games with huge numbers and catches and others with little.

What bothers me more at this point is that we are getting no production from our trio of #3 receivers. Martin, Jean, and Posey have done nothing to inspire confidence. Their lack of production pretty much puts it all on the TEs, AJ, and KW

That raises a question of how often we are in 3 or 4 WR sets, how much Schaub is targetting them, are they getting seperation etc.

There are so many factors to consider when talking about WR production.

Not to mention the fact we do like to run the ball a whole lot.

 

[76Texan]

Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

I'll go watch me some Lions game to see what happens there.

For now, I remember when Orvlosky was with the Lions, he forced a lot of balls to CJ. (I remember watching those games when we first signed Orvlosky to see how he performs.)

Sometimes CJ made plays, and sometimes the defenders made plays.

 

[rolyat93]

If you don't think Rick Smith has the stones to make AJ the next salary cap casualty, you must not remember what he did with Demeco Ryans.

It's not the same situation. He let Meco go because we already had Brian Cushing playing at an elite level. Who's gonna fill in for AJ? Keyshawn Martin? :vincepalm:

 

[hradhak]

That raises a question of how often we are in 3 or 4 WR sets, how much Schaub is targetting them, are they getting seperation etc.

There are so many factors to consider when talking about WR production.

Not to mention the fact we do like to run the ball a whole lot.

I would argue that we don't go to 3 and 4 WR sets because Kubes has no confidence in these guys. The only time I see Martin / Jean etc out on the field is to spell AJ and KW. On some level these guys are limiting our playcalling.

 

[run-david-run]

This Packers game sets up perfectly for a litmus test of sorts. Andre was rather embarrassed by Cromartie, if not in performance (haven't seen the film) at least in production.
Combine that with a (potentially) high scoring team coming in against a D that just lost Cush. I've kept myself positive by saying AJ hasn't been getting the numbers because we haven't needed him to. Now I think we need him to. If the offense is struggling, the D is getting lit up and Andre doesn't come to the rescue, we can probably call it the end of an era (not a career, calm down).

But I really think he's showing up Sunday night.

 

[76Texan]

This Packers game sets up perfectly for a litmus test of sorts. Andre was rather embarrassed by Cromartie, if not in performance (haven't seen the film) at least in production.
Combine that with a (potentially) high scoring team coming in against a D that just lost Cush. I've kept myself positive by saying AJ hasn't been getting the numbers because we haven't needed him to. Now I think we need him to. If the offense is struggling, the D is getting lit up and Andre doesn't come to the rescue, we can probably call it the end of an era (not a career, calm down).

But I really think he's showing up Sunday night.

David, read my post here:

OK, let's do a quick comparison here.

This year, so far, we have been targeting AJ on the average 6 times per game.
He caught 17 balls for 283 yards and 2 TDs in 5 games.

In 2010, in 13 games, AJ was target an average of nearly 11 times per game.
He caught 86 balls for 1,226 yards and 8 TDs

Similarly, in 2009, in 16 games, AJ was targeted nearly 11 time per game.
He caught 101 balls for 1,569 yards and 9 TDs.

From basic math, if AJ is being targeted as much as he did in 2009, he would end up having a better year than 2009.

Is it because that AJ can't no longer get open that we don't throw the ball to him as much? No. I rewatched the Jets game (with the all-22 and end-zone views) and this is what happened:

- On the first four pass attemptes by Schaub, AJ was double-teamed on all four.

- On the fifth pass - the TD to OD - AJ was also wide open underneath on a speed out route (that requires a hard jab step to the inside before cutting to the outside); AJ's cut was sharp and he could have gained at least 10 yards. But since O.D. was so side open deep, Schaub went to him for the TD.

- On the sixth pass, Cromartie did a good job not biting on AJ's double move; Schaub threw the ball away.

- On the seventh pass, AJ was ahead of the receiver on a shallow crossing route, but Schaub went to Foster because there was a LB in the middle of the field at the time AJ crossed the middle of the field.

- On the eight pass, Schaub threw an INT when he tried to fit the ball into double coverage. This is the exact post route that AJ had ran a couple of times earlier and the coverage was exactly the same (double-team.)

- On the ninth pass, AJ was open with a stop and go move as the CB gave him plenty of cushion; Schaub already went to Casey underneath for 5 yards.

- He was not on the field for the next pass.

- On the eleventh pass, AJ was triple-teamed on a similar post route. Schaub went to Casey for 7.

- On the twelfth pass, AJ was wide open on a deep in route, but Schaub had already decided to go quickly to Foster underneath for a 17-yd catch and run.
His sharp cut on this route cannot be denied. He got a ton of seperation from the DB. He left Cromartie in the dirt just as OD did on the TD pass. This one could have gone for at least twenty yards.

....

And so on and so on... You get the drift.

There was one time AJ was open in the end-zone, but Schaub saw the safety getting ready to cut him off, so he went to the left side (and ended up throwing the ball away.)

On that particular play, a quick throw to AJ would have gotten the job done; however, we can't ask Schaub to be perfect.

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I noticed on Schaubs int that AJ was running an out and up or 10 route. He rounded off the out part of the route so Cromartie didn't bite and was waiting on Schaub to throw the deep ball. AJ used to be able to go up and make plays even if he was covered. Not so much anymore.

I dont know why AJ is rounding his routes. It could be that his Hamstring/Groin/Knee/ankle injuries have caught up to him. Or it could've been that AJ just had a bad game.

But there's little doubt Gary has changed the way he's using AJ. Gary may be nursing AJ through the season so that he will be healthy for the playoffs. (Hopefully this is the case.)

I'll have to go back and take a look at that. I thought he was running a 12 or a 6.

Other than that, I agree with your post. I think something's wrong with AJ and I'm not sure what. And it's eating away at his confidence.

I think Schaub forces the ball to Andre because he trusts Andre and wants to get him involved. And you never know when Andre's going to make an incredible play on a ball.

I think Gary's using him differently than in the past because of whatever issue he's dealing with.

 

[Marcus]

It's not the same situation. He let Meco go because we already had Brian Cushing playing at an elite level. Who's gonna fill in for AJ? Keyshawn Martin? :vincepalm:

Rick Smith could have care less who filled in for Demeco. He let him go because he thought (rightly or wrongly) his salary didn't match his skills.

And if he lets AJ go, it will be for exactly the same reason. That's what general managers do.

 

[76Texan]

I'll have to go back and take a look at that. I thought he was running a 12 or a 6.

Other than that, I agree with your post. I think something's wrong with AJ and I'm not sure what. And it's eating away at his confidence.

I think Schaub forces the ball to Andre because he trusts Andre and wants to get him involved. And you never know when Andre's going to make an incredible play on a ball.

I think Gary's using him differently than in the past because of whatever issue he's dealing with.

It was a post route all the way.

I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

He has always been hard on himself.

If you catch an interview on HT.com, AJ talked about always wanting to go out there and be perfect. There was also an interview that I saw on the local news where he said the same thing.
But he has never been perfect. He dropped some balls every year.

He might be pressing a little bit and ended up dropping a few balls already this year. That's more than what normally happened with him (based on the number of balls thrown his way.)

 

[run-david-run]

David, read my post here:



There was one time AJ was open in the end-zone, but Schaub saw the safety getting ready to cut him off, so he went to the left side (and ended up throwing the ball away.)

On that particular play, a quick throw to AJ would have gotten the job done; however, we can't ask Schaub to be perfect.

Very well broken down. The interception (which was a bad read and a bad throw from Matt, behind AJ when Cromartie was trailing underneath the throw) definitely made us go more conservative in the passing game. Against the Jets, that made sense, their one offensive TD came following the great field position that pick gave them.
After that, it was a matter of not letting their defense beat us when their offense couldn't. It will be very interesting to see how we do against the Packers and Ravens in this regard.

Even if it's just as a possession receiver with the occasional double move, AJ can still be a force in this league. Just ask Miami.

 

[infantrycak]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

Horse pucky. In 2010 AJ led the league in yards per game.

In 2011 he played the 1st 3 games with Schaub. In those he was on pace to 116 rec. for 1685 yds. In the playoffs he was - 13 rec. for 201 yds.

 

[dalemurphy]

Either Andre Johnson's sore/injured groin is hobbling him, or he has lost explosion for other reasons (hamstring tear and subsequent surgery, for example)...

Regardless of what the stats may or may not show, any honest view of AJ's movement this season will see he is physically quite limited. Hopefully, it is a current injury that he can recover from. Or, he will be able to rehab or strengthen whatever the lingering issues are and eventually regain most of his explosiveness. Either way, we are good. No need to lie to ourselves. He isn't right but we are 5-0 despite that.

 

[76Texan]

Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

This game rewind thing is pretty good.
It has a list of all the plays that you can scroll through to pick the one you want to watch.

I watched the Lions/Vikings game, and here are some of the things I observed:

The safety broke up 3 deep passes to CJ.
The safety turned the wrong way and wasn't able to help the CB on one play (he was expecting Stafford to go to a different receiver.)
CJ ran into the zone between two safeties on one play.
Basically, if the safety(ies) play(s) it correctly, the double-team stop CJ from making plays every time.

 

[Mac#5]

This is coming from the guy that call our QB Matt Shwab

 

[76Texan]

Either Andre Johnson's sore/injured groin is hobbling him, or he has lost explosion for other reasons (hamstring tear and subsequent surgery, for example)...

Regardless of what the stats may or may not show, any honest view of AJ's movement this season will see he is physically quite limited. Hopefully, it is a current injury that he can recover from. Or, he will be able to rehab or strengthen whatever the lingering issues are and eventually regain most of his explosiveness. Either way, we are good. No need to lie to ourselves. He isn't right but we are 5-0 despite that.

There's no need to lie just like I didn't need to in the KW's thread.

There's nothing majorly wrong with AJ; we just haven't been targeting him as much as before, that's all.

 

[dalemurphy]

There's no need to lie just like I didn't need to in the KW's thread.

There's nothing majorly wrong with AJ; we just haven't been targeting him as much as before, that's all.

"Lie"? (I'm suggesting that watching AJ without bias makes it clear he is not right. I was not suggesting anything else. As fans, we all struggle to not allow our biases to color what we are seeing)

Whether there is something majorly wrong or not, I do not know. What I do know is that he has not been able to accelerate and separate from defenders this season as he has in the past. I am not basing that on his targets. I am basing that on watching him run his routes... I don't doubt that we are targeting him less for reasons beyond his lack of explosiveness. If you watch him running in the Jets game without efforting to win an argument, you will clearly see that he is hobbled. Other games this year, it has clearly been the case as well. It has been noticeable a few times this year. Again, hopefully, it is the groin issue and nothing more.

 

[76Texan]

"Lie"? (I'm suggesting that watching AJ without bias makes it clear he is not right. I was not suggesting anything else. As fans, we all struggle to not allow our biases to color what we are seeing)

Whether there is something majorly wrong or not, I do not know. What I do know is that he has not been able to accelerate and separate from defenders this season as he has in the past. I am not basing that on his targets. I am basing that on watching him run his routes... I don't doubt that we are targeting him less for reasons beyond his lack of explosiveness. If you watch him running in the Jets game without efforting to win an argument, you will clearly see that he is hobbled. Other games this year, it has clearly been the case as well. It has been noticeable a few times this year. Again, hopefully, it is the groin issue and nothing more.

Rewatch the TD against the Broncos.
The CB Tracy Porter never caugh up with AJ.
Look at the distance between them when AJ caught the ball all the way to when AJ reach the end zone.

This guy (Porter) ran a 4.37 at the combine in 2008.

Also read my break-down post for the Jets game up in this thread.
AJ made a couple of very sharp breaks (once on a speed out and another on a deep square in) and got good seperation both times.

 

[run-david-run]

Rewatch the TD against the Broncos.
The CB Tracy Porter never caugh up with AJ.
Look at the distance between them when AJ caught the ball all the way to when AJ reach the end zone.

This guy (Porter) ran a 4.37 at the combine in 2008.

Also read my break-down post for the Jets game up in this thread.
AJ made a couple of very sharp breaks (once on a speed out and another on a deep square in) and got good seperation both times.

I've gone both ways on this. I don't think it's an every play thing. For instance, on OD's TD catch and run against the Titans, they showed a zoomed out replay and AJ was on the other side of the field. He smoked his corner on fly route and had an easy TD, but Schaub checked down earlier.
In the same game, his two big plays, I though he looked a little slow. I remember being surprised at how sluggish the whole play looked, even though it was a big gain.

He's not at 100%, I think it's safe to assume. But he's also not crippled or useless. He's a couple breaks away from having about 4 or 5 TDs and bunch more yards and everyone talking about how he's back to the old AJ.

For the record, those breaks being (long catch against Dolphins that went out of bounds at the 4, two sort-of-drops against the Broncos that would have been big yards and touchdowns, and 2 drops against the Jets that could have been big plays). He just needs to get his hands and his confidence back in order.

 

[Texecutioner]

I think a ton of you sound like a bunch of complete fickle fans in this thread. I'd usually expect this kind of stuff out of non Texans fans who don't watch the Texans that often, but this "AJ is no more" stuff is ridiculous and laughable honestly.

Did you guys not watch the first two games of the season and also the pre season? There has been nothing wrong with AJ at all. I've noticed no difference at all. We've had a very conservative offense especially in the 2nd halves and they haven't gone to AJ nearly enough. To suggest that AJ somehow lost it after one off season is just silly. He isn't 36 years old or anything. We're a run oriented team big time, and we don't have hardly any other receiving threats outside of AJ other then Owen Daniels. In pre season AJ looked like the same beast he has always been. He did in the first game as well after the first half even when a pretty good CB was covering him.

If Kubiak wasn't so conservative and wasn't so afraid of losing leads where he just wants to run, run, run, we'd probably see a lot more of AJ. I'm not going to be bothered to much about it as of now, because we're 5-0. However I've said all season long that our offense is not near as good as people think it is this season. We can run the ball well, but the play calling hasn't been the type of play calling from a dynamic step on your throat type of play calling to do that. AJ not getting the ball as much right now also might be a good thing to some degree, because he isn't taking near as many hits as usual. Hopefully he'll be a lot more healthy by playoffs time when we'll need him the most.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

From NFL.com.

At 31, it's fair to speculate leg injuries have robbed Johnson of the explosiveness that made him a star. That said, a decline in production doesn't necessarily signal an erosion of talent.

Johnson now finds himself in an offense that prays at the altar of the run game. Arian Foster is on pace to set an NFL record for rushes in a season. That type of dedication doesn't leave a ton of opportunity for monster receiving numbers.

NFL.com and NFL Network's Ian Rapoport -- in Houston for the Texans' Week 6 matchup against the Green Bay Packers -- asked Johnson about his slow start. Johnson explained that he was shut down by the Jets because cornerback Antonio Cromartie was allowed to play under him with help over the top.

According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.

 

[Playoffs]

According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.

It opens up other options, but I still think we'll see Matt throw into double coverage on AJ sometimes and let him go up & get it. Up to now, we haven't needed to force it into him.

 

[Texecutioner]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

Wow. Two years ago?? You bash Schaub and now AJ?


I'm starting to wonder if you're really a fan of this team, and I've never said that to another member. I know you're new, so I'll hold off, but suggesting that AJ has been done as an elite guy for two years is something that only someone would say who barely follows the Texans. AJ looked awsome last season when he was healthy and the season before he looked damn good and played hurt the majority of the season.

 

[76Texan]

According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.[/URL]

Doc, you know that Johnson always "seemed resigned" right?

Obviously, nobody can deny Mother Nature.
The effects of multiple injuries eventually will catch up to Andre, but right now, I think he's fine.

In one of the interview, he even said that he thought he would play ten years and retire, but now that the tenth years comes, he feels like he can still play some more.

He seems like the kind of guy who will tell you whether he feels like he's starting to slow down.
At least, I hope so!

 

[ATXtexanfan]

Dre is done as an elite WR. No biggie. He's still the best we have and teams know it

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he has been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

 

[Texecutioner]

For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he as been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

Yeah, but how many other times in games would Schaub force the ball to AJ on a lot more plays allowing him to out muscle and size guys up?? I watched AJ make a ton of bad ass plays in pre season and in game 1 especially in that 2nd half. I did not see any slowing down of AJ.

You guys are forgetting that we've been holding leads over every team practically and Kubes is running the ball and we're not having to throw down the field nearly as much, because Kubes is calling a much more conservative game plan to hold the lead. AJ simply isn't being targeted as much from what I've observed. As far as AJ's physical abilities and positioning to get open, I don't see any differences here. In year's past we were always having to have shootouts with teams and playing from behind, so AJ had to do a lot more.

 

[infantrycak]

I am with Tex on this one. I don't agree he hasn't been able to cut this year (maybe with a slight cautiousness against the Jets). He has jocked several DB's on wicked double moves this season. His production is down because of less targets and a hopefully very temporary case of dropsies. Without those drops he would be at 400 yds and 4 TD's. That we be a better pace than his best year and that's with lower targets.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Yeah, but how many other times in games would Schaub force the ball to AJ on a lot more plays allowing him to out muscle and size guys up?? I watched AJ make a ton of bad ass plays in pre season and in game 1 especially in that 2nd half. I did not see any slowing down of AJ.

You guys are forgetting that we've been holding leads over every team practically and Kubes is running the ball and we're not having to throw down the field nearly as much, because Kubes is calling a much more conservative game plan to hold the lead. AJ simply isn't being targeted as much from what I've observed. As far as AJ's physical abilities and positioning to get open, I don't see any differences here. In year's past we were always having to have shootouts with teams and playing from behind, so AJ had to do a lot more.

Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

 

[infantrycak]

Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

I have been saying for 4-5 years one defect in AJ's game is aggressiveness back to under thrown balls and on hook routes. He has long not done as much as he could to prevent INT's by getting in between the ball and the DB even enough to interfere.

 

[76Texan]

For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he has been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

OK, Doc.
I've already mentioned him running the speed out and deep in routes in the Jets game with sharp cuts.

Here, I'm going to do the first half of the Dolphins game.
I will only mention certain routes that seem to be in question.

1st quarter:

11:27 AJ ran a deep out and caught the ball for 11 yards.

7:58 AJ ran an 18-yd deep comeback toward the inside (at 45%).
This is pretty much a hook/hitch type of route to beat double coverage that you were asking for.
Schaub was sacked, however.

2nd quarter:

13:53 AJ ran 23-yd deep comeback, this time, toward the side line.
Schaub was on a bootleg and couldn't set up quick enough to throw a good ball.
CB had time to react back to knock the ball away.

11:51 AJ ran a 10-yd deep in and left the CB on the ground.
However, Schaub went to OD who beat the LB right off the bat.

2:30 AJ ran a 6/7-yd quick hook.
He got separation, but Schaub was pressured and scrambled for 2.

2:03 AJ ran a 5-yd quick in.
He was also open, but Schaub went to OD right in front of him for 11.
The LB turned the wrong way.

Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

In the Jets game, he ran more post routes to take away the double team and open it up for the other guys.
It's just different game planning.

I only hope that he doesn't suffer a groin/hamstring type of injury, that's all.

 

[TdotTexas2Step]

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying our 31 year old wide receiver fresh off an injury plagued season and surgery doesn't look the same.

In fact, to say "there's nothing wrong with him" is probably the more illogical statement.

Fact of the matter is he decided to undergo a surgery that would benefit him short term and hinder him long term, and there's a chance that short term may be coming to an end.

HOWEVER, that doesn't take away from the fact that he's the best we've got, and still the guy we fans expect to be there when we need him the most.

 

[76Texan]

Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

The ball just got there too quickly, Doc.
He did make the tackle right away.

 

[Rey]

Against Denver Andre broke up a pass that was almost intercepted.

The pass against Miami on fourth down a few years ago where Andre reached around a guy and caught the ball was one of the best catches I've ever seen. This was the qb draw on the goal line game. Earlier on that last drive Aj made that catch on 4TH DOWN to keep the drive a live. That catch is seared in my brain and that is the catch that to me symbolizes andres greatness. That catch and the one against Arizona where he ran through the lb and safety for the TD.

 

[imatexan]

Dre is done as an elite WR. No biggie. He's still the best we have and teams know it

You sound so certain of yourself, well you shouldn't be.

Andre at 75% is still an elite receiver, I thunk early on this year and off to a 5-0 start we have had no reason to rely on him so they are letting him take it a bit easier. When the time comes I have no doubt he will rise to the occasion. I agree Tex with the conservative play calling also being a factor.

O ya and that old guy is about to have 10,000 yards receiving.

 

[Rey]

I haven't seen anything wring with Andre by the way. Before the game me and another poster (sorry I can't remember who it was to give proper credit) mentioned how we thought cromartie matched up well with Andre.

Cromartie can more than keep up with him speed wise, and he has the size and athleticism to challenge him for balls that are thrown his way. Cromartie would likely struggle to guard a guy like Martin who can change direction on a dime because his stride isn't as long.

As far as the drops go, andre has dropped a few catchable balls in his career. He always has. That is not new. That's not to say it's a problem, but he just drops a few easy ones every now and then.

I dint have a huge problem with any if our wrs so far. I couldn't see all the routes against the jets, but it seemed like we were running a bunch of vertical routes, or routes that were designed to go over ten yards.

I would have liked to have seen kmart used more as a short passing option like the patriots use welker. Even if he only gets 3-5 yards it still has it's purpose.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

OK, Doc.
I've already mentioned him running the speed out and deep in routes in the Jets game with sharp cuts.

Here, I'm going to do the first half of the Dolphins game.
I will only mention certain routes that seem to be in question.

1st quarter:

11:27 AJ ran a deep out and caught the ball for 11 yards.

7:58 AJ ran an 18-yd deep comeback toward the inside (at 45%).
This is pretty much a hook/hitch type of route to beat double coverage that you were asking for.
Schaub was sacked, however.

2nd quarter:

13:53 AJ ran 23-yd deep comeback, this time, toward the side line.
Schaub was on a bootleg and couldn't set up quick enough to throw a good ball.
CB had time to react back to knock the ball away.

11:51 AJ ran a 10-yd deep in and left the CB on the ground.
However, Schaub went to OD who beat the LB right off the bat.

2:30 AJ ran a 6/7-yd quick hook.
He got separation, but Schaub was pressured and scrambled for 2.

2:03 AJ ran a 5-yd quick in.
He was also open, but Schaub went to OD right in front of him for 11.
The LB turned the wrong way.

Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

In the Jets game, he ran more post routes to take away the double team and open it up for the other guys.
It's just different game planning.

I only hope that he doesn't suffer a groin/hamstring type of injury, that's all.

I get the feeling that you feel that I'm making a case for Andre is essentially done. That is the furthest thing from what I am trying to present. He can certainly still be a very productive player on this team. But I do see some physical limitations that he is and likely will be dealing with from here on out. I will respectfully leave you to your own conclusion when you say that you don't see anything wrong with AJ. But knowing what the type of injuries he has incurred and their implications, along with what I continue to observe in general, you'll have to excuse me if I choose to believe my lying eyes.

 

[GP]

To me, in the jets game...there were two passes where I think Schaub expected his WR to make a bigger effort to get to a spot on the field.

One was the AJ target where Cromartie picks it off. I will maintain that I think AJ was not running as hard as Schaub might have expected AJ to, which means Schaub was leading him a bit more than he should have. Watching that play in real time, AJ looked sluggish and wasn't (IMO) running hard enough.

A second play was a scramble by Schaub where there was tons of own field to the sideline, Schaub throws it there and Walter never really understood that's where Schaub was wanting him (Walter) to get to, to bail them out. Granted, it was busted and all players are scrambling...but still, Walter half-assed that scramble and should have known to go there and to get there quickly.

Those are the two types of plays that Owen Daniels thrives on, he's so instinctual and seems to hit overdrive very quickly. He's Schaub's most reliable receiver when it comes to bring not only in the right spot on any given situation, but also gets there quick enough to get separation to make the catch AND get crazy YAC too.

I think we'll see a "return to form" by AJ this week. He's going to want to have a do-over.

 

[NastyNate]

andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

You're so wrong it hurts. It's like listening to my 6 year old try to explain theorhetical physics. :vincepalm:

 

[76Texan]

I get the feeling that you feel that I'm making a case for Andre is essentially done. That is the furthest thing from what I am trying to present. He can certainly still be a very productive player on this team. But I do see some physical limitations that he is and likely will be dealing with from here on out. I will respectfully leave you to your own conclusion when you say that you don't see anything wrong with AJ. But knowing what the type of injuries he has incurred and their implications, along with what I continue to observe in general, you'll have to excuse me if I choose to believe my lying eyes.

Like I said, Doc, if the Texans had targeted AJ as many times as they did in 09 and 2010 (nearly 11 targets per game), when you pro-rate this year production (6 targets per game), he will have a better year than either of those two years (both in number of catches, number of yards, and number of TDs.)

And like I said, he's been getting open.

 

[76Texan]

To me, in the jets game...there were two passes where I think Schaub expected his WR to make a bigger effort to get to a spot on the field.

One was the AJ target where Cromartie picks it off. I will maintain that I think AJ was not running as hard as Schaub might have expected AJ to, which means Schaub was leading him a bit more than he should have. Watching that play in real time, AJ looked sluggish and wasn't (IMO) running hard enough.

What are you talking about GP?

The ball was at best a hair late and quite short.
If AJ had run any harder, he would have overran the ball by a mile.

 

[76Texan]

Against Denver Andre broke up a pass that was almost intercepted.

This is probably the pass to start the second half.

This one should have been a PI of 40 some yards.

AJ ran a skinny post from the slot (more like a post corner route, but not really that sharp.)

AJ beat both the corner and the safety.
The CB (#20 Adams) ran into AJ back (but he managed to stop himself before it became too obvious.)
It was enough to cause AJ to lose a bit of balance.
Also, the ball was a little short and late (or AJ was "too fast"), AJ had to wait for it.
The ball then grazed AJ's shoulder pad (as he lost some balance) such that he couldn't pull it in cleanly; the ball bounced around in the air.

The safety came, and AJ had to play defender to break up that INT.

If the CB didn't bump into AJ, that one would have been at least a 50yd completion.

 

[DocBar]

AJ is looking mortal this season. Hopefully he's saving up his mojo for a major playoff push.