TexansBull
Hall of Fame
Reread the first two sentences. What you are saying wouldn’t happen because OB knows he had to choose someone because the directive is coming from McNair not Rick Smith.
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
All encompassing Bill O'Brien thread
- Thread starter False Start
- Start date
Reread the first two sentences. What you are saying wouldn’t happen because OB knows he had to choose someone because the directive is coming from McNair not Rick Smith.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Not buying that McNair said to OB "you must pick a FA.". I think he said to the pair "you must improve the QB position."
I'm also not buying OB thought Oz was the best FA and still objected. If he objected to Oz there was someone he liked better.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Don't forget trades. IMO RS's job was to prepare 3 lists with evaluations: FAs, potential trades & draft prospects. Then OB would be prime in picking best option(s) for targeting.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
Not buying it is code that it disagrees with my made up mind.
Yes we know he hated all the bad picks.
I mean we know he hated nix after he saw him in camp, but then it's too late. Not sure if he realizes this.
Last edited:
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Try it's illogical and conflicts with known facts.
Oh and doesn't violate Occam's Razor.
And that fool McNair is sitting there watching OB bat 1000 and RS whiffing and will still keep RS over OB.
Somehow that is lost on many, McNair knows who pushed what picks & moves.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
What is illogical about a boss saying these are your choices. Pick one. What known facts does it violate? How do we know it didn’t happen?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
It's illogical to restrict improvement to 1 of 3 sources. It's inconsistent with McNair's public statement (consistent with my statement) that the position would be improved. It's not supported by a single shred of evidence. It's inconsistent with statements from all 3. It's inconsistent with the characters involved. It totally makes sense McNair pays twice as much to ignore his QB guru.
It's the fantasy of someone who wants to absolve OB.
But of course without video it's possible Colonel Mustard did it on Kirby with a candlestick.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Occam's Razor (which is by no means "undefeated" but has a pretty good winning percentage on these sorts of things) tells me that it's far more likely that the most obvious answer is the right one. The Texans went looking for their best possible option at QB that year, determined that they liked Os better than any other QB they saw in the draft or free agency (assuming here that Goff and Wentz would be off the board and/or too pricey in their opinion to trade up to) and signed him. They were to some degree fooled into believing that he was better than he really was by a fellow named Gary Kubiak who has the knowledge and experience to identify a young QB's shortcomings and tailor a game plan to his strengths. Os didn't really play long enough to have too many bad games. The thing were you get a player on film and then start taking apart his game didn't really have time to kick in (too much).
I don't doubt it's possible that Bill O'Brien, Rick Smith, or even both of them maybe had a reservation or two about Os. For the most part though what's not to like? Plenty of arm, good kid from all indications, Nice looking face-of-the-franchise type (Got him in front of the cameras for H.E.B. commercials as fast as they could), and if Mr. McNair told them to fix this QB ****-show that we had been going through I'm sure they both were ready to try something different. I wouldn't even be surprised if after Mallet and Hoyer McNair said "Enough of this Patriots backup bullshit" too. Speculation on my part but after that Chiefs playoff massacre we had I don't think Bob McNair was at his most patient.
All the rest of it is CYA coming from O'Brien and Smith. They genuinely don't appear to like each other. I have no idea why. Maybe it's their personalities? Maybe it's that they think the other just has it out for them. I got ideas but they're just ideas in my head. I think Rick's a drop you in the grease kind of guy if he needs to save his own ass. I think O'Brien probably picks up on that and maybe is the same way. Either way they say the right stuff in public but they both have their ways of leaking crap out through back channels. This has been going on for too long for it to not be real. They are not a good team and they're not that rare kind of paring that doesn't get along but works well together. No, these guys are oil and water.
My only reason for wanting Rick gone and Bill to stay is that I don't see a lot of obviously better choices out there and the backing Bill has from Watson and others is not something the team should ignore. He still has the locker room (Damned if I know how) and I've seen Rick with Kubiak. Never seen Bill with any other GM. Would like to see how he does with a better GM before the Texans cast him aside. Not overly fond of him at all but if he became a consistent winner with a different front office I'd get over that fast enough. If he doesn't well then our QB is still very young and we can always not bring him back after next season.
I don't doubt it's possible that Bill O'Brien, Rick Smith, or even both of them maybe had a reservation or two about Os. For the most part though what's not to like? Plenty of arm, good kid from all indications, Nice looking face-of-the-franchise type (Got him in front of the cameras for H.E.B. commercials as fast as they could), and if Mr. McNair told them to fix this QB ****-show that we had been going through I'm sure they both were ready to try something different. I wouldn't even be surprised if after Mallet and Hoyer McNair said "Enough of this Patriots backup bullshit" too. Speculation on my part but after that Chiefs playoff massacre we had I don't think Bob McNair was at his most patient.
All the rest of it is CYA coming from O'Brien and Smith. They genuinely don't appear to like each other. I have no idea why. Maybe it's their personalities? Maybe it's that they think the other just has it out for them. I got ideas but they're just ideas in my head. I think Rick's a drop you in the grease kind of guy if he needs to save his own ass. I think O'Brien probably picks up on that and maybe is the same way. Either way they say the right stuff in public but they both have their ways of leaking crap out through back channels. This has been going on for too long for it to not be real. They are not a good team and they're not that rare kind of paring that doesn't get along but works well together. No, these guys are oil and water.
My only reason for wanting Rick gone and Bill to stay is that I don't see a lot of obviously better choices out there and the backing Bill has from Watson and others is not something the team should ignore. He still has the locker room (Damned if I know how) and I've seen Rick with Kubiak. Never seen Bill with any other GM. Would like to see how he does with a better GM before the Texans cast him aside. Not overly fond of him at all but if he became a consistent winner with a different front office I'd get over that fast enough. If he doesn't well then our QB is still very young and we can always not bring him back after next season.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Excellent summation.
I would add, not just Kubiak but Elway.
I would add, not just Kubiak but Elway.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Broncos protected him well and made him look good. Based on their contract offer to him they also thought he was worth keeping around and trying to coach up even more. Everyone acts like we threw money at Os and nobody else would have ever done that. Not so much. I bet both those backstabbing bastards on Kirby were for the signing..... before they were against it.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
McNairs public statement was get reliable play out of the QB position and not a superstar. Going from a QB throwing four interception in a playoffs to a stable QB was the goal.
And only having 3-4 options is possible with FA in the NFL.
How many are actually available year to year?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
That was his statement when OB arrived not after the Hoyer meltdown.
And again you are restricting to FA. That's you, not McNair.
And again you are restricting to FA. That's you, not McNair.
zshawn10
All Pro
Texans likely to keep Bill O'Brien as head coach, sources say
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...turning-houston-texans-head-coach-next-season
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...turning-houston-texans-head-coach-next-season
Last yr there was 2 yrs and an option yr. Millions of $$$$ and after reports broke McNair came out publicly and said he was keeping BOB that was the end of the rumors.
# The Godfather
McNair is making a huge mess.
Rick probably wants OBrien to stay because a new head coach will kick him out.
Please God No!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ColeThornton
Waterboy
I thought the best option would be to replace Smith and O'Brien. The second best option would be to replace just Smith. The third best option would be to replace just O'Brien. Now that leaves the worse option of all, not replacing either and as I said earlier, I had confidence that McNair would make the wrong decision... "bingo" Now what I didn't expect was that McNair could even make it worse.
"Though his return is likely, sources say there still are issues to be discussed and hashed out with his contract."
O'Brien has already said he would coach next year without an extension, wouldn't the best thing for the team be to not have to pay him a bunch of money to fire him next year if it doesn't work out?
Let's make sure we lock up the toxic duo as long as possible... what an organization.
leebigeztx
Keep it Movin!
Oh really? You're the same poster who always talked about getting better in the trenches. They used the top 3 picks on linemen. Since Smith has been here, how many guards have he drafted in the 1st 3 rounds? That whole draft had Bill on it when he stated getting bigger and stronger. His fingerprints were also there when wanted the oline to get bigger.
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
Edit: I should know better than to post at 4:00AM after more than a few scotches, but I still think it's important that USA Today back up its claim about Smith not consulting O'Brien. It's doubtful that's what occurred.
Last edited:
MightyTExan
It's go time!
You are actually saying that Garrappolo would have been a better pick with the 33rd overall in the 2014 Draft than the X-man, wow SteelB thanks for the news flash !
Took you three years but you figured that out all by yourself ?
C'mon man you can do better than that, tell us something we don't know already.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Sorry, but I heard this from a reliable source on the medical staff at NRG..............He HATED the Nix pick FROM DAY 1. Pre Combine, he let his weight get to 370 lbs, then brought it down to 330lbs with a crash program. He had always shown problems with weight and conditioning/stamina and was never projected beyond a 2 down NT. Throughout his college career, he dealt with knee tendonitis due to his weight and poor conditioning, which culminated in his senior year. In that same year, he was IR'ed in Nov for a surgical repair of a severely torn meniscus (which would not be unexpected as a compensatory injury after chronic knee tendonitis) that they were not sure would be successful because of its size and where it was anatomically and because of his extreme weight. All of this led to him dropping from a projected 1st rnd pick to a 3rd rnd pick. Of course, Smith again was the smartest GM in the room when he clamored to pick Nix before anyone else could get to him. As it turns out, his meniscus repair was not successful (up to 25% with "normal BMI/weight" fail to begin with) and Nix not unexpectedly required excision of a good part of his meniscus (a definitive predictor of bone on bone degenerative arthritic changes) prior to TC of his rookie year. All of this was why O'BRIEN WANTED NO PART OF NIX FROM THE BEGINNING.
Last edited:
zshawn10
All Pro
Aaron Wilson@AaronWilson_NFL
Nothing has been determined about coach Bill O'Brien's status in advance of pivotal meeting with ownership Monday in Houston, according to league sources. Everything remains on the table heading into Texans' season finale.
7:43 AM - Dec 31, 2017
Nothing has been determined about coach Bill O'Brien's status in advance of pivotal meeting with ownership Monday in Houston, according to league sources. Everything remains on the table heading into Texans' season finale.
7:43 AM - Dec 31, 2017
zshawn10
All Pro
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
Wrong.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.chro...-McNair-knows-team-has-to-improve-6823940.php
And saying “oh the Texans could have traded for a QBs” is the same as some as the people who said to trade the Clowney pick for more picks. You have to have a trade partner. Swing and two misses
Yes, Nix had many injury issues.
And O'Brien probably hated him from day 1...of training camp. When it's too late. That's when all the negative reports from O'Brien came out....and none of them said he didn't want to draft him.
It makes no sense. It was O'Brien's and Crennel's first draft. It was a Wilfork replacement, not someone Rick had ever drafted for Kubiak before. Rick had rarely traded up during the Kubiak era.
We're supposed to believe he goes against the new coaching staff in the first draft? Not buying it. Again, I agree he hated Nix from day one of practice.
And it's not like Nix is the only bust the O'Brien-Rick traded up for in the 3rd round, they followed that up with Jaelen Strong the next year!
Last edited:
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
One of the leaks out of Texans HQ was that the FO felt coaches had too much say on draft day.
After Kubiak was gone Rick got the powers he wanted to have more say on draft day. Make trades etc. Makes sense when we see to complete opposite strategies on draft day.
People like to protect Rick and say it’s OB recommending to trade picks and it’s just Rick following him. But I’m willing to bet it’s the other way around and Rick is the one driving this wagon.
I'm not protecting Rick, I think he should be fired. My point is that they are making these decisions together.
Aaron's report sounds like the incomplete version of Ian's report. the report reads like a compromise position versus a true direction change. Given the corporate nature of this organization, as long as rick smith is in the building he will have some input
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
Sorry. I didn’t mean for it to sound like I was incriminating you.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
My post could not be any clearer............."day 1" did not mean "day 1 of training camp"............"day 1" was the day of the Draft. Again, O'Brien wanted no part of Nix from the beginning.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I don't care about your rabbit trail superstar crap. This was your scenario:
Your article agrees with my assertion things were not restricted to free agency:
Learn to friggin' read. I said explore what trades may be available not that it was a certainty. And by the way Bradford was traded that off-season and Garoppolo was said to be on the market if the price was right.
So Rick Smith in year 1 of a new coach does something completely out of character- trades up for a big nose tackle for Crennel's system to play the Wilfork role
I could buy this story more if it was a Crennel pick, not Rick
And was your source in the draft room? I have no doubt they realized very early Nix was a bust.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
You can deal with fantasy manipulation all you want. It changes nothing. I was informed of this real time on the day of the Draft. Let it go.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
zshawn10
All Pro
More tweets from Ian saying Texans are looking to keep bob and trying to give him more control
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/947488912368390145
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/947459813486878720
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/947488912368390145
https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/947459813486878720
houstonhurricane
Veteran
Move Smith out of decision-making role, find a legit GM, give BOB a one year extension but be willing to kick him to the side if we fall short again next season. BOB has done nothing to warrant him getting greater control over personnel at this point.
Fair enough. It fits the pattern, O'Brien gets convinced to do something he doesn't want to do
Wolf
100% Texan
If O'Brien is going to get more power (reports) then I wonder if he told them that if he were to be here one more year then he wants to sink or swim on his own.(to an extent) and maybe make the final call on players that they have ranked about the same
I look at the Texans as they go into decisions as a group yet Rick has the deciding factor. I think it is more than a "my way or the highway" type decisions and O'Brien is left with a "make it work" scenario.
However with mounting loses and frustration with failed picks. It magnifies who wanted who (within the decussiins in the draft war room)to which we fans love to speculate which picked the bad or even good ones.
I look at the Texans as they go into decisions as a group yet Rick has the deciding factor. I think it is more than a "my way or the highway" type decisions and O'Brien is left with a "make it work" scenario.
However with mounting loses and frustration with failed picks. It magnifies who wanted who (within the decussiins in the draft war room)to which we fans love to speculate which picked the bad or even good ones.
McNair should know who made the picks.
So it is interesting to see what obriens argument would be if he has been getting the guys he wanted
Mr. White
Retired OLine Coach
If this is true, then this is something that I can live with. Doesn't seem like smart business to keep paying Rasputin Rick in a different capacity on the merits of being such a good @$$kisser, but it's their money. Not really sure what he brings to the table that would make him a good non-football executive.
If nothing else, OB has done a good enough job in years past IMO to earn himself a year's worth of more rope.
