Adam Schein: "Texans Shouldn't Give up on Carr now"

[HoustonFrog]

but,but,but ROMO is supposed to be a backup quarterback for his entire career!!

Why not get Sage a shot in my opinion.

LOL..good one..exactly and my point. Every person they named above was considered damaged/mediocre goods until playing and now all of a sudden those teams could upgrade because of talent (eye roll)

 

[Pantherstang84]

We're not talking about 'playoffs' next year--we're talking about scoring points--avg 12 tds/yr (16 best) for 5 seasons, for example, is not going to be something that almost any body can not better...-except Carr,maybe, as he slipped to 11...

Ok then. Go get Brooks from Oakland. I'm sure he is available. ABC right?

 

[Johnny Utah]

I will blow your doors off with another bit, 1 team even offered a 1 rd pick!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Someone is lying to you. LOL. First round pick. Not a chance in hell someone would offer that, and not a chance in hell the Texans would turn that down.

 

[HoustonFrog]

Ok then. Go get Brooks from Oakland. I'm sure he is available. ABC right?

I'm not sure why ABC keeps coming up. We have discussed the people who have a possibility and everytime we make an argument...like the QBs that got named off, it comes back to something like Brooks. No one wants Brooks.

 

[HoustonFrog]

What would you like me to do, tell you were and who i have heard it from? why in the bloody heck would i share anything with most! of you? there are people who know around here, I dont care to say who, they know.

Like I said what is my reson for lying? Why would I just make it up, you guys allready hate him so what does it matter right? I drop stuff on here from time to time for people who acctually care and trust me.

I write things and you think I am lying, well I am not a guy that goes around deseving people and lying to make others look good. You can believe me or not, thats up to you, I dont need to defend what I write because it is what it is. You guys make me laugh, who do you think might know a little something, you or me? I said 20 so you can believe it is 20 or not. You dont cause you think he is bad, and not having resources like other successfull QB means nothing to you. It is Carr, it is all on him, we want Quinn we want this guy, even Jake Plummer is better now, anyone but Carr, BUT 20 think other wise, I will blow your doors off with another bit, 1 team even offered a 1 rd pick!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Bill Walsh called him and told him how much he likes to watch Carr play, and how much respect he has for him, and he called to tell Carr that they would be crazy to get rid of him. So you can think I am lying about that to if you would like.

Where ever he goes, it will be were God wants him to be.

And Carr is better then Jake.
Hey believe me or not, it does not bother me. I send little things out for people who acctually care to read it, we have a saying, "You dont need to lie to hang out".

BTW, I forgot this last night Hulk. The way the NFL usually works is that the GM and owner and coach start receiving trade scenarios from other GMs, etc. During this period, unless their is a no-trade clause that needs to be waived, the players involved, because they are still with the team, usually don't get the heads up on what is going on. Sometimes they are the last to hear. I'm sure Dave isn't getting daily calls as to "hey we don't want you here anymore but there are 20 teams that want you." You don't alienate your players and they aren't privy to the trade offers..like fantasy #1s, etc. So your whole scenarios isn't really in the realm of NFL reality. Add that to the fact that I'm sure their family isn't sitting there finding this info out either. That isn't how NFL teams work.

 

[Pantherstang84]

I'm not sure why ABC keeps coming up. We have discussed the people who have a possibility and everytime we make an argument...like the QBs that got named off, it comes back to something like Brooks. No one wants Brooks.

If you look at the previous posts, the poster was saying "almost anyone" could do a better job than Carr. I was merely illustrating absurdity by being absurd.

Within this thread itself there are posters saying a high school QB could do a better job. We really need maintain some levity here.

Yes. There are factions on this mb that want to see Carr gone no matter the consequences.

Switching gears for a moment...

The Texans have already made one huge blunder on a QB contract. I would hate to see the Texans make another one with little or temporary gain.

 

[tsip]

Ok then. Go get Brooks from Oakland. I'm sure he is available. ABC right?

Like many posters, you can't tell us what Carr has done in 5 yrs that warrant keeping him longer. True, we've heard all the ways that other people and other things have held David back. The bottom line, though, is that Carr hasn't achieved desired results.

OK. Aaron Brooks. I didn't bring up Brooks, you did. And, it's obvious you don't think Brooks is any good and Carr is so much better, right? OK, let's compare their 5 yr stats as starters--

CARR BROOKS

YDS 13391 17642
YPA 6.47 6.84
TDS 111 59
COMPLETIONS(20-40+ yds) 164 274
QB Rating 76 79

Now, you don't have to go into all the excuses why Brooks stats (and W-L) are so much better--certainly, he had better 'circumstances' than Carr--except for last year.

My point is that these 'blind' statements by homer's destroy your credibilty.

 

[Pantherstang84]

Like many posters, you can't tell us what Carr has done in 5 yrs that warrant keeping him longer. True, we've heard all the ways that other people and other things have held David back. The bottom line, though, is that Carr hasn't achieved desired results.

OK. Aaron Brooks. I didn't bring up Brooks, you did. And, it's obvious you don't think Brooks is any good and Carr is so much better, right? OK, let's compare their 5 yr stats as starters--

CARR BROOKS

YDS 13391 17642
YPA 6.47 6.84
TDS 111 59
COMPLETIONS(20-40+ yds) 164 274
QB Rating 76 79

Now, you don't have to go into all the excuses why Brooks stats (and W-L) are so much better--certainly, he had better 'circumstances' than Carr--except for last year.

My point is that these 'blind' statements by homer's destroy your credibilty.

OK then. Go get him if he is your man.

For those of you who like to pull things out of context to fit your argument and have not read my entire discussion in this thread, let me summarize my whole take on the QB situation in Houston.

1. I'm not defending DC.
2. If you are going to get rid of him, you better get a significant upgrade in return and be prepared to take the cap hit.
3. You who are advocating writing the cap hit off, will wish you had that money to fill the other significant holes in this team.
4. The pickings are slim to none this off season to upgrade the QB position in either the draft or FA. If Plummer is available, he will want DC type money and a 3-4 year deal. No sale in my book.
5. If you are serious about building a dynasty, your best bet at upgrading the QB is in the 08 off season. Great QB class coming up.
6. There are plenty of holes to fill on the Texans. Work on those this off season.
7. Let Carr, Rosenfels, Van Pelt compete for the starting job. If Sage is that much better, let him start.

Don't git rid of your QB for the sake of doing it. Be smart about it.

I trust the Texan's front office will do just that. They will be smart when deciding what to do about the QB situation.

True the QB is probably the most important position on the team. But you have to have an o line, defense, and running game.

No more Denver retreads.

I want the Texans to be a dynasty, not the Dallas Cowboys under their current ownership.

Go ahead and twist around this post out of context to justify your argument and sleep better at night.

You are the last person that should be trying diminish credibility. Brooks? BROOKS? rotflmao

Go ahead stat boy. Your turn. Can you show me some stats that proves that Riley Dodge from Southlake Carroll High School is a better NFL QB than Carr too?

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

I write things and you think I am lying, well I am not a guy that goes around deseving people and lying to make others look good. You can believe me or not, thats up to you, I dont need to defend what I write because it is what it is. You guys make me laugh, who do you think might know a little something, you or me? I said 20 so you can believe it is 20 or not. You dont cause you think he is bad, and not having resources like other successfull QB means nothing to you. It is Carr, it is all on him, we want Quinn we want this guy, even Jake Plummer is better now, anyone but Carr, BUT 20 think other wise, I will blow your doors off with another bit, 1 team even offered a 1 rd pick!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Bill Walsh called him and told him how much he likes to watch Carr play, and how much respect he has for him, and he called to tell Carr that they would be crazy to get rid of him. So you can think I am lying about that to if you would like.

Was there a bean stalk involved ?

 

[phan1]

I don't see why people are saying Oakland would be interested in Carr. The Raiders Offense is worse than ours, and Brooks still outplayed Carr! If there was one game that said, "I'm not sure Carr can be our future QB", than that's it!

But yeah, the only team I see fitting of Carr is Minnesota. I think the Bears would sooner go with Griese than Carr, and Guden knows Carr ain't the guy to run his WCO (as Carr has shown just this year). I just can't think of anywhere else that Carr would be given a starting job.

 

[HoustonFrog]

OK then. Go get him if he is your man.

For those of you who like to pull things out of context to fit your argument and have not read my entire discussion in this thread, let me summarize my whole take on the QB situation in Houston.......

First, no one has taken your posts out of context but you keep throwing out things to cover for different arguments and they don't stick.

1) Your first of many points was Plummer = Carr 5 years from now and we should just wait it out...basically accept another year with Carr and even admitted to wanting a QB in 08. When it was pointed out that Plummers stats were not bad with Kubiak and that he actually won on a horrible Cards team...playoff win... you went to point #2...

2) That there was 2 ways to think of it and that you'd rather build a dynasty than take "10-6", a playoff loss and an old QB that will need to be replaced. But wait....you just said that you wanted a replacement or a guy for the future in 08...so what is the difference?You wouldn't want a 10-6 year with the playoffs and yet still get to do what you said you wanted which was find the man of the future in 08?......

3) So you agree to disagree but say it is a cap space thing...oh and the Denver retreads are getting old even though we really haven't brought in too many and our best back last season was Dayne. When I brought up we don't need another "get by" year or AJ and others might slip out in FA you said....

4) "Plummer did not just click under Kubiak his first year either." But Jake was 9-2 in 11 games had a 62.6 completion percentage with 15 TDs and 7 ints..a 91.2 QB rating...no response

5) It was back to ABC where it took a turn towards Brooks..I was out of it then...

I'm not picking on your posts and I know you had some other points in between. I'm just demonstrating how these arguments can go round and round and no matter what facts or points are made, there is always another answer. Some say that there are Carr haters that do it but this goes on all day. Anyways, I know you say you are in neither camp and are in between. But there are real legit arguments for bringing another person in and still looking toward the future. Have a great one!

 

[TwinSisters]

I don't see why people are saying Oakland would be interested in Carr. The Raiders Offense is worse than ours, and Brooks still outplayed Carr! If there was one game that said, "I'm not sure Carr can be our future QB", than that's it!

Kiffin is a Bulldog.
The Raiders haven't drafted a QB worth anything since 1968.
Since then they have started 4 project QBs that have guided them to 3 Super Bowls ( Gannon ( 11 years ), Plunkett ( 8 ), Schroeder ( 4 ), Hostetler (8) ). Plus I don't even want to count the playoff games ( at least 11 years ).

Not to mention the other QBs like George, Collins.

Carr fits the menu item for Al Davis. Plus it would boost his market ratings over in Bakersfield. The fallen golden boy is back in black!

It would sell.

Now if only Oakland would pony up some draft picks for it.

 

[2BCF]

Thank you Adam Schein, your check is in the mail!
Or did McNair FedEx the cash, either way thank you.

Now somebody please take this "gem" off our hands.

 

[Pantherstang84]

First, no one has taken your posts out of context but you keep throwing out things to cover for different arguments and they don't stick.

1) Your first of many points was Plummer = Carr 5 years from now and we should just wait it out...basically accept another year with Carr and even admitted to wanting a QB in 08. When it was pointed out that Plummers stats were not bad with Kubiak and that he actually won on a horrible Cards team...playoff win... you went to point #2...

Actually, my point was that I do not consider Plummer a significant upgrade over Carr. I do not condone waiting another 5 years. If the FO can get rid of DC without swallowing a huge amount of cash in the process, I'm fine with it. But please don't give up our #8 pick overall to do it. Peterson could very well be available at that spot and we need to grab him.

2) That there was 2 ways to think of it and that you'd rather build a dynasty than take "10-6", a playoff loss and an old QB that will need to be replaced. But wait....you just said that you wanted a replacement or a guy for the future in 08...so what is the difference?You wouldn't want a 10-6 year with the playoffs and yet still get to do what you said you wanted which was find the man of the future in 08?......

If the FO thinks Plummer can be aquired without mortgaging the house, then I'm fine with it. I just don't think they can get him without a 3-4 yr. guaranteed contract and around $8 mil a year. Too expensive as far as I'm concerned for a short term solution.

3) So you agree to disagree but say it is a cap space thing...oh and the Denver retreads are getting old even though we really haven't brought in too many and our best back last season was Dayne. When I brought up we don't need another "get by" year or AJ and others might slip out in FA you said....

Fact: Most FAs leave teams for more money. Others leave for other reasons. If AJ leaves, it will be because of cash not because Plummer is not in Houston.

Having Ron Dayne as our best back is not saying much. IMO

4) "Plummer did not just click under Kubiak his first year either." But Jake was 9-2 in 11 games had a 62.6 completion percentage with 15 TDs and 7 ints..a 91.2 QB rating...no response

I tend to think his success in his first year under the Kube was because of a great supporting cast. I still don't think he is a significant upgrade.

5) It was back to ABC where it took a turn towards Brooks..I was out of it then...

I'm not picking on your posts and I know you had some other points in between. I'm just demonstrating how these arguments can go round and round and no matter what facts or points are made, there is always another answer. Some say that there are Carr haters that do it but this goes on all day. Anyways, I know you say you are in neither camp and are in between. But there are real legit arguments for bringing another person in and still looking toward the future. Have a great one!

The Brooks thing was too your credit sir. I just can't believe someone pulled some numbers off of a fantasy football site somewhere to justify their unbridled hatred toward DC.

Bottom line....

I think Rick Smith and Kubiak will do what they can to fill the holes. If they can get Plummer at a reasonable price and unload that albatross of a contract of DC's in the process, ok. I would consider it an upgrade (but not a significant one) without breaking the bank and I can live with that. I still say 08 is our best chance at a significant upgrade.

 

[HoustonFrog]

Actually, my point was that I do not consider Plummer a significant upgrade over Carr. I do not condone waiting another 5 years. If the FO can get rid of DC without swallowing a huge amount of cash in the process, I'm fine with it. But please don't give up our #8 pick overall to do it. Peterson could very well be available at that spot and we need to grab him.




If the FO thinks Plummer can be aquired without mortgaging the house, then I'm fine with it. I just don't think they can get him without a 3-4 yr. guaranteed contract and around $8 mil a year. Too expensive as far as I'm concerned for a short term solution.



Fact: Most FAs leave teams for more money. Others leave for other reasons. If AJ leaves, it will be because of cash not because Plummer is not in Houston.

Having Ron Dayne as our best back is not saying much. IMO



I tend to think his success in his first year under the Kube was because of a great supporting cast. I still don't think he is a significant upgrade.



The Brooks thing was too your credit sir. I just can't believe someone pulled some numbers off of a fantasy football site somewhere to justify their unbridled hatred toward DC.

Bottom line....

I think Rick Smith and Kubiak will do what they can to fill the holes. If they can get Plummer at a reasonable price and unload that albatross of a contract of DC's in the process, ok. I would consider it an upgrade (but not a significant one) without breaking the bank and I can live with that. I still say 08 is our best chance at a significant upgrade.

Nice counter-post. Again, at least it is rational enough. We aren't too far off on our "wants" we both just see it from different angles. I don't want to give up the pick either. As far as FA, money is always tops but I also see where if the money is close (you can always use Texas' no income tax as a plus) a guy might go where it seem like they are more commited to winning...in their eyes. I can handle sound debates. It is the irrational yelling about the QB that get to me.

 

[Pantherstang84]

Nice counter-post. Again, at least it is rational enough. We aren't too far off on our "wants" we both just see it from different angles. I don't want to give up the pick either. As far as FA, money is always tops but I also see where if the money is close (you can always use Texas' no income tax as a plus) a guy might go where it seem like they are more commited to winning...in their eyes. I can handle sound debates. It is the irrational yelling about the QB that get to me.

Fair enough and I think we have exhausted this topic. At least we can debate without name calling and mudslinging. Have a great day!

 

[tsip]

OK then. Go get him if he is your man.

For those of you who like to pull things out of context to fit your argument and have not read my entire discussion in this thread, let me summarize my whole take on the QB situation in Houston.

1. I'm not defending DC.
2. If you are going to get rid of him, you better get a significant upgrade in return and be prepared to take the cap hit.
3. You who are advocating writing the cap hit off, will wish you had that money to fill the other significant holes in this team.
4. The pickings are slim to none this off season to upgrade the QB position in either the draft or FA. If Plummer is available, he will want DC type money and a 3-4 year deal. No sale in my book.
5. If you are serious about building a dynasty, your best bet at upgrading the QB is in the 08 off season. Great QB class coming up.
6. There are plenty of holes to fill on the Texans. Work on those this off season.
7. Let Carr, Rosenfels, Van Pelt compete for the starting job. If Sage is that much better, let him start.

Don't git rid of your QB for the sake of doing it. Be smart about it.

I trust the Texan's front office will do just that. They will be smart when deciding what to do about the QB situation.

True the QB is probably the most important position on the team. But you have to have an o line, defense, and running game.

No more Denver retreads.

I want the Texans to be a dynasty, not the Dallas Cowboys under their current ownership.

Go ahead and twist around this post out of context to justify your argument and sleep better at night.

You are the last person that should be trying diminish credibility. Brooks? BROOKS? rotflmao

Go ahead stat boy. Your turn. Can you show me some stats that proves that Riley Dodge from Southlake Carroll High School is a better NFL QB than Carr too?

"OK. Aaron Brooks. I didn't bring up Brooks, you did."

"...stat boy." In all my posts, I don't call people names. It's not suppose to be allowed on this board but certain posters do it regularly-are you going to be one?

 

[Pantherstang84]

"OK. Aaron Brooks. I didn't bring up Brooks, you did."

"...stat boy." In all my posts, I don't call people names. It's not suppose to be allowed on this board but certain posters do it regularly-are you going to be one?

Nice try but I'm not biting. Have a nice day.

 

[NATHANHALE]

"The Brooks thing was too your credit sir. I just can't believe someone pulled some numbers off of a fantasy football site somewhere to justify their unbridled hatred toward DC."

Until you brought up Brooks and I verified his #'s on the NFL site, I had no idea he'd put up those kinds of #'s--111tds in 5 yrs!!!! Wow...so brand me and let me know who I want as QB next year (not Brooks, though)...have a good one,sport...



http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133233

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I just don't buy into the ABC (Anyone But Carr) train of thought. He's not a great QB and probably has been too damaged. However, that anyone could be someone like A. Brooks.

It could be an Aaron Brooks but it could be the next Tom Brady. With Carr, we have a pretty good idea what we have and it's not very good. I don't want to bring in Aaron Brooks because he's as bad as what we have. I'm not a big fan of Plummer's but I think he'd be a lot more productive than Carr.

I don't agree with the idea of keeping a guy on the roster just because we paid him too much in an attempt to work some psychological magic and let the kid know we had faith in him and were in his corner. I thought we'd save about $2 mill if we let him go sooner rather than later; we eat a chunk of change either way but less if we let him go prior to... what?... June 1st? Why keep a guy on the roster if he can't earn a spot? If he CAN earn a spot, great. If he CAN improve his play, great. I just don't think he's going to.

My argument has never been to bring in someone who is as bad as Carr (like Brooks). My argument has been to bring in someone who is signifcantly better than Carr even though they might not be a long term solution. At the very heart of this argument is the belief (a belief that some people do not share) that Carr would not win the QB job in competition against most QB's in the league (including backups). That belief is not baseless; I came by that belief the hard way by watching his play.

 

[thunderkyss]

"The Brooks thing was too your credit sir. I just can't believe someone pulled some numbers off of a fantasy football site somewhere to justify their unbridled hatred toward DC."

Until you brought up Brooks and I verified his #'s on the NFL site, I had no idea he'd put up those kinds of #'s--111tds in 5 yrs!!!! Wow...so brand me and let me know who I want as QB next year (not Brooks, though)...have a good one,sport...



http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133233

I like Brooks. Always have. He's a gamer. Has a stronger arm than David, and is more mobile, and more elusive.

HE's a lot dumber than David, so go figure.

I've always thought he'd be a hell of a qB if he ever got a real coach to teach him the game. Haslette was a joke, and Art was even funnier.

The kids got problems....... no doubt. But he's got Talent, size, & a hell of an arm.

 

[Hulk75]

It's real simple--credible posters back up their statements. Unfortunately for you, Carr is what Carr is and you can't change that.

Think about it. What does Carr have to offer any team? For starters-just to even see what Carr can do-a team has to surround him with a 'perfect' environment. It's not only players but schemes/play calling/decision making--everything has to be in place for Carr to even try to succeed. With cap considerations, how many teams have the monies available to upgrade the personnel they'll need for Carr.

Too, teams that are already set at almost every position are more than likely settled at QB. Carr is a gamble, not a sure thing by any means, and is expensive. What will Carr give a team for $5 million that a min pay QB won't?

Bottom line for a QB is putting up wins...Houston is already entrenched as the worse 5 yr old franchise in NFL history in winning percentage, below the likes of Tampa Bay and New Orleans.

I just hope enough of your BS is factual- 1 st rd draft choice, bring it on-to get Carr to another team...

Let me ask you, does Phillip Rivers have the perfect situation, best player in NFL history for his HB (the back up is not o shaby either), the best line in football, one of the best TEs and FBs in the league, has a stupid Defense and he lives in San Diego, now that sounds perfect. Why is it okay for some to have all that and not for others. Would you like me to do the teams of Peyton Manning, Ben, Brees, Romo, because it does not get any better yet all these guys are Pro Bowlers and have been protected for years now or right when they came into the leaugue.

And if it is all about wins what would you have to say about Rex Grossman, if it is about wins for a QB then Rex should have made the Pro Bowl, Right?

I am sorry that is the dumbest thing I have ever read, any successfull QB has had everything you have discribed. What you just said is plane stupid. So shacky play calling like he had for years, bad scheme for years should have made him a better QB? What the heck does that mean? SO SORRY that it takes sooooo much for a QB to do well, QBs should not have players atround him like Rivers does and Peyton does, QBs should not have the such things like Olines and Hall of Fame RBs, why should scheme even play a part in a QBs future and well being in the NFL. If he is good he will just be good no matter what, I am sorry that was retarted what you just wrote.

 

[real]

MOVING CARR


Houston is trying to trade former No. 1 overall pick David Carr, and thinks it may have a taker be fore the draft.

Carr is scheduled to earn $5.5 million this year and $6 million next year. He already cashed an $8 million roster bonus from the team last year.

Minnesota and Oakland are the two rumored destinations, but don't count out Miami, which never has met a quarterback it wouldn't trade to get, or Kansas City.

By the way, Carr was one of three quarterbacks taken in the first round of the 2002 draft. The other two, Joey Harrington and Patrick Ramsey, haven't been so hot, either.

Should Houston move Carr, look for the Texans to attempt to swing a deal with Denver for veteran quarterback Jake Plummer.

http://www.nj.com/columns/times/eckel/index.ssf?/base/columns-0/117177544721420.xml&coll=5

 

[Lucky]

Bill Walsh called him and told him how much he likes to watch Carr play, and how much respect he has for him, and he called to tell Carr that they would be crazy to get rid of him.

Did Walsh tell Kubiak the same thing?

Let me ask you, does David still want to play here? If he does, why doesn't he do a local TV, radio, or print interview saying so? A lot of fans would like to know what he's thinking right now.

 

[cuppacoffee]

Did Walsh tell Kubiak the same thing?

Let me ask you, does David still want to play here? If he does, why doesn't he do a local TV, radio, or print interview saying so? A lot of fans would like to know what he's thinking right now.

Sounds like a good suggestion for TexanChick.

But...let me ask you this...What could be gained if Carr would do this?

Unlike the haters around here...Carr has chosen the high road. Not a lot he could say that would change the mind set around here.

T. Owens speaks out about what he thinks/wants and is mostly vilified for it. Go figure.

Not a criticism Lucky...just a thought.

 

[Lucky]

But...let me ask you this...What could be gained if Carr would do this?

I'm not sure it's about "gain". Carr has every media outlet saying he's gone. The front office says that teams are calling about a possible trade. If I wanted to be with the Texans, I would at least say so publicly. Some fans would like to know what he thought about this past season and where he stands with the team. I don't see how that's the same as TO throwing his QB under the bus.

 

[2BCF]

Did Walsh tell Kubiak the same thing?

Let me ask you, does David still want to play here? If he does, why doesn't he do a local TV, radio, or print interview saying so? A lot of fans would like to know what he's thinking right now.

Honestly, what DC thinks is irrelevant. It's a non-factor.
By speaking to the press about his opinion would just reflect more negatively on his situation. He's had 5 years to "think" here, time to process his thoughts elsewhere or retire.

 

[srstex]

With all the negetive press & posters, obviously don't like stats cause Carr was 15th in the league as to QB rating, VY 30th, Jake 27th, and Rex was around 23rd. This does not say Carr is the best but apples to apples, Carr is the best out there available. Draft ?, well there are only two first round worthy QB's, and maybe Quinn will be there, I personally doubt it. Complain, complain, and complain some more, untill you have a BETTER QB, we have Carr. Plummer you say?, if we can pick him up after being cut, maybe, but only if he'll work for food.

 

[thunderkyss]

Let me ask you, does Phillip Rivers have the perfect situation, best player in NFL history for his HB (the back up is not o shaby either), the best line in football, one of the best TEs and FBs in the league, has a stupid Defense and he lives in San Diego, now that sounds perfect. Why is it okay for some to have all that and not for others. Would you like me to do the teams of Peyton Manning, Ben, Brees, Romo, because it does not get any better yet all these guys are Pro Bowlers and have been protected for years now or right when they came into the leaugue.

And if it is all about wins what would you have to say about Rex Grossman, if it is about wins for a QB then Rex should have made the Pro Bowl, Right?

I am sorry that is the dumbest thing I have ever read, any successfull QB has had everything you have discribed. What you just said is plane stupid. So shacky play calling like he had for years, bad scheme for years should have made him a better QB? What the heck does that mean? SO SORRY that it takes sooooo much for a QB to do well, QBs should not have players atround him like Rivers does and Peyton does, QBs should not have the such things like Olines and Hall of Fame RBs, why should scheme even play a part in a QBs future and well being in the NFL. If he is good he will just be good no matter what, I am sorry that was retarted what you just wrote.

Everything you've just said could be said for Charlie Batch, Tim Couch, Ryan Leaf, Joey Harrington, and a hundred others who just couldn't make it. JP Losman, Kyle Bollar, Billy Joe Tolliver, Billy Joe Hebert, etc.. etc..

What makes an offensive line look bad?? too many sacks, and not enough production in the run game. Over the last 3 years of the Capers crew's regime, our running game has been top 15 or top 10, but because of the sacks, they are considered among the worst in history. top 10, top 15, with a 3rd round RB, but among the worst in history.

Now if there was anyway at all to prove that the QB was responsible for the majority of those sacks, then they'd rank up there, at least with avg NFL.

But there is no way to prove it. who would believe that a QB in his right mind would just take 40 sacks a year??

If I believed for a second, that you would give a rats ass about the Texans W-Ls if Carr was on another team, then it would be worth my time to respond to every one of your silly posts...... but as it is, I'll just have to waste my time with you, because you just won't go away.

You wanna go ahead and believe that David belongs in this league, that's fine. You want to try to convince us, you're wasting your time. We've seen him for the last 5 years.

It's just like us going through 5 running backs in '06...... the line sucks, they couldn't open a whole with a Mack truck. But it doesn't matter, we've got to find someone who can produce with it. No one wants to hear the excuses, regardless how valid.

There isn't a QB in this league who would have started against the Giants IF they put the ball on the ground 3 times against Indy(losing 2), 3 times against Washington(loosing 2, plus the INT), twice against Miami(losing one + an INT), 2 INTs against Dallas, perfect in Jacksonville, but then an INT, and two fumbles against Tennessee.

It doesn't matter who is on the line. It doesn't matter who is in the backfield, it doesn't matter who your tightends are, & it doesn't matter who the WRs are. We need a QB to produce better than that. Especially when you've already changed the personnel at those other positions multiple times.

Your time would be better spent on the Vikings board, or the Raiders board, hyping David up, & telling them how he's going to deliver them to the promised land, and how we're a bunch of idiots with no patience or understanding of how you put together a football team.

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

Sometimes there's no complaining or explaining .... it's a matter of did it get done .

 

[NATHANHALE]

Let me ask you, does Phillip Rivers have the perfect situation, best player in NFL history for his HB (the back up is not o shaby either), the best line in football, one of the best TEs and FBs in the league, has a stupid Defense and he lives in San Diego, now that sounds perfect. Why is it okay for some to have all that and not for others. Would you like me to do the teams of Peyton Manning, Ben, Brees, Romo, because it does not get any better yet all these guys are Pro Bowlers and have been protected for years now or right when they came into the leaugue.

And if it is all about wins what would you have to say about Rex Grossman, if it is about wins for a QB then Rex should have made the Pro Bowl, Right?

I am sorry that is the dumbest thing I have ever read, any successfull QB has had everything you have discribed. What you just said is plane stupid. So shacky play calling like he had for years, bad scheme for years should have made him a better QB? What the heck does that mean? SO SORRY that it takes sooooo much for a QB to do well, QBs should not have players atround him like Rivers does and Peyton does, QBs should not have the such things like Olines and Hall of Fame RBs, why should scheme even play a part in a QBs future and well being in the NFL. If he is good he will just be good no matter what, I am sorry that was retarted what you just wrote.

...just get Carr out of Houston. What's going to happen if David doesn't go to one of those perfect places?...or,even worse, he does and it doesn't help!! Wow, guess thar's when you'll get out the 'mind' problems!! We'll see...

...one question...Jon Kitna had everything worse at Detroit last year than David and still threw for over 4000+ yds and 20+ tds--what's up with that?

 

[Hulk75]

Did Walsh tell Kubiak the same thing?

Let me ask you, does David still want to play here? If he does, why doesn't he do a local TV, radio, or print interview saying so? A lot of fans would like to know what he's thinking right now.

He wants to play for a HC and team that wants him, Yes he would like to finish here, this is were he started, it was an expantion team there were going to be hard times for years he knew that comming and it would tick him off if he could not finish with the team just when they started to get some players. He just wants whatever is going to happen happen, I think and I am sure he does that he has earned the right to know about what is going on, for the most part we have heard everything from his agent and his business manager. I can tell you that they tell him that he is the starter and they are not shopping him, But take that for what it is worth. Cause we hear that, then we hear from his agent- KC, Baltimore, Carolina, Miami, Oakland, Tampa, Bills, Browns, Eagles, Jax, Minnesota, Bears, Lions, Green Bay, Redskins all want him. But whatever, he just would like to know if he is here or somewere else around March 1. He likes Houston he would love to stay here, but we will see. Kubes and them say he is staying and is the starter.

 

[Hulk75]

...just get Carr out of Houston. What's going to happen if David doesn't go to one of those perfect places?...or,even worse, he does and it doesn't help!! Wow, guess thar's when you'll get out the 'mind' problems!! We'll see...

...one question...Jon Kitna had everything worse at Detroit last year than David and still threw for over 4000+ yds and 20+ tds--what's up with that?

What if it does help?
Yea I guess his 600 attempts dont play into that, compared to carrs 440.
22 ints also, how long would Carr have been here if he throw that many?

And having PASS happy Mike Martz did not make a difference either?

 

[NATHANHALE]

What if it does help?
Yea I guess his 600 attempts dont play into that, compared to carrs 440.
22 ints also, how long would Carr have been here if he throw that many?

And having PASS happy Mike Martz did not make a difference either?

...send him to the Raiders where surely he can beat 7 passing tds and not get sacked more than 72 times

Do you look forward to the day when you don't have to make excuses for David?

...you know, you make a good point--send him to Detroit where any QB can put up #'s under Martz--that's it...problem solved...or is it???

...600 pass attempts?...well, you can blame that on Gary for not letting David throw the ball toward the end of the season...anything else?

...oh,yeah, almost forgot the intercepts...kudos to Carr for just tossing the ball a couple yds to get yac and minimize interceptions

 

[Lucky]

Kubes and them say he is staying and is the starter.

If Kubiak did tell Carr that, and the team turns around and deals him anyway, that's pretty lame. If they are going to deal or release the guy, they should tell him so he can get on with his career. That would be the classy thing to do.

I'm still not convinced that Carr won't be traded or released, but at least I understand why you feel that way.

 

[HOU-TEX]

This might be a little off topic, but it's a Carr thread. Here's a link to a Buc MB. It appears that a few of thier fans would love to have him. LOL! Well, let's hope they learn the hard way, like we did.

http://bbs.buccaneers.com/showthread.php?t=136383&page=1&pp=30

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

I think it depends on the conversation and how it was said .

Did Kubiak say ... David we would never trade or cut you . In fact we can see you being our guy for years .

Maybe this is what was said ... David we are looking at all possibilities and we're not 100% sure anything will happen.

I've known folks to take this as an endorsement .

 

[Double Barrel]

If Kubiak did tell Carr that, and the team turns around and deals him anyway, that's pretty lame. If they are going to deal or release the guy, they should tell him so he can get on with his career. That would be the classy thing to do.

I'm still not convinced that Carr won't be traded or released, but at least I understand why you feel that way.

After reading Hulk's post, I thought the same thing. How lame if they are leading him to believe that he's our starter in 2007, but then just deal him. It is a business, but there are ways to conduct business that are honorable, and other ways that are not so much.

I believe that Hulk believes what he is saying and is not just stirring the pot to stir it. I think the organization has led DC to think one way, regardless of what they are really thinking. I wouldn't expect them to tip their hands, but I'd also expect them to refrain from promising a player one thing while they do another.

 

[real]

I don't believe that statement by Hulk...


Either Gary lied, or Hulk is lying. One of the two.


Hulk has speculated about trades, and teams that are interested in Carr(20, right?) too much for me to believe that they have word from Kubiak that David won't be traded. If you have been given information like that, you wouldn't be wasting your time arguing about it. If Kubes did tell y'all that, he must have not sounded too convincing, because it doesn't seem as if you feel too secure about the whole situation.

 

[Texans_Chick]

What would you like me to do, tell you were and who i have heard it from? why in the bloody heck would i share anything with most! of you? there are people who know around here, I dont care to say who, they know.

Like I said what is my reson for lying? Why would I just make it up, you guys allready hate him so what does it matter right? I drop stuff on here from time to time for people who acctually care and trust me.

I write things and you think I am lying, well I am not a guy that goes around deseving people and lying to make others look good. You can believe me or not, thats up to you, I dont need to defend what I write because it is what it is. You guys make me laugh, who do you think might know a little something, you or me? I said 20 so you can believe it is 20 or not. You dont cause you think he is bad, and not having resources like other successfull QB means nothing to you. It is Carr, it is all on him, we want Quinn we want this guy, even Jake Plummer is better now, anyone but Carr, BUT 20 think other wise, I will blow your doors off with another bit, 1 team even offered a 1 rd pick!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! Bill Walsh called him and told him how much he likes to watch Carr play, and how much respect he has for him, and he called to tell Carr that they would be crazy to get rid of him. So you can think I am lying about that to if you would like.

Where ever he goes, it will be were God wants him to be.

And Carr is better then Jake.
Hey believe me or not, it does not bother me. I send little things out for people who acctually care to read it, we have a saying, "You dont need to lie to hang out".

Thanks for sharing your point of view. It is nice to get comments that break people out of their group think about things.

FWIW, my friend and I ran into AZ coach Ken Whisenhunt when we were at the Super Bowl. He said that he was a big fan of David Carr, and thought he was getting a bum rap from fans at large.

I think the biggest plus that Carr as a free agent/trade has is his age, athleticism and perceived upside. Most of the QBs who might be available are older, and have basically maxed out their careers. Even the biggest Carr haters cannot believe that the Texans have had the ideal offensive players around him.

 

[Texans_Chick]

If Kubiak did tell Carr that, and the team turns around and deals him anyway, that's pretty lame. If they are going to deal or release the guy, they should tell him so he can get on with his career. That would be the classy thing to do.

I'm still not convinced that Carr won't be traded or released, but at least I understand why you feel that way.

I am guessing that they aren't really shopping him, but will be open to whatever they believe is: a. an upgrade for the team; b. at the right price for just about all positions on the team.

My inner inner cynic that I try to keep bottled up thinks it is funny that the Carr trade talk came up at about the same time the season ticket renewal packages went out.

 

[Hulk75]

I don't believe that statement by Hulk...


Either Gary lied, or Hulk is lying. One of the two.


Hulk has speculated about trades, and teams that are interested in Carr(20, right?) too much for me to believe that they have word from Kubiak that David won't be traded. If you have been given information like that, you wouldn't be wasting your time arguing about it. If Kubes did tell y'all that, he must have not sounded too convincing, because it doesn't seem as if you feel too secure about the whole situation.

"He thinks I am lying"

I know it is hard to believe, cause it is all his fault. O sorry,

his agent- KC, Baltimore, Carolina, Miami, Oakland, Tampa, Bills, Browns, Eagles, Jax, Minnesota, Bears, Lions, Green Bay, Redskins all want him

15 my fault. Yes am lying you caught me, did you like how I just threw Bill Walshs name out there, got you didnt I?

 

[real]

"He thinks I am lying"

I know it is hard to believe, cause it is all his fault. O sorry, 15 my fault. Yes am lying you caught me, did you like how I just threw Bill Walshs name out there, got you didnt I?

I don't think you're lying about the teams that want Carr...

I can believe that...In fact I think that Carr has "value" around the leauge...


The part I don't believe is the part about Kubiak and the orginization telling Carr he is the starter and will not be traded.

 

[Lucky]

his agent- KC, Baltimore, Carolina, Miami, Oakland, Tampa, Bills, Browns, Eagles, Jax, Minnesota, Bears, Lions, Green Bay, Redskins all want him

Of course, it's hard to determine the level of interest that each of those teams may have. It could run from giving Carr a vet minimum contract plus incentives as a backup (Eagles?, Green Bay?) to competing for the starting job (Carolina?, Tampa Bay?). Only the agent & those teams know for sure.

Which brings up tampering. Did the Texans give Carr's agent the OK to talk contract with other teams? After telling David he's the starter and not going anywhere? Just doesn't seem to fit.

 

[real]

Which brings up tampering. Did the Texans give Carr's agent the OK to talk contract with other teams? After telling David he's the starter and not going anywhere? Just doesn't seem to fit.

Exactly. Why would there even be discussion about the teams that want David if David was told he'd be here next year? Why are y'all even worried about that ?

 

[Heath Shuler]

Let me ask you, does Phillip Rivers have the perfect situation, best player in NFL history for his HB (the back up is not o shaby either), the best line in football, one of the best TEs and FBs in the league, has a stupid Defense and he lives in San Diego, now that sounds perfect. Why is it okay for some to have all that and not for others. Would you like me to do the teams of Peyton Manning, Ben, Brees, Romo, because it does not get any better yet all these guys are Pro Bowlers and have been protected for years now or right when they came into the leaugue.

And if it is all about wins what would you have to say about Rex Grossman, if it is about wins for a QB then Rex should have made the Pro Bowl, Right?

I am sorry that is the dumbest thing I have ever read, any successfull QB has had everything you have discribed. What you just said is plane stupid. So shacky play calling like he had for years, bad scheme for years should have made him a better QB? What the heck does that mean? SO SORRY that it takes sooooo much for a QB to do well, QBs should not have players atround him like Rivers does and Peyton does, QBs should not have the such things like Olines and Hall of Fame RBs, why should scheme even play a part in a QBs future and well being in the NFL. If he is good he will just be good no matter what, I am sorry that was retarted what you just wrote.

Hopefully for Carr’s sake one of the twenty teams that is interested in him is the NFL 75th Anniversary All-Time Team.

Can you please answer a question for me? Is it the: offense coordinator, head coach, scheme, O-line, TE’s, or Wr’s fault that Carr threw the ball past the line of scrimmage not once but twice in the same quarter of football?

 

[NATHANHALE]

"If you're a quarterback out there in America, we'll be looking into yours, as well," Gruden said. "We've got to find a guy who can dominate, not a guy who can run a game or help us score here or there."

"We've got to find a guy in Tampa, Florida, who can dominate the NFL and be a superstar quarterback, and that gives us a chance to be where we want to be. Until we do, we're going to be looking."

...sorry, better scratch TB off Carr's list. In another article, Gruden says he has the big bucks for a proven winner...

"...not a guy who can run a game or help us score here or there."

And, to think, Simms has started less than 20 games!!!!!!!!!!

 

[TwinSisters]

"If you're a quarterback out there in America, we'll be looking into yours, as well," Gruden said. "We've got to find a guy who can dominate, not a guy who can run a game or help us score here or there."

"We've got to find a guy in Tampa, Florida, who can dominate the NFL and be a superstar quarterback, and that gives us a chance to be where we want to be. Until we do, we're going to be looking."

****** man **** ******* do *** * ****** ***** I ***** **** love ***** ****** Gruden.

!$@$#%#@!!!!!!

I would trade Kubiack, Carr, and a 4th rounder to Tampa for Gruden and their first. It will be like old times dealing with Tampa.

 

[HoustonFrog]

BTW, I forgot this last night Hulk. The way the NFL usually works is that the GM and owner and coach start receiving trade scenarios from other GMs, etc. During this period, unless their is a no-trade clause that needs to be waived, the players involved, because they are still with the team, usually don't get the heads up on what is going on. Sometimes they are the last to hear. I'm sure Dave isn't getting daily calls as to "hey we don't want you here anymore but there are 20 teams that want you." You don't alienate your players and they aren't privy to the trade offers..like fantasy #1s, etc. So your whole scenarios isn't really in the realm of NFL reality. Add that to the fact that I'm sure their family isn't sitting there finding this info out either. That isn't how NFL teams work.

Oh, I'm sorry, I see Hulk is still making up stories.

 

[thunderkyss]

Even the biggest Carr haters cannot believe that the Texans have had the ideal offensive players around him.

I will go so far to say that I believe we haven't had David in the most ideal offensive system for him.