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3rd Round (90th pick): Jonathan Greenard, OLB

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
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So doing so, consideration has to be made as to what performance is reached after injury. Most importantly is how do the injuries affect his future.

His wrist dislocation occurred after he was pushed out of the sidelines and landed awkwardly trying to break his fall. The high ankle sprain was suffered after his foot was stepped on. He has come back strong from both.
Knowledge is key
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
LOL yeah NIKE is really hurting for money with the testing system they tour the country with every single year.

Most of the major college programs in the country “encourage” athletes to attend one before they get an offer so they can get accurate measurements.

It’s seriously like a series of mini high school football combines.
I didn't know this
 

TexansSeminole

Hall of Fame
Good to see you back , man.

How's it been going
The wife and I had a baby boy. 6 months old this week. Not much else going on in sports with the virus. How about yourself?

I didn’t do any research for the draft, but Greenard is one of the guys I noticed all season so I think we got a guy who’s got a chance. I’m glad we were able to get him because it is probably the position where we need an upgrade the most, atleast top 3.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
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The wife and I had a baby boy. 6 months old this week. Not much else going on in sports with the virus. How about yourself?

I didn’t do any research for the draft, but Greenard is one of the guys I noticed all season so I think we got a guy who’s got a chance. I’m glad we were able to get him because it is probably the position where we need an upgrade the most, atleast top 3.
Congrats on the baby boy. I guess you're not getting much sleep now. LOL

Everything is going well, my business is considered essential personnel. How about you, are you able to work? You're in Real Estate if I remember correctly.

On Greenard, he's going to be a huge upgrade over Scarlett if he can stay healthy. This man plays angry and is very strong. He can set an edge and has a little pass rush ability. He has a good up and under move and can bend the edge but isn't explosive as a pass rusher. If he can learn a spin move he can become an even better pass rusher. He's got tools in the toolbox to become a long time starter and very solid player for a long time.
 

TexansSeminole

Hall of Fame
Congrats on the baby boy. I guess you're not getting much sleep now. LOL

Everything is going well, my business is considered essential personnel. How about you, are you able to work? You're in Real Estate if I remember correctly.

On Greenard, he's going to be a huge upgrade over Scarlett if he can stay healthy. This man plays angry and is very strong. He can set an edge and has a little pass rush ability. He has a good up and under move and can bend the edge but isn't explosive as a pass rusher. If he can learn a spin move he can become an even better pass rusher. He's got tools in the toolbox to become a long time starter and very solid player for a long time.
That’s good to hear about your business. I work for a small hospitality group that manages resorts and hotels. We primarily operate out of the Keys. It’s been a real struggle so far, but we are surviving.

Greenard is probably not going to be a high sack guy early, but I think he can do as you said and set the edge, be strong at the LOS, and play assignment football right away. I expect him to play a lot.
 

RGV82

Random guy
That’s good to hear about your business. I work for a small hospitality group that manages resorts and hotels. We primarily operate out of the Keys. It’s been a real struggle so far, but we are surviving.

Greenard is probably not going to be a high sack guy early, but I think he can do as you said and set the edge, be strong at the LOS, and play assignment football right away. I expect him to play a lot.
He has been praised by numerous reports for his play against the run but needs improvement at the NFL level against the pass. I expect him to play a fair amount rotating in his first year.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
The wife and I had a baby boy. 6 months old this week. Not much else going on in sports with the virus. How about yourself?

I didn’t do any research for the draft, but Greenard is one of the guys I noticed all season so I think we got a guy who’s got a chance. I’m glad we were able to get him because it is probably the position where we need an upgrade the most, atleast top 3.
Congratulations on your son! Can he play left tackle or quarterback?
 
35 inch arms makes 22 reps a very good number.

Otisbean can speak better about this than I ever could.
Short arms equal a shorter distance between chest and lockout. Longer arms, that is the reverse. Which is why if you have longer arms dumbbell presses work better. I'm a certified trainer but that's the basic idea. Making it at times easier to do more reps with (example) 12" arms vs 22". About 75% or more of the time it's true.
 
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otisbean

Veteran
Contributor's Club
With long arms and the bench press, as stated above, there’s more distance to push therefore each rep is literally more work for the long armed lifter. Additionally, and this is the main issue in my eyes, there’s the length tension relationship of muscles to contend with. The more a muscle is stretched the less force it can develop. So, as an athlete with longer arms brings the bar to his chest, there’s more stretch, therefore it’s harder to develop force.

As bah007 said, the 225 for reps test is more endurance than power. I’d like to take a blocking sled and attach some type of load cell or accelerometer to it and have linemen fire out into the sled to full extension. You’d have a reading of the force put into the sled and it’d give you a good idea of the kind of pop an athlete has.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Short arms equal a shorter distance between chest and lockout. Longer arms, that is the reverse. Which is why if you have longer arms dumbbell presses work better. I'm a certified trainer but that's the basic idea. Making it at times easier to do more reps with (example) 12" arms vs 22". About 75% or more of the time it's true.
With long arms and the bench press, as stated above, there’s more distance to push therefore each rep is literally more work for the long armed lifter. Additionally, and this is the main issue in my eyes, there’s the length tension relationship of muscles to contend with. The more a muscle is stretched the less force it can develop. So, as an athlete with longer arms brings the bar to his chest, there’s more stretch, therefore it’s harder to develop force.

As bah007 said, the 225 for reps test is more endurance than power. I’d like to take a blocking sled and attach some type of load cell or accelerometer to it and have linemen fire out into the sled to full extension. You’d have a reading of the force put into the sled and it’d give you a good idea of the kind of pop an athlete has.
A classic example of desirable lever lengths and body proportions in powerlifting is Andrzej Stanaszek of Poland. By definition, Stanaszek is a dwarf, having extremely short arms and legs. However, in a 2003 meet, he set world records by squatting 662.5 pounds and bench pressing 402.3 pounds . . . at a bodyweight of 114.

1588072326508.png
 

Attachments

RGV82

Random guy
I really wanted Jaylon Ferguson in last year’s draft but he came off the board just before the Texans took Warring. Greenard is just as good a prospect imo.
I find it funny you bring up Jaylon Ferguson, as his first career sack was on Deshaun Watson last year, lol.
 
With long arms and the bench press, as stated above, there’s more distance to push therefore each rep is literally more work for the long armed lifter. Additionally, and this is the main issue in my eyes, there’s the length tension relationship of muscles to contend with. The more a muscle is stretched the less force it can develop. So, as an athlete with longer arms brings the bar to his chest, there’s more stretch, therefore it’s harder to develop force.

As bah007 said, the 225 for reps test is more endurance than power. I’d like to take a blocking sled and attach some type of load cell or accelerometer to it and have linemen fire out into the sled to full extension. You’d have a reading of the force put into the sled and it’d give you a good idea of the kind of pop an athlete has.
Exactly. Now, there are ways to make it closer to equal length. But, at the combine they don't have time to custom set up the bench for each person.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Everything I hear about Greenard is encouraging and gets me excited! But there has to be a reason why he's a 3rd round pick. What are the knocks on this guy?
 

Rich Schmidt

Myopicone
Everything I hear about Greenard is encouraging and gets me excited! But there has to be a reason why he's a 3rd round pick. What are the knocks on this guy?
He is not an elite athlete, he wins with hard work, preparation and football IQ. He is a good athlete. I think NFL looks too much for measurables. I saw him not finish a lot of plays last year, but he had a hand issue and could not grab those shifty QB's. He can play the run and likes too, and has some of the best pass rush arsenal in college so happy he is in H-Town
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
I keep reading/hearing from both posters here and commentators that he is undersized. The guy is 6’3” 263 lbs. That’s not at all undersized.

Those measurables, at least to me are more prototypical of an inside linebacker than an OLB / Edge who optimally are a little longer and fleeter of foot than the typical inside guy.

I'm probably splitting hairs ....
 
Everything I hear about Greenard is encouraging and gets me excited! But there has to be a reason why he's a 3rd round pick. What are the knocks on this guy?
If you watch a few videos on YouTube of his play. It becomes more clear how good he can be. He has a good first step, natural bend, long arms and he uses his hands very well (compared to the scouting report assessment). With the right coaching he can be a monster on the edge.
He is not an elite athlete, he wins with hard work, preparation and football IQ. He is a good athlete. I think NFL looks too much for measurables. I saw him not finish a lot of plays last year, but he had a hand issue and could not grab those shifty QB's. He can play the run and likes too, and has some of the best pass rush arsenal in college so happy he is in H-Town
He has the ability but he is not elite. And as you said his football IQ is very high. His motor never stops on field and he practices as hard or harder.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
If you watch a few videos on YouTube of his play. It becomes more clear how good he can be. He has a good first step, natural bend, long arms and he uses his hands very well (compared to the scouting report assessment). With the right coaching he can be a monster on the edge.


He has the ability but he is not elite. And as you said his football IQ is very high. His motor never stops on field and he practices as hard or harder.
I'll take a couple more of those any day.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
He is not an elite athlete, he wins with hard work, preparation and football IQ. He is a good athlete. I think NFL looks too much for measurables. I saw him not finish a lot of plays last year, but he had a hand issue and could not grab those shifty QB's. He can play the run and likes too, and has some of the best pass rush arsenal in college so happy he is in H-Town
The writeups on Greenard's injury doesn't do him justice. He lost a full season to what is usually referred to as a "wrist ligament injury." What he actually suffered was a total wrist dislocation which completely tore (grade III) the 3 most supportive ligaments of his wrist, which required open ligament repair surgery with multiple pin stabilization. He has completely healed and is fully functional from his injury. And what we saw in his return year (watching him on film) was amazing, with any residual hesitancy ("guarding") to maximally stress his wrist to be entirely expected. After the confidence of a year under his belt, that hesitancy should be all but gone.
 

banned1976

Fire Bill O’Brien, maybe?
The only pick in the 2020 draft by the Texans that made really good sense. Greenard could become a solid starter along the line in a couple of years.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
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The only pick in the 2020 draft by the Texans that made really good sense. Greenard could become a solid starter along the line in a couple of years.
You dont like Blacklock?

Interior pressure was a big thing that was lacking on the defense last yr. I'm expecting Blacklock to have a Chris Jones impact by yr 2 and to be a solid upgrade in yr 1.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
You dont like Blacklock?

Interior pressure was a big thing that was lacking on the defense last yr. I'm expecting Blacklock to have a Chris Jones impact by yr 2 and to be a solid upgrade in yr 1.
Wow sounds like you are really high on Blacklock SteelB ?
So anyway what's your evaluation on Greenard SteelB ?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Wow sounds like you are really high on Blacklock SteelB ?
So anyway what's your evaluation on Greenard SteelB ?
I'm very high on Blacklock because very few men that big can move the way he does. He needs some technique work, like being able to find the ball better but Weaver should be able to help with this in short order.

I think Mercilus is Greenard's floor. Vrabel is Greenard's ceiling. I dont expect a whole lot from Greenard in his rookie yr. But hopefully he will allow the Texans to move on from Mercilus in a couple of yrs.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I think Mercilus is Greenard's floor. Vrabel is Greenard's ceiling. I dont expect a whole lot from Greenard in his rookie yr. But hopefully he will allow the Texans to move on from Mercilus in a couple of yrs.
Mercilus was lucky to have Vrabel for a coach, that's when he looked like a plus player. Without Vrabel, he's been.... eh.


Who's coaching our LBs/edge players now?
 

banned1976

Fire Bill O’Brien, maybe?
I wish someone would dislike my delete post.

It was about Blacklock. I’m always skeptical of big men that have torn their Achilles. Reports are he was nearly himself a year later but that doesn’t totally convince me. We’ll see. I just have higher hopes for Greenard.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I wish someone would dislike my delete post.

It was about Blacklock. I’m always skeptical of big men that have torn their Achilles. Reports are he was nearly himself a year later but that doesn’t totally convince me. We’ll see. I just have higher hopes for Greenard.
You’re well liked on here, I’m one of the few members who gets the dislike selected. Mainly by CW.

I have high hopes for Greenard as well.
 

banned1976

Fire Bill O’Brien, maybe?
You’re well liked on here, I’m one of the few members who gets the dislike selected. Mainly by CW.

I have high hopes for Greenard as well.
I think “delete” and “NVM” get the highest rate of likes.

I was careful in my post upstairs with the phrasing “really good sense”. The reason for Blacklock not meeting that category is because who was available; and the man making all the personnel decisions, knowing he was going to have a big hole in the secondary in releasing Gipson, the only guy you could count on in defending against tight ends opted to ignore that very high priority. The Blacklock pick was fine, it made some sense but not priority #1 IMO.

To preclude derailing the thread I won’t get into the sense I could make out of the OT and WR picks. Because quite frankly, I can’t make much out of them.

I’ve never been one to fall in love with every draft pick. And sometimes a guy surprises me. Maybe all 5 picks become really good NFL players.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
You’re well liked on here, I’m one of the few members who gets the dislike selected. Mainly by CW.

I have high hopes for Greenard as well.
You also give out the dislikes by the dozens
I hope you don't personally dislike me because I don't think DW4 is a championship level QB.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Only when you're wrong, which is apparently too much. Maybe you should take steps to correct this?

Also Greenard will meet your expectations. Book it.
Also, your infatuation with me is very flattering.
No it’s when I do not agree with your homeboys on here. That’s a big difference.

Naw you’re not all of that dude. Get over yourself
 
I'm very high on Blacklock because very few men that big can move the way he does. He needs some technique work, like being able to find the ball better but Weaver should be able to help with this in short order.

I think Mercilus is Greenard's floor. Vrabel is Greenard's ceiling. I dont expect a whole lot from Greenard in his rookie yr. But hopefully he will allow the Texans to move on from Mercilus in a couple of yrs.
He is 296...JJ is similar to his weight. But, taller...that is based on the scouting report of height and weight.
 


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