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2023 TEXANS DRAFT DISCUSSION

Speedy said:
That makes no sense. So we shouldn't draft a pass rusher because we need one?
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Everyone you draft should be because it's the right guy.

Don't draft ANY player just because you need the position he plays, draft the player who's going to be a great player.

Would you draft Zach Wilson for your QB because he's a QB and you need one of those and you're in a position to draft a QB?

I can promise you that whatever we think of these guys are not what teams are thinking. Their evaluations are a whole hell of a lot more indepth than the evaluations of anybody here. And hell, even the professionals don't get it right more times than not. This stuff truly is a crapshoot.

I have no doubt the Texans will do what THEY feel is right for their team. I was simply addressing the need we DO have for QB, being in a position to draft one, and some folks here not wanting them the draft one. If not now, when?
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No one is arguing against the fact that we have a huge need for a QB.

No one is arguing that we're in a position to draft a really great QB if one is available.

The point being argued is whether there's a great one available.

If there's not a great on available, then you have to wait until there is one available and hope you can get one.

I mean, you don't have to draft 1 or 2 in order to get a great QB. Mahomes was drafted 10th, Watson was 12th in the same draft. Hurts was drafted 53rd, Russell Wilson 75th.

In this draft, the QB who ends up being a Franchise guy could well be Hooker or Bennet or one of those other late round guys.
 
Thorn said:
How can anyone know what an organization is thinking when their public spokesperson is Caserio? I'm convinced that's why the Texans have him.
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"Gm is always an important position of need along with other critical factors. We'll evaluate all positions and review the possibilities. We haven't decided on anything as of yet ,but it's oportunial and we know exactly what we need to do.

...and I'm not leaving!"
 
The Pencil Neck said:
If there's not a great on available, then you have to wait until there is one available and hope you can get one.

I mean, you don't have to draft 1 or 2 in order to get a great QB. Mahomes was drafted 10th, Watson was 12th in the same draft. Hurts was drafted 53rd, Russell Wilson 75th.

In this draft, the QB who ends up being a Franchise guy could well be Hooker or Bennet or one of those other late round guys.
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THIS!
100% This.
 
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The Pencil Neck said:
Everyone you draft should be because it's the right guy.

Don't draft ANY player just because you need the position he plays, draft the player who's going to be a great player.

Would you draft Zach Wilson for your QB because he's a QB and you need one of those and you're in a position to draft a QB?



No one is arguing against the fact that we have a huge need for a QB.

No one is arguing that we're in a position to draft a really great QB if one is available.

The point being argued is whether there's a great one available.

If there's not a great on available, then you have to wait until there is one available and hope you can get one.

I mean, you don't have to draft 1 or 2 in order to get a great QB. Mahomes was drafted 10th, Watson was 12th in the same draft. Hurts was drafted 53rd, Russell Wilson 75th.

In this draft, the QB who ends up being a Franchise guy could well be Hooker or Bennet or one of those other late round guys.
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Seems your argument isn’t about not drafting a QB. More about drafting as many as possible to hedge your bet. Because you can’t win if you don’t play.
 
Lucky said:
Seems your argument isn’t about not drafting a QB. More about drafting as many as possible to hedge your bet. Because you can’t win if you don’t play.
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In the later rounds, yeah.

But my argument is more about creating your big board with care and diligence, trusting it, and then following it.

If the Texans think Stroud is going to be great, then they should draft him. If they think he's going to be average at best, then they should either trade that pick to whomever is willing to give them the most good stuff to get it or choose whomever is at the top of their board if they think that player is good enough. If they think Stroud is going to be average and the Colts want him, make them pay to trade up and get him, and then prove he's average every time you play him.

But, yeah, I'm totally on board with taking some late round flyers on guys like Stetson Bennett or Sammy Haegar or Clayton Tune or whomever. Because you could end up with a Purdy or a Kurt Warner.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
Everyone you draft should be because it's the right guy.

Don't draft ANY player just because you need the position he plays, draft the player who's going to be a great player.

Would you draft Zach Wilson for your QB because he's a QB and you need one of those and you're in a position to draft a QB?



No one is arguing against the fact that we have a huge need for a QB.

No one is arguing that we're in a position to draft a really great QB if one is available.

The point being argued is whether there's a great one available.

If there's not a great on available, then you have to wait until there is one available and hope you can get one.

I mean, you don't have to draft 1 or 2 in order to get a great QB. Mahomes was drafted 10th, Watson was 12th in the same draft. Hurts was drafted 53rd, Russell Wilson 75th.

In this draft, the QB who ends up being a Franchise guy could well be Hooker or Bennet or one of those other late round guys.
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Every team has a draft board that runs horizontal and vertical. When everything works right, the best player match up with the needs. I mean were Stingley and Green the best players or were they the biggest need? According to the Texans, they were graded the highest I guess
 
I fully expect to be shocked by our decision at #2. Then I fully expect that draft day analysts will tout the non-traditional decision as a good one because of the upside. Then I fully expect to read dozens of draft grade articles over the next week giving the Texans a C+ for the pick. However that manifests itself, I will be prepared.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
Everyone you draft should be because it's the right guy.

Don't draft ANY player just because you need the position he plays, draft the player who's going to be a great player.

Would you draft Zach Wilson for your QB because he's a QB and you need one of those and you're in a position to draft a QB?



No one is arguing against the fact that we have a huge need for a QB.

No one is arguing that we're in a position to draft a really great QB if one is available.

The point being argued is whether there's a great one available.

If there's not a great on available, then you have to wait until there is one available and hope you can get one.

I mean, you don't have to draft 1 or 2 in order to get a great QB. Mahomes was drafted 10th, Watson was 12th in the same draft. Hurts was drafted 53rd, Russell Wilson 75th.

In this draft, the QB who ends up being a

Franchise guy could well be Hooker or Bennet or one of those other late round guys.
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You seem to be overlooking that you do not know how good the player will be until sometime After he is drafted. There is no consensus on either one of the 2 high ranked quarterbacks. Of course you can find good Players after round one but you do not know they're going to be good until much later.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
In the later rounds, yeah.

But my argument is more about creating your big board with care and diligence, trusting it, and then following it.

If the Texans think Stroud is going to be great, then they should draft him. If they think he's going to be average at best, then they should either trade that pick to whomever is willing to give them the most good stuff to get it or choose whomever is at the top of their board if they think that player is good enough. If they think Stroud is going to be average and the Colts want him, make them pay to trade up and get him, and then prove he's average every time you play him.

But, yeah, I'm totally on board with taking some late round flyers on guys like Stetson Bennett or Sammy Haegar or Clayton Tune or whomever. Because you could end up with a Purdy or a Kurt Warner.
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Do you seriously think that if the texans think Stroud is average they will still draft him at 2?
 
badboy said:
Do you seriously think that if the texans think Stroud is average they will still draft him at 2?
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I feel like whatever player and whatever position they draft at 2 they have to be 100% certain that he’s a bonafide all pro.

If they think the top QB available to them has like a 70% chance of being great, they need to switch focus and take someone with maybe a 60% or 50% chance later on. That’s what it boils down to.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
In the later rounds, yeah.

But my argument is more about creating your big board with care and diligence, trusting it, and then following it.

If the Texans think Stroud is going to be great, then they should draft him. If they think he's going to be average at best, then they should either trade that pick to whomever is willing to give them the most good stuff to get it or choose whomever is at the top of their board if they think that player is good enough. If they think Stroud is going to be average and the Colts want him, make them pay to trade up and get him, and then prove he's average every time you play him.

But, yeah, I'm totally on board with taking some late round flyers on guys like Stetson Bennett or Sammy Haegar or Clayton Tune or whomever. Because you could end up with a Purdy or a Kurt Warner.
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I agree in principle, but at the end of the day, you either have a QB or you don't. All of the All-Star pass rushers in the world won't win you anything without an elite QB at the helm, that is the modern NFL. The days of the Ravens winning a Super Bowl with a badass defense and a game manager are long over.

Heard Zerline on the radio say that Stetson Bennett is probably going undrafted. Terrible character, basically a poor man's Manziel.

We got to see how doing cheap on garbage QBs first hand with the pre-Watson Texans, even with JJ and D-Hop.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
After what the 49ers gave up for Lance to begin with, even if there is any truth to that rumor, Lance would need to virtually be a "gimme"............something I don't believe the Niners would do.

The last time Lance made it through a full season was back in 2019 when he was still at North Dakota State where he had the kind of success that helped convince the 49ers he was worth the investment.

Since then, Lance saw one game with the Bison in 2020 before the pandemic ended that campaign (In his 2020 offseason at North Dakota, he underwent a left medial meniscus excision.), made it through two starts and a second-half relief effort for Garoppolo in 2021 (suffering a left medial collateral grade I sprain Oct 10) and then added a mere 6 quarters of action in 2022 before being relegated to a season-ending fracture/dislocation resulting in 2 reconstructive surgeries.
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I can't touch the guy with the injury history.

Don't care for Levis either.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
In the later rounds, yeah.

But my argument is more about creating your big board with care and diligence, trusting it, and then following it.

If the Texans think Stroud is going to be great, then they should draft him. If they think he's going to be average at best, then they should either trade that pick to whomever is willing to give them the most good stuff to get it or choose whomever is at the top of their board if they think that player is good enough. If they think Stroud is going to be average and the Colts want him, make them pay to trade up and get him, and then prove he's average every time you play him.

But, yeah, I'm totally on board with taking some late round flyers on guys like Stetson Bennett or Sammy Haegar or Clayton Tune or whomever. Because you could end up with a Purdy or a Kurt Warner.
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Or Jaden Hall
 
The1ApplePie said:
I agree in principle, but at the end of the day, you either have a QB or you don't. All of the All-Star pass rushers in the world won't win you anything without an elite QB at the helm, that is the modern NFL. The days of the Ravens winning a Super Bowl with a badass defense and a game manager are long over.

Heard Zerline on the radio say that Stetson Bennett is probably going undrafted. Terrible character, basically a poor man's Manziel.

We got to see how doing cheap on garbage QBs first hand with the pre-Watson Texans, even with JJ and D-Hop.
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Agreed. If we're not even going to try to get an elite QB, we might as well just run it back with Mills and be happy with irrelevance. The draft is a gamble. You just have to place your bet and hope it works out. As you mentioned, with the way the league is now, you have to try to get a franchise QB because it's the one position that can completely tank your team.
 
theCATALYST said:
Only that the Texans valued one of the QB's high enough to make the attempt. Which QB remains to be seen. IF we pass on a QB at #2 or trade down, we have our answer.
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Where do you get that Texans made an attempt to trade up? I'm not attacking you but it seems like you're reading a whole lot into nothing.
 
The1ApplePie said:
I agree in principle, but at the end of the day, you either have a QB or you don't. All of the All-Star pass rushers in the world won't win you anything without an elite QB at the helm, that is the modern NFL. The days of the Ravens winning a Super Bowl with a badass defense and a game manager are long over.

Heard Zerline on the radio say that Stetson Bennett is probably going undrafted. Terrible character, basically a poor man's Manziel.

We got to see how doing cheap on garbage QBs first hand with the pre-Watson Texans, even with JJ and D-Hop.
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Begg to differ kick but defences have won it all before!
 
badboy said:
Where do you get that Texans made an attempt to trade up? I'm not attacking you but it seems like you're reading a whole lot into nothing.
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I'm not sure I follow you?



“At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter. Rollercoaster draft season for the Texans. “DJ Moore put it over the top”

Panthers’ GM Scott Fitterer admitted that WR DJ Moore was the last trade piece the Chicago Bears needed before agreeing to deal away the No. 1 overall pick in Thursday night’s draft:
​


Context clues would have me believe that we were in contention for a trade up to number one, however DJ Moore was the piece that put the Carolina offer above ours. Do you read that another way?
 
theCATALYST said:
I'm not sure I follow you?



“At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter. Rollercoaster draft season for the Texans. “DJ Moore put it over the top”

Panthers’ GM Scott Fitterer admitted that WR DJ Moore was the last trade piece the Chicago Bears needed before agreeing to deal away the No. 1 overall pick in Thursday night’s draft:
​


Context clues would have me believe that we were in contention for a trade up to number one, however DJ Moore was the piece that put the Carolina offer above ours. Do you read that another way?
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I read it as DJ Moore was needed to be an acceptable offer, not that it would make it a better offer than an alleged Texans offer.

Do I believe that Nick inquired on what it would take? Yes. Do I believe that he put the actual assets formally on the table for acceptance? No.
 
sandman said:
I read it as DJ Moore was needed to be an acceptable offer, not that it would make it a better offer than an alleged Texans offer.

Do I believe that Nick inquired on what it would take? Yes. Do I believe that he put the actual assets formally on the table for acceptance? No.
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Okay. See this part tells me an offer was made and confirmed by Schefter.

At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter

​

We all know we could have had the #1 by losing our last game of the season....that part wouldnt need anyone's confirmation. So I have to assume the confirmation was that an offer was made, only beat by the addition of DJ Moore.
 
The1ApplePie said:
Might as well throw a packet of chips at the Jets for Zach Wilson. You are getting the same player as Levis.
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I think Levis would actually put in the work to be a top QB because he seems intelligent and mature. I don't trust his decision making though. I don't know if he'll be able to keep the turnovers down at the next level.
 
theCATALYST said:
Okay. See this part tells me an offer was made and confirmed by Schefter.

At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter

​

We all know we could have had the #1 by losing our last game of the season....that part wouldnt need anyone's confirmation. So I have to assume the confirmation was that an offer was made, only beat by the addition of DJ Moore.
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We have a direct quote from the Panther's GM saying this is what we had to do to get the #1 pick. Not beat out anyone for the #1 pick. Just to have Chicago agree to the trade.

"Confirmation by Schefter" isn't the Bible. We have no idea who he got that confirmation from.
 
theCATALYST said:
I'm not sure I follow you?



“At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter. Rollercoaster draft season for the Texans. “DJ Moore put it over the top”

Panthers’ GM Scott Fitterer admitted that WR DJ Moore was the last trade piece the Chicago Bears needed before agreeing to deal away the No. 1 overall pick in Thursday night’s draft:
​


Context clues would have me believe that we were in contention for a trade up to number one, however DJ Moore was the piece that put the Carolina offer above ours. Do you read that another way?
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Clues are way for us to interpret not evidence. Notice Schefter is one saying Texans interested not the owner. He said DJ was piece that made Bears accept offer. Schefter and you guess there was an offer by Houston because conjecture was Texans owner wants Young to sell season tickets.
 
theCATALYST said:
Okay. See this part tells me an offer was made and confirmed by Schefter.

At one point in time the Houston Texans we’re very close to getting the No. 1 pick” Confirmation from Schefter

​

We all know we could have had the #1 by losing our last game of the season....that part wouldnt need anyone's confirmation. So I have to assume the confirmation was that an offer was made, only beat by the addition of DJ Moore.
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Because Schefter confirms it you accept it as truth?
 
badboy said:
If Levis and Wilson same guy then Levis could go 2.
I am hoping That is correct but due to a trade up to houston .
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I've seen Levis described as "Josh Allen, but older and worse in every metric."

Apparently the Colts are very high on him. Doubt it would be worth trading down with them though, since the Cards would take whatever defensive players the Texans want, unless the Texans are targeting Richardson or Stroud.
 
sandman said:
We have a direct quote from the Panther's GM saying this is what we had to do to get the #1 pick. Not beat out anyone for the #1 pick. Just to have Chicago agree to the trade.

"Confirmation by Schefter" isn't the Bible. We have no idea who he got that confirmation from.
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badboy said:
Clues are way for us to interpret not evidence. Notice Schefter is one saying Texans interested not the owner. He said DJ was piece that made Bears accept offer. Schefter and you guess there was an offer by Houston because conjecture was Texans owner wants Young to sell season tickets.
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badboy said:
Because Schefter confirms it you accept it as truth?
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Jesus people it isn't that serious. I read the tweet a certain way. I'll just shut up and see myself to the door.
 
The1ApplePie said:
I've seen Levis described as "Josh Allen, but older and worse in every metric."

Apparently the Colts are very high on him. Doubt it would be worth trading down with them though, since the Cards would take whatever defensive players the Texans want, unless the Texans are targeting Richardson or Stroud.
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If we trade for 4, it can then be used to trade down again. 3 is not the only spot to get defensive starters.
 
leebigeztx said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1650596241942749185
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What I said a month ago, and I got whacked 100 times with a wet noodle for being a dunce.

At this point, IF we stay at 2, I don't want Anderson. He's good, but not elite. Tyree would be my choice, but now Doc has me afraid of the foot.

Young is 99% a Panther, so that's out the window. Stroud seems to be falling like a lead pipe.

Honestly, I'm taking Anthony Richardson. But with the smoke out there with Levis, that's probably the guy if they can't find a trade partner.
 
theCATALYST said:
Jesus people it isn't that serious. I read the tweet a certain way. I'll just shut up and see myself to the door.
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I was directly responding to your opinion with my opinion. Not saying I am right or you are wrong. Just saying there is a lot of extrapolations at play. As with most confidential source-based information. I'll still let you buy me a beer.

What I do know is that we will never have full insight into how things are done down on Kirby. Never have, never will.
 
theCATALYST said:
Jesus people it isn't that serious. I read the tweet a certain way. I'll just shut up and see myself to the door.
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Wow, we are simply discussing why you drew the conclusion you did. I said earlier i was not attacking you. You read a tweet a certain way and I read it another. Nothing wrong with that. Just discussion. That happens on a message board.
 
Marcus said:
The Texans have never had a good slot receiver who could always find a way to get open. Njigba would solve that problem. Yes, I know he was injured last year, but his combine times showed that he is healthy again. As for chances of his recurrent injury issues, you basically can say that about any player. I’d certainly take him at 12, especially if they draft Stroud at 2.
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i dont want JSN at 1.12. Rather just let Metchie have his shot, JSN is gonna be glass like Will Fuller
 
badboy said:
You seem to be overlooking that you do not know how good the player will be until sometime After he is drafted. There is no consensus on either one of the 2 high ranked quarterbacks. Of course you can find good Players after round one but you do not know they're going to be good until much later.
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How am I overlooking that?

That's baked into the whole thing. Drafting is nothing but opinions about forecasting how a player is going to perform. That's true across the board for everything and everyone.

Should I use some dice and just randomly choose guys? No. As a GM, I should use people whose opinions I trust to help me form an opinion on who I think is going to be good, on who I think will fit in with what our coaches want to do, on who the coaches think will flourish in their systems and who won't. From that, we should build up a board on who we think will before at the highest level.

There's no consensus here on this board. There's no concensus among the pundits getting paid to figure out which teams are going to draft which players. The ONLY consensus that matters is the one in the GM's mind. He has to put together all that information and then make the right choices. That's all. No biggie.

And no one is going to know if he made the right choices until a few years later, but everyone from TK to Schrager is going to judge him the day of the draft based on the consensuses (sp?) in their minds.

That's all part of the game.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
How am I overlooking that?

That's baked into the whole thing. Drafting is nothing but opinions about forecasting how a player is going to perform. That's true across the board for everything and everyone.

Should I use some dice and just randomly choose guys? No. As a GM, I should use people whose opinions I trust to help me form an opinion on who I think is going to be good, on who I think will fit in with what our coaches want to do, on who the coaches think will flourish in their systems and who won't. From that, we should build up a board on who we think will before at the highest level.

There's no consensus here on this board. There's no concensus among the pundits getting paid to figure out which teams are going to draft which players. The ONLY consensus that matters is the one in the GM's mind. He has to put together all that information and then make the right choices. That's all. No biggie.

And no one is going to know if he made the right choices until a few years later, but everyone from TK to Schrager is going to judge him the day of the draft based on the consensuses (sp?) in their minds.

That's all part of the game.
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Everything in your post is known by all.. of course the only consensus that matters is the teams. You think you have to remind us?

You said earlier that only a great QB or one that a team thinks is great should be drafted at 1.2. Duh.

I repeat a QB or any player at 1.2 will be thought to be able to do well.
 
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