2017 Houston Texans Official OTA's, Minicamp, and Training Camp Thread

[sandman]

I never said that Watson was expressly drafted to sell more tickets. I was saying that the Texans were talking him up and making him sound better than sliced bread because it helps their multiple causes with one of those being to keep the fans invested.

But hey - you keep basing your facts on what one random person says he did on the internet to represent the entire Texans fan base.

Here is a fact: in 2017 the Texans announced that they had 27,000 people on their season ticket wait list.

Here is another fact: the Texans have sold out every game in their existence.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...t-prices/bf45ba72-8f80-47ef-aa63-a02578ef2291

The first two words of your post were "Buy tickets...". Hyping up Watson isn't going to sell more tickets. That's a fact.

Additionally, O'Brien has been emphatic that Savage is the starter. Watson is #2 on the depth chart and in everything that we see coming out of TC. How is it a marketing ploy to trade up to #12, then sit the guy behind Savage?

Other than say nice things about him in pressers, there is literally nothing in terms of actions that the Texans have done to contradict their position that Watson will sit and Savage will be the starter. Not that these facts are stopping people from creating their own agenda-based narrative.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

J.J. Watt learning to focus on the big picture after back surgeries
His aggressive push to get back on the field last year only caused more problems. Now Texans coaches are making J.J. Watt go slow, and he's listening. Michael Shroyer/USA TODAY Sports
7:24 AM CT

• Sarah BarshopESPN Staff Writer

WHITE SULPHUR SPRINGS, W.Va. -- It was a hard way to learn a lesson, but sitting out the 2016 season after undergoing two back surgeries in three months gave Houston Texans defensive end J.J. Watt perspective on how he needs to be more careful to prolong his career.

During the offseason, the three-time NFL Defensive Player of the Year acknowledged that his aggressive push to return to start the season after July surgery probably caused the need for the second surgery three months later. Now, Watt says, he's learned he has to be smarter not just about how he pushes himself, but when.

"I think the biggest thing that I've learned from early in my career is, I'm not going to go out there and win a game on a Tuesday in the middle of training camp," Watt said. "We've got to win games on Sundays in September, October, November, December. So the biggest thing for me is getting ready for that first game of the season, and [the coaches] have a good plan in place, so I'm just following the plan."

Texans coach Bill O’Brien made it clear he and his staff are holding Watt to that plan. After Watt missed his second practice in a row on Tuesday, O'Brien emphasized the long-term goal is to make sure he is ready when the games matter.

"We're just trying to manage him. He's ready to go," O'Brien said. "He's in great condition, and I think it's important to get him ready for Sunday, September 10th."

Added Texans owner Bob McNair: "We just have to let [Watt] work his way back in. He doesn't need a lot of work on the field. He knows what to do. He should be 100 percent, and we want to make sure that he is and he's ready to go at the start of the season."

More people play on ESPN than anywhere else. Join or create a league in the No. 1 Fantasy Football game! Sign up for free!

That mindset has paid off so far. In Wednesday's practice -- one in which Watt participated in not only individual drills but team drills, too -- he made a play that made the fans in attendance and some players on the field gasp. On third down, Watt lifted up and pushed an offensive lineman into the quarterback for a sack. The veteran joked that while it felt good to be out on the field, he is looking forward to the day he can actually tackle the quarterback.

Until then, Watt said, he will let the Texans coaching staff take care of managing his reps and making sure he's 100 percent healthy to start the season.

"[The coaches] know what would happen if I tried to pace myself," Watt said with a smile. "But I think ... I have done a better job [of] listening to them."

*******************************************************************************************************************

Unfortunately, prior long-standing inattention by Watt himself, the training and medical staff, the F.O. and the coaching staff has left him in a very tenuous position going forward...........one that may not be able to be compensated for by over attention now.

 

[Texansballer74]

I never said that Watson was expressly drafted to sell more tickets. I was saying that the Texans were talking him up and making him sound better than sliced bread because it helps their multiple causes with one of those being to keep the fans invested.

But hey - you keep basing your facts on what one random person says he did on the internet to represent the entire Texans fan base.

Is that their job? Plus they didn't hype him up in that type of manner. But hey good try.

 

[Texian]

Here is a fact: in 2017 the Texans announced that they had 27,000 people on their season ticket wait list.

Here is another fact: the Texans have sold out every game in their existence.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...t-prices/bf45ba72-8f80-47ef-aa63-a02578ef2291

The first two words of your post were "Buy tickets...". Hyping up Watson isn't going to sell more tickets. That's a fact.

Additionally, O'Brien has been emphatic that Savage is the starter. Watson is #2 on the depth chart and in everything that we see coming out of TC. How is it a marketing ploy to trade up to #12, then sit the guy behind Savage?

Other than say nice things about him in pressers, there is literally nothing in terms of actions that the Texans have done to contradict their position that Watson will sit and Savage will be the starter. Not that these facts are stopping people from creating their own agenda-based narrative.

Savage is the starter is a ruse, a misdirection to give Watson time to learn the playbook and the offense. Once Mgmt is comfortable with Watson starting, then he will, barring injury to Savage or losing streak. Then it's in to the fire he goes.

 

[Texansballer74]

Savage is the starter is a ruse, a misdirection to give Watson time to learn the playbook and the offense. Once Mgmt is comfortable with Watson starting, then he will, barring injury to Savage or losing streak. Then it's in to the fire he goes.

That's a major assumption on your behalf.

 

[sandman]

Savage is the starter is a ruse, a misdirection to give Watson time to learn the playbook and the offense. Once Mgmt is comfortable with Watson starting, then he will, barring injury to Savage or losing streak. Then it's in to the fire he goes.

I don't think anyone is asserting anything different. Other than calling it a ruse.

The Texans draft a QB in the 1st round. They don't think he is ready to start Day 1. Maybe not even Season 1. Savage is named the starter, with the expectations that at some point TBD in the future when Watson exhibits the potential that they see in him, Watson will be come the QB for the Texans. Obviously there are variables such as injuries and poor performance that could change that timing.

Not one bit of that contradicts anything I said.

 

[edromeo]

Passing yards per completion, Watson ranked #72, so yes he was a dink and dunker: http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/individual/740/p2

I am not sure why you are making it seem like 'dinking and dunking' is a bad thing?

Also neither here nor there but I'm unfamiliar with yards per completion being used to assess the depth of target i.e. hallmark for 'dink and dunking'. The standard is almost always yards per attempt. If you look at YPA Watson ranks at: #33 @ 7.93 YPA. http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/individual/908

Watson's Average Depth of Target was: 9.2 which is good for #34 just for reference Mahomes was #33 @ 9.3, Trubs was #22 @ 9.9 and Kizer was #9 @ 11.
So if you by those numbers you label him a 'dink and dunk' passer then I agree with you.

If we are really going to drill down on this stat then you should also look at sacks. Because there is definite correlation between passing game scheme/depth of target and sacks.
You should know that Clemson offense did not take many sacks because of the schemes design and Watson's ability to get the ball out quick.

3. Watson’s average time to attempt was 2.11 seconds in 2016, the sixth-fastest time in the nation.

While time in the pocket will differ from team to team, being able to get rid of the ball quickly is essential to the success of any quarterback. Watson’s average time to attempt this year was 2.11 seconds, sixth-fastest in the nation
https://www.profootballfocus.com/college-3-stats-that-define-deshaun-watsons-game/

Btw, this was actually a different claim then the original claims you made that I disagreed with are we gonna discuss those?

 

[Brisco_County]

It sounds like we got some darn good prospects for the draft picks we didn't trade away.

Foreman, Cunningham, Decoud, not to mention Martin sound promising. Davenport too.

Tired of hearing the "it was Godseys fault" excuse though.

Is the more physical camp why Fuller got hurt?

This is the second time I've heard Starr express a poor opinion of Godsey's coaching. Whether it was poor or just mediocre, Starr is convinced that O'Brien is in a different class at coaching offense.

Fuller got hurt because he jumped up for a pass and came down on the shoulder.

 

[infantrycak]

This is the second time I've heard Starr express a poor opinion of Godsey's coaching. Whether it was poor or just mediocre, Starr is convinced that O'Brien is in a different class at coaching offense.

Pat's position begs the question why OB let Godsey run for 3 years not doing things as he wanted.

 

[steelbtexan]

Here is a fact: in 2017 the Texans announced that they had 27,000 people on their season ticket wait list.

Here is another fact: the Texans have sold out every game in their existence.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...t-prices/bf45ba72-8f80-47ef-aa63-a02578ef2291

The first two words of your post were "Buy tickets...". Hyping up Watson isn't going to sell more tickets. That's a fact.

Additionally, O'Brien has been emphatic that Savage is the starter. Watson is #2 on the depth chart and in everything that we see coming out of TC. How is it a marketing ploy to trade up to #12, then sit the guy behind Savage?

Other than say nice things about him in pressers, there is literally nothing in terms of actions that the Texans have done to contradict their position that Watson will sit and Savage will be the starter. Not that these facts are stopping people from creating their own agenda-based narrative.

I've got 4 tickets for sale for the Jags game. Sec 326

 

[steelbtexan]

Savage is the starter is a ruse, a misdirection to give Watson time to learn the playbook and the offense. Once Mgmt is comfortable with Watson starting, then he will, barring injury to Savage or losing streak. Then it's in to the fire he goes.

I'm looking forward to another bogus Savage concussion.

 

[Texian]

I am not sure why you are making it seem like 'dinking and dunking' is a bad thing?

It's not a bad thing it just strongly inflates numbers and stats. You have to take in to account that a large number of passes were completed at the line of scrimmage and behind the line of scrimmage and that inflates completion % and accuracy. Take in to account that with so many high percentage throws and TD to INT ratio is < 3 to 1 is a cause for concern, a red flag. I do believe you are sailing in the same boat as Ricky McNair, the "SS I DO Love ME Some Deshaun Watson" cruise.

 

[Texian]

That's a major assumption on your behalf.

or it could be "I know a thing or two, because I've seen a thing or two".

 

[TexansBull]

Here is a fact: in 2017 the Texans announced that they had 27,000 people on their season ticket wait list.

Here is another fact: the Texans have sold out every game in their existence.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/a...t-prices/bf45ba72-8f80-47ef-aa63-a02578ef2291

The first two words of your post were "Buy tickets...". Hyping up Watson isn't going to sell more tickets. That's a fact.

Additionally, O'Brien has been emphatic that Savage is the starter. Watson is #2 on the depth chart and in everything that we see coming out of TC. How is it a marketing ploy to trade up to #12, then sit the guy behind Savage?

Other than say nice things about him in pressers, there is literally nothing in terms of actions that the Texans have done to contradict their position that Watson will sit and Savage will be the starter. Not that these facts are stopping people from creating their own agenda-based narrative.

Hyping up Watson keeps butts in chairs. Buy tickets means keeping the crowd happy to renew and repurchase those tickets. A transaction still needs to take place. I didn't know i would have to paint a picture. Good job taking two words out of a post to make your opinion.

Someone somewhere in reliant has an Excel spreadsheet that shows profits are up when the crowd is happy vs disgruntled.

And my statement about hyping up Watson is about that, and more, such as Rick Smith and OB and going to sell this as a decision that they can't be blamed for because all the signs point to Yes. So if Watson flames out or gets injured - it's more of "well we made the right decision with the information given so can i get another extension?"

I want Watson to do great. It's cool for y'all to be happy.

My point i am trying to make is be careful buying into the pre season hype. There are multiple forces at work for a variety of reasons. Statements like "he is a winner in college and highschool" or "best rookie coached" or "never makes the same mistakes twice" is all hype. Wait until the real games happen. Wait to see it for your own eyes because reporters lie and the Texans have a product sell. We have been down this road with Osweiler, Mallett, and others.

 

[sandman]

I've got 4 tickets for sale for the Jags game. Sec 326

McNair already has your money. I'd be interested in letting you take mine.

 

[sandman]

Hyping up Watson keeps butts in chairs. Buy tickets means keeping the crowd happy to renew and repurchase those tickets. A transaction still needs to take place. I didn't know i would have to paint a picture. Good job taking two words out of a post to make your opinion.

Someone somewhere in reliant has an Excel spreadsheet that shows profits are up when the crowd is happy vs disgruntled.

And my statement about hyping up Watson is about that, and more, such as Rick Smith and OB and going to sell this as a decision that they can't be blamed for because all the signs point to Yes. So if Watson flames out or gets injured - it's more of "well we made the right decision with the information given so can i get another extension?"

I want Watson to do great. It's cool for y'all to be happy.

My point i am trying to make is be careful buying into the pre season hype. There are multiple forces at work for a variety of reasons. Statements like "he is a winner in college and highschool" or "best rookie coached" or "never makes the same mistakes twice" is all hype. Wait until the real games happen. Wait to see it for your own eyes because reporters lie and the Texans have a product sell. We have been down this road with Osweiler, Mallett, and others.

As I've never made any posts about those statements of hype or gotten on the Watson Wagon, I'm pretty comfortable in my fandom. Thanks for the concern though.

 

[TexansBull]

Is that their job? Plus they didn't hype him up in that type of manner. But hey good try.

Exactly! It's their job. Thank you for agreeing with me. I appreciate the support.

 

[Norg]

who hit Willy to cause him to break his Collar bone ..????

 

[edromeo]

It's not a bad thing it just strongly inflates numbers and stats. You have to take in to account that a large number of passes were completed at the line of scrimmage and behind the line of scrimmage and that inflates completion % and accuracy. Take in to account that with so many high percentage throws and TD to INT ratio is < 3 to 1 is a cause for concern, a red flag.

Lol, sure but guess what? That 'inflation' you mention isn't unique to Watson. It can be applied to most college and NFL QBs. You should look up Brady's passing chart.

I an not sure what you mean by high% throws? Watson iirc threw more go routes (low % throws) compared to other draftable QBs.

And we already agree that he needs to reign in his INTs.

So I guess you're not going to address the previous claims?

 

[Texian]

Lol, sure but guess what? That 'inflation' you mention isn't unique to Watson. It can be applied to most college and NFL QBs. You should look up Brady's passing chart.

I an not sure what you mean by high% throws? Watson iirc threw more go routes (low % throws) compared to other draftable QBs.

And we already agree that he needs to reign in his INTs.

So I guess you're not going to address the previous claims?

You've made you points, I've made mine....so we're done here. Any further discussion is a waste of our time.

 

[DBCooper]

Lol, sure but guess what? That 'inflation' you mention isn't unique to Watson. It can be applied to most college and NFL QBs. You should look up Brady's passing chart.

I an not sure what you mean by high% throws? Watson iirc threw more go routes (low % throws) compared to other draftable QBs.

And we already agree that he needs to reign in his INTs.

So I guess you're not going to address the previous claims?

The only claim that dude listens to is his own greasy palm.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

who hit Willy to cause him to break his Collar bone ..????

Happened like this.:

 

[steelbtexan]

McNair already has your money. I'd be interested in letting you take mine.

PM me and I will tell you more.

I'm going to be out of the office this afternoon.

 

[edromeo]

....Watson is a spread option QB who determines his pass and WR before the snap and if it's not there he tucks and runs.
.....questions his abilities to (1) read a defense, (2) go through progressions and (3) make quick good decisions,

About the only thing that is accurate in the statement above is that Watson played in a spread offense.

Even with the most cursory glance at his film anyone can see him going through progressions.
Even the most cursory knowledge of his game shows he's not a 1 read then tuck and run QB.

But this area of evaluation is difficult to discuss on a message board. I think this question can be answered by actually watching Clemson/Watson game cut-ups and understanding the Clemson offense. Its quite obvious to see Watson going through both pre and post snap progressions. And by looking at the plays from the Clemson passing game its also quite obvious that the offense required him to go through pre and post progressions.

OB seems to think that Clemson's offense prepared him well and based on his apparent success thus far in camp it would seem that OB was correct.

Or maybe Watson is such a savant that his inability to read a defense, go through a progression and make quick decisions developed over night on his own despite not being a trait he possessed prior to training camp?

accuracy for intermediate and longer passes is questionable

Questionable is purposefully ambiguous term but anyhow....


1. Deshaun Waston was the sixth-most-accurate QB on deep targets this season.


Being able to stretch the field does wonders for an offense, and Watson is one of the best in the nation at throwing deep. Among QBs with at least 50 deep attempts (passes traveling 20-plus yards in air), Watson ranks sixth in adjusted completion rate, at 49.4 percent, and his numbers improved as the season went on.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/college-3-stats-that-define-deshaun-watsons-game

I do agree that if you fine focus his accuracy only on the distances below:
31-40: Yd Adj Comp % 25.0% #39
40+ : Yd Adj Comp % 30.8% #27

He needs to improve there in the above areas.
But he's money where it counts most:
21-30 Yd Adj Comp % 60.0% #2 and this is by far the bulk of NFL throws

His accuracy numbers are well documented for anyone that's truly interested in speaking factually about such topics...

arm strength is questionable.

Questionable again ambiguous.
Sports science measures his velocity at 53.5 mph which is on par with Sam Bradford.

 

[edromeo]

You've made you points, I've made mine....so we're done here. Any further discussion is a waste of our time.

Maybe so, as it seems your mind was made up a long time ago; which btw is fine by me.
However; its when you pass off your opinions as accepted fact is where we disagree.

I was merely asking you to support the claims you expressed early that I questioned so I could understand where you were coming from with those opinions before i responded to them. But in the subsequent points it seemed clear that you weren't going to support those claims with anything so i've responded to those claims.

Cheers!
I guess we can stop wasting each others time for now.

 

[Texian]

About the only thing that is accurate in the statement above is that Watson played in a spread offense.

Even with the most cursory glance at his film anyone can see him going through progressions.
Even the most cursory knowledge of his game shows he's not a 1 read then tuck and run QB.

But this area of evaluation is difficult to discuss on a message board. I think this question can be answered by actually watching Clemson/Watson game cut-ups and understanding the Clemson offense. Its quite obvious to see Watson going through both pre and post snap progressions. And by looking at the plays from the Clemson passing game its also quite obvious that the offense required him to go through pre and post progressions.

OB seems to think that Clemson's offense prepared him well and based on his apparent success thus far in camp it would seem that OB was correct.

Or maybe Watson is such a savant that his inability to read a defense, go through a progression and make quick decisions developed over night on his own despite not being a trait he possessed prior to training camp?

Questionable is purposefully ambiguous term but anyhow....


1. Deshaun Waston was the sixth-most-accurate QB on deep targets this season.


Being able to stretch the field does wonders for an offense, and Watson is one of the best in the nation at throwing deep. Among QBs with at least 50 deep attempts (passes traveling 20-plus yards in air), Watson ranks sixth in adjusted completion rate, at 49.4 percent, and his numbers improved as the season went on.
https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/college-3-stats-that-define-deshaun-watsons-game

I do agree that if you fine focus his accuracy only on the distances below:
31-40: Yd Adj Comp % 25.0% #39
40+ : Yd Adj Comp % 30.8% #27

He needs to improve there in the above areas.
But he's money where it counts most:
21-30 Yd Adj Comp % 60.0% #2 and this is by far the bulk of NFL throws

His accuracy numbers are well documented for anyone that's truly interested in speaking factually about such topics...


Questionable again ambiguous.
Sports science measures his velocity at 53.5 mph which is on par with Sam Bradford.

I received a lot of similar comments, just like yours when I commented on Osweiler's less than promising scouting report.

Our discussions reminds me of when the Texans drafted Louis Nix. I commented that trading up and giving away so many draft picks for Nix was an exercise in stupidity and that drafting Nix was a wasted draft pick. There was a Texans Talk message board member who was bound and determined to prove me wrong. He wanted to take me through every Nix snap in the Championship game vs Alabama just to prove me wrong. When I presented differing points of view, I became the knucklehead. I sense a similar situation from you. Bon Voyage on the SS "I DO Love ME Some Deshauan Watson" enjoy your cruise.

 

[Jadmakaveli]

I received a lot of similar comments, just like yours when I commented on Osweiler's less than promising scouting report.

Our discussions reminds me of when the Texans drafted Louis Nix. I commented that trading up and giving up so many draft picks for Nix was an exercise in stupidity and that drafting Nix was a wasted draft pick. There was a Texans Talk message board member who was bound and determined to prove me wrong. He wanted to take me through every Nix snap in the Championship game vs Alabama just to prove me wrong. I sense a similar situation from you. Bon Voyage on the SS "I DO Love ME Some Deshauan Watson" enjoy your cruise.

Lol.

 

[TexansBull]

As I've never made any posts about those statements of hype or gotten on the Watson Wagon, I'm pretty comfortable in my fandom. Thanks for the concern though.

I am not trying to be rude or an ass, but i was wondering why you jumped in midstream because that's what i was originally referencing. But it's a message board and that's what we do. So i can see how you may have misunderstood me or anything else.

I will keep your fandom as a chief concern of mine though...jk.

 

[TexansBull]

Texian can't tell the difference between Dan Marino and Johnny Manziel (by his definition they are both classic Pure Pocket Passers). Yet you care what he thinks about QBs?

Damn. I didn't know there were certain people on the internet i am allowed to ask their opinion. Because that is what the internet is about - unqualified opinions. And that is what he gave me. When you find a Shannahan, Kubiak, or Belicheck on this board let me know.

Texian hate is strong on this board.

It's like battling the Borg. Either conform or die.

 

[DBCooper]

I received a lot of similar comments, just like yours when I commented on Osweiler's less than promising scouting report.

Our discussions reminds me of when the Texans drafted Louis Nix. I commented that trading up and giving up so many draft picks for Nix was an exercise in stupidity and that drafting Nix was a wasted draft pick. There was a Texans Talk message board member who was bound and determined to prove me wrong. He wanted to take me through every Nix snap in the Championship game vs Alabama just to prove me wrong. I sense a similar situation from you. Bon Voyage on the SS "I DO Love ME Some Deshauan Watson" enjoy your cruise.

Hahahahaha

When everyone the Texans sign or draft suck you're assured of getting a few correct!

Spank spank spank

 

[Brisco_County]

Pat's position begs the question why OB let Godsey run for 3 years not doing things as he wanted.

If I had to answer that, it would be that O'Brien has a strange weakness for blindspots caused by loyalty and bias. We saw it with Hoyer. Godsey was a personal friend.

 

[thunderkyss]

Derek Carr scouting report read quite a bit differently than Watson's starting with his arm, accuracy and he didn't have the INT problem, his TD to INT ratio was 6 to 1 NOT < 3 to 1.

The question was about the low YPA. Dinking & dunking.

 

[Texian]

The question was about the low YPA. Dinking & dunking.

I think you got lost somewhere along the way.

 

[Texian]

Damn. I didn't know there were certain people on the internet i am allowed to ask their opinion. Because that is what the internet is about - unqualified opinions. And that is what he gave me. When you find a Shannahan, Kubiak, or Belicheck on this board let me know.

Texian hate is strong on this board.

It's like battling the Borg. Either conform or die.

If you are not blowing smoke up their hiney or if you happen to pee in their Kool Aid, it doesn't take long for you to become Darth Vader.

 

[sandman]

I am not trying to be rude or an ass, but i was wondering why you jumped in midstream because that's what i was originally referencing. But it's a message board and that's what we do. So i can see how you may have misunderstood me or anything else.

I will keep your fandom as a chief concern of mine though...jk.

KDog gave a reason as to why the drafted Watson:

They said they drafted him because he won in college

You asserted that drafting Watson was a marketing ploy:

Then why did they pass on AJ McCarran?

Sounds like a marketing ploy.

When I asked what was the ploy, you replied with this:

Buy tickets to come see a Texans game featuring a college winning QB that may or may not be any good. And buy a jersey while you are at even though we don't know how he will do. And buy more Texans stuff because we could win with him in the future. Because he did win in college and that means something - am I right? You know it! Superbowl! Championship!

Some have already bought into this line of thinking.

Maybe you intended this to be more tongue-in-cheek than the McNair/Smith hate that it came out as. Maybe I should have recognized there wasn't any value in this engagement and kept on walking. So, I'll keep on walking now and hope you have a good one.

 

[xtruroyaltyx]

If you are not blowing smoke up their hiney or if you happen to pee in their Kool Aid, it doesn't take long for you to become Darth Vader.

Ya know....I have spit plenty venom towards the Texans organization. There are still things which the do/are doing which make me roll my eyes...During the season when they suck I will certainly not be shy about my disapproval ...After the draft, if they pick a guy I'm not that fond of I'll let that be known...

But somewhere between the draft and the start of the season I tend to ease up and drink the koolaid some. Well...Maybe not drink the koolaid, but I try to look for the good things and hope for the best...

Otherwise you spend all year griping about something you have no control over and being sour about a team that you are supposedly wanting to see succeed.

If you can't even look for the positives and not constantly rag on them during this period, what's the point of even being fan? Not saying don't be honest in your evals...Just saying, that even fans who don't think highly of the organization don't want to always hear about every negative or perceived negative.

So do you have anything positive to say about the Texans?

 

[DBCooper]

Ya know....I have spit plenty venom towards the Texans organization. There are still things which the do/are doing which make me roll my eyes...During the season when they suck I will certainly not be shy about my disapproval ...After the draft, if they pick a guy I'm not that fond of I'll let that be known...

But somewhere between the draft and the start of the season I tend to ease up and drink the koolaid some. Well...Maybe not drink the koolaid, but I try to look for the good things and hope for the best...

Otherwise you spend all year griping about something you have no control over and being sour about a team that you are supposedly wanting to see succeed.

If you can't even look for the positives and not constantly rag on them during this period, what's the point of even being fan? Not saying don't be honest in your evals...Just saying, that even fans who don't think highly of the organization don't want to always hear about every negative or perceived negative.

So do you have anything positive to say about the Texans?

Difference is that you're a Texans fan.

 

[Texian]

Ya know....I have spit plenty venom towards the Texans organization. There are still things which the do/are doing which make me roll my eyes...During the season when they suck I will certainly not be shy about my disapproval ...After the draft, if they pick a guy I'm not that fond of I'll let that be known...

But somewhere between the draft and the start of the season I tend to ease up and drink the koolaid some. Well...Maybe not drink the koolaid, but I try to look for the good things and hope for the best...

Otherwise you spend all year griping about something you have no control over and being sour about a team that you are supposedly wanting to see succeed.

If you can't even look for the positives and not constantly rag on them during this period, what's the point of even being fan? Not saying don't be honest in your evals...Just saying, that even fans who don't think highly of the organization don't want to always hear about every negative or perceived negative.

So do you have anything positive to say about the Texans?

You should know that much of my discussion comes from people asking my opinion. And that can generate a few pages of discussion.

http://www.texanstalk.com/posts/2733566/

To answer your question honestly, as I sit here and look at Fitzpatrick, Hoyer, Mallett, Weeden, Yates, the decision to spend $72MM to get Osweiler, the decision to eat $10MM of his salary and give Cleveland a 2nd RD draft pick to take him off our hands a year later, to give up next years #1 to move up I can't say there is much to be positive about. There is no more benefit of the doubt. McNair has more than likely set this team back 5 years. I have seen the Bob McNair show play out before with Rankin Smith and John Mecom Jr. Don't get me wrong Bob McNair is a great and wonderful man. He's even a very good team owner but as a the team GM he has been pitiful. To put this in perspective, the Texans today for me is much like sitting through eight years of Communist Muslim presidency hoping that one day it will all change.

 

[TexansBull]

Difference is that you're a Texans fan.

Oh damn. We are back to measuring someone's fandom by what they post.

 

[DBCooper]

Oh damn. We are back to measuring someone's fandom by what they post.

 

[Speedy]

Maybe I've just missed it in a long ass thread, but I haven't seen any reports anywhere else online as well. What is going on with special teams? Who's returning kicks? What of the kicker "battle" between Novak and Fairbairn?

 

[xtruroyaltyx]

Maybe I've just missed it in a long ass thread, but I haven't seen any reports anywhere else online as well. What is going on with special teams? Who's returning kicks? What of the kicker "battle" between Novak and Fairbairn?

Only heard about coverage units playing well and supposedly the kickers are pretty much displaying what they are. Novak not as strong a leg, but more accurate close in. Fairbiarn a stronger leg, but not as accurate.

 

[Speedy]

Only heard about coverage units playing well and supposedly the kickers are pretty much displaying what they are. Novak not as strong a leg, but more accurate close in. Fairbiarn a stronger leg, but not as accurate.

Yeah, that's pretty much all I've heard too. Not much info.

 

[Brisco_County]

patrick‏Verified account@PatDStat
"It was me vs. the playbook last year. This year it is me vs. the defense."
Braxton Miller #Texans

 

[TexansBull]

KDog gave a reason as to why the drafted Watson:



You asserted that drafting Watson was a marketing ploy:



When I asked what was the ploy, you replied with this:



Maybe you intended this to be more tongue-in-cheek than the McNair/Smith hate that it came out as. Maybe I should have recognized there wasn't any value in this engagement and kept on walking. So, I'll keep on walking now and hope you have a good one.

Yea I can see why reading comprehension is hard for you. You didn't include any of the conversation any other posters were having with myself or others when discussing the feedback on Watson coming out of camp. Plus you left out a quote in my pleasant conversation with Kdog. Your ability to read two words out of post and assume to know what a post is about is something you need to work on to find value in conversation. And as the saying goes, you get all up in the Kool aid and don't know what flavor it is.

But your passive aggressive approach is the best i have seen.

Good day to you sir.

 

[Texansballer74]

I received a lot of similar comments, just like yours when I commented on Osweiler's less than promising scouting report.

Our discussions reminds me of when the Texans drafted Louis Nix. I commented that trading up and giving away so many draft picks for Nix was an exercise in stupidity and that drafting Nix was a wasted draft pick. There was a Texans Talk message board member who was bound and determined to prove me wrong. He wanted to take me through every Nix snap in the Championship game vs Alabama just to prove me wrong. When I presented differing points of view, I became the knucklehead. I sense a similar situation from you. Bon Voyage on the SS "I DO Love ME Some Deshauan Watson" enjoy your cruise.

So what are you saying here? You're the great talent evaluation specialist.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Quick Hitters: Houston Texans Training Camp Day Eight
Quick Hitters from Houston Texans camp at The Greenbrier.

• Patrick Starr - 10 hours ago

With the absence of Will Fuller, the Texans went to work and it was clear that the level of focus was a notch higher with the loss of Will Fuller. Here are some early quick hitters from the Texans 8th day of camp. The Texans were out of pads for the first time in nearly five days giving them some type of break for the day.

Quick Hitters
"He'll be back eventually, It's not a season-ending injury." O'Brien said of Fuller.

Bill O'Brien did mention that they expect Fuller to be back this season at some point from his broken collarbone. Fuller needed surgery to fix his collarbone due to the multiple breaks but there is expectation to see him this year.

It was a strong day for Braxton Miller on the field, largely due to his ability to get into the teeth of the defense and put together catch and runs. Miller is showing a better feel for the offense and becoming a reliable target for Tom Savage. Miller continues to be good in short area spaces catching the football. Miller’s strength is inside the hashes and is still working on his game when he is asked to get downfield in a route. Miller has had one of the stronger camps through two weeks.


Entering day three with the team, DeAndrew White had a down day yesterday and then woke back up today. He was Deshaun Watson’s favorite target and he was able to get vertical and catch two touchdowns. He had the best catch of the day, going over a defender on the left sideline and catching the ball only to tap both feet in the end zone before falling out of bounds. White stepped up today with the injury to Fuller and an off day for DeAndre Hopkins.


Brennan Scarlett continues to solidify his spot on the roster and the three piece of the outside linebacker group. Scarlett is becoming a better pass rusher and is working offensive tackles. He also has enough athleticism to help in coverage, which is a plus for that position. When pads are on, Scarlett does a solid job of being physical and is rounding out some pass rush moves. He is one of the early risers from last year.


Not enough has been said about the camp Tom Savage has put together. Savage continues to run an offense that is going against a top defense in the NFL and it makes life tough. With Hopkins getting the day off, Savage depended on Jaelen Strong and Braxton Miller and linked up with both of them well. Strong is very solid when the ball is in his area, while Miller was the catch and run guy today. Savage, when operating with a clean pocket, has been better than most realize. The Texans are finding out that their right tackle position is a growing issue and has been part of the issue for the offense. Chris Clark was getting most of the work at left tackle. With the needs at tackle, the Texans brought in Austin Howard for a visit.


It was a tale of two halves of practice for Deshaun Watson and his offensive work. He came out smoking early, hitting DeAndrew White with two big throws for touchdowns. Watson likes getting the ball both to White and Riley McCarron who have become his safety nets on the field. Watson also found Evan Baylis at times on the field, giving him a strong start. Then as practice went on, the pop wasn’t there and Watson ended up getting sloppy with the ball. Near interceptions and dropped passes from targets made it a disappointing way to end his day after such a strong start. Watson shows that he has what it takes but when he struggles running the offense, it can bog down in a hurry.

**********************************************************

As per O'Brien's statement above, looks like Fuller did have a comminuted (shattered="multiple") clavicular fracture. This means that he will not return before 10-12 weeks.........likely will be put on IR with later designation to return.
[I've posted additional thoughts on the subject in the Injury Thread]

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Extended Cut of Houston Texans Training Camp: Day Eight
An extended look at the Houston Texans eighth practice at The Greenbrier.

• Patrick Starr - 6 hours ago

The extended look at the Houston Texans eighth practice from The Greenbrier.


Deandre Hopkins received a much needed day off, allowing the Texans a longer look at the wide receiver depth chart behind Jaelen Strong and Braxton Miller. The team is now working to find an answer for the lack of depth at the position and we could see a corresponding move ahead to add a veteran presence for depth.


It seems that the Texans are preparing for an extensive standoff with Duane Brown and are now looking for added depth to the offensive tackle group. The Texans are not budging, making it seem like Brown is not in a rush to report to camp. The team has started their due diligence by bringing in offensive tackle Austin Howard which indicates they are ready to move on with their roster and deal with Brown’s arrival when it happens. The organization is looking out for their offense. It is a smart move at this point of training camp with preseason set to start.


Rookie cornerback Dee Virgin has had a rough go of it at practices the past couple of days. Virgin struggles with coverage when it gets downfield and was victimized by DeAndrew White in the end zone. Virgin is trying to find his way and, through the first two weeks, it has not come easy for him.


Kurtis Drummond is fighting for his spot on the roster and the Texans are taking a long extensive look at him at safety. He continues to have the best range of the group but struggles in man coverage. Drummond will get plenty of snaps during the preseason to show what he can do and entering year three, 2017 is turning into an important year for him.



Riley McCarron is Deshaun Watson’s favorite target with his quick game and the shifty wide receiver is making the most of his opportunities. McCarron catches the ball well but some of the concern will come with his playing strength and whether he can break tackles on the field. The quickness and speed is not the issue, it is when defenders get their hands on him and how he handles it. McCarron is right on the cusp of the Texans ensuring he gets an extended look and his growing relationship with Watson does not hurt..



Evan Baylis is getting plenty of snaps due to the Texans rotating off-days for their top two tight ends, C.J. Fiedorowicz and Ryan Griffin. Baylis runs hot and cold out on the field. One minute he is catching everything, then the next, he is struggling to maintain possession of the ball. Baylis does a good job of getting open, he just has to maintain consistency on finishing plays.


Devin Street had a tough day after a strong start during which he made an athletic catch on the sideline. He had a drop on what appeared to be a pretty catchable football. Street has a pretty good grasp on what he has to do on the field but days like this continue to bury him on the depth chart.


K.J. Dillon continues to make strides and appears more and more comfortable with his knee. His closing speed is what makes him an intriguing safety and he does a good job of closing down tight ends in their routes. What is not discussed enough is how physical he is when he has a chance to square up ball carries and he is a spark plug from the second level. Dillon is working off the cobwebs of not being on the field in some time but is clearly trending in the right direction.


The Texans activated Dayon Pratt from the non-football injury list and he is one to watch, especially with an open spot behind Whitney Mercilus, Jadeveon Clowney, and Brennan Scarlett on the outside linebacker depth chart. The final spot is up for grabs and the possible odds on favorite, Pratt, finally was cleared for practice. Pratt is a long and rangy edge presence who checks in at 6-4 and 240 lbs. He took at many reps as possible today in hopes of getting him caught up and ready to go for the first preseason game. Pratt will have to show that he is up to speed defensively and if he can show that he knows what is going on, he could be ready to push for a roster spot quickly.

 

[JPPT1974]

Imagine DeShaun and Riley hooking up. As they could be really great in a game.

 

[TheRealJoker]

Imagine DeShaun and Riley hooking up. As they could be really great in a game.

Riley could've been Mike Renfrow had he gone to Clemson!